Author Topic: Some quality/important posts you may have missed  (Read 345213 times)

Offline noname

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #840 on: June 10, 2015, 12:52:41 PM »
The irony is that the Club became great precisely because what Rhi calls earthworms. We became great because we were basically never happy. A young Robbie Fowler walked of the pitch having scored five only to get a rollicking of Ronnie Moran for not getting six. Players medals were thrown at them and they were told they meant nothing as soon as the new season began they were last seasons medals and worthless.

Everyone was held to account, was expected to improve and the moment standards dropped they were history. That is how you become a great Club and how you win things. I think fans have this rose tinted view of the 70's and 80's that everyone at the Club went around patting each other on the back. It couldn't of been further from the truth and if anyone wasn't pulling their weight than us the supporters let them know.

When did that change and when did it become acceptable to basically give up. The owners haven't got the bottle or desire to push boundaries and compete, the manager made a selection surrender at Madrid and the players rolled over and got walked over by a 3rd rate Stoke side. What is the reaction oh it's par for the course. We don't have the right to compete at the top table anymore, then the owners pick on a couple of easy targets in Marsh and Pascoe and we look to sign free transfers.

When as a Club did it become okay to become soft, get walked all over and make excuses.

Something isn't right and instead of addressing it we talk ourselves down and make pathetic feeble lily livered excuses. As fans we get the Club we deserve and if we don't wake from this melancholic acceptance and let the people running the club know that surrendering against Madrid and rolling over against Stoke isn't acceptable then we will deserve everything we get.
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Offline macca888

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #841 on: June 23, 2015, 12:26:48 AM »
One of the finest and most poignant posts you'll ever read on here. Fuck all about football but all about the socialism our club was founded on being eroded.


It occurs to me (after seeing Fats on that youtube video above, for some reason)  that at some future date, their will be an update on the 'Four Yorkshireman' sketch but it will probably cause more tears of sadness than tears of laughter. It will probably go something like this.........

1st Old Man:   When I were a lad, our dad worked a 42 and a half our week, every week mind, manufacturing cars that were sold all over t' world, and every summer we were off t' Marbella for two weeks in t' sun.

2nd Old Man:    Two weeks! My dad got four weeks annual leave, fully paid, and he got a Christmas hamper every year off t' boss.

3rd Old Man:    Christmas hamper, Ha! My mam and dad both had Christmas bonuses and at t' works Christmas do me dad got so drunk he fell over and broke leg. But ambulance were there within twenty minutes an' he were off to hospital fer free treatment and physiotherapy, while getting full sick pay an' 'elp wi' rent for t' council house.

4th Old Man:   Twenty minutes waiting for ambulance! Eight minutes I had to wait when I had crash on me way to pick kids up from school gymnasium.

1st Old Man:    Gym-bloody-nasium! Our school had massive sportsfield wi' athletics track, football and rugby pitch and school bus t' ferry t' kids about. Kids used t' play footy ev'ry spare moment they had, an ev'ry Saturday they'd go to watch local team at t' stadium.

2nd Old Man:   Aye team manager lived stone's throw from t' ground and younguns from t' first team lived in flat above t' shops. Well banks wouldn't lend money unless you could afford t' pay it back, so everyone lived within means an' no one were in debt.

3rd Old Man:   Banks! We didn't need banks. We got cash in t' 'and ev'ry Thursday, didn't 'ave bank charges, or fatcats living off the poor.

4th Old Man:   Right! My mam and dad both had full time (thirty-six hour a week) jobs with five weeks full paid annual leave, which paid enough money to put real food on t' table, and a couple of holidays abroad. The NHS gave full treatment free of charge to everyone with free prescriptions, and th'ambulances turned up on time ev'ry time. Ev'ry time you set foot outside o' door o' yer three bedroomed council house (wi' spare room) you saw Bobby on t' beat. Uncle Albert (him wi' one leg since t' war) had employment rights and expectations like ev'ryone else and got special 'elp wi' mobility  and such like. Kids all went to a good school with manageable class sizes and when they left school they all got real jobs manufacturing British goods that were exported all around t' world. Politicians took decisions that were f't' benefit of all not just them 'as voted for 'em, and public utilities was owned by us and used as employment sink so no-one had t' go wi'out work.

1st Old Man:    Aye but you try telling that t' younguns nowadays...........
 
 

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Offline kavah

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Offline 24/7

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #843 on: August 20, 2015, 10:48:25 AM »
Want to see more of this please and less of the doom-mongering.

2 games in, 2 wins, 2 clean sheets. Only 3 shots on target faced meaning that we have the best defencive record in the league. The only thing you can possibly criticise is the fact that we've only scored 2 goals but even then that's moaning for the sake of moaning when we sit 3 points ahead of Arsenal and 5 ahead of Chelsea and Spurs

We went to Stoke and did the job. We got battered last season so we went there and changed that. We were tight, we had fight about us and in the end we won through a wonder goal. Overall we deserved to win

Bournemouth came to Anfield and did what every team that comes to Anfield does. They played out of their skin in what is probably the biggest league game in the history of the club. They had a goal correctly, yes correctly, ruled out early on and after the adrenaline wore off in the 1st 20 minutes we were massively on top. Yeah we scored and it should have been ruled out but then again Coutinho should have scored on his left and Henderson was very unlucky to hit the bar from the corner routine. Other than the disallowed goal did Bournemouth create anything in the 1st half? 2nd half comes around and they start brightly again but when they fail to create any clear chances they drop back and it allows us to take control again. We should have wrapped it up when Benteke saw his effort pushed onto the bar but we never and that meant that the last 10-15 minutes where cagey from us and we sat back happy with the 1-0 win and they got around our box a couple of times, once hitting the outside of the post

Overall, we defended very well again, Mignolet had nothing to worry him and dealt with crosses/corners well and we got the goal that won the game. Yeah we should be beating Bournemouth at home easily but then again Chelsea should be beating Swansea at home easily, Arsenal should be beating West Ham at home and Spurs the same with Stoke. It doesn't happen every time

So can we stop with all this shit about Arsenal twatting us on Monday and get behind the team and manager. 36 more 1-0 wins and we've won the league comfortably  8)
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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #844 on: September 16, 2015, 02:07:43 PM »
Regarding 2008/09, since Steven Gerrard has brought it up: it’s disappointing, if undeniably predictable (given that the frosty relationship between player and manager which seems to be so faithfully outlined in the book was obvious for most of their time together) to read him make so much of something that meant so little, but let us be fair and even-handed here at least. He is of course entitled to his opinion without being insulted, but so are we. The quotes I’ve seen so far show clear evidence of tunnel vision. I wonder does he acknowledge in his book, for example, the fact that he and Fernando Torres were only able to line up together in 14 out of Liverpool’s 38 League games that season, or make the comparison to Manchester United who were able to call on Wayne Rooney (signed for £25m as a teenager four years earlier), Cristiano Ronaldo (on his way to obliterating the world transfer record in an £80m+ move to Real Madrid), Dimitar Berbatov (signed for £32m that season) and Carlos Tevez (a £30m+ player who, as I recall, eventually left Old Trafford primarily because he wasn’t guaranteed first-team football)? I doubt it, but it might reflect better on him if he did.

