Topic: Brian Reade, I salute you

[impz]

Although fuck me, it's gone and gotten dark now. Bastards!!

Hah! it's almost reaching the time of year where theres daylight for 2 months over here! party 24/7 for 60 days aint bad

[Alan_X]

Keep it civil

[cowtownred]

Well, can I once again put on record the absolutely pivotal role played by this website in the defence, and ultimate reclaiming of this football club.

There's a debt owed to the RAWK hierarchy, and the members, that probably deserves a book of its own in my humble opinion.

I have no idea who ''owns'' RAWK... or who can claim to be The Leader. I know Ben and several of the mods, and its a privilege.

But the Internet Terrorists spearheaded the final toppling of that regime.. and the leadership of Fats, Roy, Shanklyboy and Andy, supported by the lieutenants designing shirts, posters, H/G not welcome here leaflets, '4th July demonstrations', musicians recording protest songs, the NYC mafia, etc etc etc...... and all the rest of us footsoldiers, can be very rightly proud of what we helped to achieve.  It was a battle against forces that we had to win, but we had no right to win, it was really David against Goliath. And for only the second time I've heard of, David won.

That was in very major part due to the community that is RAWK, that has built up over a few years. I'm proud of us.



However, the real reason for this post is to highlight how the whole festering sore was exposed in the first instance.

Now even in the beginning, many of us were very unhappy with the new ownership, and the cut of their cloth. I'm very smug to say that I was one. I remember having face to faces with the likes of Terry, NickoH etc at the time, and we were very unhappy.

But we had no idea how bad it was after Athens. What our manager was suffering, having just won an FA Cup and taken us to 2 European Cup Finals in 3 years.

Until one night in (I think) November 2007.

When I had a PM from a fella I've not met (or if I have, I don't know). And how many other people got that PM, no idea. Maybe I flatter myself in thinking it was only me and 2 or 3 'inner sanctum'. In reality, I'd imagine this fella did a RAWK search using keywords of ''c*nt'' ''Gillette'' ''Hicks'' ''I hate'' ''Football is dead'',   and came up with 30 or 40 names.  Now I have no idea where the information leading to the PM came from. But, and I must dig the PM out and read it again soon,  I got a message late one night telling me that there was a BIG BIG BIG CRISIS going on.  Rafas head was on the block... there was a dangerous happening in our Club, and that, quite literally we had a few days to save the manager, and by extension...    save the Club by helping our only last man standing.

And hence, the Porto march was born.

And the ''supporting our manager''....    (and focccccusssssing on helping him) banner was made in a night or two.

Thats how this struggle began, and how it ended.

And guess what, the common denominator is Red and White Kop.  Its an honour to be a wee part of this community. Times recently when we got slagged off for being Rafa's family tree and other shite. Balls to the infidels. We supported Rafa on this site because of the man he is, the things he brought us, and the campaign he ledas a double agent to save the Club he and we share. And the fact that the lads/lasses he met in the pub in Koln were RAWKites.

So...   thanks Rushian.

Maybe someday you will grace us and let us know how the origins of the EPIC SWINDLE came around. When I return in September (its been 2 years now), first thing I want is to meet up and have a pint.

[The 92A]

Well, can I once again put on record the absolutely pivotal role played by this website in the defence, and ultimate reclaiming of this football club.

 Agree with this. Often Rawk gets slagged but it played it's part and without it and some of the other websites I doubt we'd have had the same outcome.

[1021]

Not enjoying reading this one bit.
Good book, nothing new to me (except the behind the scenes anecdotes sort of things), but it is getting me angry again.
Inept ownership started way before those cowboys rocked up at Anfield in their nice red ties.
Unforgivable that anyone with the best interests of Liverpool FC stood idly by, or kept their mouths shut, or left it for others to slog out.

I felt physically sick for about 4/5 months towards the end whenever I thought about it.
And was fighting against them in any way I could from the Klinsmann debacle onwards.
But it was worth it, I have a clear conscience when I think about it and a small sense of pride.

