Topic: Never mind 'Stop the Boats' - STOP THE TORIES

[west_london_red]

Tories being Tories

https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1577670363739299840?

You join a political party full of bigots, don’t be surprised if your at the receiving end of some of that bigotry.

[Red Beret]

What's insane is that Truss wouldn't even make the top 5 most evil/incompetent/mad bastards in the Cabinet.

She wouldn't even make the top 20 shittest junior ministers.

Edwina Curry would make a better PM.

[Elmo!]

and some of the people we had in the hall earlier” as those who she thought were working against the interests of growth.

Well she's not wrong there, but she's thinking of the wrong people in the hall.

[Ma Vie en Rouge]

It's entirely possible they get rid of her and end up with someone even more rabid, with the current state of the Tory membership.

Let's hope the current bunch stick with some of their hated policy ideas long enough for them to be defeated in the commons, or at least long enough for a load of red wall tories to have to vote with them on things like the benefit payments, thus guaranteeing their own downfall.

Has Truss passed any legislation yet? Would she be the only PM in history not to do so if she gets booted quickly?

[oldfordie]

I agree May was a disaster. But I think history will judge her more forgivingly based on the circumstances she was trying to lead in (even if she did want that poisoned chalice).

For me, as bad as she was, she was still the more forgivable of our four current and previous Prime Ministers.

But thinking back on how this all started, for me it still has to be Cameron. Austerity, followed by caving into internal party divisions to gamble the future of the entire country in a Brexit referendum he didn´t want on an issue most of the country didn´t care about, before absolutely bottling it, with his own policies of austerity almost certainly feeding into the result, and then resigning from all of the consequences. Never been seen since. Absolute coward. His veneer of comparative respectability does not reverse the irreversible damage he has done.

Johnson and now Truss are the natural conclusion of the Brexit process. But that all started with one smarmy arrogant c*nt by the name of Cameron. I can´t think of a more disastrous legacy. And he knows it, which is why he has been hiding in his garden shed ever since.

I don't think calling the referendum was Camerons big mistake, his mistake was telling the country the government will act on the result, the result was binding. he had absolutely no right to say this, a law had to be passed to make the result binding, he walked us into chaos without giving much thought to what would happen if the unthinkable happened, the country voted leave.
May was trying to hold her party together, am absolutely convinced she asked the ERG nutters on what it would take to keep them happy, they gave her all those Red lines, they made any decent Brexit with frictionless trading etc impossible.
I wont defend Cameron, he was arrogant arsehole who thought he could scare the country into voting remain by telling us it will happen so vote remain but he did understand the damage Brexit would bring and wanted nothing to do with it, he was furious with the opposition leader for not understanding the implications as well.
Everything went to shit when May took over. we had no chance once the ERG got those red lines to define what Brexit means. we have never recovered from it.

[Red Beret]

The deputy editor of Conservative Home - Henry Hill - was just on Sky News.

He essentially called her speech, and her policies, bollocks. ‘Growth’ is not just unattainable given her platform, but the typical  ‘anti-growth’ individuals are not members of a ‘Left alliance’, but actually middle/SE England Tory home owners who don’t want more council houses built - particularly on green belts, and older Tory voters the length and breadth of the country. He was scathing.

Truss's speech, in essence, was trying to brand any disagreement or opposition to her policies as the act of subversives and political agitators. That's why I called it a desperate act of someone weak trying to look strong. It views everyone not on their side as "The Enemy". There's no room for debate, discussion, or compromise. It takes a very grey area (politics) and tries to make it black and white.

May almost had to deal with the opposite when it came to Brexit. She tried to steer a middle ground that was simply impossible to achieve, as the moment you had to make any kind of decision you would irretrievably alienate a certain section of Parliament and the people they represented.

