Author Topic: Trent Alexander-Arnold  (Read 1366344 times)

Online rob1966

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13840 on: March 9, 2024, 02:34:25 pm »
Jesus Christ it's like a soft fucking primary school playground in here.  These guys are at the height of competitive sport but ooh ooh..... we shouldn't be saying nasty things about each other in case it makes them mad/upset/motivated.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13841 on: March 15, 2024, 03:20:55 pm »
When's he due back? Listed as Apr. 2 on Transfermarkt, though I don't know where they're sourcing that.

https://www.transfermarkt.us/trent-alexander-arnold/verletzungen/spieler/314353
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Offline Gods_Left_Boot

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13842 on: March 15, 2024, 03:27:02 pm »
When's he due back? Listed as Apr. 2 on Transfermarkt, though I don't know where they're sourcing that.

https://www.transfermarkt.us/trent-alexander-arnold/verletzungen/spieler/314353

Jurgen said in the press conference today that Jones could be back for Brighton (31 March) and Trent and Jota possibly the week after that.
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Offline Bennett

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13843 on: March 15, 2024, 03:27:12 pm »
When's he due back? Listed as Apr. 2 on Transfermarkt, though I don't know where they're sourcing that.

https://www.transfermarkt.us/trent-alexander-arnold/verletzungen/spieler/314353

Just from Lijnders' "after the international break" comment I think.

Offline Kopenhagen

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13844 on: March 15, 2024, 04:46:28 pm »
Just from Lijnders' "after the international break" comment I think.

Jurgen said in the press conference today that Jones could be back for Brighton (31 March) and Trent and Jota possibly the week after that.

OK, cheers folks.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13845 on: March 15, 2024, 05:19:06 pm »
Torres with the Trent kit.  8)


Offline Samie

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13846 on: March 15, 2024, 05:28:26 pm »
Torres doing Boxing in Trent's shirt.  ;D




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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13847 on: March 25, 2024, 01:33:29 pm »
Still not sure why we only extended his deal by 1 year in 2021.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13848 on: March 25, 2024, 05:11:43 pm »
Still not sure why we only extended his deal by 1 year in 2021.

The emphasis was probably on rewarding him for his form, rather than tying him down for longer.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13849 on: March 25, 2024, 05:16:18 pm »
Maybe that’s all he wanted to sign? We’re seeing players mapping their career and earnings potential more and more. We’ve just seen Mason Mount leave Chelsea as he didn’t want to sign a deal of the length Chelsea were offering, pretty much because he knows he could negotiate a couple more on his terms. The club were right to agree whatever they could with him. I wouldn’t be shocked if (assuming he signs) his new deal is only until 2027 or 2028.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13850 on: March 25, 2024, 05:21:29 pm »
Probably agents are also expecting better TV deals or whatever for clubs. So even if trent doesn't improve, the club may pay more in 2 years.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13851 on: March 25, 2024, 06:10:29 pm »
he seems quite vocal now about wanting to play in midfield.
Id say a new contract might drag on until early june

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13852 on: March 25, 2024, 06:18:09 pm »
So he's off to Real Madrid then is he?. Should we fear a discrepancy between our valuation and their offer?.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13853 on: March 25, 2024, 08:02:25 pm »
So he's off to Real Madrid then is he?. Should we fear a discrepancy between our valuation and their offer?.

To play midfield? Good luck with that.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13854 on: March 25, 2024, 08:14:18 pm »
Maybe that’s all he wanted to sign? We’re seeing players mapping their career and earnings potential more and more. We’ve just seen Mason Mount leave Chelsea as he didn’t want to sign a deal of the length Chelsea were offering, pretty much because he knows he could negotiate a couple more on his terms. The club were right to agree whatever they could with him. I wouldn’t be shocked if (assuming he signs) his new deal is only until 2027 or 2028.

Wasn't it more of a wage issue with Mount? He'd been one of their best performers, he'd came through the youth team, but he was one of the lower paid players, while they kept bringing in players on 2-300k a week who invariably flopped. I don't think Chelsea were offering him that so he went somewhere that would (Old Trafford).  That's why he was always choosing there over us (thankfully) as we wouldn't be making him one of our top 2 or 3 earners off the bat.

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Offline Garlic Red

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13855 on: March 25, 2024, 08:34:09 pm »
Wasn't it more of a wage issue with Mount? He'd been one of their best performers, he'd came through the youth team, but he was one of the lower paid players, while they kept bringing in players on 2-300k a week who invariably flopped. I don't think Chelsea were offering him that so he went somewhere that would (Old Trafford).  That's why he was always choosing there over us (thankfully) as we wouldn't be making him one of our top 2 or 3 earners off the bat.

