Topic: Are there any intelligent reds who want Rafa out?

[SirRyanGiggs]

You mean like Vidic being rested on Sunday (when in reality he was coming back from injury as Gerrard and Torres have been).

Vidic is not to us as Torres and Gerrard are to you. Vidic has had a mediocre season and struggled against top teams. Evans and Brown did a fantastic job until Drogba pulled Brown down.

We wasted money on Nani and overpaid for Anderson but we had cover for those two. Why did your manager spend a hefty chunk of the transfer money on a player that is known to be injury-prone? You let Crouch and Bellamy go which are good players, replaced Warnock and Riise with Insua (Aurelio is really not much better) and 8 million Dossena?

[Dick Emery]

People waffle on about daytrippers, OOT-ers and the problem of keeping traditions. Makes me laugh. Our manager and team are up against it and all you get are a load of crying jonny-come-latelys who know nothing. The worst thing about this situation is not the form of the team or the plight of the manager....it's the number of people who know nothing about what it means to be a Liverpool fan. My advice to them is either strap some on and get behind the manager and the club or go an support a team in your own town.

[Promised to never post on RAWK again]

Evans and Brown did a fantastic job until Drogba pulled Brown down.

Yup. And I particularly liked what Evans did to Drogba.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXpPZ1RsP3Y

[buzzing]

Crouch wanted out. We offered him a new deal, but he wanted more first team games. With torres being our 1 up top. It wasn't going to happen.

Bellamy didn't exactly set the world alight for us. Selling him allowed us to get Torres

Riise was too predictable, we needed someone who could offer more than long shots and hoofs. In hignsight we could have done with him over Dossena.

Insua although decent gets caught out. His final ball isn't the best at times and he's very slow

[hesbighesred]

I don't want Rafa out, I hope he stays with you as longs as possible, tinkering, rotating, buying bunch of mediocre players and resting your best players in crucial games.

Yep, I quite agree.

We'd be stupid to get rid of someone, especially when a manager as successful as yours has employed his methods, exactly as you describe, on his way to his last 3 league titles.

If only we could afford your wage bill, and to spunk £17million on promising bench players - then we'd be getting somewhere.

Still, it's impressive that a Manc has noticed the clear similarities between Rafa's methods and the ones Fungus started using about a season or two after Rafa and Mourinho arrived in England - most of your lot wouldn't admit that under torture. Still, I guess that open mindedness is why your such welcome addition to these boards - an Manc who can see the 'big picture' a bit. The kind of Manc who can admit, just as we'd all agree, that Anderson is without doubt better than Lucas, as you argued so persuasively on an another thread with this epic post:

Anderson is much better

Which I have to say is possibly the most definitive contribution I've ever seen in terms of the Lucas debate. Well done to you, you are truly worthy of the legend who you so rightly praise with your username. Sir Ryan of Giggs. Indeed. What I wouldn't give for a manager who could still rely on a player after all these years of declining performances, after having spent as little as £50million plus on failed replacements...just like he's still loyal to the 'just as good as he ever was when he was really shit' Scholes - 48 years old, can barely play a half anymore, yet still better than the £100million + investments on 'talent' Fergus has pitted him against.

[PaisleyPrint]

enlighten us....

Please dont encourage him

[SirRyanGiggs]

Yup. And I particularly liked what Evans did to Drogba.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXpPZ1RsP3Y

Yeah, I liked that too. You should be happy given the way he rolled around on the pitch and cheated every time he played against you.

[bigbear]

Vidic is not to us as Torres and Gerrard are to you. Vidic has had a mediocre season and struggled against top teams. Evans and Brown did a fantastic job until Drogba pulled Brown down.

We wasted money on Nani and overpaid for Anderson but we had cover for those two. Why did your manager spend a hefty chunk of the transfer money on a player that is known to be injury-prone? You let Crouch and Bellamy go which are good players, replaced Warnock and Riise with Insua (Aurelio is really not much better)

All managers get things wrong but the more money you have to spend the more chances you get to put it right. Had ferguson played Vidic he might have been stronger than Brown and you'd have drew 0-0 - who knows ? I'm not stpid enough to think that but that's the kind of perverted bile Rafa gets thrown at him by the tits in the media.

Rafa sold Bellamy to get Torres. Who would you rather have ? He couldn't afford both. Warnck needed to go to get games and improve. He was positionally very ordinary and for me is not ahead of Aurelio at present and not a long way in front of Insua. Warnock can't defend either.

