Topic: Liverpool's defence - Giraffes, Walls and Automobiles

[Haggis36]

Selling in Sakho in January makes little sense. It really does.

Cutting our nose to spite our face there - players have done much worst (including our very own Suarez) but if you need them you make allowances.

We need players who are consistent, not players who struggle for fitness and have one outstanding game amongst 3 or 4 mediocre ones.

[Johnnyboy1973]

Selling in Sakho in January makes little sense. It really does.

Not really.

He's fucking average as well.

[OOS]

Selling in Sakho in January makes little sense. It really does.

Cutting our nose to spite our face there - players have done much worst (including our very own Suarez) but if you need them you make allowances.

What's the point in playing a player who the manager doesn't rate or trust anymore.

[007.lankyguy]

Selling in Sakho in January makes little sense. It really does.

Cutting our nose to spite our face there - players have done much worst (including our very own Suarez) but if you need them you make allowances.

He won't be sold because of his ability. He'll be sold because of his off the pitch issues. If Klopp thinks there's been too many then there's been too many. Barring a big crisis at CB, he won't be playing for us again.

[Klopp-A-Delphia]

Selling in Sakho in January makes little sense. It really does.

Cutting our nose to spite our face there - players have done much worst (including our very own Suarez) but if you need them you make allowances.

Isn't it important that it was a different manager during all the Suarez nonsense? We don't know what Klopp would have done if he had Suarez as a player.

The team comes before any player, even if he's a world beater. Even if we desperate need him. If he doesn't have the right attitude it's like a virus to the rest of the team. It just wouldn't be worth it.

[NaivetyinBlack]

Well, there is a crisis at CB. Matip is like the nanny who is holding these bunch of toddlers together. He goes missing, they run amok.

[Funky_Gibbons]

We had two midfielders playing in the back four.

Strange decision not to play Klavan today.

[007.lankyguy]

Well, there is a crisis at CB. Matip is like the nanny who is holding these bunch of toddlers together. He goes missing, they run amok.

FWIW, I don't like any of our CBs bar Matip but it'll take more than this for Klopp to bring Sakho back into the fold.

[clinical]

Well, there is a crisis at CB. Matip is like the nanny who is holding these bunch of toddlers together. He goes missing, they run amok.

Yep. Can't rely on one defender to do that. We score goals no problem. 

[him_15]

Need to invest into another CB in the winter. Lucus should never be CB again, Lovern is a hidden bomb, Klavan is probably not ready yet. As for the keeper...Why on earth we never managed to find a world-class keeper? Even Reina was nowhere near WC. The current keepers (bar Bravo) from other top six teams are miles better than us!

[clinical]

Need to invest into another CB in the winter. Lucus should never be CB again, Lovern is a hidden bomb, Klavan is probably not ready yet. As for the keeper...Why on earth we never managed to find a world-class keeper? Even Reina was nowhere near WC. The current keepers (bar Bravo) from other top six teams are miles better than us!

Reina was world class for at least 75% of the time he was here. He got worse as soon as the gk coach left

[Cpt_Reina]

The defence was fine until Lucas was introduced to it.

[King Klopp.]

Need to invest into another CB in the winter. Lucus should never be CB again, Lovern is a hidden bomb, Klavan is probably not ready yet. As for the keeper...Why on earth we never managed to find a world-class keeper? Even Reina was nowhere near WC. The current keepers (bar Bravo) from other top six teams are miles better than us!

Reina in his pomp was one of the top 5 keepers in the world.

[AaronSingh25]

Just for general purposes - what is it that Sakho was meant to have done that has been disclosed?

[Johnny B. Goode]

The defence was fine until Lucas was introduced to it.

Correlation does not equal causation.

You put Lucas alongside Matip and he'll be a rock as well.

[Cpt_Reina]

Correlation does not equal causation.

You put Lucas alongside Matip and he'll be a rock as well.

Nah.

[Upinsmoke]

What on earth was Milner doing for that pen though. It's basic defending. Don't dive in on a 50/50 in the box. Type of shite Moreno does.

