Author Topic: PL: Everton 1 vs 4 Liverpool Hendo 9' Salah 19’ 64’ Gray 38’ Jota 79’ (booooo)  (Read 40702 times)

Offline Studgotelli

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Only just getting round to watching this the fewm was wonderful   ;D

Offline afc tukrish

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Since haste quite Schorsch, but Liverpool are genuine fight pigs...

Offline goalrushatgoodison

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I understand what Rafa did for the club and he will always have a place in the hearts of Liverpool fans. However, are you saying that whilst he is manager of Everton we can’t sing songs that take the piss out of the club? I’m sure Rafa doesn’t give a shit that Liverpool fans sung ‘Rafa’s at the wheel’ as he will know it was a lighthearted piss take which is part of what you do at the match.
If you’re wanting Liverpool fans to not sing anything that could in any way be construed as taking the piss out of Rafa then the derby games are going to be worse for it.

People are reading way too much into a piss take of Everton song.

Absolutely no idea why you would take from my post that I think fans shouldn't, never mind can't, sing songs that take the piss out of Everton, regardless of who is the manager.

 I think it was clear that my post was to do with the suggestion, however nuanced, that Rafa should be lumped in with the Owens, Torres' and Sterlings, of this world. I even went out of my way to say that I saw nothing wrong with the song.

Just for the avoidance of doubt: even if I did see something wrong with a song that fans, who put their hands in their pockets to support our club, were singing, I wouldn't be coming on here, from the comfort of my armchair, to criticise them.

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Offline Ghost Town

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for the love of god - can someone please post these highlights without country protection.
Yeah, plus has anyone found the Amazon version of the full match replay? I can watch the Supersports version easily enough but fancy watching the Amazon commentary
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Offline PaulF

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Sorry to hear of your loss Did. Ynwa.
"All the lads have been talking about is walking out in front of the Kop, with 40,000 singing 'You'll Never Walk Alone'," Collins told BBC Radio Solent. "All the money in the world couldn't buy that feeling," he added.

Offline Black Bull Nova

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I'd rather play a 55 year old Claudio Taffarel than Pickford...

Neville Southall as he is now is better than Pickford



I like Neville

aarf, aarf, aarf.

Offline 12C

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Neville Southall as he is now is better than Pickford



I like Neville

In his time the best in the world. And now works with SEN kids.
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Offline Fromola

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I think with blues sometimes you have to separate the football from the person.

I used to work with someone who was a genuinely nice lad (passed away a few years ago) but he was extremely bitter and twisted about LFC to the point you just wouldn't engage with him. This was 15 years ago, things have got a lot with their fanbase since.

There's a fair amount of blues in my work now. Some are sound about football and don't hate us beyond what you'd expect of a normal rivalry. Others are pathological. My older family members that are blues and season ticket holders you can still have a laugh and a joke with about football and it doesn't get nasty.

What's concerning is it gets worse with every generation. The 20 something blue (and under) who've rarely seen them win so much as a derby, let alone a trophy, while their LFC mates and acquaintances are going off to European Cup finals. All while being told stories of Heysel etc and groomed to hate Liverpool as a rite of passage. Watching the contorted rage faces of little kids in the crowd the other night was another eye opener.

The biggest example of projection i've ever seen was their 'offended by everything' banner about us. Everything we ever do offends them. Their pathetic reaction to YNWA the other night, just because they don't like hearing it, regardless of the context or meaning behind it.

Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

Offline jckliew

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Neville Southall as he is now is better than Pickford



I like Neville


WoW! He's put on lotsa pounds!
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Offline BarryCrocker

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Neville Southall as he is now is better than Pickford



I like Neville

Never scored a goal.
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Offline Smellytrabs

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Neville Southall as he is now is better than Pickford



I like Neville



Southall is proper sound, well worth following on Twitter.

Offline Dim Glas

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Southall is proper sound, well worth following on Twitter.

indeed.

One of the good guys is Nev.

