Author Topic: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.  (Read 20516 times)

Offline Hinesy

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RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« on: August 17, 2013, 03:10:25 pm »
According to BT Sports, the last time Stoke won at Anfield, the hit tv show of the day was Dixon of Dock Green. Well, it would have been criminal if Stoke had nicked even a draw today (don't even go there with Kop/Cop) as Liverpool won their first game of the season at home for a long long time. Perhaps when Owen scored 2 against West Ham I think, 12 years ago!

Anyway, thoughts as we once again take our places round the round table and muse on the start of yet another red dawn. False hopes or genuine optimism?
For me Lapso Apso, our new attack dog, looked fab, keen, enthusiastic, already showing the start of a good relationship with Sturridge and some lovely turns and moves. He still looks like a 12 yr old with a knife, but I liked him. We were fluid going forward but once more, as ever, there are questions:
Do we know what to do in the box? For the first time, Stoke, still being a physical team (they towered over us) couldn't keep us out of the penalty box and that pleased me. Its been a long long time since we unlocked parked bus defences and we have perhaps started to do that.
But have we changed that much? It looked like a lot of games from last season, plenty of possession, chances and good football but failing to finalise. If all that happens is that we now start to win 1-0 instead of drawing 0-0 I don't care.

Filet Mignon in goal. Does he fillet or leave a gap where Pepe was? Started nervously but boy what a confidence booster that penalty save was, and perhaps more so, the follow up save off his hip. Looked slightly unsure when the ball came into the box, but shot stopping was excellent.

Hughes cannily I noticed, played two players pressing all the time on us at the back. Every manager knows we're going to try and play it out from defence, and we nearly got caught with two Stoke players chasing every ball, but luck/skill was on our side today.

So deja vu? Or definite progress?
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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2013, 12:46:20 am »
I have only highlights to go on, and am therefore wholly unqualified to post on any general matters. However, I did notice that our Danish centre half, Daniel Agger, decided to put on some sort of homage to our absent Uruguayan wantaway chompster by deliberately, and quite unaccountably, smacking a freckled hand at the ball when there appeared to be no obvious reason to do so.

I have considered the matter and concluded thus. Agger, being Danish, is naturally inclined to empathise with other folks, what with them being all sorts of socialist and whatnot in that Denmark. Consequently, we may infer that his esprit in effecting this tribute to Suarez' World Cup prestidigitation was to align himself with his confrére in a Post Modern Solidarność. Suarez is South American, passionate and obvious in his declarations. Daniel is a more measured soul, but trust me. That handball was a silent scream. Agger is pricing Catalan villas as we speak.

Offline Hinesy

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2013, 12:53:57 am »
See. You don't get that kind of analysis in the post match Agger was shite thread.
Yep.

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2013, 01:07:56 am »
Nor in the entire Transfer forum.

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2013, 02:56:16 am »
According to BT Sports, the last time Stoke won at Anfield, the hit tv show of the day was Dixon of Dock Green. Well, it would have been criminal if Stoke had nicked even a draw today (don't even go there with Kop/Cop) as Liverpool won their first game of the season at home for a long long time. Perhaps when Owen scored 2 against West Ham I think, 12 years ago!

A show I had to Google and a game from my pre-teens! Opening day does little to fill me with confidence :o

Anyway, thoughts as we once again take our places round the round table and muse on the start of yet another red dawn. False hopes or genuine optimism?

First of all, I've missed these. Secondly, credit where due. Asmir Begovic was the difference between a repeat of the 4-0 of '09 and Stoke hanging in this game right up until the 92nd minute. Not only was he commanding in the box and saving amazingly those 10 shots he did. He saved them "right". I can't remember a single shot he saved ending up with a Liverpool player, in a position to shoot again. Similarly when Coutinho made it through, he forced the angle so when Coutinho's shot got past his grips it was way wide (if you look at the replay, he had the far corner covered). And since I can't differentiate between our players, my man of the match goes to him.

As for the question. Personally, I think genuine optimism. Last year was good intentions and "well I can see what we're trying, even if we don't pull it off". Now it was quite obvious that we would, but more importantly did. There were a few good, genuine "make your own luck" moments:
- Mignolet flapping at the ball and it falling for Huth. Instantly I got spine chilling flashbacks of Gera's goal last season. But then it hit the crossbar and the "ohh for fuck's sake, not again!" became "wait, what?! FUCK YEAH!"
- Kolo Toure hitting the crossbar and instead of collective facepalming and swearing, all of a sudden there was another chance - albeit one which Sturridge fluffed.
- Walters' wondershot which we've become far too used to ending up in the back of the net. The standing ovation gave Mignolet a much needed boost that carried him for the rest of the half.
- The "Plenantly TM" as Alan Shearer calls it. It really should've been Charlie Adam. With a point to prove, their most threatening shot (can we call it that - my personal hypothesis is that he was aiming for Pennant!) and he'd had the cross that earned the pen. But up stepped Walters; shooting as he'd done in 5/6 penalties (the only one not to go there went over the bar). Mignolet had done his homework and was there to save it as well as throwing his hip at Kenwyne Jones' follow up attempt.

