Author Topic: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)  (Read 8801 times)

Offline Samee

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #40 on: June 6, 2012, 05:39:43 PM »
Comparing Jay to Ramires or Fletcher is borderline insanity. Both them players offer a lot more to the team than Jay does i.e. goals and assists.

He wasn't saying Spearing is as good as either of them.
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #41 on: June 6, 2012, 05:47:46 PM »
Jay Spearing is a honeymoon player and his "tenacity" has left him an alluring presence. The first memory people have of him is thrashing Real Madrid where he came on for Gerrard. The wee lad from Wirral running circles around Diarra, VDV, outragously expensive Gago and even the legendary Guti. His frantic running and tackling not being seen as rash decision making but as pride, passion and desire.

Fast forward a few years. Jay Spearing is a reserve team captain, been out on loan, fringe player. All of a sudden Kenny Dalglish is back as manager and the same feeling erupts. Gone are Paul Konchesky, Christian Poulsen and Joe Cole. Players who didn't care about the club. In was the young Liverpool we all wanted to be. Someone who wasn't the best but made his dream come true, playing for Liverpool. So what if he made a few rash tackles after all "football is a man's game" and things like that only enhanced his reputation. And in a way it's why he'd only be a professional at the top level in England. Running 30 yards out of position to make a tackle is met with roars of acceptance from the crowd, cheers and whistles ring throughout the stadium. Finally a player who was willing to lay down his life for the club. However try that in Italy, Spain, France, Holland et al. And you get a stern telling off from the manager and a seat on the bench.

Yorky nailed it with his description. Jay Spearing always looks like he's having a big impact on the game because of how he acts. Like a boxer circling his opponent he's always on the move, always very visual. Making hand gestures the likes of which hasn't been featured on television since the Sopranos series finale. His role really has been being an extra body in midfield, his part in the games we played 2 months into Kenny's return becoming more and more a case of mistaking correlation with cause and effect. He was a water carrier, but not in the Dechamps way. He got the ball to Lucas who made the right decision to pass it to a Maxi, Meireles or Suarez. Spearing was just an extra step in that. Skipping the first step up 3 flights of stairs and thinking you saved time by jumping up two steps at a time.

I like Jay and all but he should be moved on, however well he means. For me it's not whether he can do a job here because he could. It's do we want to create a position in the team he can fill. And for me at the end of the day is a resounding no.
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #42 on: June 6, 2012, 05:59:10 PM »

Two things to add there. Firstly, that Real Madrid cameo belies the fact they were, at that stage of the game, shellshocked, humiliated and completely demoralised. Rafa could have stuck himself on at that point and been able to nutmeg Gago.

Secondly, and I'm afraid there's no getting away from it, the continuance of Jay Spearing's Anfield career has clearly unfairly benefited from some VERY vocal local support within the dressing room. Without Gerrard bigging him up at every opportunity, he'd have been gone long long ago.
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Offline Nessy76

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #43 on: June 6, 2012, 06:44:10 PM »
Like a lot of people, I don't see Jay as similar to Mascherano.
Unlike some, I think he can still do a job as a squad player.
Like everyone, I'm not quite sure what that role should be.

Because he tackles, a lot of people see Jay as a defensive midfielder. But that term is one I'm growing to dislike more and more. It doesn't really explain the player's role properly. I prefer to talk about Holding players. That was the role Rafa had for Alonso and Mascherano (and Sissoko before him) and the one he schooled Lucas into. It requires an ability to read the game, to anticipate the movement of the ball and the opposition players. Yes, win the ball, but more important than that, move it somewhere useful.

I've gone blue in the face explaining why the loss of a "defensive" midfielder like Lucas hurt our attacking game last season. It's because that player is the key to the change in play, when possession changes hands and you have a few seconds at most while the other team needs to rethink their attacking game into a defensive one. You need to know where every man on the pitch is, ours and theirs. The explosion of attack comes from that instant, that first ball played when possession has been won.

