Topic: The Kenny Dalglish Discussion (*) - Post A Rumour and Get A Week Off Free

[cowtownred]

If I was Kenny, I'd walk. If I had Kenny's ear, I'd tell him to walk. The lad has more than done his duty by us. Yes. He's been very well rewarded. That's the game, and the money in it. But Kenny is one of the old breed. If it was still back in the days when managers and players lived in our streets, he'd still go the job. He won't jump on his sword, like some think. If he goes, he'll have been pushed. The club, and this second chance of taking it back to it's hey day, means too much to him. I'd tell him, he's done enough and it's time to enjoy his life without all this shit.

Does that mean, I'd like to see him go... does it fuck. I want the lad to succeed, and not just for my own selfish wants. I'd love to see him go out on a high, job done, LFC back on it's feet if not it's perch. But the strain of this job is something I wouldn't wish on me worst enemy. It near done for Ged and Souness. Kenny had to walk for his sanity and health. Poor Rafa looked in a shocking state when he left. And as gutted as I was to lose him, I told meself it was the best thing for him. I think the same for Kenny now. We are an ungrateful shower of bastards, always demanding more, more, more. Look at what Rafa won for us, the results and performances he gave us. It wasn't enough.

Besides the wedge, I can't see why anybody would want to manage a club with the expectations of Liverpool. Wenger's been getting it for a couple of years, and even some Mancs are starting to question the tramp. It's a shitty old game, football.

Spot on as usual Leo.

And what's more, if I had Rafa's ear, I'd be telling him thaf if he ever got approached not to be fucking soft.

Sad state of affairs we are now.

[TLW 84]

My issue is that I fundamentally disagree with the principle that you get rid of a manager after one full season. unless there are extenuating circumstances.

It was a season that showed some promise, allbeit failing since Christmas and one where we got to the finals of two cups, winning one.

I couldn't care less if it was Dalglish or Capello. I'd give that manager more time.

Fazakerley. Sometimes it feels like I've stumbled onto a Newcastle forum in the Freddy Shepherd era...

[djschembri]

He deserves another season.

There are bigger problems at the club right now which need to be resolved before we worry about the manager's job.

[jsl2000]

If I was Kenny, I'd walk. If I had Kenny's ear, I'd tell him to walk. The lad has more than done his duty by us. Yes. He's been very well rewarded. That's the game, and the money in it. But Kenny is one of the old breed. If it was still back in the days when managers and players lived in our streets, he'd still go the job. He won't jump on his sword, like some think. If he goes, he'll have been pushed. The club, and this second chance of taking it back to it's hey day, means too much to him. I'd tell him, he's done enough and it's time to enjoy his life without all this shit.

Yes but kenny said not so long ago that he owes the club.  While he still believes that he will not walk.  And if the owners do give him the push they better have a better reason than 8th place.

[BOBSCOUSE]

OK folks.  You know the groundrules

Hearing rumours you cannot read...

I mean how fucking difficult can it be people? 

I dunno, I mean surely posting one-liners in a starred topic has to be frowned upon?!! 

And for my tuppence worth, I've never known a single poster reflect my own personal opinions as closely as Fat Scouser.  All the folks out there who can't help their knee-jerking and don't understand the philosophies of this club and it's (true) support would do well to read and understand exactly what Leo is saying.  Leo, well written posts mate and I 100% agree with every word from Kenny to Rafa, to the owners and to the club.

Have patience people, I believe that in Kenny and these owners we now have the right people to make the right decisions for Liverpool Football Club.  We just have to support the club and show belief that any decisions made/to be made were in the best interests of the club and it's support.

