Author Topic: A Song of Ice and Fire general thread: BOOK AND SHOW spoilers galore (Read 234432 times)

Redcap · « **Reply #40 on:** May 30, 2012, 12:49:59 pm »

I don't think it was ever made clear. To be honest I think it's one of the most unconvincing threads of the plot.

It was Joffrey right?

JoeCole · « **Reply #41 on:** May 30, 2012, 01:42:55 pm »

Yeah it was Joffrey, I don't think it's actually confirmed but it's hinted at in a conversation between Jaime and Cersei near the end of ASOS.

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #42 on:** May 30, 2012, 02:39:24 pm »

Tyrion realises it was him on the morning of Joffrey's wedding when he says "I am no stranger to Valyrian steel". Joffrey's reaction pretty much confirms it.

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #43 on:** May 30, 2012, 05:28:51 pm »

Is it explained why he did it? I can't remember.

Why would he anyway? He doesn't know about Jamie and Cersei so why does he want Bran dead?

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #44 on:** May 30, 2012, 08:18:43 pm »

Ah yeah, cheers mate, it's coming back to me now. A lot of the whole story can be traced back to that decision.

Niru Red4ever · « **Reply #45 on:** May 31, 2012, 05:30:26 am »

Quote from: Ritari on May 30, 2012, 05:51:48 pm

<snip>

Frankly, I am still not sure about Baelish's intentions/motivation.

I assume everybody noticed the horn with the dragonglass weapons in episode 8 which were recovered by Sam. If it makes another appearance within the next season; then I will be fairly certain that its the real horn.

Redcap · « **Reply #46 on:** June 1, 2012, 12:24:01 am »

I'd be incredibly surprised if Baelish wanted to be anything less than King on the Iron Throne one day, probably beyond the scope in the books. Even within the scope of the books he's already planning on being the overlord of the Vale, the Riverlands and the North with Sansa. I wouldn't be surprised if Sansa stabbed him in the back before too long though.

JoeCole · « **Reply #47 on:** June 4, 2012, 01:41:59 am »

So apparently the ending to the Season 2 finale will be

Spoiler

The White Walkers attacking the Fist of the First Men

[close]

What a cliffhanger that'll be

Redcap · « **Reply #48 on:** June 4, 2012, 01:32:06 pm »

Well I must say I was a little disappointed in that finale. As expected it merely set the pieces in place for season 3.

Arya-Jaqen: Was done well. Liked it.

Jon and the Half Hand- Did not like how the Lord of Bones suddenly just decided to let them fight instead of holding the Half Hand back. Don't see why they couldn't have done it the way in the books really. The whole thing was a bit silly this season.

The Fist of the North Men- Not bad, although I found it a little silly that Sam was hiding behind a rock. Wtf is the point of that? Are we really to expect that he manages to evade the entire wight horde by hiding behind a rock? Also the Others look quite different to season one. They now look like undead rather than the crystalline creatures they were before. Not sure if I like the change. Feels a lot more prosaic and less alien to me.

Robb and Cat- well done, for what it was. They're making Cat a far more sympathetic character than in the books.

Brienne and Jaime- Very well done. Liked it a lot. The first time we saw a bit more of Brienne's character. She's one of my favourites because she's such an underdog.

Winterfell- I like it that they left the audience thinking that the Ironborn burned down Winterfell. I wonder how many people who haven't read the books will pick up that it makes no sense for a bunch of surrendering Iron Islanders to burn down Winterfell on their way out.

Varys and Roz- What the fuck is up with Roz? Without the doubt the greatest mystery of the show. Will she actually eventually play some important role? Maybe at the end of the series when every other character is dead she'll be one of the ones standing over the decimation?

House of the Undying- Not the worst that could have happened, but pretty unambitious and not anywhere near how it could have been. In the books this was a scene which foreshadowed much. In the books it was just an opportunity to tie up Danaerys's arc for the season and give it a bit more of an emotional kick by bringing in the Drogo illusion at the end. Dracarys was poor, and frankly the dragons should have been a bit bigger by now (as too should Summer and Shaggydog, but oh well). Not sure what was the point of making her maid a traitor at the end. Seems like a pointless decision entirely, except as another excuse to cull more of her entourage. Also it's nice to see that they turned a gay white guy in Xaro into a black straight guy. Another odd decision.

