Topic: The defining moment in our season... and it wasn't even on the pitch!

[Renato]

Adam has six assists according to the official EPL site.

He has more than 6 assists.

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/players/profile.statistics.html/charlie-adam

Don't think he has as many as that says but it's all a matter of opinion when it come to assists. Bottom line is Adam has done better than Meireles this season but because we now lack one of Meireles' few qualities he is undergoing the process a lot of former players go through in which his legend is embellished dramatically to provide an explanation for an otherwise inexplicable phenomenon. Aquilani, Arbeloa, Keane and even Alonso have gone through it.

[Vulmea]

our season has been disrupted massively by the whole Suarez fiasco, not just 8 games but the games before and the games after far more so than missing a player that wasn't even starting every game.

its been disrupted by unloading over 20 players in the summer and bringing in 7 or 8 new lads who need to settle - the Meireles issue is a minor one really isn't it?

[Z e u s]

Don't think he has as many as that says but it's all a matter of opinion when it come to assists. Bottom line is Adam has done better than Meireles this season

In your opinion.

I think it is hard tojudge Meireles under Hodgson, as we were a mess and everyone looked poor - even Gerrard, Carragher, Reina etc.

But under Dalglish he was superb, I wouldn't say Adam has been superb this season - decent, at times very good. 

Although really, Meireles should be compared to Henderson not Adam, as he was playing on the right under Dalglish, not central.

[NorthamptonKopite]

People are really getting confused about this. I'm not saying Meireles is some brilliantly gifted player, or that he was on fire last season. I'm just stating that you need to invest in your bench as much as your first 11. You need someone on there who can mix it up, and play a decisive pass, or make a decisive run. We sold someone who could've made that little difference.

[Red_Isle_Chap]

I disagree with this.

I thought Meireles was our best player under Hodgson in a six month period where no player did well and came out looking good.

When Dalglish took over he was a key part of our rise up the league.  He was full of energy, got into the box, kept the ball, got assists and goals.  I really liked him as a player.

He has been used far too deep at Chelsea from what I have seen, more of a defensive midfielder - a player he isn't.

Sorry, but he wasn't the best player under the owl faced twat, not even by a long shot. That would be Lucas "without me we'd be rock fucking bottom of the league" Leiva

Meireles might have scored a couple of goals here, but just as easily you could say the defining moment of the season was downing tearing apart sunderland and crashing a shot against the crossbar. Or the numerous other, inexplicable misses/woodwork hits.

There's a great deal of pining for players who aren't here anymore when things aren't going our way, which they haven't in the league at all this season. But at the end of the day, our season has been defined by numerous players not understanding how to put the ball in the net. Numerous, from defenders through to multi million pound attackers.

That's our season, if you want to see it over the course of 90 mins, go and watch the arsenal game. In my book we don't miss Meireles at all. We just miss the target.

[Z e u s]

our season has been disrupted massively by the whole Suarez fiasco, not just 8 games but the games before and the games after far more so than missing a player that wasn't even starting every game.

Nah, we weren't finishing our chances even before that Suarez incident.

[Z e u s]

Sorry, but he wasn't the best player under the owl faced twat, not even by a long shot. That would be Lucas "without me we'd be rock fucking bottom of the league" Leiva

Yeah Lucas did well then. 

Actually our best period under Hodgson had Meireles and Lucas together in centre midfield.

I don't care who was our best player under Hodgson, yes you are right it probably was Lucas.  But it was a period where hardly any player looked good and I thought Meireles was one of our best players in a really tough situation for the club, especially for a new player.

Anyway he has gone, but I liked him as a player and wish he was still here now.

[Red Genius]

People are really getting confused about this. I'm not saying Meireles is some brilliantly gifted player, or that he was on fire last season. I'm just stating that you need to invest in your bench as much as your first 11. You need someone on there who can mix it up, and play a decisive pass, or make a decisive run. We sold someone who could've made that little difference.

No you called it the defining moment of the season, no confusion mate. Just more knee jerk shite.

[Vulmea]

Nah, we weren't finishing our chances even before that Suarez incident.

so its had no, limited or a large impact on our season?

[Z e u s]

so its had no, limited or a large impact on our season?

Well having him for those four or five league games he missed would have helped, as he is one of our best players.  But I don't think it would have helped our biggest problem - finishing our chances.

I honestly think if this squad had any half decent finisher we'd comfortably be top four, with or without Meireles, the Suarez incident etc.

