Author Topic: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards  (Read 22830 times)

Offline Veinticinco de Mayo

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It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« on: June 30, 2010, 08:22:25 am »
This is a story that begins with a shock press conference in 1991 when events of the previous decade finally caught up with Kenny Dalglish and caused his shock resignation.  The club was plunged into turmoil and thanks to the appointment of Graeme Souness that soon became catastrophic decline.  A team that had once ruled England and Europe transformed into mid-table also rans. 

The rebuilding began in 1994 under Roy Evans, he got us playing football again, he even managed one brief challenge at a league title.  Later Gerard Houllier continued the good work and in 2001 he made us all proud to be Reds again. Then in 2004 Rafael Benitez took the reins and despite never quite managing to restore us to contention at home he took us to to European Cup finals and had the club riding high at the top of the UEFA rankings, we were once again a name to be feared throughout the continent, back on our fucking perch.

Amidst the turmoil and underachievement of last season debates raged on here about the future of the manager.  Many felt that his achievements since 2004 had earned him at least one more season to try and address the problems, others wanted rid sooner.  All of this was of course taking place to a backdrop of boardroom chaos and mismanagement of the club on a collossal scale.  It seemed obvious to me, and many others, that in the midst of this what the club needed above all else was stability in the management position.  We argued that the club, in its current state, was not an attractive proposition for any of the top managers, furthermore we doubted the ability of anyone in the current hierarchy to identify and recruit such a candidate even if they were interested. We asked those who wanted a change of manager who they thought we would get who was at least on the same sort of level as Benitez.

Well the respondents were broadly split into two camps; there were the deluded who reeled off names like Hiddink and Mourinho and there were the ostriches who claimed that it was not their job to pick a manager, we had people at the club who would do that, after all how many of us were naming Benitez as a successor to Houllier in 2003/4?   Both camps scoffed loudly when we suggested that the best we would get as a replacement in our current state, with no footballing knowledge on the board at all, was a McLeish, McCarthy, Moyes or a Hodgson figure.  An uninspired choice from men who don't know the game, the sort of choice Newcastle boards have been making for years.

Well, it looks like it has come to pass.  And I hope all the backstabbing, treacherous, little c*nts who despite all the above were determined that we should get rid of the most successful manager we have had for the last twenty years are happy with how things have turned out.  Your lack of support created a situation where poison Purslow thought Rafa's position had been weakened enough for a coup to take place unopposed.  Great.  We have now traded a manager with genuine European pedigree for a mid-table journeyman. A European Cup winner for a man who did quite well in Switzerland. Thanks for your help with that lads....   I am attempting to fight my desire to hunt every last one of you down and choke you on your own minced up genitalia.  I'll let you know how I get on with the therapy.

BIG SIGH

So moving on.  You have to adapt to the reality that you are in.  And as always I will, from the moment he is officially announced, be focusing on supporting our manager.  So welcome Roy Hodgson I hope things turn out well for you at Anfield.  Hodgson's not a bad manager, indeed in many ways his record is ideal for the straitened times in which the club finds itself.  In additon last season was so bad that there has to be immediate room for improvement there.  His problem of course is that he may not get to that far...   because Roy Hodgson is going to need all the luck in the world just to survive until September unscathed.

First he has to survive and audience with the King.  Will Kenny walk?  Has the delay in the appointment been while he was persuaded to stay and work with Hodgson.  One thing is for sure, Kenny Dalglish was included in the selection process to give it an air of legitimacy that it could never command with the clueless Purslow in sole charge.  If Kenny disagrees with this appointment then it loses that legitimacy and unfortunately for Hodgson that seriously weakens his position.  Then if he makes that hurdle he has the problem of keeping key players until the transfer deadline closes.  If the players slap in transfer requests then that amounts to a vote of no confidence in the new manager.  Rafael Benitez faced the same challenge when he took over in 2004. He won one battle and lost the other, fortunately for us he won the right one. Hodgson's tenure will similarly depend on him winning the key battles to keep at least two of Gerrard, Torres and Mascherano.  All this assumes of course that Purslow does not simply sell them above his head, if that happens then the argument that Rafa had to go because he would block sales becomes compelling and Hodgson is left looking like a powerless stooge.

It is going to be a fraught summer for all of us, but as usual it is at times like these that we have to give our full backing to our manager.  He needs our support and if we withhold it then we have lost something that was precious and unique to this club.  Don't give Purslow and his paymasters that satisfaction. 


