Topic: FSG discussion thread

[Son of Spion]

I think the current unpleasant atmosphere around FSG, and debates around ownership, comes from a vacuum. No one knows what's happening, no ones really making a statement, there's misleading reports, rumours, a lack of clarity and so people are filling the gap. I've become a bit sanguine about it all really. Football's just done for, isn't it? At the top level at least. To compete properly we probably do need something that looks more like Man City than looks like FSG. But I don't really want that. So here we are.

I think this is it. No one has a clue what, if anything, is actually going on, so it all feels rather rudderless at a time when the team is struggling too. That makes a lot of people anxious, and naturally so. Radio silence from the club then sees the rumour mill filling the blank space.

[grenny158]

I think this is it. No one has a clue what, if anything, is actually going on, so it all feels rather rudderless at a time when the team is struggling too. That makes a lot of people anxious, and naturally so. Radio silence from the club then sees the rumour mill filling the blank space.

Ultimately, and especially so in the absence of any hard facts, people will believe what they want to believe. In the age of social media, any post which offers some kind of confirmation of an individuals point of view, is leapt upon much like Luis Suarez on an opponents shoulder. This, in turn, compounds uncertainty.

"Peace is accepting today, releasing yesterday, and giving up the need to control tomorrow." Lori Deschene.

[Dave McCoy]

A few appointments would probably help. Its not great that we've seemingly 'cleared the decks' in preparation for something that most reliable sources seem to be telling us there's very little interest in.

Aside from Ward’s replacement who else is needed now that the team doctor is named? I get Graham and possibly more analysts are leaving but they wouldn’t be making any real decisions anyway.

[PhiLFC#1]

Pearces answers in his AMA on Reddit today:

Why do you think Liverpool's major transfers have been more focused on reinforcing the attack rather than the midfield? Was the club worried about life after Firmino, Salah and Mane or did the club think Hendo, Milner, Thiago and Fabinho was suitable enough?


TheAthletic_HQ

11 min. ago
Rewind just over a year and there was growing concern over the age of LFC's frontline. Salah, Mane, Firmino were either 30 or close to turning 30, and all three had 18 months left on their deals. That's why there's been such a strong focus on future-proofing that department of the squad.
Keeping one, selling one and letting one run down his contract always looked the most likely outcome and so far it's turned out that way.
With Diaz, Nunez and Gakpo on board it's a very different looking attack now.
You could argue (and I would) that they should have already started the same process with the midfield. But the reality is no-one at LFC foresaw the drop off in levels we've seen this season. I wrote many times last summer that LFC needed another elite CM (mainly because I felt the back-ups weren't good or durable enough). LFC would argue they sat tight because they couldn't get any of the targets they really wanted.
I do think there's been a fair bit of revisionism. I keep reading people saying 'this was so predictable' about the midfield struggles but Fabinho/Thiago/Henderson nearly helped LFC win the lot in 21-22.

Thanks for doing this, it's always fun to get insight from journos actually connected to the club in some way. I have four questions that I want to ask if you don't mind indulging me.

Firstly, how significant an impact did COVID and the "lost season" have on the club's squad building and did we miss out on selling a few players?

Second, do you, in your opinion, think the club has made a massive mistake prioritizing the signing of Jude Bellingham, rather publicly in some instances over rebuilding the midfield as a whole? We might end up with the lad next summer, but that doesn't change the fact that we need an overhaul next season.

Third, Cody Gakpo. Despite all the calls for a midfield signing, we ended up with a forward who likely will be our only incoming player this window. Could I ask your opinion on the transfer and whether you think that was the right move?

Lastly, is there any truth to the supposed 250m euro war chest that Liverpool FC will have for the summer window as reported by German sources?

TheAthletic_HQ

19 min. ago
One - Yeah the pandemic certainly set LFC back. Both in terms of what they could do in terms of incomings but also in terms of generating £££ from sales. I'd
Two - I don't think prioritising the signing of Bellingham is a mistake. I think he ticks every box for LFC and would be a mainstay of the midfield for the next decade. But of course they need more than him this summer. With Keita, Oxlade and Milner out of contract, a midfield overhaul is coming.
Three - Personally, I'd have liked to see LFC bring in a CM ahead of Gakpo. I know Jota/Diaz have been sorely missed and there was a vacancy on the left, but I would have said an injection of quality in midfield was needed to a greater extent. When everyone is fit (hopefully next month) I see a front 3 of Diaz, Nunez, Salah. I know LFC felt that had to move when they did for Gakpo because of interest from elsewhere and fears the fee would go up if he stayed put and scored loads more before the summer.
Four - I certainly haven't heard that. I think it's around the figure that needs to be spent in the summer to get Bellinghan and do what else needs to be done in the market. But no I don't believe that kind of amount has already been earmarked.
It's one of the reasons why FSG are seeking fresh investment. Question is what happens if they don't secure it before the summer? I don't know the answer to that one at this stage.