Tyrion and his scene with Shae was very interesting, because it packed quite an emotional punch. Enough of one that even having read the books it made me wonder whether in the show Shae will actually turn out to be loyal to Tyrion. I wonder how this will turn out.

The scene in the Iron Throne throne room.. eh.. it was perfunctory. Margaery Tyrell did well though. Another well cast character.

Sansa and Littlefinger- meh- another scene setter for the next season.

Niru Red4ever · « **Reply #49 on:** June 4, 2012, 03:52:36 pm »

The Half-hand character has been hopelessly butchered. A big reason why I am worried about their inclusion of Blackfish next season; especially the key events where he showed his mettle are already over.

Winterfell's events seemed a bit underwhelming - while they did try build it up by Theon saying that Winterfell is gonna exist for years; the burning somehow did not reflect the enormity of the event.

Niru Red4ever · « **Reply #50 on:** June 4, 2012, 03:55:22 pm »

Quote from: Redcap on June 4, 2012, 01:32:06 pm

Also the Others look quite different to season one. They now look like undead rather than the crystalline creatures they were before. Not sure if I like the change. Feels a lot more prosaic and less alien to me.

The one shown in season one was a zombie, wasn't it? I think we saw the first glimpse of an 'other' at the end of season 2 - the one which looked at Sam and thought 'meh'.

Redcap · « **Reply #51 on:** June 4, 2012, 04:26:33 pm »

Quote from: Niru Red4ever on June 4, 2012, 03:52:36 pm

Winterfell's events seemed a bit underwhelming - while they did try build it up by Theon saying that Winterfell is gonna exist for years; the burning somehow did not reflect the enormity of the event.

Yeah, the scale thing is something someone mentioned in the other thread. And I'm finding it's definitely been the case for a number of key scenes. Winterfell burning should have been one of the defining images of the show so far, but they didn't even have a single decent shot.

Niru Red4ever · « **Reply #52 on:** June 4, 2012, 07:10:59 pm »

Quote from: Ritari on June 4, 2012, 06:06:02 pm

No, the being in the first episode prologue scene that cut Ser Waymar and Gared's heads off was a White Walker (Other).

Cheers; I got confused by the kid wight shown between the two killings.

zebenzui · « **Reply #53 on:** June 4, 2012, 08:09:15 pm »

At Redcap - I agree with you on some points and nt with others.

"Jon and the Half Hand- Did not like how the Lord of Bones suddenly just decided to let them fight instead of holding the Half Hand back. Don't see why they couldn't have done it the way in the books really. The whole thing was a bit silly this season." - I think they wanted to put air time between Jon and Ygritte to build the sexual connection. I would have liked the book way too with the Halfhand, but I think it was clear in the episode that Qhorin held back, and allowed Jon to win, and it was a while before Jon went on the attack.

"The Fist of the North Men- Not bad, although I found it a little silly that Sam was hiding behind a rock. Wtf is the point of that? Are we really to expect that he manages to evade the entire wight horde by hiding behind a rock? Also the Others look quite different to season one. They now look like undead rather than the crystalline creatures they were before. Not sure if I like the change. Feels a lot more prosaic and less alien to me." - I've no idea how they're gonna fluke Sam out of that one, its not until watching this episode that I realise how trolly the Night's Watch hornblowing system is, first blow to lead alog with happy news, then bad news with second horn, then apocalyptic third blow

"Robb and Cat- well done, for what it was. They're making Cat a far more sympathetic character than in the books." - No way, nuhuh, the marriage is terribly done, in the books Robb was wracked with grief over the news that Bran and Rickon had died, and slept with Jeyne Westerling, who was tending his wounds at the time. He married her to preserve her honour, I even remember Catelyn saying how much that made Robb his father's son. The tv adaptation just shows him as some lovestruck pup who does the stupid thing knowing its the stupid thing. I hate this change from the books.

