Topic: John Henry & Liverpool's Evolution From Moneyball to Big-Spending Approach

[RobbieRedman]

I don't agree with this let them all get better thing. We didn't win at City, Arsenal, Utd or Chelsea last season. If the top 6 all get better it makes life harder for us perhaps more than City who have a larger squad (of quality) to deal with it.

What we need is is them to remain weaker and for us to stay on Citys toes and hope they get distracted with certain trophies they have never won before.

Us going 90+ points again is going to be a massive challenge, it's weird to think our closest rivals getting stronger will help our cause.

[ThePoolMan]

I don't agree with this let them all get better thing. We didn't win at City, Arsenal, Utd or Chelsea last season. If the top 6 all get better it makes life harder for us perhaps more than City who have a larger squad (of quality) to deal with it.

What we need is is them to remain weaker and for us to stay on Citys toes and hope they get distracted with certain trophies they have never won before.

Us going 90+ points again is going to be a massive challenge, it's weird to think our closest rivals getting stronger will help our cause.

Exactly - if they get stronger so as to threaten City when City plays with them, that also means they will become a greater threat to us as well when we play them!

[El Lobo]

They were a threat in the games they played with us though they could not keep it up throughout the course of the season because of their lack of depth. They appear to be addressing that as well as improving themselves in one vital area at least. We need to keep the quality advantage vis a vis them by also investing in more world class quality.

 

They lost 3 out of 3 against us

It was a scandal that they didn’t lose by 4/5 at Wembley. Everton caused us far more problems last season.

[killer-heels]

They were a threat in the games they played with us though they could not keep it up throughout the course of the season because of their lack of depth. They appear to be addressing that as well as improving themselves in one vital area at least. We need to keep the quality advantage vis a vis them by also investing in more world class quality.

We do have a quality advantage. Lets not forget we invested in two top quality midfielders last season and in Keita we have still to see his consistent best form.

People as usual are getting scared because of some shiny new toy whilst they want us to write off our shiny new toys. Keita didnt do it consistently so lets buy yet another midfielder and push him down the list so we can boast aboyt a new signing.

If they were both on the market, would you have Ndombele over Keita.

[killer-heels]

I don't agree with this let them all get better thing. We didn't win at City, Arsenal, Utd or Chelsea last season. If the top 6 all get better it makes life harder for us perhaps more than City who have a larger squad (of quality) to deal with it.

What we need is is them to remain weaker and for us to stay on Citys toes and hope they get distracted with certain trophies they have never won before.

Us going 90+ points again is going to be a massive challenge, it's weird to think our closest rivals getting stronger will help our cause.

In what way? People dont think we can get 97 points again but City can. If thats what you expect and you expect us to drop points then we need City to also drop points. They will only do that if certain teams are better.

I would be far more confident contesting a high 80-low 90 point league than another 98-190 point one.

[Alan_X]

They were a threat in the games they played with us though they could not keep it up throughout the course of the season because of their lack of depth. They appear to be addressing that as well as improving themselves in one vital area at least. We need to keep the quality advantage vis a vis them by also investing in more world class quality.

We have world class quality through the team. What we also have is an amazing team ethic and a squad that is coached so that every player knows exactly what they are doing. Klopp's Liverpool isn't about galacticos and just fielding a load of world class talent.

Apart from Van Dyck and Alisson we haven't really spent world class money on players and even the purchase of Van Dyck was laughed at by many.

Salah wasn't 'world class' when we bought him, nor was Mane, or Bobby, or Fabhino, Robertson, Wijnaldum... and Champions League winning players like Matip and Henderson were mentally binned of by a fair proportion of Liverpool's support.

And then there are the players that people said we shouldn't have let go - Coutinho, Sakho, Clyne etc. Players who had the wrong attitude or weren't right for the way we play

I think we should carry on what we're doing and not worry about what other clubs are up to. We're a team of mentality monsters. Intelligent players who are their own managers on the pitch - the Wijnaldum and Origi corners that weren't coached by Klopp for example. We don't need 'world class' players for the sake of it. We need the right players.

