Author Topic: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT  (Read 24126 times)

Offline MichaelA

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #40 on: October 29, 2015, 06:01:25 pm »
Reconnect with us – we all benefit.

The owners or SoS? ;)

Big step forward in terms of content and especially the tone that you have taken, best of luck Graham, please keep us informed, and don't fuck it up. :wave

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #41 on: October 29, 2015, 06:03:53 pm »
The point of the picture was to relate a few things which I think the image does - firstly and most importantly the way things were (the Boys' Pen kids), secondly pricing and finally the change in demographic of our support that ha contributed to local exclusion.

The race issue being suggested is trying a bit hard to be honest.

Just saying the pic made me feel uncomfortable.
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Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #42 on: October 29, 2015, 06:05:56 pm »
The owners or SoS? ;)

Big step forward in terms of content and especially the tone that you have taken, best of luck Graham, please keep us informed, and don't fuck it up. :wave

They never did exclude SOS - I would think someone in SOS interacts with someone in the Club at some level every day of every week.
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Offline Red_Mist

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #43 on: October 29, 2015, 06:11:55 pm »
Garstonite, I have a question for you and all of the locals - not meant to be contentious just wanting to know what you think the answer could be to make it happen.  How would the club protect tickets for locals to attend a match at the gate and not have someone OOT just walk up and pay for a ticket?  Would the club or supporters club have to produce and ID or would that not be desirable?  Just thinking out loud and wondering how all of you would solve that. 
It's a good question, and i don't want to jump the gun here (very early days). But in your hypothetical example, I'm not sure this would really be an issue that needed resolving.

If you're travelling from OOT or OOC, you're likely to have a ticket and wouldn't rely on some kind of first come first served entry (if that's one of the things under discussion, just guessing). You're not going to risk not getting in. And if you're 21 or under and travelling from afar, you're more likely to be travelling with an adult or group, and also therefore more likely to already have a ticket. There'd probably be nothing to stop a 20 year old from Stockholm turning up ticketless hoping to get in on the day. And if he/she wants to risk that then good luck to them. But the vast majority would be local, just through ease of getting there, having mates who want to do the same, being 'in the know' etc etc. You'd think so anyhow.

 ID might be needed, but just as a proof of age, sort of reverse of going to the pub. At the end of the day, if they started with say 500 or 1000, and there were 100s of local youngsters being locked out due to non-locals getting there first, they could look at that then. But as a scenario, i think that's pretty far-fetched.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 06:13:45 pm by Red_Mist »

Offline Andy82lfc

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #44 on: October 29, 2015, 06:17:23 pm »
I guess they picked that fella because he's got a camera round his neck, nothing to do with the colour of his skin.

The point of the picture was to relate a few things which I think the image does - firstly and most importantly the way things were (the Boys' Pen kids), secondly pricing and finally the change in demographic of our support that has contributed to local exclusion.

The race issue being suggested is trying a bit hard to be honest.

You're joking aren't you mate? It's underneath the line of 'local youth of previous generations juxtaposed with the increasing support from further away'. An pretty clear what it's trying to say.

No race issue was ever mentioned! It's a fact of generalising putting what people would see as a 'foreigner' in the picture. I just think it's a poor effort and apart from anything what is it actually trying to convey? There's just no need for it there.

I don't wanna derail from the subject, cos I think it's a really good attempt at something to get our local youth back involved a lot more, but it's wrong on levels that are quite obvious to me, especially when trying to convince a group of successful global businessmen.

Offline GregCharrua

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #45 on: October 29, 2015, 06:17:41 pm »
Just saying the pic made me feel uncomfortable.

Yeah, that pic also made me a little uncomfortable. Before: lots of white kids; now: rich non-white foreign kid.

I got the point of course but in combination with the overall tone of the letter I felt a little eh.

Its a difficult case to present, one that can easily tip into xenophobia and other nasty things with something as simple as a poorly chosen photo or a certain turn of phrase. Perhaps because that is the message running under things: we want local boys, not foreign boys here. This letter is trying to say that in a nice way, while at the same time pointing at the cost of attendance. What about all the old guys with decades of games under their belt that are going and not singing? Not much said about them, while foreign fans are made to out to be a bigger problem (i'm sure they don't all come with selfie sticks).

