Topic: 2014-15 Loan Watch

[Aceldama]

The Guardian reported 2 days ago that Kolo is close to signing a 12 month contract extension.

[ThePoolMan]

His lack of concentration is worrying; he's just very prone to switching off. It won't get better under our coaching, either.

He's young and still has a lot of potential, but part of me thinks we bought him too young. I mean, he needs games, and he'll want to be playing for us, but two consecutive seasons on loan can't be good for his confidence. If we're looking to keep him around, he almost has to be our third/fourth choice CB next season and I'm not sure he's good enough (rather give him games than Lovren, though). If he's loaned out again next season, he'll almost certainly be in the shop window.

if we brought in better coaches then maybe we can address that

[JoeCole]

Coates was absolutely brilliant for Sunderland tonight, the best I have ever seen him play

[LFC State of Mind]

Coates was absolutely brilliant for Sunderland tonight, the best I have ever seen him play

He's demonstrated that he's a competent defender when the game is played in front of him and he doesn't have to worry about covering space behind him. His positional play is good and he recovers the ball well in situations where it looks like the ball and player have escaped him. His recent form might help him secure a permanent move to Sunderland. If not, his game seems well suited to Serie A.

[Kopenhagen]

He's demonstrated that he's a competent defender when the game is played in front of him and he doesn't have to worry about covering space behind him. His positional play is good and he recovers the ball well in situations where it looks like the ball and player have escaped him. His recent form might help him secure a permanent move to Sunderland. If not, his game seems well suited to Serie A.

He's a good defender, a player who reads the game well. He could deputize for Skrtel in the sweeper role in a back 3, in my opinion. Give him no protection from fullbacks & midfield and he'd be terrible (how we regularly play in a 4-3-3).

He's a better player than Lovren the headless chicken, though, who has no clue about positioning whatsoever.

[LFC State of Mind]

He's a good defender, a player who reads the game well. He could deputize for Skrtel in the sweeper role in a back 3, in my opinion. Give him no protection from fullbacks & midfield and he'd be terrible (how we regularly play in a 4-3-3).

He's a better player than Lovren the headless chicken, though, who has no clue about positioning whatsoever.

I'm not sure he has a future at the club given how little protection we afford the defence and how exposed he'd be considering our fullbacks are encouraged to push forward.

I agree with Lovren and had major reservations about his signing, especially as he occupied that LCB position and is an inferior player to Sakho who is our most complete defender in my opinion, but I digress.

I'm interested to see what our plans are for Wisdom and Illori. I think Wisdom has the physical attributes to develop into a decent player but he is perhaps limited technically. I know he did well on loan in the Championship but has struggled for game time under Pulis at West Brown so it's hard to pass judgement. I've not seen too much of Illori but, by all accounts, many consider him to have raw potential but he is still maturing physically so may struggle with the demands of the Premier League to be considered a viable alternative to Skrtel/Sakho.

[spider-neil]

Hopefully the performance makes Sunderland buy him out right. We simply don't play in a manner that will suit Coates. The way we play we need front foot defenders who can defend a high line and that isn't Coates.

[SwordInYourGut]

Hopefully the performance makes Sunderland buy him out right. We simply don't play in a manner that will suit Coates. The way we play we need front foot defenders who can defend a high line and that isn't Coates.

This is just my opinion but I don't think front foot defenders or a high line works unless you have a dominant midfield and a crazy pressing game. If these front foot defenders are made to defend enough times miles away from goal on an island devoid of teammates in proximity, they will make a blunder sooner or later. This, I think, is what Lovren is finding different here from Southampton. Rodgers buys defensive players best suited to play this high line, but his teams never play that system. The defensive organization for us always seems to be get a lot of players to run back as fast as they can and just defend with numbers close to goal. Oldham was a fiasco but Skrtel and Coates could do a good job together if the team is set up to play deep as it has been throughout this season. Also, Coates is very good on the ball compared to the panic stations, hoof ball and back passes that Lovren and Toure produce. 

