Topic: Praise for LFC's transfer policy

[CS111]

Exactly this

That's why the Werner deal breaking went down really badly (although it wasn't the club's fault). He was exactly what was needed to keep things fresh.

It would have really freshened things up in attack. Away from home we have a lot of scoreless games at the big grounds domestically and in EUrope (and Goodison). Even at Anfield as great as he is we've got a number 9 who's scored one goal at Anfield all season. There is an argument to suggest that not signing anyone in 2019 was starting to catch up with us in 2020 as there has been a lot of iffy performances, despite doing so well to keep on winning. Atleti, Everton, City, Watford is our last 4 away games though and Norwich before that was as bad against the bottom team. West Ham and Bournemouth at home was really shaky within that period. We became quite predictable in a lot of these games.

He might be a club legend but bringing Origi on, or particularly starting him, is not the same. Same with sticking Ox out wide.

AFCON being delayed is a god send for next season but we still need that extra option. Hopefully Minamino can really push on at least. Keita staying fit would be the boost the midfield needs. Left back cover for Robertson. We don't need to go out and buy 4 or 5 but do need 2 maybe 3 for the squad.

[terry_macss_perm]

Sure we all get that, that's how RAWK work. And it been so since before man first learned how to use a computer ,  but these threads gets full of transfer chat until that forum opens. So why not?

Because the world will cease to turn on its axis if football fans are allowed to indulge in football transfer speculation on a football forum.

* awaits physicist to point out that the world doesn’t actually spin on its axis or some such shizzle *

[Stand Free]

That's why the Werner deal breaking went down really badly (although it wasn't the club's fault). He was exactly what was needed to keep things fresh.

It would have really freshened things up in attack. Away from home we have a lot of scoreless games at the big grounds domestically and in EUrope (and Goodison). Even at Anfield as great as he is we've got a number 9 who's scored one goal at Anfield all season. There is an argument to suggest that not signing anyone in 2019 was starting to catch up with us in 2020 as there has been a lot of iffy performances, despite doing so well to keep on winning. Atleti, Everton, City, Watford is our last 4 away games though and Norwich before that was as bad against the bottom team. West Ham and Bournemouth at home was really shaky within that period. We became quite predictable in a lot of these games.

He might be a club legend but bringing Origi on, or particularly starting him, is not the same. Same with sticking Ox out wide.

AFCON being delayed is a god send for next season but we still need that extra option. Hopefully Minamino can really push on at least. Keita staying fit would be the boost the midfield needs. Left back cover for Robertson. We don't need to go out and buy 4 or 5 but do need 2 maybe 3 for the squad.

Absolutely spot on. I understand the need for caution in the current climate but do feel Werner was exactly what we needed. Hopefully we see a lot more of Minamino this season and he can kick on next season as a top rotation option going forward.

[ScouserAtHeart]

We aren’t signing Thiago.


*waves hand in mysterious Jedi fashion*

(Seriously, its either his agent trying to get him a better deal at Bayern, or Bayern trying to get rid.  And you transfer whores have all fallen for it like a glamour model swooning over a league 1 footballer)

Bayern Munich’s Thiago Alcantara is a player who has been linked with the club in recent weeks and Klopp has spoken previously of his admiration for the Spaniard. However, he’s the type of player that Liverpool usually shy away from investing in. He’s fairly injury prone and, at 29, offers little in the way of a return in investment further down the line. Combine that with his high wages and how he’d block the path to the first team for Oxlade-Chamberlain and Keita, and it makes the prospect of his signing a little less likely in reality.

https://theathletic.com/1907701/2020/07/04/klopp-transfers-werner-neco-williams-mane-firmino/

Jimbo Pearce

[plura]

Bayern Munich’s Thiago Alcantara is a player who has been linked with the club in recent weeks and Klopp has spoken previously of his admiration for the Spaniard. However, he’s the type of player that Liverpool usually shy away from investing in. He’s fairly injury prone and, at 29, offers little in the way of a return in investment further down the line. Combine that with his high wages and how he’d block the path to the first team for Oxlade-Chamberlain and Keita, and it makes the prospect of his signing a little less likely in reality.

https://theathletic.com/1907701/2020/07/04/klopp-transfers-werner-neco-williams-mane-firmino/

Jimbo Pearce

Anything else to share from that article?

