Topic: Hicks & Gillett here for the foreseeable future?...

[reddwarf12003]

just a quick one,,,,,,,,,, RBS down 30%

[nm83]

Makes no difference if their due dilligence was 3 minutes, 3 hours, 3 days or even 3 months.

Once you own something , typically you have a full review of what you want to do and where you want to go.

I wholly agree with that second part, but quite frankly the first part is utterly shocking.  it reflects the "cowboy"ish nature of these guys, because it's quite evident that they didn't realise just what they were taking on, and by the time they owned the club to do their proper review of things, they realised they were in deep shit.  the rest is them trying to "make the best of it" ... and by that, i mean utterly fuck up our club

[west_london_red]

Wall Street had its worst day yesterday in this current credit crunch and there is still no sign of them selling.

We dont know that. Sadly they are not about to put up a for sale sign outside Anfield. Plus RBS are taking an absolute battering.

[reddwarf12003]

sorry, sky news quotes RBS down 39% could be on verge of going under

[Dave D]

RBS are f***ed. Is this good or bad for us?

[reddwarf12003]

If , does the uk government step in and bails RBS out.
Does the government then own us in a round about way?

They could force them to sell to get our money back.

[Liverbird 2010]

RBS are f***ed. Is this good or bad for us?

Tim will be able to answer this one for us.

[reddwarf12003]

If it does go under and the uk government step in and bails RBS out.
Does the government then own us in a round about way?

They could force them to sell to get our money back.

[FOOT]

I wholly agree with that second part, but quite frankly the first part is utterly shocking.  it reflects the "cowboy"ish nature of these guys, because it's quite evident that they didn't realise just what they were taking on, and by the time they owned the club to do their proper review of things, they realised they were in deep shit.  the rest is them trying to "make the best of it" ... and by that, i mean utterly fuck up our club

Or does it show just how obviously under valued the club was been offered for and that it was spotted by an experienced LBO to be prime for some easy money.

IF the proposed offer from S Mo is anywhere near what has been reported (a profit of about £75M EACH for a couple of years of not spending a dime on us out of their own pocket), I would love to be up to my neck in that shit trying to 'make the best of it'.

What they do for a living is very high stakes poker games. OK the current economic climate has increased the stakes a bit, but they still should walk away with a HUGE pot of money for taking a REASONABLE sized gamble that Mores and Parry were undervaluing us.

To me, no matter how much I hate the 4 of them, its is obvious that G&H are not stupid businessmen (far from it). M&P on the otherhand.....
 

[Mudface_]

So what was the 100,000 people throwing in £5000 all about then

Another ridiculous idea, but at least that had the potential merit of the people who paid up actually owning the club. The scenario you're suggesting is basically getting 50,000 people to give G&H £100 million extra to get them out of the club because no one will pay their asking price.

[fry]

its shit we have to rely on the credit crunch to get our club back.  I would rather take it back with fan power. sadly this is something we are unlikely to achieve.  I have been eagerly reading these type of threads for months hoping for that glorious post "H+G have sold".  Sadly its turning more and more into a dream.  I am worried that this will be our best year , why you ask? as this year we have a great squad, the next few years we have a squad of assets primed for the transfer market to help bail H+G out.  People say why should the sheikh pay over the odds?  He should not really, but i hope he would, he would not just be paying more for something, he would be setting us free from hicks and Gillette's pockets. As this is where we are and this is where we will be if nothing changes.   

[reddwarf12003]

RBS down graded by credit reference agencies.

So it will be more difficult for them to finance any thing let alone refinance dick and dom when it happens.

[west_london_red]

RBS are f***ed. Is this good or bad for us?

Well if it continues, its potentially good for us as they might not wish to refinance, but i doubt it will have any impact as the loan with G&H is easy money for RBS. The club has enough money to pay for the loans due ample demand for tickets and a couple of years to go on the current TV contract mean the club is reasonably well insulated and unlikely to default on their repayments. Thats my reading of it anyways.

On the otherhand peoples jobs and savings are on the line. I doubt the people facing the dole queue care about the state of the club right now.

[FOOT]

On the otherhand peoples jobs and savings are on the line. I doubt the people facing the dole queue care about the state of the club right now.

well said WLR - I think we need to keep a perspective on what we wish for in here.

[Euphoric Mess]

I've heard it mentioned before and that was why don't share Liverpool approach DIC(offer on the table), Sheikh, Amanda Stavely and say listen we are prepared to get 50,000 fans to put £2000 in to assist in buying the club along side the sheikh, if it ment happiness for fans, those figures and amount of people are a lot more workable then say 100,000 fans putting 4 or 5 grand in.  And this would mean making the difference up of the offer thats on the table.

