Author Topic: The RAWK History Channel  (Read 13577 times)

Offline So… Howard Philips

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The RAWK History Channel
« on: February 16, 2019, 11:20:52 am »
There has been a lot of discussion in the politics thread about history, the teaching of history and how some of us have started to take the subject more seriously (as we become more worldly wise I suppose). A couple of posters have suggested a sepearte thread so I thought I'd take the plunge and open one up.

I was taught history from 1066 to the restoration of Charles II and never really grasped the reality. Since leaving school (and with my interest spiked by novels by authors such as George Shipway and Patrick O'Brian) I've started to take more of an interest in British history from the Restoration onwards.

Just to kick things off one book I'd recommend would be "The Reason Why - The story of the charge of the Light Brigade" by Cecil Woodham-Smith.

Yes it tells the reasons behind the military and humanitarian disasters in the Crimea but is also a useful introduction to the class and politics of Mid Victorian times and an excellent summary of the Irish Famine.

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2019, 12:05:16 pm »
Nice one Howard mate.

I like your Cecil Woodham-Smith suggestion. A cracking book. Her book on Ireland - 'The Great Hunger' - is good too.

I hope this thread thrives, but I'm going to risk killing it before it's even been properly watered by listing (aargh) 10 history books I've loved in my life. I'll do it slowly.

1. EP Thompson, The Making of the English Working Class. Published 1963, and still in print by Penguin (now on its millionth edition). I love this book so much, and it's always near me and literally within reach. A work of literature because it is so beautifully written, but also a sophisticated theoretical work about the nature of class. It's massive but there isn't a dull page. Thompson's famous preface where he talks about his aim "to rescue the poor stockinger, the 'obsolete' handloom weaver, the 'utopian' artisan and even the deluded followers of Joanna Southcott from the enormous condescension of posterity" sets the stage. It's a book about the working class at its creation (1790s to 1832) where he treats some of the losers of early capitalism - the poor stockinger etc - with the historical respect they deserve. There's moral passion in the book too. Thompson was a socialist as well as a powerful intellectual. He's not afraid to make moral judgments. The passages on the meaning of Tom Paine, or rather "Mister Thomas Paine to you sir", to the early English working class will live with me forever.

My edition also has an engraving of a Yorkshire collier on the front cover. You can't get better than that.

......to be continued!

PS since this thread was inspired in part by the Churchill thread, I want to ask was Tom Paine the "greatest Briton", not Churchill? Up there for sure.
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Offline Djozer

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2019, 12:06:03 pm »
There has been a lot of discussion in the politics thread about history, the teaching of history and how some of us have started to take the subject more seriously (as we become more worldly wise I suppose). A couple of posters have suggested a sepearte thread so I thought I'd take the plunge and open one up.

I was taught history from 1066 to the restoration of Charles II and never really grasped the reality. Since leaving school (and with my interest spiked by novels by authors such as George Shipway and Patrick O'Brian) I've started to take more of an interest in British history from the Restoration onwards.

Just to kick things off one book I'd recommend would be "The Reason Why - The story of the charge of the Light Brigade" by Cecil Woodham-Smith.

Yes it tells the reasons behind the military and humanitarian disasters in the Crimea but is also a useful introduction to the class and politics of Mid Victorian times and an excellent summary of the Irish Famine.
Nice one for starting this thread, man. I'll have a look at The Reason Why if I can ever find a cheap copy. I think I read a book by Woodham Smith years ago about the Irish Famine and it was a good, if heartbreaking, read, and I know bugger all about the Crimean war beyond Florence Nightingale and that poem so it's something I really should learn more about.

There are huge, and shameful, gaps in my history knowledge. I know a few bits bits and pieces about the prehistoric (though perhaps that shouldn't go here!) medieval, post-med and modern periods, but there's so much out there I haven't a clue about so am eager to learn more and I think a thread like this is a great idea, where we can share and debate ideas about, like, the olden days and stuff.

