Author Topic: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City  (Read 11609 times)

Offline Hinesy

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Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City
« on: November 27, 2011, 05:56:27 pm »
Phew, we should've taken that, but credit to Joe Hart for some fine saving and more credit to our new sweeper Jose Reina.

Carroll brought on to do what he does best and plant headers in but not close enough.

Lucas had a terrific game for me and again Carra's previous injury looks good fortune with our defence playing very well against the team that 'scores for fun'.

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: November 29, 2011, 12:47:31 am by hinesy »
Yep.

Offline Aristotle

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2011, 06:09:27 pm »
I think first and foremost it highlighted that we are building a team. On paper Aguero, Silva, Nasri should be running circles around any defense they come up against. But we matched them man for man in every thing we did, and we should've won this.

Downing can't score to save his life and Carroll was unlucky. We should've won the game and City can have no complaints about this results. Only thing that has to stop is the careless backpasses. Reina's never had to run so much in his entire career.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2011, 06:12:43 pm by Aristotle »
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2011, 06:40:57 pm »
Flippin 'eck.

Theirs was a soft concession but it was a great ball in and Kompany attacked it like you want your players to attack it. First half they looked quite a side to me. Every time they broke there was a serious cutting edge to their play and we were stretched a couple of times, but nevertheless, we hung in there and did the last ditch stuff we're supposedly only dogged enough to do when Carra's there.

Charlie's goal was lucky but we started to build a decent foothold based on his work with Captain Copacabana. What a performance from Lucas Leiva. His legs are spring loaded, his centre of gravity's like a spinning whirligig, and no matter how big and strong you are, you're bouncing off him with pain for change. Charlie did his own work on that front too - we're a powerful side at our heart and we fronted up on that side, save for Stuart Downing.

We definitely grew into it and gripes notwithstanding, we're only ever gonna play as well against that team as we're either allowed to play, or (as in the second half) as we assert our right to play. In the first, they put intense pressure on up top and we did well to withstand it for the most part, but we still had our wobbles. They didn't sustain it, we started to express ourselves and show a little precision, and so the balance shifted the longer the game went on.

Dirk works. But you have to say you understand why Bellamy was going to start - he gives all that plus the inclusive dimension when we have the ball. And as for Downing, well, I think he's hiding - his confidence is low and he's like a turtle half way inside his shell in a Gladstone Small stylee. When players were looking for an option, he wasn't often enough that glaring option. When he had the ball, he showed flashes of how he can carry it at speed and disrupt an organised shape, but then somehow he'd footer out like a half sodden Guy Fawkes banger. Frrrp. Saying that, the mishit volley he struck into the ground (mishit? Is that unfair?) tested Joe Hart.

Joe Hart had a birthday night and was MOTM as a result, but Lucas was imperious I thought. Swap Bellamy and Maxi in for Kuyt and Downing.

Oh, and Charlie is getting fitter, but his concentration needs to come a bit more. But I think he's improving and making better choices as a rule. Pepe was a godsend - amazing to think the bloke sat next to me went on and on about Tommy Lawrence and how modern keepers are a disgrace for coming off their line.

For them, Balotelli was daft, Ageuro oozed class (liked the little moment with Suarez he had pre-kick off) and Silva is just a diamond.

Great game of football - really enjoyed it and I'm really bullish about where we grow from here.

Offline StevenLFC

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2011, 06:47:36 pm »
If somebody offered me 4 points from Chelsea away & City at home I'd have taken that. City started very well, and got their goal. It was important that we equalised quickly, it gave the team some belief. I thought Lucas and Adam were fantastic once again, as were Agger & Skrtel. I'm sure Craig Bellamy would have played today had the tragic loss of Gary Speed not occurred, however Henderson got the nod. I've not been as harsh on Jordan as others, he's a young lad with huge potential, and the £20M price tag weighs heavily upon him. Having said that, he was really poor today, and he knew it too. He was aware that he was having a bad game and tried to make amends, instead he just made things worse. I thought both keepers were outstanding, definately the best two keepers in the league, and Pepe looks like he'd make a decent sweeper too. All in all, we should be happy with the point and move on to our next game.

Offline the 92A

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2011, 07:29:33 pm »
Thought first few minutes, these are the real deal, they looked good they pushed us back and we were having to play decent one touch just to try and keep the ball, as the half went on we seemed to find our feet, then the goal, not the silky skills of Silva but from a corner from which City do a good impression of Stoke sending up all them massive monsters that they keep in defence. However I wondered about our mentality, would we fold but a lucky equaliser meant we went in equal. At half time though, we were talking and one of the lads says' for all their forward line apart from their setpiece they haven't really threatened, and we've had a few chances. I wasn't as optimistic but that's just me. By the way, at times looking at how high Cities defence was, they always looked vulnerable to the counter.
 
Second half and we grew and grew, I must say by the end even with the disappointment of not winning I was pleased because we looked great at times. Lucas was immense, one of the best displays I've seen in a Liverpool shirt for along time, Agger and Skertyl, Johnson and Enrique what a defence, at times towards the end we were playing such a high line I was worried that City may do to us what we were looking to do to them at the start of the first half. One of the best matches I've seen this season and during the second half the crowd sensed it and drove the players forward. Dropped two points at home but strangely satisfied, the Reds are coming up the hill boys ;D
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Offline The 5th Benitle

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2011, 07:48:09 pm »
Just hugely encouraging. Sure, we could have been more clinical, probably should have won but I'm excited by the performance. The challenge now is to play with that intensity every week.
 
Not going to dwell on the many outstanding performances, led by Agger and Lucas, but instead mention Downing. Quiet first half but early second half he seemed to divine some confidence from nowhere, started beating his man and whipping in crosses, got in good positions. Kenny at half time maybe?
 
Two cliches for you on Downing.
 
He just needs a goal
 
He will be like a new signing ;D
 
A word for the midfield...lots of discussion recently about Adam in a 2 man midfield. Well, when he works that hard, (as he did at Chelsea also) it's a non-discussion. I'd still like us to put 3 in there though occasionally.
 
I'm surprised at the lack of debate on Carra not starting. And pleased. There shouldn't even be a debate when Agger and Skrtel are in that kind of form.

