Author Topic: Formula One - The 2023 Season  (Read 88931 times)

Offline cormorant

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #440 on: March 19, 2023, 07:27:13 pm »
It involves a flex capacitor and a robotic arm and mysterious computer chip found in a factory in 1984.

Yawn.

It was a flux capacitor, but hey ho.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2023, 07:31:17 pm by cormorant »
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Offline El Lobo

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #441 on: March 19, 2023, 07:28:10 pm »
All a bit boring without Linudden losing his shit
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline naYoRHa2b

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #442 on: March 19, 2023, 07:29:21 pm »
...no doubt that mercedes have gone down a troublesome development route. Their philosophy looks totally flawed.


A very sensible and appreciated reply. Any ideas WLR on how they're doing it? I'm not asking for the whole kit and caboodle. A bit of a best guesstimate?

No idea and I'm surprised when given the opportunity to ask Wolff or even James Vowles who they went to a few times today haven't been asked because clearly it's so much more efficient than what's on any other car. Surely it would be insightful to hear fom the experts even if it's purely guesswork. Brundle alluded to it a few times so it's not like they aren't aware of it.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2023, 07:32:00 pm by naYoRHa2b »

Offline voodoo ray

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #443 on: March 19, 2023, 07:29:22 pm »
ffs sainz making reference to 'dirty air' and the old cars.

that had better only be track dependant.

Offline cormorant

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #444 on: March 19, 2023, 07:35:27 pm »
All a bit boring without Linudden losing his shit

Would agree there. At least he knows his stuff even if I fundamentally disagree with a lot of his opinions.
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Offline Elzar

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #445 on: March 19, 2023, 07:35:45 pm »
The sky coverage is shocking by the way. Ignoring overtakes, commentators no idea what’s going on (the sainz pit thing was hilarious), showing shitty helmet cameras that you can’t see a thing on. So amateur
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #446 on: March 19, 2023, 07:40:26 pm »
...no doubt that mercedes have gone down a troublesome development route. Their philosophy looks totally flawed.


A very sensible and appreciated reply. Any ideas WLR on how they're doing it? I'm not asking for the whole kit and caboodle. A bit of a best guesstimate?



No idea, I haven’t really had time to watch any F1 other than just the races and even then missed the first 30 mins today so it’s a bit hard to draw any conclusions from so little, especially when the first two races are at very similar tracks so there’s very little to compare against. But did we ever establish why last years Red Bull was so good? Sometimes we never find out.

But the fact Aston Martin is the best of the rest suggests at least part of it being down to Mercedes and Ferrari dropping the ball as much as anything else.
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #447 on: March 19, 2023, 07:41:12 pm »
The sky coverage is shocking by the way. Ignoring overtakes, commentators no idea what’s going on (the sainz pit thing was hilarious), showing shitty helmet cameras that you can’t see a thing on. So amateur

you can blame them for the commentary but again, for the coverage they use the same world feed as everyone else.

basically if you can see the f1 tv graphics and/or the f1 logo on the screen it's not sky's issue.


Offline naYoRHa2b

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #448 on: March 19, 2023, 07:48:05 pm »
Bernie Collins was probably the only positive thing from the weekend.

Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #449 on: March 19, 2023, 07:52:00 pm »
Bernie Collins was probably the only positive thing from the weekend.
I mentioned her earlier, think she’s got a fascinating insight into the tactics and strategies.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2023, 08:02:23 pm by Funky_Gibbons »
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Offline voodoo ray

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #450 on: March 19, 2023, 07:56:54 pm »
yeah more of her less of damon hill. former champion or not I've never found him any good at either punditing or commentary.

Offline sminp

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #451 on: March 19, 2023, 08:19:18 pm »
Good weekend for Merc first with Toto saying they’ve found some decent improvements that they weren’t expecting and now the 3/5. I still think it’s a 3 way battle for 2nd and that the Merc is nowhere near as bad as was being made out. The evidence is bearing that out so far.
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Online bradders1011

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #452 on: March 19, 2023, 08:54:43 pm »
+1 for Bernie Collins, fantastic insight.

