Topic: Lucas a cut above as trim inspires improved Liverpool FC form

[Beninger]

Every time I watch him, I watch to see if he gets muscled off the ball in a challenge.  Today he didn't get muscled like many other times...he did the muscling.  I liked some of the tackles he put in as well.  That ball off the ref was going to be a killer...you could just see what he was thinking.

[BazC]

Again- can't help but be impressed by his attacking game. Especially the vision he has and the ability to find the right weight when looking for the through ball. He looked like a demolition ball today as well- his mobility is a good asset as is his growing strength.

In defence, apart from a wondefully timed sliding tackle which I first thought was Masch, I didn't see him much. I would have thought he'd drop back to help the defenders out in possession but he was very much in an advanced position (far advanced than Xabi would have been). If Rafa told him to do that, it indicates that change in 4-2-3-1 to perhaps a 4-3-3 (many times I saw him much closer to Gerrard than Masch when our CB/GK had the ball. Carra had to bring the ball/pass it out quite a lot and he wasn't that great- but you can see Agger being much better. Hopefully Mascherano picks up on these things more and instead of just covering the defenders, he provides them with the short ball and moves it on to the attackers. If Lucas has got a more 'box-to-box' role, then he'll need to look to do the same- drop deeper when one of our defenders has the ball to give them a better/easier option than the increasingly frustrating long ball.

If Lucas starts a lot of games next season as an attacking midfielder, I can see him doing very, very well. It doesn't take a lot of imagination to see that Lucas has assists and goals in him.

[new-red]

In defence, apart from a wondefully timed sliding tackle which I first thought was Masch, I didn't see him much. I would have thought he'd drop back to help the defenders out in possession but he was very much in an advanced position (far advanced than Xabi would have been). If Rafa told him to do that, it indicates that change in 4-2-3-1 to perhaps a 4-3-3 (many times I saw him much closer to Gerrard than Masch when our CB/GK had the ball. Carra had to bring the ball/pass it out quite a lot and he wasn't that great- but you can see Agger being much better. Hopefully Mascherano picks up on these things more and instead of just covering the defenders, he provides them with the short ball and moves it on to the attackers. If Lucas has got a more 'box-to-box' role, then he'll need to look to do the same- drop deeper when one of our defenders has the ball to give them a better/easier option than the increasingly frustrating long ball.

I saw the same thing you did. The main reason why we struggled in attack was because carra or san jose didn't wanna bring the ball out of defense like they had to. Espanyol was playing a 4-1-4-1, and they put all 10 behind the ball. They left a lot of room for our CBs to come up but they left no room to pass to the CMs. The only thing that happened when the CMs dropped back was that the defense closed them down and gave them nowhere to pass too. If we had agger in the game it would have been a lot better.

Also, imo, lucas pushing up is much better for the attack. Last season, Alonso was deep lying, same as masch, and the attack had no support. If lucas starts getting into forward areas, he has the vision to find torres or gerrard cutting in behind the defense. We could be a lot more dynamic and unpredictable as a team with that type of play from Lucas.

Im looking for big things from him, and even if we get Aquilani, lucas will still probably get at least 15 prem starts because you kno Rafa wont be pushing aquilani with his injury record.

[dane]

Well anyone can pass it 2 yards.

He played what I call a simple game today. He went looking for the ball, got it and past it square to the nearest Liverpool player.

Lucas needs to do more to his overall game like more attacking runs, spreading the play, more shots at all. Its pre season but I believe that Lucas could be massive for us next season.

I didn't get to see the game but your description of what Lucas did sounds a lot like what Xabi was doing at his most effective last season - keeping it simple and keeping possession for us by always being open to circulate the ball via simple passing.  If Lucas can add the extra element you're calling for that would be great but in my opinion Xabi isn't particularly dynamic and people get carried away with his passing.

Regarding 'anyone can pass it 2 yards' I don't think it's the pass that many struggle with but some midfielders tend to lose possession before passing the ball due to poor body position, lack of composure or strength, or they fail to provide a pass option for another player who then gets dispossessed.

[scatman]

I didn't get to see the game but your description of what Lucas did sounds a lot like what Xabi was doing at his most effective last season - keeping it simple and keeping possession for us by always being open to circulate the ball via simple passing.  If Lucas can add the extra element you're calling for that would be great but in my opinion Xabi isn't particularly dynamic and people get carried away with his passing.

