Author Topic: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.  (Read 1502 times)

Offline Carlos: Very Kickable

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Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« on: June 9, 2012, 10:06:04 PM »

So I'm new to betting and betting exchanges but thought i would dabble a bit with the start of Euro Championships.

Not knowing much about how to go about things I though what I'd like to do is construct a system with the aim of growing an initial fund by 10% a month. Im hoping by consistently doing this i'll have tripled my money in a year.

So my strategy is to use small bets between 1.05 and 1.20 where I watch amatch and make a decision on whether I think a certain side is almost certain to win or not. If so and the odds are within the right range I place the bet. I am going to concentrate on matches such as national U21 teams where I dont havbe an emotional stake in either side and there are fewer players that can have a match turning performance on their own and where the relative effects of coaching and infrastructure are more important on the teams.

So far I have increased my stake by 25% after four bets but am already experiencing some buttock clenching moments.

ANy ideas on how to improve / replace my system for something better  - all advice greatfuly received!

Also I was wondering about the formation of a RAWK betting 'brains trust'  - take four or five members who know their onions to combine forces and back bets with higher odds - what do you think?
I know you struggle with reading comprehension Carlitos, but do try to pay attention

Offline Clayton Bigsby

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #1 on: June 9, 2012, 10:50:29 PM »
my advice is to save yourself, delete this thread and forget you ever heard of a thing called gambling

2nd piece of advice as I know the first was a waste of time. I would suggest fully researching all your bets. Novelty bets can come off but its the fully researched bets that bring home the bacon. Soccerway.com and futbol24.com are good websites to analyse form.

Offline Ickle Girl

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #2 on: June 9, 2012, 10:51:31 PM »
my advice is to save yourself, delete this thread and forget you ever heard of a thing called gambling

2nd piece of advice as I know the first was a waste of time. I would suggest fully researching all your bets. Novelty bets can come off but its the fully researched bets that bring home the bacon. Soccerway.com and futbol24.com are good websites to analyse form.

This is the best advice.

Offline SMD

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #3 on: June 9, 2012, 11:16:40 PM »
Bet on no hat trick to be scored.
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Offline Carlos: Very Kickable

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #4 on: June 9, 2012, 11:55:14 PM »
my advice is to save yourself, delete this thread and forget you ever heard of a thing called gambling

2nd piece of advice as I know the first was a waste of time. I would suggest fully researching all your bets. Novelty bets can come off but its the fully researched bets that bring home the bacon. Soccerway.com and futbol24.com are good websites to analyse form.

Thanks bud!! i will give those sites a try
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Offline Djimis Telescopic Leg

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #5 on: June 9, 2012, 11:56:00 PM »
Become a bookie or cheat at cards.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2012, 12:15:29 AM »
move to italy and make friends with some ref's
they are only great because we are on our knees......let us arise!

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2012, 12:20:25 AM »
my advice is to save yourself, delete this thread and forget you ever heard of a thing called gambling

2nd piece of advice as I know the first was a waste of time. I would suggest fully researching all your bets. Novelty bets can come off but its the fully researched bets that bring home the bacon. Soccerway.com and futbol24.com are good websites to analyse form.

I'd take the first piece of advice. Reading through the gambling thread in the 'Boozer' section and you'll learn about some horror stories some members on here have been through due to gambling. There is no such thing really as certs as one example was the Portugal v Cape Islands friendly before World Cup 2010 - Portugal were 1.02/1.03 to win and ended up drawing 0-0.

By all means test your system out if you gamble responsibly and don't go chasing any losses. But my advice will be just to keep to small stakes on Saturday and midweek European games which are more enjoyable than betting on Estonia U19s vs Poland U19s which unless you do thorough research into you'll have no real insight into.
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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2012, 12:46:19 AM »
It's funny you know.

When I first started gambling it was very straightforward, just like you said, I wanted to have some low-risk strategy that allowed me to bet everything on short-odds results (for me it was total goals 1 or greater, around 1.05-1.10), and over the course of time I would be able to build up a small stake into a large pot.

