Topic: VAR! Video Assistant Referee & Shite Referees in General

[oojason]

Brighton penalty shout vs Manchester United on 55' (nothing given) - https://clip.dubz.co/v/4qr7p0 & https://gfycat.com/colossaljointgoshawk




Salford born Paul Tierney is the referee. VAR is John Brooks.



Manchester United [1] - 2 Brighton; Alexis Mac Allister own-goal 68' - https://gfycat.com/somedentalcanvasback & https://gfycat.com/pleasingappropriategoldfish

^ handball from the goalscorer? (the ball rolled down his arm?) Maguire also offside? - who then challenged for the ball on the line...




^ a smoother video with clearer footage of the handball - https://twitter.com/SkySportsPL/status/1556286551449079808

[Tonyh8su]

Hahaha of course they’ve given that. There’s about 4 different reason to chalk to off but it’s Erik’s first game at home innit?

[rob1966]

VAR will never work while the blatant cheating from officials is allowed to continue.

[BoRed]

Same old shit var 

"Deliberately stopped running, no penalty."

[Ghost Town]

Establishment club

[rob1966]

"Deliberately stopped running, no penalty."

Welbeck runs 6 yards before diving - its v Liverpool so its a pen.

[BoRed]

Welbeck runs 6 yards before diving - its v Liverpool so its a pen.

This was more Jota at Spurs. Same ref, too.

[HomesickRed]

"Deliberately stopped running, no penalty."

Isn't deliberately changing direction what good footballers are meant to do?
Nailed on penalty, as they said in commentary.
Handball too, but who cares now? Even with VAR on their side they lost 🤣😂🤣

[Andy @ Allerton!]

The only way you'll fix VAR or the 'refereeing' in this country is to have open and honest reviews.

I have no problem with any official making a mistake. It's when it's always the same officials fucking over some teams and favouring others that annoys.

If they make a massive fuck up (I'd say the obvious red card, blatent penno and obvious offside/handball for the goal today all qualify) - then there should be some sort of visible action taken.

The penalty against us yesterday was soft to say the least and I've still to see any visible contact. The penno against Everton was equally weird. Giving the goal when Hendo was stood on was bizarre.

And yet nothing is said, nothing is done and you know as soon as your team face a certain set of officials, you're likely fucked before you kick a ball. That's not really on is it.

[Adeemo]

Probably not quite the correct thread but near enough, anyone else getting absolutely pissed off at how the final minutes of matches are being allowed to play out? You barely see any passages of play put together, due to the team that’s leading simply throwing themselves to floor and being gifted a freekick they didn’t deserve, before taking an age to restart play. That’s without mentioning players going down, feigning injury and subs coming on, with the players going off being allowed to take an age to leave the pitch. The refs who are giving these non existent fouls and then not adding anywhere near enough time on are absolute mugs, do they not realise that they’re letting players take the piss out of both them and the fans? Running down the clock has always gone on but it’s never been as bad as it is these days.

[El Lobo]

I mean yeah but also…not really. Time wasting legally is a fine art, Brighton did it well today, Real did it annoyingly well in the CL Final but then look…we did it well against Barca and other games. It’s the time wasting early which needs cutting out, the Fulham keeper yesterday had it in his hands for over twenty seconds twice in the first five minutes.

[Adeemo]

Not for me, it seems that bad now that refs seem to actually be indulging the team that’s time wasting.

[Dave McCoy]

Not a single VAR overturn the whole weekend. That seems rather implausible to say the least.

[Red-Soldier]

Not a single VAR overturn the whole weekend. That seems rather implausible to say the least.

Many things are implausible when it comes to top-level footie.

[MonsLibpool]

Probably not quite the correct thread but near enough, anyone else getting absolutely pissed off at how the final minutes of matches are being allowed to play out? You barely see any passages of play put together, due to the team that’s leading simply throwing themselves to floor and being gifted a freekick they didn’t deserve, before taking an age to restart play. That’s without mentioning players going down, feigning injury and subs coming on, with the players going off being allowed to take an age to leave the pitch. The refs who are giving these non existent fouls and then not adding anywhere near enough time on are absolute mugs, do they not realise that they’re letting players take the piss out of both them and the fans? Running down the clock has always gone on but it’s never been as bad as it is these days.

It pisses me off when it happens to us. Imagine the other team eating up 2 minutes to make subs, roll on the floor, e.t.c without the ref adding a second back.

I reckon a stop clock would be better.

[El Lobo]

I suspect this is now 'Look how good we are as refs, we dont even have to use VAR' with the new regime, man.

