Topic: Wrestling Thread (AEW, NJPW, WWE, etc) (*)

[Stockholm Syndrome]

As far as I can remember, most of his Suzuki-Gun run, although he didn't really get a good chance in interviews until the NJ Cup win (where he pronounced that he doesn't condone cruelty to animals, just humans) and the soi boi thing came up particularly when he faced Lance Archer because of course, he was the big meat eating American lad from Texas.

His moves have always been based off relatively obscure albums and British left wing comedian jokes - I know his Calf Slicer/Stretch Muffler/Banana Split leg lock submission is called "Orienteering with Napalm Death"

Benteke (please ban me mods, I am not worthy to post in this forum )  I think in particular came around when he started tagging fully with Taichi to form Dangerous Benteke (please ban me mods, I am not worthy to post in this forum ) .

Got absolutely demolished by the Benteke auto edit there 

[XabiArt]

What was it? I've never seen that before haha

[tubby]

Had to change my post too, tekkers gets auto-edited.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I'm all for weird Brit references from our wrestlers.  Ospreay having a move called a cheeky Nando's is great.

Well if you like that along with some In the Loop jokes and pop shots at the Tory government while also being the quintessential holier than thou moral high ground heel, then you'll like the ZSJ character

[Stockholm Syndrome]

One thing that hasn't got a lot of swell but Lio Rush is back in AEW. Been around for a while and is very good, so it is hard to remember he is only 26. If he isn't derailed by his own issues with depression, he could be a huge get for AEW.

Also for as multi-cultural AEW is there aren't many Black stars in the promotion, and Lio, Ricky Starks, and Hobbs are currently probably the most established they have to be stars in the medium term future (with the likes of Top Flight and Lee Johnson for the further future)

[bird_lfc]

I really enjoyed him as Lashley’s hype man and whilst he’s completely different to what I like in a wrestler , he is skilled in the ring. If he can put his personal issues aside he’s a good addition to the roster

[Jake]

For some reason I tried to watch Smackdown
31 mins till the first match got going.

Off.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Catching up on the WWE draft now it's completed and the rosters feel massively lopsided.

Smackdown feels really weak. Yeah, they've got Roman at the top of the men's division and now have Drew there as well. But beyond that, there's very little - Kofi and Woods, Usos, Cesaro, Sheamus, Corbin, Nakamura, Jeff Hardy, Ricochet and Sami Zayn... just feels incredibly weak. They've called up Hit Row and Ridge Holland from NXT, so maybe big plans for those guys.

Raw, on the other hand, is stacked. Big E as champion, then loads of good names - Rollins, Lashley, Balor, Edge, Orton, Styles, Riddle, Priest. Not to mention the Mysterios, Miz and Morrison, Street Profits. They've also got this Gable Steveson, the amateur wrestler who is getting massively hyped.

[CornerFlag]

Massive list of women's tag teams too.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Gable Stevenson may hit the ground running like Angle, but no one really ever has like him. The closest was probably Matt Riddle who still needed time training, and Ronda Rousey who could go but only in massively pre-planned matches.

Also Angle had bucket loads of charisma and was funny as hell, which helped him. Let's see how Gable is on that department but again I don't think he will be better than Angle on that, because Angle was literally one of the best ever.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Gable Stevenson may hit the ground running like Angle, but no one really ever has like him. The closest was probably Matt Riddle who still needed time training, and Ronda Rousey who could go but only in massively pre-planned matches.

Also Angle had bucket loads of charisma and was funny as hell, which helped him. Let's see how Gable is on that department but again I don't think he will be better than Angle on that, because Angle was literally one of the best ever.

Angle really was a phenom, wasn't he. One thing for him to grasp the art of being a wrestler, but the fact that he got the character/sports entertainment side so quickly was amazing.

Wonder if there might be a plan to put Angle with Steveson as a manager or something, actually. Hadn't realised until now the accusations about Steveson until today, some strange laws in certain states...

