Author Topic: I'm really genuinely concerned...no rant intended (Read 40974 times)

djschembri · « **Reply #320 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:38:54 PM »

I'm prepared to wait and see what the team is on 1 September. There is a month left of the transfer window and there have been a number of personnel changes throughout the club, so it takes time for everything to bed in.

However, we really need to reduce the amount of mistakes we make in a transfer window, and maintain some stability from a coaching point of view. Like it or not, this year is going to be another transitional season, and we've had way too many of those in recent years.

I also hope that Borini and any players who come in are worth the transfer fee & wages. It feels like years since we got a bargain

Hyypia headers · « **Reply #321 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:40:17 PM »

Quote from: Trada on July 31, 2012, 05:37:56 PM

All it needs is a couple of top signings and everyone's moods will lift.

Agreed. And everyone will talk about how doing things behind closed doors is the Liverpool way.

krispy.red · « **Reply #322 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:43:27 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:27:36 PM

What did Purslow say they were more interested in business opportunities, they didn't have the dough for a new Stadium and they wouldn't use their own money. I would say he wasn't far wrong would you?

No he wasn't wrong. And FSG said the same things when the bought they club. They also said they wouldn't saddle us with debt, which so far looks true.

So what do you propose next? Campaign to get FSG out and hope oil money buys us?

killer_heels · « **Reply #323 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:44:06 PM »

Quote from: Trada on July 31, 2012, 05:37:56 PM

All it needs is a couple of top signings and everyone's moods will lift.

Cannot wait until Clint Dempsey arrives then, cue the fanfare.

Fat Scouser · « **Reply #324 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:45:13 PM »

Quote from: Hyypia headers on July 31, 2012, 05:40:17 PM

Agreed. And everyone will talk about how doing things behind closed doors is the Liverpool way.

No, mate. Some of us have deeper concerns. We see the whole identity of our club being changed, and it hurts. Right that's me. But I'm such a mug, I'll probably jump back in after about another 10 pages and have the same discussion over and over. Sometimes, I wish I could just fuck the whole thing off, walk away, and not look back without giving a toss.

Fat Scouser · « **Reply #325 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:46:09 PM »

Quote from: krispy.red on July 31, 2012, 05:43:27 PM

So what do you propose next? Campaign to get FSG out and hope oil money buys us?

Point proved. Night, night.

koptician · « **Reply #326 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:46:31 PM »

Quote from: filopastry on July 31, 2012, 01:38:06 PM

Last year was the big opportunity, even then that was driven by sales with a decent but not spectacular net spend on top, the problem now is we don't have another Fernando Torres who we can offload for a huge profit in spite of him underperforming, things are going to be tight as a result

Last year was worse than the Diao/Diouf/Cheyrou window given the greater context the club finds itself in. Whether that has spooked the owners into withdrawing funding or whether the plan was to ride on the results of that into this year we will soon see. I get the feeling that FSG figured that after wiping out the debt and selling Torres the club could almost sustain itself...they didn't figure on Commolli screwing up royally. And now they don't know what to do so they hire a manager who is so grateful for the opportunity that he'll acquiesce to any restriction (or at least be less demanding than a Rafa or even a Villas-Boas) and their natural reaction is to take money off the table as they don't want to get burned again.

zERo · « **Reply #327 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:46:40 PM »

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/rodgers-transfer-update

Brendan Rodgers insists there is a lot of hard work going on behind the scenes to enable the manager to strengthen his squad ahead of the 2012-13 season.

Liverpool have been linked with a number of players during pre-season and, while keeping his targets close to his chest, the manager is confident he will get the players he desires.

Rodgers told Liverpoolfc.com: "There's a lot of great work going on, obviously with the board and Ian Ayre in particular doing a lot of work behind the scenes. I've got regular contact going with our American owners and, in particular, Mike Gordon from Fenway Sports Group.