Offline Timbo's Goals

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I'd reply with more thought and consideration normally, but I've spent all day at the funeral of a family member, so I'm not really up to it just now.

You are spot on with your comment there though. I spoke only of the absolutely horrible element of their support. Sadly, that's growing all the time. Sometimes, it genuinely feels like the bulk of their support too. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but it certainly feels that way at times. But yes, it's those people and only those I spoke of.

I've said a million times on here that I have no issues with genuine, decent blues. One is one of my closest and most trusted friends. Another a much valued neighbour and friend. I've had some amazing work colleagues who are blues too. Thing is, I don't care who anyone supports. I don't care what colour, creed, sexuality, religion etc anyone is. All in care about is the humanity in the person.

Unfortunately, there is an element in the Everton support that is something I just do not recognise in this city. Others see it too, because they comment on it time and again on here and I hear it said in conversations elsewhere too. I called it in an admittedly clumsy manner, but many others have called it too. The mods here will no doubt delete it if they feel it crossed a line, and that would be fair enough.

Regarding the pile-on. Far better posters than me have had a kicking over the years, so it's no problem.

What I would say though, is one poster mentioned how some try too hard to get positive replies from fellow fans. Sort of playing to the gallery, as it were. Well, that's not my game really. I don't need the approval and, to be honest, I just post without even expecting anyone to read it anyway. I often forget that posts on here are read by thousands of people when, to me, I usually feel more like I'm writing in a personal diary than on a public forum.

Anyway, it's been a long day. The long and short of that post I made relates only to the insane element that is sadly growing within the support at Goodison. No decent blue need be offended because they were not referred to.



I've highlighted what I feel are the most salient points in your reply David and had your original post conveyed the same sort of slant as that which I've highlighted then I for one would have had no problem whatsoever with your original post. However, the insinuation or perhaps even assertion in your original post was that it was the - and I quote - "bulk" of Evertonians to whom you were referring that "you genuinely didn't recognize as Liverpool people."

And I must admit when I read that and interpreted it in the way it seemed to infer I did see my arse as I vehemently disagree with any such assertion. I also admit I was quite shocked that the words came from yourself as you have always come across as the most reasonably minded of folks on here. And I said as much in my response namely "you're better than that mate".

Anyroad, it seems from what you're now saying that the "clumsily" worded text of your original post meant no such thing. You were in fact referring solely to the rancid bitter element of their support. So I say fair enough and thanks for clarifying it and my humble apologies for not seeking a clarification before jumping in to strongly register my disagreement.

Just one thing I will always maintain, however and something which does seem to escape the usual concensus on this whole Bitter Blue thing. This quite recent tendency amongst many of our fellow Reds - including many of my own mates and family - to adopt the high moral ground position and sneer at the bitterness of Blues is such an easy road to take. Speaking for myself I see it as a very clear case of "there but for the grace of God go us". I say this because I can very clearly recall the late '50's and very early '60's before Shank's magic had fully been realised and believe me the boot back then was very firmly on the other foot. We were the ones twisted by resentment and bitterness as we looked enviously at the 'millionaire' First Division Blues, their array of star signings, their magnificent double decker super stadium with its towering steel pylon floodlights and our backwater ground with its puny concrete floodlights and paltry makedo signings.

So let's never lose sight of the fact that right now as the Blues face the best part of half a century of living in our illustrious shadow just how fucking privileged we all are to be Reds and just how hugely entitled they are to be as envious and in some instances as fucking bitter as they are. Let's not kid ourselves that we - and I mean Liverpool born Reds  - would not be just as envious and perhaps in some instances as bitter and fucking twisted if the roles/situation were reversed. Albeit than fucking Christ they're not  ;D

Offline Son of Spion

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Hi Timbo.
Thanks for your reply.

I looked back on my post and did believe it was very clumsy. I certainly didn't make it clear that I was talking, as I always am, about the sizable utterly rancid element within their support. I have made that clear many times in the past, but that's usually in the Everton thread and not in derby game threads.