Rafa Benítez admittedly made some poor signings, as virtually every manager does, particularly towards the end of his time at Liverpool (but, I would argue, without sufficient finances to paper over those mistakes), and he had the option to keep £19m Robbie Keane that January as cover despite him clearly never really fitting into the team. But when you can’t pay Peter Crouch and Craig Bellamy enough to keep them happy sitting on the bench (both subsequently stated that the issue of first-team football is why they left Anfield) and you’re left with no choice but to find replacements in the same bargain bin populated by a blonde, ponytailed Ukrainian with a penchant for denim and a timid, ineffectual French youngster, the two signed for a combined fee of £1.5m, then losing the title by four points (and building a team that would ultimately be ranked number one in Europe around the same time) seems like a minor miracle in itself, especially when you’re only able to field the most lethal strikeforce in the League (arguably in Europe at the time), the fulcrum of your team, in less than 40 per cent of your games and you’re going up against a club with four of the best attacking talents in the world to choose between (it’s often called Ferguson’s second great team for a reason: because it was great).

These are factors that render connections between the infamous pre-Stoke press-conference in January 2009 and Liverpool not winning the title a few months later thoroughly moot. We have seen the statistics that Liverpool’s points per game and goals per game statistics actually improved afterwards, but even that doesn’t matter nearly as much as the fact that when Liverpool won 4-1 at Old Trafford in March 2009, Manchester United had Paul Scholes, Ryan Giggs, Berbatov and Nani sitting on the bench. Liverpool, by contrast, had the relatively inexperienced Lucas Leiva deputising for the absent Xabi Alonso, 36 year-old Sami Hyypia filling in for Alvaro Arbeloa at short notice and Jamie Carragher moving to right-back where he hadn’t played regularly for five years or more. Manchester United had a marked advantage over Liverpool in terms of squad depth, and whether you blame the manager’s signings for that or the amount of money made available to him for transfers (and I personally would lean more towards the latter than the former, though both were undeniable influences), it was this factor that eventually saw Liverpool fall short, nothing else. As Rafa Benítez himself once said, “you cannot win mind games if you have a bad team…it’s easy to talk about mind games when he has a good team and he has won, and that was the case”.

Granted, I obviously wasn’t in the Liverpool dressing-room in the days and weeks following the press-conference, but common sense nonetheless makes it difficult for me to believe that Champions League winners like Alonso, Gerrard, Hyypia and Carragher, Argentina captain and double Olympic champion Javier Mascherano, and European Champions Pepe Reina and Torres (and Alonso again) would have been adversely affected to any great degree by their manager’s comments, especially when the Manchester United players had been listening to worse from their own boss for years (I wonder how Steven Gerrard would have reacted, for example, had Rafa ever said that he’s “from Liverpool and everyone from that city has a chip on their shoulder”?) Furthermore, Stoke was a ground where they themselves had only narrowly escaped with a 1-0 win a couple of weeks earlier in a game which might have seen both Rooney and Ronaldo sent off for violent conduct (the former for throwing an elbow, the latter for kicking out at an opponent) long before they managed to fashion a winner. Even then, Liverpool (without Torres for much of the game, who was returning from yet another injury, and Alonso for all of it) hit the woodwork twice and might have won with a little luck.

Steven Gerrard would appear to disagree, and that’s fine. I don’t believe that he or his ghost writer are sensationalising anything to sell books, I think it’s clear from the bits and pieces I’ve read that this is how he really feels. The quotes I’ve seen also lead me to wonder whether there is a connection between “I can pick up the phone and speak to all of my previous Liverpool managers” and Gérard Houllier’s comment in 2010 that “after Rafa Benítez left this summer, one of the players sent me a message. He said, ‘Boss, he hasn’t beaten you.’” They also pretty much confirm my long-held suspicion that when Henry Winter (who co-wrote his first biography) welcomed the Liverpool manager’s exit in June 2010 with a relish that appeared thoroughly at odds with his position as a supposedly objective writer and journalist, he was simply channelling the Liverpool captain’s own feelings. In fact, I would suggest that the following paragraph wouldn’t look at all out of place in this latest biography: “Now that this cold political animal has gone, Anfield requires a manager who can empathise with players, who understands they are human beings as well as professional footballers. Sometimes players need a boss who asks after their family or tells them ‘well done’”. And who doesn’t say anything out of line in press-conferences, of course.

“One time he did suffer a meltdown involving Manchester United and Mr. Ferguson…I was grabbing the couch, digging my fingers into the arms, feeling embarrassed for him. When I met up with England all the Manchester United players told me Fergie was just laughing at Rafa, saying: ‘I’ve got him. I’ve got him.’”

So what if they did? So what if he was? Any objective, clear-eyed analysis with the benefit of even two months’ hindsight would have concluded exactly the opposite once Ferguson rose to his opposite number’s bait after Liverpool’s 4-1 victory at Old Trafford in March and admitted putting his club’s sports technology department to work to disprove the claim that “the difference between us is maybe £100m spent on players and a big stadium”. Even Patrick Barclay, not noted for his love of either Liverpool or Benítez, acknowledged that “you don’t need a sports technology department to know how wrong the United manager is, just the back of a cigarette pack.” And the conclusion as to who truly “got” who would have only been underlined a few weeks later when Ferguson and Sam Allardyce bizarrely joined forces to fabricate charges of disrespect against Benítez based on the most innocuous of (self-deprecating) hand gestures during a 4-0 win over Blackburn in what had all the hallmarks of a coordinated attack.

“It seemed so unlike Rafa to talk in such an emotional way. You could see the anger in him”.

Er, no, no you couldn’t. This is just demonstrably false. You could tell he was nervous and outside of his comfort zone, but emotional? Angry? “Meltdown”? Absolutely not. This wasn’t, contrary to popular belief, a Kevin Keegan-style rant. Keegan, already broken under the pressure as he would be again a few years later in the Wembley tunnel as outgoing England manager, reacted to prompting from Richard “Did you smash it?” Keyes after the penultimate game of a season which was already basically over and let rip with a wide-eyed tirade, voice cracking, finger jabbing towards the camera. Benítez was led by nobody, made no physical gestures and never once raised his voice. There was nothing spontaneous about it; it couldn’t have been more deliberate had he been reading from a typed, bullet-pointed list…oh right, he was. One man had meticulously sketched out a plan of attack, the other just snapped. That’s the difference between an emotional response and a calculated one.