« Last Edit: June 30, 2010, 10:09:03 am by Veinticinco de Mayo »
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Offline Veinticinco de Mayo

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2010, 10:32:25 am »
Get behind the manager.  Focus your energies on the owners, their hired hands particularly Purslow and his collaborators both here and at the ground. 
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Offline Greg

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2010, 10:43:27 am »
Get behind the manager.  Focus your energies on the owners, their hired hands particularly Purslow and his collaborators both here and at the ground. 
Is it right to get behind the manager if he is just going to undertake all the board's dirty work?

If he has taken the job knowing that he is going to sell Gerrard and Torres to raise money for the owners, what makes him different to any of the other greedycunts at the club?

Is he just a bailiff/administrator with coaching skills?

Offline Stussy

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2010, 10:50:51 am »
VdM, I wrote in a thread a while back that we seem like a club in managed decline. This is the action of a club in managed decline.

Roy will get our support though. We have always saved ourselves by supporting our manager.

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Offline xerxes1

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2010, 10:50:59 am »
Is it right to get behind the manager if he is just going to undertake all the board's dirty work?If he has taken the job knowing that he is going to sell Gerrard and Torres to raise money for the owners, what makes him different to any of the other greedycunts at the club?Is he just a bailiff/administrator with coaching skills?
A futile argument, the logical conclusion for which is that there should be no manager.Rafa and Kenny were happy enough to take G&H's dollar a year ago, with good reason.

How G&H must be chortling as P&B have diverted the "incoming" first, with Roy being lined up next by some of our support.

It's the ownership that matters.
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Offline Veinticinco de Mayo

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2010, 10:57:11 am »
Is it right to get behind the manager if he is just going to undertake all the board's dirty work?

If he has taken the job knowing that he is going to sell Gerrard and Torres to raise money for the owners, what makes him different to any of the other greedycunts at the club?

Is he just a bailiff/administrator with coaching skills?

We wait and judge what happens mate.  If he is complicit in asset stripping then we will judge him.  Until that point then like all new Liverpool managers he gets the benefit of the doubt and our full backing.
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Offline Greg

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2010, 10:58:36 am »
A futile argument, the logical conclusion for which is that there should be no manager.Rafa and Kenny were happy enough to take G&H's dollar a year ago, with good reason.

How G&H must be chortling as P&B have diverted the "incoming" first, with Roy being lined up next by some of our support.

It's the ownership that matters.
You're probably right. Any manager doing their dirty work wouldn't get my support. Rafa and Kenny wanted what was best for the club last year. Now one has gone and the other might follow.

And just because people don't fully trust the manager doesn't mean the these people will suddenly forget the ownership issues. That's an idiotic assumption.

At the moment, I trust Hodgson as much as I trust Purslow, Broughton, Ayre and the 2cunts.

Offline Greg

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2010, 11:04:36 am »
We wait and judge what happens mate.  If he is complicit in asset stripping then we will judge him.  Until that point then like all new Liverpool managers he gets the benefit of the doubt and our full backing.
I will wait and see what happens. But in the meantime, I certainly won't be writing letters to Echo saying how happy I am with our new manager. I am fairly confident he will be asset stripping and I'm gonna brace myself for it. If I'm wrong, then I will start looking at this appointment from a football point of view.

Offline Veinticinco de Mayo

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2010, 11:06:12 am »
Greg,

I agree with the first bit of your post.  Those suggesting that the owners must be laughing as we focus on other targets are way off the mark.  There are enough of us to take them all on.  The sights have rightly been trained on Purslow in this last week but if you think for one moment that has deflected efforts against the owners, RBS etc then you clearly have not been following our contributing to any of the excellent campaign threads on here.  We have huge numerical superiority, we can fight them on as many fronts as they wish to open.

Hodgson on the other hand has got to be trusted.  If the Yanks have reduced us to the state where we will not even back our own manager then they have won. The soul of the club has been destroyed and we may as well all go home.  That isn't the case though because we are the soul of this club and we will back the manager until such a point that his actions conclusively show that he is not acting in the best interests of the club. 
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2010, 11:07:12 am »
*types that their gonna sell everyone!...Panic!!!! Continues to lament Rafa, makes some other stuff up and generally has a big old dollop of guess work thrown in there for good measure.....Another normal post on the RAWK main forum*

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Offline Red_Isle_Chap

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2010, 11:09:08 am »
Greg,

I agree with the first bit of your post.  Those suggesting that the owners must be laughing as we focus on other targets are way off the mark.  There are enough of us to take them all on.  The sights have rightly been trained on Purslow in this last week but if you think for one moment that has deflected efforts against the owners, RBS etc then you clearly have not been following our contributing to any of the excellent campaign threads on here.  We have huge numerical superiority, we can fight them on as many fronts as they wish to open.

