Topic: FSG discussion thread

[Chakan]

It’s just funny how people on here keep threatening to stop supporting the club because they have some owners they don’t like.  It’s all attention seeking nonsense - we all know that none of them would walk away from the club, it is too much a part of their life.

Worst still we know it’s all virtue signalling - people on here saying such things reek of hypocrisy. Throwing around words like sportswashing, like they even have a clue about what’s going on in the world.  Somehow trying to feel superior.

It was only at the start of the millennium that the UK armed forces even allowed openly gay people to be in its services - where were these people then with their protests of human rights ? 

If people genuinely feel that resentful of human rights abuses to the point they would stop supporting a club ingrained in their DNA, I would expect that passionate defence of human rights to exist in most basic aspects of their lives but they don’t. 

The problem with people in the main is they jump on bandwagons with a very shallow understanding. Remember green fell, clap for the NHS etc. People soon forgot once the media stopped talking about it.  It gets tedious to keep seeing the virtue signalling and melodramatic actions of posters in response.

I’m sure people on here will twist my words, that’s just what forums do, but spend 2 mins now researching where Nike replica shirts come from, and then come back and talk to me about how passionate you really all are about human rights.

All BS and only being mentioned because the media have spoon fed you to say it.

Always fun being told what I think.

If only I knew what I thought, it would make such a difference.

Anyway carry on mate.

[ademuzzy]

Aye. It's clear that the modern "fan" sees us as dinosaurs who stand in the way of progress, and will gleefully see us fucked off because the only thing that matters anymore is spending hundreds of millions and winning trophies. Not unity, not heart, not community - just "give us the fucking silverware and how high do you want us to jump?"

I don't know if there are many in the city itself who hold those views, but there's plenty of Liverpool fans who have never set foot in the city who could tell them a thing or two about the core values of our club and what it means to support it.

Spot on

[Avens]

They are already doing that, aren't they?

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Yeah I bet you do - keep regurgitating what the media tell you.

I would put a shit ton of money on right now that you're anti-vax and vote Tory.

[mickeydocs]

I’ve got a slight hunch and it is giving me a concern about Lijnders.

Maybe Julian Ward was out of his depth. As plausible as anything else.

[MPowerYNWA]

I’ve got a slight hunch and it is giving me a concern about Lijnders.

Just speculating, but I suspect a bit of a power struggle has taken place behind the scenes, and at stake is who gets the manager’s ear.

On the one side, the stattos. On the other, it feels like Lijnders is starting to exert more influence. Possibly not just in recruitment, but also in tactics as well.

Might be barking up the wrong tree, but I wonder if the fallout is due to a department not being respected enough in terms of having the manager’s ear.

As for potential new owners, let’s see what happens. It is premature to fall out over Saudi owners, or whatever, as we don’t know what is happening. On a personal note, while I will make up my own mind as every red should, I will be watching Jurgen’s reaction closely, as he knows the score on the inner workings, and his moral compass seems in tune with the best scouse traditions of the club. 

I had a similar thought - he definitely seems to be seeking the limelight more than he has done previously. Maybe Klopp is priming him to be a long-term successor or perhaps he wants to try his hand as a #1 elsewhere.

[Legs]

Yep, giving personal quotes to BBC and Sky, something which Saudi minister is weirdly doing. (If it is not state backed, how would he know that "private sector" bids will come?)

Just my opinion, but I think there is a good chance the Saudis do bid for us. Will be very interesting to see what FSG do, if the sale is not in it's last stages already.

Dont they already have Newcastle so "shouldnt" be able to buy anyone else

Mind according to some they dont own Newcastle 🤣🤣

[Redbonnie]

It’s just funny how people on here keep threatening to stop supporting the club because they have some owners they don’t like.  It’s all attention seeking nonsense - we all know that none of them would walk away from the club, it is too much a part of their life.

Worst still we know it’s all virtue signalling - people on here saying such things reek of hypocrisy. Throwing around words like sportswashing, like they even have a clue about what’s going on in the world.  Somehow trying to feel superior.

It was only at the start of the millennium that the UK armed forces even allowed openly gay people to be in its services - where were these people then with their protests of human rights ? 