Funnily enough I did pretty well to start with, turned $20 into 50 (but then lost it) a few times, always thought to myself "ah fuck it I only lost $20" but then got impatient and next time would start with $30 because I didn't want to have to wait so long, only winning $1 at a time wasn't good enough. Then because I had lost a few initial stakes I thought I would recoup the money by placing a larger stake on a slightly longer (but still pretty short) odds result, say 1.25-1.30. Needless to say, a few of those missed and before I knew it I'd lost a few hundred $. As a result I realised that I didn't want my life to pan out like that, and that gambling was ruining my love of sport, and that actually the best thing for me was to forget about sports betting and simply focus on enjoying sport as a spectacle.

And ultimately I realised after the event that the biggest part of the problem was that I didn't see the money I put into it as a write-off (which I should have done), I saw it as an investment, in the same way that you described: all I need to do is increase my pot by say 10% a month. Actually the way to look at gambling is like buying a pint, you pay x amount and the value is what you consume, rather than the prospect that you might get any money back (for this reason I can quite happily go to the horses or the dogs, I know if I spend £20 there then it's because it is part of the entertainment, if I don't get it back I don't care). Whereas when you try to "build a system" where you are aiming for a specific % return on your investment, then over the long run you will lose every time (unless you are somehow cheating the system).

The reason for this is simple: Bookies make their living by offering odds that are lower than they should be for the inherent risk involved in the event.

Anyway, to get back on to why I started this thread with a "it's funny you know". I have avoided sports betting for the majority of the last 2 years, except for a couple of occasions - namely, when the bookies throw in a free offer. When I stopped gambling online, I didn't close my accounts, so from time to time I get an email saying "if you deposit up to $X, we'll match 50% of your deposit as a free bet". I got one of those a few days back, and replied to the email asking for clarification that I was allowed to deposit my own money, claim the free bet, withdraw my own money (without gambling it) and still use the free bet.

The guy replied saying "you're free to do what you want with your own money, but withdrawing the funds after depositing would be missing the point of this generous offer". My heart bleeds for this poor charitable organisation who are relying on the goodwill of gamblers to make ends meet.

Anyway, I realise that this is probably a major downer on your original post - I would be lying if I said that I was sorry for that. IMHO I agree with the guy who replied "delete this thread, save yourself, and forget you ever heard of a thing called gambling".

If you are still reading, and still want to go ahead with your plan, then you could try something extreme, such as no hat trick (super low odds, though RAWK will take the piss out of you eternally, as there was a guy on here a while back who tried the same thing, and pretty much his first game he called that then someone scored a hat trick). Otherwise, I had some success with "1 goal or more" markets, the odds are usually 1.03-1.15 (as extremes), though you will need a lot of discipline, as they only increase in value very slowly (and set yourself a limit after which you cash in). Alternatively you can pick a sport where it is head-to-head and the draw either doesn't exist or is extremely unlikely (i.e. tennis, or most American sports, I used to do it on Aussie Rules).

[As an aside, I had a couple of mates in Oz who did the game where you start the season with $100 and every week bet it on a short-priced favourite, in the range $1.20-1.50. They got through 9 weeks and had turned their initial stake into $3000, all of us told them to cash out and spend the money on a holiday or something, instead they said "Nah it's all good, there's one this week that's totally nailed on, we'll do that and then maybe think about it". Anyway turned out that week that Richmond (perennial whipping boys) played away at Port Adelaide, instead of getting smashed they took the lead early and it stayed like that for most of the game. My mates started off calm "Oh Port Adelaide are bound to come back, Richmond will choke" etc etc, as the clock went on the margin narrowed but with only seconds on the clock Richmond were still up, my mates were just sitting there looking sicker and sicker. Suddenly out of nowhere one of the Port Adelaide players took a massive pack mark (i.e. jumped through a ruck of players to catch the ball cleanly) then went on to score the wining goal with seconds left. I said to my mate "Wow that was lucky, surely you must cash out now", but by the next weekend they had gone and stuck their whole $3000 on again. That week's pick got rolled and they lost the whole lot - when I asked him how it felt to $3000, he said "nah not really we only started with $100, over the course of 10 weeks that's only $10 a week"].