[Drinks Sangria]

He needs more time. Manager's need time, hard work, and a little bit of the unquantifiable. Luck, perhaps. If Kenny had had an ounce of Di Matteo's Chelsea luck I can speculate that we'd be a few places higher and have an extra trophy in the cabinet. For all criticism of signings that, for one reason or another 'haven't worked out,' it's all hindsight. Criticise the fees paid by all means, but at the time, players such as Downing looked like the sort of player that would help us kick on. Kenny would be the first to admit he's made some mistakes and as he says 'the table never lies.' However, he'd probably be one of the last to acknowledge that he's been hideously unlucky. It doesn't help that he's so emotionally attached with us, the fans. Don't get me wrong, I love the man and think it's great that he does it for us above any selfish financial reasons. However, the job seems to be taking its toll with the strain that comes with letting down a loved one. If he wants time, give it to him. Above all, Kenny needs to be truthful to himself. If he doesn't think he can hack it or stand the pressure, he should walk, for his own sake above ours. Time. Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity.

[Z e u s]

If I was Kenny, I'd walk. If I had Kenny's ear, I'd tell him to walk.

Before he took the job people were worried about his reputation being damaged.

Dalglish however backs himself, cares so much about the club that he has put some of his reputation on the line in order for us to improve.  If I was Dalglish and really believed in the players I had, that I had support from the owners and backed my own ability - I would want to stay, have a really good season and prove a lot of doubters wrong, personally.

[subroc]

I don't really expect that FSG will sack Dalglish - I do believe he will be given another season whatever the rumours.

Hoewver, I would be far more concerned about the vision of the playing style than about the choice of manager at this time. A clear and pragmatically workable idea of how the team should be set up merged with the careful selection of players who fit that system and capped off with a good tactical sense would go a long way to lifting our team back into the upper echelons of the table again.

Brukner, etc aside - the staff member whom FSG should really scrutinise is Clarke. Given that Dalglish is more hands-off a manager in the technical things than Benitez, he must have relied a lot more on Clarke to make things run and work. If so, then that is perhaps the position where the club can improve to bring about an immediate tactical improvement.

[TH]

He deserves another season.

Is he not on a 3years contract? If so he deserves it in full. Not just "until January", or "one more season". We'll never build a dynasty again if we don't give a manager time to finish their project.

[gypsymoth]

What I definitely dont want is Kenny - a man we should all respect - being given support with significant strings attached.

I'd also hate to see his natural exhuberence tempered by having FSG on his back from the get go - back him and let him get on with the job.

If FSG back him, we should also be 100% behind him going into next season.

[walshys_mullet]

If I was Kenny, I'd walk. If I had Kenny's ear, I'd tell him to walk. The lad has more than done his duty by us. Yes. He's been very well rewarded. That's the game, and the money in it. But Kenny is one of the old breed. If it was still back in the days when managers and players lived in our streets, he'd still go the job. He won't jump on his sword, like some think. If he goes, he'll have been pushed. The club, and this second chance of taking it back to it's hey day, means too much to him. I'd tell him, he's done enough and it's time to enjoy his life without all this shit.

Does that mean, I'd like to see him go... does it fuck. I want the lad to succeed, and not just for my own selfish wants. I'd love to see him go out on a high, job done, LFC back on it's feet if not it's perch. But the strain of this job is something I wouldn't wish on me worst enemy. It near done for Ged and Souness. Kenny had to walk for his sanity and health. Poor Rafa looked in a shocking state when he left. And as gutted as I was to lose him, I told meself it was the best thing for him. I think the same for Kenny now. We are an ungrateful shower of bastards, always demanding more, more, more. Look at what Rafa won for us, the results and performances he gave us. It wasn't enough.

Besides the wedge, I can't see why anybody would want to manage a club with the expectations of Liverpool. Wenger's been getting it for a couple of years, and even some Mancs are starting to question the tramp. It's a shitty old game, football.

Totally agree with you fats.

i still cant get over the disgraceful way Dalglish was treated for having the gaul and right to stick up for what he believed in with Suarez. He was treated disgracefully by all quarters, hammered by press, opposition and our own.

Still rankles with me now and makes me angry.

[JohnBarnesBigToe]

It’s not been a great year. Curious team selections, lack of a overarching gameplan, Suarez, overspending on average players. But like any new manger should be given two full years. (Forget he’s Kenny for a minute)


Things I hope Kenny says while he’s over there;

‘Who appointed Comolli?, yep I’m looking at you two’

‘Got anywhere with the new stadium yet?’

