Topic: Some insight and perspective on Jurgen Klopp

[diegoLFC7]

Unless a catastrophe happens we will be in Europe next year. No matter if its europa league or champions league. If United win the EFL cup, and finish 5th and we finish 6th we will qualify for the europa. Same with the FA cup, the winner who will most likely be a top 4 side will win it and cede that european place for the next best placed team not already in a cup. Of course we still hold our own destiny in qualifying for the champions league, as we have to play city and arsenal. Next year will prove pivotal and really prove what Jurgen Klopp is made out of. His whole system will have to last over 50 games, so it will be interesting to see how rotation and depth come into play. Thats where Pearce gets the 5-6 new players in the summer comment.

[Roady]

Not the link, the fact that so many fans are already questioning him.

Honestly, if he's hounded out like they hounded out Rafa then I'm absolutely done with football.

Rafa to some degree hounded himself out though, all be it for the good of the club. Totally different situation. I don't think any fan is hounding out klopp . Relax a little. It's going to be a hell of a ride

[Mr Mingebag Squid]

and to think some myopic gobshites are already saying the honeymoon's over....reality is we're still outside the church...getting the order of the photos right...forming an orderly procession and waiting for the nuptials to begin




*other metaphors are available

we've still got the fucking of bridesmaids to come? Oh boy! 

[Alan B'Stard]

I find this thread quite cringe worthy. Not long ago we were hailing Klopp as the new messiah that was going to bring home a league title. 1 bad month where we hit poor form (like most if not all teams during a season) and the man is being questioned?!

Question not the manger at this stage, but the players he has at his disposal. Klopp was never going to make wholesale changes because; a) the club can't afford to do that and b) it would disrupt the balance of trying to gel a new team together. The signings he has brought in so far have been impressive. Karius will take time to adapt and Klavan is a short term signing. Matip, Gini and Sadio have been brilliant.

Perhaps 2 more windows and he'll have a team worthy of competing far more consistently. Until then we are 2 points from 2nd, have have made huge strides from where we were under Brendan with 13/14 season being an exception and a one off!

Sick of this we need success yesterday BS. Klopp has had 1 summer transfer window to mould a team, that is perspective! 

[Chris~]

Not sure which Klopp topic to put this in but here's him talking about the winter schedule and physical impact.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/feb/16/jurgen-klopp-liverpool-efl-cup-chelsea?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Tweet

[Solomon Grundy]

We need to make sure we have a bigger squad with more quality, so we will be able to handle possible fixture congestion much better next time around.

[ToneLa]

I find this thread quite cringe worthy. Not long ago we were hailing Klopp as the new messiah that was going to bring home a league title. 1 bad month where we hit poor form (like most if not all teams during a season) and the man is being questioned?!

First couple of pages are sound mate, it's all these negative doomsayers with no balls clogging up threads 

[jillcwhomever]

Some interesting facts from Klopp's first 500 days as Liverpool manager.


500 days of Jürgen Klopp: The facts and figures so far

 Today marks exactly 500 days since Jürgen Klopp was appointed as Liverpool boss. Club statistician Ged Rea looks at all the key facts and figures from the manager's tenure to date...

Jürgen reached 50 games in charge (in all competitions) in a quicker time following his appointment than any other Liverpool manager in history (217 days).

He currently averages 1.80 goals per game as Liverpool manager (the sixth-best in the club's history) and 1.98 in league matches (joint-third best ever).

Klopp won 26 of his opening 50 league games - only Kenny Dalglish and Bill Shankly had a better win ratio.

He was unbeaten in his first six games in all competitions - the longest run without defeat following appointment since Bob Paisley and the third-longest ever at the helm of Liverpool as a Football League club.

Liverpool took 48 league games to reach the milestone of 100 goals under Klopp. It was achieved in the joint-fewest number of top-flight matches, along with Dalglish in 1986.

Jürgen has selected three of the four youngest starting XIs ever sent onto a field by a Reds manager. All came in the FA Cup - both ties against Plymouth Argyle this season and the match at Exeter City last year.

Players with most appearances under Jürgen (all competitions): Roberto Firmino 72, Nathaniel Clyne 70, Adam Lallana 69.

Players with most appearances under Jürgen (league): Roberto Firmino 49, Nathaniel Clyne 49, Adam Lallana 49.

Most goals since Jürgen took over (league): Roberto Firmino 18, Philippe Coutinho 12.

