Author Topic: Rafa  (Read 89095 times)

Offline simmo71

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1760 on: January 15, 2008, 02:29:27 AM »
We're going no-where under Rafa. His football philosophies aren't working in the league and he can't change them.

I would go as far as to say that he is 'GH mark II'. My reason for this is that I think he has taken us as far as he can, and he has begun to lose the confidence of the players in addition to the owners, who would be forced to keep him on, btw, if he were to change our fortunes and show us progress in the league.

We can't rely on good Cup runs forever - the league is the only true measure of a side and ours is no-where near the top three in terms of quality and consistency.

Offline Macedonian_Red

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1761 on: January 15, 2008, 02:37:21 AM »
We're going no-where under Rafa. His football philosophies aren't working in the league and he can't change them.

I would go as far as to say that he is 'GH mark II'. My reason for this is that I think he has taken us as far as he can, and he has begun to lose the confidence of the players in addition to the owners, who would be forced to keep him on, btw, if he were to change our fortunes and show us progress in the league.

We can't rely on good Cup runs forever - the league is the only true measure of a side and ours is no-where near the top three in terms of quality and consistency.

And your candidate to replace him is ...


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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1762 on: January 15, 2008, 02:39:23 AM »
the league is the only true measure of a side

Where do people pick up this shit from?

Sacchi's Milan team won the league ONCE. Has there been a better team in recent memory?

The Inter Milan side that are currently cruising Serie A won't be considered great until they win in Europe. Same goes for the Lyon team in France. The European Cup screams 'greatness'. It is the greatest prize in club football.
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Offline Macedonian_Red

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1763 on: January 15, 2008, 02:40:44 AM »

 The European Cup screams 'greatness'. It is the greatest prize in club football.


Is the right answer ...

Offline ouestlereferee

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1764 on: January 15, 2008, 02:46:20 AM »
Where do people pick up this shit from?

Sacchi's Milan team won the league ONCE. Has there been a better team in recent memory?

The Inter Milan side that are currently cruising Serie A won't be considered great until they win in Europe. Same goes for the Lyon team in France. The European Cup screams 'greatness'. It is the greatest prize in club football.

is right.  I don't hear people saying Kaka, Pirlo, Seedorf, Nesta, & Gattuso are shite players because Milan are languishing in 12th in Serie A either (although they have 3 games in hand, even if they win them all they'll only be 6th)...  despite what the Gooners are saying I'd doubt there's any team they would have preferred Milan to....

Offline ouestlereferee

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1765 on: January 15, 2008, 02:49:39 AM »
Where do people pick up this shit from?

Sacchi's Milan team won the league ONCE. Has there been a better team in recent memory?

The Inter Milan side that are currently cruising Serie A won't be considered great until they win in Europe. Same goes for the Lyon team in France. The European Cup screams 'greatness'. It is the greatest prize in club football.

Just thinking Juan, you'd almost think by a lot of peoples' attitudes that the CL is the considered about as prestegious as, or possibly even less than, the FA Cup....

FFS If we're the most successful club in the CL over a 4-5 year period with Rafa in place and he's going to be sticking around, every player will want to play for us.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1766 on: January 15, 2008, 03:09:07 AM »
And your candidate to replace him is ...



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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1767 on: January 15, 2008, 03:14:05 AM »
Just thinking Juan, you'd almost think by a lot of peoples' attitudes that the CL is the considered about as prestegious as, or possibly even less than, the FA Cup....

FFS If we're the most successful club in the CL over a 4-5 year period with Rafa in place and he's going to be sticking around, every player will want to play for us.
If we were the most successful club in the CL over a 4-5 year period, not only would every player want to play for us, but it would give us the self-generated revenues to fund one world-class player like Torres and a few potential stars like Babel and Leiva every transfer window.  Without the Americans and without the shithole they've dragged the club into.

Instilling the confidence into the team through successive CL successes + strengthening of the squad over seasons also puts us on firm footing to assault the Premiere League in the future.  That's why Rafa is essential to us.