Quote
As you’d suspect, one of the stumbling blocks has been to do with the size of Mount’s salary. He is a first-team regular — the only one to play in every Premier League game for Chelsea this season, having also been picked consistently by previous managers Frank Lampard and Tuchel. The 23-year-old can rightly ask to be paid closer to what the biggest earners are getting. But that means a significant pay rise in one go.

The new owners are trying to offer players more incentivised contracts. This means giving a decent base salary but with the ability to earn a lot more depending on individual and team achievements. This is great in theory but doesn’t work if other clubs are willing to pay a higher sum should a transfer take place.

Another aspect which has prompted a lot of back and forth is the length of contract. They successfully convinced Armando Broja (six years) and James (five plus an option for another 12 months) to commit for a long period of time. The Athletic sources at the club, remaining anonymous so they can keep their job, say that one of the offers made to Mount was for seven years but this was rejected.

Should this be construed as a lack of dedication on Mount’s part compared to his team-mates? No. As Tuchel’s departure showed, things can change in football very quickly. The longer contract you sign, the more say over your future you relinquish to the club. It doesn’t mean Mount is already plotting a move away in a few years’ time. Signing for four or five years, for example, is still a long period and there is always the option to discuss fresh terms again.

It was a bit of both.

There will always be players that want the security of a long term contract, I mean look at all of the players Chelsea have recently signed penning those ridiculous deals. But I think we’ll see more players looking for a bit more flexibility, a bit more control. The NBA has gone that way massively, where players are using contractual standoffs to dictate their futures more and maximise their earnings, it feels like some of the modern players/agents are learning a few tricks from across the pond.

Offline Fromola

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13856 on: March 26, 2024, 08:25:09 am »
It was a bit of both.

There will always be players that want the security of a long term contract, I mean look at all of the players Chelsea have recently signed penning those ridiculous deals. But I think we’ll see more players looking for a bit more flexibility, a bit more control. The NBA has gone that way massively, where players are using contractual standoffs to dictate their futures more and maximise their earnings, it feels like some of the modern players/agents are learning a few tricks from across the pond.

Players want to maximise their earnings which Mount has took by going to the Old Trafford money pit..offered whatever he's on there at Chelsea, over a longer period, he'd have probably took it. Look at Colwill, making noises of wanting to leave but even at a young age has signed his prime 20s away, once he was offered the big salary.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13857 on: March 26, 2024, 08:39:36 am »
I definitely think Trent will see who the manager is and where he will play him before putting pen to paper. Also, I think Trent has a good chance of playing in midfield under the new manager especially given his passing range from deep and the form of Bradley on the right.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13858 on: March 26, 2024, 08:56:02 am »
Most of Trent’s weaknesses are mitigated at RB. Some of his strengths are emphasised in midfield (more passing options enables him to utilise his passing range better) but I just can’t see him playing CM at the highest level. Whereas if he wants to be he could be one of the greatest to ever do it from RB. And as for speculation that Trent is committed to Liverpool depending on the extent to which we’re willing to play CM… yeah that sort of attitude can get lost. He’ll play where the coach thinks he should play. And I doubt Trent is doing it anyway. He seems to love the club and I really doubt he’ll hold the club to ransom in that way.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2024, 08:59:11 am by Knight »

Offline spider-neil

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13859 on: March 26, 2024, 09:26:50 am »
Most of Trent’s weaknesses are mitigated at RB. Some of his strengths are emphasised in midfield (more passing options enables him to utilise his passing range better) but I just can’t see him playing CM at the highest level. Whereas if he wants to be he could be one of the greatest to ever do it from RB. And as for speculation that Trent is committed to Liverpool depending on the extent to which we’re willing to play CM… yeah that sort of attitude can get lost. He’ll play where the coach thinks he should play. And I doubt Trent is doing it anyway. He seems to love the club and I really doubt he’ll hold the club to ransom in that way.

Trent with a dedicated 6 behind would be the equivalent of Alonso and Mash. I can definitely see the advantage of having a player at the base of the midfield that can find a runner anywhere on the pitch.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13860 on: March 26, 2024, 11:07:51 am »
And I doubt Trent is doing it anyway. He seems to love the club and I really doubt he’ll hold the club to ransom in that way.