My little contribution pales in comparison to the actions of those on here, other boards, within the Union, and sites like KopFaithful who deserve knighting.They lead from the front, we wouldn't have crashed them servers, or got the press coverage we neededif it wasn't for the organisation and drive of the likes of Fat Scouser, Shanklyboy and Royhendo. And people who forked out so much of their own money and time on projects to get us publicity and attention whilst the majority were cooing at the prospect of getting Joe Cole on the back of their new standard chartered replicas; Terry and Jonny with their songs and shirts.
The sit ins and Independence Day Rally were brilliant, and the few exReds who were arsed enough to stop sticking the knife into Rafa and tackle the ownership situation, Thommo, Aldo (though not the Rafa bit ), Howard Gayle, Jason McAteer was good too if I remember correctly but others to shame.

Not sure how much of that makes sense but I just want to say thankyou to those who know who they are and will no doubt have the grey hairs to show for it, we owe our football club to their leadership.

EDIT: think cowtownred put it better than I could have hoped for.

[ceered]

Cowtownred, I couldn't agree more. The very fact Hicks mentioned the"internet terrorists" in his infamous sky interview (I use the term interview very very loosely!) proves the impact we had, he was obviously still very annoyed - still makes me smile when I think how much we swindled him!

[ceered]

My little contribution pales in comparison to the actions of those on here, other boards, within the Union, and sites like KopFaithful who deserve knighting.They lead from the front, we wouldn't have crashed them servers, or got the press coverage we neededif it wasn't for the organisation and drive of the likes of Fat Scouser, Shanklyboy and Royhendo. And people who forked out so much of their own money and time on projects to get us publicity and attention whilst the majority were cooing at the prospect of getting Joe Cole on the back of their new standard chartered replicas; Terry and Jonny with their songs and shirts.
The sit ins and Independence Day Rally were brilliant, and the few exReds who were arsed enough to stop sticking the knife into Rafa and tackle the ownership situation, Thommo, Aldo (though not the Rafa bit ), Howard Gayle, Jason McAteer was good too if I remember correctly but others to shame.

Not sure how much of that makes sense but I just want to say thankyou to those who know who they are and will no doubt have the grey hairs to show for it, we owe our football club to their leadership.

DITTO!

[SmithdownAndy]

So...   thanks Rushian.

Maybe someday you will grace us and let us know how the origins of the EPIC SWINDLE came around. When I return in September (its been 2 years now), first thing I want is to meet up and have a pint.

Count me in on that mate, top post and you're right this site was pivotal in the fight against the cancers.

[Kahuna{=}Berger]

Great post S. Blessed to have this site. 2 years for me too. Can't wait.

macco.

[hitman89762000]

Count me in on that mate, top post and you're right this site was pivotal in the fight against the cancers.

Absolutely i was reading this place for ages before finally getting to sign up but there were a lot of people on here playing a pivotal role against the club so very fucking brilliantly its amazing how those guys managed to do that including yourself getting those email addresses helped a lot as we all know.

[Terry De Niro]

Cowtownred nails it as per fucking usual... 

Been too fucking long, Shaun..

[barneystuta]

Up to Chapter 5 now.

Thanks to RAWK, I was clued up on most of what was going on. But it is intereting to reflect, and look back, across everything, in one book. So much that has been said by many, I agree with here.

I am just glad we got through it.

I look forward to reading the rest of the book.

[cowtownred]

Cowtownred nails it as per fucking usual... 

Been too fucking long, Shaun..

Terry, remember those days by the Sandon wall in 2007/8. We varied between happiness in meeting up , the arl arses and the younguns, there was joy but gloom between us (who suspected.. and those who thought money, money money kerching ka  ching ....sorry Jesse J).

Well, friendsips made that will last forever.