I think this is the way forward and that these 50,000 are more likely to be rewarded over the course of time with tickets, discounts, prioritys etc. Over say 5 years especially when the new stadium is built and we have an extra 40k seats, this would work.

To me that would be the best £2k i would ever spend and in todays market an affordable one.

In fairness thats prob one of the best ideas I have heard on this, and I have been reading this forum from well before the yanks took over....

I know you have inisider info and that, could this help this idea be pushed further in anyway?

getting people to commit to giving money though i not that easy, even those that have said they would might not when it comes to it.

[incredibleL4ever]

Do I see some straws u are clutching at??!!

In a very odd way this might suit H&G.  RBS, and the other banks are likely to want to tidy up their balance sheets.  If they perceive that that this loan is a risky one, they might be willing to take a write down on it in order to get it off their book.  If H&G can come up with someone to refinance the deal and they offer RBS (say) 300m to clear the 350m- 400m loan RBS just might go for it.

[Ether]

If RBS and that's a very big IF do go 'down' then the government will force a another bank to buy it or take them over themselves.

If the government do take over the bank then they will just sell off the bad assets like they did with Northern Rock and keep the good assets. 

Wether or not we like it we are classified as a good asset as we can currently keep up with the intrest payments.

[Seantheprawn]

If it does go under and the uk government step in and bails RBS out.

No they won't....trust me! They've already bailed out one bank in N.R but to continually bail out banks in this country during the credit crunch would be disasterous. The Govt are already starting to put a package together to help (including part assisting the E.U) ease the financial burden we currently find ourselves in. We will be paying for it for a LONG time to come. It was the banks who bought bad assets; broke them down and re-branded them and bought & sold them on to/from each other. They do it all the time. That's why they are known as high risk. Sadly the risk takers didn't forsee it coming back to bite them on the arse quite so hard. If RBS do fall without government intervention (a' la Lehmann Bros. in the states) it will be a sad, sad day. Ultimately though we will just have to get on with it and learn from the banks' mistakes as the U.S once did back in 1929. The two things that can be assured is a) risk will NEVER be taken by financial institutions in the same way again, I think the FSA, Treasury, Govt. and the Bank of England will make damn sure of that and b) 100+ % mortgages will be forever seen as a thing from the past. If you ain't got it; probabillity suggests there isn't much chance you can afford it ....as we are currently and with much discomfort; witnessing!!
From Shithead & Fucknoses' point of view they will have to put up more than they have in terms of securities despite their protestations. They will be on their way.......exit stage left!

[Euphoric Mess]

If RBS and that's a very big IF do go 'down' then the government will force a another bank to buy it or take them over themselves.

If the government do take over the bank then they will just sell off the bad assets like they did with Northern Rock and keep the good assets. 

Wether or not we like it we are classified as a good asset as we can currently keep up with the intrest payments.

yes we can but there is a certain amount of risk in that

If someone has a huge mortgage and their jb covers it, sometimes they must have lead man insurance (may be called something else now) where they pay a premium so that if they lose their job the insurance pays the mortgage.

Now this is even more common in business as far as I am aware, and with our repayments being based on success and being int he CL I can imagine its not that easy to insure or to lead a failing bank with confidence that that wont happen

So the risk is far higher.

I think it would depend on who takes over

But hopefully as we are speculating, i the situation never arises as many people would lose their job if RBS went down, and their livelyhood is more important than a football club.

[ShanksLegend]

Shares have just been suspended

[Euphoric Mess]

Shares have just been suspended

what does that mean, i know what suspended means, i mean what would cause this to happen, or why would this be decided on?

[4tothefloor]

If RBS and that's a very big IF do go 'down' then the government will force a another bank to buy it or take them over themselves.

If the government do take over the bank then they will just sell off the bad assets like they did with Northern Rock and keep the good assets. 

Wether or not we like it we are classified as a good asset as we can currently keep up with the intrest payments.

Can RBS not just call the loan in and refuse to refinance? 

[anfield]

what does that mean, i know what suspended means, i mean what would cause this to happen, or why would this be decided on?

If to many shares is sold at the same time then they will suspend the share.

[Ether]

Can RBS not just call the loan in and refuse to refinance? 

to be honest I can't see why they would want to.  They are in a win win situation.

I also can't personally see RBS going under

[reddwarf12003]

I can't see them going under, but you never know.

More interested in thier credit rating, That will affect thier cash flow and ability to refinance the pair of tits

[Seantheprawn]

If RBS and that's a very big IF do go 'down' then the government will force a another bank to buy it or take them over themselves.

