Topic: Individual Player Topics

[SP]

We have been having discussions in RAWK towers about the swamping of the main board with individual player topics. These topics have a tendency to become toxic. They tend to feature the same, small groups of posters who take entrenched positions and swing their handbags at each other. Much of it is unreadable to anyone joining the party late. After a poor result or performance, these topics tend to swell rapidly with posts that stretch RAWK's rules on respect to players and other posters. A sizeable number of posters seems unable to compliment one player without denigrating his rival for a place in the team.

There is a vicious circle of the topics being unpleasant to read, leading to less moderation, making them less pleasant to read etc.

The RAWK Staff have decided to stop having individual player topics as general dumping ground. Instead, if you wish to discuss the defensive options, write an OP about the defensive options, rather than shoe-horning the discussion into the Sakho topic. Then if something else defence related occurs worthy of discussion, we have a new topic to discuss it.

With unbridled optimism, we hope that this will lead to more topics, but better focussed topics, where people can read the whole topic, rather than just the last pages. Hopefully we will get less Groundhog Day arguments. 

[exiledintheUSA]

Excellent choice from the towers. I've often questioned the worth of such threads, all fans know if a player has had a shite game, the player will know hes had a shite game.  Done.

[SP]

If a player has a shite game, discuss it in the post match topic - it is a natural fit - and ephemeral criticism (or praise) should generally linger about as long as a post match does.

[Snail]

Very good idea.

[The 5th Benitle]

Instead, if you wish to discuss the defensive options, write an OP about the defensive options, rather than shoe-horning the discussion into the Sakho topic. Then if something else defence related occurs worthy of discussion, we have a new topic to discuss it.

With unbridled optimism, we hope that this will lead to more topics, but better focussed topics, where people can read the whole topic, rather than just the last pages. Hopefully we will get less Groundhog Day arguments. 

Please see this as a positive - and a chance to improve the quality of the LFC forum

[Card Cheat]

I've not really bothered with the player threads while I've been on here as I found them a bit too compartmentalised and restrictive. Unless I unconditonally adore or despise a player there doesn't (didn't) seem much point posting in them.

This should work better, at least if and when stuff gets out of hand it should be in the context of a broader more interesting discussion.

[scumbagcollege]

Rawk mods in locking threads shocker!

[The 5th Benitle]

Rawk mods in locking threads shocker!

For a very good reason.

[Motty]

Good decision this ,I try to stay out of them but you do find yourself dragged in to them now and again which is never a good thing.

[CraigDS]

Good decision this ,I try to stay out of them but you do find yourself dragged in to them now and again which is never a good thing.

Yeah, I'm the same.

I wandered into the Balotelli one and lost it with a poster who, after looking at his recent post history today, has posted about 95% of his posts over the last 3-4 weeks in that player thread and they were all repetitive negative shite.

(sorry about that mods btw)

[Motty]

Yeah, I'm the same.

I wandered into the Balotelli one and lost it with a poster who, after looking at his recent post history today, has posted about 95% of his posts over the last 3-4 weeks in that player thread and they were all repetitive negative shite.

(sorry about that mods btw)

There's always one or two in each player thread who are constantly there waiting for said player to fuck up or in some cases they make up stuff about his performance.

Bit sad really.

[SerbianScouser]

There's always one or two in each player thread who are constantly there waiting for said player to fuck up or in some cases they make up stuff about his performance.

Bit sad really.

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

[CraigDS]

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

Hopefully it won't be concentrated to one thread.

[Alan_X]

Rawk mods in locking threads shocker!

Have a look back through the site's history and the number of threads that are locked is tiny. The ones that are locked tend to be full of shite or dominated by argumentative fuckers giving each other handbags. If someone experiences a disproportionately large number of locked threads it might be because they are attracted to shite threads or that they are one of the argumentative fuckers.

[Trendisnotdestiny]

This is a nice and welcomed response. 

I hope to curb my arrogance and limit turning into a full scale "argumentative fucker" (AlanX, 2014) as my hypocrisy knows no bounds. 

And like Shady Craig I will try to avoid getting sucked into the vortex of distraction.

Thanks Mods!

[McrRed]

Affirmative action. Like it...

[Alan_X]

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

[Motty]

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

Spread the misery around so we don't notice them so much.

[Chakan]

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

It won't, but it will draw them all into a few select threads

[SP]

How is the cancellation of individual threads gonna stop them in doing so?

The player topics became so unpleasant that mods never read them unless forced to. This way there is no natural home for the bile, so it is easier to nip in the bud.