Crouch wanted games but was behind Torres in the pecking order. We have to sell to buy that's the sad truth.

If Gerrard and Torres are fit they play. The idiots who criticised Benitez for taking Torres off at Fulham and Lyon were clearly not commenting last night when he wasn't fit to play. Rafa has just been trying to manage the situation and get by which unfortunately we haven't managed to do as a bit of luck has deseerted us too.

if you're just on a wind up fuck off, if you want to debate it - fine.

[SirRyanGiggs]

All managers get things wrong but the more money you have to spend the more chances you get to put it right. Had ferguson played Vidic he might have been stronger than Brown and you'd have drew 0-0 - who knows ? I'm not stpid enough to think that but that's the kind of perverted bile Rafa gets thrown at him by the tits in the media.

Rafa sold Bellamy to get Torres. Who would you rather have ? He couldn't afford both. Warnck needed to go to get games and improve. He was positionally very ordinary and for me is not ahead of Aurelio at present and not a long way in front of Insua. Warnock can't defend either.

Crouch wanted games but was behind Torres in the pecking order. We have to sell to buy that's the sad truth.

If Gerrard and Torres are fit they play. The idiots who criticised Benitez for taking Torres off at Fulham and Lyon were clearly not commenting last night when he wasn't fit to play. Rafa has just been trying to manage the situation and get by which unfortunately we haven't managed to do as a bit of luck has deseerted us too.

if you're just on a wind up fuck off, if you want to debate it - fine.

Its not about luck anymore. You relied too much on two players and got burned once again. Benitez knows Torres is prone to knocks and injuries, why is his only backup Voronin and Ngog? Torres should have stayed on against Lyon to keep their defenders from coming up to attack. The second he took off Torres Cris had the freedom to go forward without worrying much about defending against one of the best strikers in the world. Did those few minutes off the pitch really make a difference?

[Walshy®]

I agree with the pace and technique part. We need that balance. to me kuyt was never a winger as he's lacking attributes required for it. Its a shame rafa see a one up torres as the formation but yet bcos of his favourtism of kuyt, puts a squre peg on a round hole. in due time either he sinks with the ship bcos this right ride of our attack has been shit for a top football standard. why not put that youngster kelly in earlier and johnson as RW?

stop fucking around kuyt or put him upfront where he actually was good in the dutch league and when he was here in the beginning. sometimes you CAN be TOO smart or your own good.

You mean the Dirk Kuyt who outscored Berbatov, Rooney and Tevez last season from Midfield and had the highest assits for a Right midfielder outside of Ronaldo?

Or do you mean someone else?

[Chakan]

You mean the Dirk Kuyt who outscored Berbatov, Rooney and Tevez last season from Midfield and had the highest assits for a Right midfielder outside of Ronaldo?

Or do you mean someone else?

guy you can't just throw facts like that at people, you have to have a slanted opinion for people to aknowledge first.

[bigbear]

Its not about luck anymore. You relied too much on two players and got burned once again. Benitez knows Torres is prone to knocks and injuries, why is his only backup Voronin and Ngog? Torres should have stayed on against Lyon to keep their defenders from coming up to attack. The second he took off Torres Cris had the freedom to go forward without worrying much about defending against one of the best strikers in the world. Did those few minutes off the pitch really make a difference?

Those few minutes could have crippled him - i don't know.

Re this Cris thing ?  It's just nonsense.

So you think that at 1-0 down with 2 minutes to go the Lyon coach would be saying to his big centre back. "Stay there and mark Torres, we'll take the defeat"

I don't think so. Lots of sides have gambled against us by throwing centre backs up for 5 minutes whether Torres is on the pitch or not.

[Chakan]

Its not about luck anymore. You relied too much on two players and got burned once again. Benitez knows Torres is prone to knocks and injuries, why is his only backup Voronin and Ngog? Torres should have stayed on against Lyon to keep their defenders from coming up to attack. The second he took off Torres Cris had the freedom to go forward without worrying much about defending against one of the best strikers in the world. Did those few minutes off the pitch really make a difference?

So here's a hypothetical situation, Torres stays on the field, 3 minutes later someone cuts him down and he is stretchered off.... cris goes up field and does what he does to get that goal.

Now I can almost  guarantee you your comment would be "why did Rafa leave him on the field"

[shelovesyou]

Everyone who wants Rafa out now are going to get frustrated even more than they are ,
I was reading a article today and LFC have only ever sacked 2 managers in their history , Don Welsh and Houllier , both after the season ended. They have never got rid during a campaign.
We wont get rid now at all, it will never happen.
We have along way to go and alot of the damage thats been done can be repaired yet .
Keep the faith and stick behind the gaffer. Atleast until May.