"Obviously when it's a club like Liverpool prices are always increased and so on, but I always felt it was important by the beginning of the season we could have the squad we want - and certainly by the end of the transfer window I would hope that will be the case.

"There is lots of speculation. I've seen hundreds of names linked with Liverpool and there's very few of them that were even close to coming here or we have even looked at.

"Unfortunately for the supporters they've got to read it and put up with it. But the message is there is a lot of work going on, on a number of deals and hopefully we can get those completed by the end of August."

Arcadian · « **Reply #328 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:46:48 PM »

Just back to the OP for a second...

Why aren't people entitled to be concerned? I'm quite optimistic, but that largely comes from having Brendan Rodgers here and an interest to see what he can do to restore pass and move to LFC.

People have the right to be concerned about something they love. It's not as if it's all roses is it? There are legitimate concerns about what will happen in the next season or two. That much should be obvious to everyone. Can we not just say thank you to those that wish to keep tabs on the owners for having our best interests at heart, and if they sound like conspiracy theorists from time to time just acknowledge that that's who they are... They worry about the club.

MidwestWool · « **Reply #329 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:46:54 PM »

Some people are so fucking blinded by what they read and are so easy to convince, it's shocking.

JonnyDubb · « **Reply #330 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:47:18 PM »

Quote from: Fat Scouser on July 31, 2012, 05:36:40 PM

I'm off now, got some things to do, but to me it's all pretty obvious... nobody is accusing FSG of being the devil incarnate. They are just foreign business men who've took a punt. They admitted they knew nothing of us or football. They probably only learnt of us because of H&G's financial woes. They seen a global brand going cheap and jumped on it. They have kept only one promise since arriving... improving the commercial side of the brand. They'll keep doing that as much as they can, and that will mean becoming part of the big shiny football family. But they'll sell up as soon as they think the time is right. We'll go to the next lot. They probably won't be any different than this lot. It'll keep going on until something drastic changes in football. It's the way it is. The actual football is the least of their concerns. And, far as I'm concerned, if you can't see that, then you either refuse to see it or you have some reason for not seeing it. It's as blatant as the fat smelly cigar stuck in John Henry's face.

And here, my friend, is the "pit" and lack of an alternate vision I was referring to.

filopastry · « **Reply #331 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:47:50 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:29:24 PM

We weren't looking for a new buyer though H&G were looking for a partner to prop them up and were valuing the Club at between 800m and a billion.

To start with maybe, it rapidly turned into a hunt for a buyer though, personally I don't think we were ever likely to get what we wanted from a new buyer, H&G had just done too much damage to the club in their time here.

I don't actually have an issue with the FSG approach (the club keeps what it earns but it's not getting cash ploughed into it) that's pretty much as good as we were going to get at the price we got sold at and a hell of a lot better than their predecessors.

With the gross funds we had available in 2011 I don't think top 4 was a ludicrous target for 2011-12, but the failure of those signings on top of the inherited issues with the squad have left us in trouble now.

I agree with those who say that generally there is a correlation between wages and league position, the problem is we're the exceptions to that rule given the number of people we're overpaying for what they deliver, so some high earners who aren't delivering will need to be culled, if only to reduce the burden of wages and enable us to invest more heavily in future.

I understand the concern though, obviously the culling of wages could equally be followed by non-investment in order to do a bit of window dressing on the accounts ahead of a sale, assuming FFP isn't enforced then it's fair to wonder if FSG will want to hang around and if they don't what their exit strategy will be.

Libertine · « **Reply #332 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:48:16 PM »

Quote from: zERo on July 31, 2012, 05:46:40 PM

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/rodgers-transfer-update

you missed out the main point in that article:

Get your tickets for Liverpool's Anfield clashes with FC Gomel and Bayer Leverkusen now>>

Get · « **Reply #333 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:48:31 PM »

Well.. the fuck can we do? nothing.