(Alonso rarely tackled, but he could intercept with the best of them, and his range of passing gave him an extra edge. It's harder to anticipate where the ball is going when the man in possession can effectively put it anywhere on the pitch.)

This isn't Jay's game. Jay is like a terrier, bounding over the pitch, getting in people's faces and yes, winning the ball. But when he gets it, the ground he's covered means that not only does he not know where the rest of the team are, it's a small miracle if he actually knows where he is himself. To his credit, he rarely gives it away, and there are times when that unpredictability can be an advantage, teams aren't drilled for it and if someone has spotted what Jay's up to and got himself in a good supporting position then of course, it can lead to good things, but it is a very different role to a Mascherano or Lucas.

The other side of the Holding player is the defensive cover. When you have attacking full-backs, you often want a man from midfield to drop into the back line. Lucas can do this. Mascherano does it so effectively Barca actually use him as a centre back from time to time. Jay doesn't have the tactical discipline to do this. It isn't in his nature. And, well, to be blunt, but if a cross comes in, he's not the most reassuring sight jumping in the box, is he?

Can he "do a Leon Britton"? Time will tell. He can pass a ball, and his determination and attitude will probably be very attractive to Rodgers (although I can dimly remember imagining how Danny Murphy might blossom under the influence of Rafa Benitez...)

He's not cover for Lucas, though. He never was. We ended up having to play Gerrard in that role behind Jay towards the end of last season, because however good Stevie is going forwards, he was the only other man in the squad who understood the role and had the reading of the game.

Offline bobapcoed

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #44 on: June 6, 2012, 08:26:00 PM »
Not good enough.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #45 on: June 6, 2012, 08:43:59 PM »
Not good enough.
Summed up in 3 simple words.. We can go round in circles
forever claiming how his tenacious style can be possibly accomadated
within the squad.. but the cold hard truth is, he's simply not enough and
to be honest i dont think he ever has been.

Offline BigRed100

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #46 on: June 7, 2012, 01:43:59 PM »
No no no no no.

I do not believe in dissing players either publicly or otherwise who have played for this club and I am not going to start now. But I will say this. Jay Spearing's abilities are not of the standard we as a club should set ourselves when it comes to player selection. This does not mean that I am slating the guy, just stating the facts.

End of discussion for me.
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Offline ScouserAlec

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #47 on: June 7, 2012, 01:48:51 PM »
No no no no no.

I do not believe in dissing players either publicly or otherwise who have played for this club and I am not going to start now. But I will say this. Jay Spearing's abilities are not of the standard we as a club should set ourselves when it comes to player selection. This does not mean that I am slating the guy, just stating the facts.

End of discussion for me.

I agree completely. The fact that Jay is a local lad seems to make some people think he has a automatic place as a player for the club. He's not good enough, and that's the top and bottom of it.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #48 on: June 7, 2012, 02:41:13 PM »
I agree completely. The fact that Jay is a local lad seems to make some people think he has a automatic place as a player for the club. He's not good enough, and that's the top and bottom of it.

That wasn't the crux of the thread, the point was given that both Rafa, Kenny and the club clearly rated the lad, would Brendan be the same and if so what could he coax out of him? could he be that busy little player we saw at the start of Kenny's tenure? I disagree during that time he was just a headless chicken, he was very effective. Maybe everyone has an atypical purple patch like a Barry Hayles or Michael Ricketts, maybe that was Jay's.
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Offline Z e u s

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #49 on: June 7, 2012, 02:48:34 PM »
No no no no no.

I do not believe in dissing players either publicly or otherwise who have played for this club and I am not going to start now. But I will say this. Jay Spearing's abilities are not of the standard we as a club should set ourselves when it comes to player selection. This does not mean that I am slating the guy, just stating the facts.

End of discussion for me.

But would you have had the same opinion this time last year after Lucas / Spearing had been a big part in the best football we saw under Dalglish.

I think playing Spearing as a defensive midfielder rather than as the box to box one, has made people go from quite liking him as a player to totally not rating him.

