Topic: Mohamed Salah - Best in the World *

[decosabute]

I had hoped any decline in his pace would be offset by his brain and ability to come a bit deeper and supply people instead - we have seen it plenty of times this season to know he has it in him. But a) he is bang out of form and b) those around him are too. You could argue c) not enough runners around him but that’s a summer problem.

Some of his performances have been really, really woeful but I want to believe that is just form and confidence, like so many around him. When he dipped before he had Mane to pick up the pieces or Firmino or Jota. He has no-one atm so it reflects even more terribly on him.

Everyone selling him off the highest bidder… I’d be careful what you wish for. Get better lads around him - we will need experience and quality in transition and I think he still has that somewhere.

People are overstating the pace thing. Salah hasn't been rapid for a couple of years at least. He had found a way to compensate for that and still be a really good attacker.

What we're seeing since his return from injury is something else entirely. He seems completely shorn of all confidence, is getting physically bullied in most games, honestly doesn't have any spark whatsoever. Our one decent performance in the past six weeks came when he was benched.

I don't think I've ever seen such a drop off, especially for such an extended period and at such an important time. Pace is only a small factor.

[Dave D]

It's an interesting one. There are people out there who watch him every week and genuinely want him sold, but then you go through their posts and they've held that view for years, it's baffling.

As we move towards the 100% data driven football model, it makes absolutely no sense to sell the clubs top scorer and one of the most productive players and to keep the absolute dross that has been playing beside him. There's absolutely no guarantee that any money raised would be spent on new players instead of "infrastructure projects".

I would absolutely keep him for as long as possible. Not only for his contribution to the team, but also to piss off the british far-right who have had it in for him since he arrived and pile on him (and any player who isn't proper brexit) anytime he so much as miskicks a ball.

[Zlen]

  Eh? 
You’d keep a player that is 32, and increasingly looking like a gaping hole in both attack and defence - to spite right wingers? Even if he rekindles his form and starts playing like he gives a minor fuck - that is a very thin reason to burn through 350k a week.

[Knight]

I know you want rid of Salah you say it every game, while it's true he's not been great people tend to forget he's had an injury as well. I do think people hide in his shadow if we get rid of him, as so many want; others will have to take responsibility.

We were basically fine when he was out. Jota was mostly fit though. The issue with replacing Salah is Jota is so injury prone that you can’t rely on him. And I don’t think Gapko and Diaz will score enough goals

[Jake]

Eh? 
You’d keep a player that is 32, and increasingly looking like a gaping hole in both attack and defence - to spite right wingers? Even if he rekindles his form and starts playing like he gives a minor fuck - that is a very thin reason to burn through 350k a week.

Were also gonna sign Jean-Marc Bosman to piss off the Brexit twats. At least it'll be on a... Free.

I get he's been a hero. But that's a hell of a take.

[Barryg21]

It's an interesting one. There are people out there who watch him every week and genuinely want him sold, but then you go through their posts and they've held that view for years, it's baffling.

As we move towards the 100% data driven football model, it makes absolutely no sense to sell the clubs top scorer and one of the most productive players and to keep the absolute dross that has been playing beside him. There's absolutely no guarantee that any money raised would be spent on new players instead of "infrastructure projects".

I would absolutely keep him for as long as possible. Not only for his contribution to the team, but also to piss off the british far-right who have had it in for him since he arrived and pile on him (and any player who isn't proper brexit) anytime he so much as miskicks a ball.

Every time you see an advert for a pension or an investment fund it has big disclaimers saying past performance isnt representative of the future.....
If you are 100% data driven, you dont just assume the numbers never change. If you didn't expect them better you wouldnt sign young prospects (who have mediocre current numbers). At same time If they never got worse, you would have Kaka and Zidane still running midfields.....
Numbers drop off - the secret is to sell before they do too obviously so its someone else's issue

[Draex]

The Premiership is ruthless against age, even shit teams will come and fight hard and with energy so there are never easy rest games… Everton are a grock team fighting for relegation so you need to match their physicality first, then play your better football once they tire. You can’t do that with players past it physically, Mo won none of his duels, he never was like that, he was always listed as one of the hardest forwards to play against due to exactly that.