Is it holding the club to ransom really?
If he really feels he enjoys his game more in CM and is happy to play at another club that would play him there, then surely it makes sense to sound out if he has a role in that position and to move if that's what he wants. Maybe, even for less money!!!!!
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13861 on: March 26, 2024, 11:15:19 am »
Most of Trent’s weaknesses are mitigated at RB. Some of his strengths are emphasised in midfield (more passing options enables him to utilise his passing range better) but I just can’t see him playing CM at the highest level. Whereas if he wants to be he could be one of the greatest to ever do it from RB. And as for speculation that Trent is committed to Liverpool depending on the extent to which we’re willing to play CM… yeah that sort of attitude can get lost. He’ll play where the coach thinks he should play. And I doubt Trent is doing it anyway. He seems to love the club and I really doubt he’ll hold the club to ransom in that way.

Pretty much how I see it. He's had a cracking career so far, and he's enjoyed brilliant success at Liverpool. Surely, he'd be keen to speak to the new manager and understand where he fits. He is funny one though, in that at his age he may well be looking to move position. I've stated on here before, I'd prefer us to play a right back who RELISHES defending, in a way that Trent doesn't seem to. That way you can get the best of both world's if you can deploy him further forward. He could even be a brilliant right-side midfielder in a 4.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13862 on: March 26, 2024, 11:17:41 am »
Is it holding the club to ransom really?
If he really feels he enjoys his game more in CM and is happy to play at another club that would play him there, then surely it makes sense to sound out if he has a role in that position and to move if that's what he wants. Maybe, even for less money!!!!!

To me, 'play me where I want to play or I'll leave' sounds like holding us to ransom but perhaps I'm being unfair.

Trent with a dedicated 6 behind would be the equivalent of Alonso and Mash. I can definitely see the advantage of having a player at the base of the midfield that can find a runner anywhere on the pitch.

Alonso and Mash were twin 6s weren't they, rather than Mash being behind. And tbf, it does feel like Trent has more chance of playing midfield in a twin 6 setup than any other way. I just remain unconvinced that he's good enough on the half turn and when pressed to do this job at the highest level. He's played his whole career with the play, mostly, in front of him. Plus I think he ends up being deeper, on average, than he is from RB which will hit his goal/ assist numbers. That said, obviously the plus side is massive like you say - his passing range is extraordinary and that weapon is most effectively deployed centrally. If we did move to twin 6s put Trent there it'd cause us some problems because I'm not sure we have the players for it right now. We'd need someone to play alongside Trent and I'm not sure anyone quite fits the bill. And then Szoboslai/ Jones/ Mac would need to find a place further forward.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2024, 11:20:01 am by Knight »

Offline Fromola

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13863 on: March 26, 2024, 04:17:44 pm »
Most of Trent’s weaknesses are mitigated at RB. Some of his strengths are emphasised in midfield (more passing options enables him to utilise his passing range better) but I just can’t see him playing CM at the highest level. Whereas if he wants to be he could be one of the greatest to ever do it from RB. And as for speculation that Trent is committed to Liverpool depending on the extent to which we’re willing to play CM… yeah that sort of attitude can get lost. He’ll play where the coach thinks he should play. And I doubt Trent is doing it anyway. He seems to love the club and I really doubt he’ll hold the club to ransom in that way.

Not sure he walks into the midfield at Madrid with the options they've got either.

Ultimately Trent is not a defensive midfielder and Mac is better suited to either the 6 or 8 role in those two positions. Klopp has gone from a hybrid role with Trent (playing both positions with RB and CM) to almost playing a half in each position more frequently this season.

He was the best RB in the league for years but as our midfield has become more open; plus with Fabinho's decline last season while Henderson could no longer do all the covering and running for him (and Salah getting older) has meant his defensive deficencies are more exposed - at the same time as we've given him more license to play inside and he's less interested in defending.

Maybe he could be our De Bruyne under the next manager. He's got the right foot for it. Hopefully he doesn't go down the Gerrard road of just wanting to play CM all the time, regardless of if he's better utilised elsewhere.

« Last Edit: March 26, 2024, 04:23:07 pm by Fromola »
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13864 on: March 26, 2024, 06:39:52 pm »
I don’t see it as Trent holding the club to ransom. Ultimately, it’s his career and it’s his own destiny. If he wants to develop into a midfielder, if he wants that position as his own, he can decide if he wants to move away to chase that or try and push for it here. We can all say things like he isn’t suited etc but the reality is we haven’t seen him really given the chance to start games and play full games in midfield. Inverting at right back has been a decent solution, moving him to a deep lying playmaker role towards the end of games has also worked, but ultimately it’s not playing midfield with and without the ball for 90 mins, is it? It’s unfortunate his injuries have coincided with Bradley’s rise as I’m fairly certain he’d have played there, especially against some of the sides we’ve been up against during this calendar year.