Strengthened. Kudos to this site.  And Im proud. Proud to be in the family. Terry, we've met all over the continent now... and I'll sing to yer guitar till I die because (well in part) due to this place. And Kahuna, had no idea till I checked my PMs from years ago that you are Mad macco... who I first met on a Euro away in... was it Dusseldorf?  Macco, you and Adam are like me... the real deal.  See ya soon mate. Murf  haha, theres another.

But never underestimate what this site done.

I've had a nice time looking through old PMs and posts from those bad days of late 2007/8.

And I swear, the biggest moment in our recent history was down to Steve off this site (Rushian).

Thats when the whole thing kicked off in my opinion. And hats off to those afterwards who took up the sword on our behalf.  But Redandwhite Kop takes a huge credit for the rescue of our Club in my opinion. And the stalwarts of this site should be very proud.

[Kahuna{=}Berger]

Eindhoven mate. You had the best spec of any of us.

Catch ya soon, with any luck.

[Fat Scouser]

Like I said, not how I remember it, and definitely not how any others who you confronted, or stuck your neck into various threads on it will remember it.. 

And like I've said its bollocks. Always has been and always will be.
No one will find a single post from me saying that 'campaigning against the owners is a waste of time' 
*waits for someone to quote that very sentence*
Why dont you get it ? Its not difficult to ascertain what I was saying regarding Purslow and emailing Journos regarding him, there is a HUGE difference. You know it, I know it and so does any reasonable person.

I've seen this going on. I was going to stay out of it. If it makes you and some other people feel better to rewrite history, so be it. I really don't care. It used to rile me. I got banned a few times for biting back when this sort of bollacks was going on. I didn't care. Every time I got back on, I done it again. I only stopped because seeing all the revisionism suddenly became funny to me, and I didn't care anymore. But I'm stepping into this for a couple of reasons...
1: I like Terry. He's a good red. The lad done all he could to oust H&G. In my book, The Sons of Anfield should never be forgotten and should rank up with there with all our anthems. It will be forgotten eventually, as will the effort Terry and others put into getting it made and aired.
2: The likes of you will probably go on about this for as long as you live, increasing the bullshit of what you done and how great was your contribution until you are telling our grandkids you singlehandidly ran off off H&G.
3: It seems you've already conned a few people into believing you.

I saw it last week when you went all self flagalation, wearing your hairshirt, crying your crocodile tears over how you misjudged Rafa. I was tempted to put it to rights then. I never bothered, even though I was really annoyed to see some good people falling for your act and bollacking Terry and others for pulling you up on it.

The fact is lad, not only did you lay into Rafa tooth and claw at every opportunity, you did exactly what Terry and others said you did... you came into campaign threads telling people not to bother, saying they were wasting their time.

I spent many hours over a course of weeks talking to you by PM, telling you things I really shouldn't have and practically pleading with you to stop putting people off as the campaigns were working. I even gave you information that I couldn't make public at the time, in the hope that would stop you from derailing people's efforts. You ignored me and done it again time and again, until people start to pull you on it and it became quite obvious the threads were having some effect.

I could go on. I can't be arsed. If you need to make yourself feel better by reinventing what happened and what you did, fair enough. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. But I won't stand by and say fuck all when you try to make Terry and others look vindictive. They are right in what they say, and, if and when it's needed, I'll back them on that.

So, little tip you don't deserve....
if I was you, I'd just give it a rest now. I have no desire or intention to go through all this again. But if you insist on it, I will. So, best let sleeping dogs lie no lad. You're only going to loose again and loose all face if you keep it up.

[Fat Scouser]

Well, can I once again put on record the absolutely pivotal role played by this website in the defence, and ultimate reclaiming of this football club.

There's a debt owed to the RAWK hierarchy, and the members, that probably deserves a book of its own in my humble opinion.