It's the fate of football. U can either hope u get a manager that will create miracles out of scraps, or that a sheikh or a Russian billionaire buys ur club and pumps money into your club. You can have as many protest, sleepless nights, transfer forum rants, moan about it every day, but at the end of the day, supporters are just spectators.

cox3100 · « **Reply #334 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:49:48 PM »

Quote from: MidwestWool on July 31, 2012, 05:46:54 PM

Some people are so fucking blinded by what they read and are so easy to convince, it's shocking.

what are you on about?

people read that we have no money?

or

people read what brendan rodgers says and believe that?

koptician · « **Reply #335 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:51:01 PM »

Quote from: zERo on July 31, 2012, 05:46:40 PM

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/rodgers-transfer-update

Brendan Rodgers insists there is a lot of hard work going on behind the scenes to enable the manager to strengthen his squad ahead of the 2012-13 season.

Liverpool have been linked with a number of players during pre-season and, while keeping his targets close to his chest, the manager is confident he will get the players he desires.

Rodgers told Liverpoolfc.com: "There's a lot of great work going on, obviously with the board and Ian Ayre in particular doing a lot of work behind the scenes. I've got regular contact going with our American owners and, in particular, Mike Gordon from Fenway Sports Group.

"Obviously when it's a club like Liverpool prices are always increased and so on, but I always felt it was important by the beginning of the season we could have the squad we want - and certainly by the end of the transfer window I would hope that will be the case.

"There is lots of speculation. I've seen hundreds of names linked with Liverpool and there's very few of them that were even close to coming here or we have even looked at.

"Unfortunately for the supporters they've got to read it and put up with it. But the message is there is a lot of work going on, on a number of deals and hopefully we can get those completed by the end of August."

We'll see. I hope he's right.

The Grinch · « **Reply #336 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:52:46 PM »

Quote from: krispy.red on July 31, 2012, 05:43:27 PM

No he wasn't wrong. And FSG said the same things when the bought they club. They also said they wouldn't saddle us with debt, which so far looks true.

So what do you propose next? Campaign to get FSG out and hope oil money buys us?

I think the way forward would be for a proper Football structure to be put in place and for the fans to be allowed to purchase part of the Club so that as a fanbase we know that there are people within the upper echelons of the Club who see LFC as the core business as FSG would put it.

They have shared ownership of NESN and Fenway Rousch Racing so why not LFC.

smicer07 · « **Reply #337 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:53:14 PM »

Ian Ayre playing a big role again then.

The G in Gerrard · « **Reply #338 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:53:56 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:52:46 PM

I think the way forward would be for a proper Football structure to be put in place and for the fans to be allowed to purchase part of the Club so that as a fanbase we know that there are people within the upper echelons of the Club who see LFC as the core business as FSG would put it.

They have shared ownership of NESN and Fenway Rousch Racing so why not LFC.

How realistic is that and are we asking for that just because we are Liverpool fans?

conman · « **Reply #339 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:53:58 PM »

I echo many of the concers. But im still prepared to give them time. I could have a different view after xmas however.

For those that query how we have men in charge who know less than the supporters. Well we had that for the past 2 decades.

Mumm-Ra · « **Reply #340 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:55:46 PM »

Quote from: Fat Scouser on July 31, 2012, 05:36:40 PM

I'm off now, got some things to do, but to me it's all pretty obvious... nobody is accusing FSG of being the devil incarnate. They are just foreign business men who've took a punt. They admitted they knew nothing of us or football. They probably only learnt of us because of H&G's financial woes. They seen a global brand going cheap and jumped on it. They have kept only one promise since arriving... improving the commercial side of the brand. They'll keep doing that as much as they can, and that will mean becoming part of the big shiny football family. But they'll sell up as soon as they think the time is right. We'll go to the next lot. They probably won't be any different than this lot. It'll keep going on until something drastic changes in football. It's the way it is.

I can agree with all this until this part:

Quote

The actual football is the least of their concerns. And, far as I'm concerned, if you can't see that, then you either refuse to see it or you have some reason for not seeing it. It's as blatant as the fat smelly cigar stuck in John Henry's face.