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2011, 11:48:39 pm »
I can't remember the last time I felt so uplifted after a draw at Anfield. And it's not because we scraped a point against the current best team in the league. It's because we shook off an indifferent start to, first, match and then completely outplay them. We were very good today and once we'd knocked Man City out of their early stride we were gradually filled with a brilliant self belief. The Kop responded in kind, got behind the team with some ferocious support, and we were desperately unfortunate not to bag three points.   

The boys came away with more than one point though. The team grew today. It discovered it has nothing to fear. At the back we are an increasingly slick unit. The centre backs get tight to their men and the hoofing has gone. In Lucas and Adam we have two players who solve problems. And upfront we have pace and ingenuity. Downing grew as the game went on and - along with Enrique - began to pin the City right flank back. It's great to have pace on that side again. Every time one of those lads got the ball  the opposition's first  move was to take a step backwards. One day our right will be like that too. 

Kenny will have loved the fight and aggression. There was a period in the second half when we snapped into three hard tackles in a minute and sidelined three Man City players in the process. And, of course, near the end it was the Anfield of old. Reclaiming the ball high up the pitch and launching wave after wave of attacks towards the Kop goal. What a pity - and injustice - we couldn't stick one of our chances in. Full credit to Joe Hart though who is definitely now the second best keeper in the league.

There were some excellent individual Liverpool performances, but the stand-out was Lucas. He read the game beautifully and interpreted the needs of the team perfectly. Man City's midfield will not have come up against a better player this season. They came into the match a bit cocky. They left with their arses smacked. When we needed to defend Lucas was there. When we needed to be patient he took the steam out. When we needed to pressurise them in their own half he turned the screw. And what a first touch the lad has. Doesn't matter the angle, the height, the pace, the spin - if the ball is heading to Lucas he will kill it and own it. I don't want to get carried away but he provokes the same feeling in me as when I used to watch Souness. Lucas has the ball? It's ok, all's well with the world.
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Offline barneystuta

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Re: Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City: Full time....
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2011, 09:51:53 am »
We have already drawn more home games this season, than we did last season.

We are one win away from equalling our total of away wins last season.

Bar in 2008/09, we always seem to let ourselves down in one area (results wise). And even then, it was probably a few soft home draws that cost us the title. It is so frustrating that we can't seem to manage both home and away results.

But I am not too disheartened, because yesterday, we were the under dogs, and we came out the "winners". We are almost, in some ways, like City last season. Not quiet as much spent, but certainly a team in transition with new players, and we just outplayed the best team in the league. A team that has scored 2 goals in every league game this season. A team that beat Manchester United 6-1 at the Toilet.

It seems to be the standard blue print this season for a home game, that we will dominate the game overall, but the opposition keeper puts in a MOTM display. Hart,  Vorm, Ruddy, and De Gea. 4 keepers who pulled off not one match winning save, but a handful of them. And in the other home game we played that we drew, against Sunderland, Mignolet (their GK) was lucky to stay on the pitch.

Something has got to give sometime, but I feel like I've been saying it forever now. Our next two games are away from home (Chelsea Carling Cup, and Fulham in the League). Two trips to London.

But the story is already written for our next Home game isn't it? http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/15905339.stm

QPR and Warnock screaming of a goal keeper shortage. Paddy Kenny out for 2 months. Brian Murphy has played one Carling Cup game this season (and is also injured). Elvijs Putnins has been recalled from a non league side. And Radek Cerny, a 37 year old veteran, played on the weekend. Which one is going to play a blinder against us next week then?

But in all seriousness, I am pleased with how we are playing, and frustrated that we don't have as many points on the board. But things are going the right way, we are playing the right way.

Bring on Chelsea again, where our 11 will probably have 7 or 8 changes (possibly more), and lets maintain the momentum we have gained. We are unbeaten, we have a belief we can remain that way. And, away from home, that is vital. At home though, we need to get a winning mentality, and lets hope we get that come QPR.

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Re: Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City: Full time....
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2011, 11:30:04 am »
Well Few points after calming down and watching the game again with no emotions this time:

1-Lucas is boss, Pepe is boss. They're without a doubt the two most important players in our team along with Suarez. We're lucky to have them. Lucas in particular is making a fool out of everyone who doubted his abilities before. Pepe pulled some amazing saves, Lucas made sure Silva didn't have the best nights out at Anfield.

2- 4-4-2 IS NOT our best formation, a variation of 4-5-1 is our best formation and it suits our individuals perfectly. We need to keep employing the same tactics we used against Chelsea and City, IMO one of our problems this season against the smaller teams is that we don't hold the ball for a long time because of the shortage in midfielders because usually teams who face us fill their midfield with bodies and try to play us on the counter. This didn't happen last night and for the majority of the game, Lucas, Adam and Henderson were dominating Silva, Toure and Barry. Adam played two good games when he had two players along with him in the middle of the park and IMO it should be this way as always. Last night with Lucas and Henderson behind him, Adam was able to move higher up the pitch without being afraid of leaving our midfield short of bodies since he had two players covering him, thus he was able to get more chances to shoot on goal (one of which deflected and resulted in our goal) and also be able to give very nice through balls to Suarez, Downing and Kuyt.

3- Agger and Skrtel in defense is an excellent partnership, both play the ball on the turf without any hoofs, thus allowing us to build play from the back, both press high up the pitch which give us a better chance of retrieving the ball back from the opposition quickly and Pepe is able to play as a sweeper keeper, something he always liked as it gives him better command of his area. Last night our defense had a little bit of Rafa style organization in it.

4- The Fullback did an awesome job, Enrique and Johnson limited Nasri and Milner most of the night. Johnson continues to prove that on his day he is one of the best Fullbacks in the league and I'm sure Newcastle will look at Enrique and say how the hell did we sell him for 6m pounds only.

5- Carroll was unlucky and so was Suarez, Kompany should have been sent off way early in the first half but Atkinson kept ignoring his hideous tackles on our players, we need to be more cynical though.

6- Downing played better last night, he needs to be more effective though, and helps Enrique in the defensive duties. Kuyt did well, although sometimes I thought that maybe if we had Bellamy and Maxi on the wings we could have looked more dangerous.

Bottom line is we need to take our chances better and be more consistent and I'm sure we will be there among the teams who will qualify for the CL come May.
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Offline Danyaals Kop

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2011, 12:17:45 pm »
Second side to make Man City drop points domestically.

Brilliant performance by the team in general but worthy mentions to Lucas, Adam, Agger & Pepe.

The Kop was phenomenal.

Many positives can be taken from the game.

