Topic: Brazilian Porn Review Topic (Warning: may contain Wijnaldum)

[vivabobbygraham]

Hendo was thinking safety. He is not one to time waste and slow a match down usually, at least not on purpose.

You know this? He's just come back from being coached by Gareth fucking Southgate; he's capable of anything, mate.

[JackWard33]

“I can’t see what he’s doing” becomes “He must be hiding”. Whenever I hear someone say “Wijnaldum hides” I know at once it’s a confession that they don’t really understand football. Ronnie Whelan usd to get it too, and Lucas Leiva.

He has games which he struggles to affect on and off the ball ...don't think this its "hiding" personally
There's no question he improved towards the end of last season - his first half of last year was pretty poor in the main including properly anonymous performances that where anonymous whether you 'understand football' or not.
He'll need to improve again this year if he's going to be first choice ahead of our other midfielders - but regardless he'll still be a huge asset to the squad, his versatility is really impressive as is his fitness level (is he ever injured?!).
However it does remain a source of fascination to me that some small percentage of our fans are determined to elevate him to a level he's not at - I guess its a reaction to him being criticised which I get - I did it with Henderson a couple of years back so pots and kettles.....

[Yorkykopite]

Nah.

[Giono]

You know this? He's just come back from being coached by Gareth fucking Southgate; he's capable of anything, mate.

But they got a WC semi.

I’d say that Hendo indicating that an attacking mid should pass it to the keeper can be considered a safety first option?


All Saq did was pass it to another midfielder in plenty of space. Hardly a high risk scenario.

[Giono]

He has games which he struggles to affect on and off the ball ...don't think this its "hiding" personally
There's no question he improved towards the end of last season - his first half of last year was pretty poor in the main including properly anonymous performances that where anonymous whether you 'understand football' or not.
He'll need to improve again this year if he's going to be first choice ahead of our other midfielders - but regardless he'll still be a huge asset to the squad, his versatility is really impressive as is his fitness level (is he ever injured?!).
However it does remain a source of fascination to me that some small percentage of our fans are determined to elevate him to a level he's not at - I guess its a reaction to him being criticised which I get - I did it with Henderson a couple of years back so pots and kettles.....

No injuries, just some tummy aches and a bad bout of the runs, enough to lose a few pounds.

I agree with you about criticism and response. We are in really good shape when we will have two or three of Gini, Hendo, Milner, Keita, or Fabinho on the bench every match. We’ve taken a huge step forward in midfield and everyone will have to play their best or be riding the pine.

[JackWard33]

No injuries, just some tummy aches and a bad bout of the runs, enough to lose a few pounds.

I agree with you about criticism and response. We are in really good shape when we will have two or three of Gini, Hendo, Milner, Keita, or Fabinho on the bench every match. We’ve taken a huge step forward in midfield and everyone will have to play their best or be riding the pine.

Yeah it’s great to see. The way we play it’s vital for us to challenge - Not just overall in the squad but during games - that we can rotate in midfield

[Giono]

Yeah it’s great to see. The way we play it’s vital for us to challenge - Not just overall in the squad but during games - that we can rotate in midfield

Compared to last season when we went to the CL final praying not one of our only 3 midfielders got injured...quite a change. We have Ox coning back next season and Lallana back this season. Forgot them on my list.

[vivabobbygraham]

But they got a WC semi.

I’d say that Hendo indicating that an attacking mid should pass it to the keeper can be considered a safety first option?


All Saq did was pass it to another midfielder in plenty of space. Hardly a high risk scenario.

Your chasing your own tail. What is the difference between safety first and taking time out the game? Whether you pass it back to the keeper or do keepie uppies, you're running down the clock. So, Hendo indicates to pass it back to our new keeper, means what, in your eyes? Safety first? A keeper we've bought to act as a facilitator for attack. I can't get me head round it so I'll move on 

[Giono]

Your chasing your own tail. What is the difference between safety first and taking time out the game? Whether you pass it back to the keeper or do keepie uppies, you're running down the clock. So, Hendo indicates to pass it back to our new keeper, means what, in your eyes? Safety first? A keeper we've bought to act as a facilitator for attack. I can't get me head round it so I'll move on 

Back to the keeper to go forward makes sense in a packed midfield...that was not the case. Gini was in plenty of space.

[vivabobbygraham]

Back to the keeper to go forward makes sense in a packed midfield...that was not the case. Gini was in plenty of space.

So was the keeper

[Giono]

So was the keeper

West Ham’s?