Offline jillcwhomever

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2019, 12:09:24 pm »
I'm glad we have a thread for this. I was always interested in History from early on. We had a great teacher in secondary school and I think its so important to have a teacher who exhibits a love for the subject they teach. We did quite a wide range of subjects within History. Starting with the Battle of Hastings the Bayeux Tapestry, then moving through the centuries to the Hundred Years War, to the Tudors Age and the Civil War. We also covered the Industrial Revolution the Victorian age which continues to be a fascination to me even now. I seem to remember we also studied social history under the title of Community Studies which involved looking at the social fall out of the first World War, the Suffragettes movement, Guy Fawkes and how life changed on the back of it.

I also got a love of history through reading Charles Dicken's books and the way he describes the living conditions that so many people were forced to endure. While the empire that so many still seem to be nostalgic about even now (for some reason), huge communities were being treated appallingly thrown inside prison,  kids being put in workhouses and being used as slave labour. The Victorian Age was a complex era full of contrasts. For all the incredible progress children were still being put up chimneys, the poor were sent to prison for not having enough money.

I remember studying The Charge of the Light Brigade, at times its hard to take all that in.I felt the same when I was in Belgium searching for my Grandad's brothers grave in Ypres and questioning whether anything like this would happen again, on the same scale? I'm not sure whether it would as more people would object now. Yet its always important to learn about the mistakes from the past to build a better and more secure future.

Anyone interested in the Battle of the Roses this book is fascinating. The Hollow Crown: The Wars of the Roses and the Rise of the Tudors by Dan Jones. I love his historical documentaries.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 12:24:06 pm by jillc »
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Offline Djozer

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2019, 12:26:14 pm »
I'm glad we have a thread for this. I was always interested in History from early on. We had a great teacher in secondary school and I think its so important to have a teacher who exhibits a love for the subject they teach. We did quite a wide range of subjects within History. Starting with the Battle of Hastings the Bayeux Tapestry, then moving through the centuries to the Hundred Years War, to the Tudors Age and the Civil War. We also covered the Industrial Revolution the Victorian age which continues to be a fascination to me even now. I seem to remember we also studied social history under the title of Community Studies which involved looking at the social fall out of the first World War, the Suffragettes movement, Guy Fawkes and how life changed on the back of it.

I also got a love of history through reading Charles Dicken's books and the way he describes the living conditions that so many people were forced to endure. While the empire that so many still seem to be nostalgic about even now (for some reason), huge communities were being treated appallingly thrown inside prison,  kids being put in workhouses and being used as slave labour. The Victorian Age was a complex era full of contrasts. For all the incredible progress children were still being put up chimneys, the poor were sent to prison for not having enough money.

I remember studying The Charge of the Light Brigade, at times its hard to take all that in.I felt the same when I was in Belgium searching for my Grandad's brothers grave in Ypres and questioning whether anything like this would happen again, on the same scale? I'm not sure whether it would as more people would object now. Yet its always important to learn about the mistakes from the past to build a better and more secure future.
Hope you're right and that more people would object now, but I'm worried (perhaps overly so - I'm maybe just being paranoid) about the increasingly fervent nationalism in many countries across the globe, and the subsequent stresses and belligerence that it can bring. I'd like to think that we learn from our past mistakes as a species, but I do wonder whether we are forgetting about the world wars, given that most of the people involved in them directly are either very old or have passed away. I think it's entirely possible a new world war is just a few years away, although hopefully I'm just talking shite and people realise just how devastating one would be now, with modern weaponry and technology so do all they can to avoid it.

It's probably a bit authoritarian, but if it were up to me I'd make every single person in the world visit a genocide memorial like Auschwitz or the Choeung Ek killing field. I think things like this are important, as they really hammer home in a very visceral manner how bloody terrible we can be to one another as a species, and consequently how we should do everything possible to avoid similar evils in the future.

Seeing as we're doing book recommendations, Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee's a good one. Pretty harrowing stuff unsurprisingly, as it deals with how the Native Americans were fucked over by the European settlers and their endless greed, but a very good read.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 12:31:19 pm by Djozer »

Offline jillcwhomever

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2019, 12:37:07 pm »
Hope you're right and that more people would object now, but I'm worried (perhaps overly so - I'm maybe just being paranoid) about the increasingly fervent nationalism in many countries across the globe, and the subsequent stresses and belligerence that it can bring. I'd like to think that we learn from our past mistakes as a species, but I do wonder whether we are forgetting about the world wars, given that most of the people involved in them directly are either very old or have passed away. I think it's entirely possible a new world war is just a few years away, although hopefully I'm just talking shite and people realise just how devastating one would be now, with modern weaponry and technology so do all they can to avoid it.