What I would say is if you really want to use this as an investment strategy, work out exactly what your target is and when you reach it, cash out. Otherwise it is very easy to get sucked into the temptation of just putting on bet after bet until you eventually lose. Also, be prepared for the feeling AFTER every results comes in - if you have won, there will be the voice in your head that says "I should have put more on, it was so obvious", and if you've lost there's the voice that says "Shit, now I need to make it up, next time I'll just start with a bigger stake so I make my losses back". If you can avoid BOTH of those over the long term then you're doing better than I ever did.

Hmm I'm suddenly feeling like I should have put this in the thread started by rafas3leggedtable.

Whatever you do buddy, good luck with it :wave
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 01:01:59 AM by Rusty »
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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2012, 12:51:50 AM »
And just to follow up my complete downer of a post:

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=270594.msg8162333#msg8162333

Read through this before you do anything.
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Offline kevin89

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2012, 07:45:48 AM »
Excellent post Rusty. Very sound advice.

I started gambling very recently, and I do it just for fun. I still play very small bets. And by small I mean €5 maximum.
The key word in Rusty's post is discipline. So far I can say I managed it quite well. I do sometimes bet on some stupid/pointless games, especially when I'm chasing. However, when a while back I was on a bit of a roll and increased my pot from €20 to €50, I cashed out €30 of it immediately, because I knew that if I left it there, it would all go down the drain. On the other hand, when I was losing €20 after €20 after €20, I stopped playing for a few months. I knew that it would only get worse before it got better.

As I said, personally I handle it quite well, however don't think for one second that it is easy. Keep your discipline. Also if you are going to start gambling, make sure you have a fixed budget. If you blow it, don't put in more money just to make up for your losses. If you're going to use betting sites, there are options that limit your deposits. It's a great way to restrict yourself.

Finally, you have to remember, the bookies always win.

Offline Haemogoblin

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2012, 09:39:06 AM »
There is no reliable betting 'system'.

I managed to totally luck out on a long winning streak of short odds-high stakes bets, and I decided to just quit while I was ahead, which took immense discipline because I then started dreaming about how long that streak would've continued if I hadn't stopped; almost kicking myself for having decided to do the sensible thing. Looking back (I posted a few smugass screenshots in the football bets, boxing and aftertiming threads), it was only by ridiculous sustained good fortune that I didn't suffer a significant loss - I certainly came too close for comfort a number of times (Pacquiao-Marquez 3 specifically), which ultimately made me pack it in. I made over 7 grand in total, also taking into consideration a few early losses before my freak streak began, but could very easily have lost absolutely everything on a couple of bad results. I've only placed 2 bets in all of 2012 so far, and both only £70 stakes (and both winners!! LOL :P - FA Cup & CL Final; compo bets that unfortunately came in).

Essentially, would you quit during a winning run? Or at least while you're significantly ahead? Easier said than done... I had to ban myself from any gambling websites, such was the impulse to keep it going and squeeze more out of it. That Pacquiao-Marquez fight was a very useful wake-up call, because I and a great many others felt I should really have lost the £3000+ (stupid, yes) that I backed Pacquiao with; the dodgy decision saved me, and made me reassess everything I was doing.

A high stakes-short odds 'system' will ultimately bite you on the arse something fierce if you're not extremely careful (and even if you are); a low stakes-short odds one will seem like a waste of time before long, and tempt you into raising your stakes. The only halfway-decent approach is to thoroughly research every facet of your bets, bet rarely & only ever on odds which give you good value, and wager only what you can afford to throw away - and that'll still bugger you up if you don't just happen to have lady luck on your side.


Also, anyone with a very impulsive personality should just stay away completely, 'cause it will mostly likely be your ruin. And if you have any trouble with depression, the sheer peaks and troughs of big wins & losses could needlessly plunge you into difficulties in that regard - bookies are as dependent on punters' delicate brain chemistry as they are on their outright stupidity.

Reasoned, casual betting under £100 or so every now and then is never a big deal for anyone that can afford it, but I think 'systems' are misguided, not least because they take most of the fun out of it. And any 'nailed-on' multiple over a fourfold is pretty much guaranteed to tease you, and then mug you. ;D
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 09:53:50 AM by Haemoglobin »
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Offline Carlos: Very Kickable

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2012, 02:46:58 PM »
Thanks for the great advice everyone - Keane, Haemoglobin and especially Rusty im extremely grateful for - in terms of practical advice and also more imprortantly the key to a winning mentality.