[SlowRap]

Will be interesting to see how this plays out, maybe we'll evolve into something like "Sakho appreciation topic", because I can see problems occurring with wanting to find out info about a specific defensive player without having to wade through tons of posts about the other defenders at the club. Another example is if I want to see Suso's compilation against Middlesbrough I'd need to now go to the "midfield discussion thread", then go back to the date he actually played and see if someone has uploaded anything whereas now that he has his own thread I can just click that to see if the video is there or not.

[The 5th Benitle]

Will be interesting to see how this plays out, maybe we'll evolve into something like "Sakho appreciation topic", because I can see problems occurring with wanting to find out info about a specific defensive player without having to wade through tons of posts about the other defenders at the club. Another example is if I want to see Suso's compilation against Middlesbrough I'd need to now go to the "midfield discussion thread", then go back to the date he actually played and see if someone has uploaded anything whereas now that he has his own thread I can just click that to see if the video is there or not.

Sorry but to find something on the Sakho thread you'd have had to wade through hundreds of posts about Skrtel, Lovren, Agger etc to find anything specific to the player

[leivapool]

How should we compliment any given player if they perform well?     Post match and it will get lost in a  sea of knee-jerking,  round table,  well it's not really analytical enough for that thread.  What's the best thread please?

[John C]

Will be interesting to see how this plays out, maybe we'll evolve into something like "Sakho appreciation topic", because I can see problems occurring with wanting to find out info about a specific defensive player without having to wade through tons of posts about the other defenders at the club. Another example is if I want to see Suso's compilation against Middlesbrough I'd need to now go to the "midfield discussion thread", then go back to the date he actually played and see if someone has uploaded anything whereas now that he has his own thread I can just click that to see if the video is there or not.

The 5th is right mate, there's no way you could obtain an at-a-glance update from any of the individual threads. You could read a thread during an evening then the next day after work the thread either contained the repetitive opinions that didn't distinguish the thread from the night before or something had happened but 4 pages of 40 posts prevented a concise explanation.

Perhaps this is an opportunity for more thoughtful posting and less bluster.

[B0151?]

I like it

Especially if it'll inspire some original threads

[The 5th Benitle]

How should we compliment any given player if they perform well?     Post match and it will get lost in a  sea of knee-jerking,  round table,  well it's not really analytical enough for that thread.  What's the best thread please?

There's a thread bumped about our midfield options. I'm sure someone will post another relevant and considered thread that will be applicable, too.

We are trying to have fewer player comparisons too. Whether it's Skrtel v Agger in days gone by, Sakho v Lovren or Lucas v Gerrard, it doesn't matter. We're tired of people favouring one player and denigrating another as a result. It's pointless, particularly now we have more games and a real squad to rotate.

More specifically...Look you know I have always rated and defended Lucas Leiva but to be honest it will do you good not to have a thread devoted purely to him, it will help your blood pressure! I mean that in the nicest possible way as I'm sure you know.

[leivapool]

There's a thread bumped about our midfield options. I'm sure someone will post another relevant and considered thread that will be applicable, too.

We are trying to have fewer player comparisons too. Whether it's Skrtel v Agger in days gone by, Sakho v Lovren or Lucas v Gerrard, it doesn't matter. We're tired of people favouring one player and denigrating another as a result. It's pointless, particularly now we have more games and a real squad to rotate.

More specifically...Look you know I have always rated and defended Lucas Leiva but to be honest it will do you good not to have a thread devoted purely to him, it will help your blood pressure! I mean that in the nicest possible way as I'm sure you know.

Well we can but try.

I wasn't wanting to compliment Lucas specifically,  but I get your point

I will however miss reading  pearls of wisdom from Jasbinder X and Mart365!!!

[The 5th Benitle]

I will however miss reading  pearls of wisdom from Jasbinder X and Mart365!!!

[Samie]

Good idea how about one thread specifically for discussing all Liverpool players? Similar to the Youth/Reserve thread.

[GrkStav]

Eventually, it may actually work out for the best. In the short run, it's going to be painful.

 

[The Flying Pig]

Just a thought but would it not be better to ban the posters rather than the threads?

[Trendisnotdestiny]

Just a thought but would it not be better to ban the posters rather than the threads?

I think the issue is systemic. 

The mods have already stated that some threads are dumping sites for wayward comments.  As a result, they spend less time there.  And the cycle unfolds....  I suspect the mods would say that they ban people they read, and they rarely enjoy going to the aforementioned threads.   Banning is an option, but not a panacea.