I'm also aware that I speak through emotion a lot of the time. The other night was emotional, and I posted not long after the result and whilst still having hot blood rushing through me after the vandalism of Anfield on Tuesday and the utterly disgraceful behaviour of so many of their number at the derby. Yes, it often feels like the bulk of them that act that way, and I'm far from the only Red who gets that impression these days. Is it the bulk or still the minority? I just don't know anymore, but it at least feels like the bulk at times. Even yesterday after the funeral, when football came up in conversation pretty much everyone commented on how disgusted they were with the behaviour of the home support on Wednesday. It seems a lot of people are now seeing it, and are repulsed by what they see.

That element within their number, regardless of its actual size, is just not what I recognise in the people of Liverpool. They don't feel representative to me. That element, to me, is an anomaly, with a mindset I just don't recognise in the city. It's the mindset and behavior towards fellow citizens of the city we share that I don't recognise.

When speaking in all seriousness I will say this with genuine honesty. I have no issues with Everton FC. I've defended them loads of times when outsiders have slated them. They do some fantastic community work and I have a lot of time for their genuine fans who stick by them and are proud of them despite the club itself letting them down time and time again. I also take all people on face value, and don't care who they support. Everton, united, it doesn't matter to me. I just enjoy knowing good people, regardless of different sporting allegiance and other personal differences. If you're a decent human being, you'll do for me.

I do struggle with people who harbour and cultivate hatred, though. It's those I rally against and sometimes get emotional over. Coming from a city that always stood by each other, I find the current mess a tragedy. Is it all Evertonians? Of course it isn't, but the appalling element is significant and growing. Young children are being groomed to hate, and you see them with their contorted faces showing middle fingers to superb football players. Kids in our city being radicalised and encouraged to hate by adults just boils my blood. When I go off on one about Everton, it's not the club itself or the proper Evertonian, it's the twisted haters who are happily sowing division in our city that I'm talking about. I'm sick of them, but so too are the decent Everton fans I know. I know of blues who won't go to their games because of that element. They've had enough of them too.

Proper blues? I'll stand with them and by them against anyone.

Regarding the contrasting positions our clubs find ourselves in, of course, I'm glad where we are and that we aren't in their situation. Personally speaking though, I don't see their plight as any reason for their attitude towards us. Their problems are all self inflicted. Also, I was never jealous of their 80s success. They worked for it, earned it and deserved it. Same with the Ferguson years at United. I never enjoyed seeing them winning anything, but they worked for it, earned it and ultimately deserved it. I've just never seen the point in bitterness and hatred of others who work hard and earn success.

In life, in think we can look at others and what they have, and we can do one of two things. We can wallow in self pity and become eaten up with jealousy whilst doing nothing at all to better ourselves. Or, we can say, I'm taking that as inspiration. I'm going to learn from it and build something of my own I can be proud of. Now if you take route two, you can end up a lot better off, you can build your own life and your own self esteem. You are fine in your own skin and don't then care what anyone else is doing or has got. Personally, I wish Everton would take route two, but they seem hell bent on sticking to driving down the route one cul-de-sac, and doing so just breeds yet more anger, jealousy, bitterness and hatred, and I find that absolutely tragic. That's an issue they need to own though. It's not our fault.

In daily life of I'm more of a diplomat. A peace maker. I look for common ground; the good and the positive in people. Haters rub me up the wrong way and I can react emotionally towards them and/or their actions. My intention was never to tar decent blues, of which there are many, with the the same brush as the haters.

« Last Edit: December 4, 2021, 09:31:53 pm by Son of Spion* »
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Offline Timbo's Goals

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Cheers for response D.