Hodgson on the other hand has got to be trusted.  If the Yanks have reduced us to the state where we will not even back our own manager then they have won. The soul of the club has been destroyed and we may as well all go home.  That isn't the case though because we are the soul of this club and we will back the manager until such a point that his actions conclusively show that he is not acting in the best interests of the club. 
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Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2010, 11:09:53 am »
A futile argument, the logical conclusion for which is that there should be no manager.Rafa and Kenny were happy enough to take G&H's dollar a year ago, with good reason.

How G&H must be chortling as P&B have diverted the "incoming" first, with Roy being lined up next by some of our support.

It's the ownership that matters.

To be fair Rafa worked for the club before they arrived so implying he was taking their dollar is unfair. Kenny came back to help the club and he is on record as saying he would have done it for nothing.
From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2010, 11:12:24 am »
We wait and judge what happens mate.  If he is complicit in asset stripping then we will judge him.  Until that point then like all new Liverpool managers he gets the benefit of the doubt and our full backing.
I'm interested in what he has to say in his press conference. I know that it will be "a privilege and an honour" to manage LFC, for him. But I'm really keen to hear what he feels he's going to bring us. Or what he feels he's here to do.

Offline Stompy

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2010, 11:13:53 am »
I just can't get over this feeling of utter disappointment, I have nothing against Hodgson he seems like a nice bloke, but for me it shows a complete lack of ambition on behalf of the club, if you remember just before Rafa's appointment the rumours doing the rounds was 'which of the new exciting managers were going where?' Mourinho Chelsea or Liverpool? Rafa likewise in the end we knew who went where, my point is someone like Roy would not have been at the races, in fact if a bookie gave odds they would have been laughed right out of it, and yet here we are, two CL finals (one win one honourable loss) one super cup, one FA cup later, he is the best we can get?

If ever there was a need to get rid of these two f*cks and the whole of the board with them then it's this! People talk about the Liverpool Way, well as far as i'm concerned the Liverpool Way was not accepting a lack of effort, a lack of ambition and to strive at all costs to do the best for the fans for the team! Bill Shankly once said he couldn't stand a cheat, well Bill I feel we are all being cheated!
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2010, 11:14:57 am »
As an example of what a difference a year makes:

This time last year, Rafa Benitez, as Liverpool manager, was attempting to buy David Silva from Valencia.

Today, Rafa Benitez, as Inter Milan manager and along with the rest of Europe's big clubs, is attempting to prise away our best players and generally pick at our festering corpse. 
Manchester City have signed David Silva and we have appointed Roy Hodgson, Fulham's manager.

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2010, 11:15:34 am »
I really want to get behind the new manager. However, if he turns out to be a lapdog, there to fill a roll while those fuckers continue to suck our club dry, I'm not sure if I can.

This leaves me in a dilemma. I have always been of the (vocal) opinion that it is my DUTY as a supporter to get behind the team & management of the club.

At this point, I am so disillusioned, all I can do is offer him all the best. I hope he does a good job training the team and getting them ready for matches. After that - I can't hope for too much.

Offline bleedsred1978

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2010, 11:19:01 am »
This is a story that begins with a shock press conference in 1991 when events of the previous decade finally caught up with Kenny Dalglish and caused his shock resignation.  The club was plunged into turmoil and thanks to the appointment of Graeme Souness that soon became catastrophic decline.  A team that had once ruled England and Europe transformed into mid-table also rans. 

The rebuilding began in 1994 under Roy Evans, he got us playing football again, he even managed one brief challenge at a league title.  Later Gerard Houllier continued the good work and in 2001 he made us all proud to be Reds again. Then in 2004 Rafael Benitez took the reins and despite never quite managing to restore us to contention at home he took us to to European Cup finals and had the club riding high at the top of the UEFA rankings, we were once again a name to be feared throughout the continent, back on our fucking perch.

Amidst the turmoil and underachievement of last season debates raged on here about the future of the manager.  Many felt that his achievements since 2004 had earned him at least one more season to try and address the problems, others wanted rid sooner.  All of this was of course taking place to a backdrop of boardroom chaos and mismanagement of the club on a collossal scale.  It seemed obvious to me, and many others, that in the midst of this what the club needed above all else was stability in the management position.  We argued that the club, in its current state, was not an attractive proposition for any of the top managers, furthermore we doubted the ability of anyone in the current hierarchy to identify and recruit such a candidate even if they were interested. We asked those who wanted a change of manager who they thought we would get who was at least on the same sort of level as Benitez.

Well the respondents were broadly split into two camps; there were the deluded who reeled off names like Hiddink and Mourinho and there were the ostriches who claimed that it was not their job to pick a manager, we had people at the club who would do that, after all how many of us were naming Benitez as a successor to Houllier in 2003/4?   Both camps scoffed loudly when we suggested that the best we would get as a replacement in our current state, with no footballing knowledge on the board at all, was a McLeish, McCarthy, Moyes or a Hodgson figure.  An uninspired choice from men who don't know the game, the sort of choice Newcastle boards have been making for years.

