Author Topic: Arsene Wenger  (Read 9977 times)

Offline guest

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Arsene Wenger
« on: May 5, 2009, 09:12:17 pm »
How long does he have left at Arsenal?

You can call it a slight knee-jerk from me given the fact they are 3-0 at home in a European Cup semi-final (to a very good team, admittedly) but I think it's something that has to be asked now.

Tactically he is very naive, something which is apparent given the fact he has only reached two European Cup semi-finals in ten years. You only have to look at the 4-4 matches with us and Spurs this season to see he can't quite figure out the art of attacking and defending.

His purchases are questionable to say the least right now. Arshavin was a very, very good signing but clearly the squad needs a spine to it.

You can say this is just a transition period but this will be four years without a trophy now and five since the Premier League. They have regressed dramatically since 2004, arguably getting worse every year and he's clearly struggling to stop the rot.

How long until the board (and indeed, the fans) get fed up of him? Between 97 and 04 he was fantastic in England although still disappointing in Europe. He's been woeful ever since (although ironically has reached a European Cup semi and final in that time). He deserves to be treated with respect by the Arsenal fans and board for everything he's done but when is enough enough, and when do people start questioning whether the club is going forward anymore?

I think their fans think one season, all these kids such as Vela, Lansbury, Wiltshire et al will turn up and be world beaters playing fantastic, flowing football. I just don't see it happening overnight and if it does happen, it will be another few years developing. So he'll be pushing ten years without a Premier League title while other teams get stronger.

I know people will argue about his transfer budget and such but that aside, what can Arsenal do to halt their regression?

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #1 on: May 5, 2009, 09:15:10 pm »
The clock's ticking I reckon.
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #2 on: May 5, 2009, 09:15:40 pm »
He's done a brilliant job with the kids and he's done a good job over the years. Must be frustrating for the fans that they haven't replaced people like Viera and Henry. OK, well maybe they replaced Henry and they have plenty up front especially with Arshavin but they lack something in the centre of midfield. They really need to have a Mascherano, Frings, Essien type.
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Offline guest

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #3 on: May 5, 2009, 09:19:34 pm »
The clock's ticking I reckon.

I think this match tonight could be when the whole country realises that tactically, he's a bag of shite. He struggles to win two-legged fixtures regularly in Europe and there seems to be no shape to them.

Not to sound like an arl git but football is a bit different in 2009, especially in Europe, than ten or even five years ago. There has to be something tactical up there; and if not, then you best be a great motivator. He looks a broken man on the sidelines tonight whereas a Ferguson would be bollocking them or a Rafa would be bringing on Didi Hamann.

A bit like Ferguson really - builds very good teams and allows them to play football. I don't think he has the motivational skills of Ferguson though when they are in a rut, like the five-year one they are in now.

Offline FernandoTourettes

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #4 on: May 5, 2009, 09:19:40 pm »
They've been thumped tonight, but there form in the league since xmas has been pretty good. He's building (another) new team. They've had horrible injury problems this year too, Van Persie, Rosicky, Walcott, Fabregras and Eduardo to name a few and lets not forget the 4-4 was against us!

Wouldn't surprise me if they pushed us, Utd and Chelsea hard in the league next season.

Getting rid of Wenger would be an utter crime.

« Last Edit: May 5, 2009, 09:22:04 pm by FernandoTourettes »

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #5 on: May 5, 2009, 09:19:58 pm »
Give him money in the summer to buy experienced players. Tell him a title challenge and a trophy are necessary to keep his job. If he can't deliver they HAVE to fuck him off, but reckon the board love him cause he keeps getting them CL football without spending as much.
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #6 on: May 5, 2009, 09:20:10 pm »
Always pisses me off.

Rafa gets  the odd game wrong and gets panned from all sides.

Wenger does it on aregular basis, but it seems he's beyond reproach, because he's building an empire.

It seems he's untouchable.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #7 on: May 5, 2009, 09:24:41 pm »
Was having this very topic of conversation with a close friend whos an Arsenal fan, he was adamant he needs to stay.