It's probably a bit authoritarian, but if it were up to me I'd make every single person in the world visit a genocide memorial like Auschwitz or the Choeung Ek killing field. I think things like this are important, as they really hammer home in a very visceral manner how bloody terrible we can be to one another as a species, and consequently how we should do everything possible to avoid similar evils in the future.

The rise of the right is certainly a concern I share and many others. I do think we also live in a much more cynical age now though and that can be both a good and bad thing. What worries me far more today is the fact that people just look for others to blame for their own situations. We have seemingly lost the ability to own up to our own mistakes and so its much easier now to put the blame somewhere else, ie immigration. That way we don't have to look at our own choices that we made, life always has consequences and those who ignore that risk the chance of being exposed by it at a later time. You only have to look at the refusal to demonise those policitally who used hatred as a tool to power. History tells us ignoring that always has consequences further down the road. There are certain parallels with Germany in the 30's to our situation at the moment. A country that chooses isolation is merely turning its back on the world I didn't really want to bring Brexit into this thread, but you can't ignore the context of it.
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Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2019, 01:16:04 pm »

Anyone interested in the Battle of the Roses this book is fascinating. The Hollow Crown: The Wars of the Roses and the Rise of the Tudors by Dan Jones. I love his historical documentaries.

Dan Jones's "The Plantagenets" is excellent as well.

You can see where half of the plot lines for Game of Thrones came from. :D

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2019, 01:39:48 pm »
Wonderful thread idea, as some who is an avid history lover and student of the subject I am made up with this, '


I'll post a few books later when I do a bit of a think and choose a small hand-full (for now) off my shelves.
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2019, 01:45:50 pm »
Great idea for a thread

I hope this thread thrives, but I'm going to risk killing it before it's even been properly watered by listing (aargh) 10 history books I've loved in my life. I'll do it slowly.

I'm still cursing you for your suggestion of Black Lamb and Grey Falcon a few years ago - I think I'll be of pensionable age by the time I finish it ;D

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2019, 01:52:45 pm »
Great idea for a thread

I'm still cursing you for your suggestion of Black Lamb and Grey Falcon a few years ago - I think I'll be of pensionable age by the time I finish it ;D

Oh yeah, I remember that. Hope you don't regret it!. It's a book you can put aside for a year or two and then dip back in I think. Again, Rebecca West is one of the great non-fiction prose writers so it's never a waste of time just spending half an hour with her.
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2019, 01:54:44 pm »
Excellent thread, just posting to bookmark it. Will add some recommendations of my own later.
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2019, 02:26:28 pm »
A great thread. Thanks for starting it.

I am also a lover and avid reader of history. I will also post some book recommendations soon.

Sincerely hope this thread sparks some interesting and illuminating debate.
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Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2019, 04:11:31 pm »

Seeing as we're doing book recommendations, Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee's a good one. Pretty harrowing stuff unsurprisingly, as it deals with how the Native Americans were fucked over by the European settlers and their endless greed, but a very good read.

Another in a similar vein is SC Gwynne's "Empire of the Summer Moon: Quanah Parker and the Rise and Fall of the Comanches, the Most Powerful Indian Tribe in American History".

The true story of the 9 year old Cynthia Parker kidnapped by the Comanche (the basis of the John Wayne film the Searchers) and her son, Quanah, and the brutal war the Comanche waged, not just against the settlers, but also other tribes like the Apache.

Offline jillcwhomever

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2019, 04:47:46 pm »
Dan Jones's "The Plantagenets" is excellent as well.