For me Lapso Apso, our new attack dog, looked fab, keen, enthusiastic, already showing the start of a good relationship with Sturridge and some lovely turns and moves. He still looks like a 12 yr old with a knife, but I liked him. We were fluid going forward but once more, as ever, there are questions:
Do we know what to do in the box? For the first time, Stoke, still being a physical team (they towered over us) couldn't keep us out of the penalty box and that pleased me. Its been a long long time since we unlocked parked bus defences and we have perhaps started to do that.
But have we changed that much? It looked like a lot of games from last season, plenty of possession, chances and good football but failing to finalise. If all that happens is that we now start to win 1-0 instead of drawing 0-0 I don't care.

Iago Aspas I thought had a great debut. His movement was superb, his first touch past players will continue to puzzle defenders for a long time. They've just covered an entire pre-season of Coutinho videos only to be faced with that! His run, dribbling and pass for Henderson's via Begovic shot to the inside of the post would've been a real highlight of the game had it gone in. Similarly was his movement when Henderson took the wrong decision to come inside towards Begovic was very promising. And again when Enrique got into the box, he was there abouts. He does look a bit like-minded to Sturridge (a positive sign, no?) in the sense both tend to make the run or drop off at the same time. But if that's the worst to be said about a player's debut, it's all good.

Coutinho looked a bit rattled and got virtually nothing from the ref. It will do him good in the long run, to keep his head when the less football savy try to drag him down to their level. Despite all that he still managed to be our most threatening player. He's so insightful, the way he set up Sturridge, Henderson and Aspas - on his "off" day.

Our new boys all had very good games I thought. And that's important too, considering whom they were effectively replacing. But for me the key difference was a very slight one. Looking at the goal how it was set up. It was, funnily enough, apart from hitting the back of the net, one of the worse chances we created today. But there were two key differences from this game and West Brom last season. First was Sturridge being there to take it and delivering. The "match winner" cliché. But more importantly where the ball came from. Toure and Agger were near the center of the pitch. Not in our own box, with Carra and not halfway there, constantly looking over their shoulder, with Skrtel. Agger was there and it was a simple game of the ball moving faster than the player. Agger to Sturridge to Lucas to Aspas to Sturridge, one touch and catch the GK off guard. I think that will be the key to changing those home draws into home wins. Getting the team 10 yards further up the pitch will be absolutely crucial.

Filet Mignon in goal. Does he fillet or leave a gap where Pepe was? Started nervously but boy what a confidence booster that penalty save was, and perhaps more so, the follow up save off his hip. Looked slightly unsure when the ball came into the box, but shot stopping was excellent.

The meat puns. They hurt.

Mignolet if for nothing else will have hell of a momentum behind him now. That Huth shot would've been unfortunate. But a last minute penalty save + that Walters shot and he'll have grown another 2-3 inches and gotten an extra spring in his jump next game. He looked a bit awkward with the ball at his feet. But that can be trained (we did with Carragher!) and he kept a clean sheet. That's all there is to it and needs to be.

Hughes cannily I noticed, played two players pressing all the time on us at the back. Every manager knows we're going to try and play it out from defence, and we nearly got caught with two Stoke players chasing every ball, but luck/skill was on our side today.

They were definitely hoping to catch Mignolet and Toure, both of them new and less likely to be in the groove. Think he was also trying to get away from the Trench warfare stigma of Pulis' "legacy" (if I can defoul that word by using it in that context). I was however delighted to see things bounce our way, when again they tend to go in off the bar/post.

So deja vu? Or definite progress?

Definite progress for me. For a side that hasn't spent any money, is without it's supposedly best player there were obvious improvements from not further back than the QPR game of last season.
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Offline Vulmea

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2013, 11:06:55 am »
The result sets the mood I think - its hope  rather than despair -  same ol, same ol could have been the cry - we gifted up  some chances, we continue to look dodgy on set pieces (even if the statto's think we dont), we didn't close out the game as we should - we had the traditional nervous last 10 minutes, the crowd just as bad as the players - all of that is painfully familiar - this time we didn't succumb, this time we got 3 points.

Now there were half a dozen games last year when I thought, if we could just......it would give us momentum, belief etc and none came to fruition - this game should do exactly that, it should improve our chances in the next game but the next game is, as the cliche goes the most important.
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Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2013, 11:13:40 am »
The attacking dynamic took some time to take shape but it positively purred at times. Coutinho and Sturridge have the sort of relationship that makes the heart sing. It's potentially Gerrard and Torres esq.

