Author Topic: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..  (Read 38990 times)

Offline rocco

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1760 on: December 21, 2009, 09:09:32 AM »
Is there a press conference at 11 about the new stadium ?
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Offline Spirit_of_Istanbul

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1761 on: December 21, 2009, 09:14:15 AM »
Is there a press conference at 11 about the new stadium ?

Is there even a press conference or is this just horseshit?
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Offline rocco

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1762 on: December 21, 2009, 09:16:51 AM »
Is there even a press conference or is this just horseshit?

???
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Offline lgvkarlos

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1763 on: December 21, 2009, 09:34:24 AM »
Can't believe the amount of people turning on Rafa wouldnt want to be in the trenches with you.     If managers were sacked after one bad season Ferguson and  Wenger would be long gone.   Some on here need to grow a pair.

Offline Huan14

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1764 on: December 21, 2009, 09:37:44 AM »
I didn't know the mancs lost 3-0 to fulham. Wow crazy league this year

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1765 on: December 21, 2009, 09:38:32 AM »
Some on here need to grow a pair.

Plenty of spares going these days it seems...
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Offline Mr Mojo Risin'

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1766 on: December 21, 2009, 09:40:05 AM »
Wow. That'll show me, huh?

You sure you want Rafa as manager? He's not English, you know.

No. What it shows is your little attempt to wind people up, by claiming you've info to rumours
of unrest in the side,is absolute bollox. Along with no doubt everything you say.
So keep your snidey comments to slagging the manager off in preference to Arsene Wenger,cos
everyone agrees with you that Arsene is the bestest ever manager in the prem championship trophy.
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Offline lawrie

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1767 on: December 21, 2009, 09:46:15 AM »
Anyone not think that the central reason for our appalling form and lack of energy and fight is that half of the side should be in the treatment room?

consider the following list:
johnson - in and out and playing through several injuries
Gerrard - possibly should have an operation
Torres - in and out and was borderline surgery on groin
Benny - injured then miraculous recovery except that every game he appears to  be limping about
Aurelio- cant play more than one game a week

The only players that have been doing ok are Pepe, Agger, Lucas, Masch, carra and Ngog and they are the only ones who arent carrying an injury.

( apart fom kuyt (knackered fom overplaying) and insua (doing ok but young)

I think this explains our dramatic fall in performance more than anything.


 I agree but also think the players became demoralised before the season had even started when the transfer funds were pulled from Rafa

Offline rocco

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1768 on: December 21, 2009, 09:48:57 AM »
I agree but also think the players became demoralised before the season had even started when the transfer funds were pulled from Rafa

I had forgotten those comments by Pepe.

"There isn't frustration, there's resignation," Reina said. "The buying power of clubs is very different. You can't sign players if you don't have the money, and if there is no money, that's it. As a player, there's nothing you can do. We know what's in the squad; we can't do anything about it. All we can do is roll up our sleeves, work hard and try to win matches."

Goodness, if the players were already feeling that way 3 months ago....

The damage done by G&H on and off the pitch is becoming immeasurable.

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Offline todda

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1769 on: December 21, 2009, 09:54:41 AM »
Something is seriously wrong at the Club atm Rafa has lost it, the players aren't performing and we have nowhere to go.

We can't afford to sack Rafa and get a high profile manager in, as it would cost 20mil and you think maybe we'd be better off spending that money on the squad, but, IMO Rafa has lost the dressing room, he can't say anymore to make them play for him, they've got tired of hearing the same rallying calls week-in week-out, I'm sure the wankers oh I mean owners would love to sack 'Roffa' but, know they can't afford to.  I think Rafa will stay till the end of the season and having not got us into the CL he'll walk out of loyalty to the fans (or at least I'd like to think he would) as I believe that's why he's stuck his neck out and said we'll finish 4th, guaranteed.  Lets face it no one in their right mind would say on current form we'll finish 4th, on current form we'll be lucky to finish in the Europa league spots.

