Author Topic: FAO Shitcoat, Ferguson, Guardiola et al (Read 34433 times)

Alan_X · « **Reply #160 on:** April 30, 2014, 11:54:03 pm »

Quote from: mccred on April 30, 2013, 10:47:34 pm

Shut some twat up in the pub who was saying The red nosed one was the best ever. Reminded him of our Bobs record, 1 UEFA Cup (When it was a much better standard), 3 European Cups ( When you had to win the league or European Cup, just to qualify, not win fourth) 6 League Titles(Changing the name doesn't make it any easier or harder to win) and to cap it off 3 league cups running, then the minor stuff Charity Shields etc all in 9 years.
Don't think anyone will ever achieve that level again, back then great managers could build great teams, now average managers can buy great teams. Personally don't think money has improved the game. That's a different thread.
Are Bob still the greatest.

And that doesn't take into account the level of manager he was up against. Brian Clough won the European Cup two years running during that period.

Alan_X · « **Reply #161 on:** April 30, 2014, 11:54:53 pm »

Quote from: Ryba on May 8, 2013, 04:31:18 pm

Can't argue with that but just a point. Mourinho will get 3 or 4 eventually. Will that make him better than Paisley, Ferguson, etc? Not in my book.

idontknow · « **Reply #162 on:** April 30, 2014, 11:57:33 pm »

Quote from: mccred on April 30, 2013, 10:47:34 pm

Shut some twat up in the pub who was saying The red nosed one was the best ever. Reminded him of our Bobs record, 1 UEFA Cup (When it was a much better standard), 3 European Cups ( When you had to win the league or European Cup, just to qualify, not win fourth) 6 League Titles(Changing the name doesn't make it any easier or harder to win) and to cap it off 3 league cups running, then the minor stuff Charity Shields etc all in 9 years.
Don't think anyone will ever achieve that level again, back then great managers could build great teams, now average managers can buy great teams. Personally don't think money has improved the game. That's a different thread.
Are Bob still the greatest.

Plus everything he did with Bill and what he left for Joe and then Kenny. He is the top of the top of the top, always and forever. Over and above all those trophies, every time I hear his name, or say it, or see his picture, I smile like a lord or a cat or whatever smiles wide and beaming. He created happiness. Bob Paisley, always the greatest.

Purdy · « **Reply #163 on:** April 30, 2014, 11:58:24 pm »

Pep will be the only who can do it in as short as a nine year career, although he won't be doing three in five years.

Also doing it with the same club is more impressive, keeping those players motivated and consistently performing (winning the league also required) without going to other clubs and spunking all the money possible is amazing.

Mourinho has lost 6/8 semis with the most expensive teams in the competition most of the time whilst being hailed a tactical genius, he isn't even fucking close.

rscanderlech · « **Reply #164 on:** May 1, 2014, 02:08:45 am »

You've got to remember also that Paisley did it in 9 years. That's one in every three. At the moment, only Guardiola comes close to that rate of European Cup victories, with 2 in 5.

Sorry, just realised that I'm not at all the first person to have posted this!

quinny · « **Reply #165 on:** May 1, 2014, 03:30:23 am »

Don't want anyone to match Paisley but if somebody has to I wouldn't mind Ancelotti. Will be supporting Atletico in the final but wouldn't mind Real too much. I think someday someone will get 3 and I'd rather Ancelotti got there before Mourinho, Guardiola or anyone else.

Hij · « **Reply #166 on:** May 1, 2014, 04:08:46 am »

Quote from: Juan Loco on April 25, 2012, 10:25:21 pm

Count 'em.

Hij · « **Reply #167 on:** May 1, 2014, 04:11:51 am »

Quote from: quinny on May 1, 2014, 03:30:23 am

Don't want anyone to match Paisley but if somebody has to I wouldn't mind Ancelotti. Will be supporting Atletico in the final but wouldn't mind Real too much. I think someday someone will get 3 and I'd rather Ancelotti got there before Mourinho, Guardiola or anyone else.

At least Ancelotti has class.

kaz1983 · « **Reply #168 on:** May 1, 2014, 12:56:49 pm »

Will 3 with the SAME club ever happen again tho'?

stewy17 · « **Reply #169 on:** May 1, 2014, 12:58:27 pm »

Quote from: BMW on May 1, 2014, 12:56:49 pm

Will 3 with the SAME club ever happen again tho'?

