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The Klopp Template
royhendo:
Nice to see that Athletic article - they've read Inverting The Pyramid. :)
--- Quote from: FLRed67 on January 27, 2022, 08:27:47 am ---Whoever said this has completely misunderstood the Toyota system. Limitless investment is the opposite of this system.
--- End quote ---
That's more likely down to my poor summarisation - the guy claims to have an MSC in Industrial Systems Automation (and acknowledges that it all runs far far deeper - he's being mischeivous). The isolated point he makes (among three emails/articles in response highlighted) was that Toyota introduced 'standard work' and effectively saw human intervention as a point of risk, and the correspondent to the podcast mused on the idea that by trying to eradicate the opposition's possession, and by mandating that even the best, most mercurial signings (see also Thierry Henry et al) adhere to the system by rote (with Messi being maybe the only exception), Pep, in a way, mirrors the Toyota Way.
It's here if you fancy a listen: https://soundcloud.com/secondcaptains/ep-2241-tinfoil-hats-and-tactistocrats-240122
--- Quote from: FLRed67 on January 27, 2022, 08:27:47 am ---The Toyota system is based on the philosophy of doing more with less. That’s why it’s also called “lean”. So there are fewer humans, not because humans are risky, but because the basic philosophy mandates fewer people, and less of everything.
This actually means humans become more important, not less, because these remaining people, who are organized into teams, must have multiple skills, not just one, as in traditional mass production. And each member must take responsibility and solve problems on the fly. Decision-making authority is driven down, not up. Hierarchies are flattened.
That’s why in a lean factory, each worker has the authority to hit the kill-switch and stop the entire process.
--- End quote ---
The guy does echo this point - saying that the players have to become multi-functional, and in extending this, Pep ends up with a team of midfielders, which is kind of the extension of Cruyff's view of Total Football. Every player is the Regista (to ape Sacchi), but beyond that, every player is kind of similar, be they the left back or the centre forward, because they've been bought with that template in mind, and then coached with that template in mind.
I've left the rest of it out but I think you'd enjoy the listen, because the three key points raised by separate listeners are raised as follows:
1. Pep's football is boring because 'boring' is the natural by-product of industrialising a game - there's less risk, and there's less spontaneity (the players, to extend the metaphor, have to apply for a 'Continuous Improvement' process in order to do something off script - it's not a real thing - just the feeling watching that side can give you). Boredom in an industrial process is a good sign - a sign that the approach is working.
(As the aside - our approach is contrasted as embracing and routinising chaos, which I think is an interesting point. And also as an aside, they start to talk about emotional responses, contrasting the feeling of watching Man City with the example of Maradona in training pinging five shots against the post in a row, beating the keeper each time, then dinking the sixth deftly over the keeper, nestling it into the net. That evokes an emotional response that's far more raw than the abstract stuff above.)
2. Appreciation of anything as abstract as Pep's approach to football has to be intellectually coached - it's argued you don't just 'get' certain abstract art - someone has to explain the relevance and magic and meaning, and from there, you gain a coached emotional response (ooh, it's gone 3-2-2-3, ooh, they've gone 4-3-3 again...). Anson Kiefer is the artist mentioned. I don't know anything about Anson Kiefer personally.
3. The ultimate system of control, swarm consciousness, network nodes, particular becomes general, true 9 becomes false 9, spine becomes 'no spine', rigid and 'strong' becomes invertebrate, octopine, and fluid, mperfections eradicated, the natural by-product of the unashamed harnessing of limitless capital, a mirror of the tendencies we've embraced.
So there you go :)
No666:
They really fit their owners, don't they? 'Ultimate control' on the pitch representing a repressive authoritarian regime.
wige:
--- Quote from: ScouserAtHeart on January 27, 2022, 07:47:09 am ---I can help with that.
https://theathletic.com/3087325/2022/01/27/why-liverpools-shocking-high-line-is-far-smarter-than-it-may-look/
--- End quote ---
Brighton are pretty good eh? Think a lot of people look down their nose at them because of their name, but Potter's done an exceptional job there. Put a top class finisher in that side and I think they'd be nailed on for 4th and possibly in a fight for higher positions.
MonsLibpool:
--- Quote from: wige on January 27, 2022, 11:08:53 am ---Brighton are pretty good eh? Think a lot of people look down their nose at them because of their name, but Potter's done an exceptional job there. Put a top class finisher in that side and I think they'd be nailed on for 4th and possibly in a fight for higher positions.
--- End quote ---
People don't rate Potter because he's English. If someone named "Federico Villa" was doing the job he's doing, they'd be raving about him.
Eeyore:
--- Quote from: FLRed67 on January 27, 2022, 08:27:47 am ---Whoever said this has completely misunderstood the Toyota system. Limitless investment is the opposite of this system.
The Toyota system is based on the philosophy of doing more with less. That’s why it’s also called “lean”. So there are fewer humans, not because humans are risky, but because the basic philosophy mandates fewer people, and less of everything.
This actually means humans become more important, not less, because these remaining people, who are organized into teams, must have multiple skills, not just one, as in traditional mass production. And each member must take responsibility and solve problems on the fly. Decision-making authority is driven down, not up. Hierarchies are flattened.
That’s why in a lean factory, each worker has the authority to hit the kill-switch and stop the entire process.
This philosophy has obvious application to team sports. Al elite level coaches are probably familiar with it by now. But implementing it is a whole other matter. Mainly because it is very demanding, and without the right people in the team, it won't work.
The best example of this philosophy in action in sports is the New Zealand All Blacks.
But you can clearly see it applied at LFC, especially in the way we press, but sometimes also in attack, as in the first goal at Arsenal.
--- End quote ---
In Lean manufacturing, on the fly problem-solving simply isn't allowed. The whole process is about standardised work and following process sheets. Hitting the kill switch and stopping the line happens when something has gone wrong with the process. In Roy's analogy, it is Rodri or Fernandinho committing a tactical foul so that the process can be restarted.
In lean manufacturing, problem-solving is often in the form of a 'Kaizen' or continuous improvement, something that often takes months or even years to implement in a really structured way. Decisions aren't taken lightly, and the whole process will be rewritten before the Kaizen is implemented. Until that happens, a containment will often be put in place to allow the process to continue. However, that would be implemented by management and not by the workers on the line.
I agree with Roy. City are similar to a lean manufacturing process, with any individualism removed in favour of the process. Any players that want to think for themselves or go against the process driven approach are quickly removed and replaced by players who will follow Pep's doctrines to the letter. If things go wrong it isn't about adapting, it is about resetting the process and going again.
Personally, I think that the process only takes you so far. In a League format with the quality of player they have. Following the process will get you a huge number of points because the combination of the process and the spending means that the process works nine times out of ten. The problem for Pep has always been the later stages of the CL. At that level, City become predictable.
Deep down, I think he knows the system is fallible against teams of a similar quality. That for me is why he often lashes all the principles of lean manufacturing out of the window and goes for bizarre selections in the latter stages of the CL. Then he ends up asking players who have been conditioned to not think for themselves to dig him out of a hole he himself has dug.
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