‘Now you get on with your job and I’ll get on with mine.’ 

[Fat Scouser]

If only Liverpool had some sort of Director of Communications to communicate what's happening.

If he goes it will be "By mutual consent," and he'll be offered some sort of role at the club.

[djschembri]

Is he not on a 3years contract? If so he deserves it in full. Not just "until January", or "one more season". We'll never build a dynasty again if we don't give a manager time to finish their project.

A dynasty? Let's get back to the simple aim of winning football matches before we talk about dynasties.

[Legendary_Nines]

Brukner, etc aside - the staff member whom FSG should really scrutinise is Clarke. Given that Dalglish is more hands-off a manager in the technical things than Benitez, he must have relied a lot more on Clarke to make things run and work. If so, then that is perhaps the position where the club can improve to bring about an immediate tactical improvement.

I thought Clarke was in charge of the defensive side of things? Hence why our defense has improved dramatically since he's come along. So wouldn't it more be the responsibility of Kevin Keen? Because defense hasn't been our problem.

I want Kenny to stay, he knows everything there is to know about Liverpool FC and understands how it works. I want him to do extremely well and create a brilliant set up that will succeed him after he's left.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

If only Liverpool had some sort of Director of Communications to communicate what's happening.

Plagiarist.  L6 Red will be along soon to collect his royalties.

[HighSix]

Do we know who FSG have making the decisions?

[Z e u s]

the staff member whom FSG should really scrutinise is Clarke.

He is in charge of the defense isn't he?  We have the third best defensive record in the league and that is without Lucas for most of the season.

Don't see how Clarke is at fault.

[Hinesy]

The season hasnt been bad. It has been disastrous. Had we signed some young continental techical players who could improve and won 65-ish points we probably wouldnt be having this discussion.

However we signed some dead end shite like Downing, Adam and already have some ageing players. There`s no progress to be made with these players reaching their ceiling already.

I have absolutely no problem with Kenny when it comes to tactics, man management, substitutions, dealings with press and all that. My only problem is his assesement of players he deems worthy of doing the job we need. On top of all he still belives in them.
That is very very dangerous for our long term future. Giving him money for the summer is a major risk.

I would have loved more than anything for Kenny to be the one who will go shoulder to shoulder with Ferguson and be the one who brings no.19 home. If he stays then fine but I asked myself if I would be gutted if he leaves and the answer is no.

Astonishing. You think this year has been disastrous. Ask any of the relegated clubs. Ask a manc watching his team win fuck all, all year, and denied in the last minute of someone else's extra time. Ask Gerrard after seeing his face winning the Carling Cup or my face after watching Carroll backwards head us into the FA Cup Final v the bitters. Ask any regular LFC fan after the year when we had H&G and Hodgson and no light at the end of the dark..

Disappointing yes. Frustrating at times, undeniably. Disastrous? bollocks.

[rappcats]

It's 7am in Boston now, chinese whispers started appearing about an hour ago. Surely there was a meeting at 6 am to discuss Dalglish' future.

give me a break

I am unable to read and understand the point of this thread and will be having that break. See you in a few days 

[LondonRedMan]

He needs more time. Manager's need time, hard work, and a little bit of the unquantifiable. Luck, perhaps. If Kenny had had an ounce of Di Matteo's Chelsea luck I can speculate that we'd be a few places higher and have an extra trophy in the cabinet. For all criticism of signings that, for one reason or another 'haven't worked out,' it's all hindsight. Criticise the fees paid by all means, but at the time, players such as Downing looked like the sort of player that would help us kick on. Kenny would be the first to admit he's made some mistakes and as he says 'the table never lies.' However, he'd probably be one of the last to acknowledge that he's been hideously unlucky. It doesn't help that he's so emotionally attached with us, the fans. Don't get me wrong, I love the man and think it's great that he does it for us above any selfish financial reasons. However, the job seems to be taking its toll with the strain that comes with letting down a loved one. If he wants time, give it to him. Above all, Kenny needs to be truthful to himself. If he doesn't think he can hack it or stand the pressure, he should walk, for his own sake above ours. Time. Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity.