I can't remember the last time I felt so uplifted after a draw at Anfield. And it's not because we scraped a point against the current best team in the league. It's because we shook off an indifferent start to, first, match and then completely outplay them. We were very good today and once we'd knocked Man City out of their early stride we were gradually filled with a brilliant self belief. The Kop responded in kind, got behind the team with some ferocious support, and we were desperately unfortunate not to bag three points.   

The boys came away with more than one point though. The team grew today. It discovered it has nothing to fear. At the back we are an increasingly slick unit. The centre backs get tight to their men and the hoofing has gone. In Lucas and Adam we have two players who solve problems. And upfront we have pace and ingenuity. Downing grew as the game went on and - along with Enrique - began to pin the City right flank back. It's great to have pace on that side again. Every time one of those lads got the ball  the opposition's first  move was to take a step backwards. One day our right will be like that too. 

Kenny will have loved the fight and aggression. There was a period in the second half when we snapped into three hard tackles in a minute and sidelined three Man City players in the process. And, of course, near the end it was the Anfield of old. Reclaiming the ball high up the pitch and launching wave after wave of attacks towards the Kop goal. What a pity - and injustice - we couldn't stick one of our chances in. Full credit to Joe Hart though who is definitely now the second best keeper in the league.

There were some excellent individual Liverpool performances, but the stand-out was Lucas. He read the game beautifully and interpreted the needs of the team perfectly. Man City's midfield will not have come up against a better player this season. They came into the match a bit cocky. They left with their arses smacked. When we needed to defend Lucas was there. When we needed to be patient he took the steam out. When we needed to pressurise them in their own half he turned the screw. And what a first touch the lad has. Doesn't matter the angle, the height, the pace, the spin - if the ball is heading to Lucas he will kill it and own it. I don't want to get carried away but he provokes the same feeling in me as when I used to watch Souness. Lucas has the ball? It's ok, all's well with the world.

I pretty much agree with all of that.

Offline Chakan

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2011, 03:00:10 pm »
What a pleasure to watch. I was on the edge of my seat the entire game. I think that's the most important part for me watching Sunday's performance, we were an absolute pleasure to watch. It's been a long time since there was a game where I sat down and actually thoroughly enjoyed every aspect of it. It was nail biting , it had moments of controversy and generally had the whole package.

We started off slowly and looked to be giving them a bit too much respect, but there was a change sometime during the first half where you can see we thought "Is that all they have?" and started playing some proper football. Then the goal went in, and there wasn't much we could do about it. It came off his shoulder for heavens sake, could have gone anywhere. Not sure why Dirk was the man picking up Kompany, and it just compounded the issue by getting in Johnsons way.

We had the perfect response though, the heads didn't even dip, which seems to be a big change in the team. When we concede we don't just lie down now, we go and see if we can get one. Adam's shot was wayward and my nan probably could have struck it on target, but as he said in the post match interview, if you don't try you'll never score. Which is something I really like about Adam, he tries , everything. Shots, passes, tackles ... always looking to get involved.

From then on it was liverpool all the way, except for the slow start in the 2nd, we took a good 10 minute battering, but again we got to a point where it was "is that all they got?" and played like with an attitude of "Welcome to Anfield lads". We should have won no doubt, but you can't account for a great performance from the 2nd best keeper in the league. Hart was magnificent. He was the difference maker.

Positives I take away from this, pretty much everything on display.

Pepe brought a new definition to sweeper keeper, and while it's exciting to see him run out and do all that, I know Pepe will keep a cool head and control the situation. Like when they broke late in the 2nd half and it was 2 on 1 , the pass gets to Silva on the spot and who is right in his face, Pepe, making shooting first time an impossibility. Silva then has to try dribble around Pepe, giving 3 defenders the time to get on the line and stop any shot, which is what happened.

The backline was great and solid. I am loving the Agger/Skrtel partnership. Carragher is going to be on the bench for awhile. There is no reason to bring him back, Agger is a solid leader and we look much better playing it out of defense. Enrique was stalwart in his defending, his attack however seemed to be a bit stuttered. Johnson as well, defended great, but the few runs he did make came to nothing. Still much better than anything we have had for awhile. The only criticism would be the awful back passing, played Pepe into numerous dangerous positions. This happens maybe once or twice a game yes, but I think I counted around 4/5 ... far too much.

What can you say about Lucas that hasn't been said already? I have run out of superlatives to describe this lad. He was perfect. Everything he did was Perfect. Thank god Roy/Purslow never got their way, that's all I can say.

Now to the frontline. This is where I think we are struggling a bit. Kuyt used to be the man that would get into those right places and have that easy tap in for the goal, for whatever reason this year it just hasn't happened. Could be a loss of a yard of pace or maybe just having a bad season, but he hasn't scored for us in the league. We need to seriously consider buying a tap in player. Someone of the mold of Hernandez. We have the Aguero superstar in Suarez and I wouldn't swap him for anyone, but we need that person who gets into the box and can place a header or an easy tap in. 

Downing for me has everything he needs to be a class player the only thing he is missing is confidence. I think once he gets one assist or one goal the floodgates will open and he will be prolific. Andy Carroll did everything he was asked when he came on. Was strong in the air , challenged all over the pitch and his header in the last minute was exactly what you are supposed to do, get above the defender, get a powerful header on target and going across the keeper. Hart was just that much better on the day. I doubt he will have to do that much work for the remaining season. He needed to be at his very very best that day, unfortunately he was.

Kenny got everything spot on as well, from his formation, to the lineup to his substitutions. When they went a man down his first thought was go for it, get the win. Bringing on Carroll to do so. Screw this playing for the point malarky.

All in all well impressed with the guys! Loved it. More of the same please.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 03:03:22 pm by Chakan »

Offline blert596

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Re: Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City: Full time....
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2011, 03:42:32 pm »
city had a tough champions league game in midweek and they looked jaded in the second half
also when we beat chelsea and arsenal, they were in their worst form and we played them at the right moment

No offence mate but I hate this sort of shit that detracts from our performances. Its bad enough listening to the media spout it without our own fans passing it on as though we should be grateful not to have been thrashed by any of the media darlings.

A tough week for city? One midweek game that they had plenty of time to recover from. And with the amount of money they've spent then they should be able to cope with a midweek game every now and then.