You can see where half of the plot lines for Game of Thrones came from. :D

I will have to look that out. He did some documentaries called The Bloody Crown about the Battle of the Roses, which were very good. You are right about Game of Thrones George Martin is known as having an interest in that conflict. We could probably do another thread on which people he based his characters on.  ;D
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2019, 05:22:10 pm »
There has been a lot of discussion in the politics thread about history, the teaching of history and how some of us have started to take the subject more seriously (as we become more worldly wise I suppose). A couple of posters have suggested a sepearte thread so I thought I'd take the plunge and open one up.

I was taught history from 1066 to the restoration of Charles II and never really grasped the reality. Since leaving school (and with my interest spiked by novels by authors such as George Shipway and Patrick O'Brian) I've started to take more of an interest in British history from the Restoration onwards.

Just to kick things off one book I'd recommend would be "The Reason Why - The story of the charge of the Light Brigade" by Cecil Woodham-Smith.

Yes it tells the reasons behind the military and humanitarian disasters in the Crimea but is also a useful introduction to the class and politics of Mid Victorian times and an excellent summary of the Irish Famine.

Taught history from 1066 ?

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2019, 06:27:18 pm »
Taught history from 1066 ?

Kin ell how old you ?

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2019, 06:28:35 pm »
The rise of the right is certainly a concern I share and many others. I do think we also live in a much more cynical age now though and that can be both a good and bad thing. What worries me far more today is the fact that people just look for others to blame for their own situations. We have seemingly lost the ability to own up to our own mistakes and so its much easier now to put the blame somewhere else, ie immigration. That way we don't have to look at our own choices that we made, life always has consequences and those who ignore that risk the chance of being exposed by it at a later time. You only have to look at the refusal to demonise those policitally who used hatred as a tool to power. History tells us ignoring that always has consequences further down the road. There are certain parallels with Germany in the 30's to our situation at the moment. A country that chooses isolation is merely turning its back on the world I didn't really want to bring Brexit into this thread, but you can't ignore the context of it.

This is one aspect of Facebook I hate. The Far Right create all this stuff about immigrants and people just share it all over the place without even realising they are spreading far right hate. Immigrants and Muslims take a right bashing, very much like the Jews were doing in 1930's Germany and people don't get it. Then they will drag an old soldier into it , claiming they have nowhere to live/get neglected while Immigrants are housed. No-one seems to realise that our veterans fought the very type of people whose posts they are sharing. Makes me wonder did people get taught enough about the rise of the Nazis?
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2019, 07:14:03 pm »
This is one aspect of Facebook I hate. The Far Right create all this stuff about immigrants and people just share it all over the place without even realising they are spreading far right hate. Immigrants and Muslims take a right bashing, very much like the Jews were doing in 1930's Germany and people don't get it. Then they will drag an old soldier into it , claiming they have nowhere to live/get neglected while Immigrants are housed. No-one seems to realise that our veterans fought the very type of people whose posts they are sharing. Makes me wonder did people get taught enough about the rise of the Nazis?

As someone mentioned on the Churchill thread, this is the most important thing about studying history - you learn how to evaluate sources. Too many people seem to think ‘it must be true, I read it on Facebook’ without asking the most basic critical questions. My cousin shared something a few weeks ago about an old man being mugged by some people who looked like they were non-white (was hard to tell to be honest as the picture wasn’t clear), but if she’s had taken 30 seconds to see some of the other bile the original poster had shared she would have seen exactly what the real narrative was.
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Offline rob1966

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2019, 08:37:26 pm »
As someone mentioned on the Churchill thread, this is the most important thing about studying history - you learn how to evaluate sources. Too many people seem to think ‘it must be true, I read it on Facebook’ without asking the most basic critical questions. My cousin shared something a few weeks ago about an old man being mugged by some people who looked like they were non-white (was hard to tell to be honest as the picture wasn’t clear), but if she’s had taken 30 seconds to see some of the other bile the original poster had shared she would have seen exactly what the real narrative was.

Piers Moron had posted/tweeted something that did the rounds the other week, about an ex SAS soldier who was in the Iranian Embassy seige being homeless while the only surviving terrorist lives in a council house, so it's all give terrorists priority. Cue lots of sharing and outrage. 5 minutes of looking reveals that the ex SAS fella lost his home when his business went under, he was staying with his daughter and had turned down two houses. He also hadn't filled in the paperwork that actually allowed the council to house him. The Iranian was released in 2008 btw.