For whatever reason, Alonso going (not replacing him properly), or just plain lack of confidence, we are not the same side we were last season.  on current form were relagation material, not that I think that will happen, but we're no better than a mid table side atm, I don't care what anyone says.  This season we're not good enough.
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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1770 on: December 21, 2009, 10:00:06 AM »
Wow. That'll show me, huh?

You sure you want Rafa as manager? He's not English, you know.

He asked

Rumour from where? Are you in the city? and have contacts?

You said

Yup. But I can't tell you who.

Fuck off wum
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Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1771 on: December 21, 2009, 10:16:17 AM »
We can't afford to sack Rafa and get a high profile manager in, as it would cost 20mil and you think maybe we'd be better off spending that money on the squad, but, IMO Rafa has lost the dressing room, he can't say anymore to make them play for him, they've got tired of hearing the same rallying calls week-in week-out,

the whole teams performance against arsenal first half which worked perfectly
and the win against wigan suggests rafa has NOT lost the dressing room

loosing the dressing room would mean no one is performing looked like reina, carra, aurelio, masch, lucas, kuyt and torres gave a shit even if they didnt play their best football

at chelsea last season no one but lampard and anelka looked like they could give a fuck if they won or lost
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Offline RigBon1892

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1772 on: December 21, 2009, 10:18:51 AM »
the whole teams performance against arsenal first half which worked perfectly
and the win against wigan suggests rafa has NOT lost the dressing room

loosing the dressing room would mean no one is performing looked like reina, carra, aurelio, masch, lucas, kuyt and torres gave a shit even if they didnt play their best football

You know what? Forget Torres. If this fella decides to leave us (not that he would) we'd be well and truly fucked.
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Offline Fordy

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1773 on: December 21, 2009, 10:27:18 AM »
the whole teams performance against arsenal first half which worked perfectly
and the win against wigan suggests rafa has NOT lost the dressing room

loosing the dressing room would mean no one is performing looked like reina, carra, aurelio, masch, lucas, kuyt and torres gave a shit even if they didnt play their best football



Not a simple as that.

You never played footy at a decent level? Losing the dressing room doesnt mean that you dont put on some shows/performances it means that you will lose or draw more games then normal and most of the time the players wont be giving 100%.

Look at the league table and review most of our performance this season. Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt, Carra, Fabio - All the star performers have been poor this season. Babel, Doss, Voronin - Also have all been poor.

Think you can see why some are saying he has lost the dressing room. We will see over xmas if thats really the case as for me nothing short of 6 points will do.

Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1774 on: December 21, 2009, 10:40:36 AM »
Not a simple as that.

You never played footy at a decent level? Losing the dressing room doesnt mean that you dont put on some shows/performances it means that you will lose or draw more games then normal and most of the time the players wont be giving 100%.

Look at the league table and review most of our performance this season. Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt, Carra, Fabio - All the star performers have been poor this season. Babel, Doss, Voronin - Also have all been poor.

ah so its becuase we drew/lost more than normal. Well then he lost the dressing room back in july. pre season was shite as the real season

why the fuck has no one spoken out up to now and gotten the man the sack

we had drogbreath and honest jt telling the papers every day what they thought of scolari

injuries meaning we changed the back four every week, gerrard and torres both getting injured, bad decisions from refs have led to this piont

torres 11 goals in 12 has been right old pile of shite hasnt he
kuyt looks run down rather than not putting in all he has
carra started the season poorly but has deffo been getting back to his best the past few weeks

gerrard looks off form i dont know if he doesn't beleive in the manager or it could be that he is still recovering from his injury problems

you've always been negative on Rafa anyway - remember you saying this same sort of stuff last jan/feb when we were shit
« Last Edit: December 21, 2009, 10:42:14 AM by LFCfan4Life »
Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

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Offline Cherashisushi

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1775 on: December 21, 2009, 10:57:37 AM »
Not sure if it's negativity, or just stating facts.