I appreciated The Athletic's insightful piece on the Liverpool medical staff from earlier in the season. Has there been any noticeable improvement since Jonathan Power was appointed?

I think most here would agree that one of the massive frustrations with the club is the injury track record. Moreover, injuries that are reported by the club as a couple of weeks seem to frequently lapse into months.

Edit: h/t to Briarcliff for pointing out it was Simon Hughes as the author


TheAthletic_HQ

30 min. ago
Too early to judge any real impact/change with the new doc. He's only just started.
Been a source of huge frustration for everyone at Kirkby this season, especially after days lost to injuries were cut by a third last season.
I don't believe the long gap between Moxon going and Power coming in is a real factor in those issues. All started with all the issues in pre-season - that led to some players being overplayed and breaking down, while others were rushed back from injury and then suffered setbacks.
Hope is with VVD, Firmino, Jota and Arthur due back in Feb that second half of the season will be better on that front.

Hi James, is the club going to get bought by Qatar or someone else soon? There has been a lot of talk about it. Can you shed some light on these rumours?


TheAthletic_HQ

38 min. ago
(Tin hat on)..... I'm not aware there's been any recent change. When rumours about being bought by Qatar emerged earlier this month I checked them out with various people. Senior figures at FSG were adamant it wasn't true and insisted they weren't on the brink of doing a deal with anyone. They also made it clear that as things stood selling a minority stake looked more likely than a full sale.
Obviously, it's an ongoing process and things could change but my info is that so far FSG haven't had an offer that's attractive enough.

You used to regularly lead us along as deals were happening or scouting was underway. These days, you only break news once other Tier 1s have already broken it.

Is this because the club has deliberately locked leaks down, or you’re worried about your standing with the club in case you leak it early/get it wrong?


TheAthletic_HQ

44 min. ago
I wouldn't agree with that. I've written lots of pieces for our subscribers in the past 12/24 months about playing who are being seriously looked at, on LFC shortlists etc. The Athletic has broken numerous big LFC news stories in that period too. It's policy not to just tweet news when we get it but to write the story first and then tweet it out with the link. That's obviously a gamble as it means in that 10/15mins period someone else could break the news but no real value to the company in a tweet with no link to an actual story.
A lot of my work on that front involves trying to get details on how a deal came together etc. You own a news story for barely minutes these days but those in depth reads are really popular.

TheAthletic_HQ

2 minutes ago
Jota should be full training by mid-Feb, Diaz in March. FSG's search for new investors is ongoing and as things stand I'm not expecting any more new signings before Tuesday's deadline. (But I'd dearly love to be surprised by some late activity!)

James, why did you constantly defend FSG's lack of investment over the summer? Why did you say there was "no glaring issues" with the squad when everyone and their blind grandmother could see we needed midfield signings? Why do you treat the fanbase like fucking idiots that don't see your constant flip flopping of narratives?


TheAthletic_HQ

10 min. ago
No need to be rude. I certainly didn't 'defend' FSG's lack of investment over the summer. I think you're referring to a tweet I put out in early July pushing a link to a story prior to the pre-season tour of Asia. I stand by every word of it!
My point at the time was LFC had enjoyed a productive start to the summer. They had sorted out Salah's contract, they had got the sale of Mane and the purchase of Nunez done quickly, and added cover in key positions with Carvalho/Ramsay. There was good reason for optimism at that stage.
I wrote many articles in the summer about how they needed another CM after missing out on Tchouameni. Until the injuries really kicked in, Klopp was adamant he didn't need anyone else. There was no flip flopping of narratives so you're wrong there.

[Son of Spion]

Ultimately, and especially so in the absence of any hard facts, people will believe what they want to believe. In the age of social media, any post which offers some kind of confirmation of an individuals point of view, is leapt upon much like Luis Suarez on an opponents shoulder. This, in turn, compounds uncertainty.