I think he should be sold, but he is better than people are saying in this thread.  Shame Lucas got injured as it meant Spearing had to do his job and it was one he clearly wasn't able to do half as well.  But in a partnership alongside Lucas, he looked a good player.

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #50 on: June 7, 2012, 03:10:27 PM »
Is he any worse than Park Ji Sung for example?

That fella has won a fair few leagues. Good attitude, honest and hard working. If he's not on big money he is surely worth having in the squad
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Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #51 on: June 7, 2012, 03:12:10 PM »
That wasn't the crux of the thread, the point was given that both Rafa, Kenny and the club clearly rated the lad, would Brendan be the same and if so what could he coax out of him? could he be that busy little player we saw at the start of Kenny's tenure? I disagree during that time he was just a headless chicken, he was very effective. Maybe everyone has an atypical purple patch like a Barry Hayles or Michael Ricketts, maybe that was Jay's.

In a set up where everybody presses instead of just himself he may look less like he is running around like a headless chicken.
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Offline GBF

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #52 on: June 7, 2012, 03:16:53 PM »
He is no where good enough tactically.  He lacks the skills for this job.  I hope he finds a club that suits him or accept to be on the bench for a lot of time
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Offline BigRed100

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #53 on: June 7, 2012, 03:19:43 PM »
But would you have had the same opinion this time last year after Lucas / Spearing had been a big part in the best football we saw under Dalglish.

I think playing Spearing as a defensive midfielder rather than as the box to box one, has made people go from quite liking him as a player to totally not rating him.

I think he should be sold, but he is better than people are saying in this thread.  Shame Lucas got injured as it meant Spearing had to do his job and it was one he clearly wasn't able to do half as well.  But in a partnership alongside Lucas, he looked a good player.
To be honest I don't think it has really made any difference to my opinion. He looked slightly better with Lucas alongside him, yes, but I have to be realistic and say I never considered Jay to be anything other than a squad player at best. I see no evidence of how he effects the game, either defensively or offensively, and I don't feel he really adds any value to the team at all. I don't think he's worth hanging on to.
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Offline Channo

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #54 on: June 7, 2012, 03:33:20 PM »
For Jay, surely playing for Liverpool and being in the squad is as good as it gets? If he's happy to take a squad role and sit on the bench, I don't see any reason to sell him.

He's not on big wages and wouldn't bring in a huge transfer fee. He can cover a few different roles if needs be, and he only really gets exposed when he has a run of games and at the highest level. If we had a spate of injuries and were playing Wigan at home, there's no reason why he couldn't come in and do a job.

He's not good enough to be a first team regular, but I don't see why he can't remain as a squad player for a couple of years if he's happy to do so.

Offline Gnurglan

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #55 on: June 7, 2012, 03:35:19 PM »
That wasn't the crux of the thread, the point was given that both Rafa, Kenny and the club clearly rated the lad, would Brendan be the same and if so what could he coax out of him? could he be that busy little player we saw at the start of Kenny's tenure? I disagree during that time he was just a headless chicken, he was very effective. Maybe everyone has an atypical purple patch like a Barry Hayles or Michael Ricketts, maybe that was Jay's.

I too think Spearing has indicated he can be useful for us. The problem I see is that over the years we have replaced very good CMs with average ones. There's no shield for Spearing anymore. Before he could be the 5th pick behind Alonso, Mascherano, Gerrard and Lucas. That made perfect sense. He had a clear backup role. A place to improve with time on his side. But now, when the competition is Lucas, Gerrard, Adam, Henderson and Shelvey it's different. If we want to improve, something has got to give.

Spearing has been given a few years as a backup. That's longer than most. He has not been able to establish himself as a first pick. It doesn't mean he's a poor player, but if we are to improve we need to consider selling him. Because he's no Alonso, Mascherano or Lucas in the making. He's still backup.

This is why I think it was good that Kenny didn't sign a CM in January. We got to see more of Spearing. Now we should know if we think he has what it takes or not. We have seen him play, in all sorts of games. Unlike many other players, he's been given a fair chance. I don't think he's shown enough. No need to slate him. But his role as backup should go to Henderson or Shelvey.