Well, it looks like it has come to pass.  And I hope all the backstabbing, treacherous, little c*nts who despite all the above were determined that we should get rid of the most successful manager we have had for the last twenty years are happy with how things have turned out.  Your lack of support created a situation where poison Purslow thought Rafa's position had been weakened enough for a coup to take place unopposed.  Great.  We have now traded a manager with genuine European pedigree for a mid-table journeyman. A European Cup winner for a man who did quite well in Switzerland. Thanks for your help with that lads....   I am attempting to fight my desire to hunt every last one of you down and choke you on your own minced up genitalia.  I'll let you know how I get on with the therapy.

BIG SIGH

So moving on.  You have to adapt to the reality that you are in.  And as always I will, from the moment he is officially announced, be focusing on supporting our manager.  So welcome Roy Hodgson I hope things turn out well for you at Anfield.  Hodgson's not a bad manager, indeed in many ways his record is ideal for the straitened times in which the club finds itself.  In additon last season was so bad that there has to be immediate room for improvement there.  His problem of course is that he may not get to that far...   because Roy Hodgson is going to need all the luck in the world just to survive until September unscathed.

First he has to survive and audience with the King.  Will Kenny walk?  Has the delay in the appointment been while he was persuaded to stay and work with Hodgson.  One thing is for sure, Kenny Dalglish was included in the selection process to give it an air of legitimacy that it could never command with the clueless Purslow in sole charge.  If Kenny disagrees with this appointment then it loses that legitimacy and unfortunately for Hodgson that seriously weakens his position.  Then if he makes that hurdle he has the problem of keeping key players until the transfer deadline closes.  If the players slap in transfer requests then that amounts to a vote of no confidence in the new manager.  Rafael Benitez faced the same challenge when he took over in 2004. He won one battle and lost the other, fortunately for us he won the right one. Hodgson's tenure will similarly depend on him winning the key battles to keep at least two of Gerrard, Torres and Mascherano.  All this assumes of course that Purslow does not simply sell them above his head, if that happens then the argument that Rafa had to go because he would block sales becomes compelling and Hodgson is left looking like a powerless stooge.

It is going to be a fraught summer for all of us, but as usual it is at times like these that we have to give our full backing to our manager.  He needs our support and if we withhold it then we have lost something that was precious and unique to this club.  Don't give Purslow and his paymasters that satisfaction. 




Great Post.

We need to back him until it is proven one way or the other what Roy's mo is.

I have to say though that it is a bit of a nightmare scenario all round. Roy is on a hiding to nothing i'm afraid.




From here on in its all FSG's doing. Good or bad they will stand or fall by the decisions they have made in the summer of 2012. Lets hope they have gotten it right.

Offline redmen77

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2010, 11:20:00 am »
This is a story that begins with a shock press conference in 1991 when events of the previous decade finally caught up with Kenny Dalglish and caused his shock resignation.  The club was plunged into turmoil and thanks to the appointment of Graeme Souness that soon became catastrophic decline.  A team that had once ruled England and Europe transformed into mid-table also rans. 

The rebuilding began in 1994 under Roy Evans, he got us playing football again, he even managed one brief challenge at a league title.  Later Gerard Houllier continued the good work and in 2001 he made us all proud to be Reds again. Then in 2004 Rafael Benitez took the reins and despite never quite managing to restore us to contention at home he took us to to European Cup finals and had the club riding high at the top of the UEFA rankings, we were once again a name to be feared throughout the continent, back on our fucking perch.

Amidst the turmoil and underachievement of last season debates raged on here about the future of the manager.  Many felt that his achievements since 2004 had earned him at least one more season to try and address the problems, others wanted rid sooner.  All of this was of course taking place to a backdrop of boardroom chaos and mismanagement of the club on a collossal scale.  It seemed obvious to me, and many others, that in the midst of this what the club needed above all else was stability in the management position.  We argued that the club, in its current state, was not an attractive proposition for any of the top managers, furthermore we doubted the ability of anyone in the current hierarchy to identify and recruit such a candidate even if they were interested. We asked those who wanted a change of manager who they thought we would get who was at least on the same sort of level as Benitez.

Well the respondents were broadly split into two camps; there were the deluded who reeled off names like Hiddink and Mourinho and there were the ostriches who claimed that it was not their job to pick a manager, we had people at the club who would do that, after all how many of us were naming Benitez as a successor to Houllier in 2003/4?   Both camps scoffed loudly when we suggested that the best we would get as a replacement in our current state, with no footballing knowledge on the board at all, was a McLeish, McCarthy, Moyes or a Hodgson figure.  An uninspired choice from men who don't know the game, the sort of choice Newcastle boards have been making for years.

