Topic: Was that Birmingham game Rafas 'Watford 1970'??

[catch your balls dorris]

in my personal oppinion i can see babel and a few others (hopefully voronin) going in the new year. Babbels body language at the birmingham game looked to me that hed given up hope on being any kind of success at liverpool, which is a shame because i really do believe he has a "raw" tallant which may never be exposed due to his awful attitude.

[Phil M]

Babbels body language at the birmingham game looked to me that hed given up hope on being any kind of success at liverpool, which is a shame because i really do believe he has a "raw" tallant which may never be exposed due to his awful attitude.

He came on in the 77th minute and from what I saw tried to make things happen as much as possible including
one memorable run from deep where he showed brilliant close control before laying it off to Mascherano.
Saw nothing wrong with his body language or attitude in his short time on the pitch, thought he was very
positive and exactly what you'd hope to see from him or any sub.
And that is merely my opinion on him v Brum, nothing more.

[Suspect Package.]

Oh my god, there's some weapons in this thread.

Frankly I'm a bit pissed off about money being the reason for pretty much every fuck up that the team or manager does.We don't need the money for tactical changes.

why did we play 1 up front with 2 (!!!) holding midfielders against a shitty Birmingham AT ANFIELD??  Money doesn't have anything to do with that.

I'll start with you.

You really blame Benitez for starting with our only two fully fit centre midfielders and not playing an unfit Torres? :S I agree, money has nothing to do with that at all.

Oh and btw, Lucas isn't even really a 'holding' midfielder.

Quality attacking players that would be out of contract in the summer, and therefore, relatively cheap in January: Adriano, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Maxi Rodriguez, Goran Pandev, Kevin Kuranyi, Marouane Chamakh, Jadson, Jonathan de Guzman, Fernandinho, Semih Senturk.

You seem to be confusing real life with this:



Here's a suggestion Macedonian. Try and discuss football aside from player transfers. Radical I know.

We have no dosh anyways for wholesale changes

Is sadly the correct answer. We haven't got the funds available for large alterations to the squad.

I can see the likes of Dossena being allowed to go, but expecting much money to be spent in January is just unrealistic in our current situation.

[catch your balls dorris]

i meant his persona off the the pitch and before the game. i agree with you completly he made and had some great chances but theres somthing not quite right with him he never seems to reach potential and seems frustrated, hopefully the world cup being around the corner may spear him on to step up to the challenge.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

You have almost fooled me there for a moment. Then, I have traveled a bit through your posts and I have found exactly what I have expected.

[Suspect Package.]

You have almost fooled me there for a moment. Then, I have traveled a bit through your posts and I have found exactly what I have expected.

Let me guess, my responses were not:

"Let's buy X player from Y club with hypothetical Z money that won't happen"

Cause that's all you've come up with in this thread.

What do I win?

[catch your balls dorris]

You have almost fooled me there for a moment. Then, I have traveled a bit through your posts and I have found exactly what I have expected.

is it just me or does anyone else want to know what hes found..............can we make guesses

[Suspect Package.]

is it just me or does anyone else want to know what hes found..............can we make guesses

My horse porn collection

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

What do I win?

[catch your balls dorris]

My horse porn collection

that poor estodian fellow was really wishing you had that code, what gives you 15 million on champ man.....................

[Suspect Package.]

that poor estodian fellow was really wishing you had that code, what gives you 15 million on champ man.....................

Nah, but I think if we sign Valeri Bojinov, Henry Saivet, Mamadou Sakho, Ibrahim Bakayoko, Felipe and Guilherme in January we can rescue our campaign. Course the sales of Voronin, Degen, Spearing, Nemeth, Smicer and Pako Ayesteran will cover it easily.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

Nah, but I think if we sign Valeri Bojinov, Henry Saivet, Mamadou Sakho, Ibrahim Bakayoko, Felipe and Guilherme in January we can rescue our campaign. Course the sales of Voronin, Degen, Spearing, Nemeth, Smicer and Pako Ayesteran will cover it easily.

I would have never thought of those players, but it is nice to see that we have some real transfer experts on these boards. Carry on the good work. One of these days, you will probably hit the jack-pot.

[catch your balls dorris]

isnt bojinov still at city (i remember very little of his premiership career) or has he secretly departed these shores too a far off land.

[lfc_bhoy]

I would have never thought of those players, but it is nice to see that we have some real transfer experts on these boards. Carry on the good work. One of these days, you will probably hit the jack-pot.

How's the Pandev transfer going?

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

How's the Pandev transfer going?

I have already answered you that one, couple of days ago.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=248070.msg6276686#msg6276686

What is wrong with you ?