I should explain im doing it to see how difficult it is to get right. I have deposited 200 quid into a betfair account and already written that off. My intention was to see how much i could grow it using a system.If it all goes tits up I am not putting a single penny in further as a rule ive set myself  - if I cant do it with that money im not going to succeed by throwing more after it. I'm more than happy to bet thousands of pounds on an event with the proviso that ive made that money in the first place on the markets.

I've already had my first setback and it will be a valuable lesson to me in terms of managing my discipline.

So, since yesterday I was working on my computer and had the sport on in the backgroud. I saw how the Germans were dominating in their match and wondering who was going to score (I had a hunch for Podolski). With that in mind I backed Germany to win when they came in at halftime 0-0 at 2.8 to 1. Eventually they came out and scored and I cashed in on the exchange at 2.2 to 1 rather than wait for the end of the match (which saved some buttock clenching moments as Portugal came close). My reasoning was that I was happy with my small gain and didnt want it being put at risk by a free kick from arguably the best player at the tournament.

Later i was watching the big Boston Miami Basketball match and unning and ahing about backing LeBron to score more than 31.5 point (he'd just won 45 points against the Celtics in the last match). In the event I didnt - which was lucky as he finished on 31 I think.

Also watching the match however was Manny Pacquaio who delayed the start of his fight with Timothy Bradley. This was the main event i was waiting for as boxing is one of my favourite sports. There were a lot of commentators saying before the match that they rated Bradley as the sternest test Manny or Floyd mayweather could be facing apart from each other so I decided to watch the first round.

Well I didnt have to watch much before it was clear that Manny was going to win. It was obvious to me that Bradley was in superb condition but in terms of his style it was so limited it was like watching an Allardyce team set up against a Rafa side. Paqcuaio was just to classy for him and seemed to be able to hit him at will with his left hand without even trying that hard. Not only that but his punches were jarring Bradley whose own punches didnt seem to bother Manny one bit. In fact he often seemed to be laughing them off. At the end of the round I put 60 quid on Manny at 1.8-1. After watching another three rounds in which Bradley was utterly dominated and seemed to have given up, I put another 60 quid on at 1.2-1. In my mind there was no way in hell Bradley was knocking Manny out and I couldnt see Manny losing enough rounds in that condition to lose on points.

Even the commentators grew bored as the fight wore on - they conceeded that Manny was just different class and how dispiriting it must have been for Bradley. It was a foregone conclusion. The boxing thread on RAWK is actually quite funny to read when it went down to a points decision and it went to Bradley! Even he looked sheepish afterwards, getting booed by the crowd and saying he would watch the replay to see if he had won the fight. Being generous Id have given him two rounds of the twelve - the worst decision I've ever seen.

So now i'm in a situation where I suppose it would be tempting to write that off as one episode of extremely bad luck and ignore it - however since I've set myself that rule im not going to do that. Im going to recoup and manage my existing float to recoup themoney that I lost in small increments again. As you rightly say, its a question of discipline. Lose that and you've lost before you've started.

EDIT: Hmm - just checked my betfair account and for some reason none of the money i put on the boxing has actually been taken out of my account - anyone know WTF has happened?
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 03:03:44 PM by Carlos Qiqabal »
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Offline BMW

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2012, 08:32:38 AM »
Money management and getting the best odds you can.


Offline BMW

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2012, 09:02:26 AM »
See if you expect at first to win say 2% profit on your outlay (pro gamblers make about 5%), that will be for every:

$500 you bet you win $10

For example that might be:

$100 on 6/5 >LOST
$100 on 7/4 > LOST
$100 on 4/6 > LOST
$100 on 10/9 >WIN
$100 on 2/1 > WIN

Now let's say after losing your first two bets (the 6/5 and 7/4) and the fact it is a odds on favorite, looks the goods etc etc... you decide to up your stake to $170 so that you will get back half the money you lost on your first two bets... if you win great but if you lose that bet it would be the difference between winning a little on the day and losing big. Not to mention if your last bet/the 2/1 did not come in, you would have $290 on the day = 58% of your outlay.