Well, it looks like it has come to pass.  And I hope all the backstabbing, treacherous, little c*nts who despite all the above were determined that we should get rid of the most successful manager we have had for the last twenty years are happy with how things have turned out.  Your lack of support created a situation where poison Purslow thought Rafa's position had been weakened enough for a coup to take place unopposed.  Great.  We have now traded a manager with genuine European pedigree for a mid-table journeyman. A European Cup winner for a man who did quite well in Switzerland. Thanks for your help with that lads....   I am attempting to fight my desire to hunt every last one of you down and choke you on your own minced up genitalia.  I'll let you know how I get on with the therapy.

BIG SIGH

So moving on.  You have to adapt to the reality that you are in.  And as always I will, from the moment he is officially announced, be focusing on supporting our manager.  So welcome Roy Hodgson I hope things turn out well for you at Anfield.  Hodgson's not a bad manager, indeed in many ways his record is ideal for the straitened times in which the club finds itself.  In additon last season was so bad that there has to be immediate room for improvement there.  His problem of course is that he may not get to that far...   because Roy Hodgson is going to need all the luck in the world just to survive until September unscathed.

First he has to survive and audience with the King.  Will Kenny walk?  Has the delay in the appointment been while he was persuaded to stay and work with Hodgson.  One thing is for sure, Kenny Dalglish was included in the selection process to give it an air of legitimacy that it could never command with the clueless Purslow in sole charge.  If Kenny disagrees with this appointment then it loses that legitimacy and unfortunately for Hodgson that seriously weakens his position.  Then if he makes that hurdle he has the problem of keeping key players until the transfer deadline closes.  If the players slap in transfer requests then that amounts to a vote of no confidence in the new manager.  Rafael Benitez faced the same challenge when he took over in 2004. He won one battle and lost the other, fortunately for us he won the right one. Hodgson's tenure will similarly depend on him winning the key battles to keep at least two of Gerrard, Torres and Mascherano.  All this assumes of course that Purslow does not simply sell them above his head, if that happens then the argument that Rafa had to go because he would block sales becomes compelling and Hodgson is left looking like a powerless stooge.

It is going to be a fraught summer for all of us, but as usual it is at times like these that we have to give our full backing to our manager.  He needs our support and if we withhold it then we have lost something that was precious and unique to this club.  Don't give Purslow and his paymasters that satisfaction. 



I'm with you but if as expected two out of the three you mention leaves I will find it difficult to support anything thats going on at our club at the moment. Its not the club I grew up with, it doesn't carry any sense of togetherness or the pride of being an LFC supporter. Its all very hollow, distant and machine like and certainly not in tune with the majority. Clearly the management style of our board is not one that appears to want (or have the capability) to have or build any affinity with is supporters as has been demonstrated in recent decisions over the manager position.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2010, 11:22:05 am by redmen77 »

Offline Fruity

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2010, 11:20:26 am »
the whole thing stinks and the more i read on these boards the more I just see fans accepting it. Peddling the same old arguments support the team and fuck the owners.

This club has one sole purpose at the moment and that is to make money for Hicks and Gillett. If by some miracle we win the prem they will demand more to sell it, we might get our bit of glory as fans but Hicks & Gillett will be creaming their pants. If we cant meet the repayments and end up 15th than they will strip its assets.

Everything else is going through the motions including what team is picked and how they play first day of the season. I dont actually care about Roy Hodgson's appointment. We could all see this coming though we hoped it wouldn't happen our apathy leads us to just accept it with resignation. And now we will just sit back and support the team hope they do well but all along knowing its impossible because Hicks & Gillett are ripping the club apart for every penny they can get.

The football is irrelevant the sooner people understand that the better. We may even lose Gerrard, Torres and a few others but people will still be concerned about whether we can nick 4th spot.

I have said before and will say it again and judging by most seem to be in the minority but until supporters stop putting £30 in that fat c*nts pocket every week, than we will be discussing how it all went so wrong this time next season. The Liverpool way went when they tookover and most will watch it happen every saturday whilst supporting the owners bulging pockets but yelling yanks out at the same time.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2010, 11:22:16 am by Fruity »
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2010, 11:21:36 am »
Ah come on VDM. We're LFC dontchaknow. We are the Kopites, The Famous Kopites. The most knowledgable fans in the game. So let's give Mr Hodgson a chance.