If people cannot even be bothered to research stuff that is so easily provable I despair - I also worry that this will allow those with agendas to re-write history and to do things like spread the lie that the holocaust never happened.

I didn't really enjoy history in school, in a way it was fascinating to learn about these vile thieving murdering inbred twats - but it just bred my dislike and apathy to the Royals. I was also fascinated with the RAF in WW2, so I would have preferred to have been taught that.

I do love physical history though, I love going around castles and museums, seeing how they were and imagining how people lived - the priest holes in Speke Hall always fascinated and saddened me.
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2019, 04:09:36 pm »
Never did history in school but have a keen interest in the "Truth".
Was utterly disappointed when the national curriculum stopped demanding that children be encouraged to look at primary/secondary/nonary sources and shifted emphasis off interpretation of fact and opinion.
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I was wondering about the discussion the other day...thanks for starting the thread.

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #20 on: February 18, 2019, 01:42:08 pm »
Again, thank you for the thread.

Touching on the theme that others have posted on, I do often despair at the lack of knowledge from the younger generations about history in a more general sense. When I was studying history at school in the mid to late 80's our subject matter was pretty limited. We studied, in the main, the industrial revolution, the Hapsburg empire and the french revolution. It did spark my initial interest but really I wanted to study 20th Century history. I was lucky though because I had a teacher that enthused about his subject and passed that enthusiasm to me. I was also spellbound by 'The World at War' which I watched with my Dad as a kid - that opening music and Laurence Olivier's voice just had me absolutely captivated. It is something I have kept up ever since.

However, my children (now 13 and 20), much to my frustration, have never really showed an interest in the subject and indeed many subjects. When I meet some of their teachers I can see why. There just wasn`t that enthusiasm there from some of them, which I think is key. Their lack of general knowledge is startling despite being brought up in a house full of books and newspapers. I think schools need to stress the importance of history, and wider general knowledge, on informing everything that is happening today. I actually think that some historical based fiction could spark more of an interest in them (Bernard Cornwell, Conn Iggulden, Robert Harris etc).

As for books to recommend, then whilst he is isn`t everyones cup of tea, Max Hastings 'All Hell Let Loose' is a particularly good account of WWII from the perspective of ordinary people as opposed to the grand sweep of things. I have plenty of others as well that I will recommend over time as the thread develops.

Good to see so many others on here with an interest in history. I look forward to reading some no doubt very interesting debates and book recommendations.
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #21 on: February 18, 2019, 10:45:27 pm »
I think that is quite normal Qston, children don't tend to stay interested in history while they are young, they're too busy living their lives. I just think you get to an age when all of a sudden you get curious about the way of the world. I was like you though, got a love of history through my history teacher who was brilliant. I never liked the Tudor Age at school and we did a lot on that. Now though, I can't get too much of it. A lot of that came from watching The Tudors strangely enough! I don't remember doing anything on the French Revolution though. Anyway here is a bit of that documentary I mentioned that Dan Jones did on the War of the Roses, The Bloody Crown.

https://youtu.be/fG1NpCE1B5k
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Offline TepidT2O

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #22 on: February 18, 2019, 10:48:37 pm »
If you want a book on the French Revolution, then Citizens by Simon Sharma is scintillating.
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
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Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #23 on: February 18, 2019, 10:55:35 pm »
I think that is quite normal Qston, children don't tend to stay interested in history while they are young, they're too busy living their lives. I just think you get to an age when all of a sudden you get curious about the way of the world. I was like you though, got a love of history through my history teacher who was brilliant. I never liked the Tudor Age at school and we did a lot on that. Now though, I can't get too much of it. A lot of that came from watching The Tudors strangely enough! I don't remember doing anything on the French Revolution though. Anyway here is a bit of that documentary I mentioned that Dan Jones did on the War of the Roses, The Bloody Crown.

https://youtu.be/fG1NpCE1B5k

David Starkey's Six Wives the Queens of Henry is an excellent introduction to Henrician England.

And if you are looking for a series of novels of this period CJ Sampson's Shardlake books are entertaining.

