Topic: LIVERPOOL TRANSFER THREAD 2023 - archived discussions about what’s offensive

[Lynndenberries]

No reason he shouldn’t be. Huge question marks against his durability and more importantly, quality. Only reason to keep him would be the passport he has.

Yeah, not quite sure it's that ridiculous of an idea. He has over 50 PL appearances for us and I'm still not sure where he fits in. Broke through as an attacker, now being moved into midfield, but can't stay fit and remains unconvincing as on 8. On top of that, we need money and he would probably bring in £20m+.

[Kopenhagen]

No reason he shouldn’t be. Huge question marks against his durability and more importantly, quality. Only reason to keep him would be the passport he has.

I agree, but I really don't see this management team washing their hands of him, particularly considering his passport. It just won't happen.

[Fromola]

Yeah, not quite sure it's that ridiculous of an idea. He has over 50 PL appearances for us and I'm still not sure where he fits in. Broke through as an attacker, now being moved into midfield, but can't stay fit and remains unconvincing as on 8. On top of that, we need money and he would probably bring in £20m+.

I don't think any of our midfielders fit in, in terms of our current options.

Keita - fitness issues, injury prone,  never really trusted by Klopp and leaving on a free. Despite all that he's in the team on merit right now and we need him to stay fit.

Henderson - doesn't have the legs anymore

Fabinho - massively off his game and needs the legs around him which he hasn't had

Thiago - turns 32 in April, injury prone, needs the legs around him, last year of his deal next season

Jones - wasted the chance to really stake his claim by constant niggling injuries for 2 years. Not kicked on since 19/20. Just a number.

Milner - now 37 and seems to get more games at right back now. He's not a 90 minute or 2 games a week option now.

Arthur - won't even play unless we get a bunch of injuries and then sent back

That basically just leaves Bajcetic who is an 18 year old with a few games under his belt

[PeterTheRed ...]

Don't think it's a good idea to let all our players run down their contracts just because we're struggling for funds to sign new players. Where did you get that idea from?

Well, you won't get much money this summer for players who will be 32 years old. Letting them run down their contracts until the age of 33 makes much more sense. And our revenues allow us to sign 2 quality senior players per season ...

[Bergersrightwingviews]

Yeah, not quite sure it's that ridiculous of an idea. He has over 50 PL appearances for us and I'm still not sure where he fits in. Broke through as an attacker, now being moved into midfield, but can't stay fit and remains unconvincing as on 8. On top of that, we need money and he would probably bring in £20m+.

I thought he was the heir apparent to Gini, but he just hasn’t kicked on and the durability is a real issue. I reckon he will leave sooner or later and end up being the best player for a very decent PL side but probably never a top 6 one.

[67CherryRed]

I thought he was the heir apparent to Gini, but he just hasn’t kicked on and the durability is a real issue. I reckon he will leave sooner or later and end up being the best player for a very decent PL side but probably never a top 6 one.

Nevermind Gini, when watching him run the show for the under 18s I thought we had another Gerrard on our hands    As with most of the squad it's definitely time to be ruthless, loan him to a PL side and if he doesn't excel we should definitely look to cash in when he comes back.

[Dave McCoy]

Jones is absolutely not on the chopping block.

Why shouldn't he be?

Edit: Looks like someone else asked you so no worries.

[TepidT2O]

I don't think any of our midfielders fit in, in terms of our current options.

Keita - fitness issues, injury prone,  never really trusted by Klopp and leaving on a free. Despite all that he's in the team on merit right now and we need him to stay fit.

Henderson - doesn't have the legs anymore

Fabinho - massively off his game and needs the legs around him which he hasn't had

Thiago - turns 32 in April, injury prone, needs the legs around him, last year of his deal next season

Jones - wasted the chance to really stake his claim by constant niggling injuries for 2 years. Not kicked on since 19/20. Just a number.

Milner - now 37 and seems to get more games at right back now. He's not a 90 minute or 2 games a week option now.

Arthur - won't even play unless we get a bunch of injuries and then sent back

That basically just leaves Bajcetic who is an 18 year old with a few games under his belt

On Thiago, his defensive stats put him as the second best midfielder in the league… he doesn’t need legs to help him..

It’s the others who need legs

[rossipersempre]

Jones is absolutely not on the chopping block.