PS... during the fight lots of people feel out and had crosswords. That was inevitable. Some of it was public. Some of it was in private. I personally feel out with some of the MODS on here at times and SOS. But the bottom line is, we might have had disagreements, but at the end of the day we were all after the same thing and there was no lasting damage done or grudges held. I know there wasn't on my behalf, anyway. As I always understood it was never going to be plain sailing, can't make an omellette without cracking a few eggs, and all that. But when it's all said and done... I can't praise this site, the mods, SOS, or anyone else who done their bit, no matter how small, enough.

I don't even feel bitter towards people who done nothing. But let's have it right...
There are some people who made massive contributions towards getting rid of H&G and their roles and names aren't even known to most people on here.
I'd love to name a few people. They'd go mad, and I'd never do it. What they done was in the strictest anonyminity and has to remain that way. It seems wrong. I don't even liked getting clapped on the back, while people who done far more will never be known.
That's the irony of it all, people like me getting plaudits they don't really deserve, people who done fuck all and some who even tried to derail some people's efforts, getting praised. Huge contributors remaining unknown... funny in a sort of sad way, I suppose.

[RedinExile]

It's hard to understand frankly how some people didn't get that Rafa was fighting for the club. Then again booing when going top was a new low so to be expected I guess. Sadly a significant chunk of support showed they are thick as a chunky plank and happy to slurp the sky and red top bollocks hungrily down their necks. It was embarassing then and still is now; you get the feeling Hodge was necessary to get some of these wankers to STFU.

[Red Beret]

I've had to deal with people online who have said "Rafa murdered my club.  He's a c*nt." and that SOS should fck off and we should concentrate on the football and only the football.  Anything that happened to the club would be because it deserved to happen and because the fans craved investment.  They should shut up and just accept it.

I am so glad I took part in the email campaign, even if it was only a little bit and towards the end when the Blackstone's story broke.  Just thinking about people like that - we're talking lifelong supporters here - makes my blood boil.

[Fat Scouser]

I've had to deal with people online who have said "Rafa murdered my club.  He's a c*nt." and that SOS should fck off and we should concentrate on the football and only the football.  Anything that happened to the club would be because it deserved to happen and because the fans craved investment.  They should shut up and just accept it.

I am so glad I took part in the email campaign, even if it was only a little bit and towards the end when the Blackstone's story broke.  Just thinking about people like that - we're talking lifelong supporters here - makes my blood boil.

Hopefully me final word on all this...
I had knobheads emailing me death threats mate, telling me they knew my address, telling me they were going to rape and kill my grandkids. The pathetic bastards just made me dig me heels in and try all the more. But there are some sick fuckers out there.

It's won. H&G are gone. We are organised and prepared if we are ever needed again. The rest really doesn't matter any more.

[Manila Vanilla]

RAWK can be proud of the fact that it demonstrated that free speech and open discussion can overcome a heavily censored official line. Cowtownred pretty much nails it.

Credit too to Timbo’s Goals who was the first one to stand up and shout in layman’s terms that the Emperor had no clothes (http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=213798.0). To the people who imaginatively used technology to present evidence, like the photo of Hicks sitting on a bench in NYC hoping to negotiate a new loan.
“Internet terrorism” is a term that shows Hicks was riled but is maybe misleading in suggesting it was only brute force that ousted the pair, rather than the justness of the cause.

Perversely, I’d rather read the Gillett and Hicks version of events. How did they ever think they’d make money out of a football club? It was obvious from the start that someone was going to go bust and, thankfully, it was them.

If there’s nothing new in the book then I probably won’t get it. Brian is clearly passionate but has a knack of so overstating his case that you start to think that things can’t be that black and white. Usually they aren’t. He often gives unsubstantiated opinion and “facts” that turn out to be wrong. I’d hate to read it and start to look for excuses for Gillett and Hicks.

I’d be interested if off-the-record briefings are put on record now, particularly from people like Ayres and Rafa. I will never understand how anyone could imagine Rafa was doing anything other than trying to put the club first. He was playing an impossible hand as best he could and (wrongly) assuming that everyone else would be as professional as he was…..

Sadly, we live in an age where all clubs have to attract so many new “customers” that the “support” ends up being diluted and distorted.

