Topic: Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power (Amazon TV series - September 2022)

[Riquende]

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/uEepEyrHmtE" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/uEepEyrHmtE</a>

The mystery shrouding Amazon’s new JRR Tolkien adaptation has lifted slightly, as the show has revealed its title. The multi-series epic will be known as Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power, setting viewers up for an on-screen representation of a new Middle-earth story.

“The Rings of Power unites all the major stories of Middle-earth’s Second Age: the forging of the rings, the rise of the Dark Lord, Sauron, the epic tale of Númenor and the Last Alliance of Elves and Men,” said showrunners, JD Payne and Patrick McKay, in a statement accompanying a video that shows the programme’s title being forged in a blacksmith’s foundry.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/jan/19/until-now-audiences-have-only-seen-the-one-ring-details-announced-for-lord-of-the-rings-tv-show

[Riquende]

Pretty excited for this... the second age is the least-developed of the three, so the writers will have more room to introduce their own elements without stepping on the toes of the Tolkien scholars.

[RedSince86]

I read that the 1st season budget was a whopping $465 million.

This is going to be fucking amazing.

Bezos must have been big into Tolkien growing up.

[TepidT2O]

Game of thrones sans tits I suppose.

They are filming series 2 down the road form me, you can see the back of the sets… I should try and sneek in!

[Musketeer Gripweed]

I checked the cast list the other day and my heart sunk when I saw Lenny Henry listed. Peter Mullan will make a great dwarf though. It'll be great, sure of it.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

I checked the cast list the other day and my heart sunk when I saw Lenny Henry listed. Peter Mullan will make a great dwarf though. It'll be great, sure of it.

He's a legit actor

[newterp]

I look forward to this. Quite a bit.

[Barefoot Doctor]

I read that the 1st season budget was a whopping $465 million.

This is going to be fucking amazing.

Bezos must have been big into Tolkien growing up.

Should certainly look amazing. But whether that translates into a good show...

[[new username under construction]]

I mean how do you balls up the voice over!!!

[reddebs]

Think I might enjoy this if it's not been Americanised.

[redwillow]

Really looking forward to this!

[Dench57]

Trying to temper my expectations for this, but it's hard.

[Drinks Sangria]

Hopefully it's good. A Big budget is helpful but isn't the be all and end all - they sacked the original writing team partway through early shooting so there's been some big delays and issues behind the background. Tolkien's estate basically allows certain sanctioned additions to the lore as long as it doesn't fly in the face of established lore or contradict some of Tolkien's lessons.

As has been said, there's a lot of vagueness about the second era and general overarching stories, rather than the clarity of narrative that came with The Hobbit and LOTR, so it does give space for the writers to respect the material but introduce their own creation. The quality of the cast will be crucial and it's probably best to cast a lot of unknowns.

I don't actually have high expectations but am looking forward to it.

It will be hard to match the quality, heart and epic nature of Jackson's interpretation.

[Sangria]

Hopefully it's good. A Big budget is helpful but isn't the be all and end all - they sacked the original writing team partway through early shooting so there's been some big delays and issues behind the background. Tolkien's estate basically allows certain sanctioned additions to the lore as long as it doesn't fly in the face of established lore or contradict some of Tolkien's lessons.

As has been said, there's a lot of vagueness about the second era and general overarching stories, rather than the clarity of narrative that came with The Hobbit and LOTR, so it does give space for the writers to respect the material but introduce their own creation. The quality of the cast will be crucial and it's probably best to cast a lot of unknowns.

I don't actually have high expectations but am looking forward to it.

It will be hard to match the quality, heart and epic nature of Jackson's interpretation.

They could attempt a word for word adaptation of Galadriel's life, and it would fly in the face of established lore. From what I've read, I think that's the story (if you can call it that) with the most variations, parts of which are mutually exclusive.

Or they can do a Fourth Age series based on the further adventures of Trotter & Sons.