[Jake]

I know I'm in the minority but I feel that confidence knock of the double Senegal defeats in 2022 coupled with decline in pace and strength has changed his game too much to be our 400k pw talisman. I'm grateful for all he's done. I've sung his name I've screamed love at him in the stands and if I ever met him id kiss his feet and buy him a mango lassi. He is up there with the greatest of all time.

But this morning I've watched his goals from 21/22 onwards again, to see if I've just been unfair. And I haven't. I know he posts good numbers relative to the rest of the squad but that was the system we build, to suit him, and he is no longer the diamond at the top we can rely on.

21/22 he won the golden boot. Can't turn my nose up at that can I? His opening goal at Norwich a great finish from edge of the box. He doesn't do that any more. His fourth a volley he watched onto his foot which he snatches at these days. Omg that twisty goal vs city. And again the next goal vs Watford that's beyond belief. The manc hat trick in October. Racing away from Coleman at woodison.

Then he went to Afcon and when he came back he scored in five of fifteen games. Three of those seven goals were pens, the last one was scraped over the line vs Wolves. He was decent vs the mancs though.

So in that season he went from super hero producing moments of excellence on a regular basis to fairly absent.


22/23 season. He gets a few in the CL group stage to be fair but in the league it's the Fulham goal that bounced off him. Then the goal at OT which was a rebound tap in header. That spin was good to beat city from halfway. Showing that old pace and strength. The rest of his goals were tidy but inside the box finishes. A fair few tap ins.  Not many pens to be fair to him but no finishes that I thought wow. Only he can do that.

Now this season. 5 pens and 12 from open play. All rap ins/tidy inside the box finishes except that open goal vs forest. One of his goals was old school salah vs west ham and his goal against arsenal was a salah finish but that's it.

The drop off point for Salah's very special talent is afcon 2022.

[Knight]

People are overstating the pace thing. Salah hasn't been rapid for a couple of years at least. He had found a way to compensate for that and still be a really good attacker.

What we're seeing since his return from injury is something else entirely. He seems completely shorn of all confidence, is getting physically bullied in most games, honestly doesn't have any spark whatsoever. Our one decent performance in the past six weeks came when he was benched.

I don't think I've ever seen such a drop off, especially for such an extended period and at such an important time. Pace is only a small factor.

Pace is huge. A wide forward without athleticism in our setup is awful for our system. Perhaps Salah has been on a downward curve athletically for a couple of years and it’s now reached a point where he can’t compensate in other ways. Perhaps his decline in pace has been matched with a decline in balance, strength, stamina etc and he can’t compensate for it.

[Barryg21]

I think the lob miss against Atlanta was pace affected as well

If he was his old electric self, he has more gap between defender, so can take his time
They always say best layers have more time than others

When you are under pressure and can feel a defender closing in, you snatch more
(we saw that last night as well)

[jepovic]

Pace is huge. A wide forward without athleticism in our setup is awful for our system. Perhaps Salah has been on a downward curve athletically for a couple of years and it’s now reached a point where he can’t compensate in other ways. Perhaps his decline in pace has been matched with a decline in balance, strength, stamina etc and he can’t compensate for it.

Maybe the loss of pace has gotten to him mentally? He seems frustrated.
It's easy to say that he should adapt his game, but we have to remember that he has been a quick guy his entire life and that is part of his identity.

[kaesarsosei]

Its a pretty unprecedented drop-off. I honestly can't remember the last time he tried to kick a ball and actually made a good contact with it. People joke about our strikers having the yips, but this genuinely is the closest thing I can think of to football yips. We know his pace has gone but his finishing and assists, until January, were still as good as ever. Without any of that we have nothing.