[jillcwhomever]

We have world class quality through the team. What we also have is an amazing team ethic and a squad that is coached so that every player knows exactly what they are doing. Klopp's Liverpool isn't about galacticos and just fielding a load of world class talent.

Apart from Van Dyck and Alisson we haven't really spent world class money on players and even the purchase of Van Dyck was laughed at by many.

Salah wasn't 'world class' when e bought him, nor was Mane, or Bobby, or Fabhino, Robertson, Wijnaldum... and Champions League winning players like Matip and Henderson were mentally binned of by a fair proportion of Liverpool's support.

And then there are the players that we shouldn't have let go - Coutinho, Sakho, Clyne etc. Players who had the wrong attitude or weren't right for the way we play

I think we should carry on what we're doing and not worry about what other clubs are up to. We're a team of mentality monsters. Intelligent players who are their own managers on the pitch - the Wijnaldum and Origi corners that weren't coached by Klopp for example. We don't need 'world class' players for the sake of it. We need the right players.

Is right.

[SerbianScouser]

Remember Ferguson saying the longer team is together the better they become.

It makes perfect sense to me. This group hasn't been together that long, now that they've achieved great success they can use this experience and elevated confidence to maintain our extremely high level of last season even without new signings.

We simply have the know how and all the tools needed to just keep on doing what we did so far which is figuring teams out during games and finding ways to win.

[ThePoolMan]

In what way? People dont think we can get 97 points again but City can. If thats what you expect and you expect us to drop points then we need City to also drop points. They will only do that if certain teams are better.

I would be far more confident contesting a high 80-low 90 point league than another 98-190 point one.

City will certainly be spending bid this window and trying to increase their quality advantage - shouldnt we do the same?

[Alan_X]

City will certainly be spending bid this window and trying to increase their quality advantage - shouldnt we do the same?

What are the world class player we need and who do they replace? We need some cover for our best players but a 'world class' player will expect to go straight in.

I'm not saying we shouldn't buy someone like Mbappe if he was available and the management team thought he would fit but who does he replace in the first-choice starting line-up?

And who are the world class players that are available?

[ThePoolMan]

We have world class quality through the team. What we also have is an amazing team ethic and a squad that is coached so that every player knows exactly what they are doing. Klopp's Liverpool isn't about galacticos and just fielding a load of world class talent.

Apart from Van Dyck and Alisson we haven't really spent world class money on players and even the purchase of Van Dyck was laughed at by many.

Salah wasn't 'world class' when we bought him, nor was Mane, or Bobby, or Fabhino, Robertson, Wijnaldum... and Champions League winning players like Matip and Henderson were mentally binned of by a fair proportion of Liverpool's support.

And then there are the players that people said we shouldn't have let go - Coutinho, Sakho, Clyne etc. Players who had the wrong attitude or weren't right for the way we play

I think we should carry on what we're doing and not worry about what other clubs are up to. We're a team of mentality monsters. Intelligent players who are their own managers on the pitch - the Wijnaldum and Origi corners that weren't coached by Klopp for example. We don't need 'world class' players for the sake of it. We need the right players.

Of course the mentality and unity of our squad is our great strength and our squad is already so good as it is, and staying together will further improve their cohesiveness. However all those arguments are not mutually exclusive with the idea of signing a world class talent to further enhance the team. It is not a case of either/or - it is rather than what you said is true and correct, but that does not mean that by that token, we do not have to strengthen further with world class talent.