"Winterfell- I like it that they left the audience thinking that the Ironborn burned down Winterfell. I wonder how many people who haven't read the books will pick up that it makes no sense for a bunch of surrendering Iron Islanders to burn down Winterfell on their way out." - It'll work out somehow, they'll shoehorn Ramsay in and the plot thread will correct itself.

"The scene in the Iron Throne throne room.. eh.. it was perfunctory. Margaery Tyrell did well though. Another well cast character." - She was pretty good, and I liked this scene, obviously rehearsed, just like in the book.

"Sansa and Littlefinger- meh- another scene setter for the next season." - they had to do that since they dispensed with Dontos' contribution in book 2.

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #54 on:** June 4, 2012, 11:51:29 pm »

Enjoyed that.

The throne room scene was well done. Clearly staged, just as it was in the books. They didn't take the opportunity to bring Ser Loras into the Kingsguard though. Suppose it isn't plot-essential but it's a strange thing to leave out.

Thought they might drop Jaqen changing his face so ultra-pleased they kept it in.

Poor Theon. Even more humiliating for him than in the book. Hopefully the Winterfell-burning knot will be resolved next season with some Ramsay/Theon scenes.

They played it safe with the House of the Undying. Could at least have given us something relevant to the history of House Targaryen rather than a pointless wander through the throne room.

Robb's marriage makes no sense and it looks like 'Tulisa' is here to stay. Also why did they marry in the eyes of the Seven rather than The Old Gods? Disappointing.

No Ser Barristan in a fake beard. Gutted.

A friend of mine who hasn't read the books has started ASOS today because he doesn't want to wait a year to find out what happens. Had a flick through the first few chapters and everyone's roughly in the right place, it's only how they've got there that's changed. Good job HBO.

Redcap · « **Reply #55 on:** June 5, 2012, 01:25:21 am »

I thought the way they corrected Theon's part of the story was rather neat. This way he'll be out cold and I think we're just going to think he's dead for a number of episodes in the third season, possibly up until close to the RW, when Ramsay sends Robb a piece of his flayed skin. I think they'd need to involve Ramsay minimally at this point, because they wouldn't want to reveal the surprise of which side he's actually on.

Remember that at this point, the Boltons must have actually already turned, with Ramsay having sacked Winterfell.

Although I suppose it may be a little ambiguous here- or maybe I'm just forgetting something. Maybe it's possible that Ramsay actually acted independently to burn Winterfell, and that contributed to Roose turning against Robb later on? I'm still a little unclear as to the exact timeline.

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #56 on:** June 5, 2012, 01:48:50 am »

Quote from: Redcap on June 5, 2012, 01:25:21 am

Although I suppose it may be a little ambiguous here- or maybe I'm just forgetting something. Maybe it's possible that Ramsay actually acted independently to burn Winterfell, and that contributed to Roose turning against Robb later on? I'm still a little unclear as to the exact timeline.

Think Roose plots against Robb prior to Ramsay's actions. Have a read of the final Arya chapter of ACOK - from my understanding of it, it appears that Roose has already turned at this point: he discusses Robb's chances in the war with various Freys before writing to Ser Helman Tallhart telling him to march on Duskendale, which leads to the annihilation of much of the Northern forces. Pretty sure it's confirmed at some point in ASOS or AFFC that it was Bolton's intention to weaken the Northern forces by doing this. (Robb has married Jeyne at this point: in the same chapter, Elmar Frey - whom Arya is unknowingly betrothed to - tells her that his betrothal is off due to the Freys being dishonoured.)

Also during the sack Ramsay tells his men to save him the two Freys. He wouldn't be doing that if it was a independent act of wanton destruction.

Redcap · « **Reply #57 on:** June 5, 2012, 02:07:37 am »

Cheers you're right. I did remember all of those things, I just forgot they were all mentioned in an Arya chapter in ACOK, but that makes sense.

So I guess Roose must have made the switch incredibly quickly after the events at Winterfell, King's Landing and The Crag. I wonder if he received a raven from King's Landing already by this point or whether he took his own initiative here.