I don't know. I don't want to say more. I don't want to get drawn into this topic again so I'll just leave my two cents here and leave the rest to the club and the associations to work out.

Certainly they can make youth-priced tickets available no matter all the other details.

Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #46 on: October 29, 2015, 06:23:47 pm »
You're joking aren't you mate? It's underneath the line of 'local youth of previous generations juxtaposed with the increasing support from further away'. An pretty clear what it's trying to say.

No race issue was ever mentioned! It's a fact of generalising putting what people would see as a 'foreigner' in the picture. I just think it's a poor effort and apart from anything what is it actually trying to convey? There's just no need for it there.

I don't wanna derail from the subject, cos I think it's a really good attempt at something to get our local youth back involved a lot more, but it's wrong on levels that are quite obvious to me, especially when trying to convince a group of successful global businessmen.

Agreed without apology - the image was supposed to represent the change in dynamic of the crowd - the local exclusion versus the international support. Change in dynamic - not suggesting exclude anyone from outside an L postcode I'd hasten to add.

And as you will see from the report of the meeting - FSG complimented the briefing document and its contents.

Anyway, as you say - not to derail.
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Offline Claire.

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #47 on: October 29, 2015, 06:26:36 pm »
Change in dynamic - not suggesting exclude anyone from outside an L postcode I'd hasten to add.



What about a CH postcode? Should they get the same rights as someone with an L postcode?

Offline Sooty89!!!

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #48 on: October 29, 2015, 06:28:41 pm »
Hmm... why?

To be clear on this, it was as much (if not more) about getting young people into the ground instead of the older generation, as it was about locals.
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Offline sideshowme

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #49 on: October 29, 2015, 06:33:04 pm »
Yeah, that pic also made me a little uncomfortable. Before: lots of white kids; now: rich non-white foreign kid.

I got the point of course but in combination with the overall tone of the letter I felt a little eh.

Its a difficult case to present, one that can easily tip into xenophobia and other nasty things with something as simple as a poorly chosen photo or a certain turn of phrase. Perhaps because that is the message running under things: we want local boys, not foreign boys here. This letter is trying to say that in a nice way, while at the same time pointing at the cost of attendance. What about all the old guys with decades of games under their belt that are going and not singing? Not much said about them, while foreign fans are made to out to be a bigger problem (i'm sure they don't all come with selfie sticks).

i thought i was reading a UKIP presentation when i got to that bit.  well intended, i'm sure, but very, very poor judgement there.
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Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2015, 06:34:14 pm »
What about a CH postcode? Should they get the same rights as someone with an L postcode?

What rights are these?
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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #51 on: October 29, 2015, 06:39:13 pm »
What rights are these?
Whatever rights you want, under your 'local exclusion versus the international support' argument. Would a youngster from a CH postcode have more rights than a youngster who lived in a CF (Cardiff) or NG (Nottingham) postcode?

Offline Andy82lfc

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #52 on: October 29, 2015, 06:40:40 pm »
Agreed without apology - the image was supposed to represent the change in dynamic of the crowd - the local exclusion versus the international support. Change in dynamic - not suggesting exclude anyone from outside an L postcode I'd hasten to add.

And as you will see from the report of the meeting - FSG complimented the briefing document and its contents.

Anyway, as you say - not to derail.

I think it's a great effort Graham honestly, really happy to see such things getting put forward and people putting in such an effort, but although I'm projecting all over it and no-one hopefully paid any notice to it, I just thought that picture was not a good addition for reasons mentioned, and some that haven't been.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 06:42:47 pm by Andy82lfc »

Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #53 on: October 29, 2015, 06:44:04 pm »
Whatever rights you want, under your 'local exclusion versus the international support' argument. Would a youngster from a CH postcode have more rights than a youngster who lived in a CF (Cardiff) or NG (Nottingham) postcode?

Don't know where this 'rights' thing has come from.

More opportunity the closer you are to the ground seems fair to me. Simple as that.
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #54 on: October 29, 2015, 06:48:04 pm »
Top stuff GS. Didn't think the Supporters Committee would amount to anything. Hope they listen.
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Offline Red_Mist

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #55 on: October 29, 2015, 06:50:35 pm »
Whatever rights you want, under your 'local exclusion versus the international support' argument. Would a youngster from a CH postcode have more rights than a youngster who lived in a CF (Cardiff) or NG (Nottingham) postcode?
Graham said earlier in the thread, "not suggesting exclude anyone from outside an L postcode I'd hasten to add". So i don't understand your question Claire (sorry for butting in like :)) Or am i missing something here?