I think we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this issue. The aspirations of the lifestyle ideals you cite are laudable but have fuck all to do with how some folks react to the desperate fortunes of their own footy club and the soaring success of their rival club. It seems to me we likely have widely differing experiences of growing up as footy fans in this city. In my case at least there were always a fair share of what I’d term bad bastards around both Red and Blue. So I will simply reaffirm my own point which I’ve now made in both my posts on this subject. Namely, if we were ever to find ourselves in the same position as Evertonians have been for many many years ie if we were totally in the shadow of a multi successful illustrious rival Everton team then I’m pretty sure we would have broadly the same proportion of bitter and twisted c*nts in our fan base as Everton do now. No question about it for me.

As far as I’m concerned folks from this city are in essence no different in their essential goodness, badness or whateverness be they of red or blue or any other persuasion.

Offline Son of Spion

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Hi again, Timbo.

I don't particularly disagree with anything you've said at all. I am 100% with your final paragraph too.

People are people. Good and bad everywhere.

To be honest, when talking with all seriousness, it's difficult (for me, anyway) to articulate thoughts on a this complex issue in a forum post on a mobile phone. Last night I was typing, deleting then trying again to be more succinct but not sure if I got there.

For me personally, I'd never end up like some Blues have. If football did to me, what I see it doing to them, I'd have walked away from it long ago and changed my priorities in life to something more healthy. That's just me though. Maybe a proportion of Reds would go down the bitter and twisted route if LFC went the way Everton have gone and Everton were successful. I just don't know.

I'm not quite old enough to have ever known a more successful Everton. As a 60s child I only really knew Liverpool and wasn't aware of Everton. We all know how the 70s and 80s panned out.

I still don't believe the hatred so many of them afford us is justified. Their issues are their clubs own making and the mindset of much of the fanbase doesn't help their cause.

One thing is for sure. What has happened to the Mersey derby and the emotions around it are very complex these days. It's not easy, when talking seriously, to cover it in even lengthy forum posts. There is a thousand says of seeing it, and we'll agree on some I'd imagine, but not all. Such is life, eh.

Have a good day, Timbo. I'm off to a dog show now, and just glad the rain we had yesterday has now gone. Take care, mate.

The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jόrgen.

Offline Timbo's Goals

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Hi again, Timbo.

I don't particularly disagree with anything you've said at all. I am 100% with your final paragraph too.

People are people. Good and bad everywhere.

To be honest, when talking with all seriousness, it's difficult (for me, anyway) to articulate thoughts on a this complex issue in a forum post on a mobile phone. Last night I was typing, deleting then trying again to be more succinct but not sure if I got there.

For me personally, I'd never end up like some Blues have. If football did to me, what I see it doing to them, I'd have walked away from it long ago and changed my priorities in life to something more healthy. That's just me though. Maybe a proportion of Reds would go down the bitter and twisted route if LFC went the way Everton have gone and Everton were successful. I just don't know.

I'm not quite old enough to have ever known a more successful Everton. As a 60s child I only really knew Liverpool and wasn't aware of Everton. We all know how the 70s and 80s panned out.

I still don't believe the hatred so many of them afford us is justified. Their issues are their clubs own making and the mindset of much of the fanbase doesn't help their cause.

One thing is for sure. What has happened to the Mersey derby and the emotions around it are very complex these days. It's not easy, when talking seriously, to cover it in even lengthy forum posts. There is a thousand says of seeing it, and we'll agree on some I'd imagine, but not all. Such is life, eh.

Have a good day, Timbo. I'm off to a dog show now, and just glad the rain we had yesterday has now gone. Take care, mate.



Nice response David.

For what it's worth my own take on why things have turned more sour at derby games stems back to the introduction of all seater stadiums following Hillsaborough. Prior to that a derby crowd at either Anfield or Goodison was pretty evenly split between red and blue so no faction was really in the majority and red and blue mixed freely before and after the game and often at the game too.. However, since the all seater stadium we have pretty much 90/10 split with the away Reds or Blues allocated their own small section and I think we all know what happens to such minorities in any form or walk of life. They can get targetted and picked upon. When you throw in the completely unbalanced state of affairs in terms of one team's success and the other's failure and misery then we see all the blue haters who are going to hate. My conttention is that if roles were ever reversed [pray not  ;D] then we'd definitely see red haters who are going to hate.

