Topic: Martin Ronald Kelly

[gloves]

Great game considering his age and that it was against Chelsea's left side!  I'd forgotten how big he is!

[will2003]

Another solid performance from him to be honest, definately deserves and run looked class defensively and wasn't bad going forward. Well done Martin.

[sinnermichael]

definitely deserves to retain his place.

[danwms]

Thought he was excellent.

[scatman]

Was it only me who noticed Kelly asking for more help and this leading to Dirk actually being put onto the right?

The lad had Malouda and Cole doubling up on him constantly, thankfully that lad Lucas kept coming over to help him out

[mbutu]

Did very well, cramped up early but sucked it up and finished like a champ..

Thought he was gonna score when he hit that left-footed strike!

[KingKolo]

He should keep his place.  Did nothing wrong when given a chance.

[jackh]

 paul_tomkins Paul Tomkins
RT @empireofthekop: Martin Kelly to get new 3 year contract http://bit.ly/aibHkL

[farawayred]

paul_tomkins Paul Tomkins
RT @empireofthekop: Martin Kelly to get new 3 year contract http://bit.ly/aibHkL

Interesting contract length... Is that certain? From what I read about NESV, the contract should be for a significantly longer term, but maybe I'm wrong. The difference is that in the US baseball contracts are honored, which would mean that he'd be expected to be with us at least for 3 years. But in football, with the Bosman rule in mind, 3 years means that he/we has/have to renegotiate again next year or risk losing him on the cheap.

Any thoughts? Has the NESV metrics system kicked in, or are they postponing long-term contracts until it does?

[Robert_B]

Interesting contract length... Is that certain? From what I read about NESV, the contract should be for a significantly longer term, but maybe I'm wrong. The difference is that in the US baseball contracts are honored, which would mean that he'd be expected to be with us at least for 3 years. But in football, with the Bosman rule in mind, 3 years means that he/we has/have to renegotiate again next year or risk losing him on the cheap.

Any thoughts? Has the NESV metrics system kicked in, or are they postponing long-term contracts until it does?

I'd say it makes sense.

The fairytale answer would be that he gets a 6 year contract, but who's to say what will happen? He wouldn't be the first player to start well only to fall in to obscurity. 12 months down the line (when we will need to have a look at his contract situation) we will be in a better position to judge him (as he will have more experience) and can then tie him in to a longer contract if he's progressing well - or - if things have gone the other way, we're not spending reasonably big money on someone who won't make the grade.

3 years is still a good show of faith, but it's fairly pragmatic too.

[jDJ]

Of all our youngsters, I'd be most surprised if Kelly doesn't have a very good career in football playing for a top 6 club, I even think there's international potential for him.  I'm personally not convinced centre half is his best position either.  I've seen him play a fair bit in the reserves and in pre-season friendlies playing in both positions and I think he's a better player from right back.

He's strong, good in the air, quick and decent on the ball and his delivery is very good.  I think he's going to be a top player for us.

[farawayred]

Of all our youngsters, I'd be most surprised if Kelly doesn't have a very good career in football playing for a top 6 club, I even think there's international potential for him.  I'm personally not convinced centre half is his best position either.  I've seen him play a fair bit in the reserves and in pre-season friendlies playing in both positions and I think he's a better player from right back.

He's strong, good in the air, quick and decent on the ball and his delivery is very good.  I think he's going to be a top player for us.

Shushhhhhhhhhh, and touch wood! Agger was "never injured" when he came in...

[Degs]

Interesting contract length... Is that certain? From what I read about NESV, the contract should be for a significantly longer term, but maybe I'm wrong. The difference is that in the US baseball contracts are honored, which would mean that he'd be expected to be with us at least for 3 years. But in football, with the Bosman rule in mind, 3 years means that he/we has/have to renegotiate again next year or risk losing him on the cheap.

Any thoughts? Has the NESV metrics system kicked in, or are they postponing long-term contracts until it does?

I would be more concerned if he wasn't Scouse.
With him being local and raised through the ranks it's a bit different to somebody who was imported at 17 and has already experienced moving clubs.

The moulding of Kelly starts now, he needs to be given games.  He will only get better by playing football, like Carragher when he first started he is very raw and has talent but lacks the experience to get his positioning perfect.
I remember in Carragher's first 2 seasons he got ripped to pieces by, I'd say, the majority of people - nobody wanted to get rid and you could see he would come good but I think Kelly might have to go through this baptism of fire himself.  Most centre backs do.

