Author Topic: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe  (Read 173453 times)

Offline Ravenite

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1560 on: February 8, 2011, 02:27:12 PM »

This latest statement is very interesting. I think it reveals just how depressed Fernando was and still is. The fact that he now says Liverpool is a bigger Club than Chelsea will hardly ingratiate him to his new fans. (In fact, with these and other recent statements, I can see them turning on him.) Yet he felt the need to say it - to put the record straight as it were. Not that he has ever said previously that Chelsea is a bigger Club than Liverpool – at least as far as I am aware. In his interviews since joining Chelsea, he has said things like, ‘operating at the highest level’ and ‘there is no higher level than this’. All these statements are factually correct, after all Chelsea are playing in the Champion’s League - his stated reason for joining them.

It’s also interesting that he says that he is surprised that he has experienced a bit of friendliness and camaraderie in the Chelsea dressing room. Why should he be surprised by that and why would he want to go to a club were he thought teammates would be distant? He also describes his last months as Liverpool as being ‘black’. I think, with these statements and his general body language over recent months, he is showing signs of real depression. It’s also true that, as some have already pointed out, he looked like a bag of sh*t when he appeared on Chelsea TV on the night of his transfer. He had clearly been crying. Even a bit of TV make up couldn’t disguise that. The fact that he sees this weeks international match with the Spanish squad as a welcome break, a bit of sanctuary, from his current plight just confirms things. I think he genuinely needs medical help before things get any worse.

Clearly, he was feeling this way whilst at Liverpool. He had convinced himself that his only choice was to leave. Why the hell wasn’t Fernando taken in hand last year before he reached this point of no return in his own head? Wasn’t Roy supposed to be a manager who knew when to put an arm around a player’s shoulders? Yet, all I remember Hodgson doing with Fernando was letting the player take all the stick for his goal scoring drought, which, by the way, was mainly as a consequence of Roy’s own managerial and tactical inaptitude. I particularly remember when Fernando had to pull out of the match against Everton because of a muscle tear. The injury turned out to be serious enough for him to pull out of the Spanish squad and miss the next couple of league matches. Yet, during the post match interview when Hodgson was asked what was up with Fernando, he simply shrugged his shoulders, gave a knowing nod of the head and said, ‘I don’t know, you’ll have to ask Torres’. All of which gave the clear impression that Fernando was play-acting!

It’s hardly surprising that he’s suffering depression, given the things that have gone on: the departure of Benitez, together with familiar Spanish coaches and Spanish speaking team mates; three years turmoil off the pitch during the Hicks and Gillett era; Hodgson’s disastrous managerial reign; suffering an injury that ensured he played a bit part in the World Cup and seeing his beloved Atletico winning the UEFA Cup and Super Cup without him. Even fatherhood, normally an amazingly happy time for most, can also take its emotional toll.

In some ways, it’s probably for the best that Liverpool fans have turned on him. He expected that. Had they started to show him respect, understanding and affection at this time, knowing he couldn’t return to the Club, it would probably push him over the edge!

Even so, if the Chelsea fans now turn on him, which, as I said earlier, wouldn’t surprise me at all - especially if his performances don’t improve quickly - I think he’ll continue his downward spiral of depression. If this happens, he’ll end up back in Spain sooner rather than later. Imagine if we were Chelsea fans (my sincere apologies for asking people to consider such a unsavoury prospect), how would we feel if our new star signing said the things that Fernando has been saying. Statements like, Liverpool are a bigger and more historic club, that I always carry Liverpool and its supporters in my heart, that I will have nothing bad said about Liverpool, that, in any case, I will only ever support Atletico Madrid. Add to this the fact that he has stated that he only came to the Chelsea because they are playing Champion’s league football, that he didn’t expect his team mates to be friendly and that going off with the Spanish squad is a welcome break. Then, to top it all, he puts in an awfull debut performance!

I, like many others, have thought long and hard over the departure of Fernando and I am more than looking forward to the future without him.

The one thing that troubled me was how I, and many others, seem to have been so wrong about him. That his stated love of the Club and its fans was simply manipulative PR and that he was simply an unfeeling mercenary footballer. I have concluded that we were not misled. I do think that Fernando fell in love with Liverpool though I also accept that he may have changed and fallen out of love with it too! However, this need he seems to have to keep talking about Liverpool tends me to believe that the latter is not the case. I reached my conclusion because I kept coming back to stories like this one: http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=184433.msg4237947#msg4237947 These are not the actions of a selfish mercenary.



Reading through this post provided me with full closure. I believe that he may have been ill advised over dec/jan.

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Offline Geezer08

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1561 on: February 8, 2011, 02:43:44 PM »
 :lmao  That Torres video modelled on Justin Bieber is so embarrassing and yet amazing and very catchy. Like Torres Torres Torres No :lmao

Offline The Fletcher Memorial

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1562 on: February 8, 2011, 02:50:32 PM »
Rock-N-Red that was a bloody good post, a bloody good post indeed.