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Offline artanis

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #56 on: June 7, 2012, 04:13:49 PM »
Fantastic abuse of the apostrophe in the OP.

I didn't want to mention it but now I don't feel weird or mean about it. I cringed.

I hate bashing our players. When Lucas got that treatment in his first two seasons I was banned at TIA for calling out his critics since his quality was immediately noticeable. I supported him from day one. It breaks my hart as a supporter to say that I cannot defend Jay. The only Masch in him is his ability to get booked or commit a foul. I hope he makes a good living somewhere away from LFC, he deserves it with his hard work.

Offline Red Bird

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #57 on: June 7, 2012, 05:14:03 PM »
Carrgher didn't look a particularly useful player early on, if I recall. Yet he became a powerhouse of a centre-half for us, mostly after Benitez arrived at Anfield. I'd not write off Spearing so soon; and he is not worse than some players we have actually paid money for, anyway.

Offline JackWard33

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #58 on: June 7, 2012, 05:18:44 PM »


Secondly, and I'm afraid there's no getting away from it, the continuance of Jay Spearing's Anfield career has clearly unfairly benefited from some VERY vocal local support within the dressing room. Without Gerrard bigging him up at every opportunity, he'd have been gone long long ago.

Club captain in 'trying to boost confidence of everyone-knows-hes-not-that-great-really' player in squad.... not exactly a great crime is it?

Offline Nessy76

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #59 on: June 7, 2012, 05:29:59 PM »
Carrgher didn't look a particularly useful player early on, if I recall. Yet he became a powerhouse of a centre-half for us, mostly after Benitez arrived at Anfield. I'd not write off Spearing so soon; and he is not worse than some players we have actually paid money for, anyway.

He'll be 24 next November. At that age, Carra was a permanent fixture in Houllier's treble-winning side. He wasn't the legendary centre back of Istanbul, but he was a solid first choice week-in, week-out at left back.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #60 on: June 7, 2012, 05:49:19 PM »
Is he any worse than Park Ji Sung for example?

That fella has won a fair few leagues. Good attitude, honest and hard working. If he's not on big money he is surely worth having in the squad

You mean Ballon d'Or nominee Park Ji Sung? Yeah Spearing is a step or two below his level
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #61 on: June 7, 2012, 05:53:55 PM »
Carrgher didn't look a particularly useful player early on, if I recall. Yet he became a powerhouse of a centre-half for us, mostly after Benitez arrived at Anfield. I'd not write off Spearing so soon; and he is not worse than some players we have actually paid money for, anyway.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #62 on: June 7, 2012, 06:05:10 PM »
Jay has a good attitude, and I dont agree with talking down players, but threads like these DOES NOT HELP.

Return of the Masch then talking about Jay Spearing? Hes a decent player but I dont see him being taken to the next level. He has been given time last season since Lucas was injured, and while he has done decent...... thats all he is capable of doing imo. Putting in a decent performance, but overall he will never be a great player. I hope I get proved wrong, but hes been given enough chances and personally hasnt taken it. We need to bring someone in, here and now that will improve our midfield. We cant wait for Spearing to improve.

Offline John C

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #63 on: June 7, 2012, 06:44:22 PM »
I'm with the majority on this one, like it would have been regressive to enter a new season with Kuyt it would also be with Jay. Its essential that we introduce new dynamics and a fresh approach imo.

Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #64 on: June 7, 2012, 07:32:28 PM »
The best teams always have this position filled (or similiar), De Jong at City (but with the Barry/Toure variations, Makelele at Chelsea, Viera/Flamini at Arsenal, Scholes (plus Carrick/Fletcher) at United, McMahon/Case/Lee/Souness at LFC, Busquets at Barca, Alonso at Real (ouch that hurts).

I think it's key to Brendan's strategy, as he said to be able to have the ball you have to get it. A player who can win the ball and reliably distribute is the bedrock of a passing team. Jay's not the man, probably was never intended to be other than back up to Lucas so you can't blame the lad, which clubs have two good un's in this role.