We signed  Van Dyk and Alisson to provide world class quality in places where we had clear weak points in the first team and it is arguable that we no longer have any weak points in the first squad. However we do not have much depth in the squad in the attack  and there is no alternative to the front 3 of the same quality. If any of them - or worse 2 or all 3 of them - are injured, that may derail our challenge in circumstances where virtual perfection is needed in the league to beat City who will be aiming at perfection themselves as they realise that they need that kind of performance to beat us. There is no margin for error. So if we were to sign a forward who is even better or at the same standard as our top 3, that provides competition and keeps them on their toes, provides alternatives in case of injury or loss of form or suspension without losing any quality in the first team and provides alternatives even in structure or formation of the team. Imagine also the confidence it will further add to the team to know that we have such options.

Now that we have built a fine first team by adding two expensive world class players, it is now time for us to move to the next level of our tam's development by spending even more serious money to sign one or two of the world's best players to further enhance our quality and performance level so that we are now the favourite even when we play any of the biggest teams in the world. We have the money to be able to afford it, we have the pull and the draw because we are the European champions. The biggest mistake we could make is to stand still because to stand still in the face of our rivals especially our greatest rival puling ahead, will be to fall behind.

[JackWard33]

Remember Ferguson saying the longer team is together the better they become.

It makes perfect sense to me. This group hasn't been together that long, now that they've achieved great success they can use this experience and elevated confidence to maintain our extremely high level of last season even without new signings.

We simply have the know how and all the tools needed to just keep on doing what we did so far which is figuring teams out during games and finding ways to win.

This is absolutely definitely true - there's no question teams develop together.

However to win consistently in football you have to ALSO continuously invest to upgrade your team because if you don't others will.

Just had a quick google - he signed 100 ish players in his time there - players every summer almost always including players intended to go into the first team
Here's the list   https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/sir-alex-fergusons-99-signings-4002742
As a further note he bought a SHIT load of players that make and score goals

[Mutton Geoff]

Ooook, pilgrim. Get off your horse and drink your milk, Ted.

different genre " But do you feel lucky punk? "

[ThePoolMan]

What are the world class player we need and who do they replace? We need some cover for our best players but a 'world class' player will expect to go straight in.

I'm not saying we shouldn't buy someone like Mbappe if he was available and the management team thought he would fit but who does he replace in the first-choice starting line-up?

And who are the world class players that are available?

Mbappe is precisely the player we can try to make a bid for either now or at the end of next season even if it means breaking the world transfer record because he has only 2 seasons left on his contract. He doesnt have to replace anybody to be first choice all the time or to sit on the bench either - the starting forward line depends on who is best to fit in to face a particular opponent, and rotation will enable them to keep their freshness and liveliness.

An alternative would be Ousmane Dembele who is more gettable in the face of Barcelona's reported interest in getting Neymar back.

[ThePoolMan]

This is absolutely definitely true - there's no question teams develop together.

However to win consistently in football you have to ALSO continuously invest to upgrade your team because if you don't others will.

Just had a quick google - he signed 100 ish players in his time there - players every summer almost always including players to go into the first team
Here's the list   https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/sir-alex-fergusons-99-signings-4002742
As a further note he bought a SHIT load of players that make and score goals

Exactly - it is a logical fallacy to think that keeping the core of the team together and making quality additions are mutually exclusive.

[Mutton Geoff]

This is absolutely definitely true - there's no question teams develop together.

However to win consistently in football you have to ALSO continuously invest to upgrade your team because if you don't others will.

Just had a quick google - he signed 100 ish players in his time there - players every summer almost always including players to go into the first team
Here's the list   https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/sir-alex-fergusons-99-signings-4002742
As a further note he bought a SHIT load of players that make and score goals

Can you not upgrade your team by investing in youth then develop them , it doesnt always need to be the this years black dress mentality to bring success,

As for Fergie i would suggest his greatest team came from investing in youth,  he spent loads after because they did not get the next golden generation coming through.

Here i can see traits of a golden generation coming through at Anfield and that is good to see in my opinion.

[ThePoolMan]

Can you not upgrade your team and invest in youth then develop them , it doesnt always need to be the this years black dress mentality to bring success,

As for Fergie i would suggest his greatest team came from investing in youth,  he spent loads after because they did not get he next golden generation coming through.