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #58 on:** June 5, 2012, 05:09:28 pm »

Roose is a conniving, tricky customer so I reckon he's out on his own at the moment because he is smart enough to see where this is heading.

I really loved the episode myself, it did a terrific job of tying this season up while leaving enough things dangling to keep people on board for next season.

Definitely Dany's strongest episode of the season, the House of the Undying wasn't how I pictured it but they did a pretty good job, some of the scenes were stunning especially the abandoned throne room. They streamlined a lot of stuff out the imagery/prophecies but got the important stuff across. Mainly how she isn't ready at all for the Throne yet and leaving behind Drogo and her kid is the first step to her maturation. I was surprised at how much that scene got to me, I'd forgotten how good them two were in the first season and how much the show misses his presence.

The Theon scenes were fantastic again (best character of the season?), funny and sort of sad. The pathetic desperation of trying to prove himself to his dad and the other men proved to be his downfall.
The stirring speech and Finchy letting him finish before knocking him out was hilarious and yet another embarassing kick in the teeth for him. I'm now thinking Ramsey is being kept back so they can give him and Theon plenty of scenes next season, there is no way they will keep Theon off screen for the next three seasons like in the books. Seeing Theon as he is book five for the first time is a great reveal, but now I think we'll see his descent into that state and slow redemption to a 'good guy'.

Tyrion's scene was perfect, never seen him that vulnerable before. Can't wait to see his story next season, plenty of scenes with Tywin which should be awesome

The Jon scenes were good but suffered from feeling a little too rushed like the rest of his stuff this season. Apart from Ygritte hes been given the short shrift this season, arguably his story in book 2 isn't that vital so it's not too bad but he is front and centre for book 3 and basically grows up. They better beef his scenes up next year.
The Halfhand didnt leave much of an impression on me in the books, it felt like he was only there to push Jon's story forward and thats all I got from TV show Halfhand, so not a major disappointment for me. Also why the death scene felt anti-climatic.

The Jamie and Brienne scene was a great taster for what is to come next season. Even Jamie looked stunned by how well she can handle herself. I can't wait for the 'hand' scene.

I am very intrigued by Roz and Varys, is she just going to inform on Littlefinger or is there something else going on there?

Thought the sack of Winterfell was portrayed well enough, the burning, the corpses and Luwin's last scene with the kids was well done and got across what they needed to. The last wide shot of Winterfell burning was great.

Overall I think they've done a fantastic job as an adaptation of the book and phenomenal job as a tv show. The changes have been well handled, made sense and in some cases improved upon on the book.

Forgot to add the Others in the last scene looked fantastic. Really nice and creepy make up/cgi and an excellent cliffhanger. The actual threat of the Others is definitely something that can be improved upon from the books. I'm certain the last two books are going to have millions of them storming Westeros so they need to be shown properly.

JoeCole · « **Reply #59 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:47:52 am »

I'm enjoying A Feast For Crows so far, really like Brienne. Was nice to see good old Pod turning back up aswell.

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #60 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:21:40 pm »

Thinking about the finale again and the House of the Undying I realised the prophecy of the Prince Who Was Promised and the song of Ice and Fire thing wasn't mentioned at all. Obviously this is a major plot point for the overall story and it seemed like the ideal time to at least introduce it the idea of it to me?

I mean there was "Snow" on the throne but not much else, it was all about Dany.

Also if they want to show Rhaegar in any of the flashbacks they should totally bring Harry Lloyd back in a slightly different wig.

Redcap · « **Reply #61 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:28:09 pm »

Quote from: JoeCole is for life, not just Christmas! on June 8, 2012, 03:47:52 am

I'm enjoying A Feast For Crows so far, really like Brienne. Was nice to see good old Pod turning back up aswell.

Yeah I like Brienne very much. After so many of the "heroic" characters getting killed off she's one of the few left that you can really root for. She's one of the few characters that actually gets pretty vividly described fight scenes too. For all the talk about the Hound or the Mountain or even Jaime Lannister, they rarely seem to actually get into scraps. Brienne on the other hand seems to have a fight in every book.