[Red Beret]

Hopefully me final word on all this...
I had knobheads emailing me death threats mate, telling me they knew my address, telling me they were going to rape and kill my grandkids. The pathetic bastards just made me dig me heels in and try all the more. But there are some sick fuckers out there.

It's won. H&G are gone. We are organised and prepared if we are ever needed again. The rest really doesn't matter any more.

Utterly disgusting mate.  Nobody should have to put up with crap like that.  It angers me that these do-nothing berks will reap the comfort and benefit of your hard work and have probably somehow convinced themselves that all your effort was irrelevant and it would have all worked out like this anyway.

[Davvo7]

Some superb posts in this thread over the last few hours. Cowtownred, Terry, FS, Rushian I salute you.

Hopefully there is another book to be written in the near future, one where the real legends of our supporters can be fully documented and allow somebody like me, who was a willing foot soldier, to appreciate what some of you had to put up with. You could call it, "David came up the hill and beat Goliath" (although h&g were never giants so maybe it doesn't quite work). It would allow me to say the proper thank you that I have wanted to do for so long. Some people I will never be able to personally thank because they can't say who they are and what they did and some like Ray Osbourne are no longer with us in body - but his spirit is still here and every time you stand at Anfield and sing or watch on the telly, and cheer us on to a bright new future........ remember them, because without them we would have been fucked. I would pay anything to read that book.

[No666]

What this reminds me of is a kind of post-war setting to rights. Country gets invaded, some people fight in the known resistance, some people fight in secret, some people don't like it but keep schtum, some people collaborate - and a lot of history gets rewritten when the freedom fighters, with firepower and help from external allies, win. But at the end of the day, you have to have your peace commission and move on. I've decided not to buy Reade's book. Part of it is that I don't remember him doing that much at the time (less than the much-maligned Maddock) but mostly it's because I don't want to revisit it all. I really do want to talk about the football, as we yearned to.

[In Fowler we trust]

Maybe someday you will grace us and let us know how the origins of the EPIC SWINDLE came around. When I return in September (its been 2 years now), first thing I want is to meet up and have a pint.

Shaun - brilliantly put

Never forget the way that banner was put together in a matter of a couple of days.  I still have 3/4's of the banner in my house - it should go in the club museum, marking the start of the long battle against the two cancers.

There were times when I thought we would never win - but win we did.

Anyway it has been too long Shaun - hopefully see you really soon.

[mulfella]

2/3 of the way through it at the moment.

Seems a bit too much about Brian for my liking but i suppose thats inevitable.

Still its good to have it all in one place and its a great reminder of the hard work done by you.

Reading some of the names posting in this thread brings back the memories of just how tense things were during the campaigns and the last days.

So heartfelt thanks to those at the core who ensured a much larger number of people got involved in at least a small way in the campaigns.

[mactifosi]

My anger has long subsided but I still have that lingering disappointment that some of my oldest mates did nothing and basically castigated me for trying to educate fellow reds.

I don't really need to read the book to know what happened, the gaps in information will surely come to light some day.
I think the book does have value in helping to counter some of the propaganda and maybe change some minds about SOS and the fight in general.

I do think SOS has a role for the future, supporters are being disenfranchised from their clubs, we need to band together to protect our rights.

[shelts]

you know a lot of people have complained that it wasn't anything that everyone didn't already know, that the book was disappointing, etc etc -  they are CRAZY.

I watched the saga from the beginning - and I thought I paid close attention to most of it - but I have been quite happy with having a lot of background and information gaps filled in.  It's a great and easy read.

And man I am disappointed in Stevie and Carra -- [ducks and runs for cover].

Also Parry still lives in a fucking fantasy land.  And Moores is the biggest idiot of all.

Only on Chapter 2 and I still find it very hard to believe that no research into their background was done and they (Moores and Parry) allowed a bankrupt and a schyster  into our club when even the smallest amount of checking should have set alarm bells ringing.  Completely unbelievable that 44 months of these tossers could have been avoided and those 44 months have set us back at least a decade in terms of development and where we could and should have been!