And with that, surely we are done here?
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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1563 on: February 8, 2011, 02:54:50 PM »
Yeah whatever Nando, you made your choice, I just hope that you realise what a stupid choise it really was. Time to move on.
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Offline sirjames

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1564 on: February 8, 2011, 03:09:55 PM »
I actually forgive torres. We are better of without him so he hasnt hurt the club. He isnt the player he once was.
He has made a awful choice, but once i fucked off this dead sound bird to get with a fit bird, then the fit bird got a funny haircut and became abit weird but my ex got engaged to this well sound lad and they put pictures on facebook from glasto and thailand - morale of my experience is - you dont know what youve got till its gone. I imagine this is what will happen to torres.
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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1565 on: February 8, 2011, 03:11:11 PM »
this is all a result of player power

shame torres went

shame reine wont be here long.

shame the instigators dont fuck off too and rid our club of the most destructive virus a dressing room can have.
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Offline Gnurglan

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1566 on: February 8, 2011, 03:15:06 PM »
This is actually more depressing when considering his apparently haunting realisation of what he's joined and what he's left behind, and the legacy he has sundered.

And all for what? Instant gratification of a two-month long Champions League campaign, and by no means a guarantee of playing in it next year.

He's regretting it already, and I can only feel that in time, he'll come to regret it even more.

Such a fucking shame.

It's a shame alright. Won't benefit us, him or Chelsea.

And while a lot of people are prepared to nail him to a tree, I'm not. I think it's a tragedy for all parties and Torres will come to regret his decision. The question we should ask is - why couldn't we hang on to him or Mascherano?

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1567 on: February 8, 2011, 03:29:11 PM »
What's wrong in what he's said there?

He is doing himself a disservice by constantly repeating that he went to Chelsea to win things, because if they end up winning nothing this year he will look like a total fool and be totally derided both here and in Spain. He better stop talking fast. Just hush. It's like the more he talks, the more the little respect I have left for him dwindles into nothingness.

On the one hand he says patronisingly to Atlético: "It's expensive to win titles." But still he wants us to believe that it was not greed (and very likely the worst kind of envy) that made him leave us.

I ask you all: Is greed for money any worse a crime than greed for glory/fame/recognition?

I believe our dear Fernando got addicted to the adulation and sense of achievement of being on the Ballon d’Or list 2 years in a row after he joined us. He then made the critical error of starting to believe his own hype, associating his success ONLY with his own talent rather than the efforts of the people around him (who at Chelsea is gonna work hard to set up his goals like Stevie, Dirk and even Voronin did during his first season). Perhaps in his “blackest hour” he should have reminded himself that in winning Euro 2008 and the World Cup he was already in possession of medals of which 99.9% of footballers can only dream.

Another thing I want to say is that I love Rafa like any pro-Rafa Red; but he wasn’t the only one who knew how to use Fernando effectively.

Luis Aragonès, who substituted him constantly during Euro 2008, was THE authority on how to cope with Fernando Torres in a team situation. We didn’t see it then (or perhaps we did but we were only too willing to forgive his petulance ... forgive him anything, really). But Rafa perhaps catered to Fernando too much. Remember the Euros when we all wailed and moaned and complained about how Luis was treating him because we wanted to see our star striker tearing up the field and shining in that tournament. But Luis knew that
1.It was best to keep Fernando’s ego in check and put the team first.
2. How to protect him from injury.

Fernando’s ego is probably part of the reason Robbie Keane never worked out. That was the year we came second.
Fernando’s ego is probably why despite signing Luis Suarez he still HAD to escape: he doesn’t know how to share the glory. Or perhaps he couldn’t cope with not being the idea of being our ONE & ONLY striker anymore, even though he knew how damaging that was to the TEAM.

 And don’t forget Luis practically raised him from when he was a boy at Atlético. Had Luis remained in charge of the NT Fernando would not have been injured so much for us. And perhaps his ego and greed for silverware would not have exploded out of control.

In short, he needs to stop talking now ... Or perhaps we need to stop talking about him. Either way something's gotta give, as the saying goes. If being constantly associated with the best and those who  “are winning/have won everything” is all that matters to him, then I don’t see what the great difference is between leaving for more money and jumping ship at the last minute as an act of desperation to “win more medals.”

I wonder if Fernando realizes just how much he needs to be admired and loved? I wonder if he realizes that it wasn’t JUST his talent but also our love and admiration that gave him wings and put him on that Ballon d’Or list? If he did, he would never have gone to Chelsea.
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Offline threeatatimejay

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1568 on: February 8, 2011, 03:30:22 PM »
I have been watching this thread since before I was able to comment, and at first was just not going to say anything, but I think for my own part in being able to move on from this drama, I'd like to comment.  :)

I do sort of feel bad for him, bad in the way you feel when you watch someone fuck up and then realize that they fucked up. But it remains the truth: HE fucked up. Not the club in letting him go nor making those 50 million pounds. So then, why should LFC be the one to backtrack and reconsider? Take him back in the summer? Take him back ever? I appreciate sentimentality as much as any empathetic human being, but I don't toss my common sense out the window for the sake of it.

