Author Topic: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic  (Read 47230 times)

Offline Gromit

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1120 on: March 24, 2012, 07:05:19 PM »
not disagreeing with that so you agree it is the players fault then?

Aren't managers responsible for their players though?  Evans was undone by a lack of professionalism by his.  Houllier ditto after rejecting Anelka and buying a trio that ruined his team.  Rafa's tactics hit a brick wall after Alonso left, and his latter signings were mostly crap.  Yup, he might have been let down by his scouts, but the buck stops with him.  Same point with Kenny, his signings have been mostly out of their depth, and the ones who come out of this season with any credit are the backbone of the team he's chosen to keep from Rafa.

Offline Hazell

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1121 on: March 24, 2012, 07:05:35 PM »
Certain individuals at the Club decided that it was the Foreign players who were continually stopping us from winning the League, they decided that the Club being to Foreign meant that the media, the LMA and the complete gobshites who run English football hated us. We fucked off a brilliant manager and went off on a idiotic English is best crusade that has culminated in the likes of Torres, Alonso, Mascherano being replaced by the likes of Carroll, Adam and Downing.

Well Jamie and Steven you have got what you wanted the Club has become more British and there are hardly any dirty foreigners left to blame. So who are you going to blame for performances like Stoke away, Everton Away, Blackpool at Home, West Ham away last season Bolton away, QPR away and Wigan at home this season. All abject surrenders that are so called leaders played in and stunk the place out.

For the last decade it has been a constant cycle of a decent start to the reigns of Houllier, Benitez, Hodgson and Dalglish whilst Mr and Mrs Liverpool believed in the manager followed by a slump when Mr and Mrs Liverpool began to lose faith in the manager which ended when the Two Senior players believed the manager wouldn't win the League.

The laughable bit is Houllier, Benitez, Hodgson and Kenny have all won League titles unlike Carragher and Gerrard. We need to stop changing manager's when the local two decide their time is up and get rid of the two players who have failed time and time again to even mount a challenge. Why do managers get canned yet the Captain and the vice Captain get to fail time after time.

Someone once said if you cannot change the mentality of the players then you change the players because today the two of them were absolutely awful with Carra spending most of the game bent over double and Gerrard not even being involved with the free kicks at the end. Managers have come and managers have gone but the two constants are blindingly obvious, we didn't lose against QPR and Wigan because of the manager we lost because we had absolutely no onfield leadership that must not be allowed to continue.

We need to back the manager to the hilt and allow him the breathing space to clear out the Captain and the vice Captain and let him appoint his own men but sadly it won't happen. We will take another short term decision and the two senior players will get a reprieve.

Another excellent post.

With respect that's bollocks Juan the knives were out for Benitez three League games after that 86 points haul.

And add to that the backroom problems that Rafa faced here, particularly evident towards the end of his reign.
"My coach told me to warm up just before the break. He told me I was going to take care of Kaka. I didn't think it was possible to turn things around but in the dressing room at halftime Rafa Benitez was calm - "We are Liverpool FC, we have so many fans, we are not going to be slaughtered. If we can score a goal quickly we push on from there.""

Offline And Could He Play

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1122 on: March 24, 2012, 07:05:43 PM »
So, how do we fix it?




we win the fa cup, then start again next season, with Kenny as our manager. If we do one thing, its give managers time, the ones that deserve it. I think Kenny deserves more than one full season.
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Offline Red_Mist

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1123 on: March 24, 2012, 07:05:54 PM »
Option 1 is we retain the current management
For me, this would be using our heads Billy.

Offline East of Anfield

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1124 on: March 24, 2012, 07:05:58 PM »
By pointing the finger, spitting dummies and lamenting by-gone managers. Why, what else is there to do?

Not watch footy for the rest of the season?

Offline RedDan87

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1125 on: March 24, 2012, 07:06:14 PM »
Hazard.

because with the offers he'll have pouring in from europe's elete, he'll want to play for us right now won't he?

Offline mercurial

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1126 on: March 24, 2012, 07:06:18 PM »
Kenny Dalglish is perhaps the ultimate guardian of our club's spirit. He's the biggest living legend we have and know one knows us better then he does.
He's also the biggest playing icon in our history and was our father at our lowest ebb.
The love we have for him is unique. His position in our hearts is unique.

But when it comes to him as a manager in the modern game there has to be question mark against his name.