[Knight]

Absolutely spot on. I understand the need for caution in the current climate but do feel Werner was exactly what we needed. Hopefully we see a lot more of Minamino this season and he can kick on next season as a top rotation option going forward.

Apart from the Werner stuff about him being perfect nothing in that post is spot on.

[ScouserAtHeart]

Nothing we didn't already know. Goes through the squad and says backup left-back and another attacker are the only things we need, Werner would've likely joined if not for the pandemic, Klopp expects a quiet summer, onus on other teams to catch up, promotion of Jones and Elliott and Williams likely, future uncertain for Woodburn, Ojo, Wilson after returning from loan. If we do sign a forward, it'll be someone cheap.

Speculates about a possible backup LB signing using data to see who'd be a good fit and comes up with Jamal Lewis, Harry Pickering (from Crewe of all places) and Konstantinos Tsimikas of Olympiakos.

[plura]

Nothing we didn't already know. Goes through the squad and says backup left-back and another attacker are the only things we need, Werner would've likely joined if not for the pandemic, Klopp expects a quiet summer, onus on other teams to catch up, promotion of Jones and Elliott and Williams likely, future uncertain for Woodburn, Ojo, Wilson after returning from loan. If we do sign a forward, it'll be someone cheap.

Speculates about a possible backup LB signing using data to see who'd be a good fit and comes up with Jamal Lewis, Harry Pickering (from Crewe of all places) and Konstantinos Tsimikas of Olympiakos.

Thanks, as kinda expected then. I can only speculate what kind of attackers we'd sign, that for a low fee can come in and provide us with cover to either Mane or Salah in a compelling way. If that's even a smallish ambition. Minamino I'd like to see rotate with Firmino when needed.

Before the pandemic, it would be a hard try to find cover for Salah or Mane for anything less than £50m. But now teams around the world surely will be happy to take big cuts as they've been struggling to get any real cash flow in. So maybe with £20m you'd get something very interesting after all now.

[killer-heels]

What does promoting Jones and Elliott mean? They already are part of the first team squad and get games when players in front of them are not selected.

[Asam]

What does promoting Jones and Elliott mean? They already are part of the first team squad and get games when players in front of them are not selected.

They will be used more if experienced players who leave are not replaced (Lallana/Shaqiri/Clyne etc)

[Eeyore]

That's why the Werner deal breaking went down really badly (although it wasn't the club's fault). He was exactly what was needed to keep things fresh.

It would have really freshened things up in attack. Away from home we have a lot of scoreless games at the big grounds domestically and in EUrope (and Goodison). Even at Anfield as great as he is we've got a number 9 who's scored one goal at Anfield all season. There is an argument to suggest that not signing anyone in 2019 was starting to catch up with us in 2020 as there has been a lot of iffy performances, despite doing so well to keep on winning. Atleti, Everton, City, Watford is our last 4 away games though and Norwich before that was as bad against the bottom team. West Ham and Bournemouth at home was really shaky within that period. We became quite predictable in a lot of these games.

He might be a club legend but bringing Origi on, or particularly starting him, is not the same. Same with sticking Ox out wide.

AFCON being delayed is a god send for next season but we still need that extra option. Hopefully Minamino can really push on at least. Keita staying fit would be the boost the midfield needs. Left back cover for Robertson. We don't need to go out and buy 4 or 5 but do need 2 maybe 3 for the squad.

We have a dressing room dynamic that works though. Two of the front three love scoring goals and competing for the golden boot. The other member of the triumvirate is more interested in being a provider whilst still chipping in with goals. Is it worth disrupting that harmony on the off chance that the front three need motivating.

Sometimes you can have too much of a good thing. I think throwing Werner in to the mix may well of been a case of that. He would have come in and wanted to be starting the majority of games, in that scenario who do you leave out. I think Bobby is fundamental to the way we play so that means you are either benching Sadio or Mo. In that scenario how are you going to keep the harmony and bond the squad currently have.

Look at Sadio's frustration boiling over when he felt Mo wasn't passing to him. Imagine the frustration levels if you had one of Sadio, Bobby, Werner or Mo sitting on the bench on a regular basis.

