Topic: Match Preview: UCL QF 2nd Leg City 0 v Liverpool 3 [10 April 2018, KO 19:45 GMT]

[Red_Irishman]

Considering that we wore orange against porto, I imagine we will do the same tomorrow.

Klopp has a top on with some orange in it that's why I asked. Served us well so far.

[farawayred]

yellows are wiped off after this game.

Yes, after the game. Moreno will miss the next game if he gets booked in this game.

[Caligula?]

Wondering will Klopp have Salah on the bench and wait and see how the games pans out

Nah, fuck that. If he is fine and fit then start him and do the damage early on. It's the CL second leg quarters for fucks sake, you don't keep your best players on the bench and wait to see 'how the game pans out' even if you're 6-0 up from the first leg.

Yes, after the game. Moreno will miss the next game if he gets booked in this game.

I don't think there's any danger in him getting booked this game.

[farawayred]

Nah, fuck that. If he is fine and fit then start him and do the damage early on. It's the CL second leg quarters for fucks sake, you don't keep your best players on the bench and wait to see 'how the game pans out' even if you're 6-0 up from the first leg.

I don't think there's any danger in him getting booked this game.

We have the personnel to cope with City and to protect the 3-0 lead. The same goes for the league, we should be able to master 3 wins even without Salah (not saying we should, but we could) I'd rather make sure that he is fully fit for the CL semis.

I don't think there's any danger in him getting booked this game.

[Red_Irishman]

Mentally I'm taking the same approach to this one as the last game. If we go out, we go out. Fair play to City if they do it. We've done really well to get this far in the tournament this season I feel. As much of a collapse it would be I still think QF of the CL and top 4 again would represent some progression. Therefore I'm trying not to get worked up about it.

I just hope Salah is properly fit and we don't see him going off early due to a reoccurance. Wijnaldum done well against the Ev but he will not have half as much space or time in the midfield against City.

[S]

Anyone who thinks this is going to be straightforward hasn't watched much of Liverpool in European knockouts. One goal and it's surely out of their reach though.

[CraigDS]

We have the personnel to cope with City and to protect the 3-0 lead.

I'd hope we're looking to score a goal or two rather than just protect the 3-0 lead, otherwise it's going to be a long night.

If he's fit then Salah starts. No waiting to see how it pans out.

[JackWard33]

I know this is a case of recency bias but the 'you get lots of yellow cards you miss games' really is a stupid concept in all of football
The yellow / red card system works well to moderate player behaviour in games I don't see the need for additional penalty and I dont like anything that stops players from playing unless there's good reason

[PhaseOfPlay]

I know this is a case of recency bias but the 'you get lots of yellow cards you miss games' really is a stupid concept in all of football
The yellow / red card system works well to moderate player behaviour in games I don't see the need for additional penalty and I dont like anything that stops players from playing unless there's good reason

It's a concept that stops teams becoming out and out thugs who spend their entire time kicking people off the pitch knowing they might, at worst, get sent off in one game. Missing games after accumulating yellows acts as a deterrent for those who would abuse a system without it.

[JackWard33]

It's a concept that stops teams becoming out and out thugs who spend their entire time kicking people off the pitch knowing they might, at worst, get sent off in one game. Missing games after accumulating yellows acts as a deterrent for those who would abuse a system without it.

I get the point I just don’t agree with it

[Zoomers]

One more sleep...

[Fruity]

One more sleep...

Not sure I will

[nico 8]

I know this is a case of recency bias but the 'you get lots of yellow cards you miss games' really is a stupid concept in all of football
The yellow / red card system works well to moderate player behaviour in games I don't see the need for additional penalty and I dont like anything that stops players from playing unless there's good reason

It's a concept that stops teams becoming out and out thugs who spend their entire time kicking people off the pitch knowing they might, at worst, get sent off in one game. Missing games after accumulating yellows acts as a deterrent for those who would abuse a system without it.

I fully understand the rationale behind it and the only issue I have with the present system is that the the team in the next round benefits.
What about this idea- the first yellow carries into the 2nd leg and a a 2nd yellow is effectively a red. In that the opponent benefits from any transgression within the tie. The slate is then cleaned for the next round. This also prevents the losing team in the final minutes of going out from hacking their opponent.