Regarding 'anyone can pass it 2 yards' I don't think it's the pass that many struggle with but some midfielders tend to lose possession before passing the ball due to poor body position, lack of composure or strength, or they fail to provide a pass option for another player who then gets dispossessed.

agreed, like yourself i didnt see the game, so its nice to hear a few positive comments, im advocating what you think the young lad should be doing too.

[PJLFC1]

Every time I watch him, I watch to see if he gets muscled off the ball in a challenge.  Today he didn't get muscled like many other times...he did the muscling.  I liked some of the tackles he put in as well.  That ball off the ref was going to be a killer...you could just see what he was thinking.

Concur , looking like a bargain at 8mil now

[Twelfth Customer]

Yes keeps it simple short passing OK but when he tries to spray it wide or long 1st touch like Xabi most of his passes were inaccurate, too slow so picked up, but he is trying I guess.

[royhendo]

Didn't see that Twelfth Man. His passing looked pretty accurate to me.

And wasn't it £6m pjl...?

[Twelfth Customer]

Didn't see that Twelfth Man. His passing looked pretty accurate to me.

Xabi has the ability to pass long one touch almost without looking and instinctively something I guess very few players in the world have the ability to do, so to ask Lucas to do it would be a little unfair. I did see him try and do it yesterday on occasion, to Glen in the 1st half (the ball went behind him) and to babel in the 2nd half where the ball hit was too soft and cut out easily by the defence.

[royhendo]

He's definitely not at Xabi's level on that front, that's true. He adds things Xabi lacks though. For me we really need Agger and Skrtel fit - centre half was the big problem last night.

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

i like the way he doesnt knock it long
we dont need another quarter back ffs.

he is another option

a proper pass and move player

i find it ridiculous that he HAS to be abe to knock a 50 yard ball just to please half the fans.
if you have players around you supporting you a long ball is mostly the wrong one.

thank fuck lucas seems to know when and when not to play this ball.

[abhred]

Lucas was brilliant. Think he'll prove a lot of people wrong this season.

[PJLFC1]

Didn't see that Twelfth Man. His passing looked pretty accurate to me.

And wasn't it £6m pjl...?

If it was 6 thats even better Roy , he seems really confident at the minute and i just hope the boo boys get behind him and allow him grow even more than he has done during the last 6 months , or since he had his wig chopped 

[Hazell]

He's definitely not at Xabi's level on that front, that's true. He adds things Xabi lacks though. For me we really need Agger and Skrtel fit - centre half was the big problem last night.

Yeah definitely. Though San Jose and Carragher weren't particularly great last night.

Lucas linked up well with the forwards last night, seemed a lot more confident. Early in the first half, he had posession, held onto it and held onto it, waiting for Johnson to make a run and then played him in. That's the the kind of thing he's good at and with him playing further forward, it would give us something different.

[Dr Cornwallis]

I think Rafa has reinvented the lad, and if we get Aquilani then that will prove it.
Lucas was bought to play the Gerrard role, that's how he impressed when in Brazil, but it seems that Rafa now has him ear-marked for the Alonso role. 
Aquilani plays further forward than a defensive midfielder, so he wouldn't be a like for like replacement for Xabi, hence why I think that Lucas will drop back into there and Aquilani will provide back-up for Gerrard.

Still think that Lucas gets caught a bit too often in possession though, he really needs to sort that out as we'll get punished if he loses it back there and not further forward as usual.
I like Lucas a lot though.

[Raul!]

Perfectly decent player, our Lucas.  His passing suffers in comparison to Xabi's but so does most of the rest of the team's including Gerrard's.

Step forward lad, this could be your time.

[fishmyman]

I think Rafa has reinvented the lad, and if we get Aquilani then that will prove it.
Lucas was bought to play the Gerrard role, that's how he impressed when in Brazil, but it seems that Rafa now has him ear-marked for the Alonso role. 
Aquilani plays further forward than a defensive midfielder, so he wouldn't be a like for like replacement for Xabi, hence why I think that Lucas will drop back into there and Aquilani will provide back-up for Gerrard.

Still think that Lucas gets caught a bit too often in possession though, he really needs to sort that out as we'll get punished if he loses it back there and not further forward as usual.
I like Lucas a lot though.

you may like him, but hes mine.

[Fordy]

I didn't get to see the game but your description of what Lucas did sounds a lot like what Xabi was doing at his most effective last season - keeping it simple and keeping possession for us by always being open to circulate the ball via simple passing.  If Lucas can add the extra element you're calling for that would be great but in my opinion Xabi isn't particularly dynamic and people get carried away with his passing.