Apparently he's signed a 3 year contract. So, seeing we're also the most loyal fans in the game, famous throughout the world for our brand loyalty, shouldn't we at least give Mr Hodgson the time of his contract before saying it's a backwards step?

And then fair enough, if he hasn't won at least one European Cup, reached another final, and won an FA Cup, then I'd say it's fair to judge.

Afterall we are Liverpool FC, the finest team the world has ever seen and the most knowledgable and loyal fans in the world. Dontchaknow.

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2010, 11:27:24 am »
Exactly, M. Except I am not finding it quite so easy to offer him all the best. Horrible. Horrible. Horrible.

That's the bit that kills me Rhi.

I was a supporter of GH up to the end. When he was replaced, I said thanks GH, WOW here's Rafa B.....this time I cannot pretend to muster the excitement.

I am sure I could if it were not the impending feeling of doom. If we were under decent stewardship I'd be all over this - 'bigging him up' and giving him a raucous welcome. But I can't.

I do wish him the best, but this is far less than I expect from myself when we get a new manager. I cannot see myself singing his name. (It would be strange as I won't be at a game)


My only hope is that he brings something to the club that fuels some hope. The problem is, results will not give me hope nowadays. Militancy against the owners is the only thing that will stop me from feeling shit about LFC at the moment.

I have a 4 year old. I should be teaching him EVERYTHING about LFC that I can and steering him down the right road. Instead I find myself unable to switch on the LFC TV channel and watch the classics with him or I'll be pissed off at what we have.

I'll always love LFC. I wish Roy all the best. That is all I can do at the moment :(

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2010, 11:37:20 am »
I'd hope that during his time in South Africa, RH had the chance to talk to the key players and "secured" their OK. Worst thing that could happen now would be if Mascherano, Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt, Carra & Co all came out against the appointment.

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Offline Walter Sobchak

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2010, 11:39:31 am »
I need to wait untill it becomes clear for what reasons he has actually taken the job before he gets my support or not.  a manager that is willing to overlook the asset stripping purely to be able to add manager of LFC onto his CV is just as bad as puslow and broughton
right now I'll reserve judgement untill the transfer window closes. but if the clubs best players are sold this summer and the money not re invested in the squad it will become obvious that hodgson has either been incredibly stupid and not investigated and looked into the clubs situation and allowed himself to be wooed by the yanks or he is complicit in the whole sorry mess, either way i wouldnt want him as manager

Offline the 92A

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2010, 11:40:14 am »
Watched Spain last night, trying to dispel this feeling of utter dispair about football. David Villa brilliant season before last was hoping we'd sign him, a realistic target with Rafa's project. We weren't that far off being right up there with Barca, a few quality signings that would cost real money. Cut to todays reality. Roy Hodgson, it hurts. Nothing against Hodgson hope he sucsessful, but his appointment signals where we are and it hurts. With all the off field fighting part of me hasn't given a fuck about the new manager but a Pellegrini or a Dalglish could have lifted my spirits, instead I'm closer to jibbing it than I've been since my eighties holiday away from the game.
 
Funny getting lessons on the need to support the manager, from people who did anything but that with Benitez. Always been loyal to the manager untill they did something that was un acceptable. The only manager I actively wanted gone was Souness, so I'll support Hodgson but as the original poster says and I totally agree, 'It's hard not to see it as a giant leap backwards'.
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Offline Greg

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2010, 11:42:17 am »
Hodgson on the other hand has got to be trusted.  If the Yanks have reduced us to the state where we will not even back our own manager then they have won. The soul of the club has been destroyed and we may as well all go home.  That isn't the case though because we are the soul of this club and we will back the manager until such a point that his actions conclusively show that he is not acting in the best interests of the club. 

I don't necessarily agree with your notion that the yanks have suddenly won if we don’t back our manager. Won what exactly? It’s not as if we will all collectively surrender just because we are all sceptical about the appointment of Hodgson. If anything, it would make our campaign even stronger.

We can talk about “Soul” and the “The Liverpool Way” but I think it just sounds like romanticism at the moment. The situation we are in is unique and I don’t honestly know what principles we need to keep in order to win the fight.

I’m willing to give Hodgson a chance but I can’t pretend that I’m fully behind him as things stand. I am sceptical of his appointment and he will have to earn my trust – he won’t get it by default.

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2010, 11:43:43 am »
Get behind the manager.  Focus your energies on the owners, their hired hands particularly Purslow and his collaborators both here and at the ground. 

They are not going anywhere the appointment of Hodgson confirms it. How fuckin depressing this is all is how did we end up in this mess?
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2010, 11:46:03 am »
Good body copy in the OP VDM, although I disagree with the header. I don’t see this as a “giant leap backwards”, just another predictable and inevitable lower rung on the ladder of decline. In fact, if Roy doesn’t have to sell players , we may actually do better next season than last on the pitch .But that could only be temporary reprieve for a club in inexorable decline under G&H’s ownership.