"Peace is accepting today, releasing yesterday, and giving up the need to control tomorrow." Lori Deschene.

I definitely agree with that. But mindfully living in the present moment is not something football fans are renowned for.

[Eeyore]

Aside from Ward’s replacement who else is needed now that the team doctor is named? I get Graham and possibly more analysts are leaving but they wouldn’t be making any real decisions anyway.

A replacement for Mike Gordon.

[Samie]

Mike Gordon's replacement is Billy Hogan. The equivalent of a Gordon would be for the new owners. 

[Eeyore]

Mike Gordon's replacement is Billy Hogan. The equivalent of a Gordon would be for the new owners. 

Hogan isn't able to make major decisions though. I mean Henry didn't even bother to tell him about the ESL plans and had to apologise to him.

[Samie]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

[67CherryRed]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

I'm imagining Hulk replacing Anthony in a Sean Dyche Everton side.

[Eeyore]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

Hogan was Peter Moore's replacement.

[4pool]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

And that Hogan is on the email list now. 

[BornRedSince76]

Whilst there is disagreement amongst people on whether FSG have been good, bad or whatever, is there consensus that it is time for them to go?

[Pradan]

Whilst there is disagreement amongst people on whether FSG have been good, bad or whatever, is there consensus that it is time for them to go?

Depends on the alternative. If it's a human rights abusing state then i hope they stay here for the rest of my lifetime.

[LFCTikiTaka]

Whilst there is disagreement amongst people on whether FSG have been good, bad or whatever, is there consensus that it is time for them to go?

I'd rather they stay and fund the rebuild we need. But if they can't do that then they need to go.

[McSquared]

I'd rather they stay and fund the rebuild we need. But if they can't do that then they need to go.

Personally i’d rather they stayed and invested in the club, but if they can’t there is no point in them staying. If they do cash in,  I hope we get a non sportswashing owner who is prepared to invest in the team and sort the c level, scouting and medical structure out. As one of the richest clubs in the world, that isn’t too much to ask is it? Otherwise we are just going backwards. Thank fuck we have got Klopp.

[Son of Spion]

Whilst there is disagreement amongst people on whether FSG have been good, bad or whatever, is there consensus that it is time for them to go?

For me, it depends on whether they are willing to fully commit to competing or not. If they are, then great. If not, it's time for them to take their profit and sell up.

Do they have the stomach for the rebuild? If not, they need to sell up. Klopp has the stomach for it, but he needs proper backing.

[Eeyore]

For me, it depends on whether they are willing to fully commit to competing or not. If they are, then great. If not, it's time for them to take their profit and sell up.

Do they have the stomach for the rebuild? If not, they need to sell up. Klopp has the stomach for it, but he needs proper backing.

I think that is it in a nutshell.

[HeartAndSoul]

For me, it depends on whether they are willing to fully commit to competing or not. If they are, then great. If not, it's time for them to take their profit and sell up.

Do they have the stomach for the rebuild? If not, they need to sell up. Klopp has the stomach for it, but he needs proper backing.

Amen to that. Decided to put the club up for sale once they knew a massive rebuild was needed. So either back the rebuild or fuck off

[please, I have my reasons for it but...]

Pearces answers in his AMA on Reddit today:

Thanks for doing this, it's always fun to get insight from journos actually connected to the club in some way. I have four questions that I want to ask if you don't mind indulging me.

Firstly, how significant an impact did COVID and the "lost season" have on the club's squad building and did we miss out on selling a few players?

Second, do you, in your opinion, think the club has made a massive mistake prioritizing the signing of Jude Bellingham, rather publicly in some instances over rebuilding the midfield as a whole? We might end up with the lad next summer, but that doesn't change the fact that we need an overhaul next season.

Third, Cody Gakpo. Despite all the calls for a midfield signing, we ended up with a forward who likely will be our only incoming player this window. Could I ask your opinion on the transfer and whether you think that was the right move?

Lastly, is there any truth to the supposed 250m euro war chest that Liverpool FC will have for the summer window as reported by German sources?