We are not playingtoo well, are we?

Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1776 on: December 21, 2009, 11:02:57 AM »
Not sure if it's negativity, or just stating facts.

We are not playingtoo well, are we?

no saying rafa has lost the dressing room is just idle gossip and rumour - not fact unless he is in fact one of our players, sammy lee or rafa himself

fuck sake the papers aren't even running that and they would jump on it if they thought it was true but there are people spouting it off on here
« Last Edit: December 21, 2009, 11:06:37 AM by LFCfan4Life »
Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

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JUSTICE 4 THE 96.

Offline LFC_4_life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1777 on: December 21, 2009, 11:12:21 AM »
no saying rafa has lost the dressing room is just idle gossip and rumour - not fact unless he is in fact one of our players, sammy lee or rafa himself

It sure as hell looks like Rafa has lost the players because it seems that aside from Torres and Carra, no one could really care less. It seems that no one is reacting to what Rafa says anymore.

Offline Jookie

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1778 on: December 21, 2009, 11:25:55 AM »

On this forum and in ‘real life’, particularly, I’ve been a staunch supporter of Rafa. I think we’ve over achieved in the last few years. Not dramatically but over achieved all the same (in a our final league place anyway). One stick I heard fans beat Rafa with is around his poor transfer policy. And while we can pick out poor signings by Rafa over the last few years, the same can be said for any manager in the league. Overall  think he’s been decent in his transfer record, not amazing but definitely not poor either. It’s fair to say that I just haven’t bought some of the criticisms of Rafa from fellow fans. I think it’s fair to say also say that he’s been dealt a sh*tty stick so far this season -  Alonso wanting to go, transfer funds being pulled, numerous injuries, beach balls etc..

I think it is wholly fair based on past performances and some of the luck we have been dealt this season to place some faith and trust that Rafa could turn it round. My thoughts were wait till we get our players back fit, wait till we get they have played a few games together and let’s wait till we get an easier run of games and then let’s judge Rafa. To me all of them things are now happening, and the performances are getting worse not better. No matter how good the 1st half was, the 2nd half performance, or should I say surrender, against Arsenal was gutless. We were poor against Wigan, while on Saturday we put in one of our worst performances ever under Rafa ( maybe only the Peter Crouch inspired 2-0 defeat at Soton in his 1st season was worse). It wasn’t just the result either. Not one player could take credit from that game. Again, the defence looked all at sea. In midfield, we had Mascherano lose his head (again!) and Lucas try hard but not really influence the game. Now the sending off may have been 50-50 but for an experienced player to put himself in that position was reckless and showed a severe lack of discipline. While the selection of Dossena was mind boggling, the continued selection of an off form Kuyt is baffling. I really do wonder what he’d have to do to be dropped. Now on to our 2 superstars –Gerrard and Torres. Torres cut a very frustrating figure on Saturday. He isn’t playing well personally but his season (for the 2nd year running) is being hampered by injury. Gerrard’s performances over the last 3 games have been an insult to the captaincy. When we’ve needed him most in the past he’s delivered. At the moment, his performances are making matters worse. Having your captain walk around the pitch sulking sends completely the wrong message to the other players, the supporters and the watching World.

Over the last 20 years there have been numerous highs but also a number of lows. While we have lost many a big game over this time some of my lowest points have come in more ‘low key’ games . Getting beat at home to Bristol City in the FA Cup. Probably the lowest point in the last 20 years for me was getting beat at home to Leicester City by an Iain Marshall goal as a Roy Keane inspired United came back from 2-0 in Turin to reach the Champion’s league final. For me, the game when we got beat 1-0 to Portsmouth in the FA Cup and Owen missed a penalty was the day I lost faith that Gerard Houllier was the man to take us any further. Back to Fratton Park, this weekend and I had that same feeling. Well maybe not exactly the same feeling of the loss of complete faith in Rafa Benitez but definitely the 1st time I’ve truly questioned whether he is the right man for the job.