Here i can see traits of a golden generation coming through at Anfield and that is good to see in my opinion.

Certainly we should do that and we are doing that with Brewster, Adam Lewis, Hoever and now Van Der Berg and others coming in. But they are not ready yet in the short and medium term. Brewster will be over the medium term if he fulfils his potential but even he will not be ready to fill in for Salah etc and offer no drop in performance for next season. We do not need to sign many world class players - just one world class forward like Mbappe or Ousmane Dembele to bring us over the top as it were. It will be the capstone to cement where we are now and what we are capable of doing and the kind of player who will get into our first team - not just a boost to our actual performance and depth of resources, but also a message to the world that Liverpool FC has the best and strongest team in the world.

[JackWard33]

Can you not upgrade your team by investing in youth then develop them , it doesnt always need to be the this years black dress mentality to bring success,

As for Fergie i would suggest his greatest team came from investing in youth,  he spent loads after because they did not get the next golden generation coming through.

Here i can see traits of a golden generation coming through at Anfield and that is good to see in my opinion.

I can't see that with Ferguson in the way you're suggesting. The 'golden generation' that came through was a one time freak of nature (its never happened at any club since - maybe with the exception of Barca) ... after that he invested in youth sure if you count players like Ronaldo and Rooney the most in demand/expensive young players in european football.
They were constantly buying at the top of the market during his time 

[SerbianScouser]

Exactly - it is a logical fallacy to think that keeping the core of the team together and making quality additions are mutually exclusive.

It's impossible to predict what is it exactly that we need to maintain our level this season.

For example a front 3 signing may fail and Ox may turn out to be that very refreshment for our team that we're looking for.

At the end of all ends we now have a great core just like most of Fergie's team and just like him we'll be looking to add one very good player at the most just to avoid going stale - it's a great position to be in.

[Mutton Geoff]

Certainly we should do that and we are doing that with Brewster, Adam Lewis, Hoever and now Van Der Berg and others coming in. But they are not ready yet in the short and medium term. Brewster will be over the medium term if he fulfils his potential but even he will not be ready to fill in for Salah etc and offer no drop in performance for next season. We do not need to sign many world class players - just one world class forward like Mbappe or Ousmane Dembele to bring us over the top as it were. It will be the capstone to cement where we are now and what we are capable of doing and the kind of player who will get into our first team - not just a boost to our actual performance and depth of resources, but also a message to the world that Liverpool FC has the best and strongest team in the world.

I think the problem sometimes is buying players for some is like a bragging contest and any high priced footballer will do , but for me its not the price of the player that matters it is are they the right player for us , Robertson turned out to be a good example of this approach but how many posted negative stuff about buying a lad from Hull rather than some other guy costing three times the amount.

[ThePoolMan]

It's impossible to predict what is it exactly that we need to maintain our level this season.

For example a front 3 signing may fail and Ox may turn out to be that very refreshment for our team that we're looking for.

At the end of all ends we now have a great core just like most of Fergie's team and just like him we'll be looking to add one very good player at the most just to avoid going stale - it's a great position to be in.

Agreed, it is up to the players themselves to excel and make their mark. If we add to the overall level of quality in the team by raising the bar even further, the whole team are motivated to work harder and smarter to achieve even higher levels next season.

[ThePoolMan]

I think the problem sometimes is buying players for some is like a bragging contest and any high priced footballer will do , but for me its not the price of the player that matters it is are they the right player for us , Robertson turned out to be a good example of this approach but how many posted negative stuff about buying a lad from Hull rather than some other guy costing three times the amount.

What you say is correct and I am all for it if the analysts can find a player as good as our top 3 or better but who is not known that well and thus costs much less! However that may indeed be a forlorn hope as a forward player of such high levels would usually be known by all the top clubs and so that unicorn may not exist...