I can see another ball winner/short passer joining us but these players often go unnoticed. No-one noticed Flamini alongisde Fabregas but I don't think Arsenal ever recovered from losing him. Anyone comment on youngsters coming through the ranks with potential?
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #65 on: June 7, 2012, 07:47:16 PM »
Masch v Spearing
Souness v Lee
Barnes v Downing

WORLDS APART

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #66 on: June 7, 2012, 07:59:19 PM »
Like Guthrie, who has just been released by Newcastle, Jay is a stop gap.  When we don't need a stop-gap, he'll be gone to his proper level.

Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #67 on: June 7, 2012, 08:09:31 PM »
Masch v Spearing
Souness v Lee
Barnes v Downing

WORLDS APART

Souness played with Lee who was so good when he covered for Case when he got injured that he never got back in the team.

Joe Allen stats

3rd most tackles in PL, completed 91% of his 2,177 pass attempts. Only 9 players attempted more passes this season; 3 of those were his team mates (Ashley Williams, Angel Rangel and Leon Britton).

Moussa Dembélé (Fulham) Only Victor Moses was involved in more ground duels than Moussa Dembélé during the 2011/12 Premier League season. Only one player made more tackle attempts than the Fulham midfielder too.

Youssuf Mulumbu (West Bromwich Albion) ?



Youssuf Mulumbu
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #68 on: June 7, 2012, 08:15:06 PM »
We need better than Jay now.

Jay has had his chance.

Offline Liverbird88

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #69 on: June 7, 2012, 08:29:14 PM »
I too was in the category thinking that Jay might not be good enough for Liverpool, as a regular anyhow. But he did begin to flourish in the role under Kenny, and especially since he got the chance to regulary play, with Lucas out for the long term, Gerrard injured and then Adam out. However at the Fulham game before the FA cup final, I remember how off form he was. Not that the team as a whole were any better, but he certainly had a shocker. Thought it was a one off, but he carried on the performance during the FA cup final. It was like he was done for the season, which isn't really good enough, and then he was replaced by Shevley and dropped to the bench for the remaining games. Although I do think he is a better player than I thought he would be, and I do think that is because he was given the chance to develop on a more regular first team basis, but I reckon that he is more of a back up option.
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #70 on: June 7, 2012, 08:36:50 PM »
Club captain in 'trying to boost confidence of everyone-knows-hes-not-that-great-really' player in squad.... not exactly a great crime is it?

Not on the face if it but such unwavering support was distinctly lacking when a certain Brazilian kid was cutting his teeth in the first team, much younger than Spearing too. Gerrard and Carragher once shook their heads at the mere sight of him and Carragher boosted his confidence no end by pretending he was invisible most of the time.

It's also doing nobody any favours, least of all Jay. He should be encouraged to further his career elsewhere where he may get to play regularly. At Leicester they loved him for example when he went there on loan. But instead he believes he really does have what it takes at Liverpool, which is only natural when you have a player like Gerrard bigging you up and Carragher happy his wife has another local WAG she doesn't have any language barriers with.
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Offline rossipersiempre

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #71 on: June 7, 2012, 08:39:07 PM »
We need better than Adam now.

Charlie has had his chance.
:o
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #72 on: June 7, 2012, 08:41:23 PM »
Carragher happy his wife has another local WAG she doesn't have any language barriers with.

Off Topic - Mate of mine has been doin some work on Carras house and said he is sound but his wife is murder to deal with.
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #73 on: June 7, 2012, 11:13:36 PM »
I'm with the majority on this one, like it would have been regressive to enter a new season with Kuyt it would also be with Jay. Its essential that we introduce new dynamics and a fresh approach imo.