[El Lobo]

Hopefully not, could do without seeing Angle hobbling about anymore.

[gazzalfc]

The Smackdown roster has been decimated in the draft.

Basically Roman, Drew and Charlotte. Thats it.

Vince has to do something to elevate someone

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Angle really was a phenom, wasn't he. One thing for him to grasp the art of being a wrestler, but the fact that he got the character/sports entertainment side so quickly was amazing.

Wonder if there might be a plan to put Angle with Steveson as a manager or something, actually. Hadn't realised until now the accusations about Steveson until today, some strange laws in certain states...

Thing is as well, which I never knew, he had a TONNE of matches before debuting, all dark matches or with Dory Funk's promotion as training for WWE, but he wrestled like 70 matches in 6 months before debuting.

Maybe Gable will be an absolute prodigy, but that seems like a mighty risk that this guy is just going to be great without training, because being an Amateur wrestler and being a Professional Wrestler are pretty big leaps, nevermind the character and TV work.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Thing is as well, which I never knew, he had a TONNE of matches before debuting, all dark matches or with Dory Funk's promotion as training for WWE, but he wrestled like 70 matches in 6 months before debuting.

Maybe Gable will be an absolute prodigy, but that seems like a mighty risk that this guy is just going to be great without training, because being an Amateur wrestler and being a Professional Wrestler are pretty big leaps, nevermind the character and TV work.

I guess that's the problem, in years gone by they'd have put Gable in OVW or the non-televised NXT stuff to find his feet. But I don't think NXT is touring anymore is it? He'll obviously be spending tons of time at the Performance Centre, but it's not the same thing as being in front of a crowd. Guys who came through the system like Lesnar, Cena, Batista, Reigns all needed that time.

But there's no patience in WWE anymore. They'll want to capitalise on Steveson while the name value is there, rather than put him in developmental for a couple years. For the same reason I fully expect the Steiner kid to be on the main roster by next summer, even though he's hardly been wrestling anytime at all.

The Smackdown roster has been decimated in the draft.

Basically Roman, Drew and Charlotte. Thats it.

Vince has to do something to elevate someone

Yeah, real strange one. Raw's the longer show so obviously needs more depth, but I reckon they've got it badly wrong. Roman and Drew are probably the biggest stars in the company, but there's just nothing else on the Smackdown side. Who is the next biggest singles star (not counting part timers like Brock)? Honestly think you're looking at Corbin or Sheamus, who would genuinely be the 11th or 12th biggest singles star on Raw. Really not sure what the plan is, although in fairness there's a few weeks until the new rosters take effect so you might yet see some moves.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I guess that's the problem, in years gone by they'd have put Gable in OVW or the non-televised NXT stuff to find his feet. But I don't think NXT is touring anymore is it? He'll obviously be spending tons of time at the Performance Centre, but it's not the same thing as being in front of a crowd. Guys who came through the system like Lesnar, Cena, Batista, Reigns all needed that time.

But there's no patience in WWE anymore. They'll want to capitalise on Steveson while the name value is there, rather than put him in developmental for a couple years. For the same reason I fully expect the Steiner kid to be on the main roster by next summer, even though he's hardly been wrestling anytime at all.

Yeah, real strange one. Raw's the longer show so obviously needs more depth, but I reckon they've got it badly wrong. Roman and Drew are probably the biggest stars in the company, but there's just nothing else on the Smackdown side. Who is the next biggest singles star (not counting part timers like Brock)? Honestly think you're looking at Corbin or Sheamus, who would genuinely be the 11th or 12th biggest singles star on Raw. Really not sure what the plan is, although in fairness there's a few weeks until the new rosters take effect so you might yet see some moves.

Smackdown has been destroyed, utterly destroyed. After Drew, which seems to be the next feud, you are probably going with Nakamura or Jeff Hardy. You'll probably see a Goldberg title defence for Roman at the Rumble before (if they can do it) The Rock at Mania.