Most goals since Jürgen took over (all competitions): Roberto Firmino 20, Divock Origi 18, Philippe Coutinho 17, Daniel Sturridge 17.

His first goalscorer as Liverpool manager was also a German - Emre Can against Rubin Kazan in the Europa League.

Klopp has given debuts to 19 players, including 10 who came through the Academy: Trent Alexander-Arnold, Sergi Canos, Ovie Ejaria, Ryan Kent, Joe Maguire, Sheyi Ojo, Connor Randall, Danny Ward, Harry Wilson and Ben Woodburn. 

27 different scorers have found the net for the Reds since he became manager - he has used 44 outfield players.

In December, he became the first Liverpool manager in history ever to win his first two derby matches in charge.

Of all the teams he has faced more than once in the Premier League he has a 100 per cent win record against three - Manchester City (in three games), Everton (two), Stoke City (two).

23 goals have come from substitutes during Klopp's tenure so far.

He has played 31 cup ties since his appointment (13 Europa League, 11 League Cup, seven FA Cup) and has reached two finals.

On 14 occasions, Liverpool have scored four goals or more in a game (seven times each at Anfield and away from home).

He has had nine different captains - all within his first 47 games in charge.

Liverpool have scored 155 times under Klopp, with 74 being scored in the opening 45 minutes and 81 in the second half.

The Reds scored 86 goals during 2016 - their best total in the league since 1985.

[ToneLa]

That's a sound post full of genuine info and warms me heart 

[Coolie High]

Whereas yes  they should give Tuchel time (and will), there is no comparison to the state of the club when both took over. Tuchel took over a stable club that's become a power, with a strong squad, Klopp took over a team in financial turmoil and who'd totally lost their identity. He barely had a transfer budget to work with for his first 3 seasons there. Tuchel is being backed to the hilt financially.

Yep, just like Jürgen Klopp did there, he won the league with two 19 year old central defenders for starters

Tuchel has plenty of experience in that squad, but chooses not to use a lot of it.

As for Kloppo, I can't even be arsed to come here when we lose, cos the vitriol would make my blood boil. And as mentioned previously and rightly in this therad, if fans turn on him as they did Rafa then that's it for me.

When Klopp arrived at Liverpool I couldn't believe he took the job, he didn't need to. But he did, cos he's brave, he's got guts, he's different, and he's not a manager who needs the safety net of deep pockets to pay astounding transfer fees and huge wages, such as the likes of Guardiola, Ancelotti and Mourinho.

Klopp is this team's greatest asset, and it isn't even close.

We need him more than he needs us, maybe time for some to remember that.

Agree with basically everything, but a line, the other option for us as a club was Carlo Ancelotti 3 time champions league winning manager, i wanted Klopp instead and think he is the greatest manager around, but we both need each other in equalling amounts.

[RedForeverTT]

Klopp is the best thing that happened to us for the long time. In the short time, he has given us pride, belief, enjoyable football, crazy quotes and loyalty to fans and players. I hope we will keep him for the longest time.

[SerbianScouser]

Top 7 mini table :

1. Liverpool              19 pts (9)
2. Chelsea                16 pts (9)
3. Tottenham           10 pts (9)
4. Everton                 9 pts  (7)
5. City                       8 pts  (8 )
6. Utd                        7 pts (7)
7. Arsenal                  5 pts  (7)

And this is our problem in a nutshell. We're absolutely fantastic against big teams that usually want to play football against us but I'll bet we'd be bottom of this league against the bottom 13. Don't remember the last Liverpool team that was this good against top sides but then utterly hopeless against the dross at the same time.

Klopp has clearly not yet figured out how to cope against direct teams but on the other hand this is a slightly less difficult problem to solve rather than if it was other way around.

You can bet your bottom dollar that we're gonna beat Arsenal next week and that we'll do well against City, Everton and Bournemouth but we're probably ain't beating W.Ham, Watford and maybe Wba.

[jillcwhomever]

He needs to start trying out Ben Woodburn a bit more against the smaller teams. Even if its for twenty minutes, then maybe increase it and give him a genuine run of games. He made a chance for Gini who should have done better than he did. He is just someone who is different, none of those teams are going to know much about him, so lets just give it a try.

