Topic: Andy Carroll, Prime Target by Paul Tomkins

[Zlenpasha]

He fought today.

[Shanks1965]

He did win most headers......  Did you actually watch them game?

I did ...and he didnt.

[JayH93]

He fought for the shirt today, first time he's done that for me, header at the end would have rounded off a good performance nicely.

[Lenin]

Big Andy is the new Lucas Leiva. You either see it or you dont.

[rednich85]

Big Andy is the new Lucas Leiva. You either see it or you dont.

*sniggers*

[Lenin]

No Big Andy, no domestic cups, no?

[NOTBORNIN1982]

He actually looked like he could hold the ball up and lay it off today, a few nice touches and flicks... pleasantly surprised. Well done big lad. Let's hope he's turned the corner.

[Lenin]

He actually looked like he could hold the ball up and lay it off today, a few nice touches and flicks... pleasantly surprised. Well done big lad. Let's hope he's turned the corner.

MOTM.

[Lenin]

..........but, but, but. Fucking gobshites.

[oddball]

I did ...and he didnt.

Well he did, if you read the stats already posted 18 won, plus 3 chests down to 10 not won, of which 2 went out for a throw to us.

[oddball]

Big Andy is the new Lucas Leiva. You either see it or you dont.

Hahahahhahahaha, I like that, and I tell you what mate, Id like that even more if he came off for us.

[Lenin]

Hahahahhahahaha, I like that, and I tell you what mate, Id like that even more if he came off for us.

Where are all the 'only messing, like' gifs? fucking beauts.

[oddball]

Thing is though mate, I can see both sides. I'd love for Andy to work out, but if I had a gun to my head and had to decide now, Id say he wont, and that goes with what Ive heard, and what has been corroborated.

[Dr Manhattan]

Still stand by my post from a few pages back, but you give credit where it's due, especially if you've ripped him to pieces when he's deserved that too.

He was boss today.

Still think he's got no future here and isn't the sort of player we need, but I can't take anything away from the way he played today. Put in a real shift.

[Lenin]

Still stand by my post from a few pages back, but you give credit where it's due, especially if you've ripped him to pieces when he's deserved that too.

He was boss today.

Still think he's got no future here and isn't the sort of player we need, but I can't take anything away from the way he played today. Put in a real shift.

Squad Manhattan, squad. Throw Big Andy on. Throw Craig on. Throw Dirk on. Throw Charlie on. Squad.

[rusty-la]

Still stand by my post from a few pages back, but you give credit where it's due, especially if you've ripped him to pieces when he's deserved that too.

He was boss today.

Still think he's got no future here and isn't the sort of player we need, but I can't take anything away from the way he played today. Put in a real shift.

Fair play to the Doc.

Carrol had a good game today, maybe his best in Red.

He's not the finished article, we know that.  But the lad is doing his best. 

He's here and he loves being here, so let's treat him as one of ours.  Some say that given time he may turn in to the player we all hope/believe he can be. The club clearly think so.

In the meantime I'm waiting for a few of the mud slingers to come in here and follow Docs lead......Chakan?

[Dr Manhattan]

He's not the finished article, we know that.  But the lad is doing his best. 

See, that's just it. He ISN'T doing his best. That's why I made up my mind on him a while ago.

Approaching his best was today's performance. If you're not scoring then you're putting in a real shift, and that's exactly what he did. Nobody can teach you that, it's not something you work on in training, it's just real sweat and grind and working your arse off for the side. Today was the first time I've seen him do that for fucking ages. In fact it may have been the first time this season I've seen him work really really hard. And that's really all you can ask for. It's why I've been one of Kuyt's supporters over the years - if he doesn't score he at least puts a shift in.

I said the other day that Bellamy, a man 10 years his senior with dodgy knees, is putting Carroll to complete shame, and he was. The effort is what makes everyone happy with Bellamy, even when he isn't scoring. If Carroll did what he did today more often then we might actually have a player here. Truth is, he's done that about three times since he's been here. And it's all well and good for people to think they've seen him do this sort of thing before, but have you really? Didn't today's performance stick out just that little bit? Just that little bit above what he's done before? I think, if you're honest, it did.

I don't think he's giving his best every game and he really needs to if he isn't scoring. If he WAS scoring as well then he'll get away with it, but he isn't, so the effort needs to be loads more like today and loads less like what he's usually doing, which is trotting around the pitch looking unfit and lazy, looking half-arsed and no threat at all. He's done it all too often and people just keep defending it. All I'm doing is NOT defending it, but at the same time I will tip my hat when he's worked his fucking c*nt off to get us a result - and that's entirely what he did today.