Yes John. Rodgers has stated he likes players who love having the ball at their feet. Jay, unfortunately, is always telling the man in possession to send it to someone other than himself.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #74 on: June 7, 2012, 11:17:18 PM »
Best defensive full back in the league, just suffered from halfwaylinophobia

So true. He treated the half-way line like a Portuguese sailor treated the great western ocean before the discovery of America. Too dangerous to cross. There was the edge of the world to think about.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #75 on: June 8, 2012, 12:02:46 AM »
Praise/ Criticism of Spearing seems to vary whether we win or lose - probably because to some he is the scapegoat and to some he has an overly underrated style of play. Therefore when the team as a whole had a bad time at the end of last season everyone just gave up on Spearing and said he wasn't good enough - which imo is too simplistic. He needs to be the runner/playmaker between your defensive mid and attack - he has the tools for that. What he misses to be truly effective in defensive mid is strength and speed almost in equal measure.

And I love that people say he makes mistakes. All players make mistakes - I remember Lucas making gaffes that cost us vital points in the 08/09 season, I remember Gerrard's mishaps. Spearing doesn't make any more mistakes then anyone else. And 'he doesn't love the ball at his feet', that's an interesting theory.

Passes per game average from whoscored.com

Lucas Leiva - 57.3
Jose Enrique - 52.1
Jay Spearing - 51.8
Steven Gerrard - 49.7
Charlie Adam - 49
I know what you mean. I really wish the Madrid born former Real Vallodolid, Osasuna, Tenerife, Extremadura, Valencia and Inter Milan manager stayed loyal and faithful to a foreign club that sacked him by never managing another club again. Burn him.

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #76 on: June 8, 2012, 01:26:40 AM »
Praise/ Criticism of Spearing seems to vary whether we win or lose - probably because to some he is the scapegoat and to some he has an overly underrated style of play. Therefore when the team as a whole had a bad time at the end of last season everyone just gave up on Spearing and said he wasn't good enough - which imo is too simplistic. He needs to be the runner/playmaker between your defensive mid and attack - he has the tools for that. What he misses to be truly effective in defensive mid is strength and speed almost in equal measure.

I said during the 10-11 season that Spearing faced a lot of competition for the roaming slot, and that he stood a better chance of fashioning a niche for himself if he could fit into the holder slot. Since then, the younger Henderson has moved ahead of him in the roamer slot, while he's been tried and failed in the holder slot, to the extent that Dalglish would rather use Gerrard there than turn to Spearing again. So we now know for certain that he can't fill the holder role, while there's a younger player ahead of him in the roamer role. The next question to ask, if Spearing is to further his Liverpool career, is whether he's versatile enough to make himself useful in other roles. The evidence so far suggests not. So where does Spearing fit?
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
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http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #77 on: June 8, 2012, 01:43:09 AM »
I thought when played with Lucas at the end of last season he was great. Lucas dominated the midfield and Spearing picked up the pieces but since Lucas has been injured this season, no one has dominated the midfield in his absence which has exposed Jay. I'd still keep him for another season, he can do a job I think and see how it progresses without asking him to be our main defensive midfielder and shouldering all the responsibility which is quite clearly above him. That said, I do think we should be after another player in this position and have Spearing as back up.
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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #78 on: June 8, 2012, 01:58:57 AM »
Jay plays with a lot of heart. If everyone in the starting XI played with Jay's desire, we'd have had a much better season.

That said, he's too limited physically to provide what Liverpool needs from midfield. He wouldn't see the pitch for any of the clubs that finished above us this past year, except for maybe Everton (which kinda says it all).

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Re: Return of the Masch (The mini Masch that is)
« Reply #79 on: June 8, 2012, 02:06:53 AM »
I thought when played with Lucas at the end of last season he was great. Lucas dominated the midfield and Spearing picked up the pieces but since Lucas has been injured this season, no one has dominated the midfield in his absence which has exposed Jay. I'd still keep him for another season, he can do a job I think and see how it progresses without asking him to be our main defensive midfielder and shouldering all the responsibility which is quite clearly above him. That said, I do think we should be after another player in this position and have Spearing as back up.

The thing is though, Henderson, who is younger, does that job better than Spearing does, and looks to have a considerably higher ceiling. So why not give Henderson that senior gametime, and offer one of the kids the last ditch back up role?
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
Vidocq, 20 January 2011

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258