Its staggering how one of the biggest sports in the world has such a group of unqualified, spiteful men essentially dominating it.

[Fromola]

Going to be another one of those seasons for us with decisions. The transition from one Fergie stooge to another: Riley to Webb, the SYP bizzie.

[The G in Gerrard]

https://youtu.be/6bbv5Af8BhU

What's this raising the bar nonsense Dermott is on about? Warnock is right. It's nothing to do with first day of the season.

[Dr Stu-Pid]

If Dermot Gallagher thinks you got it wrong then my god you must have got it wrong.

This is where PGMOL should act.  Come out with a statement saying that VAR got it wrong and that the decision should have been overturned, otherwise you are essentially setting the bar so high for an overturn that there basically shouldn't be any this season.

We've said it before, but one of the fundamental problems with VAR is that the VAR can only send the referee to the monitor if they are recommending a decision be overturned, and then the decision will be overturned 99.9% of the time.  They need to introduce another 'level' of review where the VAR says that he thinks that the decision may be incorrect but the referee still has the final call.  There you'd still expect the referee to overturn it most times, but maybe 20- 30% of the time they stick with their original decision.

The irony of course is that they don't want to undermine the referees, but instead the referees just look even more incompetent.  If the ref sees that again on video he gives the penalty instantly.  No one expects referees to get every call right first time, just as long as they get the big calls right if they get a second chance.  So for god's sake give them that chance!

I also think that the referee in our game at the weekend is probably looking at the incident on replays that evening and thinking that he's been conned by Mitrovic and almost certainly wouldn't have given it if he had the chance to see the replays again first.  Surely that must frustrate the referees themselves?

[Fromola]

Going to be another one of those seasons for us with decisions. The transition from one Fergie stooge to another: Riley to Webb, the SYP bizzie.

Tierney in charge for the Palace game 

No doubt Anthony 'Altrincham fan' Taylor will get the United game as usual and then Coote or Kavanagh for the derby.

[redgriffin73]

Tierney in charge for the Palace game 

No doubt Anthony 'Altrincham fan' Taylor will get the United game as usual and then Coote or Kavanagh for the derby.

God we seem to have a rota of the same 4 or so refs/var every fucking game.

[John C]

https://youtu.be/6bbv5Af8BhU

What's this raising the bar nonsense Dermott is on about? Warnock is right. It's nothing to do with first day of the season.

Exactly. Although we can say they'll be raising the bar if they get some decisions right. I haven't a clue how they can still get such obvious errors wrong. A shit-show from day 1 of a new season.

[red_Mark1980]

It just seems that they'll hide behind this "high bar" stuff now.

It's again so wooly and down to interpretation that it masks the weekly mistakes made.

There's zero consistency and personally the game would be better without it.

Like how the "high bar" doesn't apply to offsides. It's absolutely fine to not give an offside, but VAR shows he was offside by a gnats Pube, but that's sound as the high bar level doesn't matter for offside.

A billion pound sport and it's officiated by ex bizzies and the like who'll never admit a mistake.

[The G in Gerrard]

I saw clip of Watford game last night. Penalty was given for a very similar situation as to the Brighton one.

[The G in Gerrard]

Exactly. Although we can say they'll be raising the bar if they get some decisions right. I haven't a clue how they can still get such obvious errors wrong. A shit-show from day 1 of a new season.

Yep. It's not like there's a bedding in period of VAR now. It's been there to use for a while. Fundamentally things cannot change when people in charge of it are not consistent or follow the rules.

[KillieRed]

Not for me, it seems that bad now that refs seem to actually be indulging the team that’s time wasting.

They need to stop the watch when substitutions are made, those are by far the longest breaks of timewasting. It`s easily controllable.

[Agent99]

VAR was seemingly brought in so referees can justify poor decisions instead of getting them right.

[Learpholl]

Referees not adding on more time when there is blatant time wasting in the already allotted time is something that really does annoy me because it's usually not subjective, it's a fact. Take the City v Villa game at the end of last season. Two City players were down between the 90th and 92nd minute. I don't think the ball was in play at any stage of that period. The best referee in the league Michael Oliver was in charge and I was shocked that he blew up on 94 without adding anything else on. I was furious.

There were 5 substitutes from the 90th minute onwards in the Man United - Brighton match, 40 seconds added over the additional minutes given. Obviously I wanted United to lose but I was also annoyed that yet again the timekeeping was a disgrace.

I don't think a stop-clock is the answer but I do think it wouldn't be difficult to have someone else keep the time. Referees have enough on their plates, whilst they should remember when to stop their watch there must be occasions where they forget and then end up just making up a number.