Personally I think that is the reason we didn't move for Werner. I think he was lined up in case one of the front three wanted out, or we got an offer we couldn't refuse for one of them. I think if we are to bring in an established player or two it will either be a centre back or someone who can add creativity or goals to the midfield.

[John C]

Sure we all get that, that's how RAWK work. And it been so since before man first learned how to use a computer ,  but these threads gets full of transfer chat until that forum opens. So why not?

Hello Plura, it's a reasonable question. This is the first in-season transfer related thread we've had for a long time, it was probably only allowed to remain because the OP was well presented, but it's strayed from the initial purpose.

With regard to your question, it's a subject that will be covered in every house, every workplace, on every podcast and in every pub. Everyone will discuss transfers and targets. Every one is interested despite how much nonsense speculation most of it is. But I think RAWK often regarded it as a bit disrespectful to the playing squad. Football supporters can be reactionary, occasionally so I think there was good intention to prevent everyone saying we should buy player X every time Player Z had a bad game. Can you imagine how every thread would be contaminated with such discussions. We'd also be infested with Twitter rumours and the ridiculous fake news that delivers from wanna-be ITK's.

So as much as it's an exiting topic, perhaps allowing the incumbent set of players do their job with our full support isn't an entirely bad idea.

Maybe one of the more experienced Mods can add to that?

[killer-heels]

We have a dressing room dynamic that works though. Two of the front three love scoring goals and competing for the golden boot. The other member of the triumvirate is more interested in being a provider whilst still chipping in with goals. Is it worth disrupting that harmony on the off chance that the front three need motivating.

Sometimes you can have too much of a good thing. I think throwing Werner in to the mix may well of been a case of that. He would have come in and wanted to be starting the majority of games, in that scenario who do you leave out. I think Bobby is fundamental to the way we play so that means you are either benching Sadio or Mo. In that scenario how are you going to keep the harmony and bond the squad currently have.

Look at Sadio's frustration boiling over when he felt Mo wasn't passing to him. Imagine the frustration levels if you had one of Sadio, Bobby, Werner or Mo sitting on the bench on a regular basis.

Personally I think that is the reason we didn't move for Werner. I think he was lined up in case one of the front three wanted out, or we got an offer we couldn't refuse for one of them. I think if we are to bring in an established player or two it will either be a centre back or someone who can add creativity or goals to the midfield.

I am not sure about that. Losing Mane and Salah and replacing them with Werner? I am not an avid German football watcher but the few times I have seen him he doesnt look anywhere near an accomplished footballer as Mane or Salah.

Someone like Sancho yes but Werner? For me that would be a massive drop in quality.

[Fromola]

We have a dressing room dynamic that works though. Two of the front three love scoring goals and competing for the golden boot. The other member of the triumvirate is more interested in being a provider whilst still chipping in with goals. Is it worth disrupting that harmony on the off chance that the front three need motivating.

Sometimes you can have too much of a good thing. I think throwing Werner in to the mix may well of been a case of that. He would have come in and wanted to be starting the majority of games, in that scenario who do you leave out. I think Bobby is fundamental to the way we play so that means you are either benching Sadio or Mo. In that scenario how are you going to keep the harmony and bond the squad currently have.

Look at Sadio's frustration boiling over when he felt Mo wasn't passing to him. Imagine the frustration levels if you had one of Sadio, Bobby, Werner or Mo sitting on the bench on a regular basis.

Personally I think that is the reason we didn't move for Werner. I think he was lined up in case one of the front three wanted out, or we got an offer we couldn't refuse for one of them. I think if we are to bring in an established player or two it will either be a centre back or someone who can add creativity or goals to the midfield.

I think a big aspect of lining up Werner was AFCON every other year (and during next season) in addition to another grueling Copa America this summer leading to managing Firmino's minutes more without having a huge drop off. The delay of these two tournaments does lessen that need a bit at least for next season.

Away from home it is time to slightly evolve. We have too many scoreless games and the year we won the CL losing the 3 away games normally would have knocked us straight out the group stages and then overturning a 3-0 defeat in the semi final took a miracle. Not scoring at Atletico cost us this year. Despite two near perfect league seasons we've won 3 out of 9 away at the other big 6 (throw in two scoreless games in the derby as well).