This is a player that has proven to be about SELF; what he wants and can get. Just because I understand the logic in his jumping ship doesn't mean I'd be ridiculous enough to invite him back. Why spend money on Torres when we can buy fitter, younger, hungrier players that want to play for us (versus someone who'd only want back in for his own best interest)? It would be a waste of time, energy, and money to revisit the issue. He made his bed, etc.

Torres may see success with Chelsea. May or may not...but that's no longer our issue, is it? That's on him and Chelsea. Both parties wanted each other so badly, let them work it out.

Also, we don't need him. We really don't. And the only reason people want him is sentiment. I am, after thinking it over, glad he's gone. In the same way I'm glad the previous owners are gone, and Roy is gone: He was a divisive figure, and I feel one of those elements holding the club and team back with his sucky attitude and behavior. I think a number of people don't realize because the situation is still too near, but in the long run, it will be obvious how much better off we are without him and people like him, because when you're trying to build unity and a team atmosphere, the very last thing you want are people who are about themselves. Period.

There are a number of reasons as to why he left, as spoken by him and as analyzed by people like the author of the article, but the only thing that matters in the end is that he's gone. So, I say close the book on him and write a new one with our new players and all the new possibilities for our club that nobody would have dreamed about a few months ago.

 :scarf
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Offline Stussy

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1569 on: February 8, 2011, 03:45:31 PM »
Chelsea 2009/10 results: spin and red ink


Music to the ears that :thumbup


Offline woozie

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1570 on: February 8, 2011, 03:50:20 PM »
please god let us or tottenham beat chelsea to the champions league spot!

imagine how he would feel after moving then having to play europa league for them next year! !!!!!
PARRY OUT.

Offline MagicB8all

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1571 on: February 8, 2011, 04:01:16 PM »

This latest statement is very interesting. I think it reveals just how depressed Fernando was and still is. The fact that he now says Liverpool is a bigger Club than Chelsea will hardly ingratiate him to his new fans. (In fact, with these and other recent statements, I can see them turning on him.) Yet he felt the need to say it - to put the record straight as it were. Not that he has ever said previously that Chelsea is a bigger Club than Liverpool – at least as far as I am aware. In his interviews since joining Chelsea, he has said things like, ‘operating at the highest level’ and ‘there is no higher level than this’. All these statements are factually correct, after all Chelsea are playing in the Champion’s League - his stated reason for joining them.

It’s also interesting that he says that he is surprised that he has experienced a bit of friendliness and camaraderie in the Chelsea dressing room. Why should he be surprised by that and why would he want to go to a club were he thought teammates would be distant? He also describes his last months as Liverpool as being ‘black’. I think, with these statements and his general body language over recent months, he is showing signs of real depression. It’s also true that, as some have already pointed out, he looked like a bag of sh*t when he appeared on Chelsea TV on the night of his transfer. He had clearly been crying. Even a bit of TV make up couldn’t disguise that. The fact that he sees this weeks international match with the Spanish squad as a welcome break, a bit of sanctuary, from his current plight just confirms things. I think he genuinely needs medical help before things get any worse.

Clearly, he was feeling this way whilst at Liverpool. He had convinced himself that his only choice was to leave. Why the hell wasn’t Fernando taken in hand last year before he reached this point of no return in his own head? Wasn’t Roy supposed to be a manager who knew when to put an arm around a player’s shoulders? Yet, all I remember Hodgson doing with Fernando was letting the player take all the stick for his goal scoring drought, which, by the way, was mainly as a consequence of Roy’s own managerial and tactical inaptitude. I particularly remember when Fernando had to pull out of the match against Everton because of a muscle tear. The injury turned out to be serious enough for him to pull out of the Spanish squad and miss the next couple of league matches. Yet, during the post match interview when Hodgson was asked what was up with Fernando, he simply shrugged his shoulders, gave a knowing nod of the head and said, ‘I don’t know, you’ll have to ask Torres’. All of which gave the clear impression that Fernando was play-acting!

It’s hardly surprising that he’s suffering depression, given the things that have gone on: the departure of Benitez, together with familiar Spanish coaches and Spanish speaking team mates; three years turmoil off the pitch during the Hicks and Gillett era; Hodgson’s disastrous managerial reign; suffering an injury that ensured he played a bit part in the World Cup and seeing his beloved Atletico winning the UEFA Cup and Super Cup without him. Even fatherhood, normally an amazingly happy time for most, can also take its emotional toll.