Thing is, this could be an amazing circuit for an endurance race or a wingless series. Imagine classic Formula Fords drifting through the endless curves. But for F1, it's abysmal and exists purely for the Saudi government and military to cosplay and sportswash. A hundred million square miles of empty desert to give Tilke a blank sheet and they make a crap version of Surfer's Paradise.

Still, I bet there were some monumental arms deals made in the Paddock Club.
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Offline iamnant

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #453 on: March 19, 2023, 09:24:20 pm »
+1 for Bernie Collins, fantastic insight.

Thing is, this could be an amazing circuit for an endurance race or a wingless series. Imagine classic Formula Fords drifting through the endless curves. But for F1, it's abysmal and exists purely for the Saudi government and military to cosplay and sportswash. A hundred million square miles of empty desert to give Tilke a blank sheet and they make a crap version of Surfer's Paradise.

Still, I bet there were some monumental arms deals made in the Paddock Club.
Precisely.

And it being a track Ted seems to be boycotting, it also means that the coverage is shite without him (another +1 for Collins though, she was really interesting).
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Offline gazzalfc

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #454 on: March 19, 2023, 09:38:52 pm »
Looks like Aston managed to appeal the Alonso penalty and they managed to keep their podium

Offline El Lobo

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #455 on: March 19, 2023, 10:19:05 pm »
Good weekend for Merc first with Toto saying they’ve found some decent improvements that they weren’t expecting and now the 3/5. I still think it’s a 3 way battle for 2nd and that the Merc is nowhere near as bad as was being made out. The evidence is bearing that out so far.

It’s reliable and they’ve got two top drivers, that’s about it.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline Samio

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #456 on: March 20, 2023, 07:59:13 am »
Looks like Aston managed to appeal the Alonso penalty and they managed to keep their podium

Shitshow really.

With Alonso celebrating the podium. Then George getting his hands on the podium, and the trophy. Then having to give it back again.

Offline Romford_Red

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #457 on: March 20, 2023, 12:06:50 pm »
Yesterday's race was the first I've seen this season.

I had heard about Merc being really shit. What I saw was less them being shit and just RB looking a cut above everyone else. Why the Merc panic? Like I get they want to compete with RB but it seems less like they are shit and more like RB are simply a step ahead of everyone else and if you removed them, Merc would be fighting with with a couple of teams, like racing should be.

Am I missing something?

Offline IgorBobbins

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #458 on: March 20, 2023, 12:18:33 pm »
Yesterday's race was the first I've seen this season.

I had heard about Merc being really shit. What I saw was less them being shit and just RB looking a cut above everyone else. Why the Merc panic? Like I get they want to compete with RB but it seems less like they are shit and more like RB are simply a step ahead of everyone else and if you removed them, Merc would be fighting with with a couple of teams, like racing should be.

Am I missing something?

But that’s the thing - in F1, you always compare yourself to the benchmark (in this case Red Bull). And as you say, they are light years away from them.  For a huge team, so used to success (8 championships in a row, was it?), being so much slower than the benchmark is embarrassing, hence the “panic”.  It’s also embarrassing that a Merc customer team (Aston Martin) are quicker than them.

Offline El Lobo

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #459 on: March 20, 2023, 12:43:08 pm »
Yesterday's race was the first I've seen this season.

I had heard about Merc being really shit. What I saw was less them being shit and just RB looking a cut above everyone else. Why the Merc panic? Like I get they want to compete with RB but it seems less like they are shit and more like RB are simply a step ahead of everyone else and if you removed them, Merc would be fighting with with a couple of teams, like racing should be.

Am I missing something?

I guess because they've won the drivers and constructors so often in the last decade, its a much much bigger drop off and more noticable. People are used to Ferrari not competing but Mercedes being at least a second off another car is pretty unheard of (well, until last season) and there was an expectation they'd maybe get their shit together for this season and it looks even worse. They've already talked about getting the car wrong (again), Lewis moaning that they didnt listen to him, Toto talking about Hamilton potentially having to move teams if he wants to be competitive. So all a bit of a shitshow.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline Romford_Red

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #460 on: March 20, 2023, 01:11:55 pm »
But that’s the thing - in F1, you always compare yourself to the benchmark (in this case Red Bull). And as you say, they are light years away from them.  For a huge team, so used to success (8 championships in a row, was it?), being so much slower than the benchmark is embarrassing, hence the “panic”.  It’s also embarrassing that a Merc customer team (Aston Martin) are quicker than them.