We are a club in crisis from top to bottom, however, short term I think we need something dramatic to turn things round on the playing side of things. More of the same isn’t working. Some people will point at sacking the manager as a response. Personally, I would keep faith in Rafa. However, I think it’s got to the point where he has to try something dramatic to try and change our fortunes. I’m not really sure what this is but something out of the ordinary needs to be done. Strip Gerrard of the captaincy? Drop Kuyt? Bring in some youngsters? Trust Aquilani? Sell Mascherano  in Jan to raise funds? Like I said I don’t really know what needs to be done but something does, because churning out the same type of team selections and performances that we’ve been treated to for the 1st half of the season is not good enough and means we are significantly punching below our weight.

Fingers crossed that the right things are being done behind closed doors at Melwood to turn our season round.
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Offline kratos

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1779 on: December 21, 2009, 11:59:40 AM »
Leaving the ground on Saturday really reminded me of Houlliers last days.
I left the stadium staring at the ground in despair because that display was even worse than anything I've seen for some time. I thought the Fulham display was a low but this really topped it off.
Some of the stuff I been reading here and general comments against Rafa this season I have been really annoyed at. But Saturday was really the first time I really have had doubts if Rafa can turn this around.
I still hope this is all just madness and we go on and start winning games but 4 wins in 17 - its just really really tough at the moment. I've started to lose hope.
I really applaud the loyalty that several fans on here have shown towards Rafa. Think mine is starting to fade now..

Offline Kopite_1984

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1780 on: December 21, 2009, 12:08:38 PM »

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1781 on: December 21, 2009, 12:11:34 PM »
Tell you what, how about this?

4-4-2

Reina, Johnson, Agger, Carra, Aurellio, Gerrard, Aquilani, Benayoun, Babel with Torress and either Kuyt or Ngog up top.

Or

4-4-2 with darby right back and Johnson right mid?

Time for the shackles to go Rafa.
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Offline Cherashisushi

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1782 on: December 21, 2009, 12:13:47 PM »
Fantastic post.


Offline kratos

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1783 on: December 21, 2009, 12:18:02 PM »
Good post that may be of interest

http://robbohuyton.blogspot.com/2009/12/portsmouth-was-lowest-of-low-for.html

Can someone please paste that text on here - cant view that site..cheers..

Offline deano89

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1784 on: December 21, 2009, 12:20:16 PM »
Can someone please paste that text on here - cant view that site..cheers..

Here it is mate:

NEVER mind how many days left until Christmas, how many days left until the football season is over?

It's 139 by my calculations and if Saturday against Portsmouth was a barometer of how the rest of the season will go, May 9th can't come soon enough.

The 2-0 defeat at Fratton Park was the worst of the lot this season. And there's been a lot. Seven now in the league, a situation that has left the Reds eight points from the coveted fourth spot and the invitation to continue to dine at Europe's top table that comes with it.

With trips to Villa Park, Old Trafford, The Emirates and Eastlands still to come, plus home games with Spurs and Chelsea, further defeats in the league must be considered likely on current form.

Whatever way you look at it, no matter what mitigating circumstances are presented, it's a grim time to be a Liverpool fan.

No back-to-back wins since September and just four wins in 17 would ring alarm bells at any football club.

Most fans seem desperate to lay the blame at someone's door - be it Rafa Benitez, Tom Hicks and George Gillett, or the players.

The truth is, everyone has played a part.

Fans that fell from the optimistic tree continued to dig for reasons for the defeat to bottom of the league Pompey.

From the harsh sending off of Javier Mascherano to the fitness and form of players, exceptional finishing by Portsmouth and even the pitch.

Calling it as I saw it, it was down to predictable play and fragile confidence.