If people genuinely feel that resentful of human rights abuses to the point they would stop supporting a club ingrained in their DNA, I would expect that passionate defence of human rights to exist in most basic aspects of their lives but they don’t.

The problem with people in the main is they jump on bandwagons with a very shallow understanding. Remember green fell, clap for the NHS etc. People soon forgot once the media stopped talking about it.  It gets tedious to keep seeing the virtue signalling and melodramatic actions of posters in response.

I’m sure people on here will twist my words, that’s just what forums do, but spend 2 mins now researching where Nike replica shirts come from, and then come back and talk to me about how passionate you really all are about human rights.

All BS and only being mentioned because the media have spoon fed you to say it.

Yes your right we are all thick and we don’t really understand the bigger picture.  Remember Hicks and Gillet? Remember the lawyers, the accountants, the IT experts, the financiers, the activists, the retired postmen, the grafters, the construction workers, the students.  People from all backgrounds and all reds who came together in a brilliant example of consumer activism.  That’s who your talking to now and who are on this forum. Don’t talk down to us like we are a load of gobshites.

[MPowerYNWA]

I would put a shit ton of money on right now that you're anti-vax and vote Tory.

What on earth are you talking about now and how does it relate to the topic at hand?

[MPowerYNWA]

Yes your right we are all thick and we don’t really understand the bigger picture.  Remember Hicks and Gillet? Remember the lawyers, the accountants, the IT experts, the financiers, the activists, the retired postmen, the grafters, the construction workers, the students.  People from all backgrounds and all reds who came together in a brilliant example of consumer activism.  That’s who your talking to now and who are on this forum. Don’t talk down to us like we are a load of gobshites.

So why are people still buying Nike replica shirts if they are so concerned about human rights? Simple question.

[Barrow Shaun]

This thread is now 169 pages of....   of.....

Supermatch game, Supermatch game....

I'd say 'nothing.'

For 50 blanks, what do you say? (I have the answers, and I was nowhere near.)

[Red Beret]

Yeah I bet you do - keep regurgitating what the media tell you.

Let me guess - we're all little gullible sheepie, right?

[NaivetyinBlack]

Dont they already have Newcastle so "shouldnt" be able to buy anyone else

Mind according to some they dont own Newcastle 🤣🤣

Hence the "private sector" quote. It'll be some entity or fund backed by the state but with no connections on paper.

The very fact that the sports minister is promoting a takeover means it is a very real possibility.

[MPowerYNWA]

As someone who spent a long time in South Asia, it feels like human rights are ignored when those countries and being exploited by the west.  People only start to get uncomfortable when they see wealthy Asians buying up assets in their countries. Unconscious racism / bias - I’ve seen this first hand.

[Qston]

So why are people still buying Nike replica shirts if they are so concerned about human rights? Simple question.

This is 'whataboutery' of the highest order. If you take this to its logical conclusion I couldn't buy anything, drive anything or live anywhere.

I am not disputing that there are numerous issues in the world but at it's simplest I don't want my club associated with middle Eastern oil states with appalling human rights records

[MPowerYNWA]

This is 'whataboutery' of the highest order. If you take this to its logical conclusion I couldn't buy anything, drive anything or live anywhere.

I am not disputing that there are numerous issues in the world but at it's simplest I want my club i don't want my club associated with middle Eastern oil states with appalling human rights records

Ah yes, the convenient get out of  ‘whataboutery’ - we are accountable, so let’s not be selective.

[Johnny Foreigner]

God knows we have had our arguments over the years  in here with FSG and glass half full/empty.. If the saudis or whoever comes in, i have to lose 20 pounds - get into my standards corrupted shirt and start marching again.. losing against brentford is all right under that conditions, but not boring at least

[beardsleyismessimk1]

Nah, cretin shout. I'm a wool and I'd be done the minute we announce a Saudi takeover.

What are people going to do when they take over the whole country ? They already own 11% of it ?
In fact is 11% enough to make you think to leave the UK?  As you don't know where and when you are contributing to the devil you hate so much ?