The true story of what happened last year with Rafa is yet to be told. My view is that the whole new contract gambit for him went horribly wrong, a mixture of bad judgement, and bad luck. At that point he was too good for G&H, I suspect that he hoped that G&H would soon be gone, that the team was still just about good enough, and he was locking himself into a bright new future, not a tryst with tawdry chancers.

I shared your view that Rafa should stick it out. I look back on that view as cruel. A man who last year had to scrap around for the likes of Kyrgiakos and take a chance with Aquilani, this year finds himself managing the Italian and European Champions. Last years decline may have been in part due to the dawning realisation that he had made the wrong call by stopping on.

As for Kenny, his old friend ( their wives know each other too), I don’t think that an audience with the head of the Academy is on the cards, do you? In what capacity is Kenny intended to “work with” Roy anyway? There is no structural relationship. Kenny has remained silent on both Rafa’s departure and G&H, but he was prepared to actively assist in finding Rafa’s replacement. That position is at the very least, ambiguous. Mindful of all that, “walking out” of the Academy and his Ambassadorial role is small beer isn’t it? His role was in assisting  finding a new manager, not in appointing him.

Kenny is an idol to me which is why I never wanted him anywhere near the managers chair again. And as the shit storm swirls around Roy I will be grateful that he is not. For me Kenny’s role is in the next Administration, as Director of Football on the Board.

I agree that Roy has a very tricky transfer situation to deal with this summer. There will be pressure to raise cash. Some players might have gone if Rafa stayed, some may go because he is gone. Some should go because they are not good enough, some may need to go because of the funds they can generate for rebuilding. That is a hell of a job. Fortunately, because Roy is a current PL manager with an established international contacts and scouting network, he stands a good chance, but good and bad luck will also play a part. The argument that Rafa could “block” sales is a fantasy. He couldn’t. But it is certainly true that Roy will find the exercise less painful as he was not responsible for bringing the players in in the first place.

Sabotaging Roy is pointless, if successful next time round it could be Phil Brown.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2010, 11:48:52 am by xerxes1 »
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2010, 11:46:56 am »
I really believe that Roy is simply a steady hand whilst the sale goes through, as the compensation for a 2 yr contract will be minimal, on the scale of things e.g. £4m and reducing.  We need a manager in place who can keep things steady and Roy fits the bill.

I also think that Roy knows that he's 'holding the fort' pending the sale of the club and is happy to do so as he been told that the England job will be his when Cappello goes in two years time (no doubt after sounding out the FA).  Therefore, it is no coincidence that his contract is two years also.

I also believe that King Kenny has been brought into the loop and that's why there's been an apparent change of heart e.g. he knows about the sale, who's in the pipeline and will therefore help as much as he can.

It seems logical to me but, admittedly, is purely conjecture.
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2010, 11:48:08 am »
Sabotaging Roy is pointless, if successful next time round it could be Phil Brown.

C'mon Roy lad!  If that doesn't win the floating vote then nothing will.
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2010, 11:49:14 am »
This is exactly how I feel. I feel as though support for the manager is an acceptance of what the board have done to our club. A vote of confidence for them, even.

Sums it up for me. I'll reserve judgement until I see what sort of side we are fielding come September 1st.

Offline Guz-kop

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2010, 11:49:27 am »
Quote
This is exactly how I feel. I feel as though support for the manager is an acceptance of what the board have done to our club. A vote of confidence for them, even.

So do what do you suggest? Do we turn our anger to him? And by that I mean not on the forums but at the game, at the march, outside the ground, away games? Do we boo him? Do we sing songs about his lack of managerial success? Do we make banners demanding his dismissal? Should we educate all liverpool fans about his managerial career?

I hope the answer to those questions is no. Why? Because he isn't the issue. No manager would've been the issue. If you refuse to "support" Hodgson (what that means I don't even know) because he was appointed by the owners must mean you wouldn't have supported Capello, or Pellegrini, or van Gaal or snoogy doogy or that spanish fella that signed a FIVE year deal with the yanks last year or put up with 3 years of their bullshit and still wanted to stay, or dare I say it....Kenny Dalglish, apparently (who the fuck knows?) Purslow's mate, apparently a conduit between board and manager, apparently partly responsible for Hodgson's appointment and...who know, Rafa's departure? Even if the c*nts had got us a world class manager to replace the one they fired, it wouldn't have made a jot of difference. It wouldn't have absolved them of the stadium or the debts, it wouldn't have stopped our campaigns and it wouldn't have made our voices any quieter. So the same has to apply now. It IS presumptious to assume just because we've got hodgson everyone will forget about the owners but it's not THAT stupid. They want it to happen. They want someone to hang out there to be slaughtered and take our frustrations out on
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #31 on: June 30, 2010, 11:50:10 am »
C'mon Roy lad!  If that doesn't win the floating vote then nothing will.