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #56 on: October 29, 2015, 07:08:12 pm »
Great to see this question being directly asked to the owners. Hopefully we get a satisfactory answer and steps taken to make this happen.

Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #57 on: October 29, 2015, 08:37:44 pm »
The report of the meeting with the owners can now be released:

The owners and senior management of LFC asked representatives of the LFC Supporters' Committee to attend a meeting at Anfield prior to the match against Southampton on Sunday,

LFC Supporters' Committee Chair Graham Smith, Anna Burgess (Away Supporters Rep), Tony Fitzgerald (Season and Hospitality Ticket Holders Rep) and Ian Byrne (Family Rep) met with John Henry, Mike Gordon, Tom Werner, Ed Weiss, Ian Ayre (Linda Pizzutti joined the meeting a little later) and a number of other senior LFC management staff.

The meeting centred upon one topic, namely the disconnection between local support and the Club, including accessibility for young, local people and ticket prices. The LFC Supporter's Committee had put a briefing note to the owners prior to the meeting that formed the basis of a loose agenda to discuss the issue.

The SC representatives explained to the owners that they faced a crisis in relation to the connection between local supporters and the Club - accessibility and affordability lay behind the problem and the Committee members gave examples of where local, young supporters were being excluded - classrooms of local school children who had never been to a match, local youth excluded outside the ground on a match day and the increasing average age of our supporters both home and away.

The Committee members expressed that this was a threat to the owners’ investment - they had bought the Club off the back of its history, culture and atmosphere but that was waning and dying in front of them - Ian Ayre acknowledged that selling commercial deals demonstrating a vibrant atmosphere and experience made that part of his job easier and all agreed that more young people sitting together in the ground would make a positive difference to that atmosphere.

Tom Werner thanked the Committee for the well-written briefing that he said helped frame the debate and he said it was an issue that they acknowledged and that it was something about which they were very sensitive.

Mike Gordon picked up most of the response for the owners within the meeting saying that the Club management had spent a large part of their meeting the day before looking at pricing structures within the ground and this review encompassed looking at more entry points rather than the current tiers of pricing. Tom Werner said ticket prices had been a part of the agenda at the PL meeting late last week that he had attended with Ian Ayre.

It was mentioned at this point that a major issue for our away support was the discrimination created by categorisation of ticket prices for LFC away supporters who regularly paid twice as much as other visiting Clubs at some grounds.

Mike Gordon said that there were two elements to what they were trying to do - firstly the economics of what they could do and secondly the logistics of doing it.

The Committee members said that they recognised that to make any changes to ticket prices that would increase local accessibility would inevitably reduce revenues, but such a reduction would not in the Committee's eyes make us any less competitive with other Clubs and any loss of revenue would be set off in part by local supporters engaging more commercially with the Club.

The Committee also said that any major initiatives would inevitably force other big Clubs into the same sort of initiatives – underlining Liverpool leading the way and not being ‘just another Club’.

It was also pointed out that while Chelsea had the highest priced 'cheapest' ticket prices in the PL the average salary in their area was over £100k pa - in Liverpool with the second highest 'cheapest' ticket prices the average salary is £16k pa. It was mentioned that the Spirit of Shankly and the Everton Supporters Trust supporters’ groups were involved in a food bank initiative around Anfield that very day – 47% of children in the local area were considered to be in ‘poverty’.

Mike Gordon said that they had decided to make some moves on the issue and that would be discussed within the Ticketing Working Group in the next few weeks - the changes were planned to take place for next season. These changes were also linked to the opening of the new Main Stand.

The Committee said that they would wait to see what these proposed changes were but hoped they would start a move towards better engagement with the local community and fan base - it was mentioned to them that is was regrettable that they had not been able to meet with the TWG while here. Ian Ayre acknowledged that he thought supporters had a role to play in finalising these changes.

Ian Ayre picked up the point about logistics in any changes. The Main Stand redevelopment saw the Club in the midst of trying to work out how they would accommodate existing ticket holders and also what the knock on effect would be in other parts of the ground in creating capacity and the ability to meet some of the challenges being discussed in the meeting.