Still surprised we didn't bring one in January.

[keyo]

meireles had a purple patch, and also certainly had some quality about him.....however, he was not someone i was really gutted about leaving the cub, never actually thought he influenced games enough outside of that purple patch with goals.....hindsight is a wonderful thing and if you want to compare to henderson's contribution then maybe on paper you will have a case, but stick meireles in henderson's position and you are back to last season's complaints about him being no use out wide, play him instead of adam, and as much as that would please plenty he still would not have enough infuence on games to be effective overall.....so where does that leave him?  am sure a pay rise to sit on the bench would have been awesome business that would have pleased everyone.......

[Black Bull Nova]

Decent goal against Birmingham but most Chelsea fans think he's a bit shit and Chelsea have hardly been better than us this year so, no, not anywhere near defining anything

[ArgImAPirate]

I like Meireles, but I don't think he was a big loss. He could be very inconsistent, despite that excellent goalscoring form he hit. I think he ended last season very well as well.

I suppose I'd like him for depth. But it's all hindsight. Meireles isn't doing all that well at Chelsea. In all honesty, I'm more disappointed about Aquilani and Joe Cole (and I wanted Joe Cole sold, let alone out on loan). But that is, again, all just hindsight.

I liked what Raul gave to the team when he was playing well, but I don't think he was crucial to our long term success. We're still a team in transition making slower progress than we'd have hoped. It's been a strange season in a lot of ways though.

[Melbred]

Decent goal against Birmingham but most Chelsea fans think he's a bit shit and Chelsea have hardly been better than us this year so, no, not anywhere near defining anything

Apparently he didn't celebrate his goal and just stormed off the pitch after the game in protest of Luνs Andrι de Pina Cabral e Villas-Boas's sacking.

Things are pretty rosy over there for our ex-reds..

[Harinder]

so has Meireles changed every game he's come off the bench then?

[Hunter Thompson]

He would certainly have added to our quota of shite haircuts. Is he defined by the roadkill on his head? Who knows.

I'm sure Chelsea fans would send him back in a heartbeat, given half the chance.

[Rohit]

Fuck meireles, our season was defined when we choose not to buy a quality central midfielder to partner lucas or step in for him when he was out. Such did it affect us that kenny he played him every game available until the unfortunate incident with mata which left us with no central midfield. Not even hindsight, mentioned my concern with few others to not strengthen that area of the pitch. People blame our lack of goals but we have lacked lucas's incisive passing through the center of the pitch and results have been going steadily downhill ever since. So much such that one of our greatest attacking players has been shoe horned to fill the lucas sized hole in our midfield and at times has found wanting.

[montysmum]

Once a player puts in a transfer request then that is it, it's over, unless they have a rethink, see the error of their ways and withdraw it which Miereles didn't.  Like his mate Torres he asked to leave at the last minute.

I hate the attitude some players have.  Come to the club, get s bit of a name for themselves and l of a sudden they think they are the dogs pajamas, handing in demands and demanding transfers.

Miereles should have stayed here, as should Torres, but the lure of the London lights, big money and winning trophies (ironic isn't it) turned their heads .

I am sure Kenny would have tried to get them to stay, but I doubt he has much time got anyone who doesn't put the interests of the club first.

Neither player have set the world slight at the plastics, neither are in a happy club, neither have the solid people in charged that they would have had here.

Sod them both. They didn't think enough of the club to stay and give Kenny a chance, so I have nothing but contempt for them both.

[Renato]

In your opinion.

I think it is hard tojudge Meireles under Hodgson, as we were a mess and everyone looked poor - even Gerrard, Carragher, Reina etc.

But under Dalglish he was superb, I wouldn't say Adam has been superb this season - decent, at times very good. 

Although really, Meireles should be compared to Henderson not Adam, as he was playing on the right under Dalglish, not central.

Yes in my opinion, forgot to add that. I disagree that he was superb under Kenny. He scored those 5 goals and that's about it, the rest of the time he was a good player who kept us ticking over offensively - nothing brilliant or overly flashy, but dependable nonetheless.

But anyway, having watched Meireles about 10 times this season he has gone backwards if anything. Whether or not that has something to do with Luνs Andrι de Pina Cabral e Villas-Boas's strange tendency to play him in a deeper role I don't know, but hes just not been that good, period. Adam certainly hasn't been perfect either but regardless of what Rossi will have you believe he has not scored 10 own goals or been Poulsen-level shit. He has actually contributed to about a third of our goals this season, although in many recent performances he has flattered to deceive in rather spectacular fashion, and at times there have been glimpses of a really excellent player who has just struggled to last the 90.