[Red-juvenated]

Rafa has always been trying to get a proper RW player for the last 3 years. If we had someone like Simao or Joaquin settled at RM, our team would be well balanced and Kuyt could be used as a second striker (when required).

I think this is still a position he's desperately trying to fill. Rafa can offer to sell a few players (Degen, Dossena, Babel?) to raise the dough if need be.

[Spanish Al]

Astonishing.

Firstly, Chelsea line up with a midfield Diamond 4 of Ballack, Essien, lampard and Deco for big games.  This is narrow and tight with no defined wingers but  Neither of our players would get close to that side.  In addition, they have Joe Cole and Malouda on the bench who are both better players than our two.

Secondly, Arsenal do have a winger in Walcott who is better than our two with more potential and far more technical ability. As you rightly say, Arshavin makes Babel and Riera look like dumb and dumber.

Thirdly, Ashley young is class and Villa have James Milner who is probably one of the most in form players in the league at present.  Know for an impeccable work rate and apparently one of the finest Trainers Alan Shearer has ever seen.  I'd swap him for Babel tomorrow.  Well done for remembering Downing.  Personally im not a fan of his but as you have probably guessed by now, im not really in the babel fan club either.

City have ireland, Wright Phillips, Robihno and Petrov who again is in decent form.  I'd swap any one of those for our two, particularly Wight Phillips.

I'd concede that Bentley would not be an improvement but lennon is in a different stratosphere to what we have at present.  Some like yourselves provide the easy criticism that "his final ball isnt good".  Thats an argument from yester year thesedays though as his display for England have shown recently.  In addition, for a young kid with such ability to get into the positions he does so often, its only a matter of time before his final ball becomes even better.  Ronaldo's final ball was once poo to you know.  In addition, the last time i checked, Riera and Babel weren't really providing devastating balls into the box.

United unfortunately still have giggs who despite his ripe old age is still probably quicker than Riera.  Valencia is harder to assess as he's not been there long. Nani plays sparingly and as you say is pretty piss poor.

Im not saying that our boys cant be wonderful on their day, i do however believe that most of the wingers at the other top 6 clubs are more consistent and that our players wouldnt hold down a place in their wide slots.

I genuinely hope Babel comes good for you mate as your obviously a fan and i know it frustrates when thats the case.  Ive leapt to the defence of Alonso more times than would be regarded healthy and know how frustrated i got on times as others bashed him.  I can only say what i see though and i see 8 or 9 good promising players but two distinctly average lads in babel or Riera who could fetch a pretty penny and improve us as a unit.

You cannot use formations that don't play with wingers against Riera and Babel, that's bollocks. I do not think Malouda is worth twice or more of what we paid for Riera, and don't even think he is better than him.

Arsenal have the bets wingers out of the top '6' clubs as you call them, so we are not the only club behind them in that respect.

City have Ireland? He isn't a wide man, and if he does play there on the odd occasion he is not as effective as our two. Petrov is old, and like I say, can we expect to match Robinho, with the tens of millions of pounds he cost?

Giggs plays more centrally in his old age, and isn't quicker than Riera, and definitely not Babel. We have better wingers than last seasons champions. That's good enough for me, considering Babel and Riera aren't our first choice wingers, but for some reason not good enough for you.

You brought up current form when arguing Petrov's case, but didn't bothger mentioning that when it came to Ashley Young? I wonder why? Because Young has been off form this season. Downing is shite and overated.

Now, I've compared Babel and Riera, to the FIRST CHOICE wide men at the other top clubs, and think that we are not too far behind. This imo is great considering Babel is close to third choice for the wings, and Riera is 2nd choice at the moment.

[Spanish Al]

He came on in the 77th minute and from what I saw tried to make things happen as much as possible including
one memorable run from deep where he showed brilliant close control before laying it off to Mascherano.
Saw nothing wrong with his body language or attitude in his short time on the pitch, thought he was very
positive and exactly what you'd hope to see from him or any sub.
And that is merely my opinion on him v Brum, nothing more.

Didn't ya know, Babel has to run more than Kuyt to be given praise for his efforts.

No matter what he does, people use the 'he's lazy and effortless' all the time, even though, this season, he has definitely not been that.

It's bollocks, no?

[Geoff_W]

This ''we have no money'' argument is simply not good enough. There will be a huge number of very good players available for peanuts in January, simply because they are out of contract in the summer. Not to mention the possible loan deals, something that Rafa is very reluctant to do, ever since we have got Mascherano.

You chatting to Rafa on the regular then?  I hadn't realised he was "reluctant" to do loan deals.  Who were the quality players who became available that he turned down?

I didn't realise there were going to be a huge number of players available for peanuts this January.  That's weird, it's the first time that's ever happened.  Who are they, and why aren't they costing the usual amount?