On top of this there were initiatives being looked at over a season ticket 'amnesty' at some point, more modern access systems, touting and the recapture of tickets leaking out that way and also the re-release of seats unoccupied after 15 minutes of any home game. All of these initiatives required planning to create some element of capacity. But Ian Ayre said there was a will to do this.

The Committee urged the Club to engage with supporters over the logistics - primarily with current Main Stand ticket holders - to both inform them of the challenges and also to get their views on what they wanted to achieve - it was said that there might be more common ground than the Club think. It was also the case that the Club regularly failed to push out good stories about their engagement with supporters over issues.

The issue of touting needed more from the Club and again working with supporters on this issue would help all supporters and the Club.

The Committee stressed again that they were not seeking to exclude anyone but the owners had to recognise that while LFC was an international Club now, it had to retain a Liverpool heart - that was a key issue for the Club as otherwise the Club would become just another Club. Linda Pizzutti mentioned the work of the Liverpool FC Foundation and the extensive work done with local schools - this was acknowledged by the Committee members but the problem was that these children were given a connection with LFC through these programmes but at the point that they asked to go to the match it was generally impossible through a combination of accessibility and pricing.

John Henry asked at what point this exclusion had become and major problem and the Committee said probably around the time just after Istanbul - when the romance of that success propelled LFC to a different place as far as people wanting to attach themselves to the Club. He also mentioned that in recent years ticket prices had only risen in small percentages but he was reminded that the proper starting point in relation to ticket prices was their high cost, not the limit in increases over the last few years.

The Committee also reminded the owners that in paying these prices supporters were actually being invited to participate inside the ground and that had a value to the owners in supporting the 'brand' they had purchased.

John Henry said that approaches to sponsors to subsidise away game showings for local schools in the Boot Room might be something they could consider.

The Committee made the point that their request for local people and younger local people seeking access to the ground was not a request for charity – it was considered a right for local people to at least have the opportunity.

The meeting closed with the owners saying they hoped that the proposals they were coming up with were a start and also that it was important that this was seen as a journey as the issues raised could not be solved overnight.

They thanked all of the Committee (present and not present) for the work that they did on behalf of the Club and supporters.
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #58 on: October 29, 2015, 08:43:25 pm »
The only way we are going to get young local kids to matches, is if we the supporters OOTs, worldwide, London scum subsidise it. Rather contribute towards that than pay for the LFCTV shyte.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 08:45:59 pm by Twelfth Man »
The courts, the rich, the powerful or those in authority never lie. It has been dealt with 'by the courts' nothing to see here run along.

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #59 on: October 29, 2015, 09:29:56 pm »
Would you be able to do that legally?  I think people from Liverpool need to be mindful about their attitude towards 'tourists.'  I know plenty of super passionate and vocal Irish liverpool fans that follow them everywhere. Fans from outside the city are as important as those in the city.  The club is a global brand and relies on their worldwide support to be able to compete.  Without a global fanbase, the club would be.... well... Everton, really.
Would you be able to do that legally?  I think people from Liverpool need to be mindful about their attitude towards 'tourists.'  I know plenty of super passionate and vocal Irish liverpool fans that follow them everywhere. Fans from outside the city are as important as those in the city.  The club is a global brand and relies on their worldwide support to be able to compete.  Without a global fanbase, the club would be.... well... Everton, really.

It is the youth factor that I think is the most important to address.  The fans and players of tomorrow.  The next Stevie...

It is the youth factor that I think is the most important to address.  The fans and players of tomorrow.  The next Stevie...

Well West Ham have been doing it for about 10 years
Offering £5 tickets to residents of certain postcodes. I remember the EDL kicking off saying it was anti white because of the postcode

Offline Sooty89!!!

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Re: LFC Supporters' Committee meet FSG owners
« Reply #60 on: October 29, 2015, 09:33:57 pm »
Fairly easy solution...Pay on the gate for those 1,000 seats, would make touting impossible.
who is to say it wont be oots and tourists paying on the gate?

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #61 on: October 29, 2015, 09:57:29 pm »


You can do this – for instance a 1000 local youth together in the ground would see the atmosphere and place transformed – the Spion Kop 1906 supporters group are half a dozen lads who fund the vast majority of the flags you see on the Kop – they don’t want your money, because they don’t want your seal of approval, but look what contribution just a small group s making, they’d love to see scores of like minded youth in the ground making the noise and atmosphere we all want to see.