I personally don't think Meireles should be compared to Henderson personally as while he was here Raul was given a bit more license to attack, meanwhile Henderson has been more of a workhorse pumping up and down the sidelines helping out his fullback. Also Adam has often-times this season taken up the role that Meireles vacated as the advanced playmaker

[NorthamptonKopite]

No you called it the defining moment of the season, no confusion mate. Just more knee jerk shite.

Well, as people kept on going about fine margins, I thought I'd bring up someone who could've changed those fine margins. Which you could call defining. It's not knee jerk, it's called 'calling it how you see it'. I see a team who have been so close to turning draws into wins on so many occasions, and having that little extra quality in the squad could've done it.

People throw the word knee jerk around a bit too often these days. It's not like I posted this the second we lost to Arsenal, or drew to Stoke. That would be knee jerk.

[Z e u s]

It should be added Meireles has more league assists for us than Downing this season - despite only playing 40 minutes for us!

I think he was underated.  He was no Alonso and not a great or anything, but I also think he would enhance our first XI we have at that moment.  But then again Maxi would enhance it as well and he doesn't play much either.

[Renato]

Well, as people kept on going about fine margins, I thought I'd bring up someone who could've changed those fine margins. Which you could call defining. It's not knee jerk, it's called 'calling it how you see it'. I see a team who have been so close to turning draws into wins on so many occasions, and having that little extra quality in the squad could've done it.

People throw the word knee jerk around a bit too often these days. It's not like I posted this the second we lost to Arsenal, or drew to Stoke. That would be knee jerk.

Yeah but there have been far more glaring 'defining' moments in the season than this - Lucas' injury (in particular), Suarez' ban, Gerrard's recurrence, etc.

[Z e u s]

I personally don't think Meireles should be compared to Henderson personally as while he was here Raul was given a bit more license to attack, meanwhile Henderson has been more of a workhorse pumping up and down the sidelines helping out his fullback.

Meireles was mainly on the right last season under Dalglish - that is where Henderson has been.  It is obvious they should be compared and Meireles got more goals and aasist than Henderson has.  So on stats alone, he would have improved us given scoring is a problem.

Anyway we might have to agree to disagree about how much impact he would have had. 

I think our biggest problem has been a lack of a finisher.  If this squad had a Fowler, Owen, Torres or Rush we'd be top four, possibly challenging for the title.

[Vidocq]

Meireles was/is twice more intelligent player than Adam or Henderson

so is Maxi over Downing

so was Babel (as a striker 9) over Carroll

[Gizoku]

I would take our bench this season over our bench of last season every day of the week.

[Pistolero]

our season has been disrupted massively by the whole Suarez fiasco, not just 8 games but the games before and the games after far more so than missing a player that wasn't even starting every game.

Agreed...the defining moment of the season was actually in the referees changing room just after the Man U game in October...

[Y2J]

He has more than 6 assists.

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/players/profile.statistics.html/charlie-adam

Don't think he has as many as that says but it's all a matter of opinion when it come to assists. Bottom line is Adam has done better than Meireles this season but because we now lack one of Meireles' few qualities he is undergoing the process a lot of former players go through in which his legend is embellished dramatically to provide an explanation for an otherwise inexplicable phenomenon. Aquilani, Arbeloa, Keane and even Alonso have gone through it.

THE PAGE CANNOT BE FOUND

Can you please provide screen shots of the page.

[Vulmea]

Well having him for those four or five league games he missed would have helped, as he is one of our best players.  But I don't think it would have helped our biggest problem - finishing our chances.

I honestly think if this squad had any half decent finisher we'd comfortably be top four, with or without Meireles, the Suarez incident etc.

Still surprised we didn't bring one in January.

I understand but the point I was trying to make was that the Suarez incident had an effect not just for the 8 game ban (in fact 9 given the cause of the other ban) but on Suarez and the team prior to the ban, basically a month - and even since with Suarez desparate to show his 'greatness' and how that impact has shaped our season - we win a couple of games, score a few extra goals in that period and our whole season takes a different road

I'm not sure the difference between Meireles and Henderson equates to that impact, in fact it probably heightens any difference that does exist.