Even with 11 men on the pitch, Liverpool barely made a chance worthy of the name. Daniel Agger headed over when he should of scored, Dirk Kuyt swung at the air when well placed in the box and Fernando Torres had a speculative shot from outside the area.

And that was about that.

Once Mascherano was given his marching orders out came the white flag, in went the towel and it never looked like anything else but a home win.

And that was what really grated. Did every player bust a gut to try and get something from the game? Did they squeeze out every last bead of sweat in an effort to salvage a point for the club that pays their hefty wages? Did they take some responsibility, grab the game by the scruff of the neck, go for broke? No, no, no.

But it can be done. And it can be done by a Liverpool team managed by Benitez.

Rewind to March 2006, an Anfield derby. Steven Gerrard is sent for an early bath after just 18 minutes. Rabid Evertonians celebrate in the Anfield Road end like they've just won the FA Cup. With not even a quarter of the game on the clock, and the score at 0-0, they sense victory.

Cue team spirit, hard work and passion. Liverpool steamroller the Blues with a high-tempo approach that the Toffees can't cope with and win the game 3-1.

That performance compared to the one on Saturday is like comparing Pele to Phil Neville.

Next question - why?

 It was a strong enough line up on Saturday, and clearly one that Benitez felt could win the game, so why a performance so meek? It came on the back of a win over Wigan - didn't that lift confidence?

Clearly not. What's worrying for me is the play has been pedestrian for some time, even in victories, and teams seem to be getting the measure of Liverpool.

Portsmouth followed Fulham in allowing the Reds possession and sitting deep but while they saw a lot more of the ball Liverpool did little with it in the final third.

Benitez's insistence on sticking with out of form players is not helping matters. I'm a big fan of the Spaniard, he's brought the club forward in his time in charge and provided some truly memorable moments but that does not mean he is absolved of blame for the current crisis.

Kuyt is crying out for a rest, he's clearly far from his best, as is Emiliano Insua. Yet still they start matches. The Dutchman's touch and decision making has deserted him while the young Argentinean, still a great prospect, needs a spell out of the firing line as he is regularly being exposed and found out of position.

Stubborness is the chink in Benitez's armour. And the longer he persists with the policy of trying to play certain players into form, that chink will get bigger.

Petulant behaviour to the media doesn't help either, the 'perfect' diatribe may have been born of frustration but it just gave Liverpool's many knockers another stick to bash the club, and Benitez, with - an invitation they duly accepted with relish.

Just as Rafa is not immune to criticism, neither is Gerrard. He is a shadow of his former self. Still injured, not fit, struggling for form or fed up? We can only speculate from the outside looking in. But the skipper hasn't hit a ball in anger that I can recall since returning to the side. He looks off the pace and his body language, while never great, is even worse than usual.

Other players are going backwards. Glen Johnson looked a world beater a few weeks ago. But his confidence must be flimsier than Fabio Aurelio's limbs, because one own goal later he looks a bag of nerves.

So what now, what's the answer?

Well the club acting like a club would be a start. The players, the manager and the owners need to collectively pull their fingers out and start working for the common cause.

The owners need to stop behaving like the landlords of a dodgy student house. It's all well and good paying a two-bit decorator to paint the walls but if you don't pay the big bucks to tackle the dry rot, it'll come back to bite you on the arse.

I'd like to see them take their rigid business plan and throw it in the Mersey. Instead, recognise the problems on the playing side and stump up some cash for a bit of January window shopping. And  preferably in Harrods rather than the dump bin at Netto.

On the playing side, every player needs to look in the mirror and say am I trying my hardest? Am I being professional? Quite a few players need to ditch the petulance and play like they mean it.

For Rafa, I'd like to see him throw off the shackles. The Pompey line up was cautious and caution sends out the wrong message, certainly to fans and maybe to players, too.

