Author Topic: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success  (Read 5605 times)

Offline koolkamal

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Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« on: February 27, 2012, 08:48:02 pm »
Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success

Posted: Monday February 27, 2012 7:03AM

Jonathan Wilson


As Cup final victories go, Liverpool's Carling Cup final success (3-2 in a penalty shootout) over Cardiff City on Sunday was particularly unconvincing. When a Premier League team plays a side from a lower division, even if it plays a team from lower down the same division, anticlimax is probably the best it can hope for; to win by a comfortable two- or three-goal margin.

When Nottingham Forest retained the trophy by beating the second-flight side in Oldham in 1990, the midfielder Steve Hodge recalls there being only exhaustion afterward, whereas the previous season, when Forest had come from behind to beat the top-flight team Luton Town, there had been raucous celebration. Liverpool would probably have welcomed such tiredness; as it was, it was forced to go through the agony of falling behind, conceding a last-minute equalizer and twice losing the initiative in the penalty competition before eventually winning through. The great performances came in the earlier rounds, against Chelsea and Manchester City.

This couldn't have been further from the image the club was presumably hoping for of a giant reasserting itself, proving that the bad times are over with a display of resonant superiority. But the thing is that it doesn't matter. That Cardiff was plucky and Liverpool blundering (although, it should be said, Liverpool still had more than enough chances to have won the game with ease) will soon be forgotten. Far more important is that Liverpool has won something for the first time in six years. That particular clock has stopped, as Arsenal must wish its counter of ignominy could have been reset with a victory over Birmingham City in the Carling Cup final last season.

Perhaps the most significant element of Liverpool's success happened in Exeter in August. Against a League Two side, Dalglish might have been expected to field a weakened side, to ease players in to the season, but his starting 11 included Pepe Reina, Martin Skrtel, Maxi Rodriguez, Raul Meireles, Charlie Adam, Jordan Henderson and Luis Suarez -- seven players who would be considered regular first-teamers, plus Andy Carroll who came off the bench after 20 minutes. Compare that to the previous season, when Roy Hodgson's side to face Northampton Town, also of League Two, in Liverpool's first appearance in the competition (having qualified for Europe, it entered at a later stage) included just Daniel Agger and Lucas Leiva -- and perhaps, if you're being generous, Sotiros Kyrgiakos and Ryan Babel -- among regular first-teamers. Hodgson's team drew 2-2 and went out on penalties.

Hodgson is far from the only manager to have rested players for the early rounds of the Carling Cup and there is a certain logic for doing so. But for Dalglish to field such a strong side sent at least one and perhaps two clear messages. Most obviously, it said the Carling Cup was a tournament worth taking seriously, generating a mood that sustained Liverpool throughout. And perhaps it also suggested to players that there is no pampered elite at Anfield, that everybody has to muck in when asked.

The neglect of the Cup competitions by so many clubs remains baffling. To an extent it's an indictment of modern soccer: remaining in the Premier League (or, at a higher level, qualification for the Champions League) offers a regular revenue stream, the logic runs, and so must be prioritized -- as it is in the bonus structures at most clubs for both players and managers. But Cup finals are special days, occasions that offer the chance of glory and memories that endure for both players and fans. I'm a Sunderland fan and I recall the 2-1 FA Cup quarterfinal replay victory over Chelsea in 1992 much more fondly than the 4-1 demolition of the same opposition in 1999-2000, the year Sunderland achieved its best finish in half a century and came seventh. Surely most people in soccer below the boardroom operate with similar priorities?

But there is an argument that goes beyond romance. Dalglish has won something. He has added something to the trophy cabinet. With Liverpool facing Stoke City in the quarterfinal of the FA Cup, he might yet add another this season and so repeat the double Gerard Houllier achieved in 2000-01 (although Houllier's side also lifted the UEFA Cup that season). But even if the FA Cup eludes Liverpool, Dalglish has done something indelible. The second-place finish Liverpool achieved in the Premier League in the 2008-09 season under Rafa Benitez was quickly forgotten amid poor results the following season, but silverware is silverware. In a sense the pressure is off: Dalglish has achieved something and Liverpool is guaranteed Europa League play next season wherever it finishes in the league.

"We deserved our first trophy in six years but we need to continue to work hard and see where it takes us," Dalglish said to reporters. "We didn't think six years ago that it would take this long to win our next trophy. We have won it, we will really enjoy it and it will give us a flavor to come back and do it again. Every member of the squad has contributed to this and worked really hard to get here. Now we need to see if we can kick on from here. I think this will inspire the players."

Liverpool only has to think back to its last appearance in a League Cup final to see how that can work. In 2005, it lost 3-2 to Chelsea to give Jose Mourinho his first trophy in English soccer. He went on to win two Premier League titles, an FA Cup and another Carling Cup over the two-and-a-half seasons that followed.