[Zlen]

Since LOTR movies came out we've had a number of great to good fantasy TV shows and movies which have a bit more 'shades of gray' view of the world. I guess after GOT and Witcher, for me at least, LOTR feels a bit quaint and dull in it's binary view of good and evil.

[Sangria]

Since LOTR movies came out we've had a number of great to good fantasy TV shows and movies which have a bit more 'shades of gray' view of the world. I guess after GOT and Witcher, for me at least, LOTR feels a bit quaint and dull in it's binary view of good and evil.

I liked the most recent In Deep Geek video where he points out that Galadriel was doing to the Fellowship exactly what the Dark Lord (Sauron's boss) was doing that was considered anathema.

[jillcwhomever]

Weren't the films enough? Also The Rings of Power sounds a bit underwhelming.

[jillcwhomever]

Game of thrones sans tits I suppose.

They are filming series 2 down the road form me, you can see the back of the sets… I should try and sneek in!

There aren't any women in it. One of the reasons I could not get on with the books.

[Riquende]

Weren't the films enough? Also The Rings of Power sounds a bit underwhelming.

The films are about a completely different period of history though. The Second Age was about 3,500 years and ended with the big battle in the movie prologue, then the Third Age was about another 3000 years and ended with the destruction of the One Ring. Given that Elves are immortal and the men of Numenor (Aragorn's ancestors) lived for hundreds of years at this point, events will transpire that take place all across the Second Age.

It's largely uncharted territory in terms of storytelling, which is the exciting bit. The vague timeline is:

0 - the 'Half-Elf' brothers (Elrond and Elros) are split, Elrond chooses to remain an Elf but Elros becomes a man and is made ruler of the new specially-made island of Numenor. Time of peace as the previous Dark Lord Morgoth was defeated and his lieutenants (including Sauron) fled.
500 - Elros dies, Sauron returns in secret
600 - Numenoreans sail from their island to Middle Earth and resume friendly contact with the Elves
1200 - Numenoreans begin to colonise Middle Earth. Sauron appears in 'fair guise' to the Elves to convince them to make the Rings of Power but is at first rebuffed.
1500-1700 - The Rings are made, Sauron reveals himself openly in Mordor and invades Eregion (the main land of the Elves at the time). Numenoreans eventually arrive and defeat him, but the Elven kingdom is mostly in ruins and they build refuges like Rivendell.

Over the next 1500 years, relations between the Numenoreans and Elves worsen as the Men become more powerful, but their lifespans shrink and they become envious of the still-immortal Elves

3200 - Sauron is captured and taken to Numenor. The king gets old and afraid of death so Sauron becomes the king's advisor and convinces him to sail West to invade the undying lands (where Frodo etc went to at the end of the movies) after founding a religion with himself as the high priest
3300 - The king invades and Numenor is sunk into the sea, with only some 'faithful' warned and able to escape, this includes Elendil and Isildur (from the movie prologue). Sauron escapes back to Middle Earth and can no longer "appear fair". Any Numenoreans on Middle Earth are either also 'faithful' and join up with them to found Gondor (and Arnor in the North) or still worship Sauron and become Black Numenoreans in his service.
3400 - Last Alliance of Men and Elves defeat Sauron and Isildur takes the One Ring but doesn't destroy it.

[Zee_26]

Howard Shore's score for LOTR is so iconic and that, alongside Cate Blanchett's intro voice over in the films, makes this teaser seem like an inferior attempt at doing the same.

It's far too early to speculate on quality and a lot of money's been spent on the production. So here's to hoping it will be quality when it eventually arrives.

[AndyMuller]

This will either be brilliant or one of the most expensive flops ever made, no middle ground (earth).

[El Lobo]

The films are about a completely different period of history though. The Second Age was about 3,500 years and ended with the big battle in the movie prologue, then the Third Age was about another 3000 years and ended with the destruction of the One Ring. Given that Elves are immortal and the men of Numenor (Aragorn's ancestors) lived for hundreds of years at this point, events will transpire that take place all across the Second Age.