For me, they didnt tire that much. What they did do was played a high pressing game to start off with. It succeeded for a while, but then WE seemed to grow a bit of confidence and started passing it through their 2-3 players that were hunting. Both Lucas and Adam were very good at making themselves available yesterday (after the 15 min point). This meant that City continually ended up being short in midfield and having to cover more ground retreating back, or chasing the ball. I'd like to think that we deserved somne credit for working them so well. Playing that high pressing game is hard work at the best of times. When you're doing it and the opponents are still passing it through you then it becomes physically - and probably more importantly - mentally very very difficult.

As for Chelsea I really dont get why we weren't classed as "going there at the wrong time and feeling the Chelsea backlash". Chelsea arent a poor side. Chelsea were as poor as we made them look. Yes, we maybe only had 2 shots on target, but its two that we scored. It seems strange how when we dont score due to good goalkeeping then a lot of fans cant wait to class it as poor finishing. When we do score from an almost 100% strike rate in a game its classed as being lucky.

Christ, weve took 8 points from Chelsea,away, Arse away, City and the Mancs.

We're lucky bastards us.
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Offline Sabu Pundit

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Re: Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City: Full time....
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2011, 04:42:49 pm »
my scouse Libpole got less Windsor home than when HM is on stake visit, Butt this irreverent after such intoxicate and rausch-in performs REICH SABU PUNDIT.

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The scouse may non-Basturk (i.e legitimately) arks who can bit this correction of champion? Who can dare faze this Bloo tight what flush Ceramic Furjism’s foulest forceps 1-6 an’ trauma Tottenham  tax-trimmer 1-5? Oh unbleeting generation, how long Willy Suffolk you?…it be Canny Sahib, off Kursk. Tanks Canny!

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Offline SMD

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2011, 05:05:58 pm »
I think the positives have been more than highlighted, even in the media. Pepe Reina and Joe Hart both showed why they're easily the best keepers in the league, though neither team could point to any sort of clinical finishes. In fact I thought this match saw both sets of players being quite sloppy on the ball, as in the game at Stamford Bridge. Skrtel and Agger have pretty much proven they can play with each other and fitness permitting should be starting every week. Johnson and Enrique are competent even at their worst and the whole back five are as good as any in the league.
Charlie Adam gave the man of the match award to Lucas and to be quite honest, that sums up the partnership now. It seems a world away from the frustration of early season when Adam looked to completely unbalance the middle of the park and Lucas was doing the work of two men with no support from out wide. Now we have a base that can match the best in the league and is probably greater than the sum of its parts.

We're still lacking cohesion going forward but the progress we've been making through the side bodes well.

However, we're still not totally comfortable on the ball. The game was end to end because both teams lost the ball far too easily. We're not talking about being under massive amounts of pressure here, either. Quite often balls would sail out of touch or fail to meet the man running onto it. Is it laziness or tension? I'm not sure but some of these players had no problem with it before.
It's quite disappointing that our flanks still look weak. Downing is very much lacking in confidence, when honestly he shouldn't need to be. He doesn't have to bang in goal after goal, he just needs to make sure he keeps moves going and keeps creating chances. Henderson also did his impression of a rabbit in headlights in the first half but picked up as the game wore on.

I actually thought Kenny's subs were disappointing. Carroll could've and should've come on much sooner and I felt that Maxi could've come on for the last 10 or so minutes to help give us composure in the final third. I don't know if it's his firm belief in his tactics - which I thought were spot on - or a feeling that our subs won't make enough of a difference to warrant deviating from our tactical set up but I thought City were there for the taking before Balotelli was sent off. Mancini clearly feared us a lot more than United at Old Trafford, as leaving out Dzeko and Mario with Aguero as a lone striker made a clear statement that he didn't think he could risk going at us. Despite their immense squad, I felt City waned after an hour and their subs had little impact. They really were there for the taking.

Still, 4 points from 6 against Chelsea and City is nothing to moan about. As always, the points dropped against the teams below us in the table bites us in the arse. Fix that and we'll challenge for the league. That simple.

I'm not overly confident about our quarter final tomorrow, though. I'm pretty sure Torres will play and I bank on him scoring. I can't see Suarez starting so I hope Bellamy's alright to feature, though it'd be understandable if he needed more time off.
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2011, 06:37:15 pm »
Looking at the League table, Man City's goal difference is +31. The nearest to them are the red mancs with +17. We're only 1/3 of the way through the season and their goal difference is almost double that of their nearest chasers. They replaced Aguero with Dzeko yesterday, both of whom have 20 goals between them already this season. That's 3 more than what our entire team has managed to score in our 13 games thus far. Their total goal tally is 44 to our 17. At this rate they'll smash the goal record for a single season. I think it's fair to say that Man City are collectively far far better than we are at this moment in time. So for all of those moaning about us failing to win at home yet again, when 3 points were there for the taking, they all all really ought to stop for a second and put things into perspective. That wasn't Swansea or Norwich we were up against yesterday.

The bad news is that we are a considerable distance behind City in terms of quality and depth. That's just something we're going to have to accept for now. The good news however, is that we proved to ourselves yet again (just as we did last week) that we're capable of being greater than the sum of our collective parts, provided we have the right attitude, commitment and concentration. I wont go naming names now but IMO there have been a couple of players lacking in those traits at some stage or another this season, which has cost us. Yesterday however, every single player gave it 100%. We attacked as a unit, we defended like dogs as a unit, and every player battled tooth and nail for his team mates for 90 minutes.

The result of that was us putting a team that are collectively stronger than us on the back foot. We had them on the ropes going into the last 15 minutes, and if it weren't for their keeper pulling off numerous top quality saves then the 3 points would have been ours. So what have we learned? That we've dropped another 2 points at home in a game that we should have won? Sure that's one way of looking at it I guess. Or unlike the Swansea, Norwich, and Sunderland games, we can use this game (and last weeks) as a welcomed reminder of what we're capable of doing when everyone in the starting 11 brings their A game and gives it 100%. Even if its against a team who are better than us on paper, we can hold our own.

Perhaps if we can focus on maintaining that attitude throughout the season then we'll get the points we want from teams lesser than City. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'd gladly give up the 2 points we dropped yesterday as long as we can play with 100% attitude, commitment, and concentration for the majority of the remainder of the season.
When overtaken by defeat, as you may be many times, remember than mans faith in his own ability is tested many times before he is crowned with final victory. Defeats are nothing more than challenges to keep trying.” – Napoleon Hill.

