Topic: Round Table Wigan 0-0 Liverpool

[new-red]

What's happening to Charlie Adam? The guy's been playing well when it comes to other aspects (tackling, winning the ball back, closing down spaces, or at least trying to anyway) but his main skill-sets, what he was known for at Blackpool and presumably the reason he was brought here, are horrendous. Be it the incisive, defence-splitting passing, or more worryingly, the set pieces. The corners especially are woeful. And didn't he put away all his penalties last year for Blackpool? Same goes for freekicks. Not to pick on the lad, cos like I said other aspects of his game are worth highlighting, but what happened to his set pieces when he got here? Has it got to do with something in training? Is it the pressure he can't handle?

simple: time and space.

At blackpool teams would aggressively attack that poor defense which left acres of space to exploit on counters and plenty of time to execute a pass.

At Liverpool, sides know that they have to press early and often and make sure that we don't get into a passing rhythm, which we clearly didn't against Wigan.

Adam's situation at blackpool highlighted his strengths perfectly by relieving him of the bulk of the defensive duties while making sure he was always involved in the attack. Classic Big Fish, Small pond.

At Liverpool, he clearly isn't our best player by some distance. And so he has to learn to work within the team framework and make the team function efficiently and effectively with less touches of the ball.

He has come on quite a bit but he still has a lot to learn and improve upon.

[has gone odd]

the game itself started brightly, looked like we were going for the juggular but as soon as wigan built up a head so steam they looked capable of nicking something.

as with just about every game this season, the longer it goes on without a goal the worse we get.

we need our captain back and a top on form striker. carroll will come good but not this season methinks. pretty much all the new signings have had patchy moments, look good at times and woeful at others.

glen left so many acres of space for wigan to run in you could park a jumbo jet there. defensively we are resolute and is our only saving grace so far this season.

[Fiasco]

We started well I thought, lots of possesion, quite a few corners etc but no real clean cut chances. Henderson had a shot which was comfortable for Al-Habsi, who I must say is quite a decent keeper and that isn't based just on last night. But it wasn't until Johnson when he was clean through that we had a proper chance that you would of expected us to score, and I'm sure Johnson will be kicking himself with that. It's also an indication of just how toothless we are at times up top, when the best chance of the game from open play falls to your right back.

At Villa we didn't need to get out of second gear, that would of been helped by being 2 up at 15 minutes but we didn't need to raise our game too much. At Wigan last night we struggled to do what we didn't need to do at Villa. We couldn't raise the tempo to such a level that we needed. Okay, the pitch was poor and everything but still, quality sides should still be trying to play good football no matter the surface.

Wigan broke at us like teams have this season with way too much ease at times. I said in the post-match thread and I'll say it again now: teams who are of more quality will create more in the final third and ultimately they'll score more goals. I'm not criticising the defense here, we have the best defence in the league for a reason, but the midfielders let players into dangerous areas way too often for my liking, something that was dealt with most of the time by Lucas. He's a massive loss, not just in big games but against teams who aren't scared to attack us.

And thats another thing, as good defensively as we are and considering we do have some class players in the side, teams don't fear us anymore. We need to get a ruthless streak in us to make teams a little more fearful of having a go.

[DanA]

Downing is the dead end of attacks. Far too often, especially on the right, he will run forward and A, look for someone behind him to pass too, B, turn back inside and run across the box - but not angled towards the goal and then pass back to a midfielder. He has absolutely no confidence, it is painful to watch. I hate watching it. Passionately.

Al Habsi didn't have a great game at all.

Henderson chance - hit it with his side foot straight at Al Habsi
Kuyt chance - hit it weakly right at the keeper
Adam penalty - a replica of the Carroll monstrosity against Chelsea

For all the good passing, I never see us pass it into a man on the edge of the box and then return the pass and try and work it into the box. We ponderously work it around the area and rarely create good chances. One of the only times we did it was the Glen Johnson chance.

I disagree that we can be positive about this game, we were awful and I honestly didn't think we looked like scoring.

We didn't look like scoring?

We missed a penalty
A shot one on one with the keeper
A cross squared to just beyond the 6 yard line with little pressure.
Henderson shooting inside the box when Downing crossed to him
Kuyt's duffed chance from the chip free kick

That's 5 good chances excluding corners and the other free kicks in good positions.

[djschembri]

In my eyes there were 4 clear cut chances for us yesterday:

Glen Johnson's run
Kuyt's shot from Downing cross
Kuyt from Adam's quick free kick
Adam's penalty.