Solanke type money and he's a goner IMO. Unless he steps up massively in the next 4 months. There'll never be a better time for him to claim a place in a decimated and dysfunctional midfield, and if he can't manage that, sorry but it's time to find to someone who can. He's had enough experience by now, and isn't a teenager anymore, now 22 only a couple of weeks younger than Enzo Fernandez.

[JackWard33]

Sort of feels like we should’ve found a loan for Jones this window
He’s got a shit ton of talent but he desperately needs significant minutes to develop and he’s not going to get them with us at the moment or at the maximum they’ll be sporadic

[redmark]

Solanke type money and he's a goner IMO. Unless he steps up massively in the next 4 months. There'll never be a better time for him to claim a place in a decimated and dysfunctional midfield, and if he can't manage that, sorry but it's time to find to someone who can. He's had enough experience by now, and isn't a teenager anymore, now 22 only a couple of weeks younger than Enzo Fernandez.

Solanke type money, maybe. But even if he doesn't become the player we all hope(d) he would, he still has value. Squads need options. Better a young option, on less than £50k/week, not just homegrown but club trained. There's no rush to move on someone like Jones when we'll have to fill that squad position anyway, with a transfer fee and potentially higher wages (and maybe older, when we need to reduce the average age of our midfielders) and juggle homegrown numbers. And beyond that, there remains a chance he'll become something like the player we hope(d).

[Schmidt]

Sort of feels like we should’ve found a loan for Jones this window
He’s got a shit ton of talent but he desperately needs significant minutes to develop and he’s not going to get them with us at the moment or at the maximum they’ll be sporadic

He's not? If he could stay fit he would have played a ton this season due to everyone else being either injured or awful. If everyone stays fit and we end up mostly playing once a week I can see him struggling for minutes, but otherwise I think he'll get games if he gets fit.

[Dave McCoy]

He's not? If he could stay fit he would have played a ton this season due to everyone else being either injured or awful. If everyone stays fit and we end up mostly playing once a week I can see him struggling for minutes, but otherwise I think he'll get games if he gets fit.

He could be playing now over Keita or the first one off the bench yet he's not. I've a long history of Jones skepticism but at some point if he's healthy and Klopp still is barely playing him then it I think that says more than anything else.

[TepidT2O]

He could be playing now over Keita or the first one off the bench yet he's not. I've a long history of Jones skepticism but at some point if he's healthy and Klopp still is barely playing him then it I think that says more than anything else.

This is of course rubbish.

Because Jones has something other players don’t.  He’s club and association trained.  Gold dust.  That some here cannot see that is quite astonishing.  He’s a really valuable member of our squad for that reason.

The lad has had a really quite serious injury.  He’s getting over it, but it’s not an injury you just wait 6 weeks and then do some laps and way hay you’re fit again.

Will Jones ever be first name on the team sheet? Probably not, but he’s a really good club trained player.

[JackWard33]

He's not? If he could stay fit he would have played a ton this season due to everyone else being either injured or awful. If everyone stays fit and we end up mostly playing once a week I can see him struggling for minutes, but otherwise I think he'll get games if he gets fit.

I’d put his over / under on starts between now and the end of the season at 5

[LiamG]

Keeping all the older underperforming players is part of the problem though right? In Henderson’s case definitely he’s physically gone and I’d be surprised if he ever got that back.

You'd think though that Henderson steps into the Milner role, the older head of the squad, We can't just get rid of everyone in one summer

[WhereAngelsPlay]

This turned into the 'Slag our Own off' thread ?

[TepidT2O]

You'd think though that Henderson steps into the Milner role, the older head of the squad, We can't just get rid of everyone in one summer

This in a nutshell.  And what happens when you do?  See Souness for details

[LiamG]

Yes, that would be a very good squad. And with Thiago and Matip being out of contract in the summer of 2024, we can then bring in a defensive midfielder and a left-footed central defender ...

Yeah, 3 players this summer and 3 players the summer would be ideal

[Dave McCoy]

This is of course rubbish.

Because Jones has something other players don’t.  He’s club and association trained.  Gold dust.  That some here cannot see that is quite astonishing.  He’s a really valuable member of our squad for that reason.