[Severely]

I don't really mind that these individual player threads are gone, but at the same time, I'd be concerned about the inevitable influx of condemnation OPs that will appear after every poor game. Won't the people who usually post their reactive bile just make a host of new threads to do this instead? And then won't that result in banning anyway?

[Mutton Geoff]

a much needed action in my view, slating one player against another is forgetting that they are all Liverpool Players in the end.

[Haemoglobin]

Myself, I just think this is overkill. Who ever heard of a football discussion forum without any topics for individual players, even your bona fide club legend of a captain? Can't really join the chorus of grateful applause for this, sorry fellas.

Even if you had to wade through some shite, it's unarguably more convenient to find something specific to a player in their own thread they currently had running, rather than a general squad position one, with multiple players as well as countless tangential topics inevitably being discussed by our hundreds to thousands of active members at any one time. Easier to make a mental note of and then recall seeing that boss highlights video or magic goal gif or whatever posted in the thread dedicated to the footballer in question, than one of probably several midfield/attack related threads. If you go to a general gif place to look for it, that's a full page of gifs loading on every one you check.

And what of being able to discuss individual Liverpool players from the past, and current players of other teams? The Lionel Messi thread, the recent George Best and Tommy Smith ones, all interesting and not congested at all. Much better to take a zero-tolerance policy with the culprits supposedly ruining the forum for everyone - maybe you should just take on a few more mods who will happily read through individual player threads and weed out the crap?

Plus, sharp posters putting raging idiots in their place is half the fun of this forum anyway. 

[Titi Camara]

What the fuck have hammers done besides hit the nail on the head?

[Alan_X]

Myself, I just think this is overkill. Who ever heard of a football discussion forum without any topics for individual players, even your bona fide club legend of a captain? Can't really join the chorus of grateful applause for this, sorry fellas.

Even if you had to wade through some shite, it's unarguably more convenient to find something specific to a player in their own thread they currently had running, rather than a general squad position one, with multiple players as well as countless tangential topics inevitably being discussed by our hundreds to thousands of active members at any one time. Easier to make a mental note of and then recall seeing that boss highlights video or magic goal gif or whatever posted in the thread dedicated to the footballer in question, than one of probably several midfield/attack related threads. If you go to a general gif place to look for it, that's a full page of gifs loading on every one you check.

And what of being able to discuss individual Liverpool players from the past, and current players of other teams? The Lionel Messi thread, the recent George Best and Tommy Smith ones, all interesting and not congested at all. Much better to take a zero-tolerance policy with the culprits supposedly ruining the forum for everyone - maybe you should just take on a few more mods who will happily read through individual player threads and weed out the crap?

Plus, sharp posters putting raging idiots in their place is half the fun of this forum anyway. 

I was in favour of heavier moderation of the existing player threads at first but the truth is I never go into them except when there's been a report to mod because they are such a mess.

We review things constantly and it's possible that player threads could return in the right circumstances. We  do things differently because we think it gives a better opportunity for sharing thoughts and views about the club. 

The internet in general can tend to be a very selfish place. People post what they want without considering whether it's either interesting to others or a repetition of something that has been said many times before simply because they want to post 'their' opinion. And there's a tendency to get into local arguments that alienate the many people who simply want to read the good stuff.

The match day threads for most people and certainly from the point of view of the moderation team have been a huge success. Do I miss the excitement of posting 'GOALLLL!!!!!!!...' when we scored to fill three or four pages of an in game thread, or the hundreds of dismal moaning posts about how shit we were ten minutes into the game?... Not really.

Let's give this a go. Who knows, more people might actually get engaged in the discussions if they have more of a focus and a decent OP.

[robgomm]

You may just find you have all around less discussion doing this. But then that's not necessarily a bad thing. Often after the match the player threads are a series of "great player!" one liners or a long discussion about whether someone is shit/needs more time etc.. Posts for posts sake and embarrassing threads like when Sterling was written off last season or we have pages of criticism of Markovic or the centre back debacles.

Discussing individuals as part of a team is much truer to the game we watch. I'm happy with it. But it may lose a lot of people who think the game is all about individuals.

[Titi Camara]

The bit that killed me was people re-posting identical posts. They'd put something up that either no-one agreed with, wanted to discuss, was banal or circular and because it was largely or totally ignored, a couple of pages later they'd post the exact same thing.

Frustrating in the extreme!

[Alan_X]

Discussing individuals as part of a team is much truer to the game we watch. I'm happy with it. But it may lose a lot of people who think the game is all about individuals.

"The socialism I believe in is everybody working for the same goal and everybody having a share in the rewards. That's how I see football, that's how I see life."