Can he just come back after ten years away and slot back in at the highest level of the sport?
It would be a massive task for anyone in any profession.

To say its too big a task is not to diminish his previous achievements or question him as a person. But it's a massive ask for any human being to perform a task at the highest level of a profession after such a long gap out of it and during a time when it has become more professional than it ever has been.

For my money its just too much to ask of him.

He was there for us when our spirit was on the floor. We needed him and only him and needed us. He's put a smile back on our faces and we've put one back on his. But if we want to compete again at the highest level of all, we have to detach ourselves from his legacy and ask ourselves if he's the right man, right now.

And for my money he is not.

Which Coach will you guarantee us to get who will take us to 4th place next year? You know I hope that it is exactly this sort of opinion leads us to our downfall. It got rid of Rafa and will get rid of Kenny as well if we are not careful. It will not get rid us of our problem though. A new manager, a new set of problems and new challenges and no where near fourth next season. Your opinion is wrong on so many counts, in fact you probably want to vent your feelings more than actually rationalise. A new manager is not the answer. Kenny has won against most of top teams, has won a cup, we are in FA cup semis. That is quite an achievement, name me another manager in the league who has managed that so far? On overall achievement this season, I cannot think of more than 3 managers who have done better and those 3 are with teams in the top 3 places. So decide whatever you want but really asking for a manger's head at this stage is just fundamentally wrong and not acceptable.

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Offline Sat1

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1127 on: March 24, 2012, 07:06:22 PM »
After wasting what we did on very poor footballers I'm surprised many people didn't see this coming.

This is the weakest 1st team for a very long time, back to Evans time.

We won't challenge any time soon so may as well enjoy being a cup team. There's a fair few already think we're progressing coz we won the Carling cup. I might stick my head in the sand like they have

Offline Libertine

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1128 on: March 24, 2012, 07:07:14 PM »
Luis Garcia and Alonso built on those solid foundations and lifted the team.  Kenny's signings have mostly let him down, the best players (Suarez apart) have all been the ones he's chosen to keep (Agger, Skrtel, Johnson, Lucas, Gerrard) from Rafa's time here.

For me there's a lot of similarity between Kenny and Rafa's first summer of purchases.

Rafa came into a new league, barely speaking the language, and his transfers initially focused on the market he knew best - Spain. Some of these didn't deliver (mostly cheap ones) but more did and success flowed from that.

Kenny wasn't new to this league, but he was 10 years out of management. Thrown back into the deep end, he again focused on what he knew best - the english market. Unfortunately for Kenny, the standards in the British market are so far below the Spanish one.

Of course the whole point of having a Director of Football is that you have someone whose whole focus is recruitment and you have a more long term and considered approach. Which makes me wonder what exactly our esteemed DoF has done since he got here.....
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Offline The G in Gerrard

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1129 on: March 24, 2012, 07:07:31 PM »
Certain individuals at the Club decided that it was the Foreign players who were continually stopping us from winning the League, they decided that the Club being to Foreign meant that the media, the LMA and the complete gobshites who run English football hated us. We fucked off a brilliant manager and went off on a idiotic English is best crusade that has culminated in the likes of Torres, Alonso, Mascherano being replaced by the likes of Carroll, Adam and Downing.

We need to back the manager to the hilt and allow him the breathing space to clear out the Captain and the vice Captain and let him appoint his own men but sadly it won't happen. We will take another short term decision and the two senior players will get a reprieve.

That's an excellent post. Just disagree that getting rid of our captain would be of a benefit.

Offline Circa1892

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1130 on: March 24, 2012, 07:07:36 PM »
Read this piece by Winter about that Villa defeat and everything fits into a place. A piece hawked around fleet street by Struan Marshall.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/liverpool/6263287/Rafa-Benitez-must-keep-Steven-Gerrard-and-Jamie-Carragher-on-his-side-at-Liverpool.html


Carraghers always got his mates in the media to fight his battles for him. There's that character assassination and then the ludicrous attack on Arbeloa orchestrated by him and Winter after the West Brom game.
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Offline Zelnaga

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1131 on: March 24, 2012, 07:08:08 PM »
Hazard.

lol ..... yes, hed want to come to a club with no champions league and potentially finish mid table when you have the likes of some of the top football teams wanting to sign him?