In some ways, it’s probably for the best that Liverpool fans have turned on him. He expected that. Had they started to show him respect, understanding and affection at this time, knowing he couldn’t return to the Club, it would probably push him over the edge!

Even so, if the Chelsea fans now turn on him, which, as I said earlier, wouldn’t surprise me at all - especially if his performances don’t improve quickly - I think he’ll continue his downward spiral of depression. If this happens, he’ll end up back in Spain sooner rather than later. Imagine if we were Chelsea fans (my sincere apologies for asking people to consider such a unsavoury prospect), how would we feel if our new star signing said the things that Fernando has been saying. Statements like, Liverpool are a bigger and more historic club, that I always carry Liverpool and its supporters in my heart, that I will have nothing bad said about Liverpool, that, in any case, I will only ever support Atletico Madrid. Add to this the fact that he has stated that he only came to the Chelsea because they are playing Champion’s league football, that he didn’t expect his team mates to be friendly and that going off with the Spanish squad is a welcome break. Then, to top it all, he puts in an awfull debut performance!

I, like many others, have thought long and hard over the departure of Fernando and I am more than looking forward to the future without him.

The one thing that troubled me was how I, and many others, seem to have been so wrong about him. That his stated love of the Club and its fans was simply manipulative PR and that he was simply an unfeeling mercenary footballer. I have concluded that we were not misled. I do think that Fernando fell in love with Liverpool though I also accept that he may have changed and fallen out of love with it too! However, this need he seems to have to keep talking about Liverpool tends me to believe that the latter is not the case. I reached my conclusion because I kept coming back to stories like this one: http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=184433.msg4237947#msg4237947 These are not the actions of a selfish mercenary.


wow, I posted something similar in one of the other Torres threads.  I think you have his state of mind sewn up
Goodbye & thank you Rafa. You've given us more than we ever had a right to expect from you and you stayed loyal and fought for us even when some of our own turned on you. I truly hope that you find somewhere with the support that you deserve & win everything in sight.

Offline No666

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1572 on: February 8, 2011, 04:13:40 PM »
I don't think it was a purely emotional, or at least not an unbalanced decision. In fact, primarily it was calculated, though that doesn't mean to say it was right.
I think what happened was this:
Torres is unhappy with the season so far and calculates that even after Kenny has taken over and results improved that we are less likely than Chelsea to gain CL football next year.
Torres knows that the FFP rules are going to kick in. It will be harder for Abramovich to buy him in the summer than now. (Their latest accounts make pretty reading as it is.)
Torres knows FSG are going to spend in the summer but cannot know how much, how wisely and whether this will ensure CL football in 2012-13.
Torres has flirted with Chelsea in the summer but decided (heart over head) to stay put. In January, he goes - if you like - head first.
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Offline MagicB8all

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1573 on: February 8, 2011, 04:24:58 PM »
I don't think it was a purely emotional, or at least not an unbalanced decision. In fact, primarily it was calculated, though that doesn't mean to say it was right.
I think what happened was this:
Torres is unhappy with the season so far and calculates that even after Kenny has taken over and results improved that we are less likely than Chelsea to gain CL football next year.
Torres knows that the FFP rules are going to kick in. It will be harder for Abramovich to buy him in the summer than now. (Their latest accounts make pretty reading as it is.)
Torres knows FSG are going to spend in the summer but cannot know how much, how wisely and whether this will ensure CL football in 2012-13.
Torres has flirted with Chelsea in the summer but decided (heart over head) to stay put. In January, he goes - if you like - head first.
head and heart have to be in alignment for you to excel and to be brutally honest Torres is conflicted right now - I don't expect too much in terms of performance at Chelsea in the near term
Goodbye & thank you Rafa. You've given us more than we ever had a right to expect from you and you stayed loyal and fought for us even when some of our own turned on you. I truly hope that you find somewhere with the support that you deserve & win everything in sight.

Offline fowlermagic

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1574 on: February 8, 2011, 04:33:06 PM »
I feel a little sorry for the younger fans who put their heart on players who more & more are just doing it for the money and the chance to play on the biggest stage possible. Said it a while back Torres and even Rafa will always look at the CL as the biggest prize …..most European based players will always think the CL is the one to win especially when not competing for their home title that they grew up on thus having childhood dreams tied in with La Liga, Seria etc. Torres is doing what he has to do at this stage as his heart only belongs to his boyhood club and from there onwards he probably feels he has sold out on Atletico so what does it matter if he plays for us or Chelsea? Hurts us but not much skin off his back. Thing is the best players when they do travel abroad probably see better pay days / glory days when they feel for a team, willing to shed blood for a team …the same works both ways and when your employer sucks which we did for 2 seasons then you may get what you saw with Torres.   
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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1575 on: February 8, 2011, 04:50:28 PM »

He has made a awful choice, but once i fucked off this dead sound bird to get with a fit bird, then the fit bird got a funny haircut and became abit weird but my ex got engaged to this well sound lad and they put pictures on facebook from glasto and thailand - morale of my experience is - you dont know what youve got till its gone.