We don't have a god-given right to win the League, when we've spent 18 seasons chasing it.  Rafa's done miracles keeping us in sight of the Mancs, Gooners and Chelsea given a decade and a half of stasis on our part and perpetual, heavy reinvestment by the other top clubs in their sides.

People who say Rafa's not working out should get their head screwed on straight.  And take a good, hard look at the alternatives.
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Offline ouestlereferee

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1768 on: January 15, 2008, 03:33:23 AM »
If we were the most successful club in the CL over a 4-5 year period, not only would every player want to play for us, but it would give us the self-generated revenues to fund one world-class player like Torres and a few potential stars like Babel and Leiva every transfer window.  Without the Americans and without the shithole they've dragged the club into.

yes please

Instilling the confidence into the team through successive CL successes + strengthening of the squad over seasons also puts us on firm footing to assault the Premiere League in the future.  That's why Rafa is essential to us.

100% agreed.  If we'd been able to splash out for Aguero, say, 18 months ago, Mati Fernandez 12 months ago - all who would want to come on the basis CL success, our array of attacking talent & possibilities would be considerably more potent.  Hopefully this will be the case going forward.

We don't have a god-given right to win the League, when we've spent 18 seasons chasing it.  Rafa's done miracles keeping us in sight of the Mancs, Gooners and Chelsea given a decade and a half of stasis on our part and perpetual, heavy reinvestment by the other top clubs in their sides.

True - and the fact that the financial gap between us and them has grown ever wider....

People who say Rafa's not working out should get their head screwed on straight.  And take a good, hard look at the alternatives.

Correct. 

We know from Wenger & Fergie that you need to have the right manager in place for a long period of time.  Who are the alternatives?   There are good managers out there - but they're all 10+ years older than Rafa.   With one exception - Mourinho - and does he have any pedigree when it comes to building a team?  And as regards Klinsmann etc - absolutely no pedigree whatsoever - we can't be going near anyone like that.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1769 on: January 15, 2008, 04:08:58 AM »
I know I don't need to (and shouldn't) get involved: but I DO remember that it was "Rafa will be here next season- and so will the owners" rather than "Klinsmann won't be here next season".

And I have a good memory 5pool [sic].

BazC ( no sic involved as i prefer to be civil)

You are close.

There were two seperate bets.

1: Rafa would be here next season.

2: G&H wouldn't sell the club.



Durango:

It's nice that Bascombe got his scoop. However, he printed AFTER the december meeting that Rafa was gone and Klinsmann would take his place in the summer. Of course after first saying it was Mourinho.

Now, you can if you want as i do, believe the December meeting sorted things. In which case, Bascombe was wrong to print what he did.

And he printed G&H would sell the club. Doesn't look as likely but i guess there's hope for some.

So before the New Year I offered the bets. As you'll recall my December 31st deadline.

Now if Bascombe was that good, he would have known this was put to bed and Klinsmann was going Bayern. Did he get that scoop? Is that why he wouldn't bet me? I don't recall him breaking the news before Bayern did.

The revelation of talking to Klinsmann is a bit of a shocker to me. However, as is customary, many are going ott with it. People ask Why Jurgen.  Well he did play in the premiership, has some knowledge of the game, and wasn't working. How many managers were unemployeed in November? A little hard for them to talk to Fergie and Arsene wasn't it. They already knew Rafa's plans and one would assume they had talked to Rafa about the Premiership, Europe, and the like in the months they owned the club. December wasn't their first face to face meeting with Rafa. So they got another perspective. (and maybe more from others who haven't been named)

Rafa played his chess game, seems like Hicks was playing poker and the two butted heads.
I hope it is all behind them now. They all say it is. So i'll go with that.