Offline jillcwhomever

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #24 on: February 18, 2019, 11:04:07 pm »
David Starkey's Six Wives the Queens of Henry is an excellent introduction to Henrician England.

And if you are looking for a series of novels of this period CJ Sampson's Shardlake books are entertaining.

I'm having a hard enough job getting through A Clash of Kings at the moment. But thanks for yet more possible reading.  ;D
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Offline TepidT2O

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2019, 11:13:10 pm »
Oh shardlake is great.

“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
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Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2019, 11:14:31 pm »
Oh shardlake is great.

A bit lighter than Hilary Mantel, also excellent.

Offline Qston

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #27 on: February 21, 2019, 01:29:47 pm »
David Starkey's Six Wives the Queens of Henry is an excellent introduction to Henrician England.

And if you are looking for a series of novels of this period CJ Sampson's Shardlake books are entertaining.

Cheers for the recommendations. I have just ordered the first 3 in the series of Shardlake books. Looking forward to reading them.

My favourite set of historial fiction books is the Conn Iggulden Emperor series, closely followed by Thomas Harris Cicero Trilogy. In fact anything be them both and Cornwell as well is brilliant.

The Emperor series should be made into a TV series or films.
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Offline Sangria

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #28 on: February 21, 2019, 06:22:08 pm »
Cheers for the recommendations. I have just ordered the first 3 in the series of Shardlake books. Looking forward to reading them.

My favourite set of historial fiction books is the Conn Iggulden Emperor series, closely followed by Thomas Harris Cicero Trilogy. In fact anything be them both and Cornwell as well is brilliant.

The Emperor series should be made into a TV series or films.

Mary Renault's Greek novels. Chronologically, details from wiki:

The King Must Die - the mythical Theseus up to his father's death
The Bull From the Sea - the remainder of Theseus' life
The Praise Singer - the poet Simonides of Ceos
Last of the Wine - set in Athens during the Peloponnesian War; the narrator is a student of Socrates
The Mask of Apollo - an actor at the time of Plato and Dionysius the Younger (brief appearance by Alexander near the end of the book)
Fire From Heaven - Alexander the Great from the age of four up to his father's death
The Persian Boy - from Bagoas's perspective; Alexander the Great after the conquest of Persia
Funeral Games - Alexander's successors
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Offline afc tukrish

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #29 on: February 21, 2019, 07:03:50 pm »
Mary Renault's Greek novels. Chronologically, details from wiki:

Funeral Games - Alexander's successors


One to add that's not a novel, but damn fine scholarship and very readable on a neglected historical period, Dividing the Spoils: The War for Alexander the Great's Empire, by Robin Waterfield, about the Diadochi and their fight to rule what was Alexander's world...
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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2019, 10:15:21 pm »
The Civil War by Shelby Foote is probably the best factual set of books I've ever read.

Absolutely epic history of the American Civil War.

Takes a while to get through, but it is utterly superb, as is the TV documentary series that accompanied it.

Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #31 on: February 21, 2019, 10:19:10 pm »
The Civil War by Shelby Foote is probably the best factual set of books I've ever read.

Absolutely epic history of the American Civil War.

Takes a while to get through, but it is utterly superb, as is the TV documentary series that accompanied it.

I haven't read the book but watched the recent TV documentary. Excellent.

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #32 on: February 22, 2019, 05:43:24 pm »
I would love a sub forum for this, there is a lot of knowledge on this forum and condensing it to a single thread may make it unreadable, lurching from topic and time.

Offline the oxonian

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #33 on: February 22, 2019, 05:46:03 pm »

One to add that's not a novel, but damn fine scholarship and very readable on a neglected historical period, Dividing the Spoils: The War for Alexander the Great's Empire, by Robin Waterfield, about the Diadochi and their fight to rule what was Alexander's world...
[/quote]

Got that,very good read.