Im on the record as saying that I think Sturridge will match what Torres delivered for us, if he stays fit. And I stand by it. The boy is remarkably complete for an English player and he's a natural in front of goal.

If he is to get anywhere near having the same influence then it'll be Coutinho that enables him. Not Gerrard, not Suarez, Pip.

Suarez is a lone wolf, he plays for himself in so many ways. He's great at it, he'll match up to any defender and most likely better him. He loves it. But he doesnt really feed off of anyone (arf), nor does he really look to facilitate anyone other than himself. It's no bad thing necessarily and if you replace Aspas in that team with Luis then we're obviously better for it.

Having him be able to do his own thing safe in the knowledge that we have Coutinho and Sturridge pulling each other forward could bring out the best in all 3.

A solid start overall, against a tough opposition (the Pulis elements were certainly still visible). But we were up for the fight. Rodgers seemed less content to try and take the high road against them and believe that his morally superior football would simply win the day. We matched them and faced up. Literally at times. And its exactly what was needed.

Toure was great, and great value. Mignolet will be so much better for having gone through the range of emotions he'll have felt. And Lucas was imperious.

Villa next? Another ghost to be exorcised. Bring em on.

Offline Hinesy

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2013, 05:58:20 pm »
Round table is back and up.
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2013, 06:14:19 pm »
Do we know what to do in the box? For the first time, Stoke, still being a physical team (they towered over us) couldn't keep us out of the penalty box and that pleased me. Its been a long long time since we unlocked parked bus defences and we have perhaps started to do that.
But have we changed that much? It looked like a lot of games from last season, plenty of possession, chances and good football but failing to finalise. If all that happens is that we now start to win 1-0 instead of drawing 0-0 I don't care.

Sturridge is not a six-yard box striker, like all our fluid attack he prefers to get the ball deep and attack or be put in from angles. Perhaps the system does not require such a striker, rather, the players taking more of the many chances created. I don't think we have changed, it is the same game plan, slow possession in the final third and smart runs, turns around the box, allowing the full-backs and runners to get on the end of through balls. So we are always going to give off that impression of creating a lot of chances. Two fell to Enrique, three for Henderson, arguably more and better chances than what we created for Sturridge, Coutinho and Aspas combined. The opportunities, though many tend to fall to deeper lying players rather than our forwards. A few minor tactical adjustments could see our attacking players getting more clear cut chances in the box. No idea what adjustments though.
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Offline tellusajoke

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2013, 06:16:44 pm »
Loved it when Coutinho squared up to that big fella and then Lucas pulled him out of the way to take his place. Thought that was proper fighting for each other...can't remember who it was but he should of been sent off for that, you know he would have if he was a Liverpool player.

Also didn't really like the ref. Although, he kept the game flowing, it felt he only wanted to penalise Liverpool players (e.g. Lucas got a booking for nothing) and Coutinho was getting kicked all over the place and no bookings.
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Offline johnhouldinglfc

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2013, 06:35:45 pm »
Anyone any thoughts about the subs bench ?

Jones , Wisdom , Alberto , Allen , Sterling , Ibe , Borini

Only 1 defender in Wisdom.

No Skrtel, No Kelly, No Coates, No Flanagan

Who was fit ?
Who is possibly on the way out (either permanently or on loan)?
What does it all mean?

Assaidi and Pacheco the other 2 who could be described as two others who didnt feature.


Offline Djimi Smicer34

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2013, 06:49:58 pm »
Anyone any thoughts about the subs bench ?

Jones , Wisdom , Alberto , Allen , Sterling , Ibe , Borini

Only 1 defender in Wisdom.

No Skrtel, No Kelly, No Coates, No Flanagan

Who was fit ?
Who is possibly on the way out (either permanently or on loan)?
What does it all mean?

Assaidi and Pacheco the other 2 who could be described as two others who didnt feature.

Skrtel and Kelly likely were not quite fit enough, unless another CB is imminent then I highly doubt Skrtel will be leaving in this window.  Coates is way down the pecking order, Wisdom is ahead of him if pre-season is anything to go by.  Same goes for Flanagan, I imagine he is available for loan and would go somewhere else if an offer came in.