I guess because they've won the drivers and constructors so often in the last decade, its a much much bigger drop off and more noticable. People are used to Ferrari not competing but Mercedes being at least a second off another car is pretty unheard of (well, until last season) and there was an expectation they'd maybe get their shit together for this season and it looks even worse. They've already talked about getting the car wrong (again), Lewis moaning that they didnt listen to him, Toto talking about Hamilton potentially having to move teams if he wants to be competitive. So all a bit of a shitshow.

Yeah I get that stuff (though didn't realise the Aston stuff). Obviously they won't but I personally just see that as normal. A rules refresh often does these sort of things and it is rare that one off season is enough for a team to claw back a deficit. I mean what RB are doing, lead wise, doesn't really seem any different to me to how Merc just destroyed everyone in the first few seasons of the hybrid era.

Offline Graeme

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #461 on: March 20, 2023, 03:46:24 pm »
Verstappen and Checo isn’t gonna end well is it. I hadn’t seen any post-race stuff as we’re away at the minute but have seen clips of Checo speaking with Max after the race about their pace and the fastest lap, and also Jos absolutely blanking Checo whilst he was congratulated by his mechanics.

I absolutely respect Max’s driving ability. Nobody can turn near back of the grid starts to podiums with ease like he does, by my god he’s an absolute prick and so is his dad.

Offline paulrazor

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #462 on: March 20, 2023, 03:49:48 pm »
yep, they really are so unlikeable

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Offline naYoRHa2b

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #463 on: March 20, 2023, 03:51:28 pm »
I agree Graeme.

I actually think Max thought he could win the race by means of checo moving over/slowing down once the safety car had come out it changed his perception of how he thought the race was going to pan out. Him and his dad can fuck off with that shit, checo was there by merit, not his fault there was an issue on the car the day before.

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #464 on: March 20, 2023, 03:51:56 pm »
Verstappen and Checo isn’t gonna end well is it. I hadn’t seen any post-race stuff as we’re away at the minute but have seen clips of Checo speaking with Max after the race about their pace and the fastest lap, and also Jos absolutely blanking Checo whilst he was congratulated by his mechanics.

I absolutely respect Max’s driving ability. Nobody can turn near back of the grid starts to podiums with ease like he does, by my god he’s an absolute prick and so is his dad.
Well we do need to have some sort of drama this season ;D

When Max talks about his Dad and his upbringing it really makes you realise how much of an absolute c*nt Jos really was to him, and that's from Max barely scratching the surface I'd imagine.
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Offline naYoRHa2b

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #465 on: March 20, 2023, 07:45:31 pm »
...no doubt that mercedes have gone down a troublesome development route. Their philosophy looks totally flawed.


A very sensible and appreciated reply. Any ideas WLR on how they're doing it? I'm not asking for the whole kit and caboodle. A bit of a best guesstimate?

Here's a good breakdown by scarbs on twitter about how drs can vary

https://twitter.com/ScarbsTech/status/1637892099142983692?t=NIzAdtTRDdF6o2iJFZ149w&s=19

Offline cormorant

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #466 on: March 20, 2023, 08:35:35 pm »
Here's a good breakdown by scarbs on twitter about how drs can vary

https://twitter.com/ScarbsTech/status/1637892099142983692?t=NIzAdtTRDdF6o2iJFZ149w&s=19

That is very much appreciated.

The 1s or so gap between Red Bull and the rest of the field is a distinct outlier. For those posters who questioned my intensions yesterday, it was really to point out the huge gap. Practically unprecedented. When it comes down to that sort of time difference, there's usually shenanigans going on.

To me, it's fairly clear that there's something going on at the rear of the red bull that sets them apart. Obviously aero is a huge difference but I was wondering if there might be a link between that and their gearbox/power-train reliability gremlins. Adrian Newey is an absolute genius and no other team out there has anything close to that advantage. Still wouldn't be surprised if they're not bending the rules in some way.