Offline UntouchableLuis

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2011, 06:38:21 pm »
I have mixed emotions about our season and indeed the draw at the weekend.

Yet more points dropped at Anfield when we should have taken all 3. Yes, City had only dropped 2 points all season before this but we had them right where we wanted them and we had ample opportunity to finish them off. It was the same when we played Norwich and when we played United we had chances to win the game and didn't take them.

It's all very well beating Chelsea and Arsenal and playing very well against the big teams (with the exception of Spurs) but to break back into the top 4 we have to put a winning run together. We're very hard to beat which is credit to the defensive side to our game but I still feel there's a problem in attacking midfield where Suarez has to be the player to link the midfield and attack but is also expected to fire home the goals. At United, Hernandez very rarely comes deep at all because there's players like Rooney and Young to do all the for him. Suarez is having to come deep constantly when there's no natural striker up there and when he does recieve it, although he's clearly a very good quality player, he's not superman and can't dribble past 2 or 3 defenders and score. This is why we are missing Meireles and why we're missing the type of player Gerrard is - someone to get in and around the attack and feed the balls through ala Luis Garcia or Benayoun.

I think the defence have a great wavelength at the moment. It's been a bold decision from Kenny to leave Carragher out the team but one that's paying dividends because there's no 'leader' of the defence now, everyone is instrumental and work as one unit. I'm not saying Carragher was detrimental to this type of understanding but there was always a tendancy to give the ball to him to clear out from the back but now we have 4 good footballers who can take the ball out from the back like we saw Agger do on several occasions at the weekend.

Credit once again goes to Pepe Reina. People have said 'Why does he come out and slide like a crazy defender' but I see that is a brilliant aspect to his game. His reading of the game is superb and he always seems to know where he needs to be in order to prevent a goal. How many other keepers would have gone to ground or done something hasty when Silva was trying to worm past and slot it into the net? Pepe is fantastic.

Of course, I'm happy with our performance, Lucas and Adam are looking like a nice pair in the heart of the midfield but the lack of goals for our forwards is worrying me. Every good team needs a striker who is going to score week after week; Arsenal have it with RVP, Spurs have it with Adebayor. Chelsea don't currently have it but Sturridge has been pretty clinical when he has started. I'd like to see Maxi play this forward role in behind the striker as I think he's got the brains to play there until we get to January where I hope we'll go after someone in this position.
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Offline Feorax

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2011, 06:38:46 pm »
I think the big thing to take away from yesterday is that we are finally beginning to see our best XI take shape. Our back 4 and Lucas (and Adam I suppose) have build a strong bond over the last 4 games, and I hope Kenny sticks with them unchanged for a few more league games. There is no reason to barring injury, and the fact that we can play a back 4 of Kelly, Carra, Coates and Aurelio, with Speo as holding mid in the cup games speaks volumes of our depth in defence.   

Upfront, we are less certain. Suarez of course is a given, but the lad is starting to look a bit fucked now. He really does need a rest for a week or 2. I would rather Maxi and Bellamy than Kuyt and Downing on the wings, but the former may well not have the stamina. Carroll is Carroll, we know what we are getting there, and Stevie is still sorely missed. Henderson is doing a decent job, but he's nowhere near Stevie's level, and won't be for a few years.

Our defence can deal with almost anything the league can throw at them on their day, yesterday proved that beyond doubt. Once we can sort out our front end in a consistent starting XI, we'll be flying.

We just need to do it soon.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 06:43:12 pm by Feorax »

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2011, 06:49:45 pm »
The stocky beefy stock of Mr Surly Atom is more sort Arfur each weak, and them trundlin’ Panzer-like run from mid-feel even floor mammoth Mr Micra Wretched’s giant jacksy.

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2011, 06:57:09 pm »
I think this is something of a confirmation that Adam plays best as part of a midfield three.

It also seems that Jordan henderson might be suited to this as well.

Do we want this to be the way forwards?
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Offline Feorax

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Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2011, 07:01:47 pm »
Why not? 4-3-3 / 4-5-1 will deal with a lot of situations. Whatever gets us out of the habit of constantly playing 4-4-2 (it's like the anti- pass & move formation imo, far too rigid).


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Offline Redeo

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2011, 07:11:49 pm »
I think Enrique is a great player, but he had a very poor first half yesterday. He was our only player to consistently give the ball away and in poor areas as well. He almost gifted them a goal, or a sending off of Pepe, and it was his tackling that led to the corner kick from which they scored. I felt he was perhaps a bit too confident the way he started the game, going for a bit too much with his passes, before he settled in. It is a balance thing that Kenny should help him get right.

Otherwise, I cannot really complain about the performance. It was a pleasure to watch how we utterly dominated them during a 5 minute or so spell in the second half (not sure if it was before or after Balloteli was sent off.

It is obvious that Downing is lacking in confidence, and he needs a goal and a good game. Kuyt was his usual reliable self, though a bit limited, given his lack of speed. I thought it was amazing that we succeeded in dominating them with a relatively poor performance from our two wingers Downing/Kuyt.

I liked Henderson's performance very much. He has an eye for a cross, and thinks fast which comes across in his first-touch passing game. Suarez was a nightmare for Company, Lucas was simply brilliant (MOTM, without any doubt), and our defensive unit was rock solid (apart from Enrique's shaky start). Reina was superb, as well!

With this kind of performance from the whole team, it is obvious that we are heading in the right direction. For the long term, we just need a couple of more world-class additions (+ Stevie) and we could potentially challenge!

The main issue of concern, however, is how we are going to perform against lesser teams. That is where our limitations have been most evident.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 07:13:43 pm by Redeo »
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Offline Sangria

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2011, 07:14:29 pm »
I'm disappointed in Sabu Pundit. Such a commanding performance, and yet no mention of Mr. Luger Sliver.
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2011, 07:17:26 pm »
Lots of positives to take from this, the team as a whole played very well and it's good to see Lucas get some press attention for the way he's been playing for 2 or 3 years now.  The Agger-Skrtel partnership continues to grow in stature and personally I think they've done enough so far to deserve a run in the side.

The one little thing to spoil an otherwise very good performance is the lack of a deadly 'number 9' in the team.  We just don't have the cutting edge that a Rush, Fowler, Owen or Torres would give this team, potentially turning 1 point into 3 on more than a couple of occasions this season.

But otherwise we looked boss, City looked vulnerable for the first time in the league this season that I can remember.