It's largely uncharted territory in terms of storytelling, which is the exciting bit. The vague timeline is:

0 - the 'Half-Elf' brothers (Elrond and Elros) are split, Elrond chooses to remain an Elf but Elros becomes a man and is made ruler of the new specially-made island of Numenor. Time of peace as the previous Dark Lord Morgoth was defeated and his lieutenants (including Sauron) fled.
500 - Elros dies, Sauron returns in secret
600 - Numenoreans sail from their island to Middle Earth and resume friendly contact with the Elves
1200 - Numenoreans begin to colonise Middle Earth. Sauron appears in 'fair guise' to the Elves to convince them to make the Rings of Power but is at first rebuffed.
1500-1700 - The Rings are made, Sauron reveals himself openly in Mordor and invades Eregion (the main land of the Elves at the time). Numenoreans eventually arrive and defeat him, but the Elven kingdom is mostly in ruins and they build refuges like Rivendell.

Over the next 1500 years, relations between the Numenoreans and Elves worsen as the Men become more powerful, but their lifespans shrink and they become envious of the still-immortal Elves

3200 - Sauron is captured and taken to Numenor. The king gets old and afraid of death so Sauron becomes the king's advisor and convinces him to sail West to invade the undying lands (where Frodo etc went to at the end of the movies) after founding a religion with himself as the high priest
3300 - The king invades and Numenor is sunk into the sea, with only some 'faithful' warned and able to escape, this includes Elendil and Isildur (from the movie prologue). Sauron escapes back to Middle Earth and can no longer "appear fair". Any Numenoreans on Middle Earth are either also 'faithful' and join up with them to found Gondor (and Arnor in the North) or still worship Sauron and become Black Numenoreans in his service.
3400 - Last Alliance of Men and Elves defeat Sauron and Isildur takes the One Ring but doesn't destroy it.

That sounds like there's a lot of scope for a really cool TV show which could run for a good number of seasons. If they're still launching that sort of money at it when the 'final battle' comes around it could be absolutely epic.

[Sangria]

That sounds like there's a lot of scope for a really cool TV show which could run for a good number of seasons. If they're still launching that sort of money at it when the 'final battle' comes around it could be absolutely epic.

If you want a really great story with TV style antecedents, try Children of Hurin, which IMHO is the best thing Tolkien did. Barring the presence of a dragon, most of it is human and human sized drama (Men and Elves and Orcs). Nargothrond is the only sizeable battle I remember from it, with the rest being Sharpe-sized skirmishes. Unless you want to show the Nirnaeth, which would make the War of the Last Alliance look like a minor encounter (although I'd only show the last fight, with Hurin taking on 80 trolls and more).

[[new username under construction]]

Howard Shore's score for LOTR is so iconic and that, alongside Cate Blanchett's intro voice over in the films, makes this teaser seem like an inferior attempt at doing the same.

It's far too early to speculate on quality and a lot of money's been spent on the production. So here's to hoping it will be quality when it eventually arrives.

This is what I was talking about, how do you balls up that voice over!!! I mean, it's literally the only thing you have to draw people in and they chose that voice?!?!?!?!?!

[Riquende]

If you want a really great story with TV style antecedents, try Children of Hurin, which IMHO is the best thing Tolkien did. Barring the presence of a dragon, most of it is human and human sized drama (Men and Elves and Orcs). Nargothrond is the only sizeable battle I remember from it, with the rest being Sharpe-sized skirmishes. Unless you want to show the Nirnaeth, which would make the War of the Last Alliance look like a minor encounter (although I'd only show the last fight, with Hurin taking on 80 trolls and more).

Agree with the recommendation, but I just want to point out that that story (and the others that have been published in recent years as standalone books) are tales from the end of the First Age, and have nothing to do with what will be on this show.

Obviously it wouldn't be Tolkien without lots of crossovers between events, so I will also point out that many of those tales revolve about how the half-Elves came about (several generations of mighty heroic Men winning the hearts of fair Elf maidens, obviously). These heroes of Men thus link all the way down to Aragorn at the end of the Third Age (the ring he wears was made in the Undying Lands and given to his ancestor Barahir by one of the most powerful Elven kings).