Seriously though, even if there were players available for peanuts, we'd still struggle to compete in terms of wages.

[shanklyboy]

Yup. You are probably the most intelligent poster on these boards. In fact, I don't know why are you wasting your time here. You could probably earn a lot by being a pundit at Sky Sports.

The problem I have with your comments are that you don't listen to what has been asked of you or you do but choose to ignore them because you don't have an answer.
Your problem is coming up with a wide variety of potential transfers plucked from the air and despite being asked about where the money is coming from in JANUARY!.........you ignore it and keep on repeating yourself.
I have never claimed to be intelligent , far from it, but I attempt to address each point someone makes.
You don't need to agree with my points but I'd suggest you should put your arrogance to one side for a minute and you wouldn't be seen as avoiding questions because they don't fit in with your solution.

Resorting to insults in favour of a rational discussion is fine if you are retaliating. However that isn't the case here, so either answer the question put to you and validate your points or shut the fuck up......simple!

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

The problem I have with your comments are that you don't listen to what has been asked of you or you do but choose to ignore them because you don't have an answer.
Your problem is coming up with a wide variety of potential transfers plucked from the air and despite being asked about where the money is coming from in JANUARY!.........you ignore it and keep on repeating yourself.
I have never claimed to be intelligent , far from it, but I attempt to address each point someone makes.
You don't need to agree with my points but I'd suggest you should put your arrogance to one side for a minute and you wouldn't be seen as avoiding questions because they don't fit in with your solution.

Resorting to insults in favour of a rational discussion is fine if you are retaliating. However that isn't the case here, so either answer the question put to you and validate your points or shut the fuck up......simple!

Yup. You are definitely Sky Sports pundit material.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

You chatting to Rafa on the regular then?  I hadn't realised he was "reluctant" to do loan deals.  Who were the quality players who became available that he turned down?

The records don't lie. Apart from Mascherano, Rafa has never signed a high-profile player on a loan deal. Which is very weird, considering our financial situation and the success of that one example at LFC. If you want a name: Mauro Zarate.

I didn't realise there were going to be a huge number of players available for peanuts this January.  That's weird, it's the first time that's ever happened.  Who are they, and why aren't they costing the usual amount?

I have posted a list of 10 players earlier in this thread: Adriano, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Maxi Rodriguez, Goran Pandev, Kevin Kuranyi, Marouane Chamakh, Jadson, Jonathan de Guzman, Fernandinho, Semih Senturk. And those are only the attacking players. I have deliberately avoided to mention the Bosmans from our PL opponents (like Michael Ballack, Joe Cole, Deco, Martin Petrov), as I don't see a chance of signing any one of them, especially not in January.

As for the reason why aren't they costing the usual amount, it is actually pretty simple. The financial crisis has forced many clubs to slash their wage bills, and therefore, the players mentioned above, even though they have quality, were not offered new deals at the level they were expecting. Subsequently, they have decided to run down their contracts and get better wages elsewhere, being signed like Bosmans in the summer. Some of their clubs (or maybe even most of them) will like to cut their losses in this financial climate, so we will probably see most of the players mentioned on that list being sold in January, for a cut price deals.

Seriously though, even if there were players available for peanuts, we'd still struggle to compete in terms of wages.

This is where I think we are getting it wrong. We all know that Rafa was shafted by the Americans for some 30 million this summer. But, that decision is coming back to haunt them now, as we are clearly in danger of missing the next year's Champion League. If something like that is to happen (God forbid), the consequences for the Americans would be immense. Not only that we will be missing the prize money from the Champions League, but we will be also missing a part of our sponsorship money, as all of our commercial deals (Standard Chartered included) have clauses dependant on our presence in the CL, according to reports from reliable sources.

Gillet and Hicks might be liars and thieves, but they are not idiots. The best way to avoid the possible loss of 30-40 million because of LFC missing the CL next season, would be to invest some fresh transfer funds right now, and to allow Rafa to add to that fresh funds anything he could recoup through sales (Dossena, Voronin, Degen and maybe even Babel) in January.

[shanklyboy]

Yup. You are definitely Sky Sports pundit material.

Of course I am.
Anyone could see that by the random, ill-informed baseless comments I make.
Especially when compared to your insightful, well thought out, logical, dealing only in facts comments that you make over and over again.

[Suspect Package.]

I would have never thought of those players, but it is nice to see that we have some real transfer experts on these boards. Carry on the good work. One of these days, you will probably hit the jack-pot.

Indeed, I'm particularly hopeful on the Imbrahim Bakayoko transfer swoop. He'll do well in the prem.