And i still am a firm believer that Rafa will be here next season.
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Offline myralfc

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1770 on: January 15, 2008, 04:13:10 AM »
We know from Wenger & Fergie that you need to have the right manager in place for a long period of time.  Who are the alternatives?   There are good managers out there - but they're all 10+ years older than Rafa.   With one exception - Mourinho - and does he have any pedigree when it comes to building a team?  And as regards Klinsmann etc - absolutely no pedigree whatsoever - we can't be going near anyone like that.

I've always thought that Mourinho only reaped the benefits of a team that Ranieri built.  I damn sure don't want that egotistical prick coming here and pulling a Chelsea all over again.  That's when all the fucking fun started in the first place.  Billionaire playboys wanting to come and play for a while, meanwhile destroying the lives of fans everywhere.  Absolutely gutted!  And can't seem to escape the train wreck.

Offline KFC

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1771 on: January 15, 2008, 04:25:44 AM »
The fact that we spend 45 pages on talking about all this crap (owners / Rafas / finances, etc) and not the matches / games is exactly the reason why we are having serious problem this season on the pitch.

Convince me this has not an impact to Rafa / players on the pitch.  Rafa has kept relatively silent so far, which showed his class -- I want to make sure people understand how lucky we are to have him. 

Now it is time for the supporters to show that we all have the same class, by telling the world who do we support : the coach / players, or the owners.  The day when the owners won is the date when we have told the world that Liverpool Football Club has degraded to the same level as the likes of Newcastle / Spurs.

And I will make sure I mark that day on my calender so it will never be forgotten.

We won it 5 times

Offline ouestlereferee

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1772 on: January 15, 2008, 04:29:25 AM »
I've always thought that Mourinho only reaped the benefits of a team that Ranieri built.  I damn sure don't want that egotistical prick coming here and pulling a Chelsea all over again.  That's when all the fucking fun started in the first place.  Billionaire playboys wanting to come and play for a while, meanwhile destroying the lives of fans everywhere.  Absolutely gutted!  And can't seem to escape the train wreck.

My suspicion is that Mourinho actually may be a good motvator, and an ok tactician, but in terms of team building/development is rather poor.  Chelsea's points totals decreased each year under him, also I'm not convinced Duff, Robben, & Gudjohnsson were replaced with similar quality....  last year for example Drogba stepped up from scoring around 10 PL goals in the previous two seasons to scoring 20, yet Chelsea still scored around 10 goals less last season than they had the previous two...

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1773 on: January 15, 2008, 04:51:28 AM »
My suspicion is that Mourinho actually may be a good motvator, and an ok tactician, but in terms of team building/development is rather poor.  Chelsea's points totals decreased each year under him, also I'm not convinced Duff, Robben, & Gudjohnsson were replaced with similar quality....  last year for example Drogba stepped up from scoring around 10 PL goals in the previous two seasons to scoring 20, yet Chelsea still scored around 10 goals less last season than they had the previous two...
Mourinho is probably regretting the day he signed with Chelsea because no one's going to remember the 2 premierships they 'bought' and his CL success with Porto is all forgotten

Offline lucid-tentacles

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1774 on: January 15, 2008, 08:24:56 AM »
BazC ( no sic involved as i prefer to be civil)

You are close.

There were two seperate bets.

1: Rafa would be here next season.

2: G&H wouldn't sell the club.



Durango:

It's nice that Bascombe got his scoop. However, he printed AFTER the december meeting that Rafa was gone and Klinsmann would take his place in the summer. Of course after first saying it was Mourinho.

Now, you can if you want as i do, believe the December meeting sorted things. In which case, Bascombe was wrong to print what he did.

And he printed G&H would sell the club. Doesn't look as likely but i guess there's hope for some.

So before the New Year I offered the bets. As you'll recall my December 31st deadline.

Now if Bascombe was that good, he would have known this was put to bed and Klinsmann was going Bayern. Did he get that scoop? Is that why he wouldn't bet me? I don't recall him breaking the news before Bayern did.