.

Been saying that for years....well since May anyway....Bring back the boys pen....35p and Birmo's mandatory!



My view is you start by introducing teenage groups 'the next generation' by giving over 1000 seats in the Kop every game to a £10 pay on the gate...no pre solds...it will encourage groups of mates to attend...rather than with Dads , Uncles etc...aged 14 to 18 ...it will give priority to those who make the effort so are more likely to sing  etc , i.e get there early to queue up...and ( no offense to anyone outside the L post code) provide a priority to young local fans to see their team and a  realistic price....something like this , lets call it 'The Boys Pen'..could..hold on don't want to upset anyone ' The Non Specific Gender Pen'...kick start something in the Kop.

Of course this would receive short shrift from the Club...my rough maths tell's me the club could lose £1million revenue a season to this ...based on tourist fan match day spend....but I would charge every one else and extra £1 on their tickets to subside a crucial investment in our future.

Posts on the internet wont change this it will the pro-active actions of individuals and groups that will.



Offline Graham Smith

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #62 on: October 29, 2015, 10:21:20 pm »
Here is the TWG supporters' reps response - agreed by the LFC SC reps on that group:

Following the recent statement by the Supporters Committee after their meeting with the clubs ownership at the weekend, the Ticket Working Group (TWG) would like to update supporters about our discussions that we have had to date with the club.

The Supporters Committee meeting with the owners has been used as a good opportunity to raise the ongoing and important issue of ticket pricing and accessibility to Anfield, particularly for younger supporters. It is due to this issue being brought up regularly by Spirit Of Shankly and the Supporters Committee, and the campaigning work of Spirit Of Shankly and Spion Kop 1906 both at Anfield and nationally, that we asked for the creation of this group. It was our view that such a group could sit around the table with the club and talk about the problems we faced and work together to find solutions. This was agreed by club executives and a terms of reference was agreed so that we could discuss openly and frankly the problem of ticket pricing and accessibility and allow the club to present ideas and initiatives to resolve them.

We have engaged in this process fully since our first meeting in December 2014 and initial discussions centred on the clubs plans for the current season (2015/16). It was on the back of these discussions that the club agreed to freeze ticket prices for both season tickets and match day tickets, both in recognition of the cost and the need to give the group time to work. Since these announcements in early 2015, we have meet with club executives several times to discuss pricing structures for a redeveloped stadium and how they intend to manage the seating in the redeveloped Main Stand. These discussions have been worthwhile and whilst passionate have allowed us to better understand what the club want to achieve, and also allow the club to understand the supporter’s views more clearly. No firm proposals have yet been presented to us.

It was, with this in mind, disappointing that the club ownership did not wish to meet with the members of the Ticket Working Group whilst they were in the country. It was an opportunity missed to continue our work and further frustrates the process despite the best efforts and patience of those involved.

Whilst we will continue to abide by the terms of reference and do not intend to breach any confidentiality, it is worth us pointing out what our main asks have been so far. These are:

Lowering of prices – Whilst we would like across the board decreases, we are not naïve enough to expect this to happen overnight if at all. However for us, ticket pricing as it currently stands is unaffordable. It is also unfair to have such high prices at a time of increasing commercial revenues within the club and the game. We believe that now is the time to reduce prices and reward supporter loyalty which has financially sustained the club for so long. It was with this in mind that we said to the club that the majority of tickets should be at an ‘affordable’ price. Much discussion has taken place on what affordable is but our view was this was around the £30 mark. We recognise this is an aspiration and something that may have to be worked towards over a period of time and have said to the club we would welcome seeing their alternative.
Removal of categorisation – As supporters both home and away are aware, categorisation of matches unfairly disadvantages our away supporters and those away supporters coming to Anfield. Similarly, home supporters do not pay to see our opposition. They come to watch and support Liverpool Football Club. To pay different prices per opposition is something that supporters told us was unfair. We also believe removing categorisation would not only be fairer, but a first step towards recognising the problem of pricing and allow for price decreases across the board.
More youngsters in the ground – The support at Anfield is one that is ageing. Worse still, there is no pathway for getting more youngsters into the ground, at an affordable price, regularly. This needs rectifying urgently, particularly if we want to retain any traditions and atmosphere inside Anfield.