Having a good PR machine and commercial value does you no good if you are in mid-table mediocrity. LFC simply have to be successful for FSG to be successful. Ideally that level of success would be winning the league but if all it really comes down to is getting back in the top 4, then I'm OK with that in the short-term.

It looked like they were fully ready to put together an amazing team this summer - Bergistain (sp?), Van Gaal as DoF or whatever, and a young manager. Maybe that whole escapade was some elaborate smokescreen to fool us all but I doubt they are that Machiavellian. Now whatever happened - my thought is they just couldn't get the personnel to agree and ended up going for Rodgers and the more traditional English managerial route - but whatever was going on behind the scenes - and whether it was well-managed or complete chaos, my take is that they were fully willing to write to some huge cheques to put the structure in place. And that's all I want from them - the willingness to write cheques to make us successful. That's what they are there for.

If at the end of this, and the next, transfer window, all we are left with is evidence of them reducing wages and turning us into a shoestring team then I will freak out, frankly. But I'm still optimistic that they are going to make an attempt - might not be successful, but they will try - to get us back up on top. If we win the league and cement ourselves as a CL team they can put a for-sale sign up and I'll wish them well

RyanBabel19 · « **Reply #341 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:55:53 PM »

Quote from: Kasper on July 31, 2012, 05:36:57 PM

Wasn't that quote in the context of the commercial potential of LFC to operate within the rules of Financial Fairplay?

Nope in was in direct response to a question on the return of (current) player investment

To me its something that just shouldn't have been said but that's just me, i'm tired of all the bullshit talk instead of just sticking to saying little and leading with your actions instead

The Grinch · « **Reply #342 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:56:02 PM »

Quote from: The G in Gerrard on July 31, 2012, 05:53:56 PM

How realistic is that and are we asking for that just because we are Liverpool fans?

We had Shareholders meetings and representation with in the Club 5 years ago why can't we have it now.

CraigDS · « **Reply #343 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:56:27 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:52:46 PM

I think the way forward would be for a proper Football structure to be put in place and for the fans to be allowed to purchase part of the Club so that as a fanbase we know that there are people within the upper echelons of the Club who see LFC as the core business as FSG would put it.

They have shared ownership of NESN and Fenway Rousch Racing so why not LFC.

The shared ownership is with other companies isn't it, not fans. The two are very different!

El jefe · « **Reply #344 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:57:50 PM »

My main concern right now is the role Ian Ayre continues to play. Seems to have his finger in every pie at our club, and yet i wouldn't trust him one tiny bit.

The G in Gerrard · « **Reply #345 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:58:24 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:56:02 PM

We had Shareholders meetings and representation with in the Club 5 years ago why can't we have it now.

Things and time move on? I don't know how things are at other clubs like Man City, PSG, Malaga etc but are the fans for those clubs - shareholders at all?

krispy.red · « **Reply #346 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:59:18 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 05:52:46 PM

I think the way forward would be for a proper Football structure to be put in place and for the fans to be allowed to purchase part of the Club so that as a fanbase we know that there are people within the upper echelons of the Club who see LFC as the core business as FSG would put it.

They have shared ownership of NESN and Fenway Rousch Racing so why not LFC.

They aren't shared with fans though right? I just don't think it's feasible in today's game. Who gets the majority of voting rights, the fans or FSG?

The Grinch · « **Reply #347 on:** July 31, 2012, 05:59:27 PM »

Quote from: Mumm-Ra on July 31, 2012, 05:55:46 PM

I can agree with all this until this part:

Having a good PR machine and commercial value does you no good if you are in mid-table mediocrity. LFC simply have to be successful for FSG to be successful. Ideally that level of success would be winning the league but if all it really comes down to is getting back in the top 4, then I'm OK with that in the short-term.