Offline Redeo

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2011, 07:21:33 pm »
I think this is something of a confirmation that Adam plays best as part of a midfield three.

It also seems that Jordan henderson might be suited to this as well.

Do we want this to be the way forwards?
Perhaps, but I think we need better performing wingers to make that work. With three in the midfield + Downing (not very confident at the moment) and Kuyt (offensively sound but limited), we need more attacking options.
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Offline Redrider

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2011, 07:23:36 pm »
A few thoughts from Sunday:

The sending off, worked to City's advantage as it destroyed our momentem. Immediately prior, we had them on the rack, with near misses and goal line clearances and with 10 mins to go the winner was clearly coming.
But, with the fuss and delay surrounding the red card, we lost our attacking force, which combined with an enforced reorganisation from City and a concentration on ball holding it took at least five minutes for us to regain our momentum, by which time there was too little time left to be effective.

Henderson was improved and played a lot of quick effective passes in midfield in addition to closing down effectively, but when given the opportunity in the clear to effect a killer pass or a stab on goal, he panicked and failed to deliver. Clearly he just lacks confidence.

We need a fit Andy Carroll, the late header on goal was Top Draw!

Finally, RIP Gary Speed. A credit to football and a big loss. So Sad!


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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2011, 07:25:12 pm »
I think that Henderson is a little bit in awe of his teammates at times
but he is a player who is going to be immense for us in the future.
If he fouls someone get on with it, look at some clips of Xabi, Didi or Sammy
and not look apologetic.

My thoughts about yesterday were, how lucky they were in the second half
and will it give other teams ideas on how to play against them.

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2011, 07:36:35 pm »
I think we have found our best defensive line-up. I'm still a bit concerned about set pieces but we've got a good blend.

Midfield....Lucas. Our best player overall (including Suarez). Adam.....hmm I still think he's too slow and ambles back at times. When Gerrard comes back we may add more bite and zip.

Attack....Suarez is a dream player. He terrorises every defence.

That's the basis of our team.

We do lack some flair in attacking midfield and we also do not get enough bodies forward when we attack. When City were down to 10 men we didn't get bodies into their box enough.

We are also still a bit weak on the bench. Games now need 14 players and we need to be bringing on some top class players.

So we are about two thirds of where we need to be which all-in-all is still great progress.

Bring in a couple of very good attacking players and we should easily get into the top 4. We are a match for all of the top teams but we lack a bit of edge against the weaker teams (who let us come to them but we don't have the players to cut them to pieces like City do).
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Offline montysmum

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2011, 07:58:04 pm »
I was delighted with the way we played and disappointed with the result because we played so well we really deserved something from it.

I dont think a single player had a bad game and some were really outstanding.  I think the main thing though is that this is the team to take us forward.  The defence has gelled together really well - the way the manned the line when Pepe was battling out in the box was brilliant and it is right that Carra has been unable to regain what was nailed down as his place.

The main thing though is the boost this game will have done to our confidence and belief.  Yes, we didn't win, but against the side that is generally regarded as being favourites to win the League, have got enough top class players to choose two teams from and who have hardly lost or drawn a game his season (even battering Man U 6-1 along the way), we more than held our own and eventually were unlucky to cme away with a draw.

The fact we managed to take the game to them and not be intimidated will do wonders for the team.  All they have to do now is take that belief through to the games against the so called 'lesser' teams.  If we do that we could make good inroads into the top 4 places.

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Offline Vulmea

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2011, 08:14:02 pm »
dont like all the gushing when we do well, just like a I dont like all the foul mouthed ranting when we dont

Think the problem with commenting on a whats seen as a 'good' performance is the negatives get largely forgotten - everybody is suddenly far better than they actually are - its like views have to be polarised somehow -

charlie adam is a prime example - how many times did he try and break through midfield but show himself a yard short of pace - at least three by my reckoning on another day when the opposition make  better use of the lost possession and the cm being out of position he gets slated - but yesterday because we didn't concede from it,  its forgotten and brushed aside - whether he's a perfect foil for Lucas I still aint convinced - he needs to continue to improve to be a fixture in the side especially a two man midfield and he's already improved a lot

the back four did well but they were also sliced open three times down our right in the first half alone - from corners we looked decidedly iffy - again on another day the opposition take advantage and a 'great performance' becomes a poor game when our players have done nothing different but the opposition have.

who was it that let Dzeko go near the end - that could have been a killer moment but for Reina playing Cb against Silva -  why can't it be acknowledged that players can make mistakes and still be top drawer - doesn't do any good pretending the lads aint human

I dont think enrique has played as well in the last two games as previously and his use of the ball going forward hasn't been great. Downing had plenty of opportunity to get at the full back and didn't -

Go through the team and the reality of it is that we probably didn't play that well individually - but as a team we started to look the part

Kuyts early treatment from the crowd was rubbish - granted he gave the ball away three times and was saved once by a fortuitous hand ball but it was his grit and determination which saw his game improve despite his mistakes and despite the crowd - sometimes I think we've forgotten how to support whether its Downing struggling for confidence or Kuyt needing encouragement rather than groans -

thought the ref was a joke - the challenge from behind is illegal isn't it - why then are their centre halves allowed to tag team suarez all match - its like their allowed 2 free hacks each before the ref does anything at all

our finishing is still rank - against Chelsea and City we've probably created fewer clear chances than against swansea and norwich but a bit of luck and and more clinical finishing in the Chelsea game has seen the performances labelled fantastic - that type of finishing in earlier games and we'd have cruised to very comfortable wins - as it is against City we should have won by two clear by the end

we should be at least 10 points better off than we are but we seem grateful to be where we are - its an odd one that - we'll need some ridiculous luck over the next 12 games to balance where we should be to where we are

having said all that we went toe to toe with City and should have won - our ball retention was much better than against Chelsea or so it seemed to me - we were our own worst enemies at the back creating pressure on ourselves on a number of occasions - in fact we created more opportunities against us than City did -

all in all I'm happy with the performance just not sure why

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Offline Tomo!

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2011, 08:21:08 pm »
I think this is something of a confirmation that Adam plays best as part of a midfield three.

It also seems that Jordan henderson might be suited to this as well.

Do we want this to be the way forwards?

Yes, with Adam, Lucas and either Henderson or Gerrard we have a nice mix that covers all bases.