Still makes my blood boil!

[Red Beret]

At the end of the day Moores and Parry relied on other people to do the checking for them and those people told them what they wanted to hear.  The only thing you can say in Moores' defence is that he only held 52% of the club so at least one of the other major shareholders is equally culpable, as the septics needed 60% to make the mandatory offer and the other shareholders were not obliged to accept it, even if Moores and Parry urged them to.


SPOILER:

Steve Morgan especially is shown up.  He's publicly on the record castigating Moores for selling to the yanks yet the book clearly shows he was pressuring Moores to sell to somebody - ANYBODY - and telling Moores he had an obligation to maximise the share value and if he didn't Morgan would sue.  I always hated that man.

[RedRush]

Good to hear from you again putting people in their rightful places, Fat Scouser. I'm a mere foot soldier and I know my generals. You were the one I followed the most. For me, you played a big part in the war that saved our club! But you've also made it clear. always, that you've got your sources that needed their privacy, and I'd like to thank them too.

I had knobheads emailing me death threats mate, telling me they knew my address, telling me they were going to rape and kill my grandkids.

Sick. And I mean, really sick. What's wrong with people nowadays?

[Fat Scouser]

Mate, thanks for that, but I'm sick of being applauded. I honestly done very little. I've tried me best to make this plain time and time again. All I done was a bit of rebel rousing. Any bullets I fired where provided by other people. It's not false modesty looking for more plaudits. It's the truth. I just gave a bit of me time, that's all. I enjoy a scrap anyway, even if I'm so old it can only be on a keyboard nowadays. But I really wish I could name a few names of people behind the scenes, and say some of the things they done. It makes me laugh to see people trying to grab undeserved credit, when some real heroes will never be known. On top of that, some people made real sacrifices to see this happen. Here's something I shouldn't say but fuck it, I'm going to...
The lad who made the Standard's Corrupted shirts, put real money aswell as his heart and soul into that venture. But very few people know his Dad was dying at the time, and passed away while it was all going on and the lad was looking after him and his Mam at the time. There's a hero for you. But he hasn't been seen since. He done what he needed to do and left it at that. That's the sort of person that deserves the plaudits, and the others in the background working away, and getting big results, but demanding to stay anonymous. Then there's people like Shanklyboy, who worked non stop and isn't around to see what his efforts have helped bring around.
They're the true heroes of all this mate, not the likes of me.

[ArcticRed]

They might have invested more time, energy and effort, Fats... but you shouldn't underestimate what you did on here to get the masses going. Speaking for myself, at least, I think your work as one of the "agitators" on here, kicking peoples asses and getting us in gear, deserve massive plaudits. And you should never downplay that. There might be bigger heroes areound, but you're definitely one as well in all this.
Gonna hold the applause, though... for fear of making you sick

Just my meager £.02

[Fat Scouser]

Hopefully me final word on this. I'm not doing that false modesty bit. I know what I done. I've just told the truth of it, and you're right... my agitating did play it's part. I know I rallied a lot of troops. I think that's why fellas like Hendo, Shanklyboy, Terry, Andy and plenty more sort of pushed me as the mouthpiece. I was glad to do it. As bad as the situation was that caused us to act, it, well.... for awhile there, it even felt like the old days before all the hype of the Sky years, Kopites joining together against all oncomers, united behind our club. And as awful as it was that we had to do it, it was actually a pleasure at times to be involved with people like Johnny that made the shirts.