[seal75]

He's a good defender, a player who reads the game well. He could deputize for Skrtel in the sweeper role in a back 3, in my opinion. Give him no protection from fullbacks & midfield and he'd be terrible (how we regularly play in a 4-3-3).

He's a better player than Lovren the headless chicken, though, who has no clue about positioning whatsoever.

What are you talking about?
It has been proved by statistics that Lovren is the best defender in the premierleague 

[Giono]

This is just my opinion but I don't think front foot defenders or a high line works unless you have a dominant midfield and a crazy pressing game. If these front foot defenders are made to defend enough times miles away from goal on an island devoid of teammates in proximity, they will make a blunder sooner or later. This, I think, is what Lovren is finding different here from Southampton. Rodgers buys defensive players best suited to play this high line, but his teams never play that system. The defensive organization for us always seems to be get a lot of players to run back as fast as they can and just defend with numbers close to goal. Oldham was a fiasco but Skrtel and Coates could do a good job together if the team is set up to play deep as it has been throughout this season. Also, Coates is very good on the ball compared to the panic stations, hoof ball and back passes that Lovren and Toure produce. 

Very interesting observations. But can you really call what we do "organization"?


I too feel our defensive issues are rooted in midfield and overall organisation rather than individual contributions. Young defenders are not suited to having little support so I don't see Coates, Illori or Wisdom really given a chance here.

[farawayred]

Are we keeping anyone except Origi and Ilori? (For the senior team, I mean).

[Mamadou]

i hope Texeira too

[farawayred]

i hope Texeira too

Forgot about him; shame! I hope he comes strong from the broken leg.

[Schmidt]

Are we keeping anyone except Origi and Ilori? (For the senior team, I mean).

Has anything been said about Ilori/Alberto by the club? Or is Ilori staying and Alberto going just the general assumption?

[Nessy76]

Has anything been said about Ilori/Alberto by the club? Or is Ilori staying and Alberto going just the general assumption?

It's an assumption. And it seems reasonable that we'd let Luis Alberto go if the right offer came in. The lad has serious talent, but he's not going to get into our side as the attacking player he wants to be. Still think we could use him in a deeper role.

[RyanBabel19]

Would love to see Alberto stay, he's a talented player and he creates and scores goals, something we need desperately

Nowhere near as slow as some make out either

[Redman78]

Would love to see Alberto stay, he's a talented player and he creates and scores goals, something we need desperately

Nowhere near as slow as some make out either

Would you know what his record in Spain was like mate?

[Redman78]

Does anyone know how long Tex is out for by any chance?

[Daniel Cabbaggio]

No idea what kind of break but for footballers generally playing again in 6-9 months. Cisse for Liverpool got back quick enough to play in a champions league final the same season he broke his leg. But players like eduardo took longer and didn't look the same again.

Tex is still young tho so that's on his side

[Daniel Cabbaggio]

Seb Coates looked brilliant against arsenal would love to see him given another chance here,

[Max_powers]

Does anyone know how long Tex is out for by any chance?

Think they said 3-4 months when he got injured in march so he should be fit by pre season or by the Europa league games

[Redman78]

Think they said 3-4 months when he got injured in march so he should be fit by pre season or by the Europa league games

Cheer bud

It'd be great if he could fit for pre season, could be a make or break season for him

[redgriffin73]

Does anyone know how long Tex is out for by any chance?

He posted a video of himself diving into a pool and swimming on his Instagram yesterday, couldn't believe he was doing that already.

[Pradan]

Origi named in the 'Worst XI of the Season' by L'Equipe.

[Nessy76]

No idea what kind of break but for footballers generally playing again in 6-9 months. Cisse for Liverpool got back quick enough to play in a champions league final the same season he broke his leg. But players like eduardo took longer and didn't look the same again.

Tex is still young tho so that's on his side

Nowhere near as bad a break as Cisse. It was a scan that showed up the fracture, whereas anyone could see Djibril had snapped his leg from the way it wobbled about sickeningly.

[Schmidt]

Origi named in the 'Worst XI of the Season' by L'Equipe.

If it's anything like Garth Crooks's team of the week/season I wouldn't read too much into it.