You can't play the neutral card on Brexit - you're either on one side or the other. Boris didn't really give a fuck. It's probably the one sliver of a leadership trait he had - a boss has to handle not being liked by some people. Of course, it helped his cause that his calculated buffoonery was very disarming and media friendly - something May really struggled with, and Truss will struggle even more.

May's biggest failure was the early election, but that was a political error. Blowing a 20 point lead against Corbyn sounded the death knell for her Premiership. Truss can at least claim they were already behind in the polls, but she's still gifted Starmer a 30 point lead, and almost crashed the entire UK economy over a 48 hour period.

Economic mismanagement is miles worse than an errant political misjudgement on an election. I suppose we can ask Gordon Brown which is worse. He shit out of calling an early election and then got crushed under the financial crash that followed.

[Statto Red]

May was dreadful, completely robotic, that she was dubbed Maybot, called that snap general election & lost the majority the Tory's won in 2015, that they had to ask DUP to prop the Tory government up, her manifesto was awful, that she ended up scrapping some of the main policys in that manifesto because of the vitriol

[Red Beret]

It's entirely possible they get rid of her and end up with someone even more rabid, with the current state of the Tory membership.

Let's hope the current bunch stick with some of their hated policy ideas long enough for them to be defeated in the commons, or at least long enough for a load of red wall tories to have to vote with them on things like the benefit payments, thus guaranteeing their own downfall.

Has Truss passed any legislation yet? Would she be the only PM in history not to do so if she gets booted quickly?

That's how Einstein defined insanity. And indeed the Tories would be going full crazy if the jettisoned Truss for someone more "radical"

[LFC_NCL]

fingers crossed truss' ego will make her call a GE

[TepidT2O]

fingers crossed truss' ego will make her call a GE

She’d have to win a vote for that inthe House of Commons wouldn’t she?? Is that right now?

I’m not sure Tory MPs would vote for an election, who’d vote for putting them selves out of work (ok ok…. opposition MPs in 2019 did just this

[TepidT2O]

Their party political broad cast was… fucking  dreadful…. And I’m a lot more even handed than many of you lot!

[Machae]

Was Moving on up intro in response to their polling numbers?

[Lusty]

She’d have to win a vote for that inthe House of Commons wouldn’t she?? Is that right now?

I’m not sure Tory MPs would vote for an election, who’d vote for putting them selves out of work (ok ok…. opposition MPs in 2019 did just this

Not anymore, no. She can call an election whenever she wants. Or at least, she can ask the King for one.

[Gerry Attrick]

What a car crash of a month for her. Don’t see it getting much better.

[west_london_red]

What a car crash of a month for her. Don’t see it getting much better.

The thing is the old adage is very true, first impressions really do last and once people have made their minds up about someone it’s incredibly hard to change, never mind if we have power shortages over the winter and interest rates hitting 5-6%. It’s bad for her now and there’s a world of pain still to come.

[Statto Red]

Not anymore, no. She can call an election whenever she wants. Or at least, she can ask the King for one.

Yep, the fixed term parliament act, was repelled after Johnson won in 19, PM can call for the election anytime this session until January 2025, which is the latest date when the next election can be held.


Autumn elections are rare but like the last election do happen, don't think an election has ever been held in winter, a spring election is most likely though

[Jiminy Cricket]

Truss's speech, in essence, was trying to brand any disagreement or opposition to her policies as the act of subversives and political agitators. That's why I called it a desperate act of someone weak trying to look strong. It views everyone not on their side as "The Enemy". There's no room for debate, discussion, or compromise. It takes a very grey area (politics) and tries to make it black and white.

May almost had to deal with the opposite when it came to Brexit. She tried to steer a middle ground that was simply impossible to achieve, as the moment you had to make any kind of decision you would irretrievably alienate a certain section of Parliament and the people they represented.

You can't play the neutral card on Brexit - you're either on one side or the other. Boris didn't really give a fuck. It's probably the one sliver of a leadership trait he had - a boss has to handle not being liked by some people. Of course, it helped his cause that his calculated buffoonery was very disarming and media friendly - something May really struggled with, and Truss will struggle even more.