Offline ThepepeReina

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1132 on: March 24, 2012, 07:08:18 PM »
Another excellent post.

And add to that the backroom problems that Rafa faced here, particularly evident towards the end of his reign.
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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1133 on: March 24, 2012, 07:08:33 PM »
For me there's a lot of similarity between Kenny and Rafa's first summer of purchases.

Rafa came into a new league, barely speaking the language, and his transfers initially focused on the market he knew best - Spain. Some of these didn't deliver (mostly cheap ones) but more did and success flowed from that.

Kenny wasn't new to this league, but he was 10 years out of management. Thrown back into the deep end, he again focused on what he knew best - the english market. Unfortunately for Kenny, the standards in the British market are so far below the Spanish one.

Of course the whole point of having a Director of Football is that you have someone whose whole focus is recruitment and you have a more long term and considered approach. Which makes me wonder what exactly our esteemed DoF has done since he got here.....

Is there fuck.

An Alonso and a Garcia last Summer would have had me delighted, despite Luis being the most frustrating footballer in history. Kenny knows football. Certain players have let him down big-time, and we were shopping without the lure of being in the European cup. We could have spent less and got the same return that we have had.
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Offline Z e u s

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1134 on: March 24, 2012, 07:09:27 PM »
Hard to know what to say, as that was a very disappointing performance – probably our worst at home all season.   In the past when we have dropped points at home, they have usually not been deserved.  On the whole I think we have played some really good football this season, some of the best I have seen in the last 10 or so years.  But the problem is we haven’t produced winning football and that is what matters. 

I am fully behind Dalglish.  I want to see stability at the club and I don’t want to see us chopping and changing our manager every season – I think if anyone deserves patience, time and another season to get it right it is him.  Having said that is my heart talking and my head however thinks he has to be accountable for this woeful league position.  The cup runs are papering over the cracks for him and that is good in the regard I would hate to be in the position where we did have to sack Dalglish.  I think as supporters and a club we give our managers time (Hodgson being an exception), that is something I will give Dalglish, another season to get this right.
It is really frustrating because as I said we have played some very good football on the whole this season, even the 70 minutes at QPR mid-week we saw that.  But when things don’t go well they escalate and even two of our best players this season in Skrtel and Enrique are making mistakes in the last two games and that is not what we need.  If I had to give the player of the season award now, it would be to Bellamy, as he has been consistently our best player when used this season.

I thought today we looked a right mess in the first half.  The players were all over the place and as a result we lacked cohesion and were making numerous mistakes all over the place – our passing was dreadful.  The crowd then got moany and groany, the little confidence the players had left and we looked really poor.  The annoying thing is Wigan were awful today, not one of their players would get in our team or even squad on paper.  I don’t know what Skrtel was doing for their first goal, it was rash and not needed as Moses was never going to generate enough power to beat Pepe with the header.  But what was most disappointing was when we had possession, I don’t think the players lacked passion or effort, they clear care – but they were always trying to force things and we could really have done with some composure on the ball, something our side has lost since Alonso left… although I thought Shelvey gave some of that when he came on the pitch, he was finding red shirts with his passes and I think we aren’t making use of this guy who should be used far more IMO.

I have issues with Gerrard, who was awful today, as I don’t know where he should play.  If we play him in centre midfield, like today then he isn’t near the oppositions goal enough unless he leaves his position and that leaves Spearing having to do too much and a massive whole in our midfield.  If we play high in a free role off Suarez, then where is Suarez going to play as that is where we want Suarez to be surely?!  I’m thinking he might be best on the right, as we saw in the last 20 minutes or so today and I think it was the best the team looked all match.  It is a problem!

I look at our squad and I still think we are very close to being a very good team.  Unfortunately for Dalglish I think the players who are letting us down on the whole are his signings – Henderson, Carroll and Downing today and Adam in other matches.  Now today the whole team were poor, bar Flanagan, Shelvey, Sterling and possibly Suarez.  But our league position isn’t because of this one match, it is down to several poor results and I think those four players have been disappointing, as has Kuyt and Carragher when used this season.

I might be deluded but I really think we have got a really good spine of players to work with in Reina, Johnson, Kelly, Flanagan, Skrtel, Agger, Coates, Wisdom Enrique, Robinson, Lucas, Spearing, Shelvey, Gerrard, Bellamy, Sterling, Suso and Suarez. 