The revelation of talking to Klinsmann is a bit of a shocker to me. However, as is customary, many are going ott with it. People ask Why Jurgen.  Well he did play in the Premier League, has some knowledge of the game, and wasn't working. How many managers were unemployeed in November? A little hard for them to talk to Fergie and Arsene wasn't it. They already knew Rafa's plans and one would assume they had talked to Rafa about the Premier League, Europe, and the like in the months they owned the club. December wasn't their first face to face meeting with Rafa. So they got another perspective. (and maybe more from others who haven't been named)

Rafa played his chess game, seems like Hicks was playing poker and the two butted heads.
I hope it is all behind them now. They all say it is. So i'll go with that.

And i still am a firm believer that Rafa will be here next season.

and this would seem to bear that out i don't think Rafa is going anywhere thank god

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_3047716,00.html

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1775 on: January 15, 2008, 08:28:11 AM »
and this would seem to bear that out i don't think Rafa is going anywhere thank god

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_3047716,00.html

To summarise:
Tabloid hacks: Will Rafa leave?
RAFA: Fookin' make me.
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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1776 on: January 15, 2008, 08:31:08 AM »
I would go as far as to say that he is 'GH mark II'.

Then you clearly don't remember the football we played under Houllier, because if you think they're comparable I can tell you you're mistaken.
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Offline Durango

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1777 on: January 15, 2008, 08:31:25 AM »






Durango:

It's nice that Bascombe got his scoop. However, he printed AFTER the december meeting that Rafa was gone and Klinsmann would take his place in the summer. Of course after first saying it was Mourinho.

Now, you can if you want as i do, believe the December meeting sorted things. In which case, Bascombe was wrong to print what he did.

And he printed G&H would sell the club. Doesn't look as likely but i guess there's hope for some.

So before the New Year I offered the bets. As you'll recall my December 31st deadline.

Now if Bascombe was that good, he would have known this was put to bed and Klinsmann was going Bayern. Did he get that scoop? Is that why he wouldn't bet me? I don't recall him breaking the news before Bayern did.

The revelation of talking to Klinsmann is a bit of a shocker to me. However, as is customary, many are going ott with it. People ask Why Jurgen.  Well he did play in the Premier League, has some knowledge of the game, and wasn't working. How many managers were unemployeed in November? A little hard for them to talk to Fergie and Arsene wasn't it. They already knew Rafa's plans and one would assume they had talked to Rafa about the Premier League, Europe, and the like in the months they owned the club. December wasn't their first face to face meeting with Rafa. So they got another perspective. (and maybe more from others who haven't been named)

Rafa played his chess game, seems like Hicks was playing poker and the two butted heads.
I hope it is all behind them now. They all say it is. So i'll go with that.

And i still am a firm believer that Rafa will be here next season.
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Offline tamimio

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1778 on: January 15, 2008, 08:53:55 AM »
Then you clearly don't remember the football we played under Houllier, because if you think they're comparable I can tell you you're mistaken.

I agree... How ppl claim we're heading in the same direction as we were under GH is shocking! It's true the results have not been going our way in the past few months, but under Benitez, Liverpool play organized footie, they control games, they set the tempo.. Under GH, we played the ugliest brand of long ball football with no organization, no tempo or play control... Basically when we won games under GH, it was because of good luck in counter attacks as well as other lucky breaks, while nowadays, it's the opposite case of controling almost every game but having bad luck when we lose...

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1779 on: January 15, 2008, 11:07:02 AM »
I hope it is all behind them now. They all say it is. So i'll go with that.

Is because you've spoken to someone who knows, or just based on the media reports and 'statements'?

I was fully willing to give the Americans the benefit of the doubt, but things have just been getting worse and worse.  Every time Hicks opens his mouth, he puts another foot in it - his mouth must look like a branch of Brantano by now.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1780 on: January 15, 2008, 11:10:08 AM »
Then you clearly don't remember the football we played under Houllier, because if you think they're comparable I can tell you you're mistaken.