[MPowerYNWA]

What are people going to do when they take over the whole country ? They already own 11% of it ?
In fact is 11% enough to make you think to leave the UK?  As you don't know where and when you are contributing to the devil you hate so much ?

True. They own a large chunk of Sainsbury’s, something like a quarter of Heathrow airport, own Harrods outright and significant chunks of property in the prime parts of London.

It’s their money that creates a huge inflow into the coffers of our government too - good old arm sales and the like.

If memory serves me correctly I believe they also built the USA embassy in London too?

They are loved by UK politicians from Labour and Conservatives, as well as our royalty.

[beardsleyismessimk1]

This is 'whataboutery' of the highest order. If you take this to its logical conclusion I couldn't buy anything, drive anything or live anywhere.

I am not disputing that there are numerous issues in the world but at it's simplest I don't want my club associated with middle Eastern oil states with appalling human rights records

Forget your club , what about the country you live in being heavily associated with them ? You going to leave the UK bad boy ?

[Bergersrightwingviews]

What are people going to do when they take over the whole country ? They already own 11% of it ?
In fact is 11% enough to make you think to leave the UK?  As you don't know where and when you are contributing to the devil you hate so much ?

There is nothing we can do about that. I can choose whether I continue to support Liverpool or not. As far as I’m concerned, if the Saudis buy the club then it will be dead.

[beardsleyismessimk1]

They own a large chunk of Sainsbury’s, something like a quarter of Heathrow airport, own Harrods outright and significant chunks of property in the prime parts of London.

And God only knows what else. Best friends with the king to

[reddebs]

Jesus fucking Christ we haven't half picked up some amoral gobshites in recent times.

How the fuck has that happened?

[Samie]

Jesus fucking Christ we haven't half picked up some amoral gobshites in recent times.

How the fuck has that happened?

Winning trophies brings it's downsides too.

[beardsleyismessimk1]

There is nothing we can do about that. I can choose whether I continue to support Liverpool or not. As far as I’m concerned, if the Saudis buy the club then it will be dead.

You can choose to leave the UK as it means so much to you. Moreover weren't people saying if the Germans cared so much they shouldn't have gone to the WC?  So if you care so much probably best to pack your bags and head to Norway.  I hear they have plenty of their own reserves where they don't have to rely on the middle east so much.

[Sharado]

Forget your club , what about the country you live in being heavily associated with them ? You going to leave the UK bad boy ?

It's up to any individual where they draw their moral lines. Plenty will draw them at Saudi or other state ownership. If you don't draw your lines there, fine, that's for you to decide. Saying people can only care about one thing if they care about everything is complete and utter bullshit.

[Avens]

Forget your club , what about the country you live in being heavily associated with them ? You going to leave the UK bad boy ?

Sorry but what is your suggestion? Is it genuinely "don't stand up for anything at all"?

I know these arguments keep resurfacing but I'd like to get a direct answer to this question from someone who engages in this whataboutery.

[thaddeus]

There is nothing we can do about that. I can choose whether I continue to support Liverpool or not. As far as I’m concerned, if the Saudis buy the club then it will be dead.

Saudi Arabia owning - indirectly or not - Newcastle, Man U and Liverpool would be a fitting end to professional football for me.  I'll be devastated if we end up owned by sportswashing despots but knowing the whole Premier League is sinking into the cesspit would soften the blow the tiniest amount.

I'm not sure at what stage the other clubs might make a stand or do they just stand in line and wait for their own despotic owners?

[beardsleyismessimk1]

It's up to any individual where they draw their moral lines. Plenty will draw them at Saudi or other state ownership. If you don't draw your lines there, fine, that's for you to decide. Saying people can only care about one thing if they care about everything is complete and utter bullshit.

Or just pick and choose what suits your own agenda . That's very moral

[Bergersrightwingviews]

You can choose to leave the UK as it means so much to you. Moreover weren't people saying if the Germans cared so much they shouldn't have gone to the WC?  So if you care so much probably best to pack your bags and head to Norway.  I hear they have plenty of their own reserves where they don't have to rely on the middle east so much.

You are trying everyone’s patience with your moronic false equivalences. Do fuck off now.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Ah yes, the convenient get out of  ‘whataboutery’ - we are accountable, so let’s not be selective.