But I think Dalglish has to get tough and ruthless with the other players in the summer as I would release or get rid of Carragher, Maxi, Kuyt, Carroll, Henderson, Aurelio and Downing.  Might seem harsh but the club can’t stand still and I think we need to be ruthless if we want to progress and get to where we want to be and we should get some good fees for some of those players that can get us better players for the future – although I think Shelvey, Suso, Stelring and Wisdom are four players who should be in our first team squad, so that four players who have cost nothing but are probably improvements on Carragher (Wisdom), Downing (Sterling), Kuyt (Suso) and Henderson (Shelvey).

We need to be bold, Dalglish needs to be bold and we need to put sentiment to one side and we need to be ruthless… until we are and we cut our losses on these players and are brave enough to tell someone like Carragher that they aren’t in our future then we won’t improve.  On the whole the future of the club is really bright, but we have five or six players letting us down and unfortunately we have seen too much of Carragher, Downing, Carroll, Henderson and Adam this season and it has cost us as they aren’t good enough for where we want to be!     

In the summer we need to get rid of those players, promote some youth and buy two or three top class players.  But are Dalglish and Comolli brave enough to do that?  We'll see I guess.

Sterling, Flanagan and Shelvey today proved they are good enough and better than some of the options ahead of them.

Offline karl1987

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1135 on: March 24, 2012, 07:09:29 PM »
Is this true? -

Results in last 7 Andy Carroll starts

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Offline surfer

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1136 on: March 24, 2012, 07:09:39 PM »
Kenny's also not shopping as part of a club with champions league football. So yeah, big difference. Rafa wasn't operating with a DoF either, let's be fair.

But y'know, the situations aren't comparable, so it would seem unfair to me to compare Rafa Benitez going into his 6th season at the club - with a side that finished 2nd and with the highest points total in 20 odd years- with Kenny Dalgish going through his first since returning. Doesn't stack up. Rafa was far further into the 'project'.

He also managed his last season at a time of uncertainty and upheaval for the club, financially limited.That should be the main factor when looking at that season and judging it, the same way the fact that this is Kenny's first should be given emphasis.

Not a single word about those factors during his last season in your posts. Exited cups this, regression that. Are you in the least interested in being fair to the man or still trying to justify it to yourself. What a loada crap.

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1137 on: March 24, 2012, 07:09:42 PM »
Is this the Rafapool thread? I thought we were discussing our somewhat lack-lustre performance today for some reason.
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Offline Juan Loco

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1138 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:17 PM »
lol ..... yes, hed want to come to a club with no champions league and potentially finish mid table when you have the likes of some of the top football teams wanting to sign him?

Yes.

Deadly serious.

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Offline Fruity

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1139 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:27 PM »
Billy while your post is ok,
 it lacks one thing though Rafa was given 5 years not 12 months and he had a better foundation to build on, given the Istanbul team was three quarters Ged's

I seriously dont think we had a better side in 2005. We had an almost endless list of deadwood. And look where most of those players ended up.

I dont actually think we have that bad a side at the moment - its a better group of individual players then say Arsenal. Problem for me is that Kenny just hasn't got it clicking yet and I am not sure he knows what is his best team/formation.

Don't take this wrong as I certainly don't feel we should be getting rid of kenny. Infact I do think that will set a really bad precedent for us as a club. Not only that it allows the players to put a really shit performance (like today) and feel they can pass the buck to the manager. But with that said Kenny needs to work out what his perfect team is and try and get them playing again. 
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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1140 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:39 PM »
What's that little motto of ours again? Something along the lines of "No one person is bigger than the club"

Oh, and that other one, something along the lines of "players and managers will come and go, Liverpool football club will always remain"

And of course the short and simple "the club comes first".

I love Kenny. I always have and I always will. Nothing will ever diminish my undying love and adoration for that man. But I can't keep living in denial. I can't keep ignoring the fact that we're regressing in the desperate hope that its all eventually going to click and fall into place for us. My heart is telling me to defend him at all costs, but my head just wont let me blank out the harsh truths. Because the truth is, our league campaign has been beyond bad. It has actually been a total and utter failure. That was our 10th loss today. We've lost one third of all our league games. We have also drawn 9. Our home record is appalling. We've been continually dropping points all season against dross opposition. And there's no point denying the fact that we invested a significant amount of money in players who have simply not delivered.

