Topic: Supporters to visit rail seating at Celtic

[Redsnappa]

Excellent Guardian article on the ridiculous Government position taken up by the Sports Minister:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2018/apr/15/sports-minister-tracey-crouch-safe-standing?CMP=share_btn_tw

[24/7]

That's a belter of an article with a suckerpunchline. Good stuff, Daniel.

[Red Beret]

Just a general article on rail seating, probably nothing that nobody here doesn't already know.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safe_standing

I've always felt seating was safer and shied away from the concept of "safe" standing, but reading the articles and the opinions of people on here I realise now it's all down to effective crowd control and monitoring crowd density.

This isn't the 1980s anymore; technology and safety has moved on in leaps and bounds.  We've managed without the fences and the pens.  I think we can trust people to stand.

[24/7]

As usual though, the powers that be are woefully behind the curve of public opinion.

[Samie]

 https://bbc.in/2JVNg9H

More evidence is needed before safe standing can be allowed at top-flight stadiums, the Premier League has said.

Earlier this month, sports minister Tracey Crouch rejected West Brom's request to trial safe standing.

The legislation forbidding it was introduced following the Taylor Report into the 1989 Hillsborough disaster.

"This subject is complex and nuanced and clearly requires more research," said the Premier League, whose clubs discussed it at a meeting last week.

BBC Sport understands that fans numbering in the low thousands have been asked for their views over the past 16 months by polling company Populus, on behalf of the Premier League.

The statement added: "The results so far suggest a majority of fans like the idea of standing areas in principle but only 5% want to stand for an entire match.

"Additionally, the majority want the option of being able to stand and sit.

"Taking this into account, we understand and appreciate why the Minister for Sport would require far more evidence before considering a change to the current all-seater policy."

On Monday, English Football League chief executive Shaun Harvey said he would "robustly" ask the government to change its stance because of "significant popular demand".

Crouch's decision has been criticised heavily by both fans and safety experts, with an online petition to force the government to debate the issue having amassed more than 56,000 signatures.

West Brom's pilot scheme would have meant 3,600 seats in the Smethwick End were converted to 'rail seats', which can be locked in an upright position.

The Baggies - who are bottom of the Premier League - hoped to install them in time for next season.

Scottish Premiership leaders Celtic introduced safe standing in the summer of 2016.

Manager Brendan Rodgers endorsed the move, saying it helped to create a "better ambience", but admitted "it may not be for every club".

The All Party Parliamentary Group for Football is set to discuss the issue on 1 May.

[CraigDS]

Only 5% wanted to stand all game?

Who the fuck were they asking?

[cdav]

Only 5% wanted to stand all game?

Who the fuck were they asking?

Probably emailled club supporters over the age 80 to ensure they got the answer they wanted.

Even if it is 5% wanting it though- surely start with a 2,000 standing area in a 40,000 seater stadium and increase if a success?

[4pool]

Only 5% wanted to stand all game?

Who the fuck were they asking?

Well i do sit down at halftime...

[mersey_paradiso]

Repost :

Sign this !

Mods is it ok to put the safe standing petition here on the main board?
23k people and rising in a couple of days...
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

[Grobbelrevell]

Bump

Petition:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

[Groundskeeper Willie]

Is the petition only for UK residents?

[meady1981]

Is the petition only for UK residents?

Yes

[Gnurglan]

Probably emailled club supporters over the age 80 to ensure they got the answer they wanted.

Even if it is 5% wanting it though- surely start with a 2,000 standing area in a 40,000 seater stadium and increase if a success?

That's the approach. Test it and see what happens. Getting the chance to test it is the most important thing, even if it's just 500 in the area. Standing sections work everywhere, but in order to bring it back it's most likely a step by step process. With small initial steps.

[meady1981]

Bump
Up to 78k now

Petition:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

[mersey_paradiso]

Petition:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

Bump - 83,000 now !! Sign and pass it on !

[mikey_LFC]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

Bump - 87,500 now.

[Asam]

Bump - 87,500 now.

Reckon it will get to 100k this month if it's pushed a little more

[dudleyred]

Crystal Palace have tweeted it asking their supporters to sign it I believe

[iAnfieldRoad]

Great stuff from palace and if any set of fans outwith Liverpool who would benefit from rail seating then its them.

[Hij]

Bump. So close to the threshold now!

[meady1981]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

89,500

[Kashinoda]

I see lots of clubs have been pushing this petition, the movement is gathering pace quicker than I previously imagined really.