[Schmidt]

What does promoting Jones and Elliott mean? They already are part of the first team squad and get games when players in front of them are not selected.

It's putting a positive spin on the inevitable.

[killer-heels]

It's putting a positive spin on the inevitable.

There will be a tonne of different combinations used to step in for one of the front three, be it Origi, Minamino, Oxlade-Chamberlain and even Keita before Elliott is considered to play in an important league game.

Jones has more of a chance but then has even more competition ahead of him. Bar an injury nightmare, I very much doubt both will play many more games next season as they did this season.

[kasperoff]

This is where we try to strike that seemingly impossible balance. Elliot, Williams, Brewster and Jones are as good as you could want for youth prospects. If Lallana and Shakiri leave, then the sensible option is to give these lads more time, rather than replace them with someone like Willian or Alcantara.

However, it's a no win situation for our management in many ways. If they don't hit the ground running, and we get off to a shaky start, then they get blamed for not signing anyone. If they do decide to bring in Willian for cover, and Elliot doesn't get game time, then we get accused of not bringing through the youth.

I see a quiet summer, personally. Our first 15 are still some of the best around and have enough in them to push for another challenge. I think we are trying to keep our powder dry for big, game changing signings such as Sancho or Havertz, or dare I say Mbappe.

I think ideally, we want to keep the existing group together and wring it out for another season, whilst trying to bring our youth players in. Then have another Van Dyke/Alisson type splurge next summer. May coincide with one or two of our big names moving out.

One thing that is going to be nice is that we don't need to worry about shitehawks like Real or Barca trying to take any of our players this summer.

[Fromola]

There will be a tonne of different combinations used to step in for one of the front three, be it Origi, Minamino, Oxlade-Chamberlain and even Keita before Elliott is considered to play in an important league game.

Jones has more of a chance but then has even more competition ahead of him. Bar an injury nightmare, I very much doubt both will play many more games next season as they did this season.

You can probably add Shaq to that as well if we don't sign anyone.

In reality Jones and Elliott's best chance of games was the League Cup which we probably won't be in next season.

[IanZG]

There will be a tonne of different combinations used to step in for one of the front three, be it Origi, Minamino, Oxlade-Chamberlain and even Keita before Elliott is considered to play in an important league game.

Jones has more of a chance but then has even more competition ahead of him. Bar an injury nightmare, I very much doubt both will play many more games next season as they did this season.

Thing is, next season should be the year Jones starts playing more often. Not talking about starting every game, of course, but getting the a league start or two and minutes in games that are not done by the time he comes on. Last season he started training with the first team, this season he's a regular in the cups and gets the odd substitute appearance in the league, next season we should start seeing a bit more of him if he continues progressing as expected.

Even with Elliott, next season he'll be the same age as Sterling was when he played something like 20 games for the first team. Of course, Sterling was the bigger talent, and the team was a lot weaker back then so it was easier to get minutes, but if he's the type of talent we believe he is we should definitely see him feature more.

[groove]

*watches youtube video of thiago*

Wellllll... I guess I'm not totally opposed to it 

[So… Howard Philips]

You can probably add Shaq to that as well if we don't sign anyone.

In reality Jones and Elliott's best chance of games was the League Cup which we probably won't be in next season.

What makes you think we won't be in the League Cup?

[Schmidt]

There will be a tonne of different combinations used to step in for one of the front three, be it Origi, Minamino, Oxlade-Chamberlain and even Keita before Elliott is considered to play in an important league game.

Jones has more of a chance but then has even more competition ahead of him. Bar an injury nightmare, I very much doubt both will play many more games next season as they did this season.

Yeah I'm expecting the same, they'll get cup games to give others a break, maybe the odd sub appearance, but we'll rely on the same core and use Minamino to pick up the minutes Lallana would've had and maybe give Firmino the odd rest if he shows some improvement.

[markmywords]

We have a dressing room dynamic that works though. Two of the front three love scoring goals and competing for the golden boot. The other member of the triumvirate is more interested in being a provider whilst still chipping in with goals. Is it worth disrupting that harmony on the off chance that the front three need motivating.