Another idea is bringing the penalty shoot out to the end of 90 mins before extra time. The result is suspended pending the end of extra time. If it is still a draw, the shoot out winner wins. In this way, those who missed a penalty can redeem themselves. The biggest problem is the time delay between the shoot out and the start of extra time. Unlikely to be viable.

[PhaseOfPlay]

I fully understand the rationale behind it and the only issue I have with the present system is that the the team in the next round benefits.
What about this idea- the first yellow carries into the 2nd leg and a a 2nd yellow is effectively a red. In that the opponent benefits from any transgression within the tie. The slate is then cleaned for the next round. This also prevents the losing team in the final minutes of going out from hacking their opponent.

Another idea is bringing the penalty shoot out to the end of 90 mins before extra time. The result is suspended pending the end of extra time. If it is still a draw, the shoot out winner wins. In this way, those who missed a penalty can redeem themselves. The biggest problem is the time delay between the shoot out and the start of extra time. Unlikely to be viable.

Or lets just leave the game as it is, it's functioned pretty bloody well thus far.

[Nessy76]

I know this is a case of recency bias but the 'you get lots of yellow cards you miss games' really is a stupid concept in all of football
The yellow / red card system works well to moderate player behaviour in games I don't see the need for additional penalty and I dont like anything that stops players from playing unless there's good reason

It's not a perfect solution, but it does make some sense. I think they might look at when cards get wiped, as that's something that changes fairly frequently. Perhaps a rolling three or four match period rather than just letting them build up and then cleaning the slate. (I confess I'm not totally up to date on what the rules are right now.)

[Alan_X]

I fully understand the rationale behind it and the only issue I have with the present system is that the the team in the next round benefits.
What about this idea- the first yellow carries into the 2nd leg and a a 2nd yellow is effectively a red. In that the opponent benefits from any transgression within the tie. The slate is then cleaned for the next round. This also prevents the losing team in the final minutes of going out from hacking their opponent.

Another idea is bringing the penalty shoot out to the end of 90 mins before extra time. The result is suspended pending the end of extra time. If it is still a draw, the shoot out winner wins. In this way, those who missed a penalty can redeem themselves. The biggest problem is the time delay between the shoot out and the start of extra time. Unlikely to be viable.

First idea as something. Second idea is ridiculous.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Anyone who thinks this is going to be straightforward hasn't watched much of Liverpool in European knockouts. One goal and it's surely out of their reach though.

I don't think anyone is thinking that way as far it being straightforward.

I expect they will score 2 goals, Aguero will improve them and he always seems to score against us. having said that, I expect that we will cause them problems defensively.


We also have a bit to prove to ourselves, and I am sure Klopp will mention it, after the last visit at their ground. I am sure they are looking forward to rectifying that. Based on what VVD was saying as well, no one will be thinking that this is done or that we will defend for an entire match and try to protect the lead.

[mrantarctica]

I fully understand the rationale behind it and the only issue I have with the present system is that the the team in the next round benefits.
What about this idea- the first yellow carries into the 2nd leg and a a 2nd yellow is effectively a red. In that the opponent benefits from any transgression within the tie. The slate is then cleaned for the next round. This also prevents the losing team in the final minutes of going out from hacking their opponent.

Not sure it would really prevent this. If a team was going out, and some of their players really wanted to kick lumps out of the other team, then they are going to do that irrespective of if they get sent off or not. Another yellow card (effectively a red card in your terms if they already have a yellow card from the 1st tie) isn't going to be a deterrent because they are going out anyway (i.e. not play in the next game). Being sent off and making it harder for their team to win the game won't matter because they are going out of the cup anyway.

The opposition should benefit from teams that have ill discipline. If your team progresses through the competition by bullying other teams and persistent fouling and generally distasteful play, then there should be a deterrent to such a team progressing. The point of having good discipline is to promote teams to play good football rather than turn matches into some sort of opportunity to be thugs. Fans don't want to watch a team just batter and bruise other teams in order to progress through the world's premier club competition. They want to watch fast paced, high intensity games between top level athletes where plenty of skills are displayed and players express themselves positively through feats of athleticism, innovation, charisma and style rather than ill tempered aggression, violence, cheating and generally poor sportsmanlike conduct. In other words, that's fans want to turn up and watch Man City or Liverpool rather than say Everton or whoever else Fat Sam or Pulis happens to be coaching.