Offline Pistolero

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This has been doing the rounds today...not sure who penned it, but it's spot on...

As the dust settles to the floor from everton’s trophy cabinet, another merseyside side derby is over, I say “merseyside” because that’s what I remember one city, two teams, together, united in banter and rivalry, but somehow we lost our way and drifted apart, we aren’t friends anymore we are enemies,

It’s sad to see a city split by hatred these days, we still have a laugh with them, but you know they hate us to the core, while we have irrelevant sympathetic feelings towards them, they wish we hated them with as much passion as they hate us, maybe that’s why they shout murderers, so they get a reaction off us, so we finally show some interest in them, show them some sort of affection,

It must be hard being a small club, a forgotten club, an irrelevant club, must be even harder to see your one time friend doing so well, they could have been happy for us, and concentrate on themselves, as that’s what a true friend would do, instead they became insanely jealous, that jealousy turned to anger, that anger turned to hatred and that’s where we find ourselves today,

Bitter twisted and proud they say with a passion, they believe that, they want that, they own that, imagine thinking acting and speaking that way about yourself? Actually being happy to be a negative horrible person?

You have become the dark side to our light, you were once our brothers and sisters, now you are the blue sheep of the family, don’t project your insecurities onto us, have some dignity, have some pride, concentrate on your own club and you might just drag yourself out of the canyon of shit you are currently in,

Move on with your own lives,

We have.
They have life in them, they have humour, they're arrogant, they're cocky and they're proud. And that's what I want my team to be.

Offline Timbo's Goals

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This has been doing the rounds today...not sure who penned it, but it's spot on...

As the dust settles to the floor from everton’s trophy cabinet, another merseyside side derby is over, I say “merseyside” because that’s what I remember one city, two teams, together, united in banter and rivalry, but somehow we lost our way and drifted apart, we aren’t friends anymore we are enemies,

It’s sad to see a city split by hatred these days, we still have a laugh with them, but you know they hate us to the core, while we have irrelevant sympathetic feelings towards them, they wish we hated them with as much passion as they hate us, maybe that’s why they shout murderers, so they get a reaction off us, so we finally show some interest in them, show them some sort of affection,

It must be hard being a small club, a forgotten club, an irrelevant club, must be even harder to see your one time friend doing so well, they could have been happy for us, and concentrate on themselves, as that’s what a true friend would do, instead they became insanely jealous, that jealousy turned to anger, that anger turned to hatred and that’s where we find ourselves today,

Bitter twisted and proud they say with a passion, they believe that, they want that, they own that, imagine thinking acting and speaking that way about yourself? Actually being happy to be a negative horrible person?

You have become the dark side to our light, you were once our brothers and sisters, now you are the blue sheep of the family, don’t project your insecurities onto us, have some dignity, have some pride, concentrate on your own club and you might just drag yourself out of the canyon of shit you are currently in,

Move on with your own lives,

We have.


The self-righteous pomposity and air of smug superiority seaming through that piece makes me fucking nauseous and ashamed to think the c*nt supports the same amazing club as me. Let the writer of that piece of garbage try walking in the shoes of frustrated Blues for as long as some of those Blues have had to do and see if he or she would still be spouting how fucking great and perfect he or she appear to presume they are.

Offline Pistolero

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The self-righteous pomposity and air of smug superiority seaming through that piece makes me fucking nauseous and ashamed to think the c*nt supports the same amazing club as me. Let the writer of that piece of garbage try walking in the shoes of frustrated Blues for as long as some of those Blues have had to do and see if he or she would still be spouting how fucking great and perfect he or she appear to presume they are.

