Topic: URGENT: Hicks's 281m loan - campaign to fight for our club!

[Paddock77]

Another poker play perhaps just like Khirdi? The man is playing a high risk game....

He may the most odious fat waste of space we have ever had the misfortune to come across but he has made millions by being an astute business man. He must have other plans in place.

[Franky]

Looking at the unprecedented degree of censorship on .tv, in addition to the latest desperate propaganda, that a potential takover would bring O'neil to replace Hodgson, I think they are paniced. So we should turn pressure up.

Again attention to their "little blue parrott", he'll try hard to refinance them

[No666]

My feeling is that we put the boycott against Blackstone's companies in mothballs unless Blackstone have second thoughts. We need a real groundswell of support to be effective and a lot of fans will be wondering what the point is if Blackstone is not financing Hicks. PLUS we want a carrot and stick approach as we've used with RBS. You do what we want, you get a reward.

BUT I think we should keep the emails up to all these high-priests of capitalism, as detailed in this thread and in the Kopfaithful initiative.

AND I'm trying to think of ways to target Hicks and his other companies, directly. Want to make the fat pig sweat a bit more. [Apologies to Stockdam if I've offended his sensibilities there.  ]

[redmen77]

My feeling is that we put the boycott against Blackstone's companies in mothballs unless Blackstone have second thoughts. We need a real groundswell of support to be effective and a lot of fans will be wondering what the point is if Blackstone is not financing Hicks. PLUS we want a carrot and stick approach as we've used with RBS. You do what we want, you get a reward.

BUT I think we should keep the emails up to all these high-priests of capitalism, as detailed in this thread and in the Kopfaithful initiative.

AND I'm trying to think of ways to target Hicks and his other companies, directly. Want to make the fat pig sweat a bit more. [Apologies to Stockdam if I've offended his sensibilities there.  ]

Have we had actual confirmation though mate that Blackstone have backed out? I know plenty of journo's have reported this but couldn't that just be mis feeding of info?

[No666]

I think they're fully aware of what would happen if they tried that.

[fredfrop]

I think the time is right for us to take a step back and try and empathise with our American owners

This chapter from Tom Wolfe's book A Man in Full, should give you some idea what (I fervently hope) Tom & George are going through right now: http://www.bookbrowse.com/excerpts/index.cfm?book_number=437&page_number=1


He kept staring at Croker (H&G) with his chin lifted and his head blinked, as if his credulity was being put to a severe test. "Let me tell you two gentlemen something about loans. A loan is not a gift. When we make a loan, we actually expect to get paid back."

"Nobody's talkin' about not payin' you back," snapped Croker. "We're talkin' about something very simple." Sump'm veh simple.

"Simple I like," said the Artiste. "I'd like to hear some simple proposals as to how we're gonna get paid back. Simple, no assembly necessary, batteries included."  Peepgass noticed that the first little dark crescents of sweat were beginning to form on Croker's shirt, beneath his arms.

[RayPhilAlan]

Great post, and thank you. There's a lot of questions I want to ask, but I note your comment about not wanting to to release info that might allow the current owners to see where attacks are coming from. Fair enough.

One question others might want to discuss: Bamba has in the past had his info from the Huang camp. The Rocket was implied to be a Huang weapon. Who thinks Bamba is still getting his stuff from the same places, and if so, is Huang still in action, but waiting for the October deadline?

[RayPhilAlan]

G&H personally dont have liability to pay the debts to RBS.  The companies do (specifically Kop Football Ltd and LFC&AG Ltd).

So the joint and several liability only relates to the £110m worth of guarantees.  ie Only if the companies default on the loans do G&H have to pay up personally, and then only up to a max of £110m between them.

While I am sure you are right that in principle it is joint and several liability, in practice the guarantees are themselves secured (some are in the form of cash deposits we have been told).  And so if the banks simply seize the securities backing the guarantees, then that will mean that, in effect, G&H have each paid half.

Of course, if GG has somehow lost one of the securities put up for his guarantee  (eg $75m from Springfield, or Mill, or whatever its called) then that would have consequences for all concerned.



If the RBS loan is paid off in full by the companies, then the issue of he guarantee doesnt arise.  ie if LFC can be sold for an amount equal to the RBS debt.

It would not be in GG's interests to block a sale of LFC though, would it?  Obviously, it would depend on price, but he would want the quickest sale possible.

The directors cannot "block" a full refinance.  They can vote against, but if they do, then G&H can sack them.  The bank would have to agree to this.



What do you mean?

If this is true, he will have difficulties in continuing to act as a director of the UK companies.  He will also need to notify the PL.

I think Bamba is simplifying things here, Jack. Frustrating, since we want a clearer picture, but he either doesn't know further details or feels it unwise to share them.

[baffled]

Martin Broughton, Christian Purslow and Ian Ayre are not the enemy.

As much as I've always suspected. hopeful news bamba. I can't believe there's going to be another bank going to lend Hicks £281m. lets hope that hunch is right.

[Franky]

I have suggested this in the past and didn't seem to attract any attention. I'll suggest it again, maybe now it sounds more interesting and perhaps more relevant.