It was good to see that many of these issues were reaffirmed in the Supporters Committee meeting and we hope that the decision makers at the club can see the strength and breadth of feeling on these issues. We will continue to push for these and hope that the meetings we have had, along with the Supporters Committee meeting, demonstrate the need for the club to take this action.

We note the comments made by Mike Gordon, around the economics and logistics of what the club could do. This has been the crux of many conversations with the club – that any such plan requires movement from the club in terms of how much they expect to make from ticketing. We believe that such a move, to lower their expectation, would be welcome and would reap both financial rewards elsewhere and other benefits to the club including improved atmosphere and sense of belonging. Logistics of what can be done and how are important but remain tinkering around the edges without tackling the important issue of price.

The other initiatives mentioned such as a season ticket amnesty and use of empty seats have been discussed with the club and would further demonstrate a recognition from the club to find solutions.

The owners made clear to the Supporters Committee that they have been discussing plans and will present these to us shortly. We look forward to seeing them and hope they have taken into account our conversations we have had with them so far, so that we can use them to continue discussing and working together to find a solution that benefits supporters.

We will be convening a meeting with supporters shortly to update them on progress and of proposals presented by the club. Details will be published in due course.

Spirit Of Shankly, Spion Kop 1906, LFC Supporters Committee
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Offline Jay_Mc

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #63 on: October 29, 2015, 11:01:18 pm »
Thanks for posting the TWG update Graham

It's down to the club now - we've met for months with them to talk about what we want. The SC have now done it. Will they move and will they move enough?
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Offline Six Beardy

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #64 on: October 29, 2015, 11:04:56 pm »
I think this is a great campaign, local youngsters should always be encouraged to follow in their fathers/grandfathers footsteps and be allowed the opportunity to go to Anfield. Whilst the worldwide popularity of the club is something to be welcomed, the local roots must never be ignored or forgotten, scousers are and always have been the lifeblood of the club and all measures should be taken to ensure it's a heritage that won't be lost in the globalisation of the club.

I can't say I'm comfortable with 'that' photo though - surely the need to maintain a young local presence in the ground shouldn't be promoted at the expense of others, it's something separate ? Nor do I like reading about 'London scum' (even if it was just a joke) - like many a scouser I moved to the capital to find work in the early 80's and stayed here. I can recall being called 'scouse scum' by some cockneys back then, so it makes me wince a little to be referred to as 'London scum' by a fellow scouser now.

Every scouser has some non-English, non-Liverpool heritage, so perhaps a little more sensitivity is in order here ? Although as I say, it's a campaign I wholeheartedly support.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 11:28:14 pm by boyspenhoolie »

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #65 on: October 29, 2015, 11:13:18 pm »
who is to say it wont be oots and tourists paying on the gate?
Does it matter if they're young and enthusiastic? Look, if enough local lads wanted to attend, there wouldn't be much room for anyone else. Plus I reckon most fans who have to travel a long way only do so once they've already got a ticket sorted. If they made 1,000 tickets pay on the gate, I'm willing to bet at least 500 of those would be locals. Which is better than none.

 The issue is getting the next generation of young supporters in the ground. In the 80's that naturally meant (first come first served) about 75-90% locals, depending on your definition of local. Those figures would inevitably be a bit lower now given that a lot more fans travel from further afield than they did 30 years ago, but at least the 'opportunity' would be there if it was combined with affordability. At the moment, there's neither the opportunity nor the affordability for that 16-21 age group.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 11:23:06 pm by Red_Mist »

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #66 on: October 29, 2015, 11:14:44 pm »
If you ask 100 people what to do, what they would like, etc..you'll get loads of different answers.

Well done to Graham and the lads & lasses for being involved and slowly turning the clubs ideas towards working to helping the ticket situation out.

Will everything be implemented? Of course not. Change takes time.

But at least both sides are working together hopefully towards a common achievable goal.
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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #67 on: October 29, 2015, 11:21:38 pm »
Have any of our stat/math guys crunched the numbers on the sort of revenue change we can expect to see if the cheaper ticket prices are achieved?
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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #68 on: October 29, 2015, 11:52:59 pm »
20-30 tickets per school, per game, to be used by the teachers as rewards.