[RideTheWalrus]

Bleh, he was okay. No more, no less. He had a really good scoring run, and often caught a few good rasping shots. But, his inability to tackle, and last full matches cancelled that out really. He always looked shattered in the last 10/15 minutes. He was a good link-up player, but him leaving wasn't the problem, but not replacing him, as you say, was.
Personally, Adam's not done it for me so far, and I doubt he will. For this reason, it's a shame Meireles wasn't kept and played in the centre.

[Z e u s]

I understand but the point I was trying to make was that the Suarez incident had an effect not just for the 8 game ban (in fact 9 given the cause of the other ban) but on Suarez and the team prior to the ban, basically a month - and even since with Suarez desparate to show his 'greatness' and how that impact has shaped our season - we win a couple of games, score a few extra goals in that period and our whole season takes a different road

I know what you meant, but I disagree.

We were not scoring enough even before the Suarez incident, so I think your point is flawed.

[keyo]

Fuck meireles, our season was defined when we choose not to buy a quality central midfielder to partner lucas or step in for him when he was out. Such did it affect us that kenny he played him every game available until the unfortunate incident with mata which left us with no central midfield. Not even hindsight, mentioned my concern with few others to not strengthen that area of the pitch. People blame our lack of goals but we have lacked lucas's incisive passing through the center of the pitch and results have been going steadily downhill ever since. So much such that one of our greatest attacking players has been shoe horned to fill the lucas sized hole in our midfield and at times has found wanting.

so our problem this year has been not controlling midfield?  personally i think it is the lack of goals and missed chances when dominating games.......there is a case that meireles may have provided a more clinical edge (but then, so does maxi) to our finishing/chance creation and that is the fine margins that the op refers to....it could equally be that meireles would have been anonymous as he was for much of last season and we would have less control in the midfield

[over the line an far away]

Selling the shite Keane wasn't the problem in 2008/9. Not replacing him was.

Just as selling Meireles in 2011 isn't the problem now. No, that would be letting Aquilani leave on loan, and playing Charlie Adam every single fucking week.

The man talks sense

[Vulmea]

I know what you meant, but I disagree.

We were not scoring enough even before the Suarez incident, so I think your point is flawed.

because Meireles would have provided the goals from assists or directly even though he was a fringe player?

[Z e u s]

because Meireles would have provided the goals from assists or directly even though he was a fringe player?

No I agree with you, Meireles would probably not have changed much either, as I don't think Kenny would have played him.  Even if Kenny had played him, he wouldn't change our biggest issue - we have no striker who can finish the numerous chances we create.  That is our biggest problem and everyone knew this in January and we still did nothing!

I just don't think the Suarez incident was the biggest problem either.  I think it was the lack of a finisher, as we don't have one.  Our best finisher is Bellamy and we play him on the wing.

[Rohit]

so our problem this year has been not controlling midfield?  personally i think it is the lack of goals and missed chances when dominating games.......there is a case that meireles may have provided a more clinical edge (but then, so does maxi) to our finishing/chance creation and that is the fine margins that the op refers to....it could equally be that meireles would have been anonymous as he was for much of last season and we would have less control in the midfield

Our forwards don't get the ball earlier enough, suarez is having to drop deeper and deeper to collect the ball. Lucas is our best passer and he builds up alot of our attacks from deeper in midfielder. Him being our has also forced us to play gerrard there which has taken away our best attacking midfielder away from the forwards and having to do the dirty work in midfield. The quality of our chances is crap compared to some of the teams above us.

[Z e u s]

Lucas is our best passer

Little guy called Steven Gerrard might disagree with that.

Lucas is many things, but he is not our best passer!

[Rohit]

Little guy called Steven Gerrard might disagree with that.

Lucas is many things, but he is not our best passer!

Oh he is, gerrard is a great player and his final pass is world class but no lucas keeps the ball better and uses it better in deeper areas. Gerrard is a better passer in the final third however.

[RideTheWalrus]

Little guy called Steven Gerrard might disagree with that.

Lucas is many things, but he is not our best passer!

Depends on the type of passing. Gerrard will have a lower percentage because he tries longer passes, Lucas goes for more simple passes.

[Z e u s]

Right I think I have had enough for tonight.  I can't be bothered to debate with people who think Lucas is a better passer than Gerrard.  You couldn't make it up!

Good night all.

[will2003]

Personally i think shelvey is this years Raul but the kid can't seem to get a look in and must be wondering why the hell he was brought back from Blackpool. The lad has huge potential IMO and would fill the gap Raul has left. I think for the sake of a raise he should have stayed but the club thought better.