And that perhaps is where Liverpool can draw most encouragement. Winning is often described as a habit, but it is perhaps rather an attribute in itself. However gifted a side it must also have a toughness, an ability to drag itself over the line. Dalglish has always had that, both as a player and as a manager, and the way Liverpool kept going despite the missed chances, kept going despite conceding a late equalizer, didn't capitulate after missing its first two penalties is perhaps a reflection of that. And perhaps the first part of instilling that determination came in August when, by picking a strong side, he showed the competition mattered.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/jonathan_wilson/02/27/liverpool/index.html?sct=sc_t11_a1

Lot of clubs especially top clubs don't take the League Cup too seriously "Mickey Mouse Cup" and use it to give their young players some opportunity like Arsenal but I think that's the wrong attitude especially for a club that's not won anything for a long time. Winning the League Cup about midway through the season can give you that extra boost for the rest of the season and it also helps instill that winning mentality. While trying to give opportunity to young players is a good thing I'm glad Kenny has taken this seriously. Can still give opportunity to one or two but don't need to play all your young players or reserve players.
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Offline shelovesyou

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2012, 11:09:40 pm »
Cheers for that. Good article.
We were brave yesterday. We DESERVED that trophy.
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Offline shelovesyou

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2012, 11:48:13 pm »
Well, according to Monday Night Football Club, and the 'genius' Ian McGarry et al, its a nothing competition, we should of won with ease yesterday, when the reality kicks in weve drawn a match against Cardiff City.
It doesnt mean that much, and according to the 'Genius', Kenny fielded that team to justify them and himself.
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Offline Adeemo

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2012, 11:51:21 pm »
Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
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Offline shelovesyou

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2012, 11:55:58 pm »
To be fair Chapman is trying to defend us.
And McGarry has just completely contradicted himself.
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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2012, 12:24:22 am »
Lot of clubs especially top clubs don't take the League Cup too seriously "Mickey Mouse Cup" and use it to give their young players some opportunity like Arsenal but I think that's the wrong attitude especially for a club that's not won anything for a long time. Winning the League Cup about midway through the season can give you that extra boost for the rest of the season and it also helps instill that winning mentality. While trying to give opportunity to young players is a good thing I'm glad Kenny has taken this seriously. Can still give opportunity to one or two but don't need to play all your young players or reserve players.

To be fair to Arsenal, I don't think they have the squad to not play their "kids" in the League Cup while trying to be successful in the other competitions they are in. Same as with us. Top players play a shitload of games every year (league, Europe, domestic cup, internationals). So, I really believe that there are times, when you need to give them a rest. To do that, you have to prioritise the competitions you're in and if you are challenging for the title (top 4), for the FA Cup and the CL, I just think the League Cup is the least attractive and nobody will blame you for playing some weaker players in that.

Offline sinnermichael

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2012, 01:11:51 am »
Well, according to Monday Night Football Club, and the 'genius' Ian McGarry et al, its a nothing competition, we should of won with ease yesterday, when the reality kicks in weve drawn a match against Cardiff City.
It doesnt mean that much, and according to the 'Genius', Kenny fielded that team to justify them and himself.


the three twats on that show talk utter drivel, especially mcgarry. chapman pulled him up saying "you don't like liverpool do you"? and he backtracked. we shouldn't be surprised though. this is the same guy who accused rafa of being "arrogant" in the past. motson was just as bad in putting us down.

Offline DukeRed

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2012, 07:32:27 am »
Sick and tired of hearing our bitter rivals belittle this victory. It was however, expected. What I did not expect however is for our national no.1 daily here in Malaysia, print something as tasteless and classless as this!

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2012, 08:03:51 am »
Watching the players celebrate, some of whom haven't won anything before in their careers or haven't won anything in England - you could see how much they enjoyed it. You listen to people like Jose Enrique talk about how he didn't realise the feeling he would get from winning a trophy. These are the players that will be inspired to change, to work harder, to improve. It's a perfect platform for success breeding success.

And, we all know it's a trophy, so just ignore the nobheads who call it a nothing competition. They want a rise out of you.
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Offline woof

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2012, 08:05:10 am »
Sick and tired of hearing our bitter rivals belittle this victory. It was however, expected. What I did not expect however is for our national no.1 daily here in Malaysia, print something as tasteless and classless as this!
Sorry, what was tasteless?

Offline MaschHead

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2012, 08:10:48 am »
Sorry, what was tasteless?

(they wish)

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2012, 01:04:52 pm »
Sick and tired of hearing our bitter rivals belittle this victory. It was however, expected. What I did not expect however is for our national no.1 daily here in Malaysia, print something as tasteless and classless as this!

Fuck 'em.  We won the game & thats all that counts.
Its a cup final and you can't expect either team to roll over and die.

Might have been different if we'd have got the early goal but we still should have won it more comfortably.

At the end of the day the record books will always show that LFC won the League Cup in 2012.
That can never be taken away from us.

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Offline DukeRed

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2012, 02:59:23 pm »
Fuck 'em.  We won the game & thats all that counts.
Its a cup final and you can't expect either team to roll over and die.

Might have been different if we'd have got the early goal but we still should have won it more comfortably.

At the end of the day the record books will always show that LFC won the League Cup in 2012.
That can never be taken away from us.

Indeed but no less disgusted with that caption as are many other Malaysian Reds. A FB Group has been created calling for a boycott of the said paper and is swelling in numbers. https://www.facebook.com/groups/316024358447341/

Also, a number of us have written in to the paper in question and it's editor.