I fucking love all these 'fucked a boss bird off' analogies that keep appearing on here! Keep 'em coming!

Offline RedHandGang

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1576 on: February 8, 2011, 06:19:37 PM »
We move onwards and upwards and will have many a great player come and go. The King has put the focus back where it should have been, the club, it is the most important thing, and Torres is consigned to its history. Perhaps this ethos of the club being instilled again opposes the commercial interests of superstar players and their advisors who's agenda's and image/profile is simply incompatible?

The question is if by some quirk of fate he wanted to come, or was brought back would many accept/welcome him in an altered reality where no one is more important that the club?
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Offline reddd10

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1577 on: February 8, 2011, 07:24:38 PM »

This latest statement is very interesting. I think it reveals just how depressed Fernando was and still is. The fact that he now says Liverpool is a bigger Club than Chelsea will hardly ingratiate him to his new fans. (In fact, with these and other recent statements, I can see them turning on him.) Yet he felt the need to say it - to put the record straight as it were. Not that he has ever said previously that Chelsea is a bigger Club than Liverpool – at least as far as I am aware. In his interviews since joining Chelsea, he has said things like, ‘operating at the highest level’ and ‘there is no higher level than this’. All these statements are factually correct, after all Chelsea are playing in the Champion’s League - his stated reason for joining them.

It’s also interesting that he says that he is surprised that he has experienced a bit of friendliness and camaraderie in the Chelsea dressing room. Why should he be surprised by that and why would he want to go to a club were he thought teammates would be distant? He also describes his last months as Liverpool as being ‘black’. I think, with these statements and his general body language over recent months, he is showing signs of real depression. It’s also true that, as some have already pointed out, he looked like a bag of sh*t when he appeared on Chelsea TV on the night of his transfer. He had clearly been crying. Even a bit of TV make up couldn’t disguise that. The fact that he sees this weeks international match with the Spanish squad as a welcome break, a bit of sanctuary, from his current plight just confirms things. I think he genuinely needs medical help before things get any worse.


I think you've got it spot on here. When he was on that first Chelsea interview, it's clear he had been crying beforehand, and on the bench on Sunday, depressing faces and on the verge of tears again. He looks depressed to me, and to want to go to your National Team instead of your club desperately, that is not right. I mean, obviously he's been winning things with them. However, everything that has happened with all the injuries, all the managerial changes, the staff changes, players/friends changes. I think all of that mixed in with the love his has for the club and the fans has completely and utterly wrecked his head. It pains me to see it, but after all, we are on the bad side of this aswell as him.

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1578 on: February 8, 2011, 09:48:12 PM »
While I agree with most of the recents posts, I can't really see anything to support the theory that he had been crying. I think it might have dawned on him later on what he really has done, but in that first interview he just looks...serious.
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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1579 on: February 8, 2011, 10:23:36 PM »
Torres wanted to go. Handed in a transfer request. Disrespected the club and fans straight after becoming a rentboy.

Some people need to get a fucking grip.

Offline Azi

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1580 on: February 8, 2011, 10:55:18 PM »
Torres wanted to go. Handed in a transfer request. Disrespected the club and fans straight after becoming a rentboy.
.

He essentially wanted to have his cake and eat it whoever his advisors were told him the grass is greener on the other side where in reality it’s not

imo it was a snowball effect thommo said on here the night before that nando left Kenny’s office in tears, I think this is where nando realised what had happened and it was too late for anything to happen the damage had been done he had to go, so his PR team  tried to impress his new "fans" by belittling us and failed and he realised this afterwards and is trying to put that right   and without sounding bitter or arrogant I think nandos eyes were finally opened at full time on Sunday irrespective of the result the fans were the difference the above poster has hit the nail on the head where nando has been depressed from the hodgson era no matter what anyone says he had broken promises’ hodgson only cared about the British players the "foreigners" were separated and the special feeling  the Spanish lads got under rafa he no longer got under hodgson, his confidence was broken and was essentially feeling homesick I don’t think this will change at Chelsea and am pretty confident he will be in Spain by the end of next season. I won’t abuse him like some fans on here but I won’t respect him either anymore
He may be gone but he won’t be forgotten he brought me great moments like Madrid, Manchester and even Portsmouth away but for me like my first love even though she dumped you and you’ve got someone new you still wonder what if things had been different and Kenny had been in charge from the start ....