Quote from: Rusty Oysterburger on June 8, 2012, 03:21:40 pm

Thinking about the finale again and the House of the Undying I realised the prophecy of the Prince Who Was Promised and the song of Ice and Fire thing wasn't mentioned at all. Obviously this is a major plot point for the overall story and it seemed like the ideal time to at least introduce it the idea of it to me?

I mean there was "Snow" on the throne but not much else, it was all about Dany.

Also if they want to show Rhaegar in any of the flashbacks they should totally bring Harry Lloyd back in a slightly different wig.

Yeah I agree, particularly since it's hard to describe a prophesied hero without making it look quite hammy. A situation like the House of the Undying seemed like an ideal place to do it. I wonder if they'll write out the prophecies entirely.

I wonder how they're going to handle the Maggy the Frog prophecies though, if they do keep them.

Henry Chinaski · « **Reply #62 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:33:39 pm »

Think I'll start reading the books. Been immersing myself into the GoT-wiki lately, and I must say I'm getting intrigued with the Boltons. Such a pity Ramsay Bolton hasn't yet figured in the show, think his character will make for a compelling watch.

Redcap · « **Reply #63 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:36:39 pm »

Quote from: Henry Chinaski on June 8, 2012, 03:33:39 pm

Think I'll start reading the books. Been immersing myself into the GoT-wiki lately, and I must say I'm getting intrigued with the Boltons. Such a pity Ramsay Bolton hasn't yet figured in the show, think his character will make for a compelling watch.

Have you already spoiled half the plot for yourself mate?

Henry Chinaski · « **Reply #64 on:** June 8, 2012, 03:46:11 pm »

Quote from: Redcap on June 8, 2012, 03:36:39 pm

Have you already spoiled half the plot for yourself mate?

Yes. If there's gonna be spoiling, I'd rather do it myself

Then again, I don't watch films or great television series sheer out of plot-curiousity

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #65 on:** June 8, 2012, 04:15:45 pm »

Quote from: JoeCole is for life, not just Christmas! on June 8, 2012, 03:47:52 am

I'm enjoying A Feast For Crows so far, really like Brienne. Was nice to see good old Pod turning back up aswell.

Jaime's chapters in AFFC are excellent. Probably the character who changes the most over the series.

The best place for them to bring in the prophecy of the Prince Who Was Promised would be when Jon reads that book on Aemon's advice. No need for flashbacks that could look quite cheesy. They definitely could have done more with the House Of The Undying though; I wanted to see Rhaegar.

Redcap · « **Reply #66 on:** June 9, 2012, 03:19:30 am »

Quote from: Henry Chinaski on June 8, 2012, 03:46:11 pm

Yes. If there's gonna be spoiling, I'd rather do it myself Then again, I don't watch films or great television series sheer out of plot-curiousity

Yeah I have much the same attitude. There are a few things which would have had a lot more impact without pre-spoiling though. Like the Red Wedding.

JoeCole · « **Reply #67 on:** June 9, 2012, 03:42:56 am »

I'd unfortunately read about (ASOS spoilers)

Spoiler

Robb's death

[close]

before I read the books but didn't know in which manner it happened, and wasn't expecting

Spoiler

Catelyn

[close]

To go at the same time. It was a real killer that section of the book, I can't wait for show only peoples reaction when it happens. If it is pulled off right it really could go down as the greatest thing I've seen on TV.

Redcap · « **Reply #68 on:** June 9, 2012, 03:45:19 am »

Yeah the show runners said it's their favourite scene, so I expect they'll put a lot of effort into doing it just right.

I'm expecting Robb to get more screen time season 3 than he did again in ASOS, but they will have to manage it better than they did in season 2 or shock factor aside it will lack the emotional payoff at the end of it and will just seem senselessly brutal.

JoeCole · « **Reply #69 on:** June 9, 2012, 03:58:04 am »

They need to handle the Robb/Catelyn relationship better and show how close they really are, they screwed that up in the finale.

Looking forward to the Karstark beheading scene.. really hope they keep that

JoeCole · « **Reply #70 on:** June 12, 2012, 09:00:22 pm »

New interview with GRRM

One final question on behalf of all your fans -- how's the next book coming?