If the government do take over the bank then they will just sell off the bad assets like they did with Northern Rock and keep the good assets. 

They CAN'T sell bad assets in the present climate Ether, that's why the western hemisphere is in this position. Ultimately the banks can't sell them because there are no takers and that's why shares are plummeting.

[djphal]

Shares have just been suspended

so what does this mean?

[Seantheprawn]

so what does this mean?

One can't trade with RBS

[The_Last_Don]

They CAN'T sell bad assets in the present climate Ether, that's why the western hemisphere is in this position. Ultimately the banks can't sell them because there are no takers and that's why shares are plummeting.

Yes, the bailout is to buyout the bad assets that are creating havoc on the big banks balance sheet.  Take away those bad assets the balance sheet looks a whole lot better.

[peterb17]

With reference to the quoted Pm from SL about a minority share liverpool stake......

The only piece of information I have ever received in my life agrees totally with this.

As you will see I very rarley post and am more of a stalker on these boards however i am an accountant and not long ago I came into contact through work with one of Share Liverpools Board members and he had said this was one of the discussions that they had.

He also said that it suited the Sheiks vision as it allowed a local involvement and kept the fans still at the heart of the club with a voice on the LFC board howver the obvious stumbling block was getting rid of the two parasites.

Believe if you want all as I will say is that I don't post often as I believe in saying something only if it is worthwhile.

[HarryLabrador]

One can't trade with RBS

That's about it. Whilst the shares are suspended no trading is allowed or transfer of shares.

[Euphoric Mess]

That's about it. Whilst the stock is suspended no trading is allowed or transfer of shares.

is this likely to be a move prior to an announcement? or is it just to stop the current sales and stocks issue they are having.

who suspends it, and who ensures no sales can be made, say i had some what stops me selling them to you.

[cambridge]

With reference to the quoted Pm from SL about a minority share liverpool stake......

The only piece of information I have ever received in my life agrees totally with this.

As you will see I very rarley post and am more of a stalker on these boards however i am an accountant and not long ago I came into contact through work with one of Share Liverpools Board members and he had said this was one of the discussions that they had.

He also said that it suited the Sheiks vision as it allowed a local involvement and kept the fans still at the heart of the club with a voice on the LFC board howver the obvious stumbling block was getting rid of the two parasites.

Believe if you want all as I will say is that I don't post often as I believe in saying something only if it is worthwhile.

Is this a realistic possibilty?
Has the Sheik been contacted with a proposal?

[riise6]

Dubai is a poor sibling to Abu Dhabi.  Most of the Dubaian funds (including DIC) are apparently one margin call away from liquidation.  The funds are highly leveraged and thus susceptible to the problems hitting the financial industry. Thats why you hear mumblings that DIC is not involved and if that the takeover is to happen it would be through the personal money of Sheikh.

I'm not too sure if Dubai is the solution.

WTF ARE YOU ON ABOUT PURE SHITE THAT!!

[Alan_X]

With reference to the quoted Pm from SL about a minority share liverpool stake......

The only piece of information I have ever received in my life agrees totally with this.

As you will see I very rarley post and am more of a stalker on these boards however i am an accountant and not long ago I came into contact through work with one of Share Liverpools Board members and he had said this was one of the discussions that they had.

He also said that it suited the Sheiks vision as it allowed a local involvement and kept the fans still at the heart of the club with a voice on the LFC board howver the obvious stumbling block was getting rid of the two parasites.

Thanks.

Believe if you want all as I will say is that I don't post often as I believe in saying something only if it is worthwhile.

A good principle and one that a few others would do well to follow.

[Alan_X]

WTF ARE YOU ON ABOUT PURE SHITE THAT!!

Thanks for your considered response.  Do you actually know that or is it just your opinion?



Oh and turn your caps lock off.

[HarryLabrador]

is this likely to be a move prior to an announcement? or is it just to stop the current sales and stocks issue they are having.

who suspends it, and who ensures no sales can be made, say i had some what stops me selling them to you.

As far as I know, there are 2 ways through which a company's stocks and shares can be suspended. Suspension is either requested by the company or by the stock exchange; and in the worst case scenario, the statement "suspended pending clarification of company's financial situation" applies. Whether that's the case here, I don't know. When Mr. Darling injects a significant amount into the RBS as a rescue package, it's shares should then be requoted and trading can then commence.

Whist the stock is suspended, no trading is permitted or even the transfer of your shares to me.

[riise6]

Thanks for your considered response.  Do you actually know that or is it just your opinion?



Oh and turn your caps lock off.

i know that!!

[Alan_X]

i know that!!

Fair enough - I don't - care to explain?

[riise6]

he just likes to talk crap be it on here or facebook