If you had not of tried to 'get back your money' and just keep betting the same amount you would have won your 2% ($10)

As it is you lost 10% or $60 (of your outlay for the day)

>>also if that 10/9 bet that won you $110, was 9/10 you have only won $90 and made a $10 loss over your 5 bets)

It's no wonder it's so hard to make money on sportsbetting.

One mis-step can set you back weeks or even months, make them on a regular basis and you'll be broke before you know it.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 09:25:09 AM by BMW »

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2012, 11:01:48 AM »
In my opinion the only real way to make money is to lay not back.

One good way is to back something with the bookmakers when they give an enhanced price. For example Ladbrokes usually give special odds for an hour on a Saturday, say Suarez to score first is priced at 11-4 everywhere but they give 7-2 or 4-1 for that specific hour only.

You throw 100 on at 4-1 meaning you get 400 back if he scores first not including your stake and then you go home and lay 125 at  to 3-1 on bet fair meaning you have to pay out 375 if he scores.

If he scores first your up 25 and if he doesn't your still up 25. Backing at one price and laying at lower is the key. You must try to avoid the urge of trying to actually predict the result and move towards managing the odds so that you cannot lose before a ball is kicked.

From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2012, 11:39:01 AM »
In my opinion the only real way to make money is to lay not back.

One good way is to back something with the bookmakers when they give an enhanced price. For example Ladbrokes usually give special odds for an hour on a Saturday, say Suarez to score first is priced at 11-4 everywhere but they give 7-2 or 4-1 for that specific hour only.

You throw 100 on at 4-1 meaning you get 400 back if he scores first not including your stake and then you go home and lay 125 at  to 3-1 on bet fair meaning you have to pay out 375 if he scores.

If he scores first your up 25 and if he doesn't your still up 25. Backing at one price and laying at lower is the key. You must try to avoid the urge of trying to actually predict the result and move towards managing the odds so that you cannot lose before a ball is kicked.



Yeah if you can find arbitrages then you can minimise the risk, it requires keeping an eye out and being in the right place at the right time though. Generally they don't last long because other people have the same idea ;)
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Offline Spanish Al

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2012, 11:53:02 AM »
Limit yourself to a certain amount you can afford to 'lose' or bet. Dont go over that limit by chasing if you lose. I went on a roll on the horses a month or so ago, made nearly £300 in a week of about £20. That was using a system which has worked wonders for me. Afer that I lost about £20 on four horses (on the bounce) and just left it for a week or two and went back.

Hardly bet on football because I always lose, but have had a few punts on the euros. Be rude not to ;D
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Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2012, 11:54:49 AM »
Yeah if you can find arbitrages then you can minimise the risk, it requires keeping an eye out and being in the right place at the right time though. Generally they don't last long because other people have the same idea ;)


:)

Can get a bit dodgy alright. You actually need to bring the laptop with you and have it out in the car after you place the bet with the bookies. Does work though if you have balls and patience.

Golf is another great sport to lay with such big fields imo.
From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2012, 11:59:57 AM »
Just by way of letting you know how foolish it is to try and predict results in the long term i'll give you an example.

I walked into the bookies a few years ago and had 20 quid that i wanted to turn into 60. Plan was much like yours, back short priced favorites.

Anyway, decided on a 5 timer, Celtic at home 2/5 on, Newcastle at home to Derby at 1-2 on etc.

Marked the quickslip wrong and ended up backing 5 draws instead. Had the docket in the bin at one stage and was pissed off i could have been that stupid.

Collecting €11,080 the next day softened the blow though. True story.
From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2012, 12:03:28 PM »
Just by way of letting you know how foolish it is to try and predict results in the long term i'll give you an example.

I walked into the bookies a few years ago and had 20 quid that i wanted to turn into 60. Plan was much like yours, back short priced favorites.

Anyway, decided on a 5 timer, Celtic at home 2/5 on, Newcastle at home to Derby at 1-2 on etc.

Marked the quickslip wrong and ended up backing 5 draws instead. Had the docket in the bin at one stage and was pissed off i could have been that stupid.

Collecting €11,080 the next day softened the blow though. True story.

Holy shit!!