[hesbighesred]

Its not about luck anymore. You relied too much on two players and got burned once again. Benitez knows Torres is prone to knocks and injuries, why is his only backup Voronin and Ngog? Torres should have stayed on against Lyon to keep their defenders from coming up to attack. The second he took off Torres Cris had the freedom to go forward without worrying much about defending against one of the best strikers in the world. Did those few minutes off the pitch really make a difference?

Fungus knows that Rooney's scoring is like phases of the moon - it waxeth full for about one week in every four on average - and that Berbatov is about as reliable as anyone else who appears to be suffering from methodone withdrawal while he plays.

Yet he's relying on perma-crock Owen as his only back up, a man who has failed to even get close to Ngog's impact for us this season.

Oh, and injuries are far more likely in the closing stages of matches, but then I can't see some insignificant body of knowledge like medical science making a dent in your views, so I'll stop now.

[Johnnyboy1973]

Dunno why you are entertaining the know nothing manc shite.

Any prick that tells you that we let Crouch go and questions why Voronin is our only back up to Torres is a fucking idiot.

[Sr Harvest Fiields]

rafa out. ive had enough. useless fat waiter. get allardyce in. hes far moe experienced. or o neill.  bloody foreign managers

[East of Anfield]

Yeah, I liked that too. You should be happy given the way he rolled around on the pitch and cheated every time he played against you.

2 wrong doesn't make a right

[lakes]

The problem i have is i remember standing in the Kop and the team coming around after winning the league, for me our club has always been about winning the league, as Bill Shankly said "The League Championship is our bread and butter" .
I have never believed that Rafa was going to be the right man to do that with us, I do believed that if he stays we could win more CL.

Last year we run the close and if it was not fr a few strange sub here and there we could have one it (my view only).

but i do feel he has run out of time and money to win it for us now.

what i see as an even bigger problem is that there are no mangers about that would fit into the club , all the good ones have jobs and some of the good one i can't stand.

but yes I do think time is getting ver short for him.......ok so after last nights game i did say he get sacked, but that was just rage.

[lakes]

rafa out. ive had enough. useless fat waiter. get allardyce in. hes far moe experienced. or o neill.  bloody foreign managers

no no no allardyce, 5 years ago yes but now no.

[Achmat]

Are people retarded?

Who dares argue with Sir Ryan Giggs? PFA Player of the Year with a booming 1 goal when the award was given. The best player in world sport on current form. The man who was tipped to be the difference between Man Utd and Chelsea. The man who would lessen the blow when Ronaldo left. The man who would take Nani under his wing and transform him into the best left midfielder in the world.

His word is law. It is so obvious  that we had the option to keep Warnock, Riise, Crouch, and Bellamy. Isn't it? We have a pool of funds sitting in the bank for Rafa to spend (wouldn't be surprised if it was a gift from Ryan Giggs).


Seriously, why are you even on this forum? You are wrong. Rafa has to sell to buy. This is why we don't have depth. We weren't able to keep Crouch and Bellamy. If we had funds we could have but we don't.

And stop acting like you could manage Liverpool better than Rafa. Your tactical insight is outstanding. I think I may just create a team of my own and make you the manager. I think only a manager with the calibre of yourself or Ryan Giggs in the future would be able to anticipate the taking an injured Torres off at Lyon would have led to us conceding a goal.

MODS: Please create a poll on the main page asking fans whether they would want Rafa or SirRyanGiggs as the manager. Clearly he has more knowledge about the sport.

Also, lets not get into the argument of bad transfers. Mr. Ferguson is the king at making poor transfers see: Nani, Anderson, Carrick, Hargreaves, Berbatov all within a couple of years and all not worth anything what you paid for them. Yes, I said Carrick. He has been absolute shite this season.

[yorkykopite]

Why is anybody bothering to argue with a Man Utd fan? They know fuck all about football.

[gatcliffe]

I personally feel if the season does continues to go from one low to another, and some fans do really turn against Rafa, no silverware and no CL qualification god forbid I really think Rafa himself will be honest enough to resign unless things really change with G & H. and new investors.

[Sr Harvest Fiields]

how bout we all just chill, take a step back and relax. the team is having a bad time. not Rafa. we al are suffering. injuries are taking us down etc.lets get some realism here. Rafa can only put out whats available and atm that isnt the best.