[Zlen]

I think we'll keep a clean sheet.
Said it before the last game, I feel the same about this one.

[Caligula?]

I'd hope we're looking to score a goal or two rather than just protect the 3-0 lead, otherwise it's going to be a long night.

If he's fit then Salah starts. No waiting to see how it pans out.

Absolutely. I've seen us blow enough two and three goal leads over the last couple of seasons (including this season vs. Sevilla) to casually watch us sit back and try and protect a lead against one of the best attacking sides out there. If Salah is fit he must start, and we go for the kill early on. We're more than 50% there.

Put City to the sword. Get a goal early on and they'll know they'll need 5. It'll deflate the fans and players alike. They'll start to force things. Misplace passes. Shoot from anywhere. Make rash challenges, get players booked or maybe even sent off. That has to be our game plan.

[nico 8]

Not sure it would really prevent this. If a team was going out, and some of their players really wanted to kick lumps out of the other team, then they are going to do that irrespective of if they get sent off or not. Another yellow card (effectively a red card in your terms if they already have a yellow card from the 1st tie) isn't going to be a deterrent because they are going out anyway (i.e. not play in the next game). Being sent off and making it harder for their team to win the game won't matter because they are going out of the cup anyway.

The opposition should benefit from teams that have ill discipline. If your team progresses through the competition by bullying other teams and persistent fouling and generally distasteful play, then there should be a deterrent to such a team progressing. The point of having good discipline is to promote teams to play good football rather than turn matches into some sort of opportunity to be thugs. Fans don't want to watch a team just batter and bruise other teams in order to progress through the world's premier club competition. They want to watch fast paced, high intensity games between top level athletes where plenty of skills are displayed and players express themselves positively through feats of athleticism, innovation, charisma and style rather than ill tempered aggression, violence, cheating and generally poor sportsmanlike conduct. In other words, that's fans want to turn up and watch Man City or Liverpool rather than say Everton or whoever else Fat Sam or Pulis happens to be coaching.

Point taken. I guess you mean Chelsea and not Everton.

[farawayred]

It's a concept that stops teams becoming out and out thugs who spend their entire time kicking people off the pitch knowing they might, at worst, get sent off in one game. Missing games after accumulating yellows acts as a deterrent for those who would abuse a system without it.

Good concept, but I'm with Jack disagreeing on the implementation. The teams that would suffer the consequences in the semis are probably us, Bayern, Real and Barca. You wouldn't think they are made of thugs. IMHO, this is a good concept until the round of 16, but from the quarters on that shouldn't apply.

If I recall, one of the first implementation of the idea lead to someone, a big player, missing a final, then they brought the wipeout concept at the semis. I'd bring the wipeout earlier.

[mrantarctica]

Point taken. I guess you mean Chelsea and not Everton.

Football fans alike appreciate good football. Even though Man City are our rivals, you can't help but appreciate that they have consistently played a very high level of football and are a classy team who play in an attractive way. In contrast, teams that play a dour style should be admonished or criticised roundly - particularly if they have the resources to field players of a high skill level. This is why teams like Man Utd and Chelsea get criticised.

I used Everton in order to have a dig at Everton, but in reality you're right, Chelsea or Man Utd are better examples, Everton would never qualify for the CL anyway. 

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Absolutely. I've seen us blow enough two and three goal leads over the last couple of seasons (including this season vs. Sevilla) to casually watch us sit back and try and protect a lead against one of the best attacking sides out there. If Salah is fit he must start, and we go for the kill early on. We're more than 50% there.

Put City to the sword. Get a goal early on and they'll know they'll need 5. It'll deflate the fans and players alike. They'll start to force things. Misplace passes. Shoot from anywhere. Make rash challenges, get players booked or maybe even sent off. That has to be our game plan.