Offline Cochise

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2013, 06:57:46 pm »
Sorry this doesn't add much to the discussion here but is there anymore info on what happened with Wilson Palacios yesterday? He had to pull out just before kick off and was rushed to hospital and had minor surgery. Hope it's nothing to serious  :-\
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Offline GODS LEFT BOOT

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2013, 07:01:41 pm »
I agree with whatever Phaseofplay posts.
If my assistant had not signalled a goal, I would have given a penalty and sent off goalkeeper Patr Cheh. he beeped me to signal the foul. The noise from the crowd  stopped me hearing it, I have been involved at places like Barcelona, Ibrox, Old Trafford, Arsenal, but I've never in my life been involved in such an atmosphere. IT WAS INCREDIBLE

Offline StrikingMidfield

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2013, 07:10:44 pm »
Sorry this doesn't add much to the discussion here but is there anymore info on what happened with Wilson Palacios yesterday? He had to pull out just before kick off and was rushed to hospital and had minor surgery. Hope it's nothing to serious  :-\
According to the Daily Mail he's going to be out for a few weeks. Not much news about it however. He was apparently taken to the hospital for minor surgery, but Stoke haven't said why yet. The story from Stoke was that he was "sick". Here's the link. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2396525/Wilson-Palacios-weeks-injury-Liverpool-v-Stoke.html
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Offline Cochise

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2013, 07:18:10 pm »
According to the Daily Mail he's going to be out for a few weeks. Not much news about it however. He was apparently taken to the hospital for minor surgery, but Stoke haven't said why yet. The story from Stoke was that he was "sick". Here's the link. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2396525/Wilson-Palacios-weeks-injury-Liverpool-v-Stoke.html

In the comments bit someone said he had a twisted bollock.
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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2013, 07:22:08 pm »
In the spirit of RAWK and Bill Shankly - What ever any of you are saying, I totally disagree with.



Especially Norris


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Offline stockdam

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2013, 07:52:11 pm »
I was so engrossed in the match that I barely remember anything about it. It was a great match but I was still left with the same old feeling that I got many times last season.


The positives.

Coutinho is a special player who can breeze past players. He's fast becoming my favourite player and I expect big things from him this year.
Lucas.......looks to have regained his confidence and gives his all.
Henderson......for some reason he has his critics but he is a very important part of our team. He supports both the attack and the defence and was unlucky not to score.
Sturridge looked lively and will score bags of goals this year.
Simon M.......shakey at times but had a wonderful double save that secured the three points.

The negatives......

Our defence still looks as if it's going to give away soft goals. There sometimes is a lack of composure at the back and that gets worse as the final whistle approaches.
We dominated the match and deserved the three points but in a moment of panic we gave away a penalty that on another day would have resulted in a draw. Stoke didn't need to do an awful lot to get back into the game and without a super double save they would have come away with a point and we would have lost two points.

I'm not getting carried away as I feel that we got off lucky. Of course we deserved the 3 points but when you hand the other team a soft penalty then all the hard work is undone in a split second. Stoke rarely put us under pressure and without a MOTM display from their keeper they would have been well beaten (they have more issues to sort out than we do).

We don't have a striker. Sturridge does a lot of his work outside of the box but we don't have anybody that pokes the ball in from 6 yards. We also don't get the ball into that area that much so the solution is not just a poacher. A lot of our play is outside of 18 yards.

Can't wait for Suarez to return and hopefully one more exciting attacker coming in.

Early days and a win was great to see. However for one horrible moment near the end I had that awful feeling of deja-vu.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 07:56:10 pm by stockdam »
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Offline MolbyLovesGravlax

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #18 on: August 18, 2013, 08:36:33 pm »
I agree with whatever Phaseofplay posts.

Hope he doesn't post anything about your mother...
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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2013, 08:42:47 pm »
Hope he doesn't post anything about your mother...

 :)

On a more serious note I enjoyed the way we kept playing our football - the players seemed to have the belief they would break through, despite the usual Stoke love they were receiving.

And Aspas looks like a crafty little sod.
If my assistant had not signalled a goal, I would have given a penalty and sent off goalkeeper Patr Cheh. he beeped me to signal the foul. The noise from the crowd  stopped me hearing it, I have been involved at places like Barcelona, Ibrox, Old Trafford, Arsenal, but I've never in my life been involved in such an atmosphere. IT WAS INCREDIBLE

Offline dirks digglers

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #20 on: August 18, 2013, 08:45:15 pm »
Really enjoy these round tables and reading your opinions, haven't posted on here before, thought I'd break my duck...

Very interesting game and very enjoyable up to the point at around 65 minutes where we couldn't get the crucial second goal and it looked like the last couple of seasons all over again. Fortunately BT Sport went down and spared me the heart attack last 15 minutes.

Plenty of positives I thought. Aspas carried on his good start from pre-season. He's got a very nice selection of turns with his back to goal that often beat the defender, he's speedy and his movement looks good. Watching pre-season I don't feel like he's a real top predatory goalscorer but he'll chip in for sure. Looked pissed off when he got hooked which I kinda liked. Coutinho - we all know he's class, and even better in the 10 role - effective coming in from the left too, just not so dominant, but I do think we need the balance with Henderson so not surprised to see him start on the left. He seems pretty tough under the hacking, but I think a lot is riding on him and Sturridge staying fit. Sturridge - massive talent, really coming into his own. Should score 20 in the prem this year. Thought he was good considering he's coming back from injury. Deadly from range with those minimal backlift strikes. He's definitely got all the attributes in there.