May's biggest failure was the early election, but that was a political error. Blowing a 20 point lead against Corbyn sounded the death knell for her Premiership. Truss can at least claim they were already behind in the polls, but she's still gifted Starmer a 30 point lead, and almost crashed the entire UK economy over a 48 hour period.

Economic mismanagement is miles worse than an errant political misjudgement on an election. I suppose we can ask Gordon Brown which is worse. He shit out of calling an early election and then got crushed under the financial crash that followed.

Good post that, Red.

[Jiminy Cricket]

Their party political broad cast was… fucking  dreadful…. And I’m a lot more even handed than many of you lot!

That tickled me.

[Nobby Reserve]

Truss's speech, in essence, was trying to brand any disagreement or opposition to her policies as the act of subversives and political agitators. That's why I called it a desperate act of someone weak trying to look strong. It views everyone not on their side as "The Enemy". There's no room for debate, discussion, or compromise. It takes a very grey area (politics) and tries to make it black and white.

May almost had to deal with the opposite when it came to Brexit. She tried to steer a middle ground that was simply impossible to achieve, as the moment you had to make any kind of decision you would irretrievably alienate a certain section of Parliament and the people they represented.

You can't play the neutral card on Brexit - you're either on one side or the other. Boris didn't really give a fuck. It's probably the one sliver of a leadership trait he had - a boss has to handle not being liked by some people. Of course, it helped his cause that his calculated buffoonery was very disarming and media friendly - something May really struggled with, and Truss will struggle even more.

May's biggest failure was the early election, but that was a political error. Blowing a 20 point lead against Corbyn sounded the death knell for her Premiership. Truss can at least claim they were already behind in the polls, but she's still gifted Starmer a 30 point lead, and almost crashed the entire UK economy over a 48 hour period.

Economic mismanagement is miles worse than an errant political misjudgement on an election. I suppose we can ask Gordon Brown which is worse. He shit out of calling an early election and then got crushed under the financial crash that followed.

Quality post 

[TSC]

And so it continues

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/average-two-year-fixed-rate-mortgage-hits-6-25-for-first-time-since-2008/ar-AA12DicL

[Jiminy Cricket]

The thing is the old adage is very true, first impressions really do last and once people have made their minds up about someone it’s incredibly hard to change, never mind if we have power shortages over the winter and interest rates hitting 5-6%. It’s bad for her now and there’s a world of pain still to come.

You only get one chance to make a first impression.

When people show you who they are, believe them.

...and all that.

[Red Beret]

Not anymore, no. She can call an election whenever she wants. Or at least, she can ask the King for one.

Dunno if C3R can turn her down, but would be funny as fuck* if he did. "You told me I can't go to the climate conferernce - you can suck it up for another 18 months."

*In relation that she can't even command the respect of The King. Obviously we need to get them out asap.

[Red Beret]

The thing is the old adage is very true, first impressions really do last and once people have made their minds up about someone it’s incredibly hard to change, never mind if we have power shortages over the winter and interest rates hitting 5-6%. It’s bad for her now and there’s a world of pain still to come.

Imagine power shortages when people's energy bills have effectively doubled?  Even with government help that 's really really bad.

[Red Beret]

Good post that, Red.

Quality post 

Thanks. I'm not used to praise.

[west_london_red]

And so it continues

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/average-two-year-fixed-rate-mortgage-hits-6-25-for-first-time-since-2008/ar-AA12DicL

And in 4 weeks time rates will go up again by 1%.

[buttersstotch]

And in 4 weeks time rates will go up again by 1%.

Haven't they already factored in future raises? Lenders got spooked, at least I am hoping that is the case as the housing bubble won't last much longer with fixed rates at 6%.

[TSC]

Haven't they already factored in future raises? Lenders got spooked, at least I am hoping that is the case as the housing bubble won't last much longer with fixed rates at 6%.