He's put in that position by Lovren though, it should of never came about. Your right he shouldn't of made the challenge but it would of never happened if Lovren puts the ball out instead of trying to keep it alive.

[him_15]

Reina in his pomp was one of the top 5 keepers in the world.

Agree that Reina was probably the best keeper we signed during the Premier league era. Still doubt he would make it into top 5 though.

[King Klopp.]

He's put in that position by Lovren though, it should of never came about. Your right he shouldn't of made the challenge but it would of never happened if Lovren puts the ball out instead of trying to keep it alive.

Because Lovren fucks up does not then give Milner the ok to fuck up as well.

[harryc]

What was the point in wasting the £3M on Klavan if he cant get in ahead of Lucas who by the way was abject today.

[hide5seek]

Have soton got any good defenders we could buy? *walks off whistling*

[U13]

The defence was fine until Lucas was introduced to it.

Wow, didn't see this post coming at all.

[hesbighesred]

What was the point in wasting the £3M on Klavan if he cant get in ahead of Lucas who by the way was abject today.

I watched the first half - not the second, admittedly, but he was excellent in the first half. Didn't put a foot wrong and was quality in possession, set up a lot of attacks. So I have a distinct feeling that this is probably agenda driven, overly emotional guff - but I could be wrong.

[tubby]

I watched the first half - not the second, admittedly, but he was excellent in the first half. Didn't put a foot wrong and was quality in possession, set up a lot of attacks. So I have a distinct feeling that this is probably agenda driven, overly emotional guff - but I could be wrong.

Lucas looks good in defence when we're on top and he can step out, win the ball early and keep it simple.  When we're under pressure he struggles because he's just not a centre half.  He wasn't the reason for us losing today but his performance contributed.  Not really his fault though, he's a midfielder playing out of position and keeping our new centre half signing on the bench for some reason.

[harryc]

I watched the first half - not the second, admittedly, but he was excellent in the first half. Didn't put a foot wrong and was quality in possession, set up a lot of attacks. So I have a distinct feeling that this is probably agenda driven, overly emotional guff - but I could be wrong.

As you have not seen the second half yeah you are wrong.

In fact not sure which first half you saw as there was a few wayward passes from Lucas.

[TheShanklyGates]

#LFC 2016/17 With Matip - 11 games, conceded 9 goals - DWWWWDWWWDW Without Matip - 3 games, conceded 9 goals - WLL

https://twitter.com/peterjharvey/status/805434357544550400

Not many stats more telling than that.

[SerbianScouser]

If Klopp rates Lucas higher than Klavan which is what recent events suggested then in combination with selling Sakho in January we'll simply have to address this situation. Lucas at CB experiment really should be over today as the stakes are too high now to keep risking. January is a very difficult market but in the case of some very good CB being available somehow we really should go for it.

[King Klopp.]

Lucas was at fault for the goals we conceded today?

Nah the lad playing centre back had nothing to do with conceding 4 goals at all. Nothing whatsoever. Pure coincidence than when he replaces Matip we concede 4 goals.

[hesbighesred]

Lucas looks good in defence when we're on top and he can step out, win the ball early and keep it simple.  When we're under pressure he struggles because he's just not a centre half.  He wasn't the reason for us losing today but his performance contributed.  Not really his fault though, he's a midfielder playing out of position and keeping our new centre half signing on the bench for some reason.

That seems fair.

He's spot on though 

And that's bollocks. The reason so many mangers have kept him on - and he's performed well for all of them, if not always at the highest levels - is because he personifies professionalism. We're lucky to have him because he does a fuck of a lot more than just what we see for 90 minutes on the pitch, and if/when he does eventually leave, you'll find there's a lot of glowing tributes to him because of that, and his presence will be missed.

Plus there's the fact that he's just such a sound human being. If you don't have a soft spot for Lucas, it's kind of strongly suggestive of being a c*nt. Sorry.

[King Klopp.]