This is just it, the board must know this. They may be novices in the football industry but they have experience in sport.

I think Kenny's biggest challenge next season will be balancing European success and cup success with good performances in the league - even if we are out of the title race early on. Kenny is a winner so playing for 3rd/4th spot is alien to him. This may well be Kenny's biggest personal challenge next season - getting his subordinates up for league games whilst being out of the title race. If we can get a good run going from the get go next season and slowly establish title race credentials I think we will be good for the top 4 (who knows, may even win the thing!).

I also think Steve Clarke and Kenny should input into who the new DoF should be. The owners would do well to pick their brains on this issue. We need all three working in tandem. A brave thinking outsite the box move would be Gerard Houllier as DoF. Houllier knows the club, the PL and has experience as a technical director for France. In fact he helped in producing their world cup winning set up.

[Kaiser]

I just can't wait till next season, whatever happens over the summer in terms of the managerial position; I wont be safe in the knowledge that it's the right choice.
We are a mediocre side at the moment, it seems there's a lot of uncertainty around how the owners want the club to be run. As was mentioned on the Anfield Wrap; we need to get Champions League next season and we need some structure in place and a clear plan of how we're going to go about taking the club back to where it belongs.

It is going to be a very long summer.

[thekremlin]

How much of a hiding to nothing is he on though? If he does stay on for next season and there's even a hint we're heading in the same direction we've been going this season then the fans, the media, the owners, everyone will be down on him like a ton of bricks... just waiting for the slightest chink in the armour. And then it'll be the constant speculation, the rumours, the plain old made up stuff. A very unpleasant situation for all.

I think that if he goes now then he can look back and point to a cup and a cup final, which is not too shabby by anyone's standards. His reputation hasn't been damaged at all as far as I'm concerned. In fact, its probably grown because of the way he's stepped up and looked after us (Suarez affair, backing Carroll, taking the reins up again, etc.)

As for what I'd like to see happen... he should have another season. Definitely. He deserves it and the club deserves to have Kenny in charge of it. We may not be doing too well on the field at the moment but one thing we need to do is re-establish what this club stands for. Kenny is the man to do that.

[gazzalfc]

Plagiarist.  L6 Red will be along soon to collect his royalties.

Awww has it been said before? I thought I was being really original as well

[Twelfth Customer]

Astonishing. You think this year has been disastrous. Ask any of the relegated clubs. Ask a manc watching his team win fuck all, all year, and denied in the last minute of someone else's extra time. Ask Gerrard after seeing his face winning the Carling Cup or my face after watching Carroll backwards head us into the FA Cup Final v the bitters. Ask any regular LFC fan after the year when we had H&G and Hodgson and no light at the end of the dark..

Disappointing yes. Frustrating at times, undeniably. Disastrous? bollocks.

I think it has been a pretty disastrous return in the league given the money spent. Kenny's preference for a certain type of British player ahead of more technical and intelligent continental players is also worrying, on that point, I also agree with SerbianScouser.

[TheTeflonJohn]

To the people who think it would be best for Kenny to leave - Have you thought about how much money that will cost in paying off Kenny and his backroom staff, potentially paying fees/compensation for a new manager and backroom staff, and the cost of changing the playing staff that a new manager would want to bring in?

Not having a go, a serious question.

We`ve just paid £M`s out two seasons in a row to Rafa, Roy etc. That is a shitload more money to be paid out which is money we can not afford to lose.

[timmyonions]

The season in the league has been difficult from Christmas onwards.Kenny has had a lot to deal with with the Luis situation.It was as if Kenny took the complete burden on his shoulders( once again).It seemed to derail him.The stance he took,right or wrong was what he believed was best at the time.
He's been a different man this last six months.He looks jaded.The entithusiasm that was bursting out of him when he got the job back now seems to be waning.

With that said id like to believe the summer break will do kenny good.Recharge the batteries and get back in July refreshed.Id like to think the club can back him and let him continue what he has started.

[subroc]

He is in charge of the defense isn't he?  We have the third best defensive record in the league and that is without Lucas for most of the season.