I find this sort of thing fascinating and part of why I enjoy F1 so much...
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Offline Dave McCoy

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #467 on: March 20, 2023, 09:23:49 pm »
If it's Checo wining instead of Max then I can live with this season being a Red Bull procession assuming we get some decent midfield battles. Still doesn't excuse Mercedes getting it this wrong and Ferrari somehow getting worse. Also wtf is McLaren doing? Comical.

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #468 on: March 21, 2023, 07:30:19 am »
Wy does Jos Verstappen act like he's billy big bollocks? He was absolutely turbo shite as a driver and he's just piggybacking his son's glory
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #469 on: March 21, 2023, 08:13:04 am »
Wy does Jos Verstappen act like he's billy big bollocks? He was absolutely turbo shite as a driver and he's just piggybacking his son's glory
He was merely Schumacher's lapdog while at Benneton. Clearly living his life through his son.

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #470 on: March 21, 2023, 08:28:48 am »
Jos had potential and speed but yeah, he isnt in Max's league and for most of his career was bang average
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #471 on: March 21, 2023, 09:18:43 am »
Think you're being a bit harsh. Who could forget the 2000 Italian GP when he dragged that Arrows to 4th place, amidst the likes of Ralf Schumacher, Alex Wurz and Ricardo Zonta.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline voodoo ray

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #472 on: March 21, 2023, 10:50:45 am »
The only memorable thing jos the not boss ever did in F1 was catch fire.

Offline paulrazor

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #473 on: March 21, 2023, 11:18:10 am »
undoubtedly that is the biggest memory of his time in f1

To be fair there was times he punched above his weight, i think if he got into a Jordan or Ligier in mid 90s he could have built a decent career.

There was promise but very stop start.

1994, two seperate stints with Benetton, couple of podiums but erratic, to be fair that car was violently twitchy, plus the team geared purely towards Schumacher although that wasnt a bad thing from a Benetton point of view

1995, promising start with Simtek, very underfunded team that ended up withdrawing from the championship after only a few races that season, he was running 6th at one point in Argentina which was a pretty mega achievement

1996, against a promising start with an underfunded team, Brazil he gained loads of places early on and even set some fastest laps, Argentina he scored a point but then the team seemed to abandon work and concentrate on 1997 early on following a buy out from TWR

I think by 1997 and 1998 with Tyrrell and Stewart he had missed the boat, proven further by 1999 when had a real good opportunity to join Jordan when Damon Hill was supposed to leave, however it was probably quite telling a half arsed under motivated Hill was 2 seconds quicker than him at the test

Rest of his career was just meh after that apart from the odd drive here and there (Malaysia 2001 he was flying in the rain)

I think he did have promise but the constant stop start beginning to his f1 career lost momentum and then he was just lost in the shuffle

He was never going to be anywhere as good as his son anyway
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #474 on: March 21, 2023, 02:24:23 pm »
Will never forgive him for shunting JPM off in Brazil in '01 after his move on Schumacher.
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #475 on: March 21, 2023, 02:30:41 pm »
Will never forgive him for shunting JPM off in Brazil in '01 after his move on Schumacher.
funny enough i was only watching that this morning

clumsy bastard
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #476 on: March 21, 2023, 04:21:09 pm »
Wy does Jos Verstappen act like he's billy big bollocks? He was absolutely turbo shite as a driver and he's just piggybacking his son's glory
Normally aspirated shite in his case!
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Offline Ray K

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #477 on: March 21, 2023, 04:42:53 pm »
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Mentions of Jos Verstappen catching on fire reminds me of the greatest F1 opening credits ever. It makes me sick to see how far we done fell, as Bunk once said.
"We have to change from doubters to believers"

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Offline Qston

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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #478 on: March 21, 2023, 04:50:09 pm »
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Mentions of Jos Verstappen catching on fire reminds me of the greatest F1 opening credits ever. It makes me sick to see how far we done fell, as Bunk once said.

The Chain.

It just is F1 as far as I am concerned
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Re: Formula One - The 2023 Season
« Reply #479 on: March 21, 2023, 05:58:15 pm »
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Mentions of Jos Verstappen catching on fire reminds me of the greatest F1 opening credits ever. It makes me sick to see how far we done fell, as Bunk once said.
Superb. Love the Eau Rouge shot