[Hazell]

I remember in Carragher's first 2 seasons he got ripped to pieces by, I'd say, the majority of people - nobody wanted to get rid and you could see he would come good but I think Kelly might have to go through this baptism of fire himself.  Most centre backs do.

Sounds a lot like Insua too. Will be interesting to see what the reaction will be when he (inevtably) has some poor games for us.

[farawayred]

Good point, Degs, I didn't factor his Scouse roots... (Agree with the rest too).

[Istillstilltrustrafa]

Reminds me a bit of John O'Shea  in the sense that he could cover a few posistions along the back capably.

[Degs]

Sounds a lot like Insua too. Will be interesting to see what the reaction will be when he (inevtably) has some poor games for us.

It depends what the state of the squad is.
Look at the likes of Rafael at the Mancs and he has been eased in very gently because they have Brown, Neville, and O'Shea, he is left out when he's on a shocking run and nothing gets said.

Insua was lambasted because he made a mistake, whether it was positioning, tackling etc,. almost every match with no respite.  Insua wasn't being blooded he was being sacrificed.

Johnson is the one being looked at now because he's in a very similar situation to Insua last season, he's in a team that relies on a strong defence and it turns out he can't defend.  There's a place for Kelly in a side like this.

[bigbear]

Of all our youngsters, I'd be most surprised if Kelly doesn't have a very good career in football playing for a top 6 club, I even think there's international potential for him.  I'm personally not convinced centre half is his best position either.  I've seen him play a fair bit in the reserves and in pre-season friendlies playing in both positions and I think he's a better player from right back.

He's strong, good in the air, quick and decent on the ball and his delivery is very good.  I think he's going to be a top player for us.

It'll be interesting to see how fit he can get.

The injuries over the years have taken away that regular training where the stamina is built up but he is also a really big lad so will never have the legs of someone like Ashley Cole. If he is to be a right back (and I'm not sure I'd agree with that) then I guess his aim would be a Markus Babbel type player but he needs to be a really good athlete to acheive that.

I'd still say he was more a centre half but in any event he is getting crucial game time now and is part of the first team squad at the age of 20 which is massive. He's probably already played 7 or 8 games this season so it really is a breakthrough for him.

Great addition to the squad at worst, potential to be very very good at best. Brilliant and just what the youth development programme is all about.

[kvarmeismydad]

Kelly's 3 year contract makes sense because in about 2 years you'd expect him to have progressed to a level beyond this contract and it would need re-negotiating.

[B_I_F]

Interesting contract length... Is that certain? From what I read about NESV, the contract should be for a significantly longer term, but maybe I'm wrong. The difference is that in the US baseball contracts are honored, which would mean that he'd be expected to be with us at least for 3 years. But in football, with the Bosman rule in mind, 3 years means that he/we has/have to renegotiate again next year or risk losing him on the cheap.

Any thoughts? Has the NESV metrics system kicked in, or are they postponing long-term contracts until it does?

To be honest, very long contracts in North American sports are usually a way to trick the wage cap they have. Plus I doubt Kelly wants a longer contract anyway, afterall his negotiation position is quite weak now compared to what it can be within the next 2-3 years...

[bigbear]

Kelly's 3 year contract makes sense because in about 2 years you'd expect him to have progressed to a level beyond this contract and it would need re-negotiating.

What do you reckon ?

3 years at 25k a week plus appearance money.

[farawayred]

To be honest, very long contracts in North American sports are usually a way to trick the wage cap they have. Plus I doubt Kelly wants a longer contract anyway, afterall his negotiation position is quite weak now compared to what it can be within the next 2-3 years...

Well, that's what I fear... Call me selfish, but I want the club to be in a strong position, and the player in a weak position so that switching clubs doesn't cross the mind of a player who we need. But as Degs said, he's Scouse, and that goes some way to keep him hooked.

[kvarmeismydad]

--- Quote from: bigbear on Today --- What do you reckon ?

3 years at 25k a week plus appearance money.

--- End quote ---
 
Don't ask me mate. All footballers contracts sound ridiculous to me!

[Hazell]

It depends what the state of the squad is.
Look at the likes of Rafael at the Mancs and he has been eased in very gently because they have Brown, Neville, and O'Shea, he is left out when he's on a shocking run and nothing gets said.

Insua was lambasted because he made a mistake, whether it was positioning, tackling etc,. almost every match with no respite.  Insua wasn't being blooded he was being sacrificed.

Johnson is the one being looked at now because he's in a very similar situation to Insua last season, he's in a team that relies on a strong defence and it turns out he can't defend.  There's a place for Kelly in a side like this.