Of course it's much better now, but look at the football we play when Rafa makes big changes to the squad consistently (Wigan at home, birmingham at home, Marseille at home etc).
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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1781 on: January 15, 2008, 12:00:54 PM »
Of course it's much better now, but look at the football we play when Rafa makes big changes to the squad consistently (Wigan at home, birmingham at home, Marseille at home etc).

He only made three changes for the Wigan match at home from Man City away and two changes for Brum home from Porto away. In fact the Marseilles home match is the only one of those three where he actually has made big changes (five changes from Wigan away).

That's without checking whether any of those changes were due to injury or suspension too. I suppose it's easier to whinge about something if you don't actually check whether it's true first though.
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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1782 on: January 15, 2008, 12:07:10 PM »
We're going no-where under Rafa. His football philosophies aren't working in the league and he can't change them.

I would go as far as to say that he is 'GH mark II'. My reason for this is that I think he has taken us as far as he can, and he has begun to lose the confidence of the players in addition to the owners, who would be forced to keep him on, btw, if he were to change our fortunes and show us progress in the league.

We can't rely on good Cup runs forever - the league is the only true measure of a side and ours is no-where near the top three in terms of quality and consistency.

Actually, you look at it the other way.

The bloke's done a absolutely fucking grade A job with the money and resources he's had at his disposal.

Remember the dross he had to win us the Champions League?

We can beat anyone on our day, but over a season, we lack quality in areas of the pitch, that only chucking large amounts of money at, will fix.

Rafa's managed to get at least one quality signing per window, whereas the Chelsea and the mancs have gone out and got 2/3 players.

If you don't like the man, fine, but don't underestimate what he's achieved in such a sort time, with so little money.


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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1783 on: January 15, 2008, 01:15:17 PM »
People try to be conciliatory and offer olive branches,but you me friend deserve all you get!

Thanx..;)

Is because you've spoken to someone who knows, or just based on the media reports and 'statements'?

I was fully willing to give the Americans the benefit of the doubt, but things have just been getting worse and worse.  Every time Hicks opens his mouth, he puts another foot in it - his mouth must look like a branch of Brantano by now.

I have said why. It's just that people aren't listening or comprehending. Of course the british press aren't helping.

I guess i'll explain it another way one more time.

I speak Texan. Or maybe understand them would be better. Whether you want to follow along or dismiss it totally. It's not my fault.

There's is an old saying it Texas, you're word is your bond.

Stop and think about that for a moment. And please don't take what i am about to say out of context, just take it for what it's worth.

I've known and seen loads of Texans, especially those of Tom Hicks age where that means more to them than contracts and banks. Tom Hicks in his statements strikes me as another "one of those". As does his two sons.

I get a number of calls being in sales and as the technical guru for what I do from accounts around the state ( mind you I have the whole country). I get calls of get me what I need or I need to order this...and not once is price asked. That is because they know I ( the company) aren't going to rip them off. Whether it cost $25 or $250 for what they want. They also know the problem will be handled.  We don't use an automated phone system. You talk to us. That's the way people like to do business. We had a record year last year in this bad economy and january has started strong again.

I am used to dealing with Texans. They say what they mean and you don't need an interpreter or mystic meg to read between the lines.

So when Hicks is quoted, that is exactly what he means. No more, no less.

And the way the press goes on and on and on along with supporters looking for every nuance or conspiracy, it feeds itself.

Some people don't want to believe the owner(s) when they speak. Well fair enough for you.  You aren't alone but it makes for 50 page threads about all kinds of speculation.

Yesterdays events where Hicks said he backs Rafa was all I needed to see. Klinsmann is out of consideration and probably was after the december meeting. Hicks wants people he can trust. He doesn't need people complaining to the press. Does any company? So he gave Rafa the opportunity, face to face, not in the press to see what was what. He wanted to hear it from the man himself and read his face or body language. Wanted to see if he would lie to him. Harsh as that may seem but i'm going to tell you that's how Texans are. That's my take on what took place.

So Rafa is under that type of scrutiny. As long as Rafa does what he says, he's fine. He can complain or be upset with how fast or slow things are moving all he wants. As long as it is internally. If he has a problem he can call Hicks. I bet he was told that.