The lad has had a really quite serious injury.  He’s getting over it, but it’s not an injury you just wait 6 weeks and then do some laps and way hay you’re fit again.

Will Jones ever be first name on the team sheet? Probably not, but he’s a really good club trained player.

You know there's not a quota, right? You could play with no HG players if you wanted.

[TepidT2O]

You know there's not a quota, right? You could play with no HG players if you wanted.

If you were shit at your job, yes.

[Flaccido Dongingo]

Jones is just not of the required quality for a team with aspirations of being at the top of the table, our midfield is dross right now and he isn't starting games.

[MonsLibpool]

Jones is just not of the required quality for a team with aspirations of being at the top of the table, our midfield is dross right now and he isn't starting games.

I thought he looked very mature when he started playing regularly but he has stagnated because he hasn't added output/decisiveness to his game.

[TepidT2O]

Jones is just not of the required quality for a team with aspirations of being at the top of the table, our midfield is dross right now and he isn't starting games.

He’s not been able to due to a serious injury

[Schmidt]

He could be playing now over Keita or the first one off the bench yet he's not. I've a long history of Jones skepticism but at some point if he's healthy and Klopp still is barely playing him then it I think that says more than anything else.

He's only just back and tends to occupy the same spot as Thiago, you used Keita as an example but he came off the bench how many times before getting a start?

[classycarra]

Worth remembering almost everyone spoke of Keita this way while he was coming back from injury too, now the late adopters are now desperate for him to start.

Jones' recovery from injury has been badly managed all season, but appears to be being more eased in this time than the previous few rushed attempts. During a catastrophic team performance, coming in cold and in an entirely new position, he started as the 6 in an almost 442 with Fabinho against Forest and put in a performance which was far superior to most of the performances we've seen there from Fabinho and Henderson. Let's see if he is being eased in like Keita was first, before jumping to conclusions.

Given the state of our season, we want him playing as much as possible to be able to better assess where he's at - because he's played far too few minutes for some of the definitive judgments being shared above - so hopefully he's finally been better managed in his recovery and can do this (seems like we've also finally moved away from wasting potential dvelopment minutes playing Chamberlain too, which will help). Also favours him that you've got to imagine Klopp won't want to be introducing both Hendo and Fabinho together into games we are looking to keep tight, so he probably jumps one of them as Keita's sub (and maybe we'll stop playing Thiago almost every minute too)

I’d put his over / under on starts between now and the end of the season at 5

I'd bet on over, given how much we've overplayed Thiago

[skipper757]

Regardless of the past, it's now an opportunity for Jones.  If he can get a run of games (and he should have chances now) with the midfield in disarray, and prove himself to Klopp, that's one midfield role and future starter (or rotation player) set.  For players like him and Gomez, they need games, and when we were humming along, even if they were fit, they were never going to get a consistent run as they got back into the team.  And when we had crises, they weren't always fit.  Now they are, and it's time to win the spots that are now very much up for grabs given our struggles and injuries.

[MonsLibpool]

Worth remembering almost everyone spoke of Keita this way while he was coming back from injury too, now the late adopters are now desperate for him to start.

Jones' recovery from injury has been badly managed all season, but appears to be being more eased in this time than the previous few rushed attempts. During a catastrophic team performance, coming in cold and in an entirely new position, he started as the 6 in an almost 442 with Fabinho against Forest and put in a performance which was far superior to most of the performances we've seen there from Fabinho and Henderson. Let's see if he is being eased in like Keita was first, before jumping to conclusions.

Given the state of our season, we want him playing as much as possible to be able to better assess where he's at - because he's played far too few minutes for some of the definitive judgments being shared above - so hopefully he's finally been better managed in his recovery and can do this (seems like we've also finally moved away from wasting potential dvelopment minutes playing Chamberlain too, which will help). Also favours him that you've got to imagine Klopp won't want to be introducing both Hendo and Fabinho together into games we are looking to keep tight, so he probably jumps one of them as Keita's sub (and maybe we'll stop playing Thiago almost every minute too)
I'd bet on over, given how much we've overplayed Thiago

He has the tools to become a very good PL player. Physically, he could hold his own against men from a young age and the technique is there. It's the mental part of his game that has room for improvement (confidence, tactical acumen, composure, consistency, vision...).