We finished on 63 points in 2010. We played 38 games that season, winning 18, drawing 9 and losing 11. If we drop just 1 more point between now and the end of this season then we'll finish our league campaign on a lesser points tally than we finished on in 2010. Does anyone really think we have the ability to win our last 7 games on the bounce? Considering we have yet to even string as little as 3 wins together this season, I don't see us pulling it off to be honest, and I generally pride myself on being an optimist. Can we finish higher than 63 points this season? Sadly, I don't think we can. Rafa was sacked for finishing on 63 points and he didn't have the luxury of signing nigh on 100 million pounds worth of players in two transfer windows.

In my mind we've got a two options here. Option 1 is we retain the current management, despite the fact we're slipping ever further towards mid table. We retain them in the hopes that they can improve 10 fold on this seasons abysmal league campaign. My heart wants this option.

Option 2 is the harder one. Option 2 is the one where we don't let our hearts rule our heads, and where we apply the same assessment criteria to the current management that was applied to our former European Cup winning manager in 2010, just 1 short year after he had led us to a club record points tally of 86.

That's what it essentially boils down to IMHO. Those motto's I mentioned are ringing loud in my head right now if I'm honest. And I say that with a heavy heart. I can't put in words how much I wanted the clubs greatest living icon to return and to be a triumphant. Every one of us wanted it, but sadly I don't think its going to have the ending we all wanted. I'd love to be proved wrong mind, but that's just how I honestly feel. I also think we'd be foolish to let a league cup success mask the fact that we're slipping further behind in our league form. But as I said, nothing will ever diminish my love and adoration for that man, he will always be the living breathing embodiment of all that is good about Liverpool FC. I'm just offering my honest feelings is all, in the most respectful way I can. Because I've nothing but total respect for Kenny, and I always will
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Offline andy in warrington

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1141 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:40 PM »
as Birmingham proved last season winning the Carling Cup is no sign of progress. we are going backwards at a rate of knots. poor signings, poor tactics, poor selections, players not motivated. sort it out Kenny.

Offline Romford_Red

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1142 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:50 PM »
I said it after the QPR game and I'll say it again...

Once again we were the better side, with the same problem of converting chances/pressure into goals. So no change there.
The only difference now is that we currently have 4 of our defensive players out (Agger, Johnson, Kelley and Lucas) so the fact that we are leaking goals a bit, is hardly surprising, is it?

I'm guessing this will fall on deaf ears, but I really feel we are a clinical striker, creatve midfielder and a couple of defenders (cover and/or recovery) away from being a serious force next season.

Results do no tell the whole story.

Offline Zelnaga

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1143 on: March 24, 2012, 07:10:52 PM »
For me there's a lot of similarity between Kenny and Rafa's first summer of purchases.

Rafa came into a new league, barely speaking the language, and his transfers initially focused on the market he knew best - Spain. Some of these didn't deliver (mostly cheap ones) but more did and success flowed from that.

Kenny wasn't new to this league, but he was 10 years out of management. Thrown back into the deep end, he again focused on what he knew best - the english market. Unfortunately for Kenny, the standards in the British market are so far below the Spanish one.

Of course the whole point of having a Director of Football is that you have someone whose whole focus is recruitment and you have a more long term and considered approach. Which makes me wonder what exactly our esteemed DoF has done since he got here.....

Rafa delivered us the champions league and got us 5th. Not the bloody Carling Cup and the possibility of finishing midtable. Rafa also signed Alonso who would eventually become one of the best midfielder this club has ever seen and Garcia who was brilliant for us at the time. Kennys signing is more miss than hit this season.

Similiarity? Your just clutching straws.

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1144 on: March 24, 2012, 07:11:09 PM »
What's that little motto of ours again? Something along the lines of "No one person is bigger than the club"

Oh, and that other one, something along the lines of "players and managers will come and go, Liverpool football club will always remain"

And of course the short and simple "the club comes first".

I love Kenny. I always have and I always will. Nothing will ever diminish my undying love and adoration for that man. But I can't keep living in denial. I can't keep ignoring the fact that we're regressing in the desperate hope that its all eventually going to click and fall into place for us. My heart is telling me to defend him at all costs, but my head just wont let me blank out the harsh truths. Because the truth is, our league campaign has been beyond bad. It has actually been a total and utter failure. That was our 10th loss today. We've lost one third of all our league games. We have also drawn 9. Our home record is appalling. We've been continually dropping points all season against dross opposition. And there's no point denying the fact that we invested a significant amount of money in players who have simply not delivered.