Sometimes you can have too much of a good thing. I think throwing Werner in to the mix may well of been a case of that. He would have come in and wanted to be starting the majority of games, in that scenario who do you leave out. I think Bobby is fundamental to the way we play so that means you are either benching Sadio or Mo. In that scenario how are you going to keep the harmony and bond the squad currently have.

Look at Sadio's frustration boiling over when he felt Mo wasn't passing to him. Imagine the frustration levels if you had one of Sadio, Bobby, Werner or Mo sitting on the bench on a regular basis.

Personally I think that is the reason we didn't move for Werner. I think he was lined up in case one of the front three wanted out, or we got an offer we couldn't refuse for one of them. I think if we are to bring in an established player or two it will either be a centre back or someone who can add creativity or goals to the midfield.

I doubt we were banking on selling sadio or mane this summer, there would be no need, such a move makes more sense, when your team needs multiple additions to fund.

I think you can have werner, sadio and mane in the squad, without major problems. Shaqiri(11)/sturridge( 8 )/origi(4) got 23 league starts in 18/19, so if Werner stays fit, there could be plenty of games for him.  Klopp seems to rate Werner higher than those 3 and werner is more versatile to boot. The ability rotate in this area will allow Mane and salah to remain in golden boot contention deeper into their careers and you can imagine mane's, klopp's and salah's frustration levels when their workload has lead to the various injuries they have suffered.

[killer-heels]

Thing is, next season should be the year Jones starts playing more often. Not talking about starting every game, of course, but getting the a league start or two and minutes in games that are not done by the time he comes on. Last season he started training with the first team, this season he's a regular in the cups and gets the odd substitute appearance in the league, next season we should start seeing a bit more of him if he continues progressing as expected.

Even with Elliott, next season he'll be the same age as Sterling was when he played something like 20 games for the first team. Of course, Sterling was the bigger talent, and the team was a lot weaker back then so it was easier to get minutes, but if he's the type of talent we believe he is we should definitely see him feature more.

That would require one of Milner, Henderson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fabinho, Wijnaldum or Keïta to get less minutes and I very much doubt any of them would be happy about that.

[IanZG]

That would require one of Milner, Henderson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fabinho, Wijnaldum or Keïta to get less minutes and I very much doubt any of them would be happy about that.

Personally I'd expect Milner to get way less minutes in midfield, especially if we don't sign another LB.

[Fromola]

What makes you think we won't be in the League Cup?

A September till May season won't be able to fit all the games in for teams in Europe.

[So… Howard Philips]

A September till May season won't be able to fit all the games in for teams in Europe.

I can see your reasoning but haven't seen anything definite about this.

It would be another opportunity for the youngsters and squad players anyway.

[Oskar]

That would require one of Milner, Henderson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fabinho, Wijnaldum or Keïta to get less minutes and I very much doubt any of them would be happy about that.

And that would be tough.

If Curtis Jones does enough in training and whatever other opportunities he’s given to earn more playing time, it’s up to those players to then do more themselves. Keeping them happy shouldn’t be a factor in whether or not Curtis Jones plays more first-team football if he’s deserving of it.

[killer-heels]

And that would be tough.

If Curtis Jones does enough in training and whatever other opportunities he’s given to earn more playing time, it’s up to those players to then do more themselves. Keeping them happy shouldn’t be a factor in whether or not Curtis Jones plays more first-team football if he’s deserving of it.

Some of those players are in the prime of their career. Jones isnt anywhere near as good as them yet and Id question whether he will be. We will have a league to win.

[jillcwhomever]

That would require one of Milner, Henderson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fabinho, Wijnaldum or Keïta to get less minutes and I very much doubt any of them would be happy about that.

If the youngsters are earning their chances via their work in the squad why shouldn't they get a chance? Otherwise what's the point in having them in the squad? Klopp is right about not handing out the places out as presents, but if they are proving themselves on the training field and improving then its only right they should get opportunities.

[Chris~]

The first team, and the main academy players coming through, are good enough to beat most the league with at least one of them starting,

[Oskar]

Some of those players are in the prime of their career. Jones isnt anywhere near as good as them yet and Id question whether he will be. We will have a league to win.

If Jones deserves to play, Klopp will play him.