Danny Pacheco showed enough against Fiorentina to suggest he would not be out of his depth, so play him. Bring him on, let him do his stuff. It would send out better vibes than Jay Spearing coming on for Lucas in the 88th minute...

The fear of the unknown could at the very least unnerve some opposition defenders.

My worry is that if things don't change quickly, the Americans' fingers will pull the trigger.

If Hicks and Gillett read it that Rafa is not the right man to protect their 'asset' I have no doubt they will fire him. Non-football men with power in football is a dangerous thing. Ask Mark Hughes.

If that happens then where will Liverpool be? My guess is up shit creek..without a paddle.

Because make no mistake, if Liverpool are looking for a new manager in the next few months there's a very real chance it won't be at the top end of the market.

Endless internet forum posts talk about Jose Mourinho and Guus Hiddink but let's be serious here. Neither will struggle for job offers, so why choose to voluntarily join the dysfunctional family that is Liverpool FC?

Warring owners, bickering fans, huge debt, no money to spend and a proviso that you must sell to buy. Hiddink? Mourinho? Don't make me laugh. More likely a 'second tier' manager keen to prove themselves or an ex-player with an emotional tie to the club. Either option is a step down from Benitez.

And mediocre managers spells mediocre players, then the downward spiral really will start.

Portsmouth was the lowest of the low for Liverpool this season. Let's hope now the only way is up from here on in.

Offline rocco

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1785 on: December 21, 2009, 12:21:51 PM »
.
THE KING IS BACK

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Offline Borninbethlehem

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1786 on: December 21, 2009, 12:27:27 PM »
At the end of the day our club is rotting at the core. There are so many things wrong at the moment. We need a drastic change somewhere because we are going to continue to rot without one. Either Rafa or the owners need to go because we are NOT going to finish 4th the way we are playing, and we will lose some key players next season when we are not in the Champions League.


Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1787 on: December 21, 2009, 12:29:43 PM »
At the end of the day our club is rotting at the core. There are so many things wrong at the moment. We need a drastic change somewhere because we are going to continue to rot without one. Either Rafa or the owners need to go because we are NOT going to finish 4th the way we are playing, and we will lose some key players next season when we are not in the Champions League.

heres one for you they can always work hard and fix the rot

rather than being so fickle that only a change in personal will do
Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

* * * * *
JUSTICE 4 THE 96.

Offline kratos

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1788 on: December 21, 2009, 12:30:59 PM »
Here it is mate:

Danny Pacheco showed enough against Fiorentina to suggest he would not be out of his depth, so play him. Bring him on, let him do his stuff. It would send out better vibes than Jay Spearing coming on for Lucas in the 88th minute...

Top post. Agree with pretty much everything that was said there.

I cant belive Pacheco cant even get in the squad at the moment with a 7 man bench. But then again we didnt even see Ngog on the pitch at Pompey so no chance of Pacheco. Aint seen much of him apart from that Fiorentina game but was he any worse than some of the players consistently played week in week out.

Offline Jookie

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1789 on: December 21, 2009, 01:07:55 PM »
Here it is mate:

NEVER mind how many days left until Christmas, how many days left until the football season is over?

It's 139 by my calculations and if Saturday against Portsmouth was a barometer of how the rest of the season will go, May 9th can't come soon enough.

The 2-0 defeat at Fratton Park was the worst of the lot this season. And there's been a lot. Seven now in the league, a situation that has left the Reds eight points from the coveted fourth spot and the invitation to continue to dine at Europe's top table that comes with it.

With trips to Villa Park, Old Trafford, The Emirates and Eastlands still to come, plus home games with Spurs and Chelsea, further defeats in the league must be considered likely on current form.

Whatever way you look at it, no matter what mitigating circumstances are presented, it's a grim time to be a Liverpool fan.

No back-to-back wins since September and just four wins in 17 would ring alarm bells at any football club.

Most fans seem desperate to lay the blame at someone's door - be it Rafa Benitez, Tom Hicks and George Gillett, or the players.