It looked like they were fully ready to put together an amazing team this summer - Bergistain (sp?), Van Gaal as DoF or whatever, and a young manager. Maybe that whole escapade was some elaborate smokescreen to fool us all but I doubt they are that Machiavellian. Now whatever happened - my thought is they just couldn't get the personnel to agree and ended up going for Rodgers and the more traditional English managerial route - but whatever was going on behind the scenes - and whether it was well-managed or complete chaos, my take is that they were fully willing to write to some huge cheques to put the structure in place. And that's all I want from them - the willingness to write cheques to make us successful. That's what they are there for.

If at the end of this, and the next, transfer window, all we are left with is evidence of them reducing wages and turning us into a shoestring team then I will freak out, frankly. But I'm still optimistic that they are going to make an attempt - might not be successful, but they will try - to get us back up on top. If we win the league and cement ourselves as a CL team they can put a for-sale sign up and I'll wish them well

The best financial results Arsenal have had have been since they stopped being successful and stopped winning things. You don't need to win to be successful and when you are competing with City and Chelsea it is virtually impossible to be financially successful and win things. Manage expectations reduce costs and live off the TV money, the commercial deals and the spin offs.

FitzLFC80 · « **Reply #348 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:11:40 PM »

In the words of Private Frazer "we're doooooomed" I said "we're dooooomed"!

I've never heard so much nonsense in all my life. We've not kicked a competitive ball yet and already there are concerns. When will people lighten up and get with the programme?! All this bullshit of us having no money, the new stadium not being built, FSG looking to sell, no CEO. WTF its border line stupidity. why dont a few of you go on holiday and take a break rather drumming up hysteria.

None of this happens over night, but as usual with the arm chair fan that reads newspapers and tunes into sky sports needs all this to happen within 24 hours or their head will explode. Whatever happened to patience? Since FSG have taken over they have increased our commercial revenue, thus enabling us to try and compete with the mega billionaires in this league. Not an easy task to suddenly turn that around. They spent £100m (£40-£60m Nett) on players that haven't performed. Not their fault but they backed the manager regardless.

So far this pre-season, we have sold a 32 and 31 yr old that were coming to the end of the careers possibly on mega money. We have replaced one of them with a 21yr old italian international for £8m. Seems to me like a good deal. We are now trying to get rid of an underperforming player in Carroll. Love him or hate him he didnt perform last season its as simple as that. We are trying to raise funds by doing this to add to the money given by the owners (whatever that budget is no one on here or in the media know) so we can attract the players Rogers needs to get us back into a challenging position. Fans can debate all day long who should stay or go, but behind the scenes the manager is the one qualified to make that judgement.

Its the 31st July, we play a team of part timers in a couple of days. We should have enough quality already to beat them. Before the end of the transfer window i would expect Rogers to have the players he needs to build on. Its frustrating to hear silence from the club in terms of transfers but as Rogers has already pointed out the club as always are working hard to bring their plans to fruition. Just need to give them time.

Carolina Red · « **Reply #349 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:12:23 PM »

Quote from: Al 555 on July 31, 2012, 04:59:29 PM

The big problem with that is that Football only has two directions, you can't tread water until you understand the Sport, you either move forwards or backwards we have done the latter. Quite simply they bought a business they know absolutely nothing about because it was undervalued without a plan to take the Club forward. A sensible thing for me would of been for FSG to appoint an experienced Football administrator, pick his brains and then slowly and gradually implement their ideas as they gained knowledge.

Instead they appointed a man in Comolli with a terrible record basically because he shared their philosophy and was friendly with Billy Beane, they then compounded that error by handing him a warchest and allowing him to spend it without having the necessary Football knowledge within the hierarchy of the Club to know whether he was making credible signings or not. Instead of having an experienced operator decide whether Comolli was making the right decisions they tried to do that themselves. Carroll + 15m = Torres sums up that lack of knowledge perfectly.