[freddwarf]

Some posters have mentioned Babel's body language when he came in the B'ham game. I wouldn't blame the boy if he is pissed off with life at LFC. Rafa paid 10mill for the boy and has changed him from a kid with great natural skill and pace into a misfit.

After Lyon he should have played from the start V B'ham.Riera was way off the pace coming back from injury. Babel would have been up for it after his great strike V Lyon. When a player esp a young kid who scores a goal like that doesn't get the game or treatment he deserves, he is bound to drop his head.

Another blunder by Rafa.

[yafoy]

Some posters have mentioned Babel's body language when he came in the B'ham game. I wouldn't blame the boy if he is pissed off with life at LFC. Rafa paid 10mill for the boy and has changed him from a kid with great natural skill and pace into a misfit.

After Lyon he should have played from the start V B'ham.Riera was way off the pace coming back from injury. Babel would have been up for it after his great strike V Lyon. When a player esp a young kid who scores a goal like that doesn't get the game or treatment he deserves, he is bound to drop his head.

Another blunder by Rafa.

no player is allowed to be pi**ed off at LFc ...whatever age...NO blunder, and NO "watford 1970" either...situations are so different the topic is embarassing...lets move on instead of finding more ways snipers can get at Rafa ...hold together - its about character on and OFf the field..

[shanklyboy]

Some posters have mentioned Babel's body language when he came in the B'ham game. I wouldn't blame the boy if he is pissed off with life at LFC. Rafa paid 10mill for the boy and has changed him from a kid with great natural skill and pace into a misfit.

After Lyon he should have played from the start V B'ham.Riera was way off the pace coming back from injury. Babel would have been up for it after his great strike V Lyon. When a player esp a young kid who scores a goal like that doesn't get the game or treatment he deserves, he is bound to drop his head.

Another blunder by Rafa.

How does it work then when Rafa has played him many times when he has performed poorly in previous games?
He's scored before and done little when he's been kept in the side.

To say that Benitez should have played him because he scored may or may not be right, but you have to ask yourself if it is a risk.Benitez has been extremely patient with Babel, and almost always spoken of him in glowing terms.
Sometimes you have to look at the mentality of a player to see where the problems are.

Riera made some errors in the game against Birmingham but his overall performance wasn't that bad.
He's also been left out as have many others in the past, but rarely when they have performed consistantly well.
The prime example was Benayoun.

[Sean Mac Eggman]

This ''we have no money'' argument is simply not good enough. There will be a huge number of very good players available for peanuts in January, simply because they are out of contract in the summer. Not to mention the possible loan deals, something that Rafa is very reluctant to do, ever since we have got Mascherano.

you should team up with collymore on his football articles

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

you should team up with collymore on his football articles

Why ? Because I suggest that you don't need to spend £100 million in a single year, in order to improve your team ? Well, while you are waiting for the rich Arabian ''Sugar Daddy'' to arrive, I am willing to discuss other options.

[Phil M]

while you are waiting for the rich Arabian ''Sugar Daddy'' to arrive, I am willing to discuss other options.

Options like the hypothetical signings of the most unlikely names you can think of
on a regular basis.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

Options like the hypothetical signings of the most unlikely names you can think of
on a regular basis.

You must have mistaken me for someone. By the way, it is not my fault that you have never heard of players like Adriano, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Maxi Rodriguez, Goran Pandev, Kevin Kuranyi, Marouane Chamakh, Jadson, Jonathan de Guzman, Fernandinho or Semih Senturk. And I have only posted these names because I was asked by other posters to name the players that would be available on the cheap in January, being out of contract in the summer.

[Phil M]

And I have only posted these names because I was asked by other posters to name the players that would be available on the cheap in January, being out of contract in the summer.

Riiiiight. http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=249828.msg6295584#msg6295584

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

Riiiiight. http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=249828.msg6295584#msg6295584

And what that story from the ''Independent'' has to do with this thread ?

[Phil M]

And what that story from the ''Independent'' has to do with this thread ?

It was in response to your reply above, proving my point.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

It was in response to your reply above, proving my point.

So, the fact that I have posted a story, from a source generally considered as a reliable one, on a completely different sub-forum, and that proves some theory of yours ? Good for you.

[Phil M]

So, the fact that I have posted a story, from a source generally considered as a reliable one, on a completely different sub-forum, and that proves some theory of yours ? Good for you.

I merely illustrated the fact that, as has been stated by other posters here that your sole purpose here is
to post nonsensical hypothetical transfer targets like some sort of red top headline regurgitator.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

I merely illustrated the fact that, as has been stated by other posters here that your sole purpose here is
to post nonsensical hypothetical transfer targets like some sort of red top headline regurgitator.

As I have said before, you have mistaken me for someone else.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=41952