Seriously, there was a midfielder in loads of space waving his arm in the air (like he just don’t care) wanting the ball. Maybe Hendo wasn't looking there.

[Kloppo.]

Your chasing your own tail.

Story of my life vivabob, story of my life.

I get your point though.

[PoetryInMotion]

Wow, just because a game is more than a week away from the previous one doesn't mean there has to be daft non-discussions about a player waving his arm.

[vivabobbygraham]

Story of my life vivabob, story of my life.

I get your point though.

Welcome Bobby, lad. With a name like that, you'll fit right in here with all the other attention seeking fuckers 

[Giono]

Wow, just because a game is more than a week away from the previous one doesn't mean there has to be daft non-discussions about a player waving his arm.

Have you seen the Pep Ljinders thread?

[Giono]

“I can’t see what he’s doing” becomes “He must be hiding”. Whenever I hear someone say “Wijnaldum hides” I know at once it’s a confession that they don’t really understand football. Ronnie Whelan usd to get it too, and Lucas Leiva.

Someone else is seeing what Gini’s doing:

Klopp: “Gini Wijnaldum, no-one speaks about him. He came from Newcastle as kind of a number 10 or winger. He can play the '6' and the '8' in the way I don't know many players can. They don't talk about him.”

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-boss-jurgen-klopp-admits-15046540

[Dim Glas]

Another calm and assured display from our Gini tonight    Barely missplaced a pass, just kept it nice and simple, shielded well, and what a tackle late in the 2nd half!

 

[Yorkykopite]

Travelling Kop serenaded Gini twice tonight during the match, almost as if to say “we do understand”. And he played beautifully.

[SpartanTree. No deccies or lights.]

Gini needs to be careful ... people will start talking positively about him if he keeps this up...

He was my motm along with Milner for the West Ham game and he was superb again tonight.
Bravo.

[daggerdoo]

I think it's time to stop with the Wiji clichés. We know who he is.

[BabuYagu]

Travelling Kop serenaded Gini twice tonight during the match, almost as if to say “we do understand”. And he played beautifully.

I wrote a bit last week on our 5 best chances against West Ham (goals & Salah big miss in the box). It was a second by second analysis of every movement and action to try to see how (and who) we open space in the opposition when in possession. It was interesting how much Gini featured in terms of pulling people out of a passing lane, splitting a midfield line with a pass and other little things.

I predicted the Gini/Keita combo would be important this season and you could already see in that game alone exactly why.

[RainbowFlick]

Played really well again. Wasn’t quite expecting him to be a starter for us this season but he’s sure making a case for himself. Quite like the Keita / Gini combo.

[Giono]

Travelling Kop serenaded Gini twice tonight during the match, almost as if to say “we do understand”. And he played beautifully.

I value him, but I’m watching only his movement that is picked up by the TV cameras. Interesting that the travelling Kop, who see a bigger picture, sees enough for them to get the Gini song out while he is playing the 6 in his understated way.

[elpistolero7]

He's the next-next Pogba Pogba. There can be no higher praise.

Love how well he's started the year. Ability in tight spaces was phenomenal.

Fabinho isn't even fully fit yet and we have such fantastic competition in midfield. Lallana and Henderson came off the bench.

The evolution of Gini under Klopp has been really interesting. I think a lot of us had no idea he was such a complete midfielder.

[Kansti]

He's the next-next Pogba Pogba. There can be no higher praise.

What does that even mean?

[BarryCrocker]

That 81st min tackle on McArthur was clinical.

[joe ®]

That 81st min tackle on McArthur was clinical.

Yeah it was fantastic. Waited and waited for the opportunity, didn't dive in, soon as he had a chance to nick it he won it cleanly. Excellent.

[Oberyn_Martell]

Is there a more impressive player in the squad in terms of the sheer number of roles he can play to such a high standard?
6 8 10 he can do it all.
In the pre season game against Torino he was going box to box beautifully ghosting in for late chances. I thought then Fabinho Keita Wijnaldum would be the midfield.
Now he's playing as a 6 and doing it so impressively and you can tell Klopp loves him.

[dptlfc83]

Gini has been brilliant so far this season. He can't be left out of the team at the moment.

[Giono]

Gini has been brilliant so far this season. He can't be left out of the team at the moment.

He wasn’t left out of the midfield last season when he was ‘hiding’. I am sure there will be some rotation. But Klopp surely likes him.

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

I wrote a bit last week on our 5 best chances against West Ham (goals & Salah big miss in the box). It was a second by second analysis of every movement and action to try to see how (and who) we open space in the opposition when in possession. It was interesting how much Gini featured in terms of pulling people out of a passing lane, splitting a midfield line with a pass and other little things.