Hopefully the government don't brush it aside.

[CraigDS]

Should easily topple 100k in the next few days if a few more clubs back it.

Not that it’ll make a blind bit of difference, the Govt have seemingly buried their heads in the sand when it comes to this.

[meady1981]

Should easily topple 100k in the next few days if a few more clubs back it.

Not that it’ll make a blind bit of difference, the Govt have seemingly buried their heads in the sand when it comes to this.

That's the spirit!!!!

[Kashinoda]

8,000 to go

[meady1981]

95,000
Nearly there
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

[mikey_LFC]

95,000
Nearly there
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

And it’s there!

[meady1981]

Hit the target. Good step in the right direction. If anything this goes to show its not a 'small minority'..

[oojason]

'Safe-standing petition: 100,000 people sign, triggering possible MPs' debate'...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43899649

[24/7]

'Safe-standing petition: 100,000 people sign, triggering possible MPs' debate'...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43899649

This will now be debated in parliament on June 25th. With a new Home Secretary, perhaps it might get somewhere.....

[Alf]

Encouraging sign the petition made to 100k signatures so quickly and onto the agenda for parliament. DCMS were dismissive of this 3 weeks ago, hopefully this forces a rethink.

[meady1981]

Interesting development
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44362522


The Government is set to commission a fundamental review into the issue of standing at matches in the Premier League and Championship.

Officials have spoken to the Premier League and EFL about a review into all-seater stadiums being mandatory.

The issue will be debated in Parliament on 25 June. And government source said the "time is right" to look at the it.

Sports minister Tracey Crouch had said there were no plans to change the all-seater policy at stadiums.

She was speaking in April after West Brom, who have since been relegated from the Premier League to the Championship, had a proposal to introduce safe standing at The Hawthorns rejected by the government.

Standing in English football's top two divisions was outlawed by the Football Spectators' Act in 1989, following recommendations made in the Taylor Report into the Hillsborough disaster, which claimed the lives of 96 Liverpool fans.

But, after more than 100,000 people signed a petition which called for Premier League and Championship clubs to allow safe-standing, the issue will be discussed in Parliament.

Crouch is understood to be keen to discuss safety at stadiums, and the impact of improved technologies and stadium design.

[mikey_LFC]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44407450

Labour backs safe-standing - feels like this is getting closer.

One question I’ve got around this is, how does it affect stadium capacities?

Would it help reduce the season ticket waiting list?

[Kashinoda]

The Government have revised their response to the petition and seem to be setting out the groundwork to dismiss it.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040

[sms1986]

seem to be setting out the groundwork to dismiss it.

Where do you get this part from?

[Kashinoda]

Where do you get this part from?

Citing 60% overall increased attendances with stronger participation from minority groups and women & children. They're pinning this and more on the fact we have all-seater stadiums, they then add.

"Given the success of all seater stadiums, the safety reasons for introducing the policy, and the enhancements that seated spectators have enjoyed, the Government would need strong evidence and rationale to change that policy. "

People are reading the detailed response as a positive but the language to me says the opposite.

[CraigDS]

It's more positive than their first response.

[Uncle Ronnie]

"Safety of supporters is paramount. However we recognise that technology and stadium design has evolved since the all-seater policy was introduced and the time is right to look at the issue.

"The sports minister has not shut the door to fans keen on standing sections being introduced but it is important that all the evidence and viewpoints are considered extremely carefully."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44362522

[sempi]

I am not a supporter of returning to standing, I feel that there is a vocal minority demanding its re introduction. I fail to see how it is safer now than it was then.
I saw a lot of injuries in the sixties and seventies caused by overcrowding on the kop. I "shared" a seat with a fan at Old Trafford, who had blagged his way in when we played Chelsea in the FA cup final there. And yes, I do on occasion stand when a goal is scored, but I know I can see all of the game confident that no one who barges in late will plonk himself in front of me.
Can rail standing address this? 

[CraigDS]

I am not a supporter of returning to standing, I feel that there is a vocal minority demanding its re introduction. I fail to see how it is safer now than it was then.
I saw a lot of injuries in the sixties and seventies caused by overcrowding on the kop. I "shared" a seat with a fan at Old Trafford, who had blagged his way in when we played Chelsea in the FA cup final there. And yes, I do on occasion stand when a goal is scored, but I know I can see all of the game confident that no one who barges in late will plonk himself in front of me.
Can rail standing address this?

Have you looked it examples of it at all?