[jason23]

See, that's just it. He ISN'T doing his best. That's why I made up my mind on him a while ago.

Approaching his best was today's performance. If you're not scoring then you're putting in a real shift, and that's exactly what he did. Nobody can teach you that, it's not something you work on in training, it's just real sweat and grind and working your arse off for the side. Today was the first time I've seen him do that for fucking ages. In fact it may have been the first time this season I've seen him work really really hard. And that's really all you can ask for. It's why I've been one of Kuyt's supporters over the years - if he doesn't score he at least puts a shift in.

I said the other day that Bellamy, a man 10 years his senior with dodgy knees, is putting Carroll to complete shame, and he was. The effort is what makes everyone happy with Bellamy, even when he isn't scoring. If Carroll did what he did today more often then we might actually have a player here. Truth is, he's done that about three times since he's been here. And it's all well and good for people to think they've seen him do this sort of thing before, but have you really? Didn't today's performance stick out just that little bit? Just that little bit above what he's done before? I think, if you're honest, it did.

I don't think he's giving his best every game and he really needs to if he isn't scoring. If he WAS scoring as well then he'll get away with it, but he isn't, so the effort needs to be loads more like today and loads less like what he's usually doing, which is trotting around the pitch looking unfit and lazy, looking half-arsed and no threat at all. He's done it all too often and people just keep defending it. All I'm doing is NOT defending it, but at the same time I will tip my hat when he's worked his fucking c*nt off to get us a result - and that's entirely what he did today.

Fair points Doc. You could see how frustrated he was getting when our players chose not to cross for him - Downing in particular stuck out as wasting a few opportunities to knock in a cross for him especially after he had laid the ground work and put the shits up DeGay and the Utd defenders.
He actually looked like he wanted to be in our shirt today and that will go some way to him earning a place in our squad...

[Lenin]

If all of the new lads would have hit the ground running, we would not just have been running riot in all the domestic cups we are in, we would have been pushing City for the League. Carroll, Adam, Henderson, Downing. Big step up for all of them. Give them (especially the younger lads) a bit of time. After all Craig Douglas Bellamy was a flop first time round, now he's the bees knees.

[rusty-la]

*sniggers*

You're good. Got an opinion?

[rusty-la]

Doc. That's a lot of words to make a point. Not sure what your point was, I lost interest half way through. No offense mate.

Anyway, I thought Andy put a shift in today and this was possibly his best game for us.

[Lenin]

Today’s game probed what some people already thought, that he wasn't giving it all. I fucking hate that, you can't put half-arsed displays one day and then put in a shift like he did today.

Yes today 'probed' that. Totally. Andy can turn it off and on like tap water. 

[Lastrador]

Fair points Doc. You could see how frustrated he was getting when our players chose not to cross for him - Downing in particular stuck out as wasting a few opportunities to knock in a cross for him especially after he had laid the ground work and put the shits up DeGay and the Utd defenders.
He actually looked like he wanted to be in our shirt today and that will go some way to him earning a place in our squad...

But that is the type of player that we want? One that will put a great shift one day and put some half-arsed performance the next? I think that is not the type of mentality we want in a Liverpool player. Commitment and effort should always come first no mather who the player is or who is the rival. I was happy and surprised with Andy's game yesterday, but it also proved that he wasn't giving it all to this point, and I find that in a Liverpool player unacceptable.

[Lenin]

But that is the type of player that we want? One that will put a great shift one day and then put some half-arsed performance the next. I think that is not the type of mentality we want in a Liverpool player. Commitment and effort should always come first no mather who the player is or who is the rival. I was happy and surprised with Andy's game yesterday, but it also proved that he wasn't giving it all to this point, and I find that in a Liverpool player unacceptable.

Put your dummy back in. The mancs would have beat us today if Big Andy wasnt in our team.

[Discipline]

Put your dummy back in. The mancs would have beat us today if Big Andy wasnt in our team.

What are you basing that on exactly? I mean, it was a great performance from him, but that's a load of crap.   

[rednich85]

Rusty-la, how can you say something as definitive as 'he loves being here'?

[LiamG]

MOTM for me yesterday, Never seen him battle and work so hard for us before! Hope he can carry this on now

What did Kenny say after the game about him having to adapt to how we play or something? Cant remember!

[HELLRAZOR]

He put in a great shift yesterday. I know I've criticized him but yesterday he done all that could be asked of him

well in Andy

still think we need another striker but you must stay too

[bigbear]

You can't play him up front on his own and leave him isolated. Get runners in and around him in open play and get him in the box.

Of course he's got to improve the hold up play and he will do but he is not Drogba. He doesn't have the pace to go from the half way line but he can cause defenders real problems if played right and given a bit of confidence.