My point was there's no doubt hes done wonders for the club as a whole, but at the end of the day he's not winning trophies and that should be his main priority.
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Offline gamble

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #8 on: May 5, 2009, 09:24:52 pm »
the jobs his as long as he wants, and he desperately wants the champions league.

part of me is gutted utd are in the final again, but part of me is also glad after he took the piss out of us winning it comparing us to millwall..

even fergie and fucking mike phelan outwitted him this time. what a flop.

Offline FernandoTourettes

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #9 on: May 5, 2009, 09:25:12 pm »
Always pisses me off.

Rafa gets  the odd game wrong and gets panned from all sides.

Wenger does it on aregular basis, but it seems he's beyond reproach, because he's building an empire.

It seems he's untouchable.

When Rafa wins the league, things will be different regarding his treatment in the press in my opinion. Im still hoping its this season.

Offline Alucard

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #10 on: May 5, 2009, 09:25:20 pm »
He's finished, I was surprised he didn't get the arse after last season but if he stays on for next season I don't even think they'll finish fourth, god help if Villa get their act together and stop falling to pieces. Apart from Arshavin he has been poor in the transfer market for a team meant to be challenging.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #11 on: May 5, 2009, 09:25:25 pm »
Leave him alone....in 2032 the current crop of of 3 year olds at Arsenal are gonna storm the league!!

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #12 on: May 5, 2009, 09:25:47 pm »
Arsene Wenger bought a lot of time in the seat, because of his early success. Lets just get that straight first. He has also built 3 good teams, two of which were excellent.

But the last 4 years haven't really seen the same success. The reason? They have never replaced Henry (not easy) and Viera (again not easy), but you do feel that they are missing that little bit extra to push them on.

I still stand that if Arsenal had Patrick Viera, then they would be an exceptional team. They really do lack that little bit of steel in the spine (as you rightly pointed out). I think it is a huge summer for Wenger, because a lot of these players should no longer be classified as kids. They are growing up.

If Wenger makes the big signing in the summer (a quality central midfielder, and a centre back) then maybe they will be up there with the best again. But we shall see.

Offline Bob Loblaw

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #13 on: May 5, 2009, 09:28:06 pm »
Well the board have no reasons to get rid, he spends fuck all yet gets his side into the CL money every season.

On the playing side, you wonder, if he wasn't there, would they crumble to an even further extent? He's got a knack of getting, by and large average player playing above themselves. And they've been going good for a while in the League now.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #14 on: May 5, 2009, 09:28:48 pm »
He will be off to Madrid now, if they still want him after this sort of shite.

Wouldnt be surprised, that with Barca in town at the moment little Cesc gets tapped up and goes this summer.
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Offline gamble

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #15 on: May 5, 2009, 09:31:08 pm »
one thing i did notice about this match is that how physical utd are compared to arsenal.

the old arsenal players had a bit more height and bite in them, he's lost the plot here. he never replaced viera. and their back 4 and keeper are shite. end of.

Offline MagicB8all

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #16 on: May 5, 2009, 09:32:07 pm »
Wenger's gotten stale, what upsets me now is we don't have it in our hands to stop them getting another treble
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #17 on: May 5, 2009, 09:32:55 pm »
Looks like Mr. Bean to me.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #18 on: May 5, 2009, 09:34:20 pm »

They very nearly won the European Cup Final in 2006.

And his net spend is about 57p a year.

I wish his teams would shoot occasionally though.
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #19 on: May 5, 2009, 09:36:04 pm »
He won't get sacked in my opinion.
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #20 on: May 5, 2009, 09:38:04 pm »
His job is to fund the Emirate Stadium by spend little, minimum of 4th in the league, and qualify for CL knockout stage. He is doing a brilliant job at that and I can't see how the board is going to sack him. The board and the fans has different objective and it is quite understandable that they judge the season performance on different criteria.

Offline courty61

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #21 on: May 5, 2009, 09:42:57 pm »
He won't get sacked but it is the old "One rule for Rafa, one rule for Arsene" syndrome again

If we don't win the league you can bet all the papers will be full of "well Benitez hasn't won a trophy since 2006"

I think the tell tale sign of it all is that Fergie is all nicey nice with him now- they used to HATE each other!
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #22 on: May 5, 2009, 09:43:51 pm »
His job is to fund the Emirate Stadium by spend little, minimum of 4th in the league, and qualify for CL knockout stage. He is doing a brilliant job at that and I can't see how the board is going to sack him. The board and the fans has different objective and it is quite understandable that they judge the season performance on different criteria.