Brendan!

kavah · « **Reply #170 on:** May 1, 2014, 04:05:31 pm »

Don't forget Bob got 3 European trophies on the bounce too

saoirse08 · « **Reply #171 on:** May 1, 2014, 04:08:17 pm »

Quote from: kavah on May 1, 2014, 04:05:31 pm

Don't forget Bob got 3 European trophies on the bounce too

Not on the bounce: 77, 78 & 81

Still a great achievement nonetheless.

Hazell · « **Reply #172 on:** May 1, 2014, 04:09:04 pm »

Quote from: saoirse08 on May 1, 2014, 04:08:17 pm

Not on the bounce: 77, 78 & 81

Still a great achievement nonetheless.

Uefa Cup in 76, European Cup in 77 and 78.

mccred · « **Reply #173 on:** May 1, 2014, 06:47:46 pm »

UEFA was a proper trophy back then. Nearer what the Champions League is now, with runners up, 3rd place teams etc. Did Real win the League last season? Barca did didn't they? Real wouldn't even be in the European Cup this season, they'd be in the UEFA Cup. So I think Bobs 3 would trump Ancellottis just on those grounds.
Bit like United's treble in 1999, not as good as our treble in 1984, we had to win the league twice making it a quadruple, could be being pedantic now?

saoirse08 · « **Reply #174 on:** May 2, 2014, 10:31:13 am »

Quote from: Hazell on May 1, 2014, 04:09:04 pm

Uefa Cup in 76, European Cup in 77 and 78.

Cheers!

Bloody hell! Forgot about Uefa in 76. Yep, Uefa was a proper trophy back then, too. Amazing. Too many trophies to remember back then!

Cantona · « **Reply #175 on:** May 2, 2014, 10:37:23 am »

Quote from: mccred on May 1, 2014, 06:47:46 pm

UEFA was a proper trophy back then. Nearer what the Champions League is now, with runners up, 3rd place teams etc. Did Real win the League last season? Barca did didn't they? Real wouldn't even be in the European Cup this season, they'd be in the UEFA Cup. So I think Bobs 3 would trump Ancellottis just on those grounds.
Bit like United's treble in 1999, not as good as our treble in 1984, we had to win the league twice making it a quadruple, could be being pedantic now?

Besides that being ridiculous, we also won the league 3 years on the trot 99,00,01.

courty61 · « **Reply #176 on:** May 2, 2014, 01:18:44 pm »

The debate on whether the European Cup was harder then than it is now has its fors and againsts.

For:

You had to win the league to be in it (or the euro cup the prev year)
You had no seeding - so could have a horrible draw.
One defeat could mean that you were out (even two draws could eliminate you)
Not as many players moved across Europe so smaller nations had stronger teams (think Ajax)

Against:

You can come 4th in the league and qualify
As more teams are in it, the quality of teams is greater.
There are seeds, meaning that you may not play anyone of note until the QFs (think Utd this year).
Although just because the old system had no seeds does not mean it is harder. Think FA Cup - you can play a lot of weak teams to progress.
You can afford to lose a couple of games early now and not be kicked out.

I think the fact that no team has won it on the bounce since Milan in the late 80's show that is it probably harder to win it nowadays. But previously it was harder to qualify.

Simply, its probably the same!

Does anyone view Real Madrid's first 6 trophies different to their last 3 in 98, 00 & 02? Or Bayern's first 3 in 74,75 & 76 to their more recent triumphs?

Art Vandelay · « **Reply #177 on:** May 24, 2014, 10:45:42 pm »

Of all the managers around, I'm glad it was Ancelotti.

Mamadou · « **Reply #178 on:** May 24, 2014, 10:53:30 pm »

Quote from: Art Vandelay on May 24, 2014, 10:45:42 pm

Of all the managers around, I'm glad it was Ancelotti.

yup

helmboy_nige · « **Reply #179 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:04:00 pm »

I'd like to take this opportunity to congratulate Carlo Ancelotti. 3 European titles is THE feat. He's deserved it.

LFC when it suits · « **Reply #180 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:05:35 pm »

Well done Carlo. You are now the joint greatest manager in club football history.

Skeeve · « **Reply #181 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:11:39 pm »

Quote from: courty61 on May 2, 2014, 01:18:44 pm

Does anyone view Real Madrid's first 6 trophies different to their last 3 in 98, 00 & 02? Or Bayern's first 3 in 74,75 & 76 to their more recent triumphs?

Actually plenty think that a lot of real's early wins were not proper ones as it wasn't a proper open competition back then.