Also noticed I didn't wince as much when Adam pressed for the ball, seems to be getting the hang of his defensive dutys without being as rash as he has been in the past for us.
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Offline steveeastend

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2011, 08:44:47 pm »

Great post, agree with every word, especially the Enrique/Downing bit. Concerning Adam I just wanna state that it´s kind of amazing to see how much he did improve so far. It was City we were playing and I think he showed massive improvement in his passing and positioning in which he got better and better over the last couple of weeks and which is the key for being a member in our first eleven considering the way we play as a team. He still has his flaws in defense and tackling but let´s see how far he can take it from there.

The rest of your post is just spot on and for the finishing... well, that´s where we simply lacking better quality in addition to Suarez. But that was clear after our summer business, only Maxi and Bellamy are able to add some shine there..

Imagining a team working as a unit as we did yesterday with better quality players in some positions I think we would have battered them, no doubt about that. With our new owners it shouldn´t take too long to get there.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 08:53:10 pm by steveeastend »
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Offline farawayred

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2011, 08:56:19 pm »
Strange title that, Liverpool 1-1 Man City 1. I guess we have one more '1' than them... ;D

My feeling/thoughts before the game - the result was not season making or breaking, but I wanted to see a good play. We are a team in a rebuilding stage and I reckon evident improvement was more important than the result against the runaway filthy-rich table leaders.

During the game - NEVER thought we'd have more possession than them, never! Let alone shots on goal and goal chances created... The intensity of the game was high, but there was a new element - enjoyment (after a game with such intensity my fingernails usually bleed, but not this time). I thought that we matched City as a team and we dominated parts of the game. We could have lost, but it never felt that way. It felt as we were in control against the league leaders. I wish we could play like that against every team...

After the game - I felt that we dropped points, points that I never thought were ours before the game. Isn't that the biggest sign of improvement?


I have little to add to what has been said above in this thread, but I wanted to drop this thought here anyway. Dirk Kuyt. I'm worried a bit. Kuyt has been the Duracell bunny for years, working his socks off until the last whistle. That's how we know him. But that's not what I saw recently - he's been 'lazy' (by his standards) on more than one occasion. In the past he had some periods of underperformance which have been attributed to him being a confidence player. I think that he is a confidence player. So, what happens to a confidence player who hasn't been played week in and week out? You may argue that Maxi is not played either, but Maxi has skills that Kuyt can only envy, so Maxi's been far more efficient when he comes on. I'm just worried that if Kuyt is not played regularly, he won't be a very useful player anymore, I can't see him as a bit-part player, a super-sub or anything of that ilk.

The silver lining in that cloud is that (IMHO) in the last 20-30 min Downing staked a decent claim on the right side...
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Offline redk84

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2011, 09:01:00 pm »
High quality game of football.

Was such high pressure....i mean if the Chelsea game was a game of chess.....this was speed chess. Very intense because we knew any mistake would be jumped on. Man City are a quality side and even tho they weren't their best, can still be lethal......think alot of that goes down to how well we played aswell.

The teamwork and movement off the ball impressed me the most in that game. I know again we could have won it with the chances we had....but there's nothing more we can do but create those chances. i'm sure the lads must be practising their finishing in training, if they ain't they need their heads examined  :o

The defence is solid. HAVE to leave it as it is for as long as possible....and Lucas well...There are no words to describe the improvement he has made since joining us. what a performance.
I'd say everyone had a good game....we were guilty of giving the ball away cheaply at times.....but City were pressing us very well forcing that. Enrique, Adam and Kuyt in my eyes were guilty of doing that more than most others(Suarez is excused cos of the difficult lone striker role he had to play)....Henderson ate up alot of ground which was valuable but didn't have enough impact in attack....and Downing drifted in and out of the game, however proved a threat at times and was unlucky with his shots....as a team we should have got more men in the box...but maybe the fear of the City counter attack was alive in everyone's minds. Still created decent enough opportunities to win the game though...

But that's all the negatives i want to say because of how good and disciplined we were.

I was actually impressed with how Enrique managed to get up and down the left side so often yet stay solid defensively.....Adam was very good in keeping our attacks ticking over and helped out defensively which i think he has shown great improvement in comparing his first few games with us.
Suarez was everything u wanted in a lone striker in that game....unpredictable, brought others into the game whenever possible....created some magic out of nothing. Johnson had another very good game, hope he stays fit as he is coming into some nice form....Agger is an unbelievable centre back and Skrtel impresses me more with every performance. Especially his decision making. Very good lately. Kuyt got in some decent positions and maybe could have done better at times, but his defensive work is very intelligent i must say..

And although Reina is somewhat unorthodox at times with his keeping....he's fuckin effective isn't he? What a keeper we have.

Was a sloppy goal to concede, as Kompany got a run on to the cross when he shouldn't have....but for the obvious fluke our goal was...don't think scoring with a shoulder was exactly the plan!

They had 30 minutes in the first half where they seemed to have the better of the game....we had the rest. But in terms of chances i can't remember anything other than Silva's chance late on that had my heart in my mouth (and some of our terrible passing back!). They got in some good positions, we got in more. They may have had a couple of chances, but we had many more!!
It could be seen as 2 points lost to be honest....and its performances like that and against Chelsea which make the draws with lesser teams seem more frustrating. The next 6 games are crucial.....we have to be looking to pick up at least 14 points from a possible 18...

Maybe as i said in the post-match thread.....the commitment to go for the win was not worth the risk of the loss in this game. A draw was good for both teams. We've shown we can mix it with the best, now we have to make sure we can dust off the rest.

My two pence and a bit of cheese at the end  ;)
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #33 on: November 28, 2011, 09:12:25 pm »
Very good game of football, the type of game that Gary Speed would have liked to pplay in so that was fitting.

I think our approach to the game from the 15th minute till the 90th was spot on, the lads really applied themselves and in the last 15 or so we really should have put the game to bed - the only negative I would put out there is Andy Carroll did not get a good 20 minutes to go at that tiring defence.  We need to keep playing this style of football and attacking with relentless gusto and let Adam and the imperious Lucas do the dirty work in the middle of the park.  We have played both Manchester teams off the park and sadly only have 2 points to showfor it - that will have to change.
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #34 on: November 28, 2011, 09:48:53 pm »
The pleasing thing so far is that we have been the dominant team in all but one game (Tottenham). Against United, Arsenal, Chelsea & City that's a decent feat. Even against Stoke when we lost we absolutely smashed them.