“He then railed against the fixture list and the timing of matches being skewed in United’s favour. Rafa was sounding muddled and bitter and paranoid. He was humiliating himself. It was a disaster.”

Hang on now, who was it that “railed” against the fixture list again? As recently as a week before the contentious press-conference, Ferguson, an arch-purveyor of the “siege mentality” approach, had stated the following: “I’ve been saying this for a few months, but our programme didn’t do us any favours and I think we have been handicapped by the Premier League in the fixture list. They tell me it’s not planned. I’ve got my doubts. I’m not saying what they do down there, but next year we will be sending somebody to see how it happens, I can assure you. I just don’t understand how you can get the fixtures like that.” The part in bold would appear to carry an implicit accusation of corruption, one that the Liverpool manager was, in part, responding to, so I would love to ask Steven Gerrard to expand on who was truly sounding “muddled and bitter and paranoid” at that time, or why it’s not ok or even embarrassing or humiliating for one manager to speak about Ferguson’s behaviour towards referees but it’s fine for others to do so (afterwards, incidentally, Graham Poll, a retired referee himself, stated that “Rafa Benítez has articulated what referees have been thinking for years – that Mr. Ferguson can say what he wants about them and the FA will allow him to get away with it”).

Back in 2005, in comments that evoked what the Liverpool manager would say of Manchester United some four years later (“they are always going man-to-man with the referees, especially at half-time when they walk close to the referees and they are talking and talking”), José Mourinho stated after the first-leg of a League Cup semi-final that “I know the referee didn’t walk to the dressing rooms alone at half-time…maybe when I turn 60 and have been managing in the same league for 20 years and have the respect of everybody I will have the power to speak to people and make them tremble a little bit”. Which was perhaps fair enough, unlike his baseless accusations of corruption which resulted in death threats to Anders Frisk and his family in 2005, or making more veiled charges of corruption involving Barcelona and UNICEF and gouging Tito Vilanova’s eye in 2011, or spending much of his second spell in charge of Chelsea shouting about conspiracies against his team. Sounds pretty muddled, bitter and paranoid to me. Steven Gerrard’s view? “For me, the ideal situation would obviously have been for Mourinho to have managed Liverpool”. Good grief.

“I couldn’t understand Rafa’s thinking in wanting to take on Ferguson, a master of mind games, when we were sitting so calmly on top of the table early into a new year”.

Well then Benítez, whenever he comes to write a biography himself, will no doubt be forgiven for expressing a similar failure to understand why his captain and most important player was out drinking and becoming involved in needless physical confrontations and landing himself on affray charges “when we were sitting so calmly on top of the table” (after a 5-1 away win). As for the “master of mind games” bit, there is no greater evidence of how large a grain of salt with which any reader of this book should take many of the opinions contained therein. He’ll make a fantastic English football pundit someday, Steven Gerrard, no doubt about it (assuming that Brendan Rodgers or a future successor doesn’t assign him that coveted coaching role at the club). He’s already drank the Ferguson Kool-Aid, which seems to afford automatic entry to the pundit club in and of itself. Never has the process of acting like a dickhead, sounding like a dickhead and, generally, just being a dickhead been given such a lofty title as Alex Ferguson’s “mind games”, and these people just queue up to regurgitate it.

Of course, a cursory glance through Ferguson’s “greatest hits” would tell you that Liverpool won the title handily in 1988 following his statement about Anfield that he could understand why teams “have to leave here choking on their own vomit, biting their tongue, afraid to tell the truth” (and Kenny Dalglish’s withering “you’ll get more sense out of her” response); Blackburn won the title in 1995 after he stated that they would have to do a “Devon Loch” to lose it; and Arséne Wenger won the double a season after he called him “a novice” who “should keep his opinions to Japanese football”, following up by clinching another title at Old Trafford in 2002 and going undefeated in 2004 as Ferguson protested that “they are scrappers who rely on belligerence – we are the better team”. Even Keegan in 1996, reacting to comments that Leeds and Notts. Forest wouldn’t try a leg against Newcastle, wasn’t a proper victim since the title was already gone by the time he snapped, due to his team’s utter inability to defend. And as for Rafa, well, he wasn’t putting members of his own staff to work refuting anything his opponent was saying or getting some other manager to fight his corner.

It’s an odd one. Ultimately the lesson from what I’ve read would appear to be that it doesn’t matter what you say or do as long as you end up winning in the end. “Fighting with the board, other managers and the press wasn’t the Liverpool way” he says (did Rafa ever really fight with the press, incidentally?), and yet calling a respected manager like Wenger “a novice” (or, perhaps, a “specialist in failure”), not speaking to the national broadcaster for years or poking a finger into another coach’s eye (literally fighting) all appears to be acceptable behaviour because there were trophies to show for it and because, as he says of Mourinho, “he created a special bond with each squad he managed…you heard it in the way his players spoke about him…I understood how they felt because they had shared such a big moment in their careers together…I never had that with Rafa Benítez. I would have had it with José Mourinho”. I wonder if that, then, is Rafa’s defining failure in Steven Gerrard’s eyes: that he wasn’t Mourinho? If so, it’s no surprise that so many of us are at odds with him on this one.

In truth, we can sit here and wonder all day, wonder why some behaviours are ok and some aren’t, wonder what Steven Gerrard must think of Pep Guardiola, for example, and whether it would have been more acceptable for Rafa Benítez, instead of reading out a list of “facts” in January 2009, to say of Ferguson that “in this room, he's the fucking chief, the fucking man, the person who knows everything about the world and I don’t want to compete with him at all. It’s a type of game I'm not going to play because I don't know how. Off the pitch, he has already won, as he has done all year. On the pitch, we'll see what happens”. On such matters we have but two options: (a) buy his book and find out, or (b) read his view of Mourinho that “the Liverpool fans would have loved him” and save our twenty quid.

E2K in the Gerrard thread.

Offline The 92A

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #845 on: September 16, 2015, 02:11:57 PM »
Just beat me to it

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #846 on: September 16, 2015, 02:18:34 PM »
Just beat me to it

As if you would have said all that.
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Offline cookie-monster

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #847 on: October 14, 2015, 04:56:57 PM »
I think that the mods should seriously look into prohibiting war comments even if it is humor. RAWK is probably the most frequented football related football forum in England if not the world, and it's impossible to vet who is watching what.

We have the habit of shooting ourselves in the foot, and this cannot be allowed to take off. not even as humor.

Please keep in mind that Germans are extremely sensitive on ww2. It's a hated and unwanted boulder that they have to carry for eternity, even if it was perpetrated by 2/3 generations ago. I have seen 5 year old German children on a school day out with their teacher at Dacau concentration camp. They were all noisy and frisky outside, but suddenly they turned dead silent and I could see in their eyes and faces that they were aware of something understood only by adults under normal circumstances.