Mamadou · « **Reply #182 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:13:27 pm »

Bob got them with one club

Ray K · « **Reply #183 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:21:02 pm »

Quote from: Skeeve on May 24, 2014, 11:11:39 pm

Actually plenty think that a lot of real's early wins were not proper ones as it wasn't a proper open competition back then.

Why does everyone persist with this myth that the early European Cups were easy to win, or worth less?

The FA stopped Chelsea from entering the first year. Every other major European country was represented.
Man Utd were in the second edition and Dennis Viollet was the tournament leading scorer. 22 clubs took part.

It's a Little Englander myth to think that these years were like the Emirates Cup or something.

DutchRed · « **Reply #184 on:** May 24, 2014, 11:55:32 pm »

Magnificent achievement by Ancelotti, well done to him. Says a lot that it's taken 33 years to emulate the man and his record. Overtaking it will be another very big thing.

007.lankyguy · « **Reply #185 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:30:08 am »

Quote from: Mamadou on May 24, 2014, 11:13:27 pm

Bob got them with one club

And did it in less than half the time Ancelotti did it in

quinny · « **Reply #186 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:33:29 am »

Nice one Carlo. I'd rather see Paisley on his own with three but it's not the worst thing in the world to see Ancelotti alongside him. Also, as an aside, he's won the European Cup in his first year as manager at Real. Many top managers (hello Mourinho) couldn't win it with them.

Purdy · « **Reply #187 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:35:34 am »

Well done Carlo, thoroughly deserved.

Still doesn't touch the 3 in 5 years and 3 over a total managerial career of 9 years. Still the best and doubt it'll be touched.

Juan Loco · « **Reply #188 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:38:31 am »

Definitely my preference of all the managers who could've joined him. Would rather he was still alone, but, y'know, eventually someone had to get there. Think Bob spent more time alone on 3 European Cups than the competition had existed for before he reached that landmark. Shows the scale of the achievement.

Alan_X · « **Reply #189 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:40:37 am »

Quote from: courty61 on May 2, 2014, 01:18:44 pm

You can come 4th in the league and qualify

That's only true for the three strongest leagues in Europe

idontknow · « **Reply #190 on:** May 25, 2014, 02:37:21 am »

Quote from: courty61 on May 2, 2014, 01:18:44 pm

The debate on whether the European Cup was harder then than it is now has its fors and againsts.

For:

You had to win the league to be in it (or the euro cup the prev year)
You had no seeding - so could have a horrible draw.
One defeat could mean that you were out (even two draws could eliminate you)
Not as many players moved across Europe so smaller nations had stronger teams (think Ajax)

Against:

You can come 4th in the league and qualify
As more teams are in it, the quality of teams is greater.
There are seeds, meaning that you may not play anyone of note until the QFs (think Utd this year).
Although just because the old system had no seeds does not mean it is harder. Think FA Cup - you can play a lot of weak teams to progress.
You can afford to lose a couple of games early now and not be kicked out.

I think the fact that no team has won it on the bounce since Milan in the late 80's show that is it probably harder to win it nowadays. But previously it was harder to qualify.

Simply, its probably the same!

Does anyone view Real Madrid's first 6 trophies different to their last 3 in 98, 00 & 02? Or Bayern's first 3 in 74,75 & 76 to their more recent triumphs?

Call it the Champions' League then, although it was a knockout, and the European Cup now, and the comparisons wouldn't be so time-consuming. The Big Coiners, typically, just got the names wrong way round.
Anyway, congratulations again, Carlo, I've said it elsewhere, and I will say it again.
You are now in select, illustrious company: Mr Bob Paisley,

Snail · « **Reply #191 on:** May 25, 2014, 02:51:48 am »

Oh, yes.

Mamadou · « **Reply #192 on:** May 25, 2014, 03:38:16 am »

Quote from: lankyguy007 on May 25, 2014, 12:30:08 am

And did it in less than half the time Ancelotti did it in

and i don't think any british manager is going to ever catch his record... except maybe Rodgers

perspectiveplease · « **Reply #193 on:** May 25, 2014, 12:50:28 pm »

It's scary how young Ancelloti is too. Mid 50's or something. He's got plenty of time to win more.

OsirisMVZ · « **Reply #194 on:** May 25, 2014, 01:52:30 pm »

Very classy manager and when you think about Istanbul, this is probably long overdue for him.

Congrats, Carlo.

soxfan · « **Reply #195 on:** May 25, 2014, 02:04:28 pm »

What's insane to think about is that if there hadn't been a goal scored in the 93rd minute, Ancelotti might have been fired today by that idiot Perez.