 ;D  frustrated Blues?.....why are you pushing this poor, poor Everton narrative?....were you at Goodison last week?...did you have to walk up to the ground with 'murrrrderreeess' ringing in your ears ...and even worse - the 'Always the victims' chant ..a chant started by Mancs about Hillsborough - the horrible bitter blue chorus know quite well what it means and where it came from - but despite being from the same city as the victims they still spew it out....that makes them worse than the Mancs for me.....the mindset and behaviour of a large element of their support is beyond toxic these days - it can't be explained away or apologised for just by saying 'if we were in their shoes we'd be exactly the same' ..would we fuck.....its scumbag behaviour, and it needs calling out...
They have life in them, they have humour, they're arrogant, they're cocky and they're proud. And that's what I want my team to be.

Offline Pistolero

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They have life in them, they have humour, they're arrogant, they're cocky and they're proud. And that's what I want my team to be.

Offline thejbs

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Each to their own, but I have to agree with Timbo. Thats the sort of magniloquent, pompous, smug shite that makes me cringe.

Offline Darkness

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Fuck Everton after all the piss taking about Van Djik last season they can get relegated to the conference for all I care. No sympathy from me.

Offline AndyMuller

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No sympathy for Everton or their fans whatsoever. Couldn't give a fuck if the shoe was on another foot a million years ago either, we will always be better than them.

Offline rob1966

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Each to their own, but I have to agree with Timbo. Thats the sort of magniloquent, pompous, smug shite that makes me cringe.

Ever had a mental case, match going blue ask you are you holding a minutes silence for the 39? Ever listened to people from your own City sing murderers and do wall pushing gestures? It describes the fucking loons to a T

There are great blues out there, I have them in my family, plus a couple of nut jobs, one of my best mates from being a kid until he died a few years ago, was a brilliant lad and brought his kids up as blues but in the right way, but sadly there is a very very vocal, very toxic element in their support, who drag their club down. The club doesn't help, all the peoples club shite, then fucking Moyes spouting this shite, feed into into their hatred

“There is a bit of me that wants to tell people in Europe that they should not forget that Everton were champions of England, and but for the Heysel disaster they have been denied a chance to have a long run in Europe,” he said.
“People forget that and don’t understand what happened. Everton were unfortunate but I accept it was a tragedy that made football unimportant.
“What happened after Heysel changed lots of careers. Players and managers.
“Since then we have been watching from the outside and the club was denied the chance to grow and benefit from the money in European competition.”


https://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=201633.0

« Last Edit: December 6, 2021, 09:49:00 am by rob1966 »
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Offline Red Beret

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Whilst I agree we should avoid a smug sense of superiority over our blue brethren, I really feel it's important to once again point out that explaining their behaviour should never, ever excuse it.

And whilst their defenders on here will continue to say what we witness is not mainstream behaviour amongst the vast majority of blues, the fact is that those who are behaving like twats stepped over the line years ago and have long since disappeared over the horizon. They've gone vicious, and nobody seems to be holding them to account or taking any kind of responsibility for it.

We didn't go mental when we saw United walking piss easy leagues and gradually overhauling us. And yes, we have our Munich chanting knuckle draggers too. But we certainly never did this either:



I'm way past being sympathetic and understanding towards that lot.
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I’m sure there are decent Everton fans, although I’ve not heard, or seen online, a single one of them call out Pickford’s assault on VVD for what it was. I wasn’t too fussed about them before that derby, but after it, with all the reactions from blues fans I hope the go down this season and every season until they disappear.

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Shanks said, he'd watch Liverpool and Liverpool reserves over Everton and then we have two Reds arguing over Everton of all topics  :o

Offline rob1966

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Shanks said, he'd watch Liverpool and Liverpool reserves over Everton and then we have two Reds arguing over Everton of all topics  :o

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Personally i'm ok with a smug sense of superiority over our blue brethren.

After all, we are vastly superior. Its straight up legit.

and that team of yard dogs constantly tries to make up for the talent gap by putting serious injuries on us instead of playing football. That "25 minute spell" was simply us standing off of them because they had lost their heads completely and were looking for blood not the ball.