I think for me that would have definitely been a signal to quit while I was ahead ;D

He's made Kaizer wet himself with excitement then cry when he realises all in one post. Ban him? Knight him in the new year's honours!

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2012, 12:09:28 PM »
Holy shit!!

I think for me that would have definitely been a signal to quit while I was ahead ;D



:)

As you can imagine i don't back anything with any degree of confidence after that. Really is a mugs game.  Trying to make money i mean. I enjoy a bet as much as the next fella but unless you are doing the math and are willing to put in the work to get the odds in your favour you are on a hiding to nothing.

I think very few people can get rich trying to actually predict results of sporting events. The money is in laying the field to such an extent that you don't care about the result.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 12:15:43 PM by bleedsred1978 »
From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2012, 12:22:54 PM »
Another way i have heard works more often than not is to back the bigger team when they fall behind. Say Man city go a goal down after 15 minutes away from home. While they might have been 4/6 or even money before the match there price immediately drifts to 13/8 or 7/4 once they are behind.

The plan is to back at 7/4 ,and hope they get a goal back. If and when they do get one back there price will shorten back into 6/5 or even money again. Lay at evens and keep the difference.

From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2012, 01:33:42 PM »
Another way i have heard works more often than not is to back the bigger team when they fall behind. Say Man city go a goal down after 15 minutes away from home. While they might have been 4/6 or even money before the match there price immediately drifts to 13/8 or 7/4 once they are behind.

The plan is to back at 7/4 ,and hope they get a goal back. If and when they do get one back there price will shorten back into 6/5 or even money again. Lay at evens and keep the difference.



Yeah I've seen that system before. You could probably also hedge by combining it with which team scores first.

- Bet on favourites to score first (if they win you are sweet)
- If the underdogs score first then back the bigger team to win (or lay the underdogs to win)
- Wait for the bigger team to equalise.

Of course that increases you exposure to the possibility that the comeback doesn't happen...

He's made Kaizer wet himself with excitement then cry when he realises all in one post. Ban him? Knight him in the new year's honours!

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #24 on: June 11, 2012, 01:35:35 PM »
Bet on no hat trick to be scored.

Make sure to brag about it first, tell everyone they are doing it wrong, and stick an obscene amount of money on it happening.  ;D
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Offline ghost1359

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #25 on: June 11, 2012, 01:49:01 PM »
I wouldn't bother if I were you mate. Betting is an addictive beast & as much as you're likely to win 80-100 quid on a couple of bets, if you're anything like me & most others I know you're equally as likely to go for gold & lose it all on relatively safe bets. The amount of times I've done that is unreal. I did it recently with 80 quid, backed woods in the memorial tournament, stuck the winnings on Columbia to beat Peru which they did, spotted that Canada vs USA was about to start, USA had great odds considering the difference in strength between the two sides so I lumped on them to win.

They consequently dominated the game & even luckily had a good Canadian goal disallowed only to do everything they humanly could not to put the ball in the back of the net. Including a wonder save from the Canadian keeper in the 93rd minute. I lost the lot, with betting I find more often than not, that's just the way it goes. 
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Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2012, 02:04:19 PM »
Yeah I've seen that system before. You could probably also hedge by combining it with which team scores first.

- Bet on favourites to score first (if they win you are sweet)
- If the underdogs score first then back the bigger team to win (or lay the underdogs to win)
- Wait for the bigger team to equalise.

Of course that increases you exposure to the possibility that the comeback doesn't happen...



Well that's it, we've cracked it. Time to pack in the day job and make zillions.... ;D ;D ;D ;D
From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2012, 05:24:55 PM »

More great posts - thanks all - especially bleedsred and BMW.

Will definitely give some thought to the systems mentioned. I find my reaction to betting quite interesting. I have to restrain myself from following up a losing bet with a bigger amount on a 'certainty' - as with anything I suppose discipline is the key.

I like the idea of developing my acumen with hedge betting more - that is definitely the way forward for the model I am using.