But how long will they be happy with it?

Offline Wewonit6times

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #23 on: May 5, 2009, 09:44:13 pm »
I think the tell tale sign of it all is that Fergie is all nicey nice with him now- they used to HATE each other!

Indeed, the biggest compliment we've had this season is him starting on Rafa, long may it continue.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #24 on: May 5, 2009, 09:44:14 pm »
The fans are divided, some accept the board rational, some will give him one more season, some want him gone now. The board are exactly as TheRedBull said, 4th place and CL football will keep Arsene safe. Problem is, we may now be looking as 3rd place as vital considering the new CL rules

I'll give Arsene two more seasons since I know he tried to sign a dm last summer though I am exceedingly annoyed with his Fa Cup semi final lineup.

Offline TheRedBull

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #25 on: May 5, 2009, 09:45:27 pm »
But how long will they be happy with it?
Until they pay off all the loan? :P

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #26 on: May 5, 2009, 09:45:33 pm »
I think this match tonight could be when the whole country realises that tactically, he's a bag of shite. He struggles to win two-legged fixtures regularly in Europe and there seems to be no shape to them.

Not to sound like an arl git but football is a bit different in 2009, especially in Europe, than ten or even five years ago. There has to be something tactical up there; and if not, then you best be a great motivator. He looks a broken man on the sidelines tonight whereas a Ferguson would be bollocking them or a Rafa would be bringing on Didi Hamann.

A bit like Ferguson really - builds very good teams and allows them to play football. I don't think he has the motivational skills of Ferguson though when they are in a rut, like the five-year one they are in now.
Not much to argue with there, Wengers made his bed so to speak and he's now basically lying in it
To much faith in kids, who lack the experience and he lacks the management skills to give them that extra something for this type of game.

I'd suspect big money to be spent from arsenal in the summer
but to be fair who across Europe isn't looking for a decent center half, striker and a combatative central midfielder which they lack big time

You know the score K, you need a spine to a team and they just haven't got it.
when your backs against the wall, character plays a big part in getting you through tight situation's
take that sour faced twat down the lancs what he lacks in tactical nous he makes up for in instilling charter, belief and an arrogance into his teams
something we used to do and are slowly starting to recapture
next year will be our year even though i think we are 12 months behind were we should be.
and I can't see wengers arsenal being nothing more than also rans next season
if he is still there at all.

But looking at him their he does as you say, looks a broken man, to replace him is a big decision but in my mind it's one they'll have to make
but it's plain for all to see that his days are numbered.
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Offline Mango Jango

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #27 on: May 5, 2009, 09:45:53 pm »
If the boot was put on Rafa's feet, you could bet the whole of backpages tomorrow would be crying out for Rafa's blood... But I'm sure since it's Arsene, it would somehow be tempered a bit. Yes, the odd one or two would question his buys eg. why buy Nasri and Arshavin in the same year while what he really needed was the "water-carrier" ala Makalele, Mascherano etc.

In a perverse way, I feel it ought to teach him a lesson in humility - I still remember how he belittled Rafa's success in winning the Champions League Trophy, saying that it's a worthless cup that little teams can aim to win, or something like that. I think that's more of an "absolute contempt and arrogance" if there was any...

Anyway, I do think he would still stay at the Emirates provided his head hasn't been turned by Real Madrid etc.


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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #28 on: May 5, 2009, 09:46:11 pm »
The fans are divided, some accept the board rational, some will give him one more season, some want him gone now. The board are exactly as TheRedBull said, 4th place and CL football will keep Arsene safe. Problem is, we may now be looking as 3rd place as vital considering the new CL rules

I'll give Arsene two more seasons since I know he tried to sign a dm last summer though I am exceedingly annoyed with his Fa Cup semi final lineup.

I think he deserves all the respect in the world for what he's done mate - the sides between 1997 and 2004 were excellent and he did well to re-build one title-winning side into another.