Inside there are informative stations in 2 languages, English and German. The German version says much more then the English one, as if it is intended to make sure that there is no doubt in the German visiting minds as to what really happened there.

WW2 and what was perpetrated in it had incredible effects that destroyed lives, families, and even nations, with ramifications lasting to this very day around the world. So please think before joking about it.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #848 on: November 3, 2015, 10:17:57 PM »
I thought this was a bit of a cracker from the Supporters Committee meeting with FSG thread...

I'd like to add my view into the knowledge of the people who do work for this cause to keep the local people, especially the youngsters, in close touch with the club. At first it's probably important to let everybody know where I come from, even if it might be relatively easy to make a good guess because of the way I write in english - or maybe not, it's impossible to say when you're a foreigner.

Anyway, I've begun my fantastic trip with the club in the early 80's when I was way less than ten years old. It's funny nowadays to hear the young footballers dreaming to one day play for LFC, I couldn't even dream to see the team play at Anfield! It was just unimaginable. I've been there a good few times now, fulfilling my dream that was not even a dream in the beginning.

First time I went to see a game at Anfield was around ten years ago, and I have to say that a lot has changed during these years. The biggest difference for a tourist would be the pubs close to the stadium. When I first got there those pubs were packed but mostly by the English supporters, obviously I can't tell if it was locals or not but the atmosphere was amazing with all the singing and chanting. I think there's no need to write here how it's changed during the years, but it was very different last time I was there, and of course, not in a good way.

It's well known that the atmosphere has changed a lot inside the stadium and during the games, too, but I have to admit that I've never got the tickets for the big games. The biggest must have been when we played Man City early in the season and Lucas put Yaya into his back pocket... 1-1 draw it was and still a great game with very good atmosphere, but the whole thing around my trip had already changed.

It seems I just can't write shortly, sorry for that, but I try to get to the point now. For me, as a 'tourist', even if a 'hard core lifelong boyhood supporter' who I think I am, the local people around the club are the main thing. I want to be the outsider who's got a rare chance to see this mystery stadium and the team with all the exitement the local supporters bring into it. The locals singing in the pubs before and after games, and of course during the games at the stadium. To have a chat with local supporters to get to know what these LFC specialists think of the team and the way it plays, the difficulties to understand a word they say and this frightening feeling when they ask you something and you need to ask for the third time what was that they actually meant with the question.

All the above would be needed to make a perfect trip to Anfield to see my heroes play. And to make it possible now and in the future, the club should really pay attention to what the Supporters Committee has to say. I agree with all that was said in the first post (well, all I wanted to say could've actually been written with these few words...), and I ask all the people involved to be strong and continue these efforts. The young generation is the key. The main thing for me is that the owners might not see that even for us foreigners it would be very important that when we get there, we want to see mainly local people in and around the stadium. We are ready to wait to get the tickets even if it takes years, especially because nowadays we can watch every game from tv or through internet. But if we'll only find other tourists over there, what's the point to make the trip at all?

So, all my best for the hard work to give the locals a chance to remain as the spine inside Anfield. There are too many of us foreigners in every game already, and something has to be done to save the club and all the exitement in travelling to Liverpool to see LFC play.

Edit: just realized how long a story I wrote... I try to make them shorter in the future...


Offline Callaghan.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #849 on: November 16, 2015, 08:31:37 PM »
Not important, but quality. Not about Liverpool either, it's about Viz magazine (in 2009):

Seems to have gone downhill in the last year.
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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #850 on: November 16, 2015, 11:46:01 PM »
Nope. Over my head.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #851 on: February 5, 2016, 02:42:34 PM »
So, do I or don’t I?

Before we cover that off lets set a scene. Granted that whatever is painted is done with the brush of the artist therefore it’s what I want you to see. That bias I cannot remove such is the way of the world but hopefully by the end we all have food for thought in regards to all that is going on.

Ticket prices are changing. Depending on where you sit some will be heavily impacted and others may see things go down or up slightly. Season ticket holders are in or out of pocket and members who qualify for bulk sales are going to enter the gunfight for the Kop seats that haven’t really changed price. Everybody else will have to pay more on the face of this give or take a few rows around the ground in other stands.

There has been much in the way of efforts to try and ticket prices to come down. We’ve taken a lot of hits along the way and just accepted them and continually sleepwalked into each change it feels. Premier League matches can cost £50 and over but the corresponding league cup fixture against the same team is half that price (Chelsea away springs to mind… twice!). What do we do? We take it. Because the club know we will take it. They know our emotional connection to need to see the team play is like a drug and we are like junkies. They know it and love it. They must do – they know how to push the buttons like nobody else.

So they push another button. The multi-coloured one that changes seats, categories, tiers into a rainbow with a pot of gold at the end for Liverpool Football Club. Once again those emotions are challenged and the drug seems to be getting away from us. Like junkies we clamour again to cling on to the very thing we’ve expected to be ok…getting a ticket to go the game. I must add it’s not a privilege to be able to get a ticket. Season ticket holders or members that have the ability to go to a match balance that with the cost every single time going home or away.

Members tickets. It’s right royal pain truth be told. Members sales are littered with tales of frustration and woe. Away days are near impossible to get a foot in the door and European matches away worse still. We still do it. We still cry and emotionally drain ourselves twice a year and see the money leave. Now more will leave and an online system more frail than Liverpool hamstrings leave us at the peril of baskets unfulfilled. The sting in the tail will be at the end of the whole process post the aforementioned turmoil only this time it will cost more. More because someone says so. More because you know you’ll do it somehow. More because they know that too.

Lets think for a while though. What if you can’t pay more? What if each season you’ve gone through the whole twice yearly process to buy home games and already know it was hard. I suspect if you rang up to complain you’d get through to the following automated message after “you have been charged for this call”.

   “thank you for calling Liverpool Football Club, your call is important to us. Should you wish to buy tickets please don’t press one. You previously pressed two to register your dismay at the price increases. Liverpool Football Club wishes to inform you that you can’t come if you can’t pay. You can’t pay so you can’t go. You may have come for many years and now will cry many tears but You. Can’t. Come. Please hang up and try again later”

But what can you try for? Category C because you’re worth it? The autocup scheme is no longer your friend either with price changes so the marketplace for tickets is no longer a place where you’re welcome. What do you do? You’re alone it seems because “I’m Alright, Jack” from anywheretown can go but not you. Isn’t football supposed to be affordable for all?