Analysts had priced in increases to c6% in about 6 months time.  It appears to be happening rather sooner

[McSquared]

Analysts had priced in increases to c6% in about 6 months time.  It appears to be happening rather sooner

Is that not boe rates? Providers would add their % on top

[buttersstotch]

Is that not boe rates? Providers would add their % on top

BoE fat 6%, would probably have rates at 7-8%. If that happens the bubble bursts, no amount of tax cuts. I think analysts forecasted 6% after the mini-budget after planning for 3%. Who knows what will happen, suspect a lot will depend what the US do but you'd think the BoE know the impact of 6% interest rates 2 years after we had them at near enough 0%.

[TSC]

Is that not boe rates? Providers would add their % on top

It may have been I can’t recall.  Either way it’ll become unaffordable for many.

[Wabaloolah]

Yep, the fixed term parliament act, was repelled after Johnson won in 19, PM can call for the election anytime this session until January 2025, which is the latest date when the next election can be held.


Autumn elections are rare but like the last election do happen, don't think an election has ever been held in winter, a spring election is most likely though

the last election was 12th December, that's winter isn't it? I agree that the next election is likely to be between April and June 2024 though

[Wabaloolah]

It's entirely possible they get rid of her and end up with someone even more rabid, with the current state of the Tory membership.

Let's hope the current bunch stick with some of their hated policy ideas long enough for them to be defeated in the commons, or at least long enough for a load of red wall tories to have to vote with them on things like the benefit payments, thus guaranteeing their own downfall.

Has Truss passed any legislation yet? Would she be the only PM in history not to do so if she gets booted quickly?

Red Wall Tories probably panicking about a recent poll!

"A separate poll carried out on October 3-4 of voters in 40 so-called 'Red Wall' seats - former Labour constituencies now held by the Conservatives - put Labour on 61% and the Tories on 23%, a 38-point lead."

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-05/labour-hold-on-to-strongest-poll-lead-for-more-than-two-decades


Those 40 seats in their own wipe out their majority

[west_london_red]

Haven't they already factored in future raises? Lenders got spooked, at least I am hoping that is the case as the housing bubble won't last much longer with fixed rates at 6%.

I don’t think so, the rises in mortgage rates after the Kami-Kwasi budget were because the cost government debt went up which increases the costs for banks to borrow. If that’s not the case, and the rises since the budget were caused by expected interest rates being factored in, I still wouldn’t assume banks won’t use an actual rate rise to increase rates again.

[Red Beret]

Don't waste your time speculating about the next election call. If the Tories are more than 15 points behind on average in the polls, it won't happen until it absolutely has to happen. That's simply the way they work.

[west_london_red]

Is that not boe rates? Providers would add their % on top

That’s correct

[Statto Red]

the last election was 12th December, that's winter isn't it? I agree that the next election is likely to be between April and June 2024 though

For me, winter doesn't start until December 21st, i tend to go by astronomical dates for the changing of the seasons.

[Red Beret]

For me, winter doesn't start until December 21st, i tend to go by astronomical dates for the changing of the seasons.

Same.

[PaulF]

What a car crash of a month for her. Don’t see it getting much better.

I know it's bigger in America, but the press like to review a leaders' achievements after 100 days.   So far she's seen the queen die, u-turned.sent the pound to its lowest ever rate Vs the USD. Trashed her partie's poll ratings ,doubled/trebled interest rates and pissed off the king .  If she carries on at that rate she won't last 100 days.

[PaulF]

Same.

Winter should start when the gavle goat thread is opened.

[Jiminy Cricket]

For me, winter doesn't start until December 21st, i tend to go by astronomical dates for the changing of the seasons.

Same.

That's just so, so wrong. I first came across this bizarre way of thinking when I moved to the US. The winter solstice more approximates the middle of Winter. The seasons describe climate over the course of the year. That's just the way it is. I have spoken.