[Sangria]

Agree with the recommendation, but I just want to point out that that story (and the others that have been published in recent years as standalone books) are tales from the end of the First Age, and have nothing to do with what will be on this show.

Obviously it wouldn't be Tolkien without lots of crossovers between events, so I will also point out that many of those tales revolve about how the half-Elves came about (several generations of mighty heroic Men winning the hearts of fair Elf maidens, obviously). These heroes of Men thus link all the way down to Aragorn at the end of the Third Age (the ring he wears was made in the Undying Lands and given to his ancestor Barahir by one of the most powerful Elven kings).

It's disappointing that no one commented on my post about a Fourth Age series about Trotter and Sons.

[[new username under construction]]

It's disappointing that no one commented on my post about a Fourth Age series about Trotter and Sons.

Already been done mate

[Sangria]

Already been done mate

The point being that Aragorn, King of Gondor and Arnor, heir of Elendil, Tar-Elessar, used to be a hobbit named Trotter in early manuscripts of LotR. The only remnant in later versions is his nickname of "Strider".

[Rob Dylan]

The replies to that teaser trailer on Youtube are full of incels saying it's going to be terrible, it's going to be 'woke' and the hero will probably be a gay black woman or something.

I can't decide if I want it to be brilliant to prove them wrong, or terrible to piss them off even more.

[Nobby Reserve]

This is what I was talking about, how do you balls up that voice over!!! I mean, it's literally the only thing you have to draw people in and they chose that voice?!?!?!?!?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-VUlXl0wUQ

[Dench57]

The replies to that teaser trailer on Youtube are full of incels saying it's going to be terrible, it's going to be 'woke' and the hero will probably be a gay black woman or something.

I can't decide if I want it to be brilliant to prove them wrong, or terrible to piss them off even more.

yeah, noticed a lot of this. the backlash to there being *gasp* black actors in The Witcher was really vicious. lots of complaining about "diversity quotas". hope Gandalf is black if he's in this

[markedasred]

I'm already getting Silmarillion vibes off this, a dense, unreadable tying up of loose ends, answering questions I had forgotten I was asking by the next page or scene during the stories. I'm too old for this I suspect.

[Riquende]

yeah, noticed a lot of this. the backlash to there being *gasp* black actors in The Witcher was really vicious. lots of complaining about "diversity quotas". hope Gandalf is black if he's in this

Gandalf didn't arrive in Middle Earth until some time into the Third Age. Like Saruman (and indeed Sauron) he's a 'lesser angel', in this case sent by the West not to directly confront evil but to provide wisdom and strength to the 'Free Peoples', who at this point are the last remnants of Elves (most of whom are lesser Elves who never saw the light of the trees), Men (most of whom don't descend from Numenorean bloodlines) and the dwindling Dwarf population who are increasingly content to stay under their mountains. Plus the Hobbits.

And on the point of diversity - Tolkien's works are a bit... 'iffy' in the first place given that all the noble heroic men are handsome fair-skinned westerners and all the ones who serve Sauron are the brown-skinned ones from the far south and east. I think we can move away from that at least!

[Crimson]

They better not fuck this up. The closer they are to the movies in terms of style and atmosphere the better.

[jillcwhomever]

yeah, noticed a lot of this. the backlash to there being *gasp* black actors in The Witcher was really vicious. lots of complaining about "diversity quotas". hope Gandalf is black if he's in this

Now, that would make me watch this.

[Kashinoda]

The replies to that teaser trailer on Youtube are full of incels saying it's going to be terrible, it's going to be 'woke' and the hero will probably be a gay black woman or something.

I can't decide if I want it to be brilliant to prove them wrong, or terrible to piss them off even more.

There really isn't, I scrolled through hundreds of comments and there was 1 or 2.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

There aren't any women in it. One of the reasons I could not get on with the books.