The actual deal was bad enough but it ensured that everything one and their dog knew we were absolute novices in the transfer market. Even worse the signing of a slow traditional number nine dictated our future transfer policy and meant we needed to go down the route of purchasing chance providers for a forward who couldn't create his own.

The problem for me is that they are only reshaping the commercial and PR side of the Club they have shelved their plans for a DoF or a collegiate structure and have left Ayre running the Club on a day to day business. Like Comolli's signings Ayre might make sense to numbers people like FSG because he brings in revenue but he simply does not cut it as a Football operator as the Suarez debacle showed.

As for FSG looking to move the Club on I can't see it myself, we are the next step for Fenway's attempts to bring untaxed revenue into the Red Sox their core business. They freely admitted they went into NASCAR racing with Fenway Rousch to promote the brand and to bring in extra revenue. For me we are the next extension to that and why NESV became the Fenway Sports Group. Their aim for me is to cross brand and cross promote the Red Sox, to get the Fenway brand into new markets in the far east and in Europe. Henry and Co have a problem in that they cannot market the Red Sox outside of their franchise area of New England so instead they have taken the iconic Fenway name and rebranded themselves.

To cross brand and cross promote they don't really need to push the boat out and compete at the top end of the market they have inherited a brand with 200m supporters world wide. They just need to run LFC in a sensible way, make the Club pay it's way and then take advantage of the mass appeal of the LFC brand throughout the World.

You just have this saved as a "cut and paste" don't you?

I love your passion for the club and agree with you on numerous issues, but many of your assumptions regarding how Major League Baseball works, or how deals are financed, are not accurate.

MolbyLovesGravy · « **Reply #350 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:13:45 PM »

Been gone for a while, but let me address some of the posts.
Simply said, you don't need quotes to say right now we are doing an excellent job of lowering the wage bill. And it would be insane to think that is not part of a plan, it would be crazy not to. If you thought you could lower your mortgage and get a house as nice, or nicer, wouldn't you do it?
Thus far we have got rid of Aurelio, Kuyt and Maxi, that is probably 200,000 a week right there, maybe more. Aqua seems to be very close, that is another 80,000, 100,000 or 120,000 depending on who you ask. Be very surprising if Carroll is here, that is another 80,000.
We didn't get Sigurdsson because we decided he wasn't worth the 60,000 or so Spurs offered. Again, if that was the judgement then fine, I am not knocking the club for that.
Reports have Borini at 40,000, Allen would not be higher than that, probably less. Dempsey is on about 40,000 I think at Fulham, so he may get 50,000 even 60,000.
Intentional or not, we seem to be shifting players on 70-100 grand a week for players on 30-60. That is more in line with a team in 6th-8th rather than 1st-4th. Am I wrong in that?
Again, if it works, if we get the right players then hell yeah, we have done amazing and off we go.

BUSHMILLS · « **Reply #351 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:20:16 PM »

Quote from: El jefe on July 31, 2012, 05:57:50 PM

My main concern right now is the role Ian Ayre continues to play. Seems to have his finger in every pie at our club, and yet i wouldn't trust him one tiny bit.

Has his finger in every pie?

Who does he think he is...the Managing Director?

justsean · « **Reply #352 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:20:39 PM »

Quote from: MolbyLovesGravy on July 31, 2012, 06:13:45 PM

Been gone for a while, but let me address some of the posts.
Simply said, you don't need quotes to say right now we are doing an excellent job of lowering the wage bill. And it would be insane to think that is not part of a plan, it would be crazy not to. If you thought you could lower your mortgage and get a house as nice, or nicer, wouldn't you do it?
Thus far we have got rid of Aurelio, Kuyt and Maxi, that is probably 200,000 a week right there, maybe more. Aqua seems to be very close, that is another 80,000, 100,000 or 120,000 depending on who you ask. Be very surprising if Carroll is here, that is another 80,000.
We didn't get Sigurdsson because we decided he wasn't worth the 60,000 or so Spurs offered. Again, if that was the judgement then fine, I am not knocking the club for that.
Reports have Borini at 40,000, Allen would not be higher than that, probably less. Dempsey is on about 40,000 I think at Fulham, so he may get 50,000 even 60,000.
Intentional or not, we seem to be shifting players on 70-100 grand a week for players on 30-60. That is more in line with a team in 6th-8th rather than 1st-4th. Am I wrong in that?
Again, if it works, if we get the right players then hell yeah, we have done amazing and off we go.