For all the talk of Man City's greatness I still feel they have weaknesses. I don't rate Clichy, I don't rate Lescott and I don't really rate Barry that highly anymore either. For me those three aren't good enough for big clubs.


You can't help but be happy with the form of the defence and our central midfield is really starting to control games. It's the same old problems in wide areas though despite the money we've spent but for me the bigger problem in this game and in fact all year has been the loss of Gerrard, he's the one player that can link midfield with attack and he's been world class at it. I hope he returns soon and I hope he can return to his best but regardless I hope we protect against his injury or the possibility that he won't ever be at his best again with a January signing.

Defense looks solid and I'd like to see it remain as is for the rest of the year (Cup games aside) and given a chance to succeed.
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #35 on: November 28, 2011, 10:27:36 pm »
...Dafyd Seavers (it true he higher his bodice out four pay, a hay hay).

LOL :wellin

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City 1
« Reply #36 on: November 28, 2011, 11:53:52 pm »
We've finally broken our poor-second-half-syndrome, having only permitted the would-be champions just a short spell controlling the game we took it to them for the duration. And so we all prefer the headline that City managed a point rather than the reverse.
Likewise Lucas must by now have broken the hearts of his remaining doubters, even those that want to squeeze more out his game must now realise he's an essential part of the team. Not many of us needed a powerpoint presentation or complex stats to appreciate how he smashed that game yesterday.

Its fantastic to highlight more positives than negatives. The CB's look solid, Adam proves he was worth the punt and the team is slowly gelling as a unit. All while I know there's got to be more from Downing and Henderson. If I was Steve Clark I'd take Downing on to the pitch and show him what the by-line looks like and inform him his his job not Enrique's to get his boots down to it.

Its no insult to Kenny to indicate that he's getting it right more than he is wrong now, its just time and patience isn't it. Unfortunately I can't offer either of those attributes to ar' Dirk, just think what we'd be like with a class regular in his place

I'm glad that the lads on TAW agree with my thoughts on a necessity to find goals from more areas of the team, some decent delivery to a regular starting Andy Carroll should kick-start that improvement.

All this with no SG, a quiet Suarez and with the potential of an addition just a few weeks away - surely we have our eye on someone, hopefully without the loss of Maxi just yet.

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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2011, 12:48:25 am »
Strange title that, Liverpool 1-1 Man City 1. I guess we have one more '1' than them... ;D


;D
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City
« Reply #38 on: November 29, 2011, 03:21:32 am »
On a minor note, after all these well-thought, comprehensive posts:

Enrique: He has remarkably good ball control and a very good dribbling ability for a full-back. Also, being strong and blessed with excellent speed, he can shield the ball well and can recover well. On the other hand, as others have said, he seems to have a bit of Riera-itis when it comes to making the right pass after holding on to possession and moving the ball forward well. Great quality when you're not chasing the game (meaning the fact that he holds possession so effectively) but not so hot when you're trying to score the winning goal.

He and Downing are not always on the same page. I understand the need for (and pleasure of) on-the-spot creativity and the rest of it. On the other hand, call me old-fashioned but I prefer the players, unless they've been playing together since they were wee lads, to have two or three basic 'plays' in mind when they're operating as a tandem on the flanks as Enrique and Downing do (well, usually it's usually in threes, with Adam or Suarez being the other end of the triangles).
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Re: Round Table Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City
« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2011, 10:31:58 am »
On a minor note, after all these well-thought, comprehensive posts:

Enrique: He has remarkably good ball control and a very good dribbling ability for a full-back. Also, being strong and blessed with excellent speed, he can shield the ball well and can recover well. On the other hand, as others have said, he seems to have a bit of Riera-itis when it comes to making the right pass after holding on to possession and moving the ball forward well. Great quality when you're not chasing the game (meaning the fact that he holds possession so effectively) but not so hot when you're trying to score the winning goal.

He and Downing are not always on the same page. I understand the need for (and pleasure of) on-the-spot creativity and the rest of it. On the other hand, call me old-fashioned but I prefer the players, unless they've been playing together since they were wee lads, to have two or three basic 'plays' in mind when they're operating as a tandem on the flanks as Enrique and Downing do (well, usually it's usually in threes, with Adam or Suarez being the other end of the triangles).

Agree with your point about Downing and Enrique not being on the same page.  I've said it in most of these post match discussions, they both want to run to the same place on the pitch, seemingly running in tandem down the line on many occasions.  Max works better with Enrique simply because his natural instinct is to tuck in.

On a more general note, I think we will have a decision to make come the next few matches.  4 - 4 - 2 obviously exposes the weaknesses in Adam's game.  So, it's no conincidence that his best 2 performances for us have been in the last 2 games when we have had 3 in the middle to fill the midfield.  The downside of having 3 in the middle is that it leaves Suarez up front on his own.  I don't think it's a coincidence that Luis has had his worst 2 games for us when in the last 2 matches when he has been up front on his own. 

I don't think Suarez is unsuited to playing the lone striker role, as he has shown, but he does need runners from midfield.  Maxi is good in this regard, he links very well, and Kuyt tries hard too, but from central areas Adam doesn't and Henderson hasn't quite have the positional nouse to do this yet.  Meireles was very good at linking the midfield and attack, as is Gerrard.  If we play 4 - 5 - 1 we need at least one of the central midfielders to get up the pitch to support Suarez.  If we play 4 -4 -2 to support Luis can we afford to play Adam and get over run in midfield?  Gerrard is obviously able to play in a midfield 2 or 3, and would solve this problem, but given his injury situation we may need to look for another solution to this problem come January.

Downing - I'm starting to wonder if he is fitting in to the system.  He's obviously a quality player, but besides the afore mentioned issue with Enrique, after 12 matches he has no assists and no goals.  He doesn't seem to be on the same wavelength as those around him, and at the moment Maxi and Bellamy seem better fits for the team.

However, I think the team is gelling better, Henderson is showing glimpses of real quality, Adam is certainly trying, although Kenny did have to tell him to watch his passing after another very lose pass second half.  Perhaps needs some concentration lessons!  Skrtel and Agger HAVE to be the first choice CB's and Kuyt did his stint fot the team.  Overall a good performance.

Lucas?  Well he was magnifique  ;D
 
Rossiter absolutely bossed it tonight. Really believe he'll end up playing more games this season than Lucas.


Henderson won't make it here. Sorry but he won't and won't