"Yet you participate in society" etc...

To paraphrase a user on here, who I must apologize to but I cannot remember who it was, but "I do not believe you cannot stand against anything, because you can't stand against everything"

The world is terrible, abuses everywhere, that does not mean you cannot stand against human rights abusers in your own way where you can in the means you can.

I can buy clothes and still shout out against sweat shops as a wrong in society. And I can still protest against sportswashers potentially taking over the club I love, without boycotting all of society.

Everyone has their own principles that they stand for, their own line in the sand. Reacting in different ways to different societal ills doesn't make you a hypocrite.

[MPowerYNWA]

Are we happy with US ownership as our human rights role model?

The Biden administration has determined that Saudi Arabia’s Crown Prince, Mohammed bin Salman, should be granted immunity in a case brought against him by the fiancée of Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi, whom the administration has said was murdered at the prince’s direction.

[Sharado]

Or just pick and choose what suits your own agenda . That's very moral

Mate I'm sure qanon has its own forums do us all a favour and fuck off to them

[taylorb1991]

It’s just funny how people on here keep threatening to stop supporting the club because they have some owners they don’t like.  It’s all attention seeking nonsense - we all know that none of them would walk away from the club, it is too much a part of their life.

Worst still we know it’s all virtue signalling - people on here saying such things reek of hypocrisy. Throwing around words like sportswashing, like they even have a clue about what’s going on in the world.  Somehow trying to feel superior.

It was only at the start of the millennium that the UK armed forces even allowed openly gay people to be in its services - where were these people then with their protests of human rights ? 

If people genuinely feel that resentful of human rights abuses to the point they would stop supporting a club ingrained in their DNA, I would expect that passionate defence of human rights to exist in most basic aspects of their lives but they don’t. 

The problem with people in the main is they jump on bandwagons with a very shallow understanding. Remember green fell, clap for the NHS etc. People soon forgot once the media stopped talking about it.  It gets tedious to keep seeing the virtue signalling and melodramatic actions of posters in response.

I’m sure people on here will twist my words, that’s just what forums do, but spend 2 mins now researching where Nike replica shirts come from, and then come back and talk to me about how passionate you really all are about human rights.

All BS and only being mentioned because the media have spoon fed you to say it.

Go and support Man City. You won't be missed

[Chakan]

Or just pick and choose what suits your own agenda . That's very moral

Better than standing for nothing.

[Caps4444]

If it were to be an Oil state, I presume the order of preference would be:

Dubai
Kuwait
Qatar
Saudi Arabia

[beardsleyismessimk1]

Sorry but what is your suggestion? Is it genuinely "don't stand up for anything at all"?

I know these arguments keep resurfacing but I'd like to get a direct answer to this question from someone who engages in this whataboutery.

The biggest problem here is you think you have a choice. But you know, thats what they like you to think and believe.  Oh and you're free as well. Autonomous indeed

[Qston]

Forget your club , what about the country you live in being heavily associated with them ? You going to leave the UK bad boy ?

Bad boy? Grow up. I am a middle aged man. As for leaving 'my country' I am constantly embarrassed about the country I live in for many different reasons including the selling of arms to the Saudis and many others too numerous to mention.

[Sharado]

The biggest problem here is you think you have a choice. But you know, thats what they like you to think and believe.  Oh and you're free as well. Autonomous indeed

Hahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahhahahajajajajajajjajajajajajajajajjaajjajajaja

Tell you what we should get Matt le tissier in as our next manager, we need a free thinker at the top

[NaivetyinBlack]

Jesus fucking Christ we haven't half picked up some amoral gobshites in recent times.

How the fuck has that happened?

The club, with it's rich history and recent success is a beacon for all kinds of football fans with opinions different from each other. You can't call them amoral when almost all the developed world supports the middle east in some way or the other.

The gatekeepers of selective morality will just have to get on the streets and protest, while wearing standard chartered t shirts.

Personally speaking, I want us to continue with the self sustainable model we have built, as it reaffirms our great work on and off the pitch, but I won't stop supporting the club if it results in a Saudi takeover.