“Don’t like the prices? Don’t buy” I hear them say. Allow me please to explain. Habitually people have been going to matches for a very long time. Even before memberships and fan cards came along. From near and far I’d like to add before someone pops along with any localised references here. Ask yourself this – does someone who’s been going for the last 10/20/30 years deserve to feel unwelcome now? Do we just go “soz abaar you” because they haven’t got the money? Does that actually feel good to do that to your fellow comrade? The Liverpool I’ve come to know and love didn’t exclude anyone and I should know this more than many… I’ve experienced looking and being different all my life!  I’ve never felt more at home than sitting with those who love supporting our club through thick and thin.

“But think of the cheaper seats” I hear them say. Again how many actually are there? Refer back to turmoil of online sales. Add turmoil of a world renowned ticket office that tells us things later rather than earlier. Add more turmoil when it dawns upon us all that there aren’t a lot of these seats and robbing Peter to pay Paul didn’t actually happen. Both Peter and Paul have been fleeced!

“We need it to be competitive”, I hear someone heckle. Well that’s worked. A while back I wrote that for all the off field progress in revenue streams we’ve not seen that translate to performances on the pitch. The internet is full of rage these days of persons pitted against players then pitted against each other and then the beauty of this rage manifests itself in the almighty Twitter poll (or RT for x and like for y). Something is wrong in all that. A preaching of hate to cure hate doesn’t really work I guess.

“We need to move with the times”. Pardon my French but you can fuck that shit right off. Have you seen what these times may lead to? I’m leaving economics aside as I’m sure by the time you finish reading this we’ll have someone else as our new preferred car battery supplier. These times you talk of have resulted in half and half scarves, staff to fly flags and don’t get me started on things left on seats for you as you arrive novelties. Our times have been expressed on a Kop that is beginning to ebb away. Already rinsed by photography and marketing material, it’s a surprise they haven’t attempted getting sponsor logos as banners. Could you imagine it? Bob Paisley’s huge flag in the middle of the Kop with “sponsored by Burger King” brandished somewhere… we’d become home of the Whopper indeed!

What’s all this got to do then with the boycott? Well, everything. By changing the dynamic of what comes to the game now we shape the future. Is where we are now really where we want to be? Do you really think everything that you see around you is because of Out of Towners vs Locals and atmosphere on its arse due to that? It really isn’t. It’s probably more akin to the fact that should you not be able to afford the current prices then you can’t go. You’ve been priced out a long time ago or are soon to be priced out. You who had been going for such a long time. You who have experienced highs and lows. You who’s been brought up on Liverpool Football Club. You who’s been let down by the ones next to you?

It’s not survival of the fittest here folks. WE are Liverpool Football Club. From the regulars who trek over 4 hours week in week out to get home or away to the first timer drawn to the Kop and “that” atmosphere. The very atmosphere that’s being served notice because mark my words when you make it so that’s it’s not affordable for all then it soon becomes nothing to see at all.

We’ve taken stances before against all odds and won. We owe it to all those who are impacted to be as one with them. I’ve heard many say this won’t have an impact. We won’t know until we try. You may read this and think that so long as you can afford it you’re ok or that you’re not really impacted as you don’t go enough to be. It’s not a time to be thinking of just yourself, truth be told.

You may be someone going for the very first time. This makes leaving even harder. I hear you. My first time was magic. I wouldn’t want anyone to feel any different about their first time to Anfield. I would say this though. This may be your only time. For someone else it’s already become a last time and it happened without us realising too late. What if that person was you?

Whatever happens tomorrow no-one should be chastised for staying. Emotions are a difficult thing. Hopefully the next time the spirit grows.



Offline One of those

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #852 on: March 11, 2016, 12:53:08 PM »
From the UEFA tie with MUFC post-match thread.

Have to hold my hands up here and admit that I didn’t hear any of these chants / songs from the Utd fans about the ‘S*n was Right’ – but that was purely down to how loud the Anny Road was !  We were in the Upper Anny Road, right by where the BT crew were and it was quite comical as you could see the expressions on Scholes’ and Rio’s faces close up as they saw their team being dismantled in front of their eyes.  I could hear the ‘Fergie’s Right, Your Fans are Shite’ chants loud and clear, and genuinely thought they were due to the fact that their lot were virtually silent throughout the game ….. it was only after I got home and watched the highlights at 2am on BT that I realised what they had been chanting.

Anyway …. On to the main reason for my post ……

I’ve been a Liverpool fan for more years than I care to count and I’ve spent many a happy day standing (and sitting) as part of all four stands of our famous ground, and I have no doubt bored my kids to tears on numerous occasions about the atmosphere that made the hair stand up on the back of my neck …… the occasions that really gripped my soul and wouldn’t let go.  My wife experienced it back in April 1996 when Collymore hit the last gasp winner against Keegan’s Newcastle from a spot roughly 40 yards in front of where we were standing with our hearts in our mouths, barely able to catch our breath.

I bring my kids as often as I can get tickets now to Anfield more in hope than expectation that they will get chance to experience that special atmosphere that truly hits you like no other.  Sitting at work prior to the game yesterday I could feel it building – there was a definite tension.  On the drive towards the ground, I mentioned it to the kids ……. ‘Tonight is the night, lads – it’s against ‘them

Suffice to say that we took our seats in the Upper Anfield Road and took in the sight of the rest of the ground …. But particularly the Kop.  Obviously there was the usual flag waving, songs and chants, but then it started ……
‘When You Walk, Through A Storm ….’

I looked to my left at my kids and I knew, and what’s more, they knew …… it had got them.   Totally and utterly.  Heart and soul.  100%.  If there had been any doubt before, there was none now.  I could see it in their eyes.  They had never felt it like this before – yes, they had been to games, good exciting games.  Games with good atmosphere, but this was different.  This was visceral …… and this will stay with them forever.

The absolute best rendition of our anthem I have seen, heard and been part of …. Maybe ever ?  How many times did the chorus repeat ? In my heart it’s still going on now.

To all of you who helped make it happen, I salute you.

Thank you.


* * * * *

Offline Alf Garnett!

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #853 on: May 9, 2016, 11:28:42 AM »
Yes. This.

Also, I'd like to add a word of warning to anybody who hasn't watched it yet: this film makes for a really difficult and uncomfortable viewing. I felt a tightening across my chest at certain moments last night, especially during the first hour. I've never suffered from panic attacks or anything like that; however, watching certain parts of this film brought back memories of being on a packed football terrace during the 1980s. I was lucky that day in April 1989, I was in the North Stand but had mates on Leppings Lane. I didn't experience half of what they went through, but it takes little imagination to put yourself in that end, behind that goal. With those unlawfully killed people. Even on the Anfield Kop, during the early 80s as a kid, I've had that feeling that the pressure was never going to cease and that I could be crushed against the barrier. A fleeting thought that was easily repressed because of past experience: you knew it would eventually ease off. Somebody older, more experienced, would highlight your plight, make space so you could manoeuvre your way clear from the worst of it. Or you could duck under the barrier if need be. Get your back against that firm steel holding back the pressure of the sway and the push. You'd catch up with your mates later. You knew they'd be okay too.