[Mutton Geoff]

What you say is correct and I am all for it if the analysts can find a player as good as our top 3 or better but who is not known that well and thus costs much less! However that may indeed be a forlorn hope as a forward player of such high levels would usually be known by all the top clubs and so that unicorn may not exist...

However that unicorn might be already here and given our front three are still relatively young we would have the time to develop this unicorn so they are ready to take over from any one of the front three, i also think next year we may be talking about a front 3 + 1 with Origi getting much more playing time than in previous seasons.

 Brewster will also get game time so we can see what he brings to the table remember Fowler was a similar age when he got his chance.

[ThePoolMan]

However that unicorn might be already here and given our front three are still relatively young we would have the time to develop this unicorn so they are ready to take over from any one of the front three, i also think next year we may be talking about a front 3 + 1 with Origi getting much more playing time than in previous seasons.

 Brewster will also get game time so we can see what he brings to the table remember Fowler was a similar age when he got his chance.

Fowler was a very rare gem of a player though...

If he achieves his potential, he may reach the first choice level in maybe 2 years time. But there will be a drop off in performance if he is expected to lead the line next season should any or more of the 3 are injured due to Brewster's inexperience and rawness. Origi meanwhile did exceptionally well as a supersub for us this run in but to expect him to reproduce that again - I wouldnt be too confident of that...

That is why I suggest signing a top class forward like Mbappe or O. Dembele now who is also younger than the existing 3 because when any of the 3 start dropping off in their levels as they get older, the new signing can replace them.

[Jon2lfc]

Henry didn’t think much of this arrangement. When Suarez decided it was time to move in the summer of 2013, his preferred destination was Arsenal. Liverpool didn’t want to lose Suarez—especially not to a Premier League rival—but there was one minor catch. His contract contained a release clause that stipulated he was free to leave if any club bid more than £40 million. Which made it rather awkward when Arsenal submitted an offer for Suarez in July for exactly £40,000,001.

By the terms of his contract, Suarez was free to leave Anfield. But, back then, Henry was still convinced he could change the way these games were played. So he took a leaf out of the players’ manual.

“What we’ve found is that contracts don’t seem to mean a lot in England—actually, in world football,” Henry later explained. “Since apparently these contracts don’t seem to hold, we took the position that we’re just not selling.”

I still don't understand this about footy contracts..
If the contract said he was free to leave, then how could we block it just by saying No    ?

[JackWard33]

I still don't understand this about footy contracts..
If the contract said he was free to leave, then how could we block it just by saying No    ?

we banked on not being sued and we weren't. if people don't abide by the ethical implications of them contracts aren't worth anything unless someone looks to legally enforce them

[exiledinyorkshire]

I can't see that with Ferguson in the way you're suggesting. The 'golden generation' that came through was a one time freak of nature (its never happened at any club since - maybe with the exception of Barca) ... after that he invested in youth sure if you count players like Ronaldo and Rooney the most in demand/expensive young players in european football.
They were constantly buying at the top of the market during his time 

Ajax have achieved this on a almost continuous basis. I know the league is much weaker, but they do produce consistently good top quality players, and in gluts. This latest lot being a good example.

[Jon2lfc]

we banked on not being sued and we weren't. if people don't abide by the ethical implications of them contracts aren't worth anything unless someone looks to legally enforce them

Thanks for the insight.

So does this mean - putting allegiances to the side - we, or should we say Henry, acted unethically, by refusing to sell?
He was effectively going against a contract clause which was bound by English Law?

[JackWard33]

Thanks for the insight.

So does this mean - putting allegiances to the side - we, or should we say Henry, acted unethically, by refusing to sell?
He was effectively going against a contract clause which was bound by English Law?

I mean........... let’s say it’s sketchy - depends on your ‘ethics’ I guess
But you don’t get to be a billionaire unless you’re prepared to do things in you and your businesses self interest that other people wouldn’t so we can agree he’s not a saint - the quotes from afterwards were pretty unethical by most people’s standards (Torres ignored his contract so contracts don’t matter is pretty mental)

Ultimately Suarez backed down and worked for them for another year presumably after promises were made to hm so it becomes a dispute that got resolved rather than a moral/legal fight

[Eeyore]

Thanks for the insight.