Sorry, a little OT.

Offline shelovesyou

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2012, 03:22:32 pm »
the three twats on that show talk utter drivel, especially mcgarry. chapman pulled him up saying "you don't like liverpool do you"? and he backtracked. we shouldn't be surprised though. this is the same guy who accused rafa of being "arrogant" in the past. motson was just as bad in putting us down.

I know, i was quite taken back by it, but it wont spoil it for me, nothing anyone says will.
Just thought it was harsh.
Later Chapman, ironically a Manc, said that it wasnt just about the final, its getting there and every game we played has as much relevance, they then decided to give us credit for taking it seriously from the off.
Meh.
You cant and wont pls everybody, its what we feel that matters.
Im proud of Kenny, he saw it as a huge opportunity and took it very seriously and treated it with respect.
He achieved his goal and theres no better satisfaction in life than achieving your goals.

We were a tad under par on the day BUT we bossed all of the games from Exeter to City in the semi's. I think an exception can be made for the final, expecially when you consider the added pressure of being at Wembley, the expcetancy of us to batter Cardiff, who I said were no slouches, and the chance to win our first silverware for too long. We had a lot against us that day and although it wasnt Shexy football we held our nerve and got the job done, against a very plucky Cardiff City side who were well overdue a good result at Wembley.

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2012, 03:28:42 pm »
Indeed but no less disgusted with that caption as are many other Malaysian Reds. A FB Group has been created calling for a boycott of the said paper and is swelling in numbers. https://www.facebook.com/groups/316024358447341/

Also, a number of us have written in to the paper in question and it's editor.

Sorry, a little OT.

I still don't understand what was tasteless in that paper?
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Offline drpepe

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2012, 03:31:18 pm »
I still don't understand what was tasteless in that paper?

nor me.

unless there was more in the actual article i took the (they wish) to mean the team were struggling t o get through the crowd (in the accompanying pic)  :o

Offline Finn Solomon

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #16 on: February 29, 2012, 09:16:33 am »
There's the words (they wish) after the main headline.
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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #17 on: February 29, 2012, 10:06:39 am »
I think it is fair that clubs prioritise what they are aiming for.  I don't think it's practical to go for more than three seriously.

Champions League
Premier League
FA Cup
Europa League
Carling Cup

In that order?

We only had three to go for this season.  Would have been a travesty to take any of them lightly. 
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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #18 on: February 29, 2012, 10:08:19 am »
That's a strange order, I'd much prefer winning the league to the Champions League.
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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #19 on: February 29, 2012, 10:12:29 am »
That's a strange order, I'd much prefer winning the league to the Champions League.

LOL

Yeah it's quite tricky to actually put them one in front of the other!

Probably easier to say it like this:

Champions League and Premier League = Cat A
The Rest = Cat B

So take your Cat A's if you are in them both and one Cat B.

We only had one Cat A and 2 x Cat B's to go for this year. 
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Offline Wish Matrix

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #20 on: February 29, 2012, 10:20:49 am »
Sick and tired of hearing our bitter rivals belittle this victory. It was however, expected. What I did not expect however is for our national no.1 daily here in Malaysia, print something as tasteless and classless as this!

Malaysian papers only wank to Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and the latest is Man City. Why bother reading them?
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Offline lamonti

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #21 on: February 29, 2012, 11:21:55 am »
Great article from Wilson. The final was not the greatest way to win a trophy by any means, but we performed admirably in the competition throughout which is all to easily overlooked. Yeah, we beat a spirited Championship team in the final, we didn't lose to a much inferior Championship team at home, like United. We beat the best side in the country over two legs. We beat Chelsea at home. We weren't just drawn against Cardiff.

The very fact that they are still concerned enough to have a pop at LFC for winning competitions is obviously a compliment.

Offline ALANM

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #22 on: February 29, 2012, 11:22:21 pm »
I think it is fair that clubs prioritise what they are aiming for.  I don't think it's practical to go for more than three seriously.

Champions League
Premier League
FA Cup
Europa League
Carling Cup

In that order?

We only had three to go for this season.  Would have been a travesty to take any of them lightly. 

I'd put Premier League ahead of CL. Also not sure on Europa League or Carling Cup as priority 4.

Offline JamesLS7

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #23 on: March 3, 2012, 07:13:24 pm »
Well this didnt happen.
When discussing Dirk Kuyt's work rate :

I don't think he works as hard as some people claim. No harder, for example, than Stewart Downing.

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #24 on: March 3, 2012, 07:14:00 pm »
Well this didnt happen.

Put in our best performance for a long time I think
It's wonderful, it's marvellous, it's 3-3

Offline JamesLS7

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Re: Liverpool hopes Carling Cup triumph is springboard for success
« Reply #25 on: March 3, 2012, 07:28:46 pm »
Put in our best performance for a long time I think

I agree, but the whole feel good factor has went to shit after what happened today.
When discussing Dirk Kuyt's work rate :

I don't think he works as hard as some people claim. No harder, for example, than Stewart Downing.

18 League Titles and 5 European Cups. Get counting.