Topic: RAWK Round Table LFC 5-1 NCFC

[Hinesy]

Better?
Reminds me of the old joke when Michael Owen went out to play utd on his own. It was 8-0 at half time but come the final whistle it was 12-3.
What happened says the manager, 3 goals let in? "I went off injured after the hour" says Owen. Replace Owen for Luis and you have a summation of tonight.
When the season started and Suarez was banned, we played one up and it worked. Is that how we should shape things now until Sturridge is fit? Or should we just sing, "Can we play you every week"?

[royhendo]

All I'm going to say is 'Zoinks'. What a player?!

[Raul!]

What was incredible was the very, very high technical standard of each of those goals.  1 and 3 will grab great deal of attention and 4 was rather nifty as well but even the hook in for number 2 was beautifully executed.

The man is a genius.

Equally wonderful was to see the unadulterated joy, laced with a rather childish bemusement that he demonstrated at his own goalscoring efforts.  Initially at the quality of of his first strike and the mere fact that it went in and then, as they kept going in, at the fact that they kept going in.   

Pure delight, with a cherry on top.

[Yorkykopite]

I think that's the best hat-trick I've ever seen for Liverpool. Not the most important maybe, but technically hard to beat. Rush at Villa and Rosenthal at Charlton spring to mind as contenders, but Luis's started well last night and finished on another planet. Once he got his third I decided to forgive him for this summer's shenaningans. What he's giving us are irreplaceable memories - the second best thing to yer actual trophies.

Rest of the team played well too I think. I wasn't paying too much attention to them. Nice to have Coutinho and Agger back. They should start every game. Sterling did well, as did Allen (a performance marred only by the yellow card that Skrtel handed to him). I never thought I'd miss Enrique though. But I do. Surely we can't have Flanagan at left back when we go to Man City and Chelsea. He has no left foot and he's absolutely there for the taking.

[Corkboy]

"I wish Luis Suárez would just leave us alone" - Anthony Pilkington

"I always like to talk about the team but tonight you've got to hold up Luis as one of the best strikers in the world. With the modern-day, world-class operators – the Ronaldos, Bales and Messis – it's about the numbers and what they produce. It's not one and twos, but twos and threes. It was a pleasure to watch that. He is up there with Ronaldo and Messi. The quality of his finishing is just at an incredible level. He is the happiest he has been here, this club suits him, and I think his best years will be here. I actually felt for the Norwich players because to come up against a world-class player like that is really, really difficult." - Brendan Rodgers

"We gave him the opportunities that he gratefully took. There aren't many players who can score goals like that though, but he can." Chris Hughton

"He's making the rest of us look bad!" - Robbie Fowler

“It has been a good day and it was a great performance from all of my team-mates. I just want to do my best to help make the team better. My job is just to score the goals.” - Luis Suarez

[Crosby Nick]

I think that's the best hat-trick I've ever seen for Liverpool. Not the most important maybe, but technically hard to beat. Rush at Villa and Rosenthal at Charlton spring to mind as contenders, but Luis's started well last night and finished on another planet. Once he got his third I decided to forgive him for this summer's shenaningans. What he's giving us are irreplaceable memories - the second best thing to yer actual trophies.

Interesting little side debate to have that one. I think you are right, for sheer quality (and the bonus of having one extra to choose from!), it has to be the best. Not just Liverpool either, I can only think of Rivaldo v Valencia and Zlatan v England for hat tricks of comparable quality. Could be wrong!

[No666]

Rest of the team played well too I think. I wasn't paying too much attention to them. Nice to have Coutinho and Agger back. They should start every game. Sterling did well, as did Allen (a performance marred only by the yellow card that Skrtel handed to him). I never thought I'd miss Enrique though. But I do. Surely we can't have Flanagan at left back when we go to Man City and Chelsea. He has no left foot and he's absolutely there for the taking.