Mignolet was understandably nervous early on I thought. Can't remember when watching Sunderland what he usually does with high balls. Was reluctant to come for one in the first half that seemed to have his name on it. Clearly a great shot stopper, hopefully now with his confidence up he can dominate a bit more aerially.

Still think we have some harum scarum moments when we're piling forward and the opposition break. Last year we were definitely vulnerable on the counter. Not too sure if this is a technical thing about when we all press/don't press the ball, but a couple of times yesterday our attack broke down and we tried to press to win it back and nearly got caught out. I do think we're more solid with Henderson on this count, he wins ball back well and really puts himself about.

All in all, the way things panned out, it felt like a massive turning point mentally. Starting a new season with yet another dominant performance but only one point would have really hurt us. I do think we could really use another attacking threat of real quality, we can't rely on Phil and DS too much. If we are in for Willian makes good sense and we'll look even more dangerous. We're still not deadly enough and potentailly slightly short of goals, inclined to agree with Rodgers on that one. But, moving in the right direction...

Thought Lucas was terrific, his physicality seems to have seriously upped in the last couple of games, looks like what he said about finally feeling back to 100% is true. Still wince when he goes in hard, we can't really afford him to get injured either. Kolo was a real presence, can see him playing a lot of matches this year. Fingers crossed, things are gradually coming together.
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Offline alvaro

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #21 on: August 18, 2013, 09:08:39 pm »
I know that we are supposed to analyze the game from a Liverpool pov but ffs what were Stoke thinking letting Walters take the pen? And shouldnt this fellow be aware that all the games are on the telly nowadays so if you kick every penalty to the left of the keeper they will pick on it?  Not that Im complaining :).

Mignolet is bringing to the table what we expected imo, higher save percentages and the expense of worse game with the ball on his feet, however nobody complained about suboptimal feet work after that double save that won us the game, did they? Im not going to give him slack for the shaky start, he was in front of the kop on his first game and up against the tallest attacker in the league. Its still too early but Im guessing we have made a small improvement in this area.

I love Kolo Toure already. Fuck moneyball. We needed some leadership now not in 6 years time. The guy has a winner mentality and did alright. He looks like he wants to achieve things with us, Im made up to be honest, great signing.

Agger, the less said the better. You cant lose your focus like that.

Lucas and Gerrard were fine, lets just hope they can stay healthy, they are top 4 material.

Henderson, I dont know if his finishing was bad or he was unlucky, he did miss a very good chance in the first half. I do have to say that I prefer him over Allen, the fact that he relegated  the player Rodgers wanted in his first transfer windows says a lot though. Well done Jordan.

Aspas, I would lie if I told you I loved his movement or something. I dont think he is starting XI material if we want to finish fourth. I want to be proven wrong but I just dont see it to be honest. There is a reason why we are being linked with Willian imo.

Coutinho, Im actually worried about what are we going to do when he is not playing, he is the heart of our team at the moment and he only just turned 21!!

Sturridge, he scored the winner, enough for me. He also  took an amazing shot  from a tight angle that Begovic saved. My biggest concern is his fitness.

With regards to the team, I think our finishing once again was lacking, there is a reason why keepers have the games of their lives in Anfield and its not because there is some vodoo going on or something. And  we looked shaky on set pieces yet again.  We need to score more goals because we cant keep a clean sheet every game. I hope we can add  2 more players this transfer window becuase we will need them if we actually want to play Champions League football again.

My final comment is that I hope the lucky break we had this game gives the team confidence and it carries on, I predict this is going to be our best season since 2008-09. 


Offline stevied

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #22 on: August 18, 2013, 09:21:29 pm »
I thought the fluidity was the most pleasing part of yesterdays game, Aspas, Sturridge, Hendo, Couthinio all interchanging around the central no 9 spot, it must be a nightmare to defend against, Begovic was very good but hopefully we can start slotting a few more to nil before we have the anxious last 5 minute scenario.
Toure for me had a great game, he seems to relish the chance we have given him and his attitude is great to see
Mignolet started edgy but i heard his interview and he was honest in the fact he wants to please from the first game at home, well that double pen save will certainly have pleased the faithful, the noise when it went for a corner was deafaening

Good start but with Villa away and Utd at home to come we cant count them just yet but a promising start
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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2013, 10:06:40 pm »
Nice post dirks digglers
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Offline n00bert

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #24 on: August 19, 2013, 06:34:21 am »
Quote
False hopes or genuine optimism?