[Ghost Town]

Referees not adding on more time when there is blatant time wasting in the already allotted time is something that really does annoy me because it's usually not subjective, it's a fact. Take the City v Villa game at the end of last season. Two City players were down between the 90th and 92nd minute. I don't think the ball was in play at any stage of that period. The best referee in the league Michael Oliver was in charge and I was shocked that he blew up on 94 without adding anything else on. I was furious.

There were 5 substitutes from the 90th minute onwards in the Man United - Brighton match, 40 seconds added over the additional minutes given. Obviously I wanted United to lose but I was also annoyed that yet again the timekeeping was a disgrace.

I don't think a stop-clock is the answer but I do think it wouldn't be difficult to have someone else keep the time. Referees have enough on their plates, whilst they should remember when to stop their watch there must be occasions where they forget and then end up just making up a number.

They don't base it on stopping their watch. Not at all. The two watches are a stage prop. They just base it on a 'feel' for how long they think is appropriate, given the half just past if it's at half time, or the whole game if it's full time.

They also base it partly on narrative. If one side is really going for a win they tend to add a minute or two more than if the game is largely over and the result beyond doubt.

There's no official requirement for accurate time-keeping in the laws of the game beyond the compulsory minimum 45 mins per half

[Statto Red]

This is why, football should be like Rugby, with a timekeeper in the stands, & you can see the official clock on TV screen & in the stadium too, non of this where did 5 minutes came from, & you can see if the timekeeper stops the clock on any stoppages too.

[4pool]

FWIW..it was Mike Dean on VAR for the Chelsea v Spurs match.

Hair pulling not violent conduct apparently.

[MBL?]

FWIW..it was Mike Dean on VAR for the Chelsea v Spurs match.

Hair pulling not violent conduct apparently.

Couldn't believe nothing came from that and that the coms didn’t care either. I’m happy with the draw but how is that not a free out and yellow card at least?

[Americano12345]

Couldn't believe nothing came from that and that the coms didn’t care either. I’m happy with the draw but how is that not a free out and yellow card at least?

that's the problem with it. it was either a red card or the VAR does nothing as they can't intervene and give a FK/yellow

[KissThisGuy]

that's the problem with it. it was either a red card or the VAR does nothing as they can't intervene and give a FK/yellow

There's an easy way around it. It's their own stubbornness that's fucking it. Near 100% of the time the ref goes to the pitchside video the ref will overturn the on pitch decision making that whole process pointless and for show alone. If the VAR just told the ref yesterday "this is debatable, come and have at look at it," the ref comes over, if he doesn't think it's a red, he gives a yellow and a free out. It still comes under the red card review.

[Tommy_W]

If VAR had decided it was violent conduct by Romero, would the corner not stilll have gone ahead anyway? As the ball wasn't in play?

[FiSh77]

If VAR had decided it was violent conduct by Romero, would the corner not stilll have gone ahead anyway? As the ball wasn't in play?

Yeah but the whole space time continuum would've been changed due to the sending off and no doubt another handbags fight on the touchline so more than likely would've played out differently

[Tommy_W]

Yeah but the whole space time continuum would've been changed due to the sending off and no doubt another handbags fight on the touchline so more than likely would've played out differently

That's true, I'd forgotten about the space time continuum!

[Elzar]

If VAR had decided it was violent conduct by Romero, would the corner not stilll have gone ahead anyway? As the ball wasn't in play?

Looked like it was in play to me, but you are right if it wasn't.

What's the rule about hair pulling, I've seen players pulled down by their necks before at corners and no red given so presumed this wouldn't warrant a red.

[lamonti]

You clearly have an agenda against Adrián. When questioned what he did wrong about the goal he conceded, you just don't answer but blame him for 20/21. You are a joke.

Alright there Adrián, time to log off.

What part of "he palmed it into his own six yard area" doesn't explain why the goal was conceded.

And, he was rubbish in 20/21, although hardly our biggest concern that season.

[lamonti]

It's fundamentally bad system that lets Romero away with what he did — whether a yellow or a red card — without punishment.

I understand that it's set up so that VAR aren't re-refereeing every incident, but that is a series, gaping loophole.

Also interesting to see they didn't call Richarlison offside. The whole question of the "keeper's view" thing is so open to completely random interpretation. It seemed like they were quite stringent on it for the last two years. We got away with one in the Alisson goal game at West Brom, and it felt like Kasper Schmeichel was appealing for a goal to be chalked off every week last year for the same thing (though he of course has never conceded a legitimate goal ever by his own reactions).

They should certainly bring in guidelines around the "line of sight" thing - distance from the keeper, distance of the shot, etc.