Think that's why I instinctively held my hand against my chest watching it last night during the scenes behind the goal. The Missus was alarmed for a second. Even though I was lucky not to be on Leppings Lane, (long story) I can still imagine being on that terrace. Up until yesterday, I could never really imagine those fans' final moments. Still really can't. However, this film comes as close as anything to giving you the chance to do so. It's that harrowing. Don't watch if you're easily upset or easily distressed. The warnings beforehand don't fully capture this film's power, or ability to put you at the heart of this tragedy. I don't know what it was like to watch for people who didn't attend the game that day. To be on that pitch within minutes of the players leaving for the changing rooms, like I was, looking for friends, arguing with ineffectual police, trying your best to be of help...It was extraordinary powerful and emotional. For me, this was the most difficult watch on the whole subject I've seen in 27 years.

And that's just the first half. What the families went through is incomprehensible.   

What this film also reveals, and it can't be stated enough: this tragedy occurred because those poor people being crushed to death on the Leppings Lane terrace were not thought of as human beings by the authorities, with a range of inalienable human rights. They were football fans first. Human beings second. A striking distinction during the 1980s. Something you took for granted as you travelled the length and breadth of the country back then. And something you rarely questioned, unless you wanted a copper's truncheon waved in yer face. As a football fan, your were stripped of most of your rights. That's why people were allowed to die. That they were from Liverpool, or associated in some way with the city, made the task of blaming the fans easier. We were reviled by Thatcher's government. A city fit to fall into managed decline...Who would give a fuck about them! Football fans. Scousers. Liverpool fans. The low of the low. That was why the cover-up, the conspiracy, the perversion of justice was allowed to continue for so long.

Watching this, you will cry with rage. Cry with pity. Cry with sympathy for the deceased and their families. Cry with disbelief. Cry with exasperation. Cry with joy at the verdict of the inquest. Then, return to rage again. The emotion that is most difficult for me to overcome.

I literally had to get that off my chest.

This too:

The city council need to get its act together sharpish.

Justice delayed is justice denied.

We can't thank him enough. Thanks Phil. 

Some crackin posts recently.

Offline markedasred

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #854 on: July 22, 2016, 10:10:41 AM »

An easy pick for this digest of the best from Nessy76 on the 22nd of July, mid silly season:

Re: An early look at the 2016/17 Liverpool team

« Reply #306 on: Yesterday at 03:54:55 PM »


Quote

 

The Kloppeffekt is in full swing here.

Before the summer, I was concerned that we might be about to once more sign a large number of new players, needing to give them all the customary six months to bed in, by which time the season can often be more or less over.

We've got form for this. Despite a lacklustre first transfer window as Liverpool manager, when he only brought in Joe Allen and the somewhat untried pair of Assaidi and Borini, from a recruitment perspective, Brendan Rodgers' tenure here now looks like a flurry of mis-matched signings. Promising talent going undeveloped, square pegs in round holes all over the place, fallback options being signed apparently without fallback tactics for taking advantage of them.

And to be fair, he'd inherited a squad that was a bit of a mess. True, it was still in better shape than it had been at the end of Hodgson's disastrous run, but it wasn't a side fit for purpose to play the sort of tiki-taffa Rodgers' Swansea had showed to such great effect. Dalglish and Comolli had sometimes appeared to be trying to assemble two very different teams at the same time. Adam, Henderson and Downing seemed to have been brought in to get the best out of the aerial gifts of Andy Carroll, but it was the mercurial Suarez who was soon revealed as the heart of the team, and who would get the best out of a declining but still vital Gerrard.

A few quality additions finally came through in January 2013, when Sturridge and Coutinho arrived in majestic fashion and set the scene for the title challenge of the following year. And then came summer, and the first of what would become an annual splurge. Having had a year to establish what he wanted to impose his vision on the game and his style on the club, Rodgers bought six players and loaned another two. While Luis Alberto and Tiago Ilori were seen as names for the future, the fees paid (widely reckoned around the seven million mark for each) raised expectation. Chelsea might buy prospects for that sort of money at the drop of a hat never to be seen again, but our kids from Iberia were clearly expected by many to provide an instant impact on the first team.

Sakho and Mignolet were to bring a new look to the back line, with Toure coming in for cover. Questions were asked of the Belgian keeper's distribution, surely a vital asset for a pass and move side? His shot stopping was never in doubt, though. Maybe we were just spoiled after having Reina there so long, spraying it like Molby.

Iago Aspas arrived with some excitement from La Liga followers, although it was never clear how he was to be used in a front line that already had Sturridge and Suarez, with support from Coutinho and that young Sterling kid. With the S&S combination first and second in the goal chart at the end of the season, the answer was that Iago never really got a look-in.

Finally, a couple of loans for Ally Cissokho and Victor Moses, both players who had been lauded but had points to prove. Again, neither was really able to make an impact as the team came within a whisker of the title.

Now most of us were following all of this with a feeling that things generally were moving in the right direction. We'd been right in the hunt for the league, playing sumptuous, glorious football, handing out thrashings to lesser sides all over the place. If the loan players hadn't worked out, well no problem, just send them back home and we could move on. And both Ilori and Luis Alberto had time on their sides.

And then came the blow that would eventually topple Brendan Rodgers. The sale of Luis Suarez wasn't really a surprise when it happened. And the circumstances seemed to make it inevitable. But at least we got a good fee for him. £75m. That was enormous money. And it fuelled another summer of frantic signings.

If Rodgers had assembled his team the previous year, then 2014 should have been the polish. It should have been when we added quality. Of course with the two loanees departing, Suarez leaving, Agger returning to Brondby and a minor clear out of fringe squad and former youth players like Coady, Kelly, Robinson and Suso, things were looking a little thin. The team that had come close to the title was one of the smallest in the Premier League, and the youngest. And club legend Steven Gerrard was starting to show signs of decline. Add to that the side's first Champions League run out in several seasons, and it was clear that the Suarez money would need to be stretched thinner than we might have liked.

A triple raid on a Southampton side that was being purred over by pundits started us off. Rickie Lambert's homecoming. Lallana to add a bit of magic in the final third. Lovren to shore up the defence that had ultimately cost us the title.

Then more young prospects. Versatile and indecently manly German Emre Can arrived alongside much fancied Serbian winger Lazar Markovic. Origi was signed but would stay on loan for a season. £40m for those three players was a smart investment in the club's future, it seemed.

A pair of Spanish full backs, Moreno and Manquillo, arrived. One on a permanent move, the other a two-year loan with an option to buy at the end of it.