If we want to be brutally honest, we are lucky this has happened now and not in September. I don't think Edwards will be shy about making the right decision this summer.

[deano2727]

Finishing aside, as I'm sure he will still score goals next season, he has lost his X factor on the wing for a couple of years now. He rarely takes on his man, let alone beat him.

I think we should be looking to get in a solid goalscoring number 9 to replace his goals (and the lack of goals elsewhere). and get a more traditional winger to replace Salah.

[jillcwhomever]

People are overstating the pace thing. Salah hasn't been rapid for a couple of years at least. He had found a way to compensate for that and still be a really good attacker.

What we're seeing since his return from injury is something else entirely. He seems completely shorn of all confidence, is getting physically bullied in most games, honestly doesn't have any spark whatsoever. Our one decent performance in the past six weeks came when he was benched.

I don't think I've ever seen such a drop off, especially for such an extended period and at such an important time. Pace is only a small factor.

Of all the numerous opinions on Salah, I actually agree with this the most. His pace has gone off, but he's been clever in being able to adapt to allow for that in the last couple of seasons. But his confidence seems blown away at the moment, and that's the concern. It's also hard with how you deal with it, leave him on the bench and it gets no better. Play him and he is still struggling anyway, I don't know what the best solution is at the moment. Salah like all players will have their own fears about their futures as well, it will be an unsettling time for the players as well, as to where they fit in going forward.

[alonsoisared]

I know I'm in the minority but I feel that confidence knock of the double Senegal defeats in 2022 coupled with decline in pace and strength has changed his game too much to be our 400k pw talisman. I'm grateful for all he's done. I've sung his name I've screamed love at him in the stands and if I ever met him id kiss his feet and buy him a mango lassi. He is up there with the greatest of all time.

But this morning I've watched his goals from 21/22 onwards again, to see if I've just been unfair. And I haven't. I know he posts good numbers relative to the rest of the squad but that was the system we build, to suit him, and he is no longer the diamond at the top we can rely on.

21/22 he won the golden boot. Can't turn my nose up at that can I? His opening goal at Norwich a great finish from edge of the box. He doesn't do that any more. His fourth a volley he watched onto his foot which he snatches at these days. Omg that twisty goal vs city. And again the next goal vs Watford that's beyond belief. The manc hat trick in October. Racing away from Coleman at woodison.

Then he went to Afcon and when he came back he scored in five of fifteen games. Three of those seven goals were pens, the last one was scraped over the line vs Wolves. He was decent vs the mancs though.

So in that season he went from super hero producing moments of excellence on a regular basis to fairly absent.


22/23 season. He gets a few in the CL group stage to be fair but in the league it's the Fulham goal that bounced off him. Then the goal at OT which was a rebound tap in header. That spin was good to beat city from halfway. Showing that old pace and strength. The rest of his goals were tidy but inside the box finishes. A fair few tap ins.  Not many pens to be fair to him but no finishes that I thought wow. Only he can do that.

Now this season. 5 pens and 12 from open play. All rap ins/tidy inside the box finishes except that open goal vs forest. One of his goals was old school salah vs west ham and his goal against arsenal was a salah finish but that's it.

The drop off point for Salah's very special talent is afcon 2022.

I'm inclined to agree. He's not been the same player since then but his instincts to be in the right place at the right time has allowed him to continue to post good numbers. Plus, being our key man, things are built around him. I don't think he gets these numbers at any other top level team because you'd have to build your team around him, which nobody will do for a 32 year old pacy winger who has lost his pace and doesn't dribble past anyone any more.

[decosabute]

Pace is huge. A wide forward without athleticism in our setup is awful for our system. Perhaps Salah has been on a downward curve athletically for a couple of years and it’s now reached a point where he can’t compensate in other ways. Perhaps his decline in pace has been matched with a decline in balance, strength, stamina etc and he can’t compensate for it.