This is a very fine point.

The question then becomes - is it our long term goal to have a wage cap? The type of wage cap where as soon as Suarez, Skrtel, Agger, Lucas etc. get to the top of it, they end up leaving because all the bigger clubs will pay more...

My guess is that we are trying to lower our wages to that of a club typically in 6th - 8th position and then when ( if ) we get back into the top 4 we will bring our wages back up to match the other top 4 teams (bar the crazy cases Man City and Chelsea have).

It's Jimmy Corkhill · « **Reply #353 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:22:03 PM »

I'm worried. I'm worried the owners are tightening the purse strings and consolidating at a time when we are at a low ebb. We seem to be battering the wage budget. The players that have gone need replacing, and I can't see us signing more than 3 players, maximum.

Remember Rafa saying if the right man was in charge, the team would finish where it lay in the wage table. I think FSG are hoping Rodgers, metaphorically, pulls a rabbit out of the hat. We need more quality, it's as simple as that.

KeithK83 · « **Reply #354 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:29:51 PM »

You know what, I would be lying if i said i didnt have some concerns. And many of the issues raised by the OP touch on these. However there is one thing I cant understand and maybe someone can help me out here. If FSG are only interested in the commercial side of the business to make a tidy profit and sell on, how does this grow without some success. Lets face it, we arent going to see revenues jump greatly from current levels if we continue in mid-table mediocrity are we? Surely not. Seems to me that the way to maximize commercial revenues is to bring success on the field. Now im obviously not in marketing or anything like that and like I said I have concerns about what FSG are planning for us, but to me this idea of managed mediocrity doesn't really fit well with some scheme to make a quick buck on revenue growth,(in essence in order for revenue to grow you need a successful product and in footie that means winning things or CL footie year in year out) at least not much more than they are currently making. Sorry if it sounds a tad naive.

Trada · « **Reply #355 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:33:53 PM »

Quote from: MolbyLovesGravy on July 31, 2012, 06:13:45 PM

Been gone for a while, but let me address some of the posts.
Simply said, you don't need quotes to say right now we are doing an excellent job of lowering the wage bill. And it would be insane to think that is not part of a plan, it would be crazy not to. If you thought you could lower your mortgage and get a house as nice, or nicer, wouldn't you do it?
Thus far we have got rid of Aurelio, Kuyt and Maxi, that is probably 200,000 a week right there, maybe more. Aqua seems to be very close, that is another 80,000, 100,000 or 120,000 depending on who you ask. Be very surprising if Carroll is here, that is another 80,000.
We didn't get Sigurdsson because we decided he wasn't worth the 60,000 or so Spurs offered. Again, if that was the judgement then fine, I am not knocking the club for that.
Reports have Borini at 40,000, Allen would not be higher than that, probably less. Dempsey is on about 40,000 I think at Fulham, so he may get 50,000 even 60,000.
Intentional or not, we seem to be shifting players on 70-100 grand a week for players on 30-60. That is more in line with a team in 6th-8th rather than 1st-4th. Am I wrong in that?
Again, if it works, if we get the right players then hell yeah, we have done amazing and off we go.

I don't get all this fuss about lowering the wage bill, If you want to get top players you need to pay top wages.

If lowering the wage bill means they would lower ticket prices I could understand it.