That was a lot of transfer movement. And I think most people would argue that overall, those were not a poor set of players to buy at all. But of course, we still hadn't replaced Luis Suarez in any way. Lambert was there as cover. Origi wasn't here at all yet and wasn't ready for that kind of pressure.

A move for Alexis Sanchez, in many ways the ideal replacement, looked to be going ahead until the player decided to move to Arsenal instead. The club's fall back option, Loic Remy, apparently failed a medical. With the need to bring in some kind of forward clear, a lowball offer for Mario Balotelli was accepted and he joined the club for just £16m

We all sat back in wonder. Not long before, Rodgers had given short shrift to the idea of signing the controversial Italian, but with little apparent alternative, Mario was what he got.

This mix of players was always going to take time to settle. The club had just lost one of its greatest of all time, and it wasn't just the goals and assists that were going to be hard to replace. With the side effectively in shock, we threw in some kids and a few Southampton players who at first looked to be out of their depth. Both Lambert and Lallana had come from lower league football, and along with Lovren, to begin with they struggled to impose themselves on this new patchwork side.

I don't want to dwell on what exactly went wrong that season, and it would be a mistake to put it all down to signing too many new players at once, but clearly that didn't do us any favours, even if it was probably necessary one way or another.

At least we now had a core, a big squad. It was a bit uneven, certainly. And with Sturridge going through a nightmare period of injuries, its deficiencies were exposed far too often. However, there were very bright signs in there. There was clearly a lot of talent at the club, even if it wasn't all focussed in the right direction or used to great effect.

And then Sterling left.

Now, unlike Suarez, Sterling was never the heart and soul of the team. Even when he was the best player on the pitch, which he certainly was some times, he wasn't the type of player who lifts the team, gets others closing down space, forces things to happen. Sterling was all about potential. You'd watch him and know that in five, six years, he could be a potential ballon d'or winner, but his actual return of goals and assists was fairly modest. What we lost in selling him wasn't the Sterling we had, but the Sterling he might one day be. It didn't disrupt the team in the same way, because the team was never built around Sterling.

And now, we'd lost a good player, and a great prospect, but there wasn't the need for major surgery again, just to plug a few gaps. The club was in poor form, and there were any number of ways that form could be picked up relatively simply. The new look defence was no less porous than it had been before the arrival of Mignolet, Sakho, Lovren, Moreno or Manquillo, who was sent back home again. It wasn't more defenders we needed, it was more organisation of the ones we had.

And the midfield, well Gerrard going was arguably a bigger blow than Sterling, but the writing had long been on the wall, we had needed a replacement for a very long time and everyone knew it. You don't really replace a player like that, anyway, you find a way for the team to replace what he used to do, and we'd had a couple of years where we'd been doing that already in many ways. In Henderson, Can, Allen, Lucas and Milner, we had the ingredients for a good midfield, that might become great with time.

It was the front line that was in trouble. There were questions over whether Sturridge would ever play again often enough to be called upon. The Balotelli experiment had failed disastrously. Benteke was held up as a possible solution. There were doubters. To some he was just Balotelli mark II, a big lump of a lad, decent in the air, but surely we'd had that in Andy Carroll when Rodgers took over? That was unfair, and Benteke certainly has more to his game, but as a fit for this team?

And the problem was, by this point, nobody could really tell you what this team was any more. We weren't playing tiki-takka, we sure as fuck didn't rest in possession. We had become a side that tries to score all the time, by whatever means necessary. And when we conceded, which was still far too often, we tended to panic, throw everything forwards, making us prone to a sucker punch. There was little organisation, little planning, and no clear direction. Defenders were encouraged to play the ball to feet, even when under pressure, so capable ball playing defenders like Sakho and Lovren were being forced into making daft mistakes rather than clear their lines. If they did get it back to Mignolet, his weakness in distribution had been flagged up, so he would have to give it back rather than try a long ball out.

The solution to this should have been a lot of sessions of tactical coaching. Getting the quality players to remember the basics. Coming up with a simple plan, back to square one, back to basics, instead of which ever more baroque and byzantine systems seemed to overlap.

So of course, you add another seven players to the mix.

By now, the squad was heaving, players were going out on loan not because the club didn't want them or couldn't use them yet, but just because there wasn't any room for them. And it's not that we signed poor players. You can argue the toss about Benteke's suitability, but there's a cracking player in there. Firmino would walk into any side in the country on form. Clyne is the most convincing right back I've seen at the club in a decade. Milner is an experienced and versatile player with title winning pedigree. Ings was a bargain, and might have been our top scorer last season if not for that injury. And Joe Gomez has an amazing future ahead of him in the game.

I have no real problem with any of those players. The problem was, we signed too many in too short a space of time and now have an enormous squad to contend with.

There are currently twenty nine senior players in the squad. In Brendan Rodgers' tenure here of just three and a bit seasons, nineteen of those were signed by him. And that doesn't include any of the players still under 21, or those we've sold on already.

Now, I don't much care for the "transfer committee" conversation, all parties agree that Rodgers had final say on signings, and all club managers will take advice from scouts and get clearance from the money men before making deals, it's no different to any other club.

And you'll note I'm not saying he wasted money, signed dross, or was a poor judge of talent. For me, most of the permanent signings he made were or are good players, although some of them weren't or aren't the right fit for this club. That's all normal. That's all fine.

The point is that we've gone from the sleek squad of enfants terrible who came close to winning the title to a huge corpulent mess of a squad in a very short space of time, and my concern is that we are again signing LOADS of players.

So am I worried?

Well, not as much as I might be.

There will be teething troubles. I don't doubt it. You cannot throw thirty people together and expect them to mesh perfectly. It takes time and work to build those understandings and relationships, to get to know each others movements and where they like the ball. And for each new player, those problems extend exponentially. They aren't just getting to know the club, but one another at the same time, and nobody can help them out because nobody else knows half those players either.

There will be flops amongst the signings. It's the one thing that's always true of football, get three out of four signings more or less right and you're well, well ahead.

But, and it's a big, huge but, Klopp knows what he's doing, we all agree on that. And it's his first summer at the club, his first with the kind of financial muscle LFC can flex and he's had time, as Rodgers had, to run the rule over the current squad and decide what and how he can improve it. I am completely committed to giving Jurgen Klopp all the support he needs.

I do think it's worth looking at how this is different. For one thing, Klopp does seem to have a clearly defined strategy that hasn't become distorted in the way Rodgers' did. Klopp is more of a pragmatist. He tells defenders to clear their lines when they need to. His methods are praised because in some ways they are very simple. New players aren't just meshing with a disparate group of strangers they never met before, they are being inculcated into a system, their individual talents subsumed into a wider pattern of play. This hopefully means that each player just needs to be told his own role in the system. When to attack, when to back off, when to close down. So long as there is vocal leadership on the pitch from the people who already understand the system - and while this was something else we lost with Gerrard, I wasn't convinced towards the end he was tactically on the same page as Rodgers to begin with - it should be easier for a new player to step into that role.