I predicted the Gini/Keita combo would be important this season and you could already see in that game alone exactly why.

Nice analysis as always Babu!

I've been thinking about how our midfield complement each other and come to the conclusion (possibly completely incorrectly), that Keita would benefit more from playing closer to Salah, and Gini closer to Mane. Let me explain:

Salah is our man for stretching play, constantly making runs beyond the oppo defence, stretching the play, creating space behind him. To make the most of those runs you would want the #8 nearest to him to be good at throughballs. Be a good dribbler to take advantage of the space in his wake, and someone who can burst through the opposition lines with the ball, following the havoc created by Salah's movement.

On the other hand, Mane, whilst also a player not averse to running behind and with excellent movement, prefers the ball into feet. His little bursts beyond the fullback or between FB and CB tend to be more to create space for himself to then drop off and recieve the ball into feet (although not always, as seen on Monday!). He is possibly the best dribbler in the league, able to constantly get his opponent on the back foot, and with the pace and balance to go either outside, or cut inside onto his favoured right foot. Given this, his nearest #8 needs only to play short balls into his feet (not slide-rule throughballs), would benefit Mane by making runs beyond him to help open up more space, and won't have as much space (on the inside) to dribble in compared to Salah's side of the pitch.

It makes sense in my head that Keita would be best suited to support Salah and Gini to support Mane.

So why is this not the case?
Is Keita being paired up with Mane to help him settle (their familiarity from their Salzberg days and friendship off the pitch are well documented)?
Is it just because Gini has been mostly deployed as the deeper player (#6) in the absence of Fab and Hendo from the starting 11, and as soon as either are back Gini will move behind Mane and Keita across to Salah's side?
Is it because Gini and Salah have built up a great complimentary relationship on the field which caused absolute havoc at the back end of last season?
Or is it cos i'm just some guy on the internet who thinks he knows about football but doesn't realise how limited his knowledge really is?

Anyone help? Cheers 


Edit: thought this was the Midfield thread, will post it there too as it's probably better suited.

[BabuYagu]

Nice analysis as always Babu!

I've been thinking about how our midfield complement each other and come to the conclusion (possibly completely incorrectly), that Keita would benefit more from playing closer to Salah, and Gini closer to Mane. Let me explain:

Salah is our man for stretching play, constantly making runs beyond the oppo defence, stretching the play, creating space behind him. To make the most of those runs you would want the #8 nearest to him to be good at throughballs. Be a good dribbler to take advantage of the space in his wake, and someone who can burst through the opposition lines with the ball, following the havoc created by Salah's movement.

On the other hand, Mane, whilst also a player not averse to running behind and with excellent movement, prefers the ball into feet. His little bursts beyond the fullback or between FB and CB tend to be more to create space for himself to then drop off and recieve the ball into feet (although not always, as seen on Monday!). He is possibly the best dribbler in the league, able to constantly get his opponent on the back foot, and with the pace and balance to go either outside, or cut inside onto his favoured right foot. Given this, his nearest #8 needs only to play short balls into his feet (not slide-rule throughballs), would benefit Mane by making runs beyond him to help open up more space, and won't have as much space (on the inside) to dribble in compared to Salah's side of the pitch.

It makes sense in my head that Keita would be best suited to support Salah and Gini to support Mane.

So why is this not the case?
Is Keita being paired up with Mane to help him settle (their familiarity from their Salzberg days and friendship off the pitch are well documented)?
Is it just because Gini has been mostly deployed as the deeper player (#6) in the absence of Fab and Hendo from the starting 11, and as soon as either are back Gini will move behind Mane and Keita across to Salah's side?
Is it because Gini and Salah have built up a great complimentary relationship on the field which caused absolute havoc at the back end of last season?
Or is it cos i'm just some guy on the internet who thinks he knows about football but doesn't realise how limited his knowledge really is?

Anyone help? Cheers 


Edit: thought this was the Midfield thread, will post it there too as it's probably better suited.

Another thing to think about is passing angles & shooting angles. This is why I suggested we would typically see him from the left more.

If Keita is starting from the left and Salah from the right, Salah's runs from out to in are angled towards the penalty spot. Which means if Keita was on the other side, he is either playing the ball straight or over Salah's shoulder to run onto.

[BabuYagu]

Another thing to think about is passing angles & shooting angles. This is why I suggested we would typically see him from the left more.