I think what appeals to me is the idea that whatever the bookies think about odds - the actual odds offered are heavily influenced by the amount of money that gets put on. So for big sporting events theres a lot of non expert people putting money on - eg the grand national or backing England at the world cup. That must mean theres value to be had by using discipline and analysis to guide you rather than emotion. As with the posts mentioned above, discipline I think is the key.
I know you struggle with reading comprehension Carlitos, but do try to pay attention

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2012, 12:49:47 AM »
If you going to be betting on shorter odds (evens to 7/4) here's a good way to manage your money.

Bet only a percentage of your bankroll. Then adjust the amount depending on how healthly your bankroll is.

For example:

Your bankroll is £500 and the percentage per bet size is 5%, that means each bet is £25

Let's say you lose your first £25 bet, your bankroll is now £475 - that means your next bet is £24

Two more examples:

Your bankroll is £250 - that means your next bet will be £13
Your bankroll is £800 - that means your next bet will be £40

If you see a 5/1 bet you are interested in just bet half, i.e. your bankroll is £500 - bet £12

This means you will be able to go through bad runs and suffer bad loses over and over again.

If you stick to it you keep yourself in the 'game' longer to be able to get back on a winning run.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2012, 12:53:17 AM by BMW »

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #29 on: June 12, 2012, 11:01:26 AM »
More great posts - thanks all - especially bleedsred and BMW.

Will definitely give some thought to the systems mentioned. I find my reaction to betting quite interesting. I have to restrain myself from following up a losing bet with a bigger amount on a 'certainty' - as with anything I suppose discipline is the key.

I like the idea of developing my acumen with hedge betting more - that is definitely the way forward for the model I am using.

I think what appeals to me is the idea that whatever the bookies think about odds - the actual odds offered are heavily influenced by the amount of money that gets put on. So for big sporting events theres a lot of non expert people putting money on - eg the grand national or backing England at the world cup. That must mean theres value to be had by using discipline and analysis to guide you rather than emotion. As with the posts mentioned above, discipline I think is the key.

It is, no question.

I embarked on a similar journey a few years ago on betfair. Starting with €200 and laying horses and golfers. Got up to around 500 over the course of a few weeks but the "joy" if that's what you would call it was gone.

Having an exposure of €50 to win a fiver is a different buzz to placing a fiver to win 50 and my patience just ran out in the end. From the sounds of it you have not got the bug as such for the gambling side of this so you may actually stand a better chance of success if you can keep your discipline.

If i could hammer home one point to you it is this. DO NOT GET WRAPPED UP IN TRYING TO PREDICT THE RESULT.

You are not a fortune teller. If you want to make money then the key is math not clairvoyance. Good luck mate , or should i say happy calculating as luck has nothing to do with it :wave





From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

Offline LanceLink

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2012, 11:13:51 AM »
It's all about the discipline. Unfortunately gambling is extremely addictive and the discipline goes out the window, usually along with your cash.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #31 on: June 12, 2012, 11:22:57 AM »
I've thought about doing this, low risk betting so maybe I make £100-200 a year. I can easily see myself getting addicted and throwing all of that back in on one bet. Some of the posts really got me thinking. I'm just going to take the advice from a few of you and not bother at all, it probably will ruin the spectacle of the sport too.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #32 on: June 12, 2012, 01:18:10 PM »
I've thought about doing this, low risk betting so maybe I make £100-200 a year. I can easily see myself getting addicted and throwing all of that back in on one bet. Some of the posts really got me thinking. I'm just going to take the advice from a few of you and not bother at all, it probably will ruin the spectacle of the sport too.

Tell you one thing I have definitely found though - all this time I have been watching sports im invariably supporting one side or the other and being guided by the commentators as to what's going on.

When you actually put money on an outcome and you're freed from the partisanship of watching teams you know you suddenly realise just how much crap the commentators and pundits come out with - especially in football. You suddenly start noticing that they are saying one thing and something completely different is happening on the pitch. Then when something happens 'against the run of play' they sigh and ustify it without ever pointing out how wrong they were.

If anything it has really made me pay a lot of attention to what is actually is going on and enhanced my experience of watching sport. Its been quite fascinating so far actually.
I know you struggle with reading comprehension Carlitos, but do try to pay attention

Offline Clayton Bigsby

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #33 on: June 12, 2012, 01:22:26 PM »
It's all about the discipline. Unfortunately gambling is extremely addictive and the discipline goes out the window, usually along with your cash.