Regarding 'anyone can pass it 2 yards' I don't think it's the pass that many struggle with but some midfielders tend to lose possession before passing the ball due to poor body position, lack of composure or strength, or they fail to provide a pass option for another player who then gets dispossessed.

That game was a few weeks ago now. He was miles better yesterday.

Its clear that Rafa is wanting a more attacking mind Midfielder to partner Mash and I was disappointed that Lucas wasnt showing he could do this.

However in yesterdays game he was making forward runs, passing the ball forward and wanting the ball. He impressed me yesterday more than Mash.

[bryanod]

He's definitely not at Xabi's level on that front, that's true. He adds things Xabi lacks though. For me we really need Agger and Skrtel fit - centre half was the big problem last night.

Was shocking wasn't it. Yossi and Babel didn't fare much better.

Thought Lucas played very well first half, but drifted out of it before being taken off. Played a lot better than spearing though...

[JimmyGrunt]

Yes keeps it simple short passing OK but when he tries to spray it wide or long 1st touch like Xabi most of his passes were inaccurate, too slow so picked up, but he is trying I guess.

Everyone was wayward with their passes yesterday though.

[yafoy]

thought the lad did well in the first half..the whole team struggled in the 2nd half..its a frienbly..so I will look at it with RED coloured glasses..and as we only lost 2 games in the whole of last season (including friendlies) Rafa can tell the lads..ok U have lost your "alloted 2 defeats" ..get on & wine the league now, be UNbeaten!

[yafoy]

or even Win & wine  it...

[ElSheak]

If he plays another ball like he did to Gerrard against the barcodes last season i'll take that all day.

It was the killer pass of the season for me, I can't think of a better one? Feel free to Youtube me wrong. 

[scatman]

If he plays another ball like he did to Gerrard against the barcodes last season i'll take that all day.

It was the killer pass of the season for me, I can't think of a better one? Feel free to Youtube me wrong. 

dont agree with first part, but 2nd part definately pass of teh season, nice header from lucas to gerrard, back to him from gerrard then a wonderful pass for gerrard to run onto.

[Twelfth Customer]

If he plays another ball like he did to Gerrard against the barcodes last season i'll take that all day.

It was the killer pass of the season for me, I can't think of a better one? Feel free to Youtube me wrong. 

No that was sublime..

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

Every time I watch him, I watch to see if he gets muscled off the ball in a challenge.  Today he didn't get muscled like many other times...he did the muscling.  I liked some of the tackles he put in as well.  That ball off the ref was going to be a killer...you could just see what he was thinking.

he rarely gets muscled off the ball like you say
not sure where this myth came from

[Istanbulievable]

He was the main positive for me last night.

As a few people have said, it'll be very hard to find someone who plays how Xabi does so I think it's guna be a slight change in formation next season, with whoever is partnering Masch playing further forward than Xabi does.  I hope Xabi leaving is a blessing in disguise and his replacement(s) contribute more goals and assists.

This is the season for Lucas to show everyone what he's really about.

[JRC]

... His passing suffers in comparison to Xabi's ....

That's true of almost everyone else currently playing professionally, tbf

[Jägarn99]

he rarely gets muscled off the ball like you say
not sure where this myth came from

Just watch the games from previous seasons...

Still it is just preseason, he still need to look sharp in the PL if we loose Alonso and gets a player that is injured.

[BazC]

That's true of almost everyone else currently playing professionally, tbf

Yup, but then he also states that later in the same sentence you quote.   

It's important not to compare Xabi and Lucas *unless* he plays in a holding role. Which he won't. He'll play more advanced and his attacking talents will flourish, whereas his deficiencies in defence won't rear their heads as much.

[Raul!]

Yup, but then he also states that later in the same sentence you quote.   

It's important not to compare Xabi and Lucas *unless* he plays in a holding role. Which he won't. He'll play more advanced and his attacking talents will flourish, whereas his deficiencies in defence won't rear their heads as much.

Thanks for confirming that for me mate - I had to go back and check whether I had said that or not!

[macca888]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Lucas is going to be absolutely word class within a couple of seasons of starting regularly. He was easily the best player in the first half for me. I don't know about 2 yard passes, but he spread the play out really well a few times when it was really congested in the middle. One ball he played through to Dirk showed fantastic vision, and if that soft twat of a ref had been watching what he was doing, Lucas would have played the throughball of the night.

[BazC]

Thanks for confirming that for me mate - I had to go back and check whether I had said that or not!

Don't worry you're not going mad. 

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

Yup, but then he also states that later in the same sentence you quote.   