Well, this is going to be a consistent panegyric to the Number 7 from all concerned unless we consider the rest of team so, having put my eyes back in their sockets after that 3rd goal, I'll meander onto saying Allen played himself back into composure, I felt. Norwich didn't look too bad at the start, before our Uruguayan began the exquisite torture, but once that started it afforded Allen the opportunity to settle. Johnson, Gerrard (playing injured, though, I reckon) upped their games. As well as missing Enrique, I increasingly find myself missing Mkhitaryan. Henderson's continual failures to anticipate, or his running the ball all the way to corner and out of play with an embarrassed grin are minor irritations in a match like this, but against our rivals for top four?
Oh & the Moyesiah is feeling the heat. Not a bad evening.

[BazC]

The only thing to say is Holy Shit!

How many 10s did he get in the player ratings? How many 11s? I always used to wonder what players needed to do to get a 10 in those things.

[Harinder]

Better?

Of course it is. Anything is better than losing to Fat Head's Hull. The words of caution though still need to be heeded. It may be that I get heralded a party pooper for suggesting so but with Sam "I'm a blobfish" Allardyce rolling into town we shouldn't assume a victory is a foregone conclusion. They come in the colours of Aston Villa (sort of) and that's a timely reminder if anything of being complacent when riding a high

Suarez owned the first half and made it his. The goals were mesmerising. The build up joyous. The finishing exquisite. The worrying version of me thinks that should he get injured this month or banned and face a time off pitch we be screwed. I'm hoping January remediates that situation!

But those goals. Even my wife, who doesn't really watch a lot of games, was paying attention at them!

When the season started and Suarez was banned, we played one up and it worked. Is that how we should shape things now until Sturridge is fit? Or should we just sing, "Can we play you every week"?

I'm not a shape genius when it comes to Football. Shape Ski Yoghurts I'm good with as well as being comfortable with my own physical shape but I will say this - if it aint broke, don't fix it? We all know where we seem to break down at times which is in our organisation at the back. As I wasn't at the game yesterday and watched via stream, I don't want to judge the defence unfairly but Johnson's goal looked like one we could have defended.

[the 92A]

I noticed that in their podcast the Redmen 'stole' one of the things I've been saying recently that Suarez is worth the price of the season ticket alone. We're witnessing an exceptional player come to fruition. He's that good. Up there with the Messi's. At times it's an honour to watch what he is capable of doing with a ball.
 
I thought we started nervously and didn't gell that well, there was still a hangover from the Hull game, far too many passes going a stray and too many mistakes but when you have Suarez on the field playing that good in some ways it doesn't matter, except you can't help worrying what we'd do without him. Also nice to see him helping out Flanagan, looking for him and making a real effort to look after him.
 
Coutinho looked so assured. There's nothing of him but he oozes class, he creates his own time on the ball and has that lovely touch of arrogance that great players can exude. Thought Luis Alberto looked really good when he came on, he wanted the ball and looks like he'll do some real damage in the future, as Rafa would say he can play between the lines that lad.

I didn't think Sterling had a good game, held on to the ball too long on several occasions and I thought his decision making was generally poor but on a positive note he kept showing and was rewarded with his goal. The other thing that was worrying was the mess that Mignolet and Skrtel kept getting into playing the ball from the back neither of them looks assured passing it from the back.

[Barney_Rubble]

What can you do but sit back and enjoy?

He loves the ball and the ball loves him.

[kavah]

We could have a thread on his  hatricks against Norwich

A wonderful performance and it was privilege to be at Anfield last night. My Goodness we've had some decent forwards at Anfield and Suarez is second to non of them.

Great to see Alberto and Allen prepared to shoot in the 2nd half.
And Coutinho is a treat to watch. From the very clever corner he wins for the second, to the ball in for Gerrard's over-head- pirouette and the turn run and dink for  Suaerz to chest down for the shot are just some of the examples that clearly mark him out as a very special player.

[Vulmea]

I'm not sure If I should just sit and smile or try an analyse this game and contrast it with Hull

in both it looked  like we set up and waited for the Suarez show - in one he delivered a sublime performance in the other, he looked subdued either by his own mood or a better performance from the opposition probably a bit of both

could Suarez have delivered that performance with Moses or Sterling or Aspas or Sturridge alongside him in  a two?

nah - I can't do it justice I'm just gonna sit and smile

[DanA]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?
Cracking shot and I thought he showed a bit of quality and was solid in general, couldn't ask for more really but there wasn't a hell of a lot to do. Prefer Lucas in the role but Allen did his job and hopefully will get a bit more opportunty. I wonder though do we need a proper DM and a proper AM and then if we get them does that leave a role then for Allen?