The obvious comparison is Gerrard when he wasn’t happy being played on the right, despite being outrageous there. Ultimately he felt he was better centrally and he proved it by being a quite ridiculous 10 from around 2007 and onwards.

My belief is Trent could play the midfield position, he might not be stupendous on the half turn etc but his IQ is so high and he can carry the ball quite well, ultimately he’ll find a way to get on the ball and influence the game. Some of the best sides we’ve ever seen grace the game have utilised his qualities in midfield from deep lying positions, I actually think his athleticism is better than some of those players so he could add runs into the box and score quite a lot as well if he has the right partner in midfield.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13865 on: March 26, 2024, 07:41:01 pm »
Issue for me is that every year he plays as a fullback is another year he’s not developing the skill, tactical awareness and experience to be a top-level midfielder. In my opinion he’s a generational talent and could be the best ball player in Europe, but against the best opposition at home and in Europe he’ll be up against midfielders who have been playing the position for years…if ultimately that’s where he’s going to end up, he needs to be playing there sooner rather than later.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13866 on: Yesterday at 03:26:59 pm »
Issue for me is that every year he plays as a fullback is another year he’s not developing the skill, tactical awareness and experience to be a top-level midfielder. In my opinion he’s a generational talent and could be the best ball player in Europe, but against the best opposition at home and in Europe he’ll be up against midfielders who have been playing the position for years…if ultimately that’s where he’s going to end up, he needs to be playing there sooner rather than later.


He plays half of most games in midfield. He’s being asked to do a lot of things you’d ask a CM to do, even if it’s from a starting position as an RB.

His role for Liverpool has very rarely been that of a traditional RB.


If we played Trent just as a midfielder where do you see him playing? Personally I think it’s as a 6 or part of a double pivot. I’m less convinced about him as an 8.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13867 on: Yesterday at 04:28:47 pm »
He plays half of most games in midfield. He’s being asked to do a lot of things you’d ask a CM to do, even if it’s from a starting position as an RB.

His role for Liverpool has very rarely been that of a traditional RB.


If we played Trent just as a midfielder where do you see him playing? Personally I think it’s as a 6 or part of a double pivot. I’m less convinced about him as an 8.

He'd be ideal as a 6 in certain games, but he wouldn't give you what Endo does (or Fabinho did) off the ball. I think Mac would be the better option over Trent in either of those two deep roles as well. I think Trent could do the sort of job Jones does but then Jones was really making that position his own this season when he's been fit.

Maybe in Dom/Elliott's role but we're asking those lads to run themselves ragged in that role and be the legs in the team like Henderson used to. But then the next manager will have their own midfield setup.

« Last Edit: Yesterday at 04:31:29 pm by Fromola »
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13868 on: Yesterday at 11:39:09 pm »
To me, 'play me where I want to play or I'll leave' sounds like holding us to ransom

Only if you’re a tabloid footy hack. “Held to ransom” is such a cliche.

His contract with us is a mutually beneficial arrangement - he’s not a slave, we pay him well to do a job for us. Telling the club he’d like his role to change is not “holding us to ransom”, just an employee having a frank discussion with his employer about career development opportunities. But that doesn’t make good headlines, does it?

The problem for Trent is that we don’t build teams around individuals and it might not be possible for us to give him what he wants without compromising the team ethic.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 11:43:14 pm by smutchin »

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13869 on: Today at 02:48:38 am »
I'll ask again or see if there is a discussion to be had -

Bradley seems like he's a better RB than Trent - maybe not a better passer agreed.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13870 on: Today at 02:53:44 am »
I'll ask again or see if there is a discussion to be had -

Bradley seems like he's a better RB than Trent - maybe not a better passer agreed.

No maybe about it. Trent is second only to De Bruyne

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13871 on: Today at 05:15:46 am »
Frankly, I think any manager would be asked in his interview how he plans to utilise Trent if he became the boss. He's what Americans call a 'franchise player' and you build around him.

I don't think he's the type to say he won't sign a contract if he can't play in midfield, to be honest. I think people are reading far too much into comments he's made about the England team, where it's basically been made clear to him that's the only chance he's got of ever getting a call up again.