Don't see how Clarke is at fault.

Clarke is assistant though so he is surely doing more than just defensive work. Whoever whom Dalglish was relying on - he needs to be improved on. What the club needs is a canny assistant like Pako Ayestaran ...

[Redkoprob]

There's no reason why we can't be successful with the squad pretty much as is. We only really need to sign cover for Lucas, cover for Enrique and an additional striker - we don't have to spend massive money, there is always room for maneuver and being shrewd. We have in place the big signings with big potential, now it';s time to weave in some bargains/experienced pros to provide the depth in certain positions we're lacking in.

For that to happen, you'll need someone who is in touch with the "market".  As good as Kenny is, this is one of his deficits, being away from football for so long.  Normally when you spend big, there will be hits and misses.  Rafa, Wenger, Ferguson, it's all the same.  Some great buys, others not so good.  The vintage of 11/12 is just plain bad.  Again, the league table doesn't lie.  Kenny will have a hard time with this lot.  Commolli certainly deserves the boot for getting this lot in, especially at those ridiculous 20 million price tags.

[geoffstrong]

The biggest problem for me is the elephant/s in the room is sitting in our dressing room or treatment table, I feel player power is almost as rife here as at another club with no history, but say Kenny walked and like FS sadly now I would be relieved for him if he did, who is next do we have a fanbase who gives any manager no time to develop a team over a couple of seasons?
Have we turned into the sort of fanbase we used to mock? I hope not but more and more we get hyperbole used in posts we get people wanting it yesterday, maybe I am now just an old Luddite but there is no allowance for the situations it is all results and bragging rights.

[Hinesy]

I think it has been a pretty disastrous return in the league given the money spent. Kenny's preference for a certain type of British player ahead of more technical and intelligent continental players is also worrying, on that point, I also agree with SerbianScouser.

I just think the word is totally out of context. Even you've diluted it with the word 'pretty'. I just think some of the reactions here are totally inappropriate. I'm not saying Kenny should stay nor go, but just to think about really what we're putting down on screen here..

Also Adam/Downing/Carroll/Henderson: all seen as gifted in their area. Coates/Enrique/Suarez: foreign. Bellamy I'd agree with you there...

[thekremlin]

Of course, there's always the possibility that Kenny has asked for the meeting in Boston with FSG to be brought forward so he can tell them face-to-face that he wants to leave. Give them as much time as possible to sort through the fallout and get moving on where we go next. Kenny doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who'd want to break that kind of news over the phone or by Skype or whatever it is they use.

[YoungKopite]

Give him another chance. He's took us to two cup finals in his first full season back for us. I would personally give him till January 2013 to see how we're doing in all competitions and the league. I'm confident he'll be in a position to remain for the long term.

[Tom_B]

If I was Kenny, I'd walk. If I had Kenny's ear, I'd tell him to walk. The lad has more than done his duty by us. Yes. He's been very well rewarded. That's the game, and the money in it. But Kenny is one of the old breed. If it was still back in the days when managers and players lived in our streets, he'd still go the job. He won't jump on his sword, like some think. If he goes, he'll have been pushed. The club, and this second chance of taking it back to it's hey day, means too much to him. I'd tell him, he's done enough and it's time to enjoy his life without all this shit.

Does that mean, I'd like to see him go... does it fuck. I want the lad to succeed, and not just for my own selfish wants. I'd love to see him go out on a high, job done, LFC back on it's feet if not it's perch. But the strain of this job is something I wouldn't wish on me worst enemy. It near done for Ged and Souness. Kenny had to walk for his sanity and health. Poor Rafa looked in a shocking state when he left. And as gutted as I was to lose him, I told meself it was the best thing for him. I think the same for Kenny now. We are an ungrateful shower of bastards, always demanding more, more, more. Look at what Rafa won for us, the results and performances he gave us. It wasn't enough.

Besides the wedge, I can't see why anybody would want to manage a club with the expectations of Liverpool. Wenger's been getting it for a couple of years, and even some Mancs are starting to question the tramp. It's a shitty old game, football.

Absolutely bang on.