I am not going to get into a big debate about all the revelations in the media about various things. They have a job to do to sell papers. Their job is to take quotes and invent copy.

However, I do think that G&H need a better PR person. Someone who understands them and understands the British media for what they are.

I would take the job if asked. :P because the club means that much to me and i'm tired of all the shite in the press.

And I am still of the opinion Rafa will be here next season. Unless Rafa is lying about wanting to stay and I think Rafas word is true as well.

So there you have it. And why all along I've felt Rafa would stay. I had some doubts in my mind a few times. I'll be honest about that. But nothing from any of the relivant parties made me think otherwise the more I boiled it down to what they said. Especially after the meeting. It wasn't about sticking up for G&H as many want to think. It was about my own personal take on the situation. If it was contrary to many others, that's all it was. And I know full well I was in the minority of posters. What I do hope is that people at least keep an open mind. Hard as that may be to do at times. Especially times like this.
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Offline Rox

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1784 on: January 15, 2008, 01:23:21 PM »
So what you're saying is that you're basing it on your experiences of other Texans and not Hicks himself.  A generalisation doesn't make you any more right or any more wrong.  The only way that would be is if every Texan were Tom Hicks.

I asked you a simple question.  I had no axe to grind over your position, but your reply certainly makes it a little more understandable why quite a few folks around here are pissed off with you.  See, I don't have time to go through all your posts - you seem to have assumed what my position is and I was asking just to pick on you.

I asked you a simple question based upon a post I saw, and there was no need for the aggresive tone.  Little bit trigger happy, though aren't we?

Offline Johnnyboy1973

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1785 on: January 15, 2008, 01:24:17 PM »
Little bit trigger happy, though aren't we?

Comes with the territory in Texas.

Offline SquirmyRooter

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1786 on: January 15, 2008, 01:29:59 PM »
I've read some shite in my time but that last 4 pool post takes the 'cookie'.

Texans don't lie?

I think george Bush puts a rather large dent in that theory.

Hicks told a pack of lies at the first press conference last feb and people who swallowed it whole and sang his praises (like 4pool) haven't got the brass balls to admit they were wrong.

Ministry for truth my arse.
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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1787 on: January 15, 2008, 01:33:52 PM »
BazC ( no sic involved as i prefer to be civil)

You are close.

There were two seperate bets.

1: Rafa would be here next season.

2: G&H wouldn't sell the club.


For the first point; don't get what you mean...:

Quote
The word sic may be used either to show that an uncommon or archaic usage is reported faithfully: for instance, quoting the U.S. Constitution:

    The House of Representatives shall chuse [sic] their Speaker...

or to highlight an error, sometimes for the purpose of ridicule or irony, as in this example


Basically, I thought I'd make a little joke and say I have good memory 5pool (note the 5 and not the4..) hence the [sic] to show it wasn't a typo...

On the 2nd point... I'm confused- I did see the 'bet'- you said Rafa would be here this season (as would G+H, which was added as an afterthought on your part), but then I see you're saying the bet was 'Klinsmann won't be here'... anyway, I can't be arsed- shouldn't have said anything really.

Offline Jin

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1788 on: January 15, 2008, 01:35:47 PM »
Lets face it, we've been had. You can dress it up all you like, but the fact remains that we're worse off with these fellas and its only going to get worse it seems

Offline tomasjj

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1789 on: January 15, 2008, 01:36:49 PM »
So, if Hicks means what he says and no more, where is the 60 million they said they would make available for player purchases? Actually, this is what I believe Rafa called them out on .- asking for money they said they had, but then didn't.