[skipper757]

The Origi thing is overblown.  Lille have a defensive-minded manager and have scored 43 goals in 38 games and are in 8th.  Don't know too many 20-year olds that would thrive in that.

[Red Sea]

8 goals, 3 assists for Origi in 33 matches.  Is it really that bad?

The whole team has been poor but Origi has struggled too.
He looks a prospect but not a game changer like coutinho is for us, or Hazard was for lille at an even younger age.

[bird_lfc]

8 goals, 3 assists for Origi in 33 matches.  Is it really that bad?

Doesn't he take penalties as well?

Either way I don't think it's anything to worry about. It's debatable but he might have been better off playing for us this season, or even a loan move in the Championship...

[Kopenhagen]

Doesn't he take penalties as well?

Either way I don't think it's anything to worry about. It's debatable but he might have been better off playing for us this season, or even a loan move in the Championship...

Yes, one of Belgium's three strikers, playing in the Championship. 

[Aceldama]

Yes, one of Belgium's three strikers, playing in the Championship. 

I remember before the last World Cup the Belgium manager was saying they were fucked because one of their two strikers (Benteke and Lukaku) was injured and he was considering playing Januzaj up front. Origi has established himself as the third man since then but the there hasn't exactly been a lot of competition for the slot.

[jckliew]

The worst team in Ligue 1......Gulp*

[Max_powers]

The worst team in Ligue 1......Gulp*

He is 19 has scored 8 goals in the league.

[the_red_pill]

8 goals, 3 assists for Origi in 33 matches.  Is it really that bad?

For a 20-year old? Nope.

[shook]

For a 20-year old? Nope.

I was just thinking about his age as well.  I couldn't find any French league records for 20 year old goalscorers, because I was wondering what the highest total was for someone his age.

[jckliew]

He is 19 has scored 8 goals in the league.

Confused 19 or 20 years old?

Plus why is he rated so lowly?

[kenworthy]

The Origi thing is incredibly harsh for a young lad in a defensive-minded system. It's a matter of unrealistic pre-season expectations versus reality. Oh, and selling papers and advertising.

[Max_powers]

Confused 19 or 20 years old?

Plus why is he rated so lowly?

Perhaps because of expectations rather than performances. There seem to be a number of players like that on that list. Thauvin for example is another one. There aren't many 19-20 years old players that score double digit goals in top 5 leagues, so it is unreasonable to expect that. Most strikers have their breakout season's aged 21-24, so its clear we have bought him in the hope that he has one of those in next few years.

Comparing his goal production to some of best young strikers at the same age we can see this.

Vietto- 5 goals in Argentine league
Dybala- 5 goals in Serie B
Harry Kane- 2 goals in Championship
Icardi-10 goals in Serie A
Lacazzete- 4 goals in Ligue 1
Nabil Fekir- 1 goal in Ligue 1
Jordan Ibe - 0 goals
Raheem Sterling - 7 goals in PL and he supposedly worth 50m pounds.

[jckliew]

Perhaps because of expectations rather than performances. There seem to be a number of players like that on that list. Thauvin for example is another one. There aren't many 19-20 years old players that score double digit goals in top 5 leagues, so it is unreasonable to expect that. Most strikers have their breakout season's aged 21-24, so its clear we have bought him in the hope that he has one of those in next few years.

Comparing his goal production to some of best young strikers at the same age we can see this.

Vietto- 5 goals in Argentine league
Dybala- 5 goals in Serie B
Harry Kane- 2 goals in Championship
Icardi-10 goals in Serie A
Lacazzete- 4 goals in Ligue 1
Nabil Fekir- 1 goal in Ligue 1
Jordan Ibe - 0 goals
Raheem Sterling - 7 goals in PL and he supposedly worth 50m pounds.

 

[Kopenhagen]

The Origi thing is incredibly harsh for a young lad in a defensive-minded system. It's a matter of unrealistic pre-season expectations versus reality. Oh, and selling papers and advertising.

L'Equipe are notoriously brutal with match ratings & coverage. Didn't they give someone a '0' recently? haha. I wouldn't read to much into it. He's a prospect.