The real football supporters who just wish they had a better team and are tired of all the suffering, sure i feel sympathy for them. But the rancid child throwing injury cheering types can just fuck off. I hope these get relegated. Under Moysey they were at least an organized football team but they are a footballing disgrace for a long time now. Richarlison s and Holgates all over the shop.
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Whilst I agree we should avoid a smug sense of superiority over our blue brethren, I really feel it's important to once again point out that explaining their behaviour should never, ever excuse it.

And whilst their defenders on here will continue to say what we witness is not mainstream behaviour amongst the vast majority of blues, the fact is that those who are behaving like twats stepped over the line years ago and have long since disappeared over the horizon. They've gone vicious, and nobody seems to be holding them to account or taking any kind of responsibility for it.

We didn't go mental when we saw United walking piss easy leagues and gradually overhauling us. And yes, we have our Munich chanting knuckle draggers too. But we certainly never did this either:



I'm way past being sympathetic and understanding towards that lot.
I don't think there is anything that can excuse the behaviour of far too many Blues these days. Well, I don't even call them Blues normally. That would be an insult to the decent Blues that remain. That's why my derogatory comments aimed at Everton are really aimed at the bitter, twisted and shameless element we generally refer to as Bitters/Toxics. I know decent Blues who loathe that element as much as we do.

Many of us regard the Mancs as our biggest rivals, and they cleaned up for two decades under Ferguson. Despite that, I've never witnessed Liverpool's fanbase turn to blind, pathological hatred towards them. My own 'hatred' of them is more of the pantomime variety than anything, although I do loathe much of their behaviour towards us. Same with Everton. My rivalry with them is of the panto variety too. A distraction from the daily grind of life, but nothing to get worked up about. I never hated them in that window of success they had in the 80s. I don't hate them now either, although I do loathe much of their behaviour towards us.

Nothing can excuse it, and you could write a psychology paper trying to understand it. Whichever way we look at it though, nothing can excuse it, nothing at all. When talking in all seriousness I think we can all understand their frustrations, but many clubs are much worse off than Everton and have never had a fraction of the historical success Everton have had, yet they don't act with such pathological hatred and violence. Look at those utter scumbags trying to punch Salah the other day. How on earth does that fly under the radar? How on earth has it come to this with them? Their problems are home grown, so why so much hatred for people who have nothing to do with their clubs own continual failings?

They've had it tough, but so what? Many more clubs have had it tougher. They've not been singled out and abused. They've not been unfairly targeted and suppressed. They are just a football club that has made endless bad decisions and choices and ended up reaping what they've sown. None of that excuses the pathological hatred of their neighbours just because they have got off their arses, worked damn hard and earned their success.

I do have sympathy for proper, decent Everton fans. However, I have none for their club, because it's their club who have continually let them down with their amateur incompetence. I have absolutely no sympathy for the bitter and twisted toxic types though. Their behaviour has long been abhorrent and is 100% inexcusable.

Any smugness from Reds doesn't particularly bother me. It might rub a few up the wrong way, but if a bit of smugness is the worst we throw their way then they don't have much to complain about really. It might be a bit pompous, but it's ultimately harmless.

That photo of Mancs in the Red Brick always puts me in mind of a far-right fascist rally.



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;D  frustrated Blues?.....why are you pushing this poor, poor Everton narrative?....were you at Goodison last week?...did you have to walk up to the ground with 'murrrrderreeess' ringing in your ears ...and even worse - the 'Always the victims' chant ..a chant started by Mancs about Hillsborough - the horrible bitter blue chorus know quite well what it means and where it came from - but despite being from the same city as the victims they still spew it out....that makes them worse than the Mancs for me.....the mindset and behaviour of a large element of their support is beyond toxic these days - it can't be explained away or apologised for just by saying 'if we were in their shoes we'd be exactly the same' ..would we fuck.....its scumbag behaviour, and it needs calling out...

Maybe I need to clarify once more my position on this as the misinterpretation is rife.