That's four clear cut chances, and none were taken. Our performance may not have been up there compared to the rest of our games this year, but we still should have scored at least 1 goal from those four chances.

I think our problem with out finishing is down to our personnel. As the OP states, our aim in the summer was to bring in chance creators, and hoping that Carroll will come good/Suarez will finish off moves.

But Carroll is barely getting any minutes, and you have to wonder whether he is doing enough in training because Kenny, who has been very supportive of him, does not think he deserves too much of a chance at the moment.

Suarez likes to play around the box rather than inside it, and Downing has never been a prolific goalscorer, compared to other wingers. Kuyt has looked poor all season & Bellamy/Maxi our not long term solutions to our problems.

We need a striker who can integrate into the side, but who is clinical. It's a shame Torres felt he had to leave, because he would have loved playing in this side with the amount of chances we're creating.

[ScouserAtHeart]

simple: time and space.

At blackpool teams would aggressively attack that poor defense which left acres of space to exploit on counters and plenty of time to execute a pass.

At Liverpool, sides know that they have to press early and often and make sure that we don't get into a passing rhythm, which we clearly didn't against Wigan.

Adam's situation at blackpool highlighted his strengths perfectly by relieving him of the bulk of the defensive duties while making sure he was always involved in the attack. Classic Big Fish, Small pond.

At Liverpool, he clearly isn't our best player by some distance. And so he has to learn to work within the team framework and make the team function efficiently and effectively with less touches of the ball.

He has come on quite a bit but he still has a lot to learn and improve upon.

That would maybe explain the passing, mate, but not the set pieces

[skerriesred]

adam was poor apart fromt he pen, he wasnt at the races at all. downing was non existant again, kuyt looks like hes had enough and maxi was off form. seriously need to get to the jan window and spend wisely on our attacking play.

Sums it up for me. When Suarez asked to take the penalty he was rebuffed by Adam who then looked terrified as he placed it. I wasn't surprised when it was saved.
Adam had his worst game, probably trying to take a bit too much of the Lucas responsibility of breaking up play, he seems uneasy at present. Lost the ball too many times whilst looking for his pass.

[Danyaals Kop]

Was this split into the main forum or did someone just start a seperate thread?

Some one has started a separate thread by the looks of it.

That aside.... yesterday, we were terrible, gutless and it was nothing short of what we actually deserved. Our defence was very exploited very easily at times but that mainly being due to us having no defensive cover from midfield what-so-ever.Our midfield was in shambles - from wasteful Downing, to Adam's terrible slow game, to barely mentioned Henderson and non-existent Maxi. Kuyt should really have buried the cleverly worked freekick from 7 to 8 yards, and Suarez alone with all the trauma from the fucking FA and co. just couldn't do it all himself.

Defense wise - Johnson was terrible going forward and Skrtel and Agger did well to manage Wigan's counter attacks. Pepe was reliant as ever and José was our MOTM. He defended brilliantly and was the only person actually looking to fucking attack.

Subs barely had any impact on the game. Bellamy hardly had a sniff at goal. Shelvey's presence brought very little to the already less contributing midfield and it would be hypocritical to say this as when he plays- we moan and when he could have been yearning for those crosses from José last night - we could have won it easily. Yet, 5 mins is barely enough for him and thus he contributed nothing.

Tactically, I don't know what the fuck we were supposed to be doing cause obviously we were lost doing shit. Downing cutting inside to no effect and offering very little. Maxi's movement was abysmal all game long and Adam and Henderson had a shocker. So, from a neutral perspective - Martinez' whether helped by our awful game, got it right.

I have patiently waited before agreeing upon what kind of striker we need, but it is simple. Since Suarez is the one making all the space we need one who will put the fucking ball into the net.

On a last note, should Caldwell have been sent off for denying a shot at goal with hand, deliberately, with no one but Al-Habsi to save it, whether that was likely or not. Even if it did not deserve a red, it surely was a yellow and the second booking later would have resulted in a sending off. Just saying, cause we didn't deserve to win that game anyway.

[DanA]

On a last note, should Caldwell have been sent off for denying a shot at goal with hand, deliberately, with no one but Al-Habsi to save it, whether that was likely or not. Even if it did not deserve a red, it surely was a yellow and the second booking later would have resulted in a sending off. Just saying, cause we didn't deserve to win that game anyway.

I think the ref got it right. It was undeniably a penalty but I don't think it deserved a card. I also doubt he would have got the second booking if he was sitting on a yellow. He would have been more careful and the ref more lenient. I actually think the ref did a brilliant job for the game. No complaints what so ever.