[ANFIELDGATES]

someone said recently that whiskey nose always sat the utd team down at the start of the season and they went thru the fixturesand he would basically tell the team that the league is won by beating ALL the poorer sides and let the other top sides worry about beating them.he would tell them that they could beat the bottom 10 sides home and away and all they needed against their rivals was to not lose.I know that could be bullshit but it makes perfect sense.Play the shite like its a final everytiime and your more than 2 thirds from winning the title.Id love to see the stats from the past winners of their results aginst the bottom 10 and their games against the top 6-10 teams.I bet it would show the prem winners ,top of the bottom legue and prob midtable in the matches against the top sides.In 2009 we finished 2.4pts off and we destroyed the top sides that year bar 2 draws against arsenal.We amassed 14 pts in the top 4 miini league.However i think we drew 11 games and that vast majority of those were against the bottom 10 teams.Klopp needs to figure out how to get that same feeling into the players that they have when playing chelsea etc.We were so complacent tonight,looked like we were still on the plane home.Any pro would have seen the reaction coming from the leicester players after they got the blame for ranieris sacking.Everyone knew they would come out all guns blaing yet we didnt?Fuck me what a carry on...you wouldnt get it in non league football.Anyone whos played the game would have seen that performance coming from leicester.Yet we didnt?Seriously?This ones on klopp and his backroom staff,its up to them to get these overpampered egotists up for this,the players just go thru the motions it seems and need that much looking after that they needed klopp to put the passion into them,yes the players should know better but obviously not our lads.Unbelievable....sry for that rant at the end but i lost my bollix on us tonight...fuming...

[SerbianScouser]

Just as I expected we're bottom of the Top 7 table against bottom 13 :

1. Chelsea                 47 pts ( 17)
2. Arsenal                  45 pts (18)
3. City                       44 pts (17)
4. Spurs                    43 pts (17)
5. Utd                       41 pts (18)
6. Everton                 35 pts (19)
7. Liverpool                30 pts (17)

Our ppg is actually better against the Top 7 compared to bottom 13 dross. That is just insane, this Lfc team is schizophrenic beyond belief, haven't seen anything like this from us.

[Scousebeef]

I see theres a #KloppOut hashtag currently trending. Un-fucking believable!!   

[El Lobo]

I see theres a #KloppOut hashtag currently trending. Un-fucking believable!!   

Meh, who cares.

Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat. Don't give a fuck, haven't seen a single sensible fan even hinting at it.

[Texas Reds Fan]

Just as I expected we're bottom of the Top 7 table against bottom 13 :

1. Chelsea                 47 pts ( 17)
2. Arsenal                  45 pts (18)
3. City                       44 pts (17)
4. Spurs                    43 pts (17)
5. Utd                       41 pts (18)
6. Everton                 35 pts (19)
7. Liverpool                30 pts (17)

Our ppg is actually better against the Top 7 compared to bottom 13 dross. That is just insane, this Lfc team is schizophrenic beyond belief, haven't seen anything like this from us.

Are these done using the current table? If so, it would be interesting to see what this particular mini-table looks like if it factored where the team was ranked when the game occurred.

[SerbianScouser]

Are these done using the current table?

I did it manually with the current table but apart from maybe Everton this table was the same entire season.

[Texas Reds Fan]

I did it manually with the current table but apart from maybe Everton this table was the same entire season.

Oh, I realize we'd still be in last place. I just think the point difference would be a lot greater than 17.

[jillcwhomever]

I see theres a #KloppOut hashtag currently trending. Un-fucking believable!!   

Why are you even surprised? It's the most predictable thing in the world, who ever invented social media needs putting down in my opinion. Wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.

[Redsnappa]

I see theres a #KloppOut hashtag currently trending. Un-fucking believable!!   

It's only trending cos people are complaining about it trending 

[Giono]

Meh, who cares.

Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat. Don't give a fuck, haven't seen a single sensible fan even hinting at it.

Twitter is a psychological dumping ground. It's more about the writer of the tweet than it is about the supposed subject.

Klopp is today's fire hydrant for them to relieve themselves on.

[idontknow]

Klopp is the best thing that happened to us for the long time. In the short time, he has given us pride, belief, enjoyable football, crazy quotes and loyalty to fans and players. I hope we will keep him for the longest time.

Yep yep yep, don't know how to say it any better, if I was 9 years old and a girl I'd want Klopp socks, and if I was a boy the same age I'd a want a Klopp patch on my back left jean pocket. I am a bit 70s, or retro as I understand it's called now, but that's when the game had fire, passion, brilliance, discipline, control, organisation, teamwork, passing, swiftness, interchange, tackling, support, great songs, except by the clubs, amazing theme tunes,  trophies teams wanted to win, programmes you wanted to hold onto, and half-decent the pies.