Honestly while Roman is great (even if the Head of the Table story itself I feel is kinda crap - just the same Smackdown for 18 months) they have a real issue of succession - he has beat everyone, he is going to beat all the outsider talent too, there is no one to realistically topple the monster that is Reigns.

I have no issue with unbeatable machine champions but you got to build a challenger up and set him as a real Challenge - to go back to NJPW they built Okada with an 18 month plus reign, but they gave him loads of challengers and set up at least 2, maybe 3 realistic contenders to take the belt from him (Omega, Naito, and kinda Ibushi).

Who is beating Roman for the belt? Who realistically is shown to be even close to his level?

[tubby]

Thing is as well, which I never knew, he had a TONNE of matches before debuting, all dark matches or with Dory Funk's promotion as training for WWE, but he wrestled like 70 matches in 6 months before debuting.

Maybe Gable will be an absolute prodigy, but that seems like a mighty risk that this guy is just going to be great without training, because being an Amateur wrestler and being a Professional Wrestler are pretty big leaps, nevermind the character and TV work.

This is an issue for AEW as well, they shouldn't be putting someone like Jade Cargill anywhere near TV with her current wrestling ability.  She needs to do 6 months in Stardom or wherever to learn how to call things on the fly and sell properly.  It's not as big an issue for AEW because they have those links with all the indies and they're happy for their workers to take gigs elsewhere, but some of the people coming through the systems these days just need a bunch of seasoning and they're not getting it.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Smackdown has been destroyed, utterly destroyed. After Drew, which seems to be the next feud, you are probably going with Nakamura or Jeff Hardy. You'll probably see a Goldberg title defence for Roman at the Rumble before (if they can do it) The Rock at Mania.

Who is beating Roman for the belt? Who realistically is shown to be even close to his level?

They might do it with Drew, he's the only logical one.

But yeah, not sure what they're thinking. They've lost Big E, Rollins, Edge, Owens and Balor and gained Drew, Sheamus and Jeff Hardy. I mean maybe they'll do something with Ricochet but there's nothing to suggest he's seen as anything special. And I guess they could put Kofi back in singles, but it feels that ship has sailed - it's going to be six months of the Usos vs New Day.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

This is an issue for AEW as well, they shouldn't be putting someone like Jade Cargill anywhere near TV with her current wrestling ability.  She needs to do 6 months in Stardom or wherever to learn how to call things on the fly and sell properly.  It's not as big an issue for AEW because they have those links with all the indies and they're happy for their workers to take gigs elsewhere, but some of the people coming through the systems these days just need a bunch of seasoning and they're not getting it.

Jade is the big one on that for sure. I think AEW do have a bit of a out with it though in the Elevation and Dark shows. There are a few people on the show though that need a bit of work, and those going in the right direction but needs a bit of refining (Tay Conti comes to mind there who is WAY better than when she first signed, but still needs a bit of work)

There are some people it has certainly worked on - I think Pillman Jr is a lot more rounded wrestler now, not great but solid and young. Although with Pillman Jr part of it was being in a lot more healthy circle of friends, growing up a bit, and getting out of the fast approaching QANON hole he was heading for.

[gazzalfc]

I mean WWE are going to lose Kevin owens, Sami Zayn and Jeff hardy to AEW in 6 months as well. Having Kevin Steen, Generico and a hardy family reunion at the compound sets AEW up for 2022 nicely.

They have also quietly split up the entire women's tag team division as well according to Meltzer.

You would hope Vince has a plan that goes beyond selling up but it's hard to see right now

That being said, the undertaker/new day thing on Netflix is a bit of fun

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I fucking love Taz and Excalibur. It's very clear every time they do commentary they are just having a right laugh talking absolute wham.

https://twitter.com/Maffewgregg/status/1445718674698956806?s=20

[tubby]

Taz on commentary is lowkey the best thing about AEW.  Kingston is great when he gets on too.