The truth is, everyone has played a part.

Fans that fell from the optimistic tree continued to dig for reasons for the defeat to bottom of the league Pompey.

From the harsh sending off of Javier Mascherano to the fitness and form of players, exceptional finishing by Portsmouth and even the pitch.

Calling it as I saw it, it was down to predictable play and fragile confidence.

Even with 11 men on the pitch, Liverpool barely made a chance worthy of the name. Daniel Agger headed over when he should of scored, Dirk Kuyt swung at the air when well placed in the box and Fernando Torres had a speculative shot from outside the area.

And that was about that.

Once Mascherano was given his marching orders out came the white flag, in went the towel and it never looked like anything else but a home win.

And that was what really grated. Did every player bust a gut to try and get something from the game? Did they squeeze out every last bead of sweat in an effort to salvage a point for the club that pays their hefty wages? Did they take some responsibility, grab the game by the scruff of the neck, go for broke? No, no, no.

But it can be done. And it can be done by a Liverpool team managed by Benitez.

Rewind to March 2006, an Anfield derby. Steven Gerrard is sent for an early bath after just 18 minutes. Rabid Evertonians celebrate in the Anfield Road end like they've just won the FA Cup. With not even a quarter of the game on the clock, and the score at 0-0, they sense victory.

Cue team spirit, hard work and passion. Liverpool steamroller the Blues with a high-tempo approach that the Toffees can't cope with and win the game 3-1.

That performance compared to the one on Saturday is like comparing Pele to Phil Neville.

Next question - why?

 It was a strong enough line up on Saturday, and clearly one that Benitez felt could win the game, so why a performance so meek? It came on the back of a win over Wigan - didn't that lift confidence?

Clearly not. What's worrying for me is the play has been pedestrian for some time, even in victories, and teams seem to be getting the measure of Liverpool.

Portsmouth followed Fulham in allowing the Reds possession and sitting deep but while they saw a lot more of the ball Liverpool did little with it in the final third.

Benitez's insistence on sticking with out of form players is not helping matters. I'm a big fan of the Spaniard, he's brought the club forward in his time in charge and provided some truly memorable moments but that does not mean he is absolved of blame for the current crisis.

Kuyt is crying out for a rest, he's clearly far from his best, as is Emiliano Insua. Yet still they start matches. The Dutchman's touch and decision making has deserted him while the young Argentinean, still a great prospect, needs a spell out of the firing line as he is regularly being exposed and found out of position.

Stubborness is the chink in Benitez's armour. And the longer he persists with the policy of trying to play certain players into form, that chink will get bigger.

Petulant behaviour to the media doesn't help either, the 'perfect' diatribe may have been born of frustration but it just gave Liverpool's many knockers another stick to bash the club, and Benitez, with - an invitation they duly accepted with relish.

Just as Rafa is not immune to criticism, neither is Gerrard. He is a shadow of his former self. Still injured, not fit, struggling for form or fed up? We can only speculate from the outside looking in. But the skipper hasn't hit a ball in anger that I can recall since returning to the side. He looks off the pace and his body language, while never great, is even worse than usual.

Other players are going backwards. Glen Johnson looked a world beater a few weeks ago. But his confidence must be flimsier than Fabio Aurelio's limbs, because one own goal later he looks a bag of nerves.

So what now, what's the answer?

Well the club acting like a club would be a start. The players, the manager and the owners need to collectively pull their fingers out and start working for the common cause.

The owners need to stop behaving like the landlords of a dodgy student house. It's all well and good paying a two-bit decorator to paint the walls but if you don't pay the big bucks to tackle the dry rot, it'll come back to bite you on the arse.

I'd like to see them take their rigid business plan and throw it in the Mersey. Instead, recognise the problems on the playing side and stump up some cash for a bit of January window shopping. And  preferably in Harrods rather than the dump bin at Netto.