We finished on 63 points in 2010. We played 38 games that season, winning 18, drawing 9 and losing 11. If we drop just 1 more point between now and the end of this season then we'll finish our league campaign on a lesser points tally than we finished on in 2010. Does anyone really think we have the ability to win our last 7 games on the bounce? Considering we have yet to even string as little as 3 wins together this season, I don't see us pulling it off to be honest, and I generally pride myself on being an optimist. Can we finish higher than 63 points this season? Sadly, I don't think we can. Rafa was sacked for finishing on 63 points and he didn't have the luxury of signing nigh on 100 million pounds worth of players in two transfer windows.

In my mind we've got a two options here. Option 1 is we retain the current management, despite the fact we're slipping ever further towards mid table. We retain them in the hopes that they can improve 10 fold on this seasons abysmal league campaign. My heart wants this option.

Option 2 is the harder one. Option 2 is the one where we don't let our hearts rule our heads, and where we apply the same assessment criteria to the current management that was applied to our former European Cup winning manager in 2010, just 1 short year after he had led us to a club record points tally of 86.

That's what it essentially boils down to IMHO. Those motto's I mentioned are ringing loud in my head right now if I'm honest. And I say that with a heavy heart. I can't put in words how much I wanted the clubs greatest living icon to return and to be a triumphant. Every one of us wanted it, but sadly I don't think its going to have the ending we all wanted. I'd love to be proved wrong mind, but that's just how I honestly feel. I also think we'd be foolish to let a league cup success mask the fact that we're slipping further behind in our league form. But as I said, nothing will ever diminish my love and adoration for that man, he will always be the living breathing embodiment of all that is good about Liverpool FC. I'm just offering my honest feelings is all, in the most respectful way I can. Because I've nothing but total respect for Kenny, and I always will
fucking spot on that's exactly the way to explain what I'm guessing MOST fans are thinking, I certainly am, on one of the other sites a couple of weeks ago one poster said he'd be happy to be in the champioship if it meant kenny would still be in charge , now as much as I love the guy, I support Liverpool football club first and foremost, not one individual comes close + I just want what's best for the club WHATEVER that needs to be
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Offline Greyfox

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1145 on: March 24, 2012, 07:12:05 PM »
lol ..... yes, hed want to come to a club with no champions league and potentially finish mid table when you have the likes of some of the top football teams wanting to sign him?

Right now....with our league position, ...and the potential position of them....Get Dibs on the phone at QPR....

Goals and pace ....and unfinished business here at this club

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1146 on: March 24, 2012, 07:12:39 PM »
He also managed his last season at a time of uncertainty and upheaval for the club, financially limited.That should be the main factor when looking at that season and judging it, the same way the fact that this is Kenny's first should be given emphasis.

Not a single word about those factors during his last season in your posts. Exited cups this, regression that. Are you in the least interested in being fair to the man or still trying to justify it to yourself. What a loada crap.

Oh fuck off with the Dear Leader shite lad. I haven't said anything to slag Rafa off there, I'm just saying that it's unfair comparing Rafa's last season (and the starting position) with Kenny's first.
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Offline Hazell

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1147 on: March 24, 2012, 07:12:39 PM »
I could sit and read Al's post history all day. Not going to mind.

I know his post history. It's very good.
"My coach told me to warm up just before the break. He told me I was going to take care of Kaka. I didn't think it was possible to turn things around but in the dressing room at halftime Rafa Benitez was calm - "We are Liverpool FC, we have so many fans, we are not going to be slaughtered. If we can score a goal quickly we push on from there.""

Offline rafathegaffa83

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1148 on: March 24, 2012, 07:12:59 PM »
Is this true? -

Results in last 7 Andy Carroll starts

- WWDWWWW.

Yep. But we play so much better without him....

Offline -Q-

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1149 on: March 24, 2012, 07:13:04 PM »
To lose against QPR and Wigan in space of a few days lost for words really. Many have argued on here that our squad has been improved, our first 11 definately hasn't.

We were missing probably four of our "first 11" players (Johnson, Agger, Lucas and Bellamy)
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Offline 1021

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1150 on: March 24, 2012, 07:13:05 PM »
Is this the Rafapool thread? I thought we were discussing our somewhat lack-lustre performance today for some reason.