I mean WWE are going to lose Kevin owens, Sami Zayn and Jeff hardy to AEW in 6 months as well. Having Kevin Steen, Generico and a hardy family reunion at the compound sets AEW up for 2022 nicely.

Steen and Generico should 100% make the switch, but I've zero desire to see Jeff in AEW.  You just know it'd end up with a lengthy program of the Hardyz vs the Bucks and that's just not something I have any interest in.

Also really hoping Hangman isn't the joker in the ladder match tonight.  Jay White would be great, Ospreay would be insane, but I think you bring people like that in with a bigger angle.  Expect it'll be someone like Lio Rush or Speedball Mike Bailey.  No idea who wins it though.

[tubby]

Also, can someone pls explain wtf Rollins' gimmick is now?

https://twitter.com/weratewrestlers/status/1445478356686942208

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Taz on commentary is lowkey the best thing about AEW.  Kingston is great when he gets on too.

Steen and Generico should 100% make the switch, but I've zero desire to see Jeff in AEW.  You just know it'd end up with a lengthy program of the Hardyz vs the Bucks and that's just not something I have any interest in.

Also really hoping Hangman isn't the joker in the ladder match tonight.  Jay White would be great, Ospreay would be insane, but I think you bring people like that in with a bigger angle.  Expect it'll be someone like Lio Rush or Speedball Mike Bailey.  No idea who wins it though.

Yeah definitely shouldn't be Hangman. Thought exactly the same with Ospreay and White, and Lio. Could also MAYBE see Buddy Murphy, but then he promoted the joker card and most people who promote an appearance don't appear.

Could also see perhaps one of the Motor City Machine Guns. Maybe Homicide again?

Apparently bug announcement tonight - I am expecting new titles, Trio's titles I am thinking

[Stockholm Syndrome]

https://www.postwrestling.com/2021/10/05/tony-khan-the-power-structure-in-aew-shifted-in-2019-nothing-has-changed-recently/

Interesting stuff from Tony Khan which kinda confirms what a lot of people could see and feel about AEW - probably after that awful episode which ended with the Dark Order run in and the terrible punches, he grabbed the show and basically decided himself "I am taking over this thing". Other reports have said he is booked but everyone talks through their ideas and he puts the show together as final say. I also think I heard Bucks have a big say in online stuff, and Omega is still a big big head for the women's division (which at one point was bad because he was asking them to do too complicated ideas - Hoddle as England manager comes to mind)

I think the Bucks did get pretty pissed off at this though as they disappeared for months before coming back for a big reign around about this time.

I also don't think it's a shock that 2020 onwards Omega and The Bucks got a much bigger push - they always wanted to put every man and his dog over, and so Tony was like "No stop, you can and should be stars, put people over when you are high enough for it to work"

[LiamG]

Also, can someone pls explain wtf Rollins' gimmick is now?

https://twitter.com/weratewrestlers/status/1445478356686942208

The Godfather?

[tubby]

Not how I would've brought him back, but that crowd was molten for Page.

Now he needs to plow through the Elite before taking the belt.

[Malaysian Kopite]

Cattle mutilation is a terrible finisher

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Cattle mutilation is a terrible finisher

I prefer the Lebell Lock, Cattle Mutilation is (I hope) more of a call back to early Bryan Danielson. It's pretty cool but I feel Lebell Lock and Heel Hook just look way better

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Not how I would've brought him back, but that crowd was molten for Page.

Now he needs to plow through the Elite before taking the belt.

Interesting for what they do with Bryan Danielson now - perhaps him vs Cole at Full Gear.

Odd as it is as he is so so so over, I can see Danielson in maybe 6 months or so turning heel on Hangman for the title. As good a guy as he is, he has made it clear he is here to wrestle and beat the fuck out of dudes, and his style works well both face and heel. Him going full ruthless for that title I could see working really well

[tubby]

Cattle mutilation is a terrible finisher

I like the move but I get why it's not great for TV, you can't see the face of the wrestler taking the move and capturing the tap out is tricky too.