Offline owens1234

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1581 on: February 8, 2011, 11:06:42 PM »

This latest statement is very interesting. I think it reveals just how depressed Fernando was and still is. The fact that he now says Liverpool is a bigger Club than Chelsea will hardly ingratiate him to his new fans. (In fact, with these and other recent statements, I can see them turning on him.) Yet he felt the need to say it - to put the record straight as it were. Not that he has ever said previously that Chelsea is a bigger Club than Liverpool – at least as far as I am aware. In his interviews since joining Chelsea, he has said things like, ‘operating at the highest level’ and ‘there is no higher level than this’. All these statements are factually correct, after all Chelsea are playing in the Champion’s League - his stated reason for joining them.

It’s also interesting that he says that he is surprised that he has experienced a bit of friendliness and camaraderie in the Chelsea dressing room. Why should he be surprised by that and why would he want to go to a club were he thought teammates would be distant? He also describes his last months as Liverpool as being ‘black’. I think, with these statements and his general body language over recent months, he is showing signs of real depression. It’s also true that, as some have already pointed out, he looked like a bag of sh*t when he appeared on Chelsea TV on the night of his transfer. He had clearly been crying. Even a bit of TV make up couldn’t disguise that. The fact that he sees this weeks international match with the Spanish squad as a welcome break, a bit of sanctuary, from his current plight just confirms things. I think he genuinely needs medical help before things get any worse.

Clearly, he was feeling this way whilst at Liverpool. He had convinced himself that his only choice was to leave. Why the hell wasn’t Fernando taken in hand last year before he reached this point of no return in his own head? Wasn’t Roy supposed to be a manager who knew when to put an arm around a player’s shoulders? Yet, all I remember Hodgson doing with Fernando was letting the player take all the stick for his goal scoring drought, which, by the way, was mainly as a consequence of Roy’s own managerial and tactical inaptitude. I particularly remember when Fernando had to pull out of the match against Everton because of a muscle tear. The injury turned out to be serious enough for him to pull out of the Spanish squad and miss the next couple of league matches. Yet, during the post match interview when Hodgson was asked what was up with Fernando, he simply shrugged his shoulders, gave a knowing nod of the head and said, ‘I don’t know, you’ll have to ask Torres’. All of which gave the clear impression that Fernando was play-acting!

It’s hardly surprising that he’s suffering depression, given the things that have gone on: the departure of Benitez, together with familiar Spanish coaches and Spanish speaking team mates; three years turmoil off the pitch during the Hicks and Gillett era; Hodgson’s disastrous managerial reign; suffering an injury that ensured he played a bit part in the World Cup and seeing his beloved Atletico winning the UEFA Cup and Super Cup without him. Even fatherhood, normally an amazingly happy time for most, can also take its emotional toll.

In some ways, it’s probably for the best that Liverpool fans have turned on him. He expected that. Had they started to show him respect, understanding and affection at this time, knowing he couldn’t return to the Club, it would probably push him over the edge!

Even so, if the Chelsea fans now turn on him, which, as I said earlier, wouldn’t surprise me at all - especially if his performances don’t improve quickly - I think he’ll continue his downward spiral of depression. If this happens, he’ll end up back in Spain sooner rather than later. Imagine if we were Chelsea fans (my sincere apologies for asking people to consider such a unsavoury prospect), how would we feel if our new star signing said the things that Fernando has been saying. Statements like, Liverpool are a bigger and more historic club, that I always carry Liverpool and its supporters in my heart, that I will have nothing bad said about Liverpool, that, in any case, I will only ever support Atletico Madrid. Add to this the fact that he has stated that he only came to the Chelsea because they are playing Champion’s league football, that he didn’t expect his team mates to be friendly and that going off with the Spanish squad is a welcome break. Then, to top it all, he puts in an awfull debut performance!

I, like many others, have thought long and hard over the departure of Fernando and I am more than looking forward to the future without him.

The one thing that troubled me was how I, and many others, seem to have been so wrong about him. That his stated love of the Club and its fans was simply manipulative PR and that he was simply an unfeeling mercenary footballer. I have concluded that we were not misled. I do think that Fernando fell in love with Liverpool though I also accept that he may have changed and fallen out of love with it too! However, this need he seems to have to keep talking about Liverpool tends me to believe that the latter is not the case. I reached my conclusion because I kept coming back to stories like this one: http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=184433.msg4237947#msg4237947 These are not the actions of a selfish mercenary.

Wow, truly amazing post dude. Completely agree too. I despise him for the way in which he left us. But to be fair, after reading that and seeing his body language, the Chelsea interviews, and the game at the weekend, its begrudgingly obvious he is in a state, and looks as if he regrets it already. He *thought* he chose the right option, but hes realizing now it wasn't.

Great post.