I like this idea - maybe Everton could join in and match our ticket allocation, to be used by the teachers as punishments.

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #69 on: October 30, 2015, 07:19:48 am »
Obviously it's a very sensitive subject given the club's history, but part of the reason many Bundesliga clubs have cheaper tickets and a larger capacity is due to safe standing. After a quick Google search I found some interesting stuff about the idea:

http://www.safestandingroadshow.co.uk/the-proposal/the-proposal-continued---the-sums

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2015/feb/16/safe-standing-areas-football-stadiums-fans

http://backpagefootball.com/could-safe-standing-be-the-answer-to-many-fans-prayers/70283/

Again, fan safety would have to be paramount and concerns would be more prevalent at this club than elsewhere, but it might well be an idea that could be looked at in a sensible way.

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #70 on: October 30, 2015, 07:33:40 am »
There's a big thread about it here
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=302578.960#lastPost

The meeting sounds really positive to me. And interesting to hear Ayre actually talk about the importance of the '12th man' to them business wise and therefore listening to concerns that the atmosphere is in a terrible state. It's got to hit them in the pockets before they care.

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #71 on: October 30, 2015, 07:35:02 am »
Great stuff....but dont use this "The average salary in Kensington and Chelsea is £101,000 per annum ($155,077.61)." as a comparison.  I do not think that the average fans going to Stamford Bridge are in those salary band or even if higher paid has to live under the high "London cost of living'

Actual residents of the club's town and the opposition club's town should be getting a massive discounts even if there will always be some tickets for "tourists"

I think the average London wage is appropriate. No need to big it up with the Kensignton and Chelsea average, as you say. The population living around Chelsea's ground are very unlikely to ever go to a game, unlike those around Fulham, Crystal Palace and Arsenal.

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #72 on: October 30, 2015, 07:38:36 am »
Have any of our stat/math guys crunched the numbers on the sort of revenue change we can expect to see if the cheaper ticket prices are achieved?

Hopefully not as it'll be drop in the ocean and the benefits far outweigh the negligible financial cost. I suppose doing so might make the argument stronger though as it'll be, in relative terms, a pittance.

Local kids are indoctrinated in the city yet can't get access to, or afford, a ticket? It's a joke that it has come to this.
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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #73 on: October 30, 2015, 08:52:35 am »
Obviously it's a very sensitive subject given the club's history, but part of the reason many Bundesliga clubs have cheaper tickets and a larger capacity is due to safe standing. After a quick Google search I found some interesting stuff about the idea:

http://www.safestandingroadshow.co.uk/the-proposal/the-proposal-continued---the-sums

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2015/feb/16/safe-standing-areas-football-stadiums-fans

http://backpagefootball.com/could-safe-standing-be-the-answer-to-many-fans-prayers/70283/

Again, fan safety would have to be paramount and concerns would be more prevalent at this club than elsewhere, but it might well be an idea that could be looked at in a sensible way.

It would be an incredibly powerful thing for our Club. Safe standing is safe because of safe stadia. If we lead lead the way, it could be an emotional but cathartic experience that enhances Anfield and the relationship with the fans and and the Club. It requires vision and a step change in attitude to make it happen. I think we're the only Club in the league with the fans capable of making it happen, but we would need an MP like Steve Rotheram to take a lead at a political level.



« Last Edit: October 30, 2015, 09:03:22 am by MichaelA »

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #74 on: October 30, 2015, 09:15:23 am »
It would be an incredibly powerful thing for our Club. Safe standing is safe because of safe stadia. If we lead lead the way, it could be an emotional but cathartic experience that enhances Anfield and the relationship with the fans and and the Club. It requires vision and a step change in attitude to make it happen. I think we're the only Club in the league with the fans capable of making it happen, but we would need an MP like Steve Rotheram to take a lead at a political level.





I reckon the club has enough on its plate with the new stand seating to resolve plus this powerful request to try and include young fans who have been frozen out,yet are the future season ticket holders hopefully.

To try and lead on safe standing at the same time is a bridge too far in my view and would distract from solving the vital dual problem of access for youngsters and lack of atmosphere over recent times.