I think genuine optimism this time round. There's a lot of clear improvement with the team picking up from where we left off last season and given that we weren't all that shabby in the latter part, I think there is good cause to be hopeful this year.

Quote
For me Lapso Apso, our new attack dog, looked fab, keen, enthusiastic, already showing the start of a good relationship with Sturridge and some lovely turns and moves. He still looks like a 12 yr old with a knife, but I liked him.

I too was impressed. Like I said in the Aspas thread, I would have preferred to have kept him on just for the energy. Reminds me a bit of good 'ol Dirk Kuyt but with much better overall technical ability.

Quote
We were fluid going forward but once more, as ever, there are questions:
Do we know what to do in the box? For the first time, Stoke, still being a physical team (they towered over us) couldn't keep us out of the penalty box and that pleased me. Its been a long long time since we unlocked parked bus defences and we have perhaps started to do that.

I totally agree. It's amazing what a team full of technically astute footballers can achieve. The movement in and around the penalty box was magnificent and IMO the real reason why we were carving them open as often as we were.

Quote
But have we changed that much? It looked like a lot of games from last season, plenty of possession, chances and good football but failing to finalise. If all that happens is that we now start to win 1-0 instead of drawing 0-0 I don't care.

The profligacy is concerning but given that it's Aspas' first game in the league (he could have had one at least) and Sturridge's second game since coming back from injury I think we can only improve in this area. Not to mention we have the return of Luis Suarez to come.

The most important thing is the number very good chances created against a team like Stoke who have built a reputation for being defensively sound.

What impressed me the most though was our eagerness to win the ball back early. When Rodgers was talking about 'resting with the ball' last season I thought it was a load of bollocks considering how poorly we pressed from the front last year. To say we lacked cohesion was an understatement. If we can keep this up, most teams will have problems. Just look at how poorly Arsenal did when they were harassed by Villa.



Offline DanA

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #25 on: August 19, 2013, 07:25:13 am »
I thought it was a really interesting game, definitely felt like a lot of last seasons games as has been discussed but with one big difference. We were bailed out by our keeper, and in a l honest it's been a long time since that's happened.

I think there were some areas of improvement on last season though particularly in general play. IMO we did a really good job playing out of defense and this was despite Stoke pressing rather well. Mignolet is undoubtably a downgrade on Reina in terms of distribution but despite this overall I thought we looked more comfortable than in majority of the games we were pressed last season. Both Agger and Toure dealt well with the pressure and our midfields distributed was a big plus. I'd be interested in what others thought because I thought it was one of our key issues last season.

In attack I thought our movement was also  really good, Sturridge, Aspas and Coutinho were really fluid with Coutinho and Aspas creating majority of our chances. It was a shame more of them weren't finished but i'm hoping it's an anomoly rather than the problem it was recently under Kenny.

I'd also point out that Henderson and Johnson did a particularly good job shutting down Stoke's left hand side (usually their biggest threat). I didn't notice much coming from their, just the one counter attack off the back of our corner. It was generally our left side where we gave away free kicks.

Really I was quite happy with it all and think it will be even better with Suarez in the mix. He's a creative force and playing the role Aspas did I think he'd be fantastic.
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Offline FoolForPool

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2013, 07:40:17 am »
I remember reading last season that our points to games ratio in the 2nd half of the season would have put us in the top 4 if we had played that way for the whole season.  Seeing the game on Saturday felt exactly like watching Liverpool play in the 2nd half of last season.  That gives me some confidence.  It was very much more of the same, but with a couple of extra signings we could start to challenge the 4th spot.  AND it was good football to watch - against Stoke no less!!

I loved Toure pushing forward and with confidence, especially in his first match.  He looked comfortable with the ball and a free transfer to boot.

Offline Sweeney94

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #27 on: August 19, 2013, 07:42:06 am »
I still get the feeling that we can't deal with set pieces. I was scared the whole game about them, and thought we were dealing with them shit. But looking back I think it was just my nerves from last season - we did okay defending set pieces, can still improve.

Aspas did well, although he didn't make any clear cut chances or direct shots his most impressive influence on the game was his technique. By this I mean the way he was able to receive the ball and turn facing the defense so, so quickly. This is very important to our game and breaking defenses down because it puts their defense on the back foot and instead of holding their line they must back-track. Coutinho and Suarez are masters at this, and sturridge not I bad either so nice to add another player to implement this style.

Henderson was impressive yesterday because basically he did his job, and he did it well. Without Suarez he was clearly told to get in the box ad try and score. Which he did on 3 clear occasions. But he also allowed our set up to work with his pressing and positioning. When coutinho moved centrally at times hendo was there to cover and also when aspas moved upfront for periods. Also a credit to our fullbacks who did well.