Offline keyo

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1582 on: February 9, 2011, 04:54:18 AM »
amazed at the hand wringing, the amateur psychology, and the opposite extreme of utter condemnation relating to this

lowe's article probably has some truth in it.....but the blunt truth is torres agreed to leave, handed in a transfer request and is now a chelsea player
what matters is lfc....i think we got a good deal, 50mill is good coin for torres and we have bought players that we wanted for our team so we have done what we needed to....

torres, good luck to him, he is an ex-red and i don't begrudge ex-reds ever, but can't wish him every success cos he is now at chelsea... don't really care if he regrets his decision, cos it was his decision,...nor do i see him coming back, if he did i would want it to be for lfc's benefit.....fowler's return was purely to put the smile on the club's face, and it did and he truly deserved it

Joey's ate the frogs legs, made the swiss roll, now he's munchin' gladbach!!

Offline The Manhattan Project

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1583 on: February 9, 2011, 06:09:26 AM »
He'll score against Fulham

Cue media wankfest
china syndrome 810512640 reactor meltdown fusion element
no uniquely indefinable one 59118 identification unknown 113
source transmission 4121 general panic hysteria 02 outbreak
foreign mutation 0101505 maximum code destruction nuclear
reflection 010414 power plutonium helix atomic energy wave

Offline miakeks

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1584 on: February 9, 2011, 06:40:38 AM »
He'll score against Fulham

He's a striker after all - isn't that what strikers are supposed to be doing?!
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Offline Lethal

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1585 on: February 9, 2011, 07:31:49 AM »
As we all said at the time the lad will regret this move.

Don't understand why so many getting all fucking emotional about it, he fucked us over.

Read that story of him waiting for the picture for 20 mins from 2008. Completely different person on and off the pitch nowadays.

Last post from me on him. Im happy he's gone and in time all concerned will be bar him.

Offline Niru Red4ever

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1586 on: February 9, 2011, 07:57:38 AM »
So anyone know what song he sung to his Chelsea team mates during his induction? Or what would have been appropriate?

Didn't Yossi sing YNWA during his induction. Can just imagine the look on his teammates :)
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Offline Niru Red4ever

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1587 on: February 9, 2011, 08:01:38 AM »
Gerrard WANTED to go, Torres actually did go. Spot the difference?

I bet the club did anything in its power to stop Gerrard from leaving. While in Torres case, the owners realised its the best time to cash in on him (and a correct decision too).
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Offline The Manhattan Project

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1588 on: February 9, 2011, 08:20:20 AM »
He's a striker after all - isn't that what strikers are supposed to be doing?!

Yes, but we spoiled the media narrative which was supposed to be "Chelsea's Number 9 Torres Sinks Sorry Kop Flops!!!!"

So when he finally does score his first goal for Roman, as I said, cue wankfest.
china syndrome 810512640 reactor meltdown fusion element
no uniquely indefinable one 59118 identification unknown 113
source transmission 4121 general panic hysteria 02 outbreak
foreign mutation 0101505 maximum code destruction nuclear
reflection 010414 power plutonium helix atomic energy wave

Online helmboy_nige

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1589 on: February 9, 2011, 08:29:05 AM »
He's a confidence player, if he gets it going in the next few games his head will come back.  If it doesn't he'll be playing in Spain within a year or two.

Offline beardsley4ever

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1590 on: February 9, 2011, 10:46:17 AM »
Torres will score a lot of goals for Chelsea.  He may even win a trophy or two.  But who gives a shit?  Focus on our club and the trophies we can/will win - end of.
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Offline Fordy

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1591 on: February 9, 2011, 10:52:00 AM »
Torres: Some Liverpool fans play-act for cameras
Wednesday, 9 February 2011 10:32AM GMT | Sport, Football

 New Chelsea signing Fernando Torres believes Liverpool fans who were pictured burning their 'Torres 9' jerseys were play-acting for the cameras.
The striker also refused to be drawn into a war of words with former manager Kenny Dalglish reagrding the Reds boss's dismissive talk of the Spaniard.

On Wednesday the Spanish World Cup winner said: "If there was no camera they wouldn't have burnt the shirts with my name. As for the statements of the manager each of us is free to do what they want.

"This departure was not fair, in the eyes of the fans above all.

"They didn't want to hear the truth or my truth. But that's football. You never know how things will go how they will end but in the end they ended up as I wanted as I became a Chelsea player. But not in the way I wanted.

"I have my conscience clear because I was honest with the people at the club and all the information that comes out makes me sad because it could have been handled in a different way."

http://www.globalgateway.com/article/1220/torres-some-liverpool-fans-playact-for-cameras/



Offline U13

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1592 on: February 9, 2011, 10:55:52 AM »
So he basically admits what we all know, when things got tough he took the easy way out and jumped ship at the first opportunity. Tit.

At the first opportunity? things have been tough for a while and he could have so easily left well before he did.

Offline beardsley4ever

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1593 on: February 9, 2011, 11:00:46 AM »

 New Chelsea signing Fernando Torres believes Liverpool fans who were pictured burning their 'Torres 9' jerseys were play-acting for the cameras.
The striker also refused to be drawn into a war of words with former manager Kenny Dalglish reagrding the Reds boss's dismissive talk of the Spaniard.