It's down to him to prove he deserves it, he has the potential and natural ability, it's down to him to continue to work hard and ensure that he continues to develop at the rate that he has over the past 18 months. But Klopp isn't going to ignore him out of fear of upsetting other players, that's just a ridiculous suggestion.

He's not as far away from challenging those players currently ahead of him as you seem to think he is.

[killer-heels]

If the youngsters are earning their chances via their work in the squad why shouldn't they get a chance? Otherwise what's the point in having them in the squad? Klopp is right about not handing out the places out as presents, but if they are proving themselves on the training field and improving then its only right they should get opportunities.

The point is that we are probably the best team in Europe. There is a reason for that and of course if players are slacking then maybe Jones gets a chance. But I very much doubt our players are slacking and there is questions as to whether Jones is such an exceptional talent to dislodge midfielders who are in the prime of their careers.

Elliott has more of a chance because the options ahead of him are not as strong but he is still super young.

[Coolie High]

The point is that we are probably the best team in Europe. There is a reason for that and of course if players are slacking then maybe Jones gets a chance. But I very much doubt our players are slacking and there is questions as to whether Jones is such an exceptional talent to dislodge midfielders who are in the prime of their careers.

Elliott has more of a chance because the options ahead of him are not as strong but he is still super young.

We’ve just got outplayed by a side with a 20 year old Foden, in regards to Jones I think he is much closer to the standard of our first 11 than you would predict, he’s played against Everton and was the best player on the pitch already, Elliot is some time away but Jones is already near the quality of our first team midfield in my opinion.

Midfield is not the problem though, our front three is where we look short on quality(in terms of depth).

[jillcwhomever]

The point is that we are probably the best team in Europe. There is a reason for that and of course if players are slacking then maybe Jones gets a chance. But I very much doubt our players are slacking and there is questions as to whether Jones is such an exceptional talent to dislodge midfielders who are in the prime of their careers.

Elliott has more of a chance because the options ahead of him are not as strong but he is still super young.

Happily KH you are not managing the team, otherwise we might as well close the Academy straight away. I'm happy to trust the judgement of the manager who has already decided Curtis can replace Lallana when he leaves. He ultimately has more faith than you do, and I would judge that he's seen him play more than you have as well. I have no doubt that Curtis can contribute next season.

[Fordy]

Happily KH you are not managing the team, otherwise we might as well close the Academy straight away. I'm happy to trust the judgement of the manager who has already decided Curtis can replace Lallana when he leaves. He ultimately has more faith than you do, and I would judge that he's seen him play more than you have as well. I have no doubt that Curtis can contribute next season.

I'm with you mate. Klopp said yesterday that these youngsters are really close and I believe that. Some are extremely quick to right off our own players.

It's like people are price brain washed. We paid 50m for Keita and he might come good but lets be honest hasn't set the world alight but Jones who has done everything right so far doesn't stand a chance. I don't get it.

Let me tell you all - Kelleher, Jones, Williams, Brewster, Hoever, Cain, Clarkson, Elliott, Glatzel, Wilson are talented players. Yes we might sell one or 2 but we need to get out of this mindset that if we send players out on loan they are finished here or if they don't play 10 games in a season they are done.

[afc tukrish]

Some are extremely quick to right off our own players.

Better than being left out, I suppose...

[Crosby Nick]

I'm with you mate. Klopp said yesterday that these youngsters are really close and I believe that. Some are extremely quick to right off our own players.

We could do with cover at write back.

[CraigDS]

I’m loving the thought Jones and Elliott may get quite a few more minutes next year. They both look great prospects and will be good to see them get the chance to show this.

[jillcwhomever]

I'm with you mate. Klopp said yesterday that these youngsters are really close and I believe that. Some are extremely quick to right off our own players.

I agree Fordy. The problem is, if young players don't have the talent of Sanchez then they are immediately dismissed as being "not good enough." But as we all know, players improve at different rates, some are good straight away, others take a bit more time to show it. The whole point of this training group is the manager gets first pick of the talent coming from the Academy. Then having worked with them they can decide whether each player has a realistic chance of making it here. It's obvious Klopp has seen enough of Curtis, Neco and Elliot to make him believe they have a future here in whatever capacity. It's why this whole group was set up at the club in the first place.