Obviously, the game has improved a lot since then, the increase in the amount I spend on it must prove that, I'm not stoopid, I get to see slack half-arsedness, wayward shooting, girlie heading, toe-nail crimping tackling, groans from the crowd when they do wake up, to hear the entire Mantovani for the Decrepit turntable classic LP,  and get informed by managers who spend most of the match rehearsing their after-match presser monologue just for me, we came, we dug in, we got a draw, should have had a penno, the linesman kicking crap out our mascot was diabolical, but the blatant handball for our offside equaliser, I didn't see that, was too busy texting my cat about a geezer she knows out in the Caymans with a good eye for a defensive position I might want to use.

Ok, ta, nothing to see there, and now back to the studio where Jurgen Klopp is in the news again for Liverpool being awful. And here's Jurgen with the weather ...

At which point I just quote you again RedForeverTT, and take my journey upstairs to the quiet room 

[invader_gir]

Unless a catastrophe happens we will be in Europe next year.

moving from sure to hit top 4 to ok we might be in europe thanks to united winning the cup and moving above us... kill me now

[dangerpuss]

The most worrying thing about this whole debacle is Klopp doesn't seem capable of learning from tactical errors. You can't just blame the players when the tactics are so obviously wrong. Lucas and a high line against Vardy is just stupid.

Klopp should be under pressure.  It's not just that he's losing games but it's who he's losing to and the consistent manner in which he's losing. His tactics against Leicester were baffling. I'd like to hear from him why he set up his team like that and why he persists with the same tactics against these teams.

[plums123]

I'm wondering is Klopp about to pull the same stroke as Hodgson, win nothing and walk away at the end of the season sacked with his contract paid out and a few million in his arse pocket, maybe he's realised he will never get the cash out of FSG to buy the quality of players he needs, and without it he is wasting his time, why did he keep smiling thro' the Leicester defeat Hodgson used to do that too.

[Phil M]

I'm wondering is Klopp about to pull the same stroke as Hodgson,

Please don't mention him in the same breath as Klopp ffs.

[LCapitane81]

I'm wondering is Klopp about to pull the same stroke as Hodgson, win nothing and walk away at the end of the season sacked with his contract paid out and a few million in his arse pocket, maybe he's realised he will never get the cash out of FSG to buy the quality of players he needs, and without it he is wasting his time, why did he keep smiling thro' the Leicester defeat Hodgson used to do that too.

Behave ya damn numpty...

[Stubbins]

Yep yep yep, don't know how to say it any better, if I was 9 years old and a girl I'd want Klopp socks, and if I was a boy the same age I'd a want a Klopp patch on my back left jean pocket. I am a bit 70s, or retro as I understand it's called now, but that's when the game had fire, passion, brilliance, discipline, control, organisation, teamwork, passing, swiftness, interchange, tackling, support, great songs, except by the clubs, amazing theme tunes,  trophies teams wanted to win, programmes you wanted to hold onto, and half-decent the pies.

Obviously, the game has improved a lot since then, the increase in the amount I spend on it must prove that, I'm not stoopid, I get to see slack half-arsedness, wayward shooting, girlie heading, toe-nail crimping tackling, groans from the crowd when they do wake up, to hear the entire Mantovani for the Decrepit turntable classic LP,  and get informed by managers who spend most of the match rehearsing their after-match presser monologue just for me, we came, we dug in, we got a draw, should have had a penno, the linesman kicking crap out our mascot was diabolical, but the blatant handball for our offside equaliser, I didn't see that, was too busy texting my cat about a geezer she knows out in the Caymans with a good eye for a defensive position I might want to use.

Ok, ta, nothing to see there, and now back to the studio where Jurgen Klopp is in the news again for Liverpool being awful. And here's Jurgen with the weather ...

At which point I just quote you again RedForeverTT, and take my journey upstairs to the quiet room 

Being a bit 70s myself, I feel much the better for reading that.

[wemmick]

The most worrying thing about this whole debacle is Klopp doesn't seem capable of learning from tactical errors. You can't just blame the players when the tactics are so obviously wrong. Lucas and a high line against Vardy is just stupid.

Klopp should be under pressure.  It's not just that he's losing games but it's who he's losing to and the consistent manner in which he's losing. His tactics against Leicester were baffling. I'd like to hear from him why he set up his team like that and why he persists with the same tactics against these teams.