Overall, a good performance. Haven't won on the opening day in a while, so it's a good start.

Offline Livo.85

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2013, 08:11:09 am »
I thought Toure, Johnson & Lucas were our 3 best players.

Honestly think we are a better team than Spurs & Arsenal at the moment.

If we don't have any serious injuries to our key players then top 4 is realistic. However if we lose any of Agger, Toure, Lucas, Gerrard, Coutinho, Sturridge then it's another false dawn.

Offline Frizzo

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #29 on: August 19, 2013, 08:14:38 am »
I thought Toure, Johnson & Lucas were our 3 best players.

Honestly think we are a better team than Spurs & Arsenal at the moment.

If we don't have any serious injuries to our key players then top 4 is realistic. However if we lose any of Agger, Toure, Lucas, Gerrard, Coutinho, Sturridge then it's another false dawn.

Jeepers.

I can guarantee you that we'll lose one or more of those players for at least a chunk of the season.

No team goes without any injuries to any of their key players for a full year.

Offline Red number seven

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #30 on: August 19, 2013, 08:18:11 am »
Played well. Still need to be more clinical.

Toure excellent. Lucas excellent. Sturridge not fully fit.
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And then we'll get 4th as well and everyone in the whole world can do one.

Offline Livo.85

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #31 on: August 19, 2013, 08:26:35 am »
Jeepers.

I can guarantee you that we'll lose one or more of those players for at least a chunk of the season.

No team goes without any injuries to any of their key players for a full year.
Did I need to emphasize serious injuries?
2-3 weeks out wont hurt our chances.
2 weeks still left to address our squad depth issue.
Sign a top defender & midfielder & we are sorted.

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #32 on: August 19, 2013, 08:37:41 am »
Did I need to emphasize serious injuries?
2-3 weeks out wont hurt our chances.
2 weeks still left to address our squad depth issue.
Sign a top defender & midfielder & we are sorted.

I know what you meant, but that's a long list of players we can't afford to do without. You think we need all 7 of them on the pitch to stand a chance? I think we definitely have the depth to cover for any of those players at a pinch. Obviously you'd prefer to have your best team on the park at all times.

And yes, obviously signing a top defender and midfielder would help, but that could be said of almost any team.

I just feel the depth we have now is the best it's been in years.

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #33 on: August 19, 2013, 08:48:22 am »
First of all that shot from Sturridge was precisionly placed and it needed to be to beat another keeper having a Worldy in our place. Seems like after most games we could say but for their keeper. Other reflections Stevie looked Alonsoesque at times in his slightly deeper orchestrator role. We may have sorted out that Elephant that was in the room. Coutinho plays like a slightly less physical Stevie unlocking defences with the right pass, I have to say first impressions are I enjoy watching Aspas play in much the same way as I used to enjoy Bellamy , the lads running off the ball to find space was a joy to behold. Lucas was back to being Lucas pre injury, glen and Enrique showed all their good points but also why both frustrate the hell out of me!
Toure surprised me he was better than I imagined and I was wishing he would score when he marauded up the pitch in the second half, Dagger not so much a defensive move more a clumsy pas de deux for the penalty! Simon in goal flapped at a couple in the first half ,could and maybe should have cost us first half but the penalty double save moved his performance from iffy to outstanding. Young Henderson for me he put in a great shift I still think he is wasted out wide but where else is there a space for him in the team, we need his energy around the pitch! Finish as I started great goal from Sturridge  but also I noticed how good he is at holding up the ball and bringing other players into the game around him, all in all we dominated 80% of the game and should have won by more when have I read that before?
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 08:52:23 am by Touchstone »
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Offline Alonso_The_Assassin

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #34 on: August 19, 2013, 09:32:40 am »
So refreshing to get a win on opening day (last one was when Robbie Keane was trotting around for us, was it not?). Regardless of luck, a win's a win and Saturday's performance typified the notion.

The pressing was the best I've seen since 2008. We've pressed in games since then, however not for as long as we did on Saturday. It was relentless and if we can make this a staple of our play we will batter teams. Yes, batter teams. Henderson in the side makes this achievable. His energy levels are absolutely brilliant and, in my opinion, whoever slags the lad off needs to have a word with themselves. His finishing will improve given a consistent run in the side. His ability to break up play takes so much pressure of Lucas, who himself is really coming into his own. The same will apply for Gerrard as the season rumbles on too. Hendo appears to be on the same wave length with the front three, too, which essentially means he's another genuine attacking option.

Aspas was brilliant. His ability to win the ball surprised me; he won't come up against a team much more physical than Stoke. His technical ability is fine, too. People are suggesting we don't have a poacher may need to look a little closer. Given Aspas' goals he scored in pre-season, if he can take up similar positions during the season, he'll be exactly what we're after.