Offline the oxonian

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #34 on: February 22, 2019, 05:53:23 pm »
The Normans in the south, and The kingdom in the sun , by John Julius Norwich are excellent reads, highly recommended

Offline rafathegaffa83

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #35 on: March 1, 2019, 06:38:52 pm »
As a history aficionado, I'm glad this thread exists as well. I've always loved history. Got a few degrees in the subject and probably would have gone on further had it not been for the credit crunch. My areas of interest/specialty have always been in cultural and social history, largely in modern Europe (post 1789-to the present) with a particular interest in postwar Germany. Over the past few years, the rise of populism and Trumpism has encouraged me to get back into reading more to try and help myself understand how we've got here. I've also tried to undertake more broader historical reading habits to correct blindspots with regards to certain periods or areas of the world.

 I'll be the first to admit here, the history books I've always enjoyed argely have an academic bent to them and I'm not overly keen on military history. I've always preferred a history of war book that looks at the conflict from a social and cultural perspective, as opposed to a military angle. Subsequently, my recommendations probably lean more towards works that feature a scholarly analysis rather than popular history. Additionally, I've always preferred a broad overview text that incorporates an analytical examination of a period or subject instead of a rote memorization of facts about "Great Men."

The first book I'd recommend is one of my favourite history books that I spent years putting off reading: A People's Tragedy: The Russian Revolution, 1891-1924 by Orlando Figes. This is a scholarly tome. I had to prepare myself to sit down and read this by carving out enough time to fully appreciate it. Thus, I made sure to start it during a week when I was at home over the Christmas break with nothing else to do. And it was well worth it. My edition of Figes' book (the recent Bodley Head anniversary one) is almost nine hundred pages of text and around seventy pages of bibliographic notes. Figes splits the book into four main parts looking at Tsarism,

Figes astutely goes into almost every single aspect of Russian culture, economics, society and politics that you could imagine to explain the turbulent events of the time, while making the people involved feel real with all their warts, hypocrisies and naivety. The main characters one often hears of are richly described - Nicholas II, Rasputin, Lenin, Trotsky, Prince Lvov, Gorky, Kerensky, Stolypin etc. - but Figes also crucially looks into aspects that are often neglected in broad Anglo-American works that touch on the period: the chaotic blend of savagery and violence found in Russian peasant culture,  the misplaced mysticism and pull of the Cult of the Tsar and the colossal errors made by the likes of the Mensheviks and SRs that allowed the Bolsheviks to gain control.

One of the best things about this book is how Figes shows that none of this had to happen. He demonstrates the multiple opportunities that various entities and figures could have acted to stop the revolution and the subsequent bloodshed from occurring. I think sometimes people seem to think that certain historical events unfold with a sort of predestination in mind. Christopher Clark's The Sleepwalkers is another book that comes to mind in showing how much agency certain groups and individuals have had in the build-up to major events, in which they could have significantly altered the course of history by pulling a lever to turn in an alternative direction or pull the brakes on events with serious consequences *cough* Brexit *cough*

Figes later went one step further in a follow-up book (Revolutionary Russia) in which he pondered whether the entire hundred year period between 1891-1991 acted as a giant revolutionary cycle.

Offline Bend It Like Aurelio

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #36 on: March 1, 2019, 06:54:52 pm »
D-Day Through German Eyes. Books 1 and 2. Just a bunch of collected interviews of German soldiers who survived Normandy, and their views of the war itself. I found it fascinating to say the least, as a guy who studied WW2 extensively.

Offline Qston

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #37 on: March 1, 2019, 09:57:46 pm »
D-Day Through German Eyes. Books 1 and 2. Just a bunch of collected interviews of German soldiers who survived Normandy, and their views of the war itself. I found it fascinating to say the least, as a guy who studied WW2 extensively.

Many years ago I met a fella that was a young German right on the coast on d day. His description of the naval bombardment was fascinating and terrifying in equal measure. He said it felt like the coast was going to fall into the sea.
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Offline Mutton Geoff

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #38 on: March 2, 2019, 08:45:12 am »
The problem teaching History in schools is that the main focus is always on English, Maths and the Sciences.
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Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: The RAWK History Channel
« Reply #39 on: March 2, 2019, 11:46:13 am »
The problem teaching History in schools is that the main focus is always on English, Maths and the Sciences.

And that's probably why so many on here are self taught, picking up periods of history from novels or documentaries and then reading around the subject.