If Keita is starting from the left and Salah from the right, Salah's runs from out to in are angled towards the penalty spot. Which means if Keita was on the other side, he is either playing the ball straight or over Salah's shoulder to run onto.

Just to add to this, another reason I think we set up like this is that we will tend to use the left side more in buildup/consolidation/penetration and the right side more in finishing.

So we will create overloads on the left and our best players for doing so are all on that side - Robbo, Mané, Keita + Firmino & Gini drifts across to be central to support it when we play out of the overload. When you create an overload this tends to draw the opposition into the ball. A natural occurrence of this is that players ball far side end up with either a lot of space or isolating defenders 1-v-1 in positions were winning that 1-v-1 means a clear scoring chance.

Pep used this a lot at Barcelona, particularly with David Villa then again at Bayern with Robben. It seems we may be trying something similar here with Salah. If we swapped the midfielders, then Gini would be the midfielder in the tighter spaces and Keita would be on the outside supporting and protecting the attack against the counter.

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

Another think about is passing angles & shooting angles. This is why I suggested we would typically see him from the left more.

If Keita is starting from the left and Salah from the right, Salah's runs from out to in are angled towards the penalty spot. Which means if Keita was on the other side, he is either playing the ball straight or over Salah's shoulder to run onto.

This is also true.

Despite playing very well, I think we're yet to see anywhere near the best of Naby, my enduring image of him at RB was of him making a burst with the ball triggering a range of players running off him knowing he could slide them in. Aside from our first against West Ham, we've yet to see much of that for Liverpool. It could also be due to the completely different tactical set up between us and RB and the fact we play a parked bus a lot more often, but regardless, can't wait til it all clicks.

As for Gini, he's made such a brilliant start to the season think you could put him anywhere on the pitch and he'd have a good game. Been good at everything!

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

Just to add to this, another reason I think we set up like this is that we will tend to use the left side more in buildup/consolidation/penetration and the right side more in finishing.

So we will create overloads on the left and our best players for doing so are all on that side - Robbo, Mané, Keita + Firmino & Gini drifts across to be central to support it when we play out of the overload. When you create an overload this tends to draw the opposition into the ball. A natural occurrence of this is that players ball far side end up with either a lot of space or isolating defenders 1-v-1 in positions were winning that 1-v-1 means a clear scoring chance.

Pep used this a lot at Barcelona, particularly with David Villa then again at Bayern with Robben. It seems we may be trying something similar here with Salah. If we swapped the midfielders, then Gini would be the midfielder in the tighter spaces and Keita would be on the outside supporting and protecting the attack against the counter.

Great insight, that never crossed my mind.

[Giono]

Just to add to this, another reason I think we set up like this is that we will tend to use the left side more in buildup/consolidation/penetration and the right side more in finishing.

So we will create overloads on the left and our best players for doing so are all on that side - Robbo, Mané, Keita + Firmino & Gini drifts across to be central to support it when we play out of the overload. When you create an overload this tends to draw the opposition into the ball. A natural occurrence of this is that players ball far side end up with either a lot of space or isolating defenders 1-v-1 in positions were winning that 1-v-1 means a clear scoring chance.

Pep used this a lot at Barcelona, particularly with David Villa then again at Bayern with Robben. It seems we may be trying something similar here with Salah. If we swapped the midfielders, then Gini would be the midfielder in the tighter spaces and Keita would be on the outside supporting and protecting the attack against the counter.

That’s very interesting.

As it regards Gini, that gives him a lot of responsability on the right to control space by drifting inwards and providing defensive cover as well providing late runs into the box. Could be some goals for him in this way of playing. And if Gini is ill/rotated, Henderson could probably move forward into the 8 role and perform that same role well too.

That point about build up on the left also makes Klopp’s surprising post match comments after Pallace about our wingbacks make more sense. Our wingbacks weren’t terrible. But he was disapointed with them offensively, making some quip about wanting more but understanding that they aren’t number 10s. Perhaps he is expecting more than just providing width and an outlet wide, but rather wants them to join the overload?

If what you say is what Klopp has planned, that will mean a bit more space on the pitch for Bobby, Mo, Gini/Milner and Hendo/Fabinho in the centre. Could be fun, especially against those low block teams. Where space in the centre is always an issue.

It will be intersting to see if this overload on the left appears against Brighton.

[Giono]

100% pass completion in the 1st half. 46 of 46


Pass map: https://twitter.com/basstunedtored/status/1033403388669685760?s=21



And clever movement throughout.

[Wool]

Excellent this season so far.

[Dim Glas]

man of the match

[AndyMuller]

Best player on the pitch today.