Yeah but often those who were criticising him last season weren't taking into consideration his age, lack of experience and the fact that he played too many matches last season. If Kelly's to stay here, then he'll need to play at some time and as soon as Kelly makes a few mistakes or has a run of poor games, then I think the knives will be out. I hope they won't but past experience in recent times (Insua, Lucas to name but 2) suggests otherwise.

[Degs]

Yeah but often those who were criticising him last season weren't taking into consideration his age, lack of experience and the fact that he played too many matches last season. If Kelly's to stay here, then he'll need to play at some time and as soon as Kelly makes a few mistakes or has a run of poor games, then I think the knives will be out. I hope they won't but past experience in recent times (Insua, Lucas to name but 2) suggests otherwise.

It will happen with any young player who is played week in week out.

[Hazell]

It will happen with any young player who is played week in week out.

Yeah, I just think it's wrong.

[Mad Men]

10 years at 100k per week. job safe. contract safe. happy days for me and all.

[Franky]

He's our greatest prospect. He's got a strong body and the right attitude, I reckon he's gonna go far this lad.

[Mad Men]

He's our greatest prospect. He's got a strong body and the right attitude, I reckon he's gonna go far this lad.

Same with Ayala and Darby and Robinson. The greatest. EVER.

[Franky]

Same with Ayala and Darby and Robinson. The greatest. EVER.

I don't understand the irony in your post. This is what I believe. Kelly looked much better than all the players you mentioned. He also seems quite confident, which is very important.

[cyador]

I'd personally argue the point that ayala is just as good a prospect as him, if not better, but its all opinions.

[Mad Men]

I don't understand the irony in your post. This is what I believe. Kelly looked much better than all the players you mentioned. He also seems quite confident, which is very important.

Are you mocking Ayala, young robinson and young darby? Do you not watch reserve and youth team matchs?

[Franky]

I'd personally argue the point that ayala is just as good a prospect as him, if not better, but its all opinions.

Yep, it's all opinions. To me Kelly more solid and confident defender.

Are you mocking Ayala, young robinson and young darby? Do you not watch reserve and youth team matchs?

fail.

[Mad Men]

Yep, it's all opinions. To me Kelly more solid and confident defender.
fail.

Go fail yourself sunshine. We have outstanding young talent coming through. If that's a problem for you, then I can care less.

[REDcrazy]

After his impressive showing against Chelsea, I think it's fair to say that the lad's got his sights on a permanent starting role. 

[DanA]

Are you mocking Ayala, young robinson and young darby? Do you not watch reserve and youth team matchs?

Got to say I'm of the opinion that Kelly has shown significantly more than any other prospect we have coming through. Not to say we don't have some good young players.

N'goo, Suso, Robinson, Flanagan, Wisdom, Silva & Sterling all look exceptional young players but a few more years till we will know for sure.

Ngog, Pacheco, Wilson, will certainly make it at a high level but to me Kelly looks like he'll be a class player for us of Jamie Carragher's level. I couldn't say the same for the others except perhaps Shelvey who also has amazing potential.

[ziggyy]

Good news that he has signed a new contract, should get a few more games though and be introduced slowly....

Look at Insua, great potential but overplayed last season due to the missing Aurelio (becoming Degen 2.0...) and got slated by our own 'supporters'....

Our backline for the next few years..... assuming Insua comes back and Agger stays...

Kelly/Darby   Wilson/Ayala   Agger/Skrtel   Insua/Mavinga

[opsteo]

Good news that he has signed a new contract, should get a few more games though and be introduced slowly....

Look at Insua, great potential but overplayed last season due to the missing Aurelio (becoming Degen 2.0...) and got slated by our own 'supporters'....

Our backline for the next few years..... assuming Insua comes back and Agger stays...

Kelly/Darby   Wilson/Ayala   Agger/Skrtel   Insua/Mavinga

Should it be Kelly as CB ahead of Wilson and Ayala?  I remember Ayala last season, I think that Kelly is more calm and determine to get into 'harm's way' with his body (ala Carragher style if things get more desperate)

[farawayred]

Should it be Kelly as CB ahead of Wilson and Ayala?  I remember Ayala last season, I think that Kelly is more calm and determine to get into 'harm's way' with his body (ala Carragher style if things get more desperate)

Too early for a CB starting role for either of them, imho. But 30 min here and there...

[MaschHead]

Should it be Kelly as CB ahead of Wilson and Ayala?  I remember Ayala last season, I think that Kelly is more calm and determine to get into 'harm's way' with his body (ala Carragher style if things get more desperate)

Ayala has probably more experience now, seems he's starting every game at Hull and doing well.