How about sending also e mails to the City and the Wall Street. To all financial institutions and all traders of shares, so they know our position regarding any refinance attempt. That us the "consumers" we will boycott the company, but also boycott them(the financers) plus the companies with which they're linked to. Make clear that we are NOT going to help and service any debt. To try also and expose RBS position and make them finish the current situation off and not extend the loan.

In other words to try and stir a bit the things in the stock market. We all know that rumours play a major part in there. Even the slightest impact on their share value would scare the s out of RBS and any other institution. Rumours about the ability to service debt have brought entire countries on their knees and made almost impossible for them to refinance their debt. I pressume it's much easier to achieve something similar with a football team.

What do you think about that?

[LiverBirdKop]

In other words to try and stir a bit the things in the stock market. We all know that rumours play a major part in there. Even the slightest impact on their share value would scare the s out of RBS and any other institution. Rumours about the ability to service debt have brought entire countries on their knees and made almost impossible for them to refinance their debt. I pressume it's much easier to achieve something similar with a football team.

What do you think about that?

Rumours do travel fast in the financial sectors industry. Someone more knowledgeable could give you better insight but it doesn't sound like a crazy idea to me albeit harder to implement.

Has an email campaign to G&H's offices ever been implemented at all?

[lfc_maniac_tsr]

Your message

  To:      bennett.goodman@gsocap.com;
Stephen.Schwarzman@blackstone.com; Larry Goldman; Doug Roerig; Carl
Goldsmith; Larry Goldman; Doug Roerig; lfink@blackrock.com;
tlevart@dkpartners.com; sleviant@dkpartners.com;
jbloom@trimarancapital.com; David.Shaw@deshaw.com;
jaranson@centerbridge.com; jbader@halcyonllc.com;
mbrancaccio@stonetowercapital.com
  Cc:      deepak.kannan@power.alstom.com
  Subject: Bleeding our Club Dry!
  Sent:    Mon, 20 Sep 2010 08:27:13 -0400

was deleted without being read on Mon, 20 Sep 2010 11:11:08 -0400
Final-Recipient: RFC822; droerig@beachpointcapital.com
Disposition: automatic-action/MDN-sent-automatically; deleted
X-MSExch-Correlation-Key: WhsC69U9v0mLf1HLzHI8pw==



This is the reply I got!
YAyaya!

[sydred09]

I have suggested this in the past and didn't seem to attract any attention. I'll suggest it again, maybe now it sounds more interesting and perhaps more relevant.

How about sending also e mails to the City and the Wall Street. To all financial institutions and all traders of shares, so they know our position regarding any refinance attempt. That us the "consumers" we will boycott the company, but also boycott them(the financers) plus the companies with which they're linked to. Make clear that we are NOT going to help and service any debt. To try also and expose RBS position and make them finish the current situation off and not extend the loan.

In other words to try and stir a bit the things in the stock market. We all know that rumours play a major part in there. Even the slightest impact on their share value would scare the s out of RBS and any other institution. Rumours about the ability to service debt have brought entire countries on their knees and made almost impossible for them to refinance their debt. I pressume it's much easier to achieve something similar with a football team.

What do you think about that?

Not a bad idea at all

[arnaldo]

He will get his refinance, it's a cert! The man always gets what he's wanted in his time at this club. There is no doubt in my mind, unfortunately, he will do it again

[J-Mc-]

Your message

  To:      bennett.goodman@gsocap.com;
Stephen.Schwarzman@blackstone.com; Larry Goldman; Doug Roerig; Carl
Goldsmith; Larry Goldman; Doug Roerig; lfink@blackrock.com;
tlevart@dkpartners.com; sleviant@dkpartners.com;
jbloom@trimarancapital.com; David.Shaw@deshaw.com;
jaranson@centerbridge.com; jbader@halcyonllc.com;
mbrancaccio@stonetowercapital.com
  Cc:      deepak.kannan@power.alstom.com
  Subject: Bleeding our Club Dry!
  Sent:    Mon, 20 Sep 2010 08:27:13 -0400

was deleted without being read on Mon, 20 Sep 2010 11:11:08 -0400
Final-Recipient: RFC822; droerig@beachpointcapital.com
Disposition: automatic-action/MDN-sent-automatically; deleted
X-MSExch-Correlation-Key: WhsC69U9v0mLf1HLzHI8pw==



This is the reply I got!
YAyaya!

Don't put anything to do with the club in the Subject title.

[WaltonRed]

I have suggested this in the past and didn't seem to attract any attention. I'll suggest it again, maybe now it sounds more interesting and perhaps more relevant.

How about sending also e mails to the City and the Wall Street. To all financial institutions and all traders of shares, so they know our position regarding any refinance attempt. That us the "consumers" we will boycott the company, but also boycott them(the financers) plus the companies with which they're linked to. Make clear that we are NOT going to help and service any debt. To try also and expose RBS position and make them finish the current situation off and not extend the loan.

In other words to try and stir a bit the things in the stock market. We all know that rumours play a major part in there. Even the slightest impact on their share value would scare the s out of RBS and any other institution. Rumours about the ability to service debt have brought entire countries on their knees and made almost impossible for them to refinance their debt. I pressume it's much easier to achieve something similar with a football team.