With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?
I think it was, I wouldn't mind seeing how Aspas goes partnering Suarez for 30-40 minutes agaisnt Westham but I suspect we saw our best attack out there, for the next two months at least and I thought they did alright. Certainly it was better balanced this week than agaisnt Hull, Coutinho I think the biggest reason for this. If he's out I think it has to be Alberto in his place though, Allen doesn't have the goals and we otherwise become too direct.

Do we change again or make a decision and try to find a bit of continuity at the back?
Personally I think Sakho has been hard done by and the CB's again looked poor but i'm in two minds on how Rodgers should respond. We can't change the defence every week and expect them to develop into a consistently dour defence.

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?
Redmond who put the cross in from the right had a lot of time on the ball to pick out Bradley Johnson. I think it's worth noting that it happened after Henderson was subbed, personally I don't think they get that opportunity with Henderson tracking back. Didn't think Alberto was bad but I think it's hard to justify giving him more time at the expense of Henderson.


I'd be interested to hear what others thought on the above questions.

[leivapool]

Other's will surely describe the sheer joyous brilliance of Suarez so I'll leave it to them

I've just got one point to make and it's a negative ome,  and that was the performance of Agger.  He's many people's favourite CB,  but for me he was wholely culpable for the goal we conceded,  outjumped all ends up by the 3 inch shorter Bradley Johnson.  A fine ball player he may be,  but as a defender in the air,  I think serious questions need asking,  as it's for his defensive ability he is in the team.

[Aaron Rattray1]

All 4 goals by suarez were excellent, the best was the 3rd one i think

How many goals has luis scored now for Liverpool in all competitions? Must be about 60?

[LFCsupporter]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?
A good performance overall, I thought. He passed the ball well and was willing to bring it forward quickly. He wasn't under much pressure or have any meaningful duties to perform in the middle against a defensive Norwich. But that shot was inches away from being the highlight of the night, so I hope this gives him the confidence to really push on and fight for his place in the team. I don't believe this is his limit, I think there's much more to come from him.

With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?
I'll be controversial here, but I think that out of our front '4' only Coutinho and Suarez looked dangerous. In fact, if not for the individual skill of our frontman, the number of meaningful chances conjured by our attack was penurious at best. A half-shot from Henderson, which went two yards wide, was the only one I can remember in the first half. We livened up in the 2nd, when 4-0 up, but those last 30 minutes are quite misleading. Psychologically, we had already won, Suarez was in full swing and we were free from nerves or pressure. But throughout the first half, I couldn't help but think that Suarez was carrying Sterling and Henderson. If Suarez was off-form (and there's nothing to say he won't be in the next game), I do not believe Sterling or Henderson would have broken down the Norwich defence.
Do we change again or make a decision and try to find a bit of continuity at the back?
Yes, I think Sakho is worthy of a starting place. We've had several combinations of the back 4 and none of them have looked effective at dealing with set-pieces or crosses, so its time to bring the £16m man to do the job we've bought him for.

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?
Redmond had plenty of time for the cross, but that cross should have been dealt with by Agger. That goal was criminal and it highlighted the fragilities that have dogged us for the whole season. Apart from that, despite loving harrying the opposition, I'm not sure Henderson provides enough offensively to undisputedly justify  being handed a starting spot week in week out. Because the bottom line is, he's been poor in the final third. This can be forgiven when we have someone like Suarez or Sturridge in the right mood up front, but if we're struggling to break a team down then having him sit in the opposition half is counter productive.

[TheDarkKnight]

A great feeling to have witnessed that game in the flesh. I see Suarez do sublime things at Anfield every other week but last night he took it up a notch or two, was dangerously close to Messi/Ronaldo levels from the guy. If he keeps up this season's form then we will finish top four, I have no doubt about that.