To some extent, I think Klopp is testing the player's ability and intelligence. The high-line would have been fine if we didn't constantly give the ball away around the center circle, especially when the midfielders were out of position (such as Can for the first goal. He had no reason to be standing a yard behind Gini, and Gini had no reason to pass to his right). I think Leicester would have got in behind even with a medium block with the way we were passing. I don't really mind Klopp persisting with his tactics, but I do hope that he makes more personnel changes at the end of the season. I think we need smarter players in several positions to really play his way. He likes his teams to play on the edge where stupidity either punishes us or the opposition. Right now, we are just punishing ourselves over and over again, and Klopp seems to be ratcheting up the pressure on the players to show their intelligence. He did the same at Dortmund and shipped out the players who couldn't handle it over several seasons. Then they won the league and went to a CL final. I think Klopp knows what he is doing, although it may not produce the same success.   

[Gonebay]

I'm wondering is Klopp about to pull the same stroke as Hodgson, win nothing and walk away at the end of the season sacked with his contract paid out and a few million in his arse pocket, maybe he's realised he will never get the cash out of FSG to buy the quality of players he needs, and without it he is wasting his time, why did he keep smiling thro' the Leicester defeat Hodgson used to do that too.

Have some shame you buffoon.

[daj79]

I'm wondering is Klopp about to pull the same stroke as Hodgson, win nothing and walk away at the end of the season sacked with his contract paid out and a few million in his arse pocket, maybe he's realised he will never get the cash out of FSG to buy the quality of players he needs, and without it he is wasting his time, why did he keep smiling thro' the Leicester defeat Hodgson used to do that too.

How many fucking times. Klopp's philosophy isn't to spend big and it never has been.

[kingz]

I think part of the problem other than lack of depth or lack of quality at some positions is Klopp over confidence against smaller teams .. I remember with Rafa it doesn't matter who we were facing it was all about balance, how many players behind the ball .. With Klopp we attack with so many players and our midfield is so open unlike against big teams ..

[killer-heels]

I think part of the problem other than lack of depth or lack of quality at some positions is Klopp over confidence against smaller teams .. I remember with Rafa it doesn't matter who we were facing it was all about balance, how many players behind the ball .. With Klopp we attack with so many players and our midfield is so open unlike against big teams ..

To be fair Rafa struggled against shitty sides as well. Just look at our results in 08/09 with what was the best team we had since we last won the league.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I think part of the problem other than lack of depth or lack of quality at some positions is Klopp over confidence against smaller teams .. I remember with Rafa it doesn't matter who we were facing it was all about balance, how many players behind the ball .. With Klopp we attack with so many players and our midfield is so open unlike against big teams ..

you clearly dont remember the 12 draws in 08/09 which effectvely is the reason we failed to win the league that year despite losing only two games all season, and none of which came against the top teams.

[Anfield89]

you clearly dont remember the 12 draws in 08/09 which effectvely is the reason we failed to win the league that year despite losing only two games all season, and none of which came against the top teams.

Yes because we played two holding players even at home against the likes of West Ham, Portsmouth etc.

[Lycan]

Yes because we played two holding players even at home against the likes of West Ham, Portsmouth etc.

I don't think that was really the problem. We let Crouch go in August thinking we had enough fire power with Fernando Torres. Then he got a serious injury away playing for Spain, he ended up out for ages and we didn't have anyone reliable enough to finishes our chances off for us. Hence so many draws. Had we won just two of those drawn games, we would've won the league on goal difference.

[Anfield89]

I don't think that was really the problem. We let Crouch go in August thinking we had enough fire power with Fernando Torres. Then he got a serious injury away playing for Spain, he ended up out for ages and we didn't have anyone reliable enough to finishes our chances off for us. Hence so many draws. Had we won just two of those drawn games, we would've won the league on goal difference.

We were lacking back up upfront in those Torres years yes but we could have sacrificed one of the defensive players against teams that were never going to hurt us and added a bit attacking threat.

[Bend It Like Aurelio]

I think this is also a learning experience for Klopp, which I can understand. His players who have been here a lot longer probably don't have the same excuse.

I think he should be given a lot more time in order to get his ideas across, and also for himself to adapt to this league, as it is the first foreign league he's played and coached in. I'm sure that this would be a humbling experience for him for the most part, but I think he has the right personality and frame of mind to carry us forward.

And more to the point, I cannot think of a single manager I'd want to replace him with.