So does this mean - putting allegiances to the side - we, or should we say Henry, acted unethically, by refusing to sell?
He was effectively going against a contract clause which was bound by English Law?

I don't really think you can bring ethics in to it because Arsenal should not of been made aware of the clause in the first place.

[Dim Glas]

I don't really think you can bring ethics in to it because Arsenal should not of been made aware of the clause in the first place.

there wasn't a clause according to reports today, in some interview with the then Arsenal transfer 'chief' did. Confirming that the over 40 mill thing was a right to discuss a transfer. Not a buy out.

[Jookie]

City will certainly be spending bid this window and trying to increase their quality advantage - shouldnt we do the same?

They've lost Kompany and D.Silva/Fernandinho/Aguero are another year into their 30's. There's a few Q marks about City's key players.

I know it swings both ways and could have KdB back fully fit and their new signings may be amazing (or they may be poor).

But City do have a few more key players entering the latter stages of their careers than us. That might give us a chance. We have a good number of players who can improve due to age (TAA, Gomez, Brewster), improve due to settling in (Fabinho, Keita, Shaqiri), improve due to improved availability (AOC, Lallana) or have performed better in previous seasons so may take that step up again (Firmino, Lovren).

I think it's hard to say how this will all pan out next season. Too many variable to know. What I would say is that recruitment isn't the only way to improve your squad. Anyone suggesting that this is the case is wrong in my opinion.

[Jookie]

And I know people complain about the ARE, but really we got an extra 9,000 seats at a very reasonable price, and I'd rather prioritise squad investment for the coming season; pay off some more of the Main Stand and we can look to next summer on expanding further.  We need to keep up with City, and can't afford to stand still.

Completely disagree with this.

Investment in the ground and making sure we have the capacity to alleviate the current ticketing issues, whilst capitalising on our current standing, seems pretty important to me. I'd imagine it's the same for anyone who struggles to get tickets for themselves or their kids.

Personally I think we should be able to do both. Klopp is choosing not to buy at the moment. I don't think it's  a money choice. FSG are choosing not tell us whether they are investing in ground expansion or not. Maybe they are revising plans to increase capacity to 65k. Maybe they are planning on doing nothing.

If it was down to choice of ARE versus another front 3 player for 60M then I'd choose the ARE every day of the week. Can understand if it's not because you don't go the game or have yourself boxed off with a ST though.

[CraigDS]

I don't really think you can bring ethics in to it because Arsenal should not of been made aware of the clause in the first place.

What’s the point of a clause if no one can be told about it?

[afc tukrish]

What’s the point of a clause if no one can be told about it?

Just beclause, really...

[farawayred]

there wasn't a clause according to reports today, in some interview with the then Arsenal transfer 'chief' did. Confirming that the over 40 mill thing was a right to discuss a transfer. Not a buy out.

Not set in stone, it was a matter of interpretation and enforcement. John Henry himself said that the contracts in England mean jack squat, so he held his cool.

Buy out clauses have weight only in Spain.

[CraigDS]

Not set in stone, it was a matter of interpretation and enforcement. John Henry himself said that the contracts in England mean jack squat, so he held his cool.

Buy out clauses have weight only in Spain.

If the clause is not ambiguously worded then they carry as my weight here as they do in Spain.

If there was a clause then it was clears not worded all that well and open to interpretation.

[Mutton Geoff]

We do have a quality advantage. Lets not forget we invested in two top quality midfielders last season and in Keita we have still to see his consistent best form.

People as usual are getting scared because of some shiny new toy whilst they want us to write off our shiny new toys. Keita didnt do it consistently so lets buy yet another midfielder and push him down the list so we can boast aboyt a new signing.