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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #32 on: June 30, 2010, 11:52:52 am »
I need to wait untill it becomes clear for what reasons he has actually taken the job before he gets my support or not.  a manager that is willing to overlook the asset stripping purely to be able to add manager of LFC onto his CV is just as bad as puslow and broughton
right now I'll reserve judgement untill the transfer window closes. but if the clubs best players are sold this summer and the money not re invested in the squad it will become obvious that hodgson has either been incredibly stupid and not investigated and looked into the clubs situation and allowed himself to be wooed by the yanks or he is complicit in the whole sorry mess, either way i wouldnt want him as manager

I'm with you there.

If we are asset-stripped and Hodgson sits still for it,then he becomes one of the enemy.
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Offline sattapaartridge

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #33 on: June 30, 2010, 11:53:09 am »
well said VdM.
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #34 on: June 30, 2010, 11:53:48 am »
I really believe that Roy is simply a steady hand whilst the sale goes through, as the compensation for a 2 yr contract will be minimal, on the scale of things e.g. £4m and reducing.  We need a manager in place who can keep things steady and Roy fits the bill.

I also think that Roy knows that he's 'holding the fort' pending the sale of the club and is happy to do so as he been told that the England job will be his when Cappello goes in two years time (no doubt after sounding out the FA).  Therefore, it is no coincidence that his contract is two years also.

I also believe that King Kenny has been brought into the loop and that's why there's been an apparent change of heart e.g. he knows about the sale, who's in the pipeline and will therefore help as much as he can.

It seems logical to me but, admittedly, is purely conjecture.

I'm clinging to this, I hope you're right.

Offline Dave_the_Red

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #35 on: June 30, 2010, 11:54:57 am »
Feel sorry for the fans, feel sorry for the new manager. Under whelmed

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #36 on: June 30, 2010, 12:00:00 pm »
*types that their gonna sell everyone!...Panic!!!! Continues to lament Rafa, makes some other stuff up and generally has a big old dollop of guess work thrown in there for good measure.....Another normal post on the RAWK main forum*



You forgot to attack and patronise anyone who questions the basis for your assumptions.

Fucking naive, head in the sand blerts.
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Offline tomred

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #37 on: June 30, 2010, 12:00:18 pm »
Feel sorry for the fans, feel sorry for the new manager. Under whelmed

I am neither overwhelmed or underwhelmed--just whelmed.

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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #38 on: June 30, 2010, 12:07:52 pm »
I really believe that Roy is simply a steady hand whilst the sale goes through, as the compensation for a 2 yr contract will be minimal, on the scale of things e.g. £4m and reducing.  We need a manager in place who can keep things steady and Roy fits the bill.

I also think that Roy knows that he's 'holding the fort' pending the sale of the club and is happy to do so as he been told that the England job will be his when Cappello goes in two years time (no doubt after sounding out the FA).  Therefore, it is no coincidence that his contract is two years also.

I also believe that King Kenny has been brought into the loop and that's why there's been an apparent change of heart e.g. he knows about the sale, who's in the pipeline and will therefore help as much as he can.

It seems logical to me but, admittedly, is purely conjecture.

A reasonable punt, Lord Hunt. I do not believe though that Kenny has any inside knowledge on the status of the sale other than it aint happening anytime soon.

Kenny's longstanding friendship with Roy however can only help Roy tiptoe his way through the minefield which i suspect is the dressing room at the moment.

Roy isn't in a bad position at the moment, so long as capello doesnt go soon.If he had stayed at Fulham, at some point gravity takes effect. Here, no-one is expecting much and failure can be put down to the owners, if he succeeds his England credentials are enhanced, and if he does really well his contract might be extended.
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Re: It's hard not to see this as a giant leap backwards
« Reply #39 on: June 30, 2010, 12:08:16 pm »
Hodgson talks sense, knows systems inside out, has a good knowledge of the game as far as i can see from who was available its the best of a poor bunch, i will support him 100% as he is our manager, hopefully Torres and co will follow suit and play for him and our club regardless of what still is happening behind the scenes, i just hope that all the anti-Rafa brigade are pleased with the appointment they didnt realise at the time the fact that our great football club is not the challenge that would have the best managers crawling to the front door to be the manager, dark days ahead i just hope someone, anyone comes in over the next few weeks and relieves us of our pain
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