George R.R. Martin I'm working on that, and a number of "Ice and Fire" related things at the same time. Not only "The Winds of Winter," which is Book 6, but we're also coming out with a big concordance called "The World of Ice and Fire," which is about the whole history of Westeros and will be lavishly illustrated. So I've been filling in some of the histories of the kings who ruled 200 years ago or 500 years ago. We've also been doing a map book, and I'm working on a new novella about Dunk and Egg, the prequel series I have. It's a slow process the way I write, especially books of this size that are as large and complex as they are. It's still a slow process. I am aware of the TV series moving along behind me like a giant locomotive, and I know I need to lay the track more quickly, perhaps, because the locomotive is soon going to be bearing down on me. The last thing I want is for the TV series to catch up with me. I've got a considerable headstart, but production is moving faster than I can write. I'm hoping that we'll finish the story at about the same time... we'll see.

Rest of it - http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/inside/interviews/george-r-r-martin?autoplay=true&cmpid=ABC587

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #71 on:** June 12, 2012, 09:50:09 pm »

Quote from: JoeCole is for life, not just Christmas! on June 12, 2012, 09:00:22 pm

New interview with GRRM

One final question on behalf of all your fans -- how's the next book coming?

George R.R. Martin I'm working on that, and a number of "Ice and Fire" related things at the same time. Not only "The Winds of Winter," which is Book 6, but we're also coming out with a big concordance called "The World of Ice and Fire," which is about the whole history of Westeros and will be lavishly illustrated. So I've been filling in some of the histories of the kings who ruled 200 years ago or 500 years ago. We've also been doing a map book, and I'm working on a new novella about Dunk and Egg, the prequel series I have. It's a slow process the way I write, especially books of this size that are as large and complex as they are. It's still a slow process. I am aware of the TV series moving along behind me like a giant locomotive, and I know I need to lay the track more quickly, perhaps, because the locomotive is soon going to be bearing down on me. The last thing I want is for the TV series to catch up with me. I've got a considerable headstart, but production is moving faster than I can write. I'm hoping that we'll finish the story at about the same time... we'll see.

Rest of it - http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/inside/interviews/george-r-r-martin?autoplay=true&cmpid=ABC587

No date then, I wish he'd fuck off all that other stuff and get the books done sooner.

Although the episodes of Game of Thrones he's wrote have been the best ones.

kopindian · « **Reply #72 on:** June 13, 2012, 04:22:59 am »

Finished reading the five books. Took me about a month. Had breezed through the first 3.5 after which I slowed down a bit. Third one was my favorite and fourth one least favorite.

Quote from: Redcap on May 30, 2012, 12:49:59 pm

I don't think it was ever made clear. To be honest I think it's one of the most unconvincing threads of the plot.

It was Joffrey right?

Could be Tommen as well as he had a childish motivation to harm Bran.

Littlefinger: I think he didn't want to put himself on a spot by telling that the dagger belonged to Robert. I don't think it was planned to have a war from the beginning as outcome would be uncertain and littlefinger doesn't seem to be the sort of man that would leave anything to chance. Things just went out of control with Joffrey taking Ned's head off.

Niru Red4ever · « **Reply #73 on:** June 13, 2012, 09:30:17 am »

Quote from: kopindian on June 13, 2012, 04:22:59 am

Could be Tommen as well as he had a childish motivation to harm Bran.

Littlefinger: I think he didn't want to put himself on a spot by telling that the dagger belonged to Robert. I don't think it was planned to have a war from the beginning as outcome would be uncertain and littlefinger doesn't seem to be the sort of man that would leave anything to chance. Things just went out of control with Joffrey taking Ned's head off.

Tommen seems too innocent to even contemplate something like that.

About Joff taking Ned's head; it may also have been set up in some way by somebody - he is easy to manipulate. Remember, Selmy's sacking was set up by Varys so that he could go to Dany.