Thanks GS for posting and keeping us in the picture.
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Offline scouse neapolitan

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #75 on: October 30, 2015, 09:23:20 am »
Great work  Graham and co .  I’d like to think that the club are listening, but I also think that to a certain extent they’re not in an easy position. On the one hand you get people whinging about our ability to compete in the transfer market and then the same people complain (quite rightly)  about ticket prices. Having said that there has to be a middle way. This is the chance for the club to show that they are leaders. As has already said if we act on this the other clubs will inevitably follow suit.
We’re still widely associated nationally and internationally for our “support and atmosphere” but I reckon we’re starting to be caught out and people know that the famous atmosphere is fading fast . (Basically what a lot of people have been writing on the Let’s improve the atmosphere “ thread. )I reckon that a lot of   players  are still attracted by the idea of playing for our club not just because of past success but also by Brand Liverpool. Atmosphere, the Kop , scouse romance and great European evenings etc. I reckon this is one of the first things that the club uses when they try to recruit players. I’m sure that this was a major reason for our new manager accepting the job. If this is the case then the owners will realize that they have a lot to gain by listening to our supporters’ recommendations.
The local issue is a difficult one. Who qualifies ? Who has more right? Your Irish /Scandinavian lads who spend all their free cash and time on following the team all over the place? A bit of both  I reckon.
I had the good fortune to grow up in the city and see the team throughout the 60s 70s and 80s all over the country until I moved abroad. On the very few occasions I get back to the city, I don’t expect to get a ticket.  Tickets for the likes of me should be limited. Not the other way round as it is at the moment.
 And another thing. Although it may be more pertinent in the “Atmosphere” thread. It’s time for the Kop to reclaim its real identity. Anyone who has a ticket on the Kop should accept that it is a place where noise is made and flags are waved. It’s not a place for miserable old arses who stand with their arms folded when others are busting a gut to get something going. A bit of self-regulation here. If it’s not for you then you should abdicate and do one to another part of the ground. If you can’t see that your times up then the club should do it by and  invite people to reconsider where they watch the match.
And finally. Get the club to have a word with the stewards. Doing  their job properly  isn’t the same as suffocating people’s enthusiasm.   Move them somewhere else too.

Offline MichaelA

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #76 on: October 30, 2015, 09:24:11 am »
I reckon the club has enough on its plate with the new stand seating to resolve plus this powerful request to try and include young fans who have been frozen out,yet are the future season ticket holders hopefully.

To try and lead on safe standing at the same time is a bridge too far in my view and would distract from solving the vital dual problem of access for youngsters and lack of atmosphere over recent times.

Thanks GS for posting and keeping us in the picture.

On the contrary - the club is in project mode just now and is expanding capacity. Putting a proposal together for a standing Kop would be within their capabilities, and would be a powerful piece of information to take to legislators - MP's. The standard government line is that they will react to 'demand'. There is no demand from any club or stadium owners at the present time. It would be interesting to know if newer stadia (Emirates, Etihad) are future proofed to accommodate standing areas. I think that safe standing is the only realistic way that SoS will achieve their ambition of better access for youths and locals; at the present time SoS don't appear to have a view on safe standing - I think it's a good time for them to take one.  :wave
« Last Edit: October 30, 2015, 09:25:57 am by MichaelA »

Offline audioedge

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #77 on: October 30, 2015, 09:37:26 am »
How about a safe standing area but for under 18s only?

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #78 on: October 30, 2015, 09:39:51 am »
Was interested and pleased to see a season ticket amnesty is being looked at , you may find older supporters on the kop with a season ticket in someone elses name or address not wanting to rock the boat by asking for a change of seat . My ticket which ive had for twenty years is in someone elses name and it's a pain when there's an issue .

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Re: LFC SC meet FSG owners - NOW WITH ADDED MEETING REPORT
« Reply #79 on: October 30, 2015, 09:46:02 am »
On the contrary - the club is in project mode just now and is expanding capacity. Putting a proposal together for a standing Kop would be within their capabilities, and would be a powerful piece of information to take to legislators - MP's. The standard government line is that they will react to 'demand'. There is no demand from any club or stadium owners at the present time. It would be interesting to know if newer stadia (Emirates, Etihad) are future proofed to accommodate standing areas. I think that safe standing is the only realistic way that SoS will achieve their ambition of better access for youths and locals; at the present time SoS don't appear to have a view on safe standing - I think it's a good time for them to take one.  :wave

Maybe when the inquests have come to there conclusion then a more balanced approach towards safe standing can be started .