That seems fair.And that's bollocks. The reason so many mangers have kept him on - and he's performed well for all of them, if not always at the highest levels - is because he personifies professionalism. We're lucky to have him because he does a fuck of a lot more than just what we see for 90 minutes on the pitch, and if/when he does eventually leave, you'll find there's a lot of glowing tributes to him because of that, and his presence will be missed.

Plus there's the fact that he's just such a sound human being. If you don't have a soft spot for Lucas, it's kind of strongly suggestive of being a c*nt. Sorry.

Great. He's really professional. He isn't very good at football anymore though. And fucking LOL at calling someone a c*nt because they don't love a player. Get a grip soft lad.

[Haggis36]

Lucas is a lovely lad and a great professional and as a person appears a top, top guy. He's been dining out on 6 months of good form for going on 5 years now though. He shouldn't be starting matches for us anymore, and he absolutely shouldn't be our third choice CB.

[Cpt_Reina]

https://twitter.com/AIUnderPressure/status/805457259086180353

[AaronSingh25]

https://twitter.com/AIUnderPressure/status/805457259086180353

When we play the following in defense we concede :

0.7 goals when Matip plays
1.21 goals when Clyne plays
1.38 goals when Lovren plays
1.92 goals when Klavan plays
2 goals when Lucas plays

Say's it all really

[hesbighesred]

Great. He's really professional. He isn't very good at football anymore though. And fucking LOL at calling someone a c*nt because they don't love a player. Get a grip soft lad.

I said 'soft spot', and I didn't call anyone anything. If being a c*nt is a disease, not having a soft spot for Lucas is definitely a symptom, though. Not proof in an of itself, of course. Other symptoms would include, for example, driving a Range Rover Sport, or owning a Jeremy Clarkson book, or voting Tory. None are, in isolation, enough to make the call, but taken together...

[U13]

Nah the lad playing centre back had nothing to do with conceding 4 goals at all. Nothing whatsoever. Pure coincidence than when he replaces Matip we concede 4 goals.

Of course he has something to do with it but i'm not having that he's the one to be singled out for what happened today.

The penalty conceded comes from a foul by Milner who's trying to recover from a poor headed clearance by Lovren.

The second goal comes from a forward running in behind Lovren.

the third goal is a class finish in all fairness although Origi is culpable for dallying on the ball on the edge of the box.

The fourth comes after Karius spills a shot which the midfield have to be held responsible for to some extent because there's no pressure on the ball.

The logic of some posters on here after all that - "It's because of Lucas".

Absolute bollocks.

[Eeyore]

When we play the following in defense we concede :

0.7 goals when Matip plays
1.21 goals when Clyne plays
1.38 goals when Lovren plays
1.92 goals when Klavan plays
2 goals when Lucas plays

Say's it all really

Does it ?

He hast started and played 90 in.

4-1 v Leicester
3-0 v Derby
2-1 v Spurs
6-1 v Watford
2-0 v Leeds
3-4 v Bournemouth

Clearly the last 15 minutes against Bournemouth skews things but for me that is as much about the loss of Matip as it is about Lucas playing.
 

[Always_A_Red]

What's the point in buying a 31 year old CB if you're going to play a CM ahead of him when your first choice CB is injured?

[tyrolean_red]

We'll need to get into the market for another centerback, its simple as that. Lovren can be a very good defender, he just needs somebody beside him to carry him. I think he can be a very good third option, but we need to find another player who can sort out the defence without Matip. Horrible showing today, Karius giving us the rest (altough i think he will become very good, just not used to it as of yet).

[Eeyore]

What's the point in buying a 31 year old CB if you're going to play a CM ahead of him when your first choice CB is injured?

We have two stoppers in Lovren and Klavan and two ball players in Matip and Lucas. Klopp summed it up perfectly we stopped playing football. If we continue playing then we simply don't need two stoppers. We dominate possession, we run them into the ground and we come out comfortable winners.

[King Klopp.]

I'll be honest, I hope we just sign someone who's as good as Matip.