1. Like everyone else I obviously despise the rancid behaviour of that vile bitter blue element. And yeah they are scumbags

2. Unlike yourself P and a few others I don't see it remotely as that rancid behaviour being typical of Evertonians per se. No fucking way. Not even fucking close despite some on here appearing so desperate to tarnish a nigh entire fanbase

3. Following on from 2 and as I affirmed to SOS earlier in the thread, I also reject categorically and find contemptible any insinuation that the bulk of Evertonians are unrecognizable as Liverpool people. In fact I find any such insinuation as despicable as the rancid behaviour of those bitter Blue scumbags.

4.As regards what you affirm above namely the toxicity "cannot be explained away...would we fuck", I again totally disagree. Every support has its bad bastards just like every section of humanity. We have always had our fair share and always will. It's just the way it is and always has been. No fan base any fucking where is scumbag free. Ours have just never been in the same position as the Blues since as far back as the late '50's and very early '60's. Rest assured P lad if the boot was on the other foot then we would without question have our fair share of rancid bitter c*nts. No fucking question. So there is nothing uniquely inherently Evertonian about such behaviour as so many on here are so desperate to assert. It's just that they have had to eat shite in our illustrious shadow of endless success for the best part of the past 50 years including defeats in two cup finals and a League cup final to us and all of them are understandably envious, many of them understandably resent us and a vociferous minority have turned into rancid bitter scumbags who'll stoop to any verbal level to express how much they despise us.

5. Finally my son-in-law and two of my grandsons plus half a dozen of my closest friends and cousins are mad Blues and not a solitary one of them is anywhere close to being one of these bitter specimens so I am fucked if I would ever allow to remain unchallenged this fucking despicable urge by some on this website to proclaim Reds like ourselves as inherently superior in any way shape or form to those Liverpool folk of a Blue persuasion. We're all cut from the same cloth. We just have had entirely contrasting experiences as fans and we should never ever forget just how fucking blessed as fans we have been to experience what we have and what in relative terms a fucking life sentence of drudgery the Blues have had to endure always in our shadow.
« Last Edit: December 7, 2021, 01:46:26 am by Timbo's Goals »

Offline liversaint

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Individually, most I know are sound. Collectively, many follow the crowd and turn into knobheads. The younger ones amongst the blues are a different entity to years gone by and a lot don’t have the same awareness or social thinking as before which fuels  the shite we are all too used to.


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There is another option. Mr Ferguson organises the fixtures in his office and sends it to us and everyone will know and cannot complain. That is simple.

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Individually, most I know are sound. Collectively, many follow the crowd and turn into knobheads.




Interesting and fair point to raise/highlight.

People behave differently as parts of a collective...
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Offline Son of Spion

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Interesting and fair point to raise/highlight.

People behave differently as parts of a collective...
It's quite well understood how people can change when in a crowd.

This article covers some basics. https://thegreenrooms.net/crowd-psychology-why-do-we-behave-differently-when-in-a-crowd/#

Conformity with the group norm can see an individual's better judgement recede into the background in the group setting, particularly if there is an element of anonymity involved too. People can then say and do things they wouldn't normally do or say in different settings where they would be more individually accountable.

I found it interesting recently when a Blue was filmed ranting about us in a taxi. It might have been in the Everton piss take thread. Anyway, he was saying how much he despised us, then said "not individually, but when they get together."

That was interesting to me because I've heard that said for decades about Blues, by Reds who know them one on one as good people, but know they go feral when with their Blue mates.

I witnessed this myself in the 90s. I was in a long term relationship with a girl from a family of Blues. Lovely people in daily life, but one night I was out in town and I saw his brother downstairs in Flanagan's Apple with his Blue mates, all singing really vile anti-Liverpool stuff and acting like complete twat's. He didn't know I was there, so it was an interesting observation. It seemed out of character but, as we know, people are often different in groups and conforming to the group norm.

« Last Edit: December 7, 2021, 02:09:52 pm by Son of Spion* »
The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jόrgen.