Defensively a few worries, hate to blame Agger 'cause I love the man but he suffered a lapse in concentration and it ruined a much-needed clean sheet. Does Sakho lose that header? No, 99 times out of 100 he puts his nut on it and it hits the halfway line. Flanagan and Sterling shaky earlydoors but grew in confidence, especially the latter who notched a goal (that was good to see, should help his confidence). Johnson and Gerrard also back close to their best for large parts of the game. Was a shame neither of the excellent Gerrard volleys resulted in a goal. Allen did well. Coutinho was class, as he usually is. Keeping him and Suarez fit in this period without Sturridge will be crucial to our hopes of European football. Having those two fit and firing gives us a chance of not just a draw, but a slight chance of winning the big away games.

I bemoaned our away form and inconsistency in the round table after Hull. Our home form, however, is brilliant, and Rodgers deserves credit for that because when he arrived we had really suffered in home games for a while. We went in to them expecting to draw most of the time. We dropped a fair few points there in the first half of 2012/13 but he's definitely made it fortress Anfield again. No longer do we dread home games against bottom half clubs. In our last four home matches we have had the game won at half-time (Liverpool 3-0 Crystal Palace; Liverpool 2-0 West Brom; Liverpool 3-0 Fulham; Liverpool 3-0 Norwich the half-time scores). It's good for the heart, having these games put to bed by the halfway point.

There will be bigger and tougher tests to come, but this was the perfect response to the Hull result and performance.

[dumaten]

A couple of non-suarez things, because words struggle to describe him:

Was fun to see Gerrard play with full freedom towards the end. It's not viable when the result is in doubt as it left Allen covering the whole central midfield but that spinning shot was class, and the other shot from the edge of the box was as clean I've seen him hit one for a while.

Alberto is not ready for first team starts yet. At the moment he's just offering continuity and possession, and needs more directness in his play.

Norwich were pretty good, better than Hull. They followed the advice of the experts on here and pressed us quite high up the pitch and had a few half chances early in the game. Even when Suarez had scored three they knuckled down and stuck to their plans, kept working.

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?
He played quite well, but didn't really solve any problems. If anything we were more open when we lost possession. We also had a flashback to this time last year in his little adventure with Skrtel as he thought he could shield the ball but just got steamrolled by the onrushing Norwich player.

With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?
Yes, pretty much, especially with Aspas short of fitness. I thought it worked better when Sterling and Henderson shifted as Henderson was able to influence the middle of the park more and Sterling found more space. Wonder about the fullbacks though, might be worth trying switching Johnson and Flanagan as Flanagan should be more comfortable wide right and Johnson is pretty good going forward on the left. Or try Cissokho again.

Do we change again or make a decision and try to find a bit of continuity at the back?
I don't buy the idea that changes themselves are causing problems defensively. I'd have Sakho in because I think he's really good. Thought Skrtel defended well though and more aggressively.

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?
Not much as Henderson had been playing on the left from about 40 minutes onwards. Two factors might be that we were basically playing with one CM (Allen) towards the end, and Sterling and Johnson should have done better to block or delay the cross. But really its mostly with Agger again getting caught flat footed.

[mrantarctica]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?

Solid. We don't always need a genuine DM against teams like Norwich. His distribution was tidy and was unlucky not to get a goal. Keeps picking up yellow cards would be my criticism.

With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?

We look great when Suarez plays well but there aren't a lot of other players making big chances or converting them. The jury is very much still out on Moses, Aspas, Alberto etc. Sterling has looked ok but he probably needs consistent games to come into some kind of form. Playing Henderson on the left or right gives us a bit more security but we take a hit with regard to attacking creativity and quality.

Do we change again or make a decision and try to find a bit of continuity at the back?
I just don't rate Agger any more. He looks far too flimsy aerially and seems to be found wanting more often than not. I can't say I've seen him put in a commanding performance this season. Flano has played well so far and looks to have earned himself an extended run of games. However playing against Norwich is one thing, Chelsea and City will pose a really big challenge, possibly too steep.

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?
See above. The wider midfield roles (for home games ) are more of an attacking outlet which I don't think Hendo has. I'd prefer him closer to the middle of the park where his non stop energy and running can really drive us forward.

[MerseyMania]

If not for anyone, at least for the Great No.7 Called Luis Suarez playing in our shirt we need to be constantly in Champions League, Win some titles & get a league before Gerrard retires.