On the playing side, every player needs to look in the mirror and say am I trying my hardest? Am I being professional? Quite a few players need to ditch the petulance and play like they mean it.

For Rafa, I'd like to see him throw off the shackles. The Pompey line up was cautious and caution sends out the wrong message, certainly to fans and maybe to players, too.

Danny Pacheco showed enough against Fiorentina to suggest he would not be out of his depth, so play him. Bring him on, let him do his stuff. It would send out better vibes than Jay Spearing coming on for Lucas in the 88th minute...

The fear of the unknown could at the very least unnerve some opposition defenders.

My worry is that if things don't change quickly, the Americans' fingers will pull the trigger.

If Hicks and Gillett read it that Rafa is not the right man to protect their 'asset' I have no doubt they will fire him. Non-football men with power in football is a dangerous thing. Ask Mark Hughes.

If that happens then where will Liverpool be? My guess is up shit creek..without a paddle.

Because make no mistake, if Liverpool are looking for a new manager in the next few months there's a very real chance it won't be at the top end of the market.

Endless internet forum posts talk about Jose Mourinho and Guus Hiddink but let's be serious here. Neither will struggle for job offers, so why choose to voluntarily join the dysfunctional family that is Liverpool FC?

Warring owners, bickering fans, huge debt, no money to spend and a proviso that you must sell to buy. Hiddink? Mourinho? Don't make me laugh. More likely a 'second tier' manager keen to prove themselves or an ex-player with an emotional tie to the club. Either option is a step down from Benitez.

And mediocre managers spells mediocre players, then the downward spiral really will start.

Portsmouth was the lowest of the low for Liverpool this season. Let's hope now the only way is up from here on in.

The sentiments in this post are pretty much spot on.
I think Jookie might just be the best fisherman on this thread.

Offline stockdam

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1790 on: December 21, 2009, 01:44:16 PM »
Is there even a press conference or is this just horseshit?


No it's bull.
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Offline stockdam

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1791 on: December 21, 2009, 01:45:39 PM »
It sure as hell looks like Rafa has lost the players because it seems that aside from Torres and Carra, no one could really care less. It seems that no one is reacting to what Rafa says anymore.


I think that is Sun headline stuff. No I don't think Rafa has lost their respect. I think they are very disappointed but I don't think they have fallen out with Rafa.

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Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1792 on: December 21, 2009, 01:51:35 PM »
don't know whether anyone has received a press conference today text but i'll tell you what it's for, for a laugh (which we need right now!):

11am today

Dalglish Manager
Carragher his number 2

how did that work out in the end?
Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

* * * * *
JUSTICE 4 THE 96.

Offline Fordy

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Re: Portsmouth 2 - 0 Liverpool Post Match..
« Reply #1793 on: December 21, 2009, 01:54:11 PM »


you've always been negative on Rafa anyway - remember you saying this same sort of stuff last jan/feb when we were shit

What are you talking about?

Cause you have your head in the sand and I dont does that make me negative. The points I have made are good ones. I have played the game, I understand it well and I can have a view.

Did I ever say Rafa had lost the dressing room? What I said was I can understand why some are saying it and explained why.

As for last season in Jan/Feb. Rafa had a rant, we wasnt winning. Yes I said how it was and guess what that rant and our poor Jan/Feb form cost us winning the league.  Should we have won the league last season? yes we should of.

I will prise the team & Manager when they deserve it but when they dont I wont. Unlike you who seem to not know what your praising for and clearly dont have your own views unless your a bloody robot thats programmed to accept shit.

Also lets get something straight. At the games I will never boo or complain about a player but on the Internet, a forum I will express my views and thats why we have debates on here or what would be the point in Rawk? Do I believe in the manager - YES, Do I believe in the players - Yes, Can we in improve - YES, Are we shit at this moment - Hell Yes - Do I want rid of the owners - YES.

So whats your problem Mr Positive?