Those were leads within a game, this is a lead from the first leg, these are vastly different, and because of the negative experiences, the emphasis will be to keep doing what we did in the first leg.

We aren't going to sit back casually.

[jizzspunk]

We have 90 minutes to score...this will ebb and flow...we need a disciplined positionally responsible start..we don't need an early goal..if they go 2 up then we score they still need another 3 again... patience peeps...that's why the clean sheet was massive

[Medellin]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

[JackWard33]

Good concept, but I'm with Jack disagreeing on the implementation. The teams that would suffer the consequences in the semis are probably us, Bayern, Real and Barca. You wouldn't think they are made of thugs. IMHO, this is a good concept until the round of 16, but from the quarters on that shouldn't apply.

If I recall, one of the first implementation of the idea lead to someone, a big player, missing a final, then they brought the wipeout concept at the semis. I'd bring the wipeout earlier.

Yeah this is sounds right to me. I can’t really see a fair way to do it though because the more minutes you play (the more games your team plays) the more likely you are to be banned. It’s particularly problematic given how inconsistent and arbitrarily cards are applied by referees

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Sorry for your loss mate, may he rest in peace. YNWA

[-HH-]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Sorry for your loss.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Good concept, but I'm with Jack disagreeing on the implementation. The teams that would suffer the consequences in the semis are probably us, Bayern, Real and Barca. You wouldn't think they are made of thugs. IMHO, this is a good concept until the round of 16, but from the quarters on that shouldn't apply.

If I recall, one of the first implementation of the idea lead to someone, a big player, missing a final, then they brought the wipeout concept at the semis. I'd bring the wipeout earlier.

Here's an idea - if you don't want to miss a final, don't get a yellow card. They are entirely avoidable

[PhaseOfPlay]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Sorry for your loss, mate.

[Qston]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Sorry for your loss. I am sure Jurgen and the lads won't let you or your old man down

[Solomon Grundy]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Sorry for your loss mate.

[Black Bull Nova]

There are several results that impact upon the mentality of the players going into this one.

The 4-3 at Anfield taught us two things, firstly that we can overrun City when conditions are right but also that we can never relax. I think we showed we'd learned in the first leg and good job too because it matters more in Europe. The second result was the United game at the weekend, that taught us that City can batter a decent defensive team but also that they are vulnerable on the counter. That will have put the same fear into them that the 4-3 put into us. If you add in the first leg to that all three games show that if you have a good spell, 3 goals can go down in a short spell quite easily when City are involved, at either end.

We should respect them but show no fear, we can score as easily as they can. Let's make sure they are chasing 5 or more. After all there is no team that knows more than us that when you assume 3-0 at the half way point means it's over you can get a nasty shock.

[BlackandWhitePaul]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

I'm sorry for your loss.

RIP your Dad.

[Yesitsanextender]

Theres a huge difference between a)winning a game b) needing to score a number of goals and c) to not concede a number of goals. City have all three factors to consider....we on the hand can lose, concede, draw or not need to score....the pressure is well and truly with Manchester City

[BlackandWhitePaul]

I'm looking forward to the game.

[farawayred]

Here's an idea - if you don't want to miss a final, don't get a yellow card. They are entirely avoidable

That's one school of thought. The other want to see the best teams competing with their best players. And the third is a coin toss between these two. Hopefully not the 1965 coin toss with Cologne...

[farawayred]

Superb OP to those who contributed. 

Well..where do i start,sad news when i lost me arl fella a few days before the 1st leg,he would have been 84 on the day it was played & what a birthday he must have had looking down watching.
Tomorrow he comes home & our lads (red & blue) will be with him for the game tomorrow before his send off on weds,i do hope it's one to be remembered!
He was a great red me arl fella,very knowledgeable supporter & his insight will be greatly missed.
Give it to them tomorrow redmen!
YNWA.

Condolences, mate. Hopefully he will be smiling up there in Kyiv.

[PhaseOfPlay]

That's one school of thought. The other want to see the best teams competing with their best players. And the third is a coin toss between these two. Hopefully not the 1965 coin toss with Cologne...

Then why have a contest at all? Just let Barca and Real duke it out every year.