[DanA]

With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?
I'll be controversial here, but I think that out of our front '4' only Coutinho and Suarez looked dangerous. In fact, if not for the individual skill of our frontman, the number of meaningful chances conjured by our attack was penurious at best. A half-shot from Henderson, which went two yards wide, was the only one I can remember in the first half. We livened up in the 2nd, when 4-0 up, but those last 30 minutes are quite misleading. Psychologically, we had already won, Suarez was in full swing and we were free from nerves or pressure. But throughout the first half, I couldn't help but think that Suarez was carrying Sterling and Henderson. If Suarez was off-form (and there's nothing to say he won't be in the next game), I do not believe Sterling or Henderson would have broken down the Norwich defence.

There was also the cross by Sterling for Gerrard to nod down. But yes I definitely see where you're coming from and ideally Sterling and Henderson contribute more but what's the alternative? To date Aspas, Alberto and Moses haven't looked any better. Aspas potentially could be better partnered with Suarez than he was Sturridge but we've got to wait and see, as far as the current squad goes I think Sterling and Henderson may be we have.  Both at least put in a shift defensively and Sterling this season has a 1/3 scoring record and 1/6 assist record which isn't too bad.

[GrkStav]

i am glad to see at least a few posters remark on how well Norwich actually played, despite the scoreline.

[Kopenhagen]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?

Solid. We don't always need a genuine DM against teams like Norwich. His distribution was tidy and was unlucky not to get a goal. Keeps picking up yellow cards would be my criticism.

To be fair, the yellow he picked up was entirely Skrtel's fault for that dreadful pass.

[RedKenWah]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?

I thought he was quite nervy to start with along with the team, and there were a few misplaced passes which he must have been thinking oh it's going to be one of those games. He grew into it as the game wore and more importantly as Suarez took greater control of the game. His shot was very impressive in the second half, very good technique to control the direction of the shot and had it not been for a good save, obvsiouly would have gone in and would have given him that boost in confidence.


With Sturridge out was that our best attacking setup?

I think we shouldn't look too much into this game as it was really just a case of Suarez taking the game by the scruff of the neck. I would like us to be a side that can be adaptive to how we approach our attacking side of game going by which opponent we face, however our lack of options or unwillingness to utilise other players for the time being means we pretty much know how we are going to be playing unless we get injuries to more players. I'd personally would like to see some games where Gerrard is told to play further up the field, and link up more with Suarez & co, he's better off further up the pitch.

Sorry for sounding negative!

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?

Probably had a part to play with not dealing with the build up of the cross that lead to the goal, however the cross should have been defended a lot better then it had been. Agger was a good couple of yards short of his man when the cross came in.

Not to sound too negative again after a great result but if it hadn't have been for Suarez going for it this game, then i do fear that the result would have been different. We did look very poor before that first goal and our use of the ball and at times lack of movement was pretty awful.

Sometimes though to play poorly and win a game, isn't that the sign of champions? ;-) Not that we are there just yet mind

[Redeo]

The temptation is to just to say what a brilliant player Suarez is, and leave other issues aside.

[Redeo]

Also, if Suarez still harbours ideas about leaving LFC for greener pastures, he should know that he will nowhere replicate this kind of performance. Just as with Torres, no other top side will centre their team around him to this extent. I hope he figures that one out, even though his head must be turned by Messi comparisons...

[Corkboy]

Also, if Suarez still harbours ideas about leaving LFC for greener pastures, he should know that he will nowhere replicate this kind of performance.

His goals/games ratio was better for Ajax, and not much worse for Uruguay.

[Paul5star]

Yeah he scored 4 but is he a natural goal scorer?

[PhaseOfPlay]

His goals/games ratio was better for Ajax, and not much worse for Uruguay.

He's 26 though. It will start trailing off soon. If he sees out the bulk of the rest of his contract with us, it might be the case that we will have gotten his best years.

[ChaChaMooMoo]

He's 26 though. It will start trailing off soon. If he sees out the bulk of the rest of his contract with us, it might be the case that we will have gotten his best years.

South American players have more body core strength that they can carry on until they are 31-33. I doubt Suarez will lose his "ability" in a 2-3 seasons. He has got atleast 6 good years (with us! ) ahead of him.