It's important not to compare Xabi and Lucas *unless* he plays in a holding role. Which he won't. He'll play more advanced and his attacking talents will flourish, whereas his deficiencies in defence won't rear their heads as much.

interesting because when mascher went venturing higher late last season alonso couldnt cope.

when we put mascher and lucas together who ever was left deeper coped.

alonso is a deep lying play maker who cant be relied upon to do a certain part of his job.

lucas can do the defensive side well despite what others say....ie.too many fouls etc

[shambles_uk]

This season could definately be the making of him. If he steps it up to a whole new level then he could be the answer. I hope Benitez let's him be the box-to-box midfielder that he is/was at Gremio.

I didn't see the game yesterday, but its good to see people praising him, rather than slating his every move.

[BazC]

interesting because when mascher went venturing higher late last season alonso couldnt cope.

when we put mascher and lucas together who ever was left deeper coped.

alonso is a deep lying play maker who cant be relied upon to do a certain part of his job.

lucas can do the defensive side well despite what others say....ie.too many fouls etc

No Alonso couldn't cope brilliantly well- purely because of his mobility. Lucas is more mobile but his tackles are often mistimed and it's as if he gets a rush of blood to the head. Unlike Xabi whose tackles are well timed and his ability to make space is 2nd to none.

Anyway, it shouldn't be often that Lucas is deeper than Mascherano- it makes no sense. Masch's job will be more defined next season to anchor midfield, cover the fullbacks who'll likely be more attack minded and drop deeper to help the defence out. He shouldn't find himself too far forward often. Lucas, on the other hand, will likely have the role of getting our attacking football moving along and keeping possession higher up the pitch along with Gerrard. He shouldn't be as far back as Xabi used to find himself because I don't think it'll work well with him there.

[Gerrard[LFC]]

it seems that since Alonso is going that everyone is hoping that Lucas will come through as part replacement, part different type of player who will do more attacking compared to alonso, but I am not sure if he will give similar influence like Alonso can, sure he can play neat passes but dont think that would be enough, especially the way we play.
I hope he proves me wrong but Rafa also thinks Lucas wont be enough and looking for replacement if Alonso is finally gone.
I hope not but we shall have to see. Hope everything clears up quick so whoever, whether it is Lucas and a new player coming in can get some preparations pre season and not disturb the balance.

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

No Alonso couldn't cope brilliantly well- purely because of his mobility. Lucas is more mobile but his tackles are often mistimed and it's as if he gets a rush of blood to the head. Unlike Xabi whose tackles are well timed and his ability to make space is 2nd to none.

Anyway, it shouldn't be often that Lucas is deeper than Mascherano- it makes no sense. Masch's job will be more defined next season to anchor midfield, cover the fullbacks who'll likely be more attack minded and drop deeper to help the defence out. He shouldn't find himself too far forward often. Lucas, on the other hand, will likely have the role of getting our attacking football moving along and keeping possession higher up the pitch along with Gerrard. He shouldn't be as far back as Xabi used to find himself because I don't think it'll work well with him there.

i think a lor of lucas "tackles" are just fouls to stop players getting thrpugh....some are mistimed but people are way over playing this card.

he reads the play better than most
he gets to the area of play more as a result

as for relying on mascher deeper ...imo this isnt going to a set thing.

rafa likes to mix it up.....sometimes having mascher just sitting  and other times letting him get in the faces of the opposition midfield high or low.

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

it seems that since Alonso is going that everyone is hoping that Lucas will come through as part replacement, part different type of player who will do more attacking compared to alonso, but I am not sure if he will give similar influence like Alonso can, sure he can play neat passes but dont think that would be enough, especially the way we play.
I hope he proves me wrong but Rafa also thinks Lucas wont be enough and looking for replacement if Alonso is finally gone.
I hope not but we shall have to see. Hope everything clears up quick so whoever, whether it is Lucas and a new player coming in can get some preparations pre season and not disturb the balance.

rafa changed things last season

better movement in forward areas....

alonso was important when we were more static because he would pick out a player say hugging the touch line.this would create a litte space and hopefully chances.

with movement that doesnt need to happen.and we started to create more and more chances.
the knock on efect was we could become more vulnerable in defence.

if we dont sort out those problems...............

[DeLeón]

not again:
according to brazilian newspapers lucas said yes to corinthians.

http://globoesporte.globo.com/Esportes/Noticias/Times/Corinthians/0,,MUL1253086-9862,00-NA+EUROPA+ANDRES+DIZ+TER+SIM+DE+LUCAS+E+AVISA+QUE+RONALDO+SE+APOSENTA+NO+TI.html