[Dave McCoy]

He's only just back and tends to occupy the same spot as Thiago, you used Keita as an example but he came off the bench how many times before getting a start?

I didn't use Keita as an example in anything other than he could be starting over him. Yes he is a predominately left sided player but he has had starts at RCM in the past. Also Thiago has played as the RCM in the past. If Klopp really wanted him to get minutes he could be giving him minutes he could be is the point.

[DonkeyWan]

This is of course rubbish.

Because Jones has something other players don’t.  He’s club and association trained.  Gold dust.  That some here cannot see that is quite astonishing.  He’s a really valuable member of our squad for that reason.

The lad has had a really quite serious injury.  He’s getting over it, but it’s not an injury you just wait 6 weeks and then do some laps and way hay you’re fit again.

Will Jones ever be first name on the team sheet? Probably not, but he’s a really good club trained player.

So was Jay Spearing though. 5 years and 30 appearances fort the senior squad. Jones has alsom been playing for teh senior squad for 5 years and has 85 appearances, so better, but probably because there were more oipportunities for him than Spearing. Club had no probelms letting Spearing go, i doubt they will have much compunction to keep Jones if they think he won't make the cut.

[PeterTheRed ...]

We will only sell Jones in the summer if we need the money to sign the second midfielder after Bellingham. Otherwise, he stays ...

[Samie]

I think we;re signing 3 midfielders mate.

[Schmidt]

I didn't use Keita as an example in anything other than he could be starting over him. Yes he is a predominately left sided player but he has had starts at RCM in the past. Also Thiago has played as the RCM in the past. If Klopp really wanted him to get minutes he could be giving him minutes he could be is the point.

My point was that Keita himself took 4-5 games to get a start after returning from injury, Jones is up to three small cameos so him not starting isn't a sign of anything. That said, I don't think there's the same urgency to start Jones as there was with Keita, as Keita and Thiago is a pretty good partnership when they're both fit. If Jones could get fit I do think we might look to play him, Thiago and Keita all together though, which could be our best combination right now.

[Coolie High]

I wouldn’t sell Jones but he might need a loan.

[67CherryRed]

I wouldn’t sell Jones but he might need a loan.

Should have got one before today then with interest rates going up again.

[jizzspunk]

Any view on Jones playing as the left sided forward whilst the Jota/Diaz injuries clear up?
He's got mobility in possession when he wants and good feet to skip past someone..on the outside or cutting inside..
People don't want to see Oxlade there seemingly, Elliott not for me in that position, admittedly a few good moments in the Brighton cup tie but I just don't think he occupies a defence enough in that role...Jones plays a bit too safe for me in the midfield 3, too many balls back & sideways, just a thought

[PeterTheRed ...]

I think we;re signing 3 midfielders mate.

In the summer? Unlikely. The development of Bajcetic is preventing that. More likely that the 3rd signing will be a left sided central defender, if Matip is to leave ...

[cdav]

In the summer? Unlikely. The development of Bajcetic is preventing that. More likely that the 3rd signing will be a left sided central defender, if Matip is to leave ...

Its got to be 3 midfielders this summer really with how unreliable our options are. A starting 6 and two 8s is what we need, plus a centre back.

Its great Bajcetic has come through and he will definitely save us having to buy a 4th midfielder this summer, but if we want to challenge next season he can't be anything but a really good option at his age and experience

[PeterTheRed ...]

Its got to be 3 midfielders this summer really with how unreliable our options are. A starting 6 and two 8s is what we need, plus a centre back.

Its great Bajcetic has come through and he will definitely save us having to buy a 4th midfielder this summer, but if we want to challenge next season he can't be anything but a really good option at his age and experience

We know how Jurgen reacts when he has a very talented youngster on his hands (Trent, Harvey). He won't buy a player who will stand in the way of Stefan's development. Of course, we can discuss it if you want, but we all know it won't happen ...

[Black Bull Nova]

This turned into the 'Slag our Own off' thread ?

Listen, I am staying out of a number of threads at the moment for the same reason, we are infected. I thought I'd come here as a safe place given we should be talking about prospective players, it's full of the same stuff repeated elsewhere. Let's make sure this attitude does not translate to match days otherwise we are not much higher than our blue brethren and we know where that ends up.