On Wednesday the Spanish World Cup winner said: "If there was no camera they wouldn't have burnt the shirts with my name.



He's spot on with that.
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Offline RigBon1892

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1594 on: February 9, 2011, 11:06:31 AM »

He's spot on with that.

Yeah I reckon so too.

Torres is learning a lesson learned by many, that the grass isn't always greener on the other side.
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Offline killerH

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1595 on: February 9, 2011, 11:21:32 AM »

He's spot on with that.

Indeed, there were a few posters on here who said the same thing. He's still sad about this sorry episode. If he doesn't hit the ground running, and Chelsea don't regain form, then I think he'll be even more sad.

But I still believe he made a massive mistake, an extremely short-sighted decision, based on a burining desire to win and very little patience or faith in FSG or Kenny to bring back the glory days.

Iv'e no doubt, in 12-18 months, he'll look back and think; what have I done?

Because I firmly believe that within the next 1 or 2 seasons we'll challenge for the title!

Offline beardsley4ever

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1596 on: February 9, 2011, 11:26:30 AM »
Indeed, there were a few posters on here who said the same thing. He's still sad about this sorry episode. If he doesn't hit the ground running, and Chelsea don't regain form, then I think he'll be even more sad.

But I still believe he made a massive mistake, an extremely short-sighted decision, based on a burining desire to win and very little patience or faith in FSG or Kenny to bring back the glory days.

Iv'e no doubt, in 12-18 months, he'll look back and think; what have I done?

Because I firmly believe that within the next 1 or 2 seasons we'll challenge for the title!


And if we do, then I suspect that Suarez and Carroll will play a big part in that - a bigger part, perhaps, than Torres would have played.  And if that happens, then I'll thank Torres for the great 3 1/2 years he had here which led to us getting £50m for him, and signing two high quality strikers. 

It's Sliding Doors, for me.  You don't know which outcome will actually be the more positive, so bemoaning Torres's decision to leave before seeing how it all plays out just doesn't work for me.  He's made a decision, we've reacted well to it, onwards and upwards.
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Offline Raul!

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1597 on: February 9, 2011, 11:36:52 AM »
Bloody hell those words seem to be those of a deeply conflicted chappie. If he truly had the courage of his convictions, he wouldn't feel the need to justify his actions.

Offline killerH

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1598 on: February 9, 2011, 11:42:04 AM »

And if we do, then I suspect that Suarez and Carroll will play a big part in that - a bigger part, perhaps, than Torres would have played.  And if that happens, then I'll thank Torres for the great 3 1/2 years he had here which led to us getting £50m for him, and signing two high quality strikers. 

It's Sliding Doors, for me.  You don't know which outcome will actually be the more positive, so bemoaning Torres's decision to leave before seeing how it all plays out just doesn't work for me.  He's made a decision, we've reacted well to it, onwards and upwards.

Yep, we can only look onwards and upwards.

Don't forget that while his scoring record was brilliant, we were over reliant on him. We had no real plan B if A - Torres was injured or B - Torres was off form, returning from injury or just simply sulking and not having the stomach for a tussle.
A bit like our over reliance on Alonso, the best teams figure out how to counter his effectiveness, and in turn we're a much less effective side as a result (there was a piece on Revista de la liga on how Alonso is central to Madird's play and how if he was missing, Real go missing too).

Suarez and Carroll are two top strikers, Torres was just one, so we have automatically improved. The fact that Nando did not like playing with a strike partner made our search for a back-up much harder, because, realistically, which top-class striker would want to play second fiddle to Torres? No-one.

He looks to have lost that burst of pace he had when he joined us, and his two knee operations will affect his confidence in his body. Therefore we can only be delighted with the £50m. A fantastic sum for an injury prone, sulky, moody player. Replacing him with two much younger (relatively speaking) and hungrier strikers is fantastic business. And as Rafa would say, it gives us more "Possibilities, no?".

I cannot wait to see the potentially lethal and unstoppable Suarez and Carroll partnership.



Offline Dave Mc

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Re: Torres - The Reasons for Leaving - by Sid Lowe
« Reply #1599 on: February 9, 2011, 12:01:04 PM »
Torres: Some Liverpool fans play-act for cameras
Wednesday, 9 February 2011 10:32AM GMT | Sport, Football

 New Chelsea signing Fernando Torres believes Liverpool fans who were pictured burning their 'Torres 9' jerseys were play-acting for the cameras.
The striker also refused to be drawn into a war of words with former manager Kenny Dalglish reagrding the Reds boss's dismissive talk of the Spaniard.

On Wednesday the Spanish World Cup winner said: "If there was no camera they wouldn't have burnt the shirts with my name.

He's spot on with that.
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