[bigbear]

I personally feel if the season does continues to go from one low to another, and some fans do really turn against Rafa, no silverware and no CL qualification god forbid I really think Rafa himself will be honest enough to resign unless things really change with G & H. and new investors.

The team was applauded off last night at both half time and full time. The crowd know when the team have put in a shift and when they have not. They don't automatically get applauded off.

[gatcliffe]

The team was applauded off last night at both half time and full time. The crowd know when the team have put in a shift and when they have not. They don't automatically get applauded off.

In my 40 years of going to Anfield can,t remember the team not been applauded off ! I can,t see what this is to do with my concern Rafa may walk if he thinks he has failed big time this season

[sirKennyDaggers]

I don't want Rafa out, I hope he stays with you as longs as possible, tinkering, rotating, buying bunch of mediocre players and resting your best players in crucial games.

Wouldnt get too cocky Giggsy,take Rooney out the mancs and your team would be royaly fucked.

[str]

I'm having a terrible feeling while watching Real Madrid play about a great manager from Madrid returning home soon...

[gatcliffe]

I'm having a terrible feeling while watching Real Madrid play about a great manager from Madrid returning home soon...

Totally agree with you there and just think how he would be welcomed home by all

[RyanBabelsFish]

Bellamy didn't exactly set the world alight for us. Selling him allowed us to get Torres

Again peddling this line. Babel arrived the same summer. Did Bellamy fund them both?

[bigbear]

In my 40 years of going to Anfield can,t remember the team not been applauded off ! I can,t see what this is to do with my concern Rafa may walk if he thinks he has failed big time this season

I can remember the team not being applauded off  over my 33 years of going but it is all to varying degrees.

On Monday I sensed real support on the back of a decent performance. I didn't feel that v Lyon for example.

With regard to Rafa walking if fans turned and we struggled (aas we are), i was referring to the fans retaining support for Rafa and the team which is still clearly the case based on Monday night.

[bigbear]

I'm having a terrible feeling while watching Real Madrid play about a great manager from Madrid returning home soon...

I think Mourinho will end up there quite shortly.

[ErinMc66]

Skimming through these responses... I'd say what has been proven here beyond a shadow of a doubt is that the answer to the question posed in the title is a resounding "HELL NO!"

(But I would like to thank hesbighesred for the laughs.)   

[str]

I think Mourinho will end up there quite shortly.

Mourinho is managing a team leading Serie A comfortably. They have problems in the CL but they a have good chance of going through - he has no reason to leave.

[bigbear]

Mourinho is managing a team leading Serie A comfortably. They have problems in the CL but they a have good chance of going through - he has no reason to leave.

He's not hugely popular though is he and La Liga and Madrid would probably appeal more, albeit Inter are a big club too.

[The G in Gerrard]

I think Mourinho will end up there quite shortly.

Really?

[str]

He's not hugely popular though is he and La Liga and Madrid would probably appeal more, albeit Inter are a big club too.

Was thinking about this during Inter-Roma - where certain "great" (considered to be the best at the moment) managers can end up in a few years. His preferred destination in La Liga must be Barcelona as he spent a few years there, but that probably wouldn't stop him from managing Real, considering Guardiola will most likely cements his place in the coming years.

If Rafa ever leaves I want him to manage Roma or Atletico to be honest.

I shall let normal service resume now though.

[cowtownred]

Why is anybody bothering to argue with a Man Utd fan? They know fuck all about football.

To be fair, Sir Giggs does make quite a valid observation regarding our left back position...

I'll defer to Southern Pansy for the maths,

but its not unreasonable to say that:

Warnock (improving year by year, good solid defender, getting more adventurous in attack) oh, rarely injured now, may well be a significant improvement on the pitch, and financially, than the trio of Insua, Aurelio and Dossena we have brought in instead.

Well its an exaggeration... but the lad has a point in my opinion. 

If only we could have Aurelio with Warnocks desire and Insua's injury record.

[hesbighesred]

Mourinho is managing a team leading Serie A comfortably. They have problems in the CL but they a have good chance of going through - he has no reason to leave.

He won't have a choice if he doesn't get Inter to at least the semis of the CL, I would think. That's the Moratti benchmark now - Mancini was sacked for CL underperformance after two equally impressive seasons in terms of domestic form, and Mancini sailed through the group stages in that second year, and were knocked out by an exceptional European team in ourselves. Inter looked pretty poor in the CL last season too.

[Slave]

Why is anybody bothering to argue with a Man Utd fan? They know fuck all about football.

This.