Like a few people have mentioned before, some of us smelt a rat as soon as the yanks rode into town waving fistfulls of dollars, and calling for Snoogy Doogy dead or alive. I take no credit for saying I'm one. I only had my misgivings because I'd worked for investment capitalists like them in the States. I'd never met more disgusting people. They'd eat babies for a minutes more life. Disgraceful people. But after saying me piece when they first arrived, I shut up and went along with the general euphoria, burying me head in the sand and hoping I was wrong. But when they offered Rafa's job to Klinsmann, I was made up to see some people reacting and doing something. If you think back, you might remember the kit boycott thread. The lad who started that was bang on the money, and the first to act if I remember rightly. Some people backed that immeadiately, as the only thing we had at the time, and stayed in the fight to the very finish. They got no congratulations. They didn't want any. But that was the first stirrings of a fight back that ended in the Epic Swindle. I don't think a single one of them ever wanted praising. In fact, 2 of the lads that really pushed it from the start where banned off here, never to be seen again. And people like Lyndsey and Harry Labrador never got praised for keeping it alive. Everyone who done what they could won this fight, and I really do mean it when I say I find all the congratulations I get a bit embarassing to say the least.
So, get on fat head, Terry De Niro, and leave me alone. I only came in here because of him, the prick.

[Zlenpasha]

Good to see FS (and the others) setting the record straight.
I'll wait some more before I finish the book, the feeling first chapters gave me was not the one I want to revisit anytime soon.
Looking forward now, dreams and songs to sing..

[shelovesyou]

I've seen this going on. I was going to stay out of it. If it makes you and some other people feel better to rewrite history, so be it. I really don't care. It used to rile me. I got banned a few times for biting back when this sort of bollacks was going on. I didn't care. Every time I got back on, I done it again. I only stopped because seeing all the revisionism suddenly became funny to me, and I didn't care anymore. But I'm stepping into this for a couple of reasons...
1: I like Terry. He's a good red. The lad done all he could to oust H&G. In my book, The Sons of Anfield should never be forgotten and should rank up with there with all our anthems. It will be forgotten eventually, as will the effort Terry and others put into getting it made and aired.
2: The likes of you will probably go on about this for as long as you live, increasing the bullshit of what you done and how great was your contribution until you are telling our grandkids you singlehandidly ran off off H&G.
3: It seems you've already conned a few people into believing you.

I saw it last week when you went all self flagalation, wearing your hairshirt, crying your crocodile tears over how you misjudged Rafa. I was tempted to put it to rights then. I never bothered, even though I was really annoyed to see some good people falling for your act and bollacking Terry and others for pulling you up on it.

The fact is lad, not only did you lay into Rafa tooth and claw at every opportunity, you did exactly what Terry and others said you did... you came into campaign threads telling people not to bother, saying they were wasting their time.

I spent many hours over a course of weeks talking to you by PM, telling you things I really shouldn't have and practically pleading with you to stop putting people off as the campaigns were working. I even gave you information that I couldn't make public at the time, in the hope that would stop you from derailing people's efforts. You ignored me and done it again time and again, until people start to pull you on it and it became quite obvious the threads were having some effect.

I could go on. I can't be arsed. If you need to make yourself feel better by reinventing what happened and what you did, fair enough. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. But I won't stand by and say fuck all when you try to make Terry and others look vindictive. They are right in what they say, and, if and when it's needed, I'll back them on that.

So, little tip you don't deserve....
if I was you, I'd just give it a rest now. I have no desire or intention to go through all this again. But if you insist on it, I will. So, best let sleeping dogs lie no lad. You're only going to loose again and loose all face if you keep it up.

Like Ive said many times, its bollocks. Ive never said campaigning against THE OWNERS was a waste of time. Not once.
Ive said sending emails to Journalists solely regarding Purslow was a waste of time as opposed to sending emails to BANKERS and thats a huge difference to what you are suggesting.
But you seem fixated on twisting that into something it isnt.
You care so little it seems you have to post this, and what does my opinion on Rafa have to do with this ? Its a separate issue all together.
Many weeks PM'ing me ? No, you sent me 4 PM's at most. You told me info which to this day I have never divulged. Find a post that I made that divulges it. You wont.