I don't think he looks slower than he did earlier in the season. Salah hasn't been able to beat players with pace or run away from opponents in a foot race for a long time.

As recently as the middle of February, he came on in a game vs Brentford and looked like the best version of Mo Salah - swaggering, lively, creative, composed. Contrast that to the absolute shell of a player we've seen since his injury re-occurred in that game. Pace doesn't explain that enormous drop-off from less than 10 weeks ago.

His strength was one of his huge attributes up to recently - he now looks weak as piss against any opponent.
His confidence and willingness to take responsibility are gone.
His basic touch is awful.
He can't finish.

It's not just pace - it's like all of his abilities have gone to shit. He looks like a player who's injured to me, but I don't think that's the case, cos he wouldn't be picked if he was unfit. And he's had a lot of time since his injuries to get all his match fitness back. Instead he looks almost worse by the game.

[MonsLibpool]

On a positive note, at least this drop off happened when we already had something to show for the season. Teams learn how to play against you as the season progresses. Remember saying after the 0-3 game that Atalanta had exposed our weaknesses.

Going into next year knowing that he might not be up to it wouldn't be a good decision.  Club legend but nobody play at the highest level forever.

I don't see why we should willingly play with 10 men next year (defensively) and is the new manager strong enough to phase him out because that's what he'll need to do.

[Knight]

I don't think he looks slower than he did earlier in the season. Salah hasn't been able to beat players with pace or run away from opponents in a foot race for a long time.

As recently as the middle of February, he came on in a game vs Brentford and looked like the best version of Mo Salah - swaggering, lively, creative, composed. Contrast that to the absolute shell of a player we've seen since his injury re-occurred in that game. Pace doesn't explain that enormous drop-off from less than 10 weeks ago.

His strength was one of his huge attributes up to recently - he now looks weak as piss against any opponent.
His confidence and willingness to take responsibility are gone.
His basic touch is awful.
He can't finish.

It's not just pace - it's like all of his abilities have gone to shit. He looks like a player who's injured to me, but I don't think that's the case, cos he wouldn't be picked if he was unfit. And he's had a lot of time since his injuries to get all his match fitness back. Instead he looks almost worse by the game.

I'm not quite sure I agree re Salah's pace, I suspect it's been on a small downward curve for a while. I don't think it just dropped off to current levels a long time ago. Perhaps now it's reached the point where it's a significant issue. But athleticism more broadly is probably the issue, and perhaps that's where we agree. He looks weak, he doesn't look like he's got the balance or agility to dance through defenders in the box (or the confidence or inclination to even try). That 'cutting edge' or 'penetration' which we gained in spades once Mane and Salah arrived is no longer there with Salah and, as we saw before those 2, a Klopp 433 without genuine penetration from the wide forwards, is a pretty blunt object at times. But lots of his numbers are still really, really good so it's really tricky. I'm inconsistent on this because when it comes to Nunez I'm very much in the 'trust the good numbers' camp. But with Salah I'm in the 'his numbers are good but the eye test is very concerning' camp.
Forgive me nerds, for I have sinned.

[kloppismydad]

There's a Fabinho-like drop-off here, unfortunately.

I don't want to say too much because I love him and respect him, and will be eternally grateful for the memories he's given us.

One of the greatest Liverpool players ever.

[.adam]

Such a weird trait to come back from injury and suddenly be unable to strike the ball properly. Hits it like my toddler niece at the moment.

Fair to say that the days of him cutting in and battering it into the top corner are gone.

[Felch Aid]

I thought we'd see more of Salah in the middle as his pace declined but whenever he plays it's still down the right. That threat simply isn't there in the prem.

I think he's mentally not with it and I think he's hurt just as much as we are with Klopp quitting. He's the manager who got the most out of him.

In a slower league he might do well but given his age I don't see Edwards begging his agent for a new contract.

Absolute legend and his contribution to the first half of the season immense but the club have always moved on from players.