You pay top wages for top players and these players bring excitement and shirt and merchandising sales goes up which helps to off set their wages a little.

kevmck · « **Reply #356 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:35:03 PM »

some real panicky people here - think back to not so long ago under H&G. A large number of us would have taken relegation to get rid of them and pay down the debt. A lot of us were fully on board with the idea that the club needed to be brought back into a sound financial sense.

how quickly we forget. new owners, debt paid down.. ridiculous wage bill being trimmed.. new manager.. and an obvious rebuilding phase.

like it or not - failures from past owners and poor negotiation on players are hounding us to this day - and unfortunately, that has led to us slipping down the league.. and then people are surprised when some of our best players are rumoured to want away. Its the nature of the game, its crap.. but it is what it is.

for me - i'm happy with how things are going - I wasn't happy with Kenny being removed, but I'll stand behind Rodgers and support his rebuilding effort. If that means sucking it up while we lose some of our past stars, then thats what it is. We will have new stars.. and we'll remember those who've left fondly, but we'll move on. And as for the league.. we'll ascend again - we just need to be willing to give it time.

as for everyone slamming fsg - remember where we were. now look at where we are. then shut up. theres no sign of them asset stripping us, theres no sign of them milking the club for its cash and spending it on their other sports teams. They're being sensible, which apparently is a travesty for some of you - but a sound financial footing is more important than league position in this day and age.. look around at some of the clubs in financial crisis.. look at Rangers.. that could have been us.. but its not, and we have fsg to thank for that. The stadium nonsense will get resolved at some point - chances are it'll be a redevelopment of anfield, which will have the panic-mongers crying doom and gloom that fsg won't spend the money.. completely forgetting that a LOT of fans didn't want any part of a new stadium which would take away the anfield atmosphere.. no pleasing some people I suppose.

PaulMcC · « **Reply #357 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:35:39 PM »

I think the owners have done very little good since buying the club and clearing most of the debt.

I think they've done a lot of things wrong, and I'm worried they want the wage bill cut but won't put plenty of money back in to the club.

If they don't put in some of their own money to get us going, we won't make top 4 for years to come.

L666KOP · « **Reply #358 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:36:48 PM »

Quote from: Fordy on July 31, 2012, 04:25:56 PM

Until I see the new stadium being buit or Anfield being redevelopment on a decent scale then I will always believe that FSG have an exit plan.

Buy the club - increase commercial awareness - sell at a profit.

Sell the club without building a new stadium or invest in Anfield.

Baseball is their game - their love. Football or soccer is a business to them.

FSG will have two exit strategies mate, and I guarantee they were in place before they signed to buy the club.
No self respecting business man will buy anything he expects to sell without knowing how he can sell it.
He will have his preferred strategy, and a contingency strategy.
I'm guessing preferred will be to inflate the brand aggressively on a global scale, and increase stadium revenue by the cheapest option, redevelopment, whilst trotting out the usual 'history, special nights, spiritual home' bollocks, which may well be true, but it's a ready made excuse when they're asked why the spade's still in the shed.
The playing side will take second fiddle, as long as we remain semi competitive, and challenging for honours we'll be fine.
And we'll do that the same way, by spending as little as we can.

scouse29 · « **Reply #359 on:** July 31, 2012, 06:44:51 PM »

You really can't please some people. We have been in a vicious circle since Rafa left. He was hounded out by thousands of our supporters. Everything was set as he wanted and we have been seeking that stability ever since. We have created within a bunch of so called fans that just can't be pleased. The club can't please everyone and never will, nor will we all agree on the strategy.

I here people moan about the stadium but can't see how the numbers don't seem to stack up, the same people moan about he lack of transfer activity and then moan about he players we have brought in waiting to say I told you he was shit. Will these be the same people moaning if we have a slow start in the PL or a few dodgy results which will happen. Sack BR told you he was rubbish!!

It's tiresome reading all the negative comments. Lets judge the squad when the window has shut, let's judge he players at the end of he season, let's judge the owners after a sustained period of time. Let's give BR the chance to install his vision or let's just fucking moan about everything.