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #34 on: June 12, 2012, 02:45:37 PM »
I've thought about doing this, low risk betting so maybe I make £100-200 a year. I can easily see myself getting addicted and throwing all of that back in on one bet. Some of the posts really got me thinking. I'm just going to take the advice from a few of you and not bother at all, it probably will ruin the spectacle of the sport too.

For me that was one of the major downsides about gambling, I couldn't just switch on the TV and watch some sport without thinking about the odds, what I would bet on etc.

If I did then put a bet on I'd get overly emotionally invested in it: during one Pakistan-Australia Test match (which in hindsight could well have been fixed) I ended up getting in a massive rage after the Pakistan wicketkeeper had just dropped his third easy chance of the innings, leading to Australia pulling off an unlikely comeback and me losing a short-odds bet, which resulted in me bashing a futon sofa bed with a cricket bat while swearing at Kamran Akmal).

If I didn't bet on it I would still have made a mental note of what bets I WOULD have placed, and if they came through then I would get really pissed off that I hadn't bet on them! That's one of the major troubles - looking at results in hindsight makes everything seem so simple.

Anyway I decided that I wanted to be able to watch sport and enjoy it again (aside from the fact that I had lost more money than I would have liked) so I stopped sports gambling. Still play the odd poker night with work (in fact we had one last night) or do footy tipping or whatever, just no online stuff.

He's made Kaizer wet himself with excitement then cry when he realises all in one post. Ban him? Knight him in the new year's honours!

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #35 on: June 12, 2012, 03:13:36 PM »
Bet £5 every time Messi plays, place that £5 bet on him to score 2 or more goals.

Do that all season in every single Barca and Argentina game. Sometimes even bet a fiver on him to score a hat trick, say when they play Zaragoza or Getafe.

Do this for one season and then retire from betting and have a nice holiday.
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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #36 on: June 13, 2012, 05:40:36 AM »
Messi was even money in the first leg against Chelsea to score. Inesta was 7/1.

If Messi is evens in a massive CL semi final, not exactly an easy match I'd love to know how short he is against the Getafes and Zaragozas of La Liga? My guess would be too short to bother with it, I'd say if you back the opposition to score might hold better value.... IMHO anyway

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #37 on: June 13, 2012, 11:33:37 AM »
I think betting as a "newbie" you should take your time combining betting and the sportsyou follow

Small stakes or even just playing on paper

After a decent sample to analyse you might pinpoint areas where you excell

Learn why this is the case....its important

There is software and websites out there that may help you identify areas to exploit but you will have to still put the graft in and have the right way of approacing some of your findings.

Eg...some idiot on a betting forum put samples of home team favs under evens but over 1.5 and claimed he had a winning system.

He only used one seasons stats and prices

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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #38 on: June 13, 2012, 11:45:51 AM »
Messi was even money in the first leg against Chelsea to score. Inesta was 7/1.

If Messi is evens in a massive CL semi final, not exactly an easy match I'd love to know how short he is against the Getafes and Zaragozas of La Liga? My guess would be too short to bother with it, I'd say if you back the opposition to score might hold better value.... IMHO anyway
I'm speaking from a season of doing exactly the above. In fact the bets I did above are financing two holidays.

Odds always varied for 2 or more goals scored between 3/1 and 7/1 depending on opposition.

the thing to betting is, not to worry about each individual win but to make sure you have the correct process to bet. In fact that applies to trading too, trade in the correct way and you'll find eventually you will make gains.
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Re: Constructing a betting system for a newbie.
« Reply #39 on: June 13, 2012, 12:44:47 PM »
I'm speaking from a season of doing exactly the above. In fact the bets I did above are financing two holidays.

Odds always varied for 2 or more goals scored between 3/1 and 7/1 depending on opposition.

the thing to betting is, not to worry about each individual win but to make sure you have the correct process to bet. In fact that applies to trading too, trade in the correct way and you'll find eventually you will make gains.

That's really interesting.

I was wondering though - Messi obviously has an exceptional season - will his improvement not be factored in when calculating the odds for THIS season?

Obviously if he goes on to do even better thats not a problem.
I know you struggle with reading comprehension Carlitos, but do try to pay attention