TheAthletic_HQ

19 min. ago
One - Yeah the pandemic certainly set LFC back. Both in terms of what they could do in terms of incomings but also in terms of generating £££ from sales. I'd
Two - I don't think prioritising the signing of Bellingham is a mistake. I think he ticks every box for LFC and would be a mainstay of the midfield for the next decade. But of course they need more than him this summer. With Keita, Oxlade and Milner out of contract, a midfield overhaul is coming.
Three - Personally, I'd have liked to see LFC bring in a CM ahead of Gakpo. I know Jota/Diaz have been sorely missed and there was a vacancy on the left, but I would have said an injection of quality in midfield was needed to a greater extent. When everyone is fit (hopefully next month) I see a front 3 of Diaz, Nunez, Salah. I know LFC felt that had to move when they did for Gakpo because of interest from elsewhere and fears the fee would go up if he stayed put and scored loads more before the summer.
Four - I certainly haven't heard that. I think it's around the figure that needs to be spent in the summer to get Bellinghan and do what else needs to be done in the market. But no I don't believe that kind of amount has already been earmarked.
It's one of the reasons why FSG are seeking fresh investment. Question is what happens if they don't secure it before the summer? I don't know the answer to that one at this stage.

Seems like our bank account has got a long COVID, if two years removed from the pandemic we're still suffering from it.

[TepidT2O]

This is all quite tiresome.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

This is all quite tiresome.

I've got a smoke for that 

[Hazell]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

Are the rumours there's been some disagreements between him and Klopp about bringing Can back to the club true? Klopp's not keen but Hogan fights for the rights of Emre Can.

[please, I have my reasons for it but...]

That doesn't change the fact that Hogan is Gordon's replacement mate. 

I heard Hogan is the third man, brother!

[Samie]

 

You dickheads!

[killer-heels]

When do the club accounts in terms of profit/loss come out. Thats now probably second behind the Madrid game in terms of moment of the season.

[MBL?]

I've got a smoke for that 

Can I have some?

[Eeyore]

When do the club accounts in terms of profit/loss come out. Thats now probably second behind the Madrid game in terms of moment of the season.

Usually first week in March.

[MBL?]

We probably won’t hear anything solid till it is fairly far along with a potential buyer. It’s not going to be like chelsea since it was a much different situation with political implications and the fact that the tories were involved.

I do prefer this thread being open myself since this is a better place for info or rumour discussion than social media.

[killer-heels]

Usually first week in March.

Cant wait. Will also be second in internet fume generation after the day Bellingham signs for City or Madrid.

[Cafe De Paris]

I think we’re stuck with this lot. Could be worse. We could be run by a sports washer Middle East country and enjoying transfers galore, a midfield that would make the galacticos look shit, then sing and dance as another trophy lines the cabinet through their oil money,  all the while at the back of your mind feeling sick to the stomach for selling the clubs soul and everything Shankly Paisley Kenny and Klopp stand up for is washed away because we needed investment. No thank you. There are other ways to skin a cat (ps. I do like cats, apologies)

[Sheer Magnetism]

I heard Hogan is the third man, brother!

YESSSS 

[ScouserAtHeart]

I heard Hogan is the third man, brother!

You can call this the New World Order of wrestling football, brother

[grenny158]

I definitely agree with that. But mindfully living in the present moment is not something football fans are renowned for.

Fair point 

[grenny158]

For me, it depends on whether they are willing to fully commit to competing or not. If they are, then great. If not, it's time for them to take their profit and sell up.

Do they have the stomach for the rebuild? If not, they need to sell up. Klopp has the stomach for it, but he needs proper backing.

Yep, the club and it's short/medium/long term future is always the most important factor - if they are up for the rebuild and have the deep pockets necessary for it, then great. The real issue here is that, if they do sell up, what if the new owners themselves do not have the funds necessary for the rebuild. You would hope that they do, but what guarantees are there that it will be the case?

I guess the real question here is: If FSG sell, will the interests of the club's future be their guiding principle when selecting who to sell to, or will their own profit be the primary concern - or both? Hopefully it is 'both' but there are absolutely no guarantees of that.

[Henry Gale]

Whilst there is disagreement amongst people on whether FSG have been good, bad or whatever, is there consensus that it is time for them to go?

Time for them to fuck off.

[Barneylfc∗]

Time for them to fuck off.

At all costs?

[MonsLibpool]

At all costs?

The relationship has run its course.

[El Lobo]

It’s not until someone actually makes an offer to buy us, which by most accounts no one has

[Barneylfc∗]

The relationship has run its course.

That's not what I asked.