What do you think about that?

Think this is a non-starter.  There are literally thousands of financial institutions in the City so a blanket email would be meaningless.  the chances are that no-one will read it or remember it.

what wwould be great is if we get a relationship going with some very clued up financial journalists (perhaps we already have) and that as soon as we hear whispers or any conversations between a Bank and Hicks, we then immediately fire off 10,000 warning emails - one email from 10,000 people ideally.  If during negotiations they get a sense of the potential hostility it will help to put a spanner in the works.

But I think that a general warning email is just too huge and general an undertaking to have any effect.

[capt k]

He will get his refinance, it's a cert! The man always gets what he's wanted in his time at this club. There is no doubt in my mind, unfortunately, he will do it again

But  as Bob Dylan once said..the times, they are a changing..
IF, we , as the fans and the true custodians, of this great club, apply enough pressure,  then thisperson that I find irritatingfaced LBO fat fucker will NOT get his way..
we need to make it financially impractical for anyone{group or individual} to support him.

his history speaks for itself
he is not a man that ANYONE should be dealing with..
let US remind all those that want to help him out..that aiding and abetting is against the law in our eyes.. and fuck the 3 mths suspended sentence, you aid and abett this twat..youre getting 21 yrs + of lost earnings/profit { just ask the S*n}

[jason42]

As well as those points, if lenders know that they will be targetted regardless of whether they talk to Hicks or not, then they have less to lose by talking to him.

Good point Jack - damned if they do and damned if they don't....

[Gigantic Lamb]

http://liverpoolfc.wellredmag.co.uk/Latest/dear-mr-hester-please-save-liverpool-fc.html

[lfc_maniac_tsr]

Dear all,
You might be puzzled to see such a mail from me about something which most of you are not aware of. 
You guys know pretty well that I support a football club called Liverpool. It is one of the most successful English football clubs, with rich tradition, culture and history.
The reason I wrote to you guys, is that the message should have a global reach. 
Let me paint you guys a small picture of what is the state, my football club is in:
In 2007, two guys namely George gilette and Tom Hicks took over my club and made a lot of promises. But it all turned to lies and they kept piling loads of debt, year by year. Royal bank of Scotland is the source of their finance for the last couple of years. Now, since we are not able to repay the debt(consequence of the owner's legal frauds!), the banks are calling for the owner's heads. October 6th is the deadline given to them, to leave our football club alone without any profits(referring to the owners).
There are several buyers out there to buy our football club(including Ambani and Subrata Roy!). But what these 2 owners are doing is that, they are trying to refinance the entire debt to the bank through some alternative financial consortium(Blackstone/GSO). If the re-financing goes through, then the owners will stay for another 2 years and there will be no investment in the team, players, infrastructure,etc..

We, as the supporters have come in front to demonstrate our power to oust the owners. We are trying to send the correct messages and voices to the people who are willing to re-finance those 2 crooks! We are trying our level best to make sure that the refinancing does not happen. That is the reason I sent those mails to you guys.
The products of the blackstone/GSo group(mentioned in the boycott mail) are not present in India. I am asking you guys, since you must be the direct consumers of those products, to boycott them and spread the message. 

United Biscuits – whose main brands include the following: McVities, Twiglets, Phileas Fogg, Hula Hoops, Penguin, Jaffa Cakes, Carrs, KP, McCoys, Mini Cheddars, Skips.
Orangina
Hilton Hotels, Cafe Rouge, Bella Italia, Strada, Spirit pubs.
Centre Parks, Alton Towers, Tussauds, Legoland, London Eye.
Cineworld.
T mobile.
The previous mails were all sent to the respective people in charge of those products.

Thanks a ton for reading all of my mails patiently and helping to our cause.

Regards,
**********

This was the mail sent to all those people who does not follow football, but can spread the message to ensure a global reach. I live in India where none of the products are consumed. So, I have sent it to all my friends, relatives, people I know, poised at the States, UK, Europe etc.
I thought the above mail would help people to circulate amongst those who does'nt follow football and liverpool.

[reds88]

Some people speculated this over the weekend, that Hicks was trying to scrare RBS in to another refinance by claiming he could go elsewhere.

On the other hand, RBS could be thinking - great let those suckers take the risk. 

[xerxes1]

But  as Bob Dylan once said..the times, they are a changing..

he also said "If you aint got nothing, you got nothing to lose", which is pretty much where G&H are at now.

[Franky]

As well as those points, if lenders know that they will be targetted regardless of whether they talk to Hicks or not, then they have less to lose by talking to him.

No I wasn't saying to boycott all of them. I was suggesting to send an informative e mail that in case  any of them refinance, this would be the result. A specific, targeted strategy. So they know the consequences and reject in case they are approached..

[KeithK83]

I know you posted this a while back Bamba, but i just wanna say cheers for all the updates, from the Huang thing on... i was only a guest viewer at the time and your updates were a key factor in me retaining my sanity in August. Sound man and cheers again... looking at whats going on now, looks likeyou hit the nail on the head again there.