[Fordy]

For me kenny at deserves another season. A season to run the team his why.

As soon as he started he was told Clarke was coming in(doubt he had a problem with that but still) - he has had to work with DC.

Yes I know managers get judged on the pitch but i for one don't agree with owners that don't know anything about football telling a manager that they must have a DOF etc above them.

Yes kenny has got things wrong this season but I have seen enough to tell me he can put it right.

Kenny is one of us!!

[stoj]

kenny has looked shell shocked at the end of the season and the constant battles with the untrustworthy media are showing. I dont like seeing a man i grew up to idolise, suffering but the growing whispers of the hounds on various forums are getting louder and are same vermin that called for the head of our best manager in twenty years.......no not hodgson, and look how that turned out. Most of these fans are getting their info from the rags and this is becoming a huge problem for us, for stability....they need a story and liverpool are always easy pickings.

I have seen every game this season, mostly on tv/web but i can see some positives in our performances. Admittedly, we have fallen short in the league and kenny has baffled me with his use of subs and certain players but we have had one of the most bizarre seasons in terms of luck, poor finishing, decisions and off the field bollucks, plus the combined new signings playing as if they met in the bar before kick off on certain days doesnt help at times but there are positives.

Loss of lucas and our shafting in the media of suarez gate seems to have hit us harder than expected. Hindsight is great with signings but we were all moderately excited to see new blood.....rememebr, we were not gonna get the hazards, or FM top of the tree players were we?

Personally, Kenny deserves another season, we cant get any worse in the league positionally anyhow...our performances for the majority have been decent apart from some poor finishing. Come on, we had 27 shots against west brom, and they had 1? how many times has that happened this year...like someone else said, every keeper that came to anfield had a gordan banks, its crazy.  We wont get worse luck than this year and our cup form has been great. A few tweaks around the squad and some better luck we will defo challenge for 4th....at the beginning of this season...beating the arse at the emirates, things were looking up Even one bad game at spurs didnt stop it...but lucas and suarez gate did.

Im sure the men at the top can see the positives and if getting rid of the man is their answer then next year will be yet another year of transition.

Just imagine if downings shot had dipped under the bar against sunderland.......you would have been haling our version of gareth bale lol

If we are to let Kenny go then i wouldnt hesitate to ask Rafa back, whether he would is another thing but right now, get behind the man in charge....and laugh at that buffoon in charge of Engerland at the euros........watch this space....he'll probably win it, thats how much of a fuck up this season is

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Imo, no Club must listen to its supporters more than LFC.

Imo, match-going Scousers were the only ones that wanted Rafa out

You really do not have a clue do you?   I mean if I was as woefully out of touch as you I'd be too embarrassed to post.

[TheTeflonJohn]

I think it has been a pretty disastrous return in the league given the money spent. Kenny's preference for a certain type of British player ahead of more technical and intelligent continental players is also worrying, on that point, I also agree with SerbianScouser.

But we don`t know who`s the signings were. Were they Kenny`s, Comollis or both?

[mikey_LFC]

Kenny should be allowed to see out his contract and then be judged, not halfway through.

No matter what happens or no matter who is manager of our club over the next years and decades, Kenny's name will be sung from the stands. He is a true legend, up there with Shankly and Paisley, and will always remain so.

[Twelfth Customer]

Also Adam/Downing/Carroll/Henderson: all seen as gifted in their area. Coates/Enrique/Suarez: foreign. Bellamy I'd agree with you there...

What Adam, Carroll and Downing lack is game intelligence, in comparison to Meireles, Aquilani and even Kuyt in my opinion. Adam and Downing have decent technique but don't make the right decisions on the pitch as often as they should be doing at the top level. Carroll's lack of movement, however you dress it up, is very poor. His recent improvement, while an option, is still not good enough. His presence on the pitch also results in a less nuanced style of play. Had Kuyt played more often last season alongside Suarez, I'm pretty certain you would have seen a lot better movement, understanding and goals. It is a pity that those two were not allowed to forge a partnership. Henderson has the necessary quickness of thought and game intelligence required, pity he was shunted out wide for much of the season.