[MonsLibpool]

I thought we'd see more of Salah in the middle as his pace declined but whenever he plays it's still down the right. That threat simply isn't there in the prem.

I think he's mentally not with it and I think he's hurt just as much as we are with Klopp quitting. He's the manager who got the most out of him.

In a slower league he might do well but given his age I don't see Edwards begging his agent for a new contract.

Absolute legend and his contribution to the first half of the season immense but the club have always moved on from players.

The middle is more physical and he's not winning his duels.

It's time.

[VVM]

I know it's said every season but this is the first summer where I've thought he probably will go. Not because I think he's shit but he's on 32 and on 350k a week with 1 year left before he goes on a free. Sad to say but it just makes financial sense.

[RainbowFlick]

as he has lost some pace/dynamism with age, he was also forced to play wider to accommodate Nunez. i still think he'll be a top-class forward if we had centred our game around him. he shouldn't be played as a touchline winger.

i also think this current round of criticism is somewhat unfair. he came back from an extended injury (in Salah's terms) and was expected to instantly perform in a title challenge whilst the majority of the rest of the team also have been crap. his numbers would've looked more passable if we could finish chances - i don't think that's an age thing it's just a lack of confidence/form.

[Red-Soldier]

Afcon f*cked him, yet again.

If he does go, we shouldn't replace him with another player that we'll lose, so regularly.

[Fromola]

I'd rather if Juventus came in with a 100m euro bid obviously. answer me this if Saudi offer 100m and Juve offered 50m what would you do?

Juve? An Italian club would want a loan with an option to buy, same as any other player they come in for.

[Fromola]

I know it's said every season but this is the first summer where I've thought he probably will go. Not because I think he's shit but he's on 32 and on 350k a week with 1 year left before he goes on a free. Sad to say but it just makes financial sense.

There's another AFCON next year (although it runs well into August 2025).

I wouldn't give him another contract personally. He wouldn't take a much reduced wage and role, realistically.

Open to a sale in the summer, or let him see his contract out. If he stays, hopefully he can be more pre-AFCON than post.

[decosabute]

as he has lost some pace/dynamism with age, he was also forced to play wider to accommodate Nunez. i still think he'll be a top-class forward if we had centred our game around him. he shouldn't be played as a touchline winger.

i also think this current round of criticism is somewhat unfair. he came back from an extended injury (in Salah's terms) and was expected to instantly perform in a title challenge whilst the majority of the rest of the team also have been crap. his numbers would've looked more passable if we could finish chances - i don't think that's an age thing it's just a lack of confidence/form.

I think this excuse being made for him doesn't stack up at all.

He had already returned to the squad prior to the international break, then was left at home by Egypt to help get him fit. Missing a few weeks shouldn't result in an extended slump, especially when you've been given plenty of time to recover from it. He's also been subbed in a lot of games and dropped from the starting lineup for Fulham. He hasn't been overplayed.

And after all that, his performances aren't improving as we get further from his injury. If anything, they're getting worse.

[Mister Flip Flop]

Everyone loves Mo but he's had a couple of performances recently that have been pretty unforgiveable in fairness. He didn't seem to even want to try last night which is baffling given we are going for a title. I just can't understand it.

[jizzspunk]

Haven't read back pages & pages of commenting, not sure if the point has been brought up in conversation but he's a passenger around the pitch unless he's in possession, he doesn't compete for loose balls, turns 60-40s into 50/50s and 50/50s into 40/60s, doesn't compete for aerial duels, jumps out of potential contact if he feels he might get hit, this is not a new phenomenon, a minimum 2 Seasons he's been playing like this

Virgil eluded in lasts night interview..did we give everything? I'd like to know who he was referring too

[Lisan Al Gaib]

A couple of years ago, or maybe even last year, I wouldn't have dreamt about saying this or even thinking it but I wouldn't be upset if he did get sold in the summer. There's been a massive drop off in his ability the last few months.