The Hobbit was a bit light on Women..

But Lord of the Rings/Similarian etc had..


Lady Haleth
  After her father and brother were killed in an orc siege, Haleth defended their rugged band of woodmen until the Elven cavalry arrived, politely refused the Elf-lord's offer of protection in exchange for fealty, led her people on an epic journey through a deadly wilderness prowled by giant spiders, and founded a new refuge for them in the forest of Brethil on the outskirts of the great Elven kingdom of Doriath.


Idril Celebrindal
  A wise woman, a prophetess, daughter of King Turgon and grandmother of Elrond. She was the first of three Elves to wed a mortal man, Tuor, and the only one of the three not to die for it. Their son, Eärendil, became a symbol of hope.


Lobelia Sackville-Baggins

  When Saruman fled Isengard and took over the Shire (a chapter dropped from the films), Lobelia took an umbrella to the leader of his "ruffians" and got herself hauled off to jail. When she died, she left her fortune to Frodo to be used for assisting hobbits left homeless or destitute by the pillaging of Saruman's thugs.

Melian the Maia
At the dawn of Middle-earth she fell in love with (or seduced?) the great Elven King Thingol. Together they founded Doriath, a forest realm of which Lórien and the Woodland Realm of Mirkwood are tiny echoes founded by survivors of Doriath's fall.


Lúthien Tinúviel

More than six thousand years before The Lord of the Rings, Lúthien fell in love with the mortal man Beren. Thingol, appalled by his daughter's choice, mockingly promised Lúthien's to Beren for the bride-price of a Silmaril. These magical gems had been stolen and bound into the crown of Morgoth, the great Enemy of the First Age to whom Sauron was a mere servant.


Morwen Eledhwen (Elfsheen)

After her husband Húrin was captured by orcs in the Battle of Unnumbered Tears, their lands were seized by the Easterlings, barbarian Men under Morgoth's sway. However, the chief of the Easterlings was terrified her and would not harass her household.


Yavanna and Varda (Elbereth)

Valië/Valier are the feminine forms of Vala/Valar (singular/plural). The two Valier about whom we know most are Yavanna, the Earth-goddess, and Varda / Elbereth, the "star queen" and wife of Manwë, king of the Valar.


Elanor Gamgee

Elanor was not only an unusually beautiful hobbit, blessed by Galadriel's gift of magic from her garden to Sam. She was also, from what we see of her, a sharp-witted young lady:


Galadriel ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galadriel )

Éowyn ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89owyn )

Arwen ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arwen )

Aredhel ( https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Aredhel )

Nerdanel ( https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Nerdanel )

Loreth (The wise old woman of Gondor)

Goldberry ( https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Goldberry )

Shelob ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shelob )

Rosie Cotton ( https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Rosie_Cotton )



This is an interesting read as well, debating the number and importance of the female characters and their power (or lack of it) in the works..  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_The_Lord_of_the_Rings

[Sangria]

Lúthien Tinúviel

More than six thousand years before The Lord of the Rings, Lúthien fell in love with the mortal man Beren. Thingol, appalled by his daughter's choice, mockingly promised Lúthien's to Beren for the bride-price of a Silmaril. These magical gems had been stolen and bound into the crown of Morgoth, the great Enemy of the First Age to whom Sauron was a mere servant.

The story of Beren the One Handed, arguably the greatest human hero of the First Age, summarised.

Beren gets into trouble. Luthien bails him out. Repeat.

Oh, and did you mention that Luthien threatens Sauron with humiliation unless he made himself scarce? And that Luthien lulled Morgoth to sleep until Beren effed up again and woke up the court?

[Barefoot Doctor]

Loads of information and first-look pics in this Vanity Fair article:

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2022/02/amazon-the-rings-of-power-series-first-look

[Black Bull Nova]

There aren't any women in it. One of the reasons I could not get on with the books.

Yes, but if there were they would probably be over sexualised so you cannot win these days