Interesting for what they do with Bryan Danielson now - perhaps him vs Cole at Full Gear.

Odd as it is as he is so so so over, I can see Danielson in maybe 6 months or so turning heel on Hangman for the title. As good a guy as he is, he has made it clear he is here to wrestle and beat the fuck out of dudes, and his style works well both face and heel. Him going full ruthless for that title I could see working really well

Danielson has already hinted at it with a tweet about fairy tales and dragons, so there might be a little needle between them in the lead up to Full Gear.  Punk is a ready made opponent for Page when he takes the belt, straight edge vs the beer drinking cowboy, so I'm expecting that to be one of the first feuds.

I wouldn't go hard on Danielson vs Page before the PPV, think it'd be a tricky piece of booking.  But yep, he absolutely needs to go full on ROH Dragon at some point soonish.  Would save us from his pantomime crowd interaction promos too.

[bird_lfc]

Also, can someone pls explain wtf Rollins' gimmick is now?

https://twitter.com/weratewrestlers/status/1445478356686942208

No idea but it’s the best/most interesting version of him to date IMO

[Lynx the saucy mynx]

I mean WWE are going to lose Kevin owens, Sami Zayn and Jeff hardy to AEW in 6 months as well. Having Kevin Steen, Generico and a hardy family reunion at the compound sets AEW up for 2022 nicely.

They have also quietly split up the entire women's tag team division as well according to Meltzer.

You would hope Vince has a plan that goes beyond selling up but it's hard to see right now

That being said, the undertaker/new day thing on Netflix is a bit of fun

Just as long as he sells the rights to Starrcade, Bash at the Beach and The Great American Bash to the Rhodes family. That’s all I want. It really saddens me that Dusty’s creations are bastardised like this.

Starrcade in my heart will always be the REAL granddaddy of them all. And I know AEW can prove so.

[gazzalfc]

2K Sports have had to scrap 2 of their DLC packs for WWE 2K22 because WWE releases

[tubby]

2K Sports have had to scrap 2 of their DLC packs for WWE 2K22 because WWE releases

Really hope AEW's game is good, because 2K have served up some real shit over the past few years.

[Elzar]

2K Sports have had to scrap 2 of their DLC packs for WWE 2K22 because WWE releases

They could bring out DLC that just removes people from the game. That would be realistic.

[gazzalfc]

Smackdown going to overlap with Rampage tomorrow adding an extra 30 mins to their show.

WWE also promising the final 30 mins (the part directly competing with Rampage) will be commercial free. This will be directly down to Smackdown being relegated to FS1 over FOX due to American football.

AEW are promising a CM Punk match and also a Bryan Danielson pre-show match for YouTube

The wresting war has begun.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Smackdown going to overlap with Rampage tomorrow adding an extra 30 mins to their show.

WWE also promising the final 30 mins (the part directly competing with Rampage) will be commercial free. This will be directly down to Smackdown being relegated to FS1 over FOX due to American football.

AEW are promising a CM Punk match and also a Bryan Danielson pre-show match for YouTube

The wresting war has begun.

WWE also leaking the early Rampage rating as well apparently when it is bad, to make Rampage look weak. Also some fears with Fox and them not being happy (Fox paid a lot of money and Smackdown is perhaps underperforming for the money)

[tubby]

The ratings leaking stuff is straight out of McMahon's playbook.  No one took them seriously when they said they don't consider AEW competition, and things would be a lot worse for WWE right now if they weren't propped up by the millions they're given by the Saudi government every year.

[AndyMuller]

I’ve been watching Dark Side of the Ring which is fascinating and grim at the same time. I’ve finished the 2 seasons on All4, any idea if/when season 3 comes out in the UK? Vice haven’t even got a channel over here anymore either.