If we can't do that with him we are wasting our time and his. I still think he is a good option as one of 4 strikers.

[geoffstrong]

But that is the type of player that we want? One that will put a great shift one day and put some half-arsed performance the next? I think that is not the type of mentality we want in a Liverpool player. Commitment and effort should always come first no mather who the player is or who is the rival. I was happy and surprised with Andy's game yesterday, but it also proved that he wasn't giving it all to this point, and I find that in a Liverpool player unacceptable.

Ok in view of that how did you feel after Bolton sell them all except Reina and Andy another flick on, and Craig then, nobody said he was Messi yesterday but he was dam good and a reason we won,  moderate people can accept that!

 His tar and brush mindless group cannot because it spoils their mindset, just like Lucas we have people it seems in this forum who do not want him to do well because it makes them look like the blinkered idiots they are!

So far he has never been a world beater but he also has never been as shite as people have made out either!

It would be good though if the people who dissected his 6 minutes in an away win at Chelsea did the same for yesterday because you know if they did they may get a nasty shock and find out he played well.

Haters got to hate!

[MazzaRed]

His flick on for Dirks goal was great, but apart from a couple of hold up balls, and his crossbar header... I was waiting for Kenny to swap him for Craig when that sub came....as I thought he was too isolated.  What do I know though?

[Dr Manhattan]

Ok in view of that how did you feel after Bolton sell them all except Reina and Andy another flick on, and Craig then...

His tar and brush mindless group cannot because it spoils their mindset...

Is English your first language? Genuine question.

[geoffstrong]

Is English your first language? Genuine question.

No Welsh genuine question what are you a doctor of other than banality!

It was a reply to a rather silly post, you must be used to them!

[oddball]

Meow.

[Dr Manhattan]

No Welsh genuine question what are you a doctor of other than banality!

It was a reply to a rather silly post, you must be used to them!

Grow up, for fucks sake. It was actually a genuine question. Some people on here struggle to put sentences together if they're from another country and English isn't their first language. I was asking you because sometimes it's impossible to understand what you're talking about.

Should have known you'd react that way though.

[Lastrador]

Ok in view of that how did you feel after Bolton sell them all except Reina and Andy another flick on, and Craig then, nobody said he was Messi yesterday but he was dam good and a reason we won,  moderate people can accept that!

 His tar and brush mindless group cannot because it spoils their mindset, just like Lucas we have people it seems in this forum who do not want him to do well because it makes them look like the blinkered idiots they are!

So far he has never been a world beater but he also has never been as shite as people have made out either!

It would be good though if the people who dissected his 6 minutes in an away win at Chelsea did the same for yesterday because you know if they did they may get a nasty shock and find out he played well.

Haters got to hate!

You really hit the point of my post there. Where the fuck did I say he was shit yesterday? Where the fuck did I say I want him gone?

I said I was happy with his performance. I thought he played really well to be fair, and that is because his approach to the game was totally different from what he has shown so far, he give it all out there and he never hide.

Look I have always supported the lad and I desperately want to him to do well. But you're not going to tell me in evidence of yesterday’s game that he has been trying his best so far. I have never said he was shit; I have even said that people underrate him in some areas, but what it makes me mad is when a player doesn't even put the effort, and to me one game every ten is not acceptable for a Liverpool player.

About the Bolton game, I think you're doing a great disservice to many players than although didn't play well at least put in some effort, and Andy wasn't one of them, a flick doesn't change that.

And tell me, you find it silly that a Liverpool player should always be committed and that he should at least try every time they step into the pitch? or what part of my post did you find 'Silly'?

[Shanks1965]

Well he did, if you read the stats already posted 18 won, plus 3 chests down to 10 not won, of which 2 went out for a throw to us.

Got no reason tyo argue with the stats but thats not my impression having sat and watched the game. There's a difference (in my view) between "winning headers" and getting your "head on the ball". I can recall him winning 4 good headers in the game. The one for the goal and 3 more like it but with no one making the run past him to get on the end of it.

[rusty-la]

Rusty-la, how can you say something as definitive as 'he loves being here'?

I know his Mum.

Do you beleive he'd rather be elsewhere?

[Coolie High]

I'm probably the most pessimistic poster around here(hence me being watched) but credit where its due he was very good yesterday, he may not be the most talented but if he puts a shift like that every game then there would be no complaints.

[Sinead7]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4Zb0TXkX5s

This was a great move from the big man yesterday. You can almost see him growing in confidence.  He is starting to impose his strength on the other team and its paying off.  Hopefully he is able to continue this run.