Positions are fluid these days anyway. Just look at how Matip and Virg are spending time in the midfield, or the fact Mo is often picking up the ball as a striker.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13872 on: Today at 06:59:59 am »
It will get sorted. Trent is a clever lad and his representation will listen to other offers, but ultimately I fully expect we’ll make him our highest earner or near abouts and he’ll sign a three year extension, which means he’d be 28 at the end of the next contract and in a position to negotiate one more huge deal before the end of his career.

Players are savvier than ever and more than ever running their careers as a business in one sense and you can’t blame the lad. I think we’ll pay him a lot and that coupled with his love for the club will keep him here, but I’ll be mightily surprised if we see him tied down to a 4 or 5 year deal.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13873 on: Today at 07:36:07 am »
Only if you’re a tabloid footy hack. “Held to ransom” is such a cliche.

His contract with us is a mutually beneficial arrangement - he’s not a slave, we pay him well to do a job for us. Telling the club he’d like his role to change is not “holding us to ransom”, just an employee having a frank discussion with his employer about career development opportunities. But that doesn’t make good headlines, does it?

The problem for Trent is that we don’t build teams around individuals and it might not be possible for us to give him what he wants without compromising the team ethic.

Ignoring the 'hold to ransom' framing, "I'll leave unless you give me assurances/ guarantees that you'll play me in the position I want to be played" is not behaviour that any coach should accept from one of their players or a healthy part of transfer negotiations.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13874 on: Today at 07:58:44 am »
It will get sorted. Trent is a clever lad and his representation will listen to other offers, but ultimately I fully expect we’ll make him our highest earner or near abouts and he’ll sign a three year extension, which means he’d be 28 at the end of the next contract and in a position to negotiate one more huge deal before the end of his career.

Players are savvier than ever and more than ever running their careers as a business in one sense and you can’t blame the lad. I think we’ll pay him a lot and that coupled with his love for the club will keep him here, but I’ll be mightily surprised if we see him tied down to a 4 or 5 year deal.

Agree with this.

Ultimately I think a deal gets done. I think Trent ends up our 2nd highest paid player after Mo and probably considerably more than likes of VvD and Thiago.

I think it might be a new 4 year deal. Puts him about 29 when it expires. Also provides club with 2 years of relative security before new deal discussion may be initiated.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13875 on: Today at 08:32:01 am »
Issue for me is that every year he plays as a fullback is another year he’s not developing the skill, tactical awareness and experience to be a top-level midfielder. In my opinion he’s a generational talent and could be the best ball player in Europe, but against the best opposition at home and in Europe he’ll be up against midfielders who have been playing the position for years…if ultimately that’s where he’s going to end up, he needs to be playing there sooner rather than later.


I fully agree, he's a generational talent who is basically a Beckham (skillwise) with a more diverse background and none of the celebrity bullshit. England don't see him that way, more fool them.

Would love to see him in a midfield role.
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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13876 on: Today at 08:46:25 am »
Ignoring the 'hold to ransom' framing, "I'll leave unless you give me assurances/ guarantees that you'll play me in the position I want to be played" is not behaviour that any coach should accept from one of their players or a healthy part of transfer negotiations.

Do you believe that is what Trent is actually saying to the club or is it perhaps just the media's usual desperation to make a story out of nothing? Without strong evidence either way, I'm taking it all with a pinch of salt.

Discussions about his role in the team will be a normal part of any player negotiating a new contract. Players want to be given assurances that their role will match their ambitions - whether it's the position they'll be expected to play or how often they'll be picked to start, or any number of other factors. That doesn't necessarily mean it's an adversarial player vs club situation, that's just how the media like to portray it.

I guess a lot will depend on the new manager - one of his first jobs will be to have that discussion with Trent.

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Re: Trent Alexander-Arnold
« Reply #13877 on: Today at 08:56:45 am »
Do you believe that is what Trent is actually saying to the club or is it perhaps just the media's usual desperation to make a story out of nothing? Without strong evidence either way, I'm taking it all with a pinch of salt.

Discussions about his role in the team will be a normal part of any player negotiating a new contract. Players want to be given assurances that their role will match their ambitions - whether it's the position they'll be expected to play or how often they'll be picked to start, or any number of other factors. That doesn't necessarily mean it's an adversarial player vs club situation, that's just how the media like to portray it.

I guess a lot will depend on the new manager - one of his first jobs will be to have that discussion with Trent.

I absolutely don’t think he is saying it. People in here are talking as if he is. In terms of explanations for a delay, I suspect the uncertainty over our new coach and him being savvy in terms of money/ length is what’s happening.