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #74 on:** June 13, 2012, 01:42:40 pm »

Littlefinger wanted to increase the enmity between the Starks and the Lannisters. I believe Ned dying was his ultimate aim, as it gave him a free shot at Catelyn. Obviously I doubt he predicted that Ned would lose his head to Joffrey; more likely he hoped to engineer a fight between Ned and Jaime that would result in Ned's death: see the scene where when Jaime confronts Ned in the street and Littlefinger runs off on the pretext of bringing the City Watch but doesn't return until it's too late. Though that doesn't really explain why he tried to convince Ned to let Joffrey succeed Robert... Maybe because he knew Ned wouldn't?

Alternatively:
"Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you."
Littlefinger just wants to watch the world burn.

Djimis Telescopic Leg · « **Reply #75 on:** June 13, 2012, 01:53:12 pm »

Quote from: JoeCole is for life, not just Christmas! on June 12, 2012, 09:00:22 pm

New interview with GRRM

One final question on behalf of all your fans -- how's the next book coming?

George R.R. Martin I'm working on that, and a number of "Ice and Fire" related things at the same time. Not only "The Winds of Winter," which is Book 6, but we're also coming out with a big concordance called "The World of Ice and Fire," which is about the whole history of Westeros and will be lavishly illustrated. So I've been filling in some of the histories of the kings who ruled 200 years ago or 500 years ago. We've also been doing a map book, and I'm working on a new novella about Dunk and Egg, the prequel series I have. It's a slow process the way I write, especially books of this size that are as large and complex as they are. It's still a slow process. I am aware of the TV series moving along behind me like a giant locomotive, and I know I need to lay the track more quickly, perhaps, because the locomotive is soon going to be bearing down on me. The last thing I want is for the TV series to catch up with me. I've got a considerable headstart, but production is moving faster than I can write. I'm hoping that we'll finish the story at about the same time... we'll see.

Rest of it - http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/inside/interviews/george-r-r-martin?autoplay=true&cmpid=ABC587

The World of Ice and Fire sounds boss, and a new Dunk and Egg will help alleviate the withdrawal symptoms. I've heard it may be titled The She-Wolves of Winterfell.

Also pretty excited about this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Lands-Fire-Game-Thrones/dp/0345538544

kopindian · « **Reply #76 on:** June 13, 2012, 03:26:49 pm »

Didn't Lyanna die after Rhaegar's wife and kids were murdered? That's what I understood from the first book.

Redcap · « **Reply #77 on:** June 13, 2012, 03:46:31 pm »

Quote from: kopindian on June 13, 2012, 03:26:49 pm

Didn't Lyanna die after Rhaegar's wife and kids were murdered? That's what I understood from the first book.

More or less. I wonder how she died though, or whether she died after giving birth to Jon /speculation.

All those Ice and Fire things sound fine and swell but he needs to just get the story finished first. It doesn't really sound like he's got the right mentality to really push through at the moment, but rather feels as if he wants to take a leisurely route but is being pushed by the TV show.

Assuming book 3 is the only book split into 2 seasons (although I suspect The Winds of Winter will need to be rather lengthy as well) he'll have around 5 years to get 2 books finished.

Rusty Oysterburger · « **Reply #78 on:** June 13, 2012, 04:54:58 pm »

I really like Littlefinger as well because similar to Varys, he's a sneaky fucker with ambiguous aims. It seems he wants lots of power and maybe Sansa as a Cat replacement but I think there's a lot more going on there that we won't know about until the final books where he'll play a massive part. he's one character I'd love to see get a POV chapter.

kopindian · « **Reply #79 on:** June 14, 2012, 04:34:30 am »

Quote from: Djimis Telescopic Leg on June 13, 2012, 01:42:40 pm

Littlefinger wanted to increase the enmity between the Starks and the Lannisters. I believe Ned dying was his ultimate aim, as it gave him a free shot at Catelyn.
Littlefinger just wants to watch the world burn.

He had set himself to marry Lysa which was a more realistic option, and thereby improving his status.
I don't think littlefinger wants the world to burn. He is just trying to move himself up the social ladder by making use of situations and also engineering things along the way. A war would put lot of uncertainty and maybe thats why he encouraged Ned to keep it secret. I would like to think it is this way as the whole planning and scheming everything from the beginning doesn't look realistic as there are too many factors involved that can go any number of ways.