But it must be a worry for your lot that it's five years with no sign of progression. In fact, everything points to a regression.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #29 on: May 5, 2009, 09:46:32 pm »
Think he deserves time. He's building a great side there.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #30 on: May 5, 2009, 09:47:02 pm »
Because he was held in such high regards by the Arsenal fans after the unbeaten season it gave him a platform to do whatever he liked, and so he decided to try and build a team from the ground up - from kids out of the academy rather than bring in not established players but those approaching their prime.

He's now dismantled his old side and failed to replace them with quality, the likes of Song, Diaby, and Eboue are dire at best and the likes of Denilson have failed to step up and be counted.  When a player started to settle after a long period they were let go: Hleb, Flamini and the replacements bought in will probably be sold as soon as they hit some form (Nasri).

He's more interested in his pet project than he is of Arsenal's immediate success.

Offline Libertine

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #31 on: May 5, 2009, 09:47:18 pm »
they have a potentially very tricky CL qualifier in august (minus nasri), if they can't negotiate that, the pressure might really build. other than that i'd say he'll be there a while yet.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #32 on: May 5, 2009, 09:48:33 pm »
It all depends on what they're objectives are, if they're happy finishing 4th/5th then they'll hang on to him. I can't see anyone doing better than him with the rabble that they have. They don't have enough money to bring in a manager and revamp the whole squad in a season. He needs to bring out the cheque book and actually buy a few decent players instead of trying to pick up kids who will be mediocre at best in 2-3 years.

Offline Cusamano

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #33 on: May 5, 2009, 09:48:51 pm »
He's been offered a job for life.

He can win fuck all in 5 years and he will still be around (if he wants)
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #34 on: May 5, 2009, 09:50:58 pm »
I think he deserves all the respect in the world for what he's done mate - the sides between 1997 and 2004 were excellent and he did well to re-build one title-winning side into another.

But it must be a worry for your lot that it's five years with no sign of progression. In fact, everything points to a regression.
And it worried David Dein as well that the model they first plan are too risky. That's why Dein try to bring investment in and clash with the board.

Offline Garstonite

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #35 on: May 5, 2009, 09:52:08 pm »
They will be the bestest team football has ever seen in three years.

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #36 on: May 5, 2009, 09:53:01 pm »
Their midfield has been their weak point for a few seasons now.
Fabregas is a fantastic player but they are missing a terrier
in midfield. Chelsea have Essien who also happens to be a terrific
all round footballer and Mikel, the Mancs have Anderson, Carrick etc in that role
and we have Mascherano / Alonso of course.
Wenger's reliance on the likes of Denilson to play the DM role at the age of 20 after Gilberto Silva and Edu left
the club and his over reliance on other inexperienced youths has been their downfall.
Losing Henry was another blow of course.
It's also worth noting that the move from Highbury to the much bigger pitch and surroundings
at the Emirates has surely had it's part to play in their recent demise also.
It's true to say that if Shankly had told us to invade Poland we'd be queuing up 10 deep all the way from Anfield to the Pier Head.

Offline courty61

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #37 on: May 5, 2009, 09:54:06 pm »
Think he deserves time. He's building a great side there.

Where have they been all season then? And tonight? And last week?! They only got 4 against us because we gave them on a plate!
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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #38 on: May 5, 2009, 09:56:27 pm »
John Peel once said he'd never let an Arsenal fan in his house.....so fuck you Arsene, fuck you, up their Arse(nal) luvvy duvvy media, fuck you Arsenal "Liverpool hoof the ball" fans.....I'm with Peel!

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Re: Arsene Wenger
« Reply #39 on: May 5, 2009, 09:56:29 pm »
Their midfield has been their weak point for a few seasons now.
Fabregas is a fantastic player but they are missing a terrier
in midfield. Chelsea have Essien who also happens to be a terrific
all round footballer and Mikel, the Mancs have Anderson, Carrick etc in that role
and we have Mascherano / Alonso of course.
Wenger's reliance on the likes of Denilson to play the DM role at the age of 20 after Gilberto Silva and Edu left
the club and his over reliance on other inexperienced youths has been their downfall.
Losing Henry was another blow of course.
It's also worth noting that the move from Highbury to the much bigger pitch and surroundings
at the Emirates has surely had it's part to play in their recent demise also.

They had Diarra but let him go