[Fat Scouser]

Like Ive said many times, its bollocks. Ive never said campaigning against THE OWNERS was a waste of time. Not once.
Ive said sending emails to Journalists solely regarding Purslow was a waste of time as opposed to sending emails to BANKERS and thats a huge difference to what you are suggesting.
But you seem fixated on twisting that into something it isnt.

I've been popping in an out of here to see if you'd do this. Well, I'm glad you're finally here, as I can now say my final word on the matter...
This shit doesn't matter one iota to me. I got involved for one simple reason, you are making some good people out to be liars and making them look vindictive. If it wasn't for that I'd have said fuck all and left you alone with your can of whitewash. But the fact is, you know and I know the truth. We spoke about it for ages in private. I'll leave people to decide who's telling the truth.

[shelovesyou]

I've been popping in an out of here to see if you'd do this. Well, I'm glad you're finally here, as I can now say my final word on the matter...
This shit doesn't matter one iota to me. I got involved for one simple reason, you are making some good people out to be liars and making them look vindictive. If it wasn't for that I'd have said fuck all and left you alone with your can of whitewash. But the fact is, you know and I know the truth. We spoke about it for ages in private. I'll leave people to decide who's telling the truth.

Where have I been making out people are liars ? Im sorry but I dont follow you on that one.
As opposed you and others, good reds, are making me out to be a liar. Is that right ?

[shelovesyou]

I've been popping in an out of here to see if you'd do this. Well, I'm glad you're finally here, as I can now say my final word on the matter...
This shit doesn't matter one iota to me. I got involved for one simple reason, you are making some good people out to be liars and making them look vindictive. If it wasn't for that I'd have said fuck all and left you alone with your can of whitewash. But the fact is, you know and I know the truth. We spoke about it for ages in private. I'll leave people to decide who's telling the truth.

Plus you know full well with your status amongst RAWK, and rightly so, that folk will tend to back you as opposed to me.
Clever.
I know the truth as do you, I completely refute your allegations. Its for you to prove them.
All the best.

[all_funkt_up]

In my opinion, the best thing about the internet and a community like RAWK is that it makes you realise you're not on your own. The internet and a good community like RAWK unites decent fans (and a few nob heads too). It allows fans to exchange views and if they arent happy they can attempt to bring about change for the good of the club. Its not just 1 man in a pub moaning to his mates anymore. Now we have 1 man moaning to thousands of people and that mass audience allows for change to come about.

10 years ago, owners had it their own way. Now they should realise that they under scrutiny by the true custodians of the spirit of the club and if we dont like what we see, we have the power to intervene.

[Fat Scouser]

Plus you know full well with your status amongst RAWK, and rightly so, that folk will tend to back you as opposed to me.
Clever.
I know the truth as do you, I completely refute your allegations. Its for you to prove them.
All the best.

Yep, indeed. In fact, the last time I got drew into this by you and a few others, I got banned. I racked up quite a few of them, everytime I got drew into this malarkey and you's made me out to be some sort of internet bully. So, fascinating as it would be to debate you on the subject of you, I'll swerve it.  I'm sure other people can't be arsed with it either, and I have no need or desire to prove anything. In fact, I'm on nights and I'm off for a kip now. So, all the best, indeed.

[Kloofster]

I thoroughly enjoyed the book and devoured it in a single sitting last night.

It's hard not to read it and feel absolute anger towards Moores & Parry. Not just towards the enormity of the mistake they made in selling to H&G but their continued refusal to acknowledge the scale of their error in the first place. Perhaps Reade was too kind to them.

I still feel the book only presents half the story.  To dismiss Hicks as a Fat Texan gambler and Gillett as a stunted trainer-wearing fool is very tempting but probably not wholly accurate.  I would love the inside story from their camps. What was Gillett's game plan? What was his plan for loosening Hicks' hold over him?  How far did Hicks really think he could push the debt on the club and sacrifice onfield performance before the house of cards caming tumbling down? I woudl also love to know how much both would lose from this misadventure.