You are fucking boring you.

Win, lose, or draw you are more interested in finding a way to mention a former manager you blatently don't like.
I got the Lucas thing wrong. Will be right on Henderson though. Play him RM, play him CM - Not good enough and never will be.

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1151 on: March 24, 2012, 07:14:01 PM »
Not gonna lie, I haven't felt this deflated about LFC since the Hodgson days.

Sterling and Shelvey I want to see a lot more of, great prospects.
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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1152 on: March 24, 2012, 07:14:20 PM »
Yep. But we play so much better without him....

I'll take winning first, then I'll worry about looking like Barca

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1153 on: March 24, 2012, 07:14:55 PM »
I think kenny must now be realising how bad most of his signings are. Some on here saying its not kenny bit it's the players fault... It's down to the players picked on the day, and kenny should take that responsibility. I am not knocking kenny, just wishing he gets time to dip into the transfer market and this time have more luck with signings. Personally I think he shouldn't sign players for the incredible fees we paid for Carroll for example, but instead buy 5 or 6 signings for that money with the hope some come good.
I'm really saying that Henderson, carra, Carroll, downing are all letting kenny down this season, and kenny has firm belief in them... Hence why he plays them. Sooner or later though he has to wield the axe if they don't perform.

Offline Garcepticon

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1154 on: March 24, 2012, 07:14:56 PM »
After all, this is the manager who stayed on for the 2005 Club World Championship in Tokyo despite learning that his father had passed away back in Spain. In Benítez’s eyes, he was merely being professional, being devoted to his team’s pursuit of trophies.

I'm absolutely speechless. What a c*nt Winter is.
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Offline Velky Al

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1155 on: March 24, 2012, 07:15:09 PM »
Is this true? -

Results in last 7 Andy Carroll starts

- WWDWWWW.

Last 9 without him - DDDLLLLLL


if that is true, then the answer is simple. Play the strike force FSG fucking spent the Torres money on.

Offline -Q-

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1156 on: March 24, 2012, 07:15:19 PM »
Is this true? -

Results in last 7 Andy Carroll starts

- WWDWWWW.

Last 9 without him - DDDLLLLLL


Don't you come in here with your fancy statistics and your facts! The only thing that matters what we see with our eyes and Carroll is rubbish - he only has a 6% chance conversion rate! ;)
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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1157 on: March 24, 2012, 07:15:20 PM »
Back from the game, time to reflect.......A totally inept, insipid, spineless and pathetic performance. Players and management should both be held responsible for this result; and our debacle of a league season as a whole. I fear for Kenny if this continues.
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Offline ar53fluff

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1158 on: March 24, 2012, 07:15:35 PM »
Its going to take Kenny a lot more time to turn this ship around, and I for one hope he is given the time. Some of the absolute bollocks that people trot out after each bad result is truly astounding. i wont even waste my time with the people comparing the Hodgson period with now, or the people who are calling Kenny out of touch, when he clearly showed the last half of last season that he was well capable of churning out great football and good results.

We all need to take a deep breath and start getting behind Kenny cos hes got an important summer ahead of him. We are playing the right football but if youve got professionals who cant stick the ball in the net or clear a basic fcking header of the ball, youre always going to come a cropper. To get the results turned round you at least need to have the basic premise of attacking football, something Hodgson never had a grasp of. I believe given time Kenny AND Stevie Clarke will turn this around for next season, but will they be given that time? Hopefully.
Anyone who wants to constantly belittle us winning a trophy, and being in with a shout of another one..well...theres no argument worth wasting your breath on.
Im proud as fck Kenny took us to a Wembley victory, and I hope he takes us to another...cos regardless of league position, high or low, LFC should chase down every trophy they have a chance in. Im stating the obvious there of course, but some people dont seem to see this. Already the Chav like booing at Anfield has started. Yeah, lets hound out another of our greatest managers and set ourselves back another few years.  :-\

Offline The G in Gerrard

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Re: full time Liverpool 1-2 Wigan Athletic
« Reply #1159 on: March 24, 2012, 07:15:47 PM »
We were missing probably four of our "first 11" players (Johnson, Agger, Lucas and Bellamy)

Our first 11 hasn't improved then as Bellamy is only new addition?