Offline Hunts Cross

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1790 on: January 15, 2008, 01:54:45 PM »
Mourinho is probably regretting the day he signed with Chelsea because no one's going to remember the 2 premierships they 'bought' and his CL success with Porto is all forgotten

You think? Its an impressive record, whatever I may think of the man. His record is up there with the best, to be honest. Leagues in Portugal and here, and Uefa and Champions League success.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1791 on: January 15, 2008, 02:01:35 PM »
So what you're saying is that you're basing it on your experiences of other Texans and not Hicks himself.  A generalisation doesn't make you any more right or any more wrong.  The only way that would be is if every Texan were Tom Hicks.

I asked you a simple question.  I had no axe to grind over your position, but your reply certainly makes it a little more understandable why quite a few folks around here are pissed off with you.  See, I don't have time to go through all your posts - you seem to have assumed what my position is and I was asking just to pick on you.

I asked you a simple question based upon a post I saw, and there was no need for the aggresive tone.  Little bit trigger happy, though aren't we?

Not trigger happy at all. Nice spin.

You asked how I based my opinion, I gave it. How you interpret it is up to you, not me. I tried to clarify how I based my opinion.

Like always, people read what they want into statements. Naught i can do about it. That's why face to face discussions are best. You get more of a sense of what the meaning is rather than black print on white background.

I have a "sense" of Tom Hicks because i've spoken to his two sons. I can tell from them some things about their father. I also know someone who does have dealings with Mr. Hicks  and he's explained a few thing to me as well. If i met Tom himself I don't think i'd be far wrong with my description of him.

But you are free to draw your own conclusions. I'm only giving you my 2p worth.

And gotta run..need to get my sales calls out of the way so i can watch the match. So cramming a full day into a half..
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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1792 on: January 15, 2008, 02:06:51 PM »
Not trigger happy at all. Nice spin.

If you think what I said is spin, you really should re-read you post with my reply in mind.  Like I said, I had no axe to grind.

Offline Hunts Cross

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1793 on: January 15, 2008, 02:15:04 PM »
Yeah, and why do most people want it? For the glamour and the prestige or because the Mancs are closing in? Be fucking honest with yourself.

And yeah, I know of Bob Paisley. He's revered for being the only coach to have won 3 European Cups.
Fuck bread and butter. Give me 5 star dinning.

Glamour and prestige? No. The League Champions are the best team in the land. No argument.

Is it that you would be happy then, with only European success, and never win the League again?

Offline lionel_messias

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1794 on: January 15, 2008, 02:54:03 PM »
Glamour and prestige? No. The League Champions are the best team in the land. No argument.

Is it that you would be happy then, with only European success, and never win the League again?

True, you need to look how many League titles Manchested Utd have won and then how many we have. And then consider who just won 6-0 and can use Tevez, Rooney and Ronaldo in the hunt for another league title. We need to get our league act together, quick.

Offline johnybarnes

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1795 on: January 15, 2008, 02:56:49 PM »
4pool are you not ashamed to be a 'texan' after the way they've gone about it?
eh

Offline Liverbath

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1796 on: January 15, 2008, 02:59:41 PM »
We're going no-where under Rafa. His football philosophies aren't working in the league and he can't change them.


Agree. There might be a job available at Valencia soon as Kouman is messing it up so he ought to consider taking it. He was never right for the EPL as his methods don't work here as they would in Spain.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1797 on: January 15, 2008, 03:06:34 PM »
Agree. There might be a job available at Valencia soon as Kouman is messing it up so he ought to consider taking it. He was never right for the League as his methods don't work here as they would in Spain.

For fucks sake, we really have got some knobs supporting our club :wanker
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If I live to be a hundred and Liverpool bring in genius managers who win Quadruples and Quintuples for the club, I'll always point to Rafa as the one who meant the most to me.

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1798 on: January 15, 2008, 03:12:20 PM »
For fucks sake, we really have got some knobs supporting our club :wanker

You might be happy with mediocre performaces in the league season after season, but I am not.

Offline carling

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Re: Rafa
« Reply #1799 on: January 15, 2008, 03:12:25 PM »
Ministry for truth my arse.

Read a book called Nineteen Eighty-Four and you may be able to draw some better parallels for your argument on that one  :)