[PhaseOfPlay]

South American players have more body core strength that they can carry on until they are 31-33. I doubt Suarez will lose his "ability" in a 2-3 seasons. He has got atleast 6 good years (with us! ) ahead of him.

I wasn't talking about his physical ability.

[Drinks Sangria]

Interesting little side debate to have that one. I think you are right, for sheer quality (and the bonus of having one extra to choose from!), it has to be the best. Not just Liverpool either, I can only think of Rivaldo v Valencia and Zlatan v England for hat tricks of comparable quality. Could be wrong!

I'm going to say Suarez's is the best, for pound-for-pound quality of the strikes. Both the other two you mention were superb, but three of those four goals were goal of the month contenders, two of them probably good enough to challenge for the season-long award. magnificent.

[ChaChaMooMoo]

I wasn't talking about his physical ability.

I know. I was referring to his ability to produce magic moments. Twisting and bending and faking and everything that embodies Suarez as he is today.

Physical side of it is an added advantage.

[Redeo]

His goals/games ratio was better for Ajax, and not much worse for Uruguay.

Yes but IMO jumping from Liverpool to a team like Barcelona or RMadrid would be something altogether different for Suarez, who hand-on-heart, IMO, is not at Ronaldo/Messi level. Talent-wise, he's more comparable to Ibrahimovic, or perhaps even Owen in his prime, and he'd probably do relatively well (like Owen @ RM did or Ibrahimovic @ Barca) but I don't think he would set the world on fire as here.
Rodgers said as much in the post-match conference: "...this club suits him, and I think his best years will be here." Of course the club suits him. Absent Sturridge, we have no other scorers. Everything goes through him, he has room to try all his little tricks, build his confidence...
IMO he should figure that out now...

[Hank Scorpio]

Owen?  Fukin' Owen?

[johnsmithlfc]

LOL@ Owen.... One footed, oner trick pony.... and you're saying Suarez is comparable?
Suarez is a fucking footballing genius and his touch and vision are sublime, his finishing exquisite and his movement and skill are that of someone like Messi.

I agree with Rodgers that he perhaps hasn't been as consistent as Messi or Ronaldo but then look where he played until he got to us?
Or even the few seasons here... it's not like he has the Barca or Real M team around him, providing him is it? He mostly creates out of nothing.

He would more than flourish at Barca or Real... and probably score as many goals and do as many pieces of insane genius.

[careful on these streets, I've heard stories]

Joe Allen...What did people think of his performance?
Good performance and I hope the manager continues with him for a few more games.

Do we change again or make a decision and try to find a bit of continuity at the back?
I think Sahko and Skrtel would be the best choice for the defense and hopefully solves our issues with defending set pieces

How big a part did subbing Henderson have in conceeding the goal?
IMO none what so ever, Henderson has played about every game this season and we have still let in loads of goals. If Agger wasn't ball watching it would have been much harder for the Norwich player to score

[Mutton Geoff]

I think it was a strong team performance enhanced by a world class performance from Luis, my only problem is i never feel good with this passing the ball between Skrtel and Mignolet it is a fuck up waiting to happen, I was willing that shot from Allen to go in shame it look a fantastic save to stop it.

One last thought is; has Sakho had a piss in the showers or forgot to put the toilet seat down or something, he cant get a game it seems and i cannot for the life of me understand why.

[plskikme]

LOL@ Owen.... One footed, oner trick pony.... and you're saying Suarez is comparable?
Suarez is a fucking footballing genius and his touch and vision are sublime, his finishing exquisite and his movement and skill are that of someone like Messi.

I agree with Rodgers that he perhaps hasn't been as consistent as Messi or Ronaldo but then look where he played until he got to us?
Or even the few seasons here... it's not like he has the Barca or Real M team around him, providing him is it? He mostly creates out of nothing.

He would more than flourish at Barca or Real... and probably score as many goals and do as many pieces of insane genius.

Agreed. It's hard to admit it but I can't see a player of Suarez' quality and drive to not have the same impact at any other quality side, let alone the likes of Madrid, Barca, Munich etc. I can only hope we keep hold of him as long as possible, building around this kind of talent can lead to big, big things.