Toure looked very assured. Sharp, strong and definitely effective from set plays. The latter facet was the surprising part for me. The lad has the right mentality and for free, it looks a steal.

Finally to Simon Mignolet. Yes, the penalty and the follow-up shot were both fucking brilliant, and I can't remember cheering so hard since Yossi scored at Fulham all those moons ago, however Simon's save in the first half was the catalyst. This lad can stop a shot. He can also command his area. Those who watched him at Sunderland will know this. I'd mark his early moments down to nerves. Made up for the lad. We need our keeper to save us points. That's 2 already marked down.

The test will be this weekend against big Benteke. With Kolo in the middle I'm quietly confident we can go there and get maximum points. Rush their midfield and we will create a slew of chances. Just need to convert them and we'll be laughing.

Offline Kelvinlfc

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #35 on: August 19, 2013, 09:56:22 am »
Oh how this post would of been so much different if Walters buried that penalty haha

Thought everybody had a decent game Aspas was class his touch to go past players is sublime, Sturridge was a match winner today buzzing with that and his celebration was Balotelli esque, Coutinho was decent against a team I knew were just going to try and wipe him out as much as possible (Nzonzi is a bellend).

Not good to see Spurs are now the bookies favs to sign Willian as I think we're 1 more class winger away from a push (do they even have a scouting dept or do they just read Sky Sports and say yeah lets go for him cos Liverpool are) but we'll see how this unfolds.

Bring on the Villa on Saturday!

Offline Kelvinlfc

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #36 on: August 19, 2013, 09:57:38 am »
Oh and I loved our fight, we didn't lay down and get bullied which has happened against physical teams, got well stuck in!

Offline Chivasino

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #37 on: August 19, 2013, 09:59:24 am »
Lost count the amount of times I've been told "Liverpool were lucky" in the office this morning.

Lost track of the number of times I've reminded everyone that the job of goalkeeper is to make saves. Was Sturridge lucky to score? It's what they are paid to do.

In a perverse way I think grinding out a close 1-0 will do us more good than a comfortable 2-0 win this early in the season. We need to get back into the habit of winning tight games and keeping vital clean sheets.

I thought Lucas was magnificent, Gerrard very good, and that allowed us to build from there. I still think Coutinho is wasted on the left. Even more so given the excellent partnership he's forging with Sturridge. His through balls into space are a just beautiful, anyone better than him at doing it in the league? He might have to stay on the left until we sign someone else though and that will be a shame.

Aspas and Henderson played well and their energy and pressing was welcome. The tempo was very good.

The defence coped with everything pretty well until Agger's moment of panic. Toure is boss!

Get Sturridge up to fitness, get Suarez into the team, another big signing (hopefully) and we could very well be on our way to a big season.


Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #38 on: August 19, 2013, 10:03:55 am »
I don’t feel that Stoke is the best opponent to measure Mignolet’s aerial ability against or our defensive solidity at set-pieces. We have seen over the years some of the best teams and keepers in the Premier League come undone by their aerial bombardment and even though they have a new manager this season Pullis’s finger prints were still over Stoke’s set-plays.

I think in open play we defended well and can only think of one or two chances created against us. Our passing during the game was brilliant and the movement and interchanging of the front four was joy to watch. It must have been terribly difficult for the Stoke defence to know who to pick up as Sturridge, Henderson, Aspas and Coutinho continually swapped and changed. Put Suarez into that line-up and suddenly we look to have a really exciting forward line. We will be a handful for many teams in this league.

One thing that excites me about this team is that in the past we always seemed to be reliant on one or two players and if they didn’t perform the team struggled. But we now seem to have a group where the responsibility is shared more evenly around the team. It is now more of a team effort.

Winning the first game of the season should hopefully give us a bit of momentum now. I think of the similarities to our previous first game of the season at home when we played Sunderland and absolutely battered them, hitting the post and the goalkeeper making world class saves. We ended up conceding a goal against the run of play and the game ended in a draw and that pattern seemed to continue for the rest of the season.
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Offline Carlito Roberto

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Re: RAWK Round Table Liverpool 1-0 Stoke.
« Reply #39 on: August 19, 2013, 10:13:57 am »
Loved it when Coutinho squared up to that big fella and then Lucas pulled him out of the way to take his place. Thought that was proper fighting for each other...can't remember who it was but he should of been sent off for that, you know he would have if he was a Liverpool player.

Also didn't really like the ref. Although, he kept the game flowing, it felt he only wanted to penalise Liverpool players (e.g. Lucas got a booking for nothing) and Coutinho was getting kicked all over the place and no bookings.
Just a minor point mate, but Lucas wasn't booked it was N'zonzi.