And at least we should be set for a few years here, mostly. You can always upgrade a position or three, but we shouldn't need to do a major rebuilding job like this again for four or five years, at least. And with proper maintenance, not ever again.


« Last Edit: Yesterday at 04:01:13 PM by Nessy76 »

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Offline Medellin

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #855 on: July 25, 2016, 01:23:50 PM »
One Mottman posted last year,fantastic.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=320759.msg13767561#msg13767561

Cry me a tear

Cry me a tear. Wipe it away.
Does it make you feel better about that terrible day?

Cry me a tear. Wipe again.
Good days we had. Will it ever be the same?

Cry me a tear. Maybe you don’t understand
what went on that day in that horrible stand.

Cry me a tear. Wipe it away
How come that tear keeps appearing each and every day?

Cry me a tear for the hurt and the cost.
The Kop is still silent for the people it lost.

Cry me a tear. We are still here.
Wipe it away but you won’t stop the tear.

Cry me a tear for the lads and the lasses.
We cross many borders and are loved by the masses.

Cry me a tear for the loud and the proud.
We won’t ever walk alone; even lost in a crowd.

Cry me a tear; I think not.
The 96 victims the media conveniently forgot.

Cry me a tear for the fans that survived.
Think of the grief and tears they hide.

Cry me a tear for the families that grieve.
With your help and mine lets hope they receive.

Cry me a tear for the faith and love they had.
With hope in their hearts, it’s terribly sad.

Cry me a tear. The future is bright.
It’s time for the red phoenix to flex its red might.

Cry me a tear for the true people you are.
Whether local or away from afar.

Cry me a tear. Let it run down your face.
Remember dignity, pride and grace.

Cry me a tear for the pride that we bear.
It’s our life and a hope that we share.

Cry me a tear for the sick in their hands.
They mock us and skit us, one day they’ll understand.

Cry me a tear for the weak and infirm.
They have been true reds, history can confirm.

Cry me a tear for the loved ones we’ve lost.
Whatever the pain or values it cost.

Cry me a tear for our ancestors who walked alone ahead
They set standards high for the men dressed in red.

Cry me a tear. Don’t ever forget.
Lift your head up proud, lest never forget.

Cry me a tear for the youth of today.
Let’s hope they never forget that horrible day.

Cry me a tear. King Kenny was boss.
He felt it all and cried at the loss.

Cry me a tear for the team that we had.
It’s glory is rich but terribly sad.

Cry me a tear with hope in your heart.
Think of loved ones drastically pulled apart.

Cry me a tear for all true Reds
Let’s hope you can settle in your comfortable beds.

Cry me a tear. We don’t know your name.
We may walk right past you each and every game.

Cry me a tear. As long as I last
with God’s will and strength I will never forget our past.

John Alfred Anderson (62)
Thomas Howard (39)
Colin Mark Ashcroft (19)
Thomas Anthony Howard (14)
James Gary Aspinall (18)
Eric George Hughes (42)
Kester Roger Marcus Ball (16)
Alan Johnston (29)
Gerard Bernard Patrick Baron (67)
Christine Anne Jones (27)
Simon Bell (17)
Gary Philip Jones (18)
Barry Sidney Bennett (26)
Richard Jones (25)
David John Benson (22)
Nicholas Peter Joynes (27)
David William Birtle (22)
Anthony Peter Kelly (29)
Tony Bland (22)
Michael David Kelly (38)
Paul David Brady (21)
Carl David Lewis (18)
Andrew Mark Brookes (26)
David William Mather (19)
Carl Brown (18)
Brian Christopher Mathews (38)
David Steven Brown (25)
Francis Joseph McAllister (27)
Henry Thomas Burke (47)
John McBrien (18)
Peter Andrew Burkett (24)
Marion Hazel McCabe (21)
Paul William Carlile (19)
Joseph Daniel McCarthy (21)
Raymond Thomas Chapman (50)
Peter McDonnell (21)
Gary Christopher Church (19)
Alan McGlone (28)
Joseph Clark (29)
Keith McGrath (17)
Paul Clark (18)
Paul Brian Murray (14)
Gary Collins (22)
Lee Nicol (14)
Stephen Paul Copoc (20)
Stephen Francis O'Neill (17)
Tracey Elizabeth Cox (23)
Jonathon Owens (18)
James Philip Delaney (19)
William Roy Pemberton (23)
Christopher Barry Devonside (18)
Carl William Rimmer (21)
Christopher Edwards (29)
David George Rimmer (38)
Vincent Michael Fitzsimmons (34)
Graham John Roberts (24)
Thomas Steven Fox (21)
Steven Joseph Robinson (17)
Jon-Paul Gilhooley (10)
Henry Charles Rogers (17)
Barry Glover (27)
Colin Andrew Hugh
William Sefton (23)
Ian Thomas Glover (20)
Inger Shah (38)
Derrick George Godwin (24)
Paula Ann Smith (26)
Roy Harry Hamilton (34)
Adam Edward Spearritt (14)
Philip Hammond (14)
Philip John Steele (15)
Eric Hankin (33)
David Leonard Thomas (23)
Gary Harrison (27)
Patrik John Thompson (35)
Stephen Francis Harrison (31)
Peter Reuben Thompson (30)
Peter Andrew Harrison (15)
Stuart Paul William Thompson (17)
David Hawley (39)
Peter Francis Tootle (21)
James Robert Hennessy (29)
Christopher James Traynor (26)
Paul Anthony Hewitson (26)
Martin Kevin Traynor (16)
Carl Darren Hewitt (17)
Kevin Tyrrell (15)
Nicholas Michael Hewitt (16)
Colin Wafer (19)
Sarah Louise Hicks (19)
Ian David Whelan (19)
Victoria Jane Hicks (15)
Martin Kenneth Wild (29)
Gordon Rodney Horn (20)
Kevin Daniel Williams (15)
Arthur Horrocks (41)
Graham John Wright (17)

Cry me a tear for those left behind
who live each day with thoughts in their mind.

Cry me a tear. Cry for the 96 that died.
Cry me a tear for the press that lied

Cry me a tear with hope in our heart.
Think of the loved ones drastically drawn apart.

Cry me a tear. Some say it’s just a football team.
It’s bigger than that. It’s more than a dream.

Cry me a tear. Wipe them all away.
We love and feel for them everyday.

Cry me a tear. Bill, Bob and Joe welcome you with open arms

The 96 are now immortal, never to be forgotten.

My heart still bleeds and feels for you and those you left behind.

One day we will all meet up in heaven. My thoughts are with you.

Cry me a tear, because I haven’t stopped crying yet.


Justice for all.
Support the team,Trust & Believe.