If they were both on the market, would you have Ndombele over Keita.

I fully agree with this post

[Red Beret]

Completely disagree with this.

Investment in the ground and making sure we have the capacity to alleviate the current ticketing issues, whilst capitalising on our current standing, seems pretty important to me. I'd imagine it's the same for anyone who struggles to get tickets for themselves or their kids.

Personally I think we should be able to do both. Klopp is choosing not to buy at the moment. I don't think it's  a money choice. FSG are choosing not tell us whether they are investing in ground expansion or not. Maybe they are revising plans to increase capacity to 65k. Maybe they are planning on doing nothing.

If it was down to choice of ARE versus another front 3 player for 60M then I'd choose the ARE every day of the week. Can understand if it's not because you don't go the game or have yourself boxed off with a ST though.

I don't go to the game but really wish I could; I realise tickets are very difficult to come by though, so I prefer to prioritise us winning games over getting to them.

I don't know if we can invest heavily in the squad and upgrade the ARE at the same time; I've yet to see evidence that we can do both.  That said, I'm not talking about us breaking the bank again; I just don't want FSG to make the mistake of assuming a settled side with top players wont benefit from having additional quality. 

City can and will spend a shed load; and I'm not saying it will make them better as we all know players take time to settle.  But we shouldn't rest on our laurels and so need to maintain squad investment.

We are Champions of Europe.  There should be any number of players out there who would jump at the chance to play for us and it's something we can take advantage of - if the right players are out there of course.

[ianburns252]

Completely disagree with this.

Investment in the ground and making sure we have the capacity to alleviate the current ticketing issues, whilst capitalising on our current standing, seems pretty important to me. I'd imagine it's the same for anyone who struggles to get tickets for themselves or their kids.

Personally I think we should be able to do both. Klopp is choosing not to buy at the moment. I don't think it's  a money choice. FSG are choosing not tell us whether they are investing in ground expansion or not. Maybe they are revising plans to increase capacity to 65k. Maybe they are planning on doing nothing.

If it was down to choice of ARE versus another front 3 player for 60M then I'd choose the ARE every day of the week. Can understand if it's not because you don't go the game or have yourself boxed off with a ST though.

I agree with you, in principle, that ARE should be a priority and that there are no indications that they cannot "afford" to redevelop it. What I would say though is that I would not be surprised if they have held off for any/all of the following:

1) Brexit uncertainty - how will this affect both prices of materials (imported steel for example) and also people's ability to afford tickets (this would lead to a sub-topic over ticket prices and how little, relative to our other income they are so why not change the pricing to be affordable - whatever that means as it is different for everyone)

2) Council negotiations regarding expansion and future - how much can we expand to now, can we expand further in future with minimal trouble, current and future transport link planning, do we build a tunnel over AR or does that road effectively go

3) Availability of working capital - we are not particularly cash rich, judging by the last accounts, although significantly higher cash balance than in 2017. T Debtors is £60m higher but we lose most of that income to the increased T Creds. Bank O/draft and loans are down c. £30m though so it shows we are doing something right. To finance this, we are probably looking at a similar loan to what was taken for the main stand with FSG loaning the money at a low interest rate - see Brexit effects on bank interest rates as there can be issues if loans are provided by related parties and not at a market rate. The fact is that there was some backlash by people when the first accounts post Main Stand came out showing that they were charging interest, although that may have been confined to places like here and not actually fed back to them. We also don't know if they are in a position to loan the money (although I have no doubt they are).

4) Spurs and their stadium - they have seen that Spurs had a nightmare with theirs and the spiralling costs may have left them a bit nervous and wanting to see that the construction industry is settled and that Spurs was a one off.

That all said, I believe Peter McGurk wrote a while back in the stadium thread that the current planning permission (or something to that effect) expired in September of this year so I would think we